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Comments
DAVE
2010 LaCrosse
Suspect is the loud metal to metal clang on start. It was too loud and of intensity that it would seem to defy explanation by something loose in exhaust system. And changing from 87 to 93 octane would also seem to defy stopping the sound unless something was errant with valve timing. The new VVT allows the exhaust valves timing to be extended(retarded) to the point some exhaust gases get drawn back into the cylinder rather than having to be drawn in through the intake and controlled by an EGR valve. (some systems can also vary the duration)
At this point I don't know the exact method of controlling the cam change. That is I don't know how the controlled pressure of oil goes into the chamber that varies the cam position. It is in effect a double sided chamber with a vane in the middle attached to cam. Oil could be pumped to one side to advance and released depending upon the resistance to work against the valve springs to force it out and retard the shaft. Or it could have oil being pushed to both sides of vane and proportioned according to the desired amount of advance or retard. The GM system supposedly pins the cam shaft to a start position upon shutdown. At what moment or how it is released so the oil system takes over I don't know.
I strongly suspect that the bang was the vanes slamming against one of the extremities of the chamber because of lack of oil or air being flushed upon start.
And the rough idle occurs cold or hot at around 1500 RPM.
Ours has been flawless so far. The dipstick anomaly is hard to figure out, but I know to read it above the full level to make sure it has 6 quarts.
Good luck with the rough idle diagnosis- maybe it will result in a TSB.
There are many things that only happen to a few. I was cruising for info on 3.6L. In the Acadia forum, there is an entire thread just for complaints of timing chains on 3.6L. Rather scary thought with it showing up with low mileage sometimes. I haven't verified but there were comments that it was occurring in Cadillacs as well.
That engine is used in a lot of vehicles which makes me wonder why it only seems to be big problem in Acadia.
I would think that timing chains would be a proven technology by now.
Alignment used to be a big issue on new engine designs, but I would have thought they had that bit of engineering down. I always preferred the chain approach to the belt (Japanese) with required replacing.
Maybe the key to Arcadia problems is more likelihood of towing with that platform, but usually not an early mileage development if due to wear.
I also am watching the long term reliability of the 3.0/3.6L engine family
on various forums and auto reviews. Do you know if the same chain is used on 3.0 and 3.6 since it is basically the same engine family? The engines have been used in Caddys for quite a while in various configurations and not a lot of chatter about problems in my view.
I don't look for problems, but it does help to solve them if you are informed and aware of the fix. GM has always been great with fixing our cars in the past and in the world of the internet there are few secrets kept for long!
Also mention of some foreign name vehicle, maybe Suzuki, that uses same engine and it had a lot of chain problems. Some saying that they greatly decreased the recommended change interval and recalibrated the OLM to less mileage as well. So, maybe someone thinks it is an oil problem but I'm not so sure. I knew of someone who had a Ford 400M and bragged he never changed oil, only added when light came on. The chain went just past 100K which is amazing with that type of abuse. But of course that was a real timing chain.
Some in the Acadia have issue and claim they always changed early and never let it get low. I'm pretty well convinced it is more than an oil change problem. There may be weaknesses in the oil flow, maybe just plain weak design of chain. Because some have had the camshaft shimmed for end play when chain was replaced it might be oil flow. At least one had to go back and had heads replaced in short time because the problem returned quickly.
Word in that group seems to be that stretching is what is happening to the chains. And worrisome to me is that none have reported that the gears were changed at the same time. And that may be part of the issue. That is they may no longer manufacturer chain and gears as a set. And thus you get a bad wear pattern from onset and end up with early failure. Maybe most are just lucky that the initial wear pattern set during breakin is a good one. Maybe that is why we have a 3K breakin period.
Although this is supposed to be a new Buick-GMC dealership the service and sales areas were pretty disappointing (a former SAAB facility). Only two vehicles could fit on the sales floor and the waiting area was tiny with a few used chairs, an old TV and no coffee but a huge vending machine. Compared to the Toyota and Honda dealerships just across the street this was the worst dealership I have seen in years. What is so ironic is that GM closed a Buick dealership less than a mile away and gave a franchise to this mega multiple-brand dealership that looks and feels more like an order taker than a premium brand dealership.
One thing for sure, when I receive the satisfaction survey I am going to rate them as low as possible and gladly return to my sales dealership for future service, albeit 35 miles away.
We will pay for quality but will not accept poor quality as a trade off for cost savings in design and production. Car companies future depends on the perceived initial and long term quality of their products-NOT cost savings!
The service manager apologized for not resetting the oil life gauge after the oil change. And in fact they did not rotate the tires as requested because he says it appeared that I did not need one at 4,800 miles. Again, he apologized for failing to mention that to me and instead of a refund my next service is free.
But somehow I don't feel comfortable returning to these guys for service, yet at the same time I feel the infraction is not egregious enough to report them to GM. But if I don't, they will continue to be sloppy and perhaps even put owners and innocent people at risk.
Boardies, what should I do?
Appearance is not the reason for rotating. It is so they don't appear to need attention, but that they continue even wear. Wear problems developing could indicate problems with tires, suspension, alignment, etc. Once those wear patterns surface, they will never go away.
The good news is that if they properly checked for such indications, then you have no problem needing attention.
The amount of tire wear should also be looked at. Even though they may be wearing evenly the amount of wear might need to be addressed separately.
Actually you may need to make a decision. Leave where they are and see if what is not visible to the naked eye develops to be seen at maximum rotation. Then you might be in for a new set of tires, covered to 13K I think. Check manual.
At that point they may be able to tweek something or they may make it worse.
Report, hopefully those at GM will take a tactful approach toward quality. In the past they'd flat tell you there is a disconnect between GM and dealership.
good luck.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
When the car is in park, and the RPM is 1500 - 2000 the shaking is the most noticable. What else could be causing this? Fly Wheel? Torque converter?
I am certain that I am not the only one out there with a LaCrosse that does this and wish others would try the idle thing to see if they have the problem as well.
DAVE
2010 LaCrosse
Hope you're kidding.
I've learned to check work before leaving ANY dealership.
Do we need to go back to solid rubber? Wood spokes optional.
Have you had the vehicle into a dealer? Can you please email me your VIN and current mileage?
Christina
GM Customer Service
Even on a level road I can press on the acellator slowly and it takes a long time to even pick up speed let alone downshift as I think it should.
Also asked for an update on Navagation and they said not possible although a newer version has been reported on this forum.
Can you also send me the same information, any dealer involvement, VIN and current mileage?
Christina
GM Customer Service
That is interesting. There has been a lot of claims of the benefits of Nitrogen in tires. These claims have rarely stood up under controlled testing.
Remember that air contains 78% nitrogen and the nitrogen put into tires is only 95% nitrogen. Questionable, at least to me, what bit advantage there by adding just 17% more nitrogen. Much better would be keeping your tires at the recommended pressure as far as increase in mileage. Doubtful that any advantage to increasing length of tire use as most of the tire damage is external from sun, bumps, curbs, etc. But now the tire people say that they should be changed every 5 or 6 years. Most of us would wear a tire out in this period of time anyway.
I see the addition of nitrogen as either a money maker (as high as $10 per tire) or as a promotion as Costco does.
I do find your comments interesting and there might be something to them., However I want to see it proven before I would pay to mmake a change. However if nitrogen is free when I buy the tire I would accept it.
Thought I’d share this short video on how to use the memory seat feature on the Buick LaCrosse. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiBbVcHkeDo&feature=relmfu
Enjoy!
If you use the remote to unlock I find the seat starts to move even quicker than pulling the handle. GM needs to reprogram the forward movement of seat to coincide with start. Seriously! I slope the wheel up with the stupid rake system upon exiting and don't lock. The other day, trying to get in with the seat moving forward, it got a bit ahead of me, I nailed my knee cap badly on that stupid latch lever.
And when I exited vehicle without closing front door, I opened rear and seat moved ahead. Say what?
GM has some bad programmers.
There is no way I can justify the stupid event of seat moving ahead before you have a chance to get in. It should have been tied to start.
And don't get me started on the lack of enough voice commands to get full control of NAV Entertainment system.
The rear camera system is another that lacks a lot. There are capabilities that overcome the brake lights making the system blind as well as dealing with the cloud of condensation from exhaust during cool weather. Am I supposed to just put in Reverse, back up without hitting brake pedal, blindly into that cloud of condensation? Did they test this stuff? If they fix this, then they should also overcome overexposure of camera when sun angles are low. But then they did not have sense enough to put a shroud on NAV screen to help with sun angles.
What idiot cuts bass from a good system? A properly setup system should be perfect at reproducing everything that was recorded unless the recording was poorly done. Yes there are those that crank bass to the max just so they can hear drums or crap but the purpose of HI-FI is to faithfully reproduce. Any adjustments from the standard would be done for personal preference or to accomadate acoustic environment. And the later can not be so in this case because they claim it was designed for the car. H-K should be ashamed to put their name on this garbage. But I lack familiarity with H-K so maybe this is their quality. It sure does not measure up to a Bose I had.
I do wonder if it is the H-K unit or did they just hang terrible speakers to an otherwise good amp>
Are u a 2011 LaCr CXL or other?
Although I have my complaints because I am picky, I must say I'm likely pleased overall, so far. I do have items that need attending so there is an outcome to be had. I do feel there are some quality issues in certain areas and often with items I've had at prior times and therefore I think GM may have slipped or they forgot lessons learned toward making a top notch of any line, auto style.
If you check through the forums for 2010-11 what complaints have surfaced are limited to specific areas and most have had resolution to exising equipment issues. The forum may drift through question and answer to betterment of visitors such as yourself. I've been in some forums that were tilted toward better vision of vehicle as if it was impossible to have certain issues and even complaints occasionally about jabs because of issues, personal or real.
What are you looking for in a vehicle, Lacrosse cxl? With the changing of options, even mid-season, or frequent, depending upon how loaded you are looking at, you might actually find more in the CSX for the same money. There are a few items that are limited to the CSX and those couple of items as I recall were such I decided I'd llke to have.
As reported before I do mostly city/suburban driving so my overall gas mileage is only 16.5 mpg. Originally I used regular gas then moved to mid-grade 89 octane but I was not very satisfied with that so I moved up to Shell V-Power 93 octane. Expensive yes, but I get a discount as much as $1.20 a gallon when I use my Stop & Shop card. By the way, the discount ranges from 10 cents to $1.20 depending on your Stop & Shop purchases.
Last fall I toyed with driving in the Sport and Manual modes but somehow that was not as satisfying as driving in Auto mode so I went back to driving exclusively in the auto mode even during the snow.
Speaking of snow, although we had plenty of it in New England, that did not hinder my driving, since the roads were cleaned, salted and sanded on a regular basis. Salt is not kind to cars so I am hoping the LaCrosse stands up to the salt’s corrosive effect. Still, the Good Year 19-inch tires performed poorly on the first snow and ice storm before the roads were plowed. Moreover, if you live in the snow belt, I recommend dedicated snow tires.
In terms of maintenance I had two oil changes, one at 2,500 miles and the other at 4,800 miles. I also had one tire rotation at 5,000 miles. All switches and gauges are working effectively except for the passenger side wiper that leaves a little water after the final stroke. Nothing annoying except not as smooth as the driver’s side.
On the road, the CXS is as smooth and hushed as ever. The quibble I had about tire and road noise is gone. Not sure if the tires have become more quiet, with break-in, or I simply just got used to them. Visibility is still a major concern with the very wide A and C pillars which makes driving up a spiral ramp or parking in a parking garage more eventful than it ought to be. Nonetheless, the handling, driving and ride is very satisfying although for some reason I still like the ride on our Malibu better.
All in all, the Lacrosse CXS is a great car, it handles well, feels luxurious and substantial. With no reportable conditions it almost feels boring driving this automobile. Just fill the tank, press the start button and drive. Finally, the CXS has surpassed all of my expectations except for mpg which appears to be getting worse.
I like the sport mode which gets rid of nearly all side sway induced by bumps. I know they could have produced a flat smooth riding platform without this electronic option which then could be used to further enhance the ride.
The 09 Malibu LT2 was not a bad ride, but horrible handling starting with tires that the I4 could spin when turning on dry pavement. It would frequently drift across lines without reason and the person who now owns it confirms this problem. Dealer gave up on fixing making it a lemon.
My CXS feeling is that with 4WD gas consumption wud b even worse and here in DE FWD usually does the trick in snow. The salesman indicated that by loading up on pkgs in CXL I basically was even with a CXS?
I'd appreciate any opinion from u or board on a NavStation v. OnStar. Seems to me I don t need both and I'm leaning to OS thinking it will always be more up to date and in the short run less expensive. I used OS in a rental GM suburban once in Tampa. What really impressed me was OS' quick adjustments to me making wrong turns in a strange town.
Options you'd have to add to CXL to get as close as possible but are standard on CXS are: 3.6L unless you want the 2.4L, power rack & pinion, magnetic variable effort, perforated leather, ventilated front seats, leather & wood heated steering wheel (love the heated wheel), AC power outlet, Ultra-sonic rear parking assist (fantastic with the display, it shows you where the hazard is on screen), power rear window sunscreen (nice), push-button start, passive entry system, 11 speaker H-K audio (not very good in my opinion), USB port, mirror with memory & driver side auto-dimming.
Other items would be options for either model, but you may pay more for some such as option with NAV, 40GB HDD, MP3 play, voice&touch activated NAV, & rearview camera. When adding this package the 11 speaker H-K is required, but that is listed as standard on CXS.
Items that are optional on either that I think are great:
Driver Confidence package which includes side blind zone alert (love), articulating xenon HID headlamps (great), & HUD (heads up display) a great addition.
Although the rearview camera has issues, it is great when working. I like the NAV system and added capabilities with 40GB HDD. Just sad the radio does not have top notch full spectrum (will have dealer check mine). A little added bonus is the distance to turns, when getting close, will display on the HUD in addition to audible cues.
Paying for complete OS seems rather pricey and minutes are expensive I think.
BTW, check current situation as to options. Late 2010 in to early 2011 models there were some significant changes as to what was standard or even available. Gone is the 3.0L. H-arm is no longer standard on CXL & CXS. Blind zone alert is new. An option available on either, and not expensive, hope I never need, but for safety of grandkids I got the rearseat thorax airbags.
My bet is that spoilers are screwed onto trunk which means ~ 3screws breach the metal inviting leaks and rust. Rust u say? I had Bonneville years back that starting rusting under/around trim. What I learned was that holes were drilled in body for trim clips and the holes were never sealed with paint so the the bare metal rusted as fed by water run off coming under trim. Lesson learned.
Paint is an extra couple hundred. Why is that?
There are sprinkles of a light reflecting additive. Does that provide any advantage other than beauty eg sun reflection?
Have your concerns been resolved?
Christina
GM Customer Service
Good luck. Great car choice however you load it up.
Further information on the down shifting problem - at least that I am experiencing.
This morning I was driving up a rather steep hill and as I was going up I reached a point where the transmission upshifted to the next range (I think the top) and then it simply seemed to slowed and would not down shift to continue the acceleration. Had to give it a kick in the pants to get it to down shift.
This is different and yet the same that I have experienced before. The same as it seems that it is not downshifting the way I believe it should and different in the fact this was on a steep hill rather than straight and level and on a slight hill.
Still a problem any way you look at it and dangerous if you are not aware of the problem and compensate.
I love this car and enjoy driving it. It is a pure joy (except for the above). Not particular happy with the dealers concerning the above but otherwise relative happy with them. Everything in the car works as it should (once I learned how).
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
The LaCrosse is one rare bird indeed. For only the second time I've seen a LaCrosse on the road. The one I saw yesterday was white. Not sure if it was the Summit White or the White Diamond Tricoat.
On the dealership showroom floor the White Diamond Tricoat looked fabulous. But on the car I saw yesterday it looked dull and anonymous. For some reason white does not look visually pleasing in a moving LaCrosse. I've had two white cars in the past and they looked very good but I can't say the same for the Lacrosse. It just makes the car look bloated and boring.
The extra cost for certain color choices seems to be a marketing gimmick from our viewpoint. The paint on our "standard" color Quicksliver 2010 CXL looks great to us with the 18" alloy wheels. The black option looks outstanding with the 18" chrome wheel option - but don't see any of those on the road. agree with you on the white- car looks washed out. Regarding your ? on tricoat providing extra protection. I believe the only protection is the final clearcoat paint level that protects the finish.
My concern is that quality control is local. If dealer just drills holes in trunk lid it invites future rusting if not properly painted first and it would not be baked on. Four year paint guarantee is nice but I hope to have car longer.
This is no little concern to me as a past Bonneville rusted badly around holes where trim was attached.