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When one is as ignorant as myself about the technical design of an automobile it's difficult to be insulted. We're all fortunate to have access to your wealth of knowledge about the FFH.
I believe that I heard that Ford was going to concentrate the sales on certain 'hot spot markets' only. Boston, NY/NJ, DC/MD/NoVA, Chi, DFW, SoCal and NorCal.
The rest of the country?....errrr, buy a plane ticket.
I noticed that Fitzmall has their TCH's at almost $5000 off MSRP. Even if you think the FFH is a better car, would you pay MSRP+ when the TCH is discounted? $5000 less for a somewhat compariable car would buy a lot of gas for a hybrid.
There is a lot more competition now than what the TCH had when it first arrived. Even though there may be an early shortage when they hit the floor I can't imaging Ford being able to get a stiff premium.
Not just Fitzmall - had a TCH advertised for $5000 off MSRP in Dallas. May have been a one-off loss leader ($33k list, loaded), but it's the first time I've see one discounted in the local paper.
The sales person catchs a cab back to work.
LLBean for auto buyers.
The Fusion and Mercury HB's were there but I must say that the Fusion looks more stylist. The sales folks really did not know much about them. I cannot say that folks were all over the Hybrids they were just there.
I will say more about the show later but one item that came up from both the Ford and Mercury salesman about their respective Hybrid is that there is little to no difference between the two and that they are only going to be a few hundred dollars apart. I have heard that also here.
This confuses me for some reason. I always thought the Mercury was suppose to be a step up from the Fusion. I thought it had better interior, different suspension (softer ride) and a extra or different hi-tech electronics display. Of the two I saw the Fusion really looked sportier. Perhaps the olive drab color on the Milan turned me off. I have seen Milians in Black and in Red on the road and thought they looked really sharp. Not sure if they even offer the Milian HB in red.
As a side note that MKS was the real winner and in Red it is a stunner. The concept MKC had the young folks going wild.
"Milan usually has nicer/luxury appointments i.e.; wood-grain, chrome and softer suspension"
I still cannot make up my mind on this one.
Another side note: At the DC auto show Lincoln did not have any Navigators or MKX's.
If you have a few minutes, we would greatly appreciate your participation in a quick (and fun) exercise on how best to organize our site information.
http://edmunds.optimalsort.com/ersm/
From the SAE article: "During a deceleration event, as the driver lifts off the gas pedal, torque is ramped down to zero, and the injector pulses follow. Precise calibration with the transmission allows the torque convertor to remain locked, saving fuel. When the driver resumes acceleration (presses the pedal down again), the injectors ramp up. This seamless electronic control maintains smooth, uninterrupted power delivery to the wheels. This system does not abruptly cut off gasoline flow to the Bosch fuel injectors, which would affect driveability."
This may be one of the cumulative many little things the Fusion Hybrid does to get amazing fuel economy compared to the Camry Hybrid.
I've always been a bit fuzzy about how engine controllers juggle emissions and driveability concerns during deceleration events, and it looks like Ford has raised the bar with how to do it.
The article also said Ford might increase the fuel efficiency even further by adding direct injection and lowering displacement, something a couple of Ford engineer friends of mine have been trying to do at Ford for the Fusion for a couple of years now but have been vetoed by marketeers who said customers don't care about fuel economy enough. Of course, as of summer 2008, the marketing people are beginning to see the light. Get ready for a 2.0L direct-injected 4 cylinder in the Fusion Hybrid and regular Fusion as well in a year or two.
Huh? Aren't there people who want quieter, smoother riding cars out there, and are willing to put a Merc badge on it and pay a little extra? Thats the way its always been.
I prefer the Milan styling. Lots of people prefer the Fusion. Ford has no business putting a lot of differentiation here, when it is still doubtful whether the whole shebang will surviive. I am still hoping they save the Mercury brand. If they are able to do so, right now it will be by providing half-efforts (which are super cheap to do) like the Milan. If Ford can turn around (and that is a big if), then maybe Mercury will be something again. Meanwhile, I'd buy the Milan hybrid for the exclusivity and slightly more formal look. I don't want the suspension any more wallowy than the Fusion.
Next thing he'll be asking for a bench seat........
Mercury needs unique vehicles to thrive as a brand, not just clones and rebadges of Ford products. Right now they only exist to allow Lincoln dealers to sell Fords, and that's ok for now. Longer term they'll either kill the brand or give it unique products. You're seeing that now with the lack of a new Sable to go along with the Taurus.
Why does everyone think that it makes business sense for a mfr to make whatever vehicle they want?
Toyota and Buick have that market cornered already. Ford needs to be different.
I do remember when Mercuries received unique rooflines and body panels and/or longer wheelbases or special options. But with the success of so many companies from other parts of the world, even the genuine Pontiac/Mercury styling/upgrades that used to be done before the 1990s to differentiate them from Chevy/Ford is not even enough. We no longer need such brands for volume and variety, as the choice out there is already phenomenal and increasing all the time. Just wait until Chinese and Indian and Malaysian vehicles get good enough to enter our market. If Mercury is to survive, unique models will be the only way to do it.
The first 2 things are things they could easily do, the 3rd is one they are doing:
1. Making the Merc Milan Hybrid ride smoother with more progressive spring rates.
2. Milan Hybrid quieter due to the application of more sound-deadening materials like soft polymers inside body panels.
3. Milan Hybrid already looks a little different.
Then, if somebody buys a Merc Hybrid over a Fusion Hybrid, they can say the Milan rides better and is quieter, and they paid about $1,000 more for it. The Fusion Hybrid can be the one that holds a turn better. Differentiation between the Fusion Hybrid and Milan Hybrid. Those first two changes would cost about $500 to do by Ford, so it means their profit margin is better, since it has long been known people will pay for more quiet + smoother ride (generally older, more affluent buyers). Otherwise, the Fusion Hybrid and Milan Hybrid are really the same cars, which seems silly to me.
It ain't gonna work, or it would have been tried by now. And Ford is already giving all those upgrades to Ford (the Fusion Hybrid will be one of the quietest cars on the road), so how is the Milan going to be enough noticably quieter than that so that Joe Blow will pay more dollars for it? Mercury needs unique vehicles, not Fords with some lipstick. Ford is already up market past where Mercury used to be.
that sounds amazing. I haven't been in the market for a car for ~ 10 years. What is a comparable company on the West Coast? (I'm in N Cal)
thanks!
When you say the Fusion Hybrid will be one of the quietest on the road, what are you basing this on? I haven't seen any dB sound level data to show this.
In the past, car makers have not always wanted to put enough sound deadener on because it adds weight and adds a few hundred dollars in cost. Kind of like what Lexus does to Toyota platforms, they increase noise deadening and get to charge some more to cover the buying group that tends to be a bit older and have more money to pay the $1,000 or so above the noisier base platform. That demographic that values ride smootheness and quietness over anything else has a lot of $$$$ in the marketplace and can't be ignored.
Watching that test should show you how important it is to always use the EPA MPG standard tests to compare car A to car B. Same test, comparable results.
Another great video more targeted at the Fusion Hybrid is at Ford Fusion Hybrid Fuel Economy demo
Maybe you should look into a nice used Grand Marquis.
I guess the Fusion's amazing fuel economy compared to the Camry or anything else out there (even though real world tests have shown that the Fusion mpg is about the same as the Camry's) makes it difficult for you to consider that other people may look at a car purchase from a number of angles. I am a Ford guy and have been since 1957, but I recognize that every car is a compromise. As much as I want to love Fords more than Chevys or Toyotas, I do understand when people buy something else. I'd love for it to be cut and dried, but for me it just isn't. Glad it is for you. It does make life easier that way.
Mercury is simply on the back burner while Ford gets the main brand squared away and back on solid ground. Lincoln is secondary. If they can find vehicles that make sense for Mercury but don't take away from Ford or Lincoln, it will survive. If not it won't. It's that simple. But Mercury will not be a rebadged Ford any longer.
There is no business case for Mercury in between Ford and Lincoln. Mercury has to have different vehicles. The only reason the Milan exists is to keep the few remaining Lincoln/Mercury dealers in business until they get more Lincoln products.
One person's desires does not constitute a viable market segment.
That means I could get an absolutely LOADED v6SEL AWD for around $25,000 where as a loaded Hybrid will cost me $29,500. If you can't get the XPlan pricing then you'll be paying MSRP+ or around $31,500.
So the hybrid would cost $4500 to $6500 (less tax credits) more than a V6 all wheel drive model.
Makes me wonder why I'm stuck on hybrids. I think it's the right thing to do but as a consumer this doesn't make sense. My TCH came with large tax credits and economically I came out good on that. My HH came with no tax credits but I did get a large discount. Still it was probably a $5K to $6K premium. I just wasn't prepared to own another 14mpg SUV so I am happy with it.