Tsjay, here are the options I've added to the Sport Warngler. As you can see, it's pretty loaded. Not only would it be my first new Jeep, but my first new car.
30" Wheel Group 7 Speakers Add-A-Trunk Side Steps Leather Wrapped Steering w/ Speed Controls Sentry Key Mirror w/ lamps/compass/temp Lockinng Fuel Cap Floor Mats 4 Wheel Disc Trac-Lok Differential Air Conditioning
They were applying the incentive financing to all Wranglers on the lot (03 and 04). But APRs apparently apply to when you take delivery. I at least want to get down around 4. Not 6.
Like to give a WELCOME to all the new members. BEEN a long Weekend for me. Just now catching up on ALL the post. Love to see someone getting JEEP fever. I still have mine, even if its a little different from the other jeeperd here. We are one family here. You guys will get TONS of info. From our President TOM.. I guess MAC would be our Secretary of Defense. I looked at a Rubicon on Friday.. It was tempting to trade up. The dealer was offering 0.0% And he was gonna give me 2000 over payoff on TAZZ. All u guys know i can never part with TAZZ.
Man, if you are getting the soft top only, we maybe should compare notes.
I found the post where I told the details of my deal on Thelma Jane, and her invoice price was $21,883.00. That was EVERYTHING on the invoice, including destination charge and the ad fees.
Over and above the $21,883, I had to pay tax and license, the stupid "processing fee" ($149), and the $200.00 over invoice that we had agreed to.
Now you are getting some things that I didn't get, but I got the hard top, which I believe was over $800 (invoice, not retail). I guess the disc brake option and the Trac Loc are fairly expensive, though, and I didn't get them. The rear disc brakes were not an option for the 01s.
Check to be sure you are not getting charged twice for the Dana 44 (if you ARE getting it as part of the 30" tire package). One of the dealers that I checked with when I was getting ready to order Thelma Jane tried to charge me for the Dana 44 when I was asking about Trac Loc (ended up not gettin trac loc anyway), even though I was already getting the Dana 44 with the AAS package. There was a requirement for the 01s, I believe, that you had to have the Dana 44 to get Trac Loc, so one of the options was Dana 44/Trac Loc together. Well, if you are getting the AAS, then you just need the Trac Loc added, not the option that has the Dana 44 AND Trac Loc.
I suppose I've been around here, on and off, since about '97/'98. A couple of years before the big switch over in software at the end of 2000, if my fuzzy memory serves me correctly. I think you started posting just after that momentous occasion. It took at least six months before Town Hall got back on an even keel after that!
Hi, I currently drive a PT Cruiser but like the look of the Wranglers. I live in Florida and mainly do about town/ beach road driving. I have a few questions :
1. The weather here can change quickly. Is it difficult to put the soft top up. How long would it take ? 2. If i get a hard top are they a once a season change over or do you guys change more often from hard top to soft top ? 3. I assume a Sport would be best for my style of driving (i.e around town). 4. Any options a must have ?
I saw on here a guy bought a 2002 sport for $16,500 thats a big depreciation from new. I only do approximately 6000 miles a year would it be worth me checking out the used market
With reference to post #9935 and the possibility of being charged twice for an item. There have been recent reports of some '04 Window Stickers showing some items twice. Specifically, a Dual Top and then a second line item for a soft top. As always, 'caveat emptor'.
I got Jeep Wrangler Fever. I have had regular jeep fever owning 2 grands in the family but now i want a wrangler. However, got to wait since i need to move my family into a house from our condo. Although, i did purchase my 1 year old a powerwheels Jeep Wrangler with a lift and large tire group. I know he is way to young to drive it but he sure likes sitting in his wrangler....Next comes mine....
Welcome! Man, this is great! We've been getting a lot of new folks here lately. Glad you "discovered" us, Tampabay.
I don't think I would call $16,500 a big drop in value from new. The 04s are out now, so the 02 would be considered two years old. You know how much a vehicle loses as soon as it's driven off the lot: about a fourth of its value I would guess.
Jeeps actually are known for holding their resale value much better than most other vehicles do.
I have the hard top only, so someone else will have to answer your question about soft tops. You did ask how hard it is to take the hard top off, and I can sure fill ya in on that.
The hard top is really not all that difficult to remove, if you have a second person, and I wouldn't even TRY to remove it by myself. I have heard of people doing it solo, but they must be a heck of a lot stronger than I am: the top weights 140 or 150 lbs (forget which, but think it's 140). Besides its weight, it is very hard to handle, since the weight is almost entirely in the back end, and there are only so many places to get a grip on it. The people that do it without anyone else to help get inside the cargo area and raise the top with their backs, sort of duck walking with it to get it off.
There are six torx bolts to loosen, three on each side, and the two latches about the windshield. You also need to disconnect the electrical connection for the rear wiper and the hose for the rear washer.
It's also a good idea to remove those rubber grommets in the corner of the tub where the doors close. They might get lost otherwise, and the top does not fit properly without them. Those things slip right off, and they can be stored in the center console or anywhere you want to keep them where you will be able to find them (same with the torx bolts).
I would NOT want to take the top and doors off every couple days, but it's not the end of the world if you have to put the top back on for a little while and then take it back off. I just did that, since it was raining Saturday, and I wanted to go wheelin' without getting drenched. I put the top and doors back on Saturday morning, and I just took them off while ago.
TsJay, Thanks for the quick reply , lots of info really appreciate it. I guess the way to go for me may be either the soft top or the dual top. Can I ask what model you would suggest for my type of needs. (town driving and beach road cruising), not going to off road at all.
i guess your right about the resale. i was comparing it to the 2003s and thought it was a big depreciation but on reflection you are right.
TsJay, Thanks for the quick reply , lots of info really appreciate it. I guess the way to go for me may be either the soft top or the dual top. Can I ask what model you would suggest for my type of needs. (town driving and beach road cruising), not going to off road at all.
i guess your right about the resale. i was comparing it to the 2003s and thought it was a big depreciation but on reflection you are right.
The entry level SE might be just your ticket. The only real difference between the SE and the Sport would be the 4.0 inline six engine, and around town, the four banger, which is the only engine offered in the SE, would probably be fine.
They have increased the horsepower of the four cylinder engine from 120 to 150 beginning with the 03s. The torque came up some too, but I don't know how much.
You can't get the Dana 44 rear end in the SE, but you said you would not be offroading anyway, and that's where the D 44 is really most needed.
Another option for you, if you want the 4.0 six cylinder is the X model. This gets you the six cylinder engine without your having to pay the higher price for a Sport. The X is priced between the SE and the Sport.
There is VERY little difference in fuel economy between the four and the six: maybe a couple miles to the gallon at most. If you can swing the initial cost, the six is definitely more fun to drive because of its extra power (190 HP).
TSJay, Excellent info. Thanks again. I am going to my local jeep dealer tomorrow to check them out. I think your suggestion re the X makes a lot of sense to me, definately worth the research for sure.
I'm not allowed to post a direct link, but there's a good place to chat about Jeeps where I hang out. It is called itsjeep.org, so if you want to come talk with some jeepers, come on. I'm in there now.
Click on the chat tab at the top of the home page.
I was posting in the Grand Cherokee discussion back in 99, and then I got that Grand Prix and started hanging out in the Grand Prix discussion, so I was around when the software change occurred. It was a fiasco!
I have a 2000 Wrangler with only the soft top. I put mine up and down sometimes two or three times a week depending how much it rains (this year a lot).
I hang my windows in my garage when the top is down. It takes me a little less than five minutes to put it down. This includes the little extra time to tuck it in around the inside of the tub so it folds down as low as it will go. Putting it up Probably takes seven or eight nimutes. The extra time is getting the zippers started and the windows fitted around the door frame. If you are concerned about getting caught in a quick shower, you can easily get the top up enough to keep most of the rain out in less than 30 seconds. This assumes you are at the TJ when it starts raining. To give me piece of mind when I am away from mine with the top down, I bought a cab cover which fits just over the cab from the windshield to the back of the tub. Takes about a minute to put on. I folds small enough to fit in a small sports bag which I throw in the back.
By the way, I have air conditioning, which works well with the soft top (it gets pretty hot in Chicago). Also, the heater does not have any trouble keeping up in the winter.
The Power Wheels Jeep is step one. That's where I started off from. It won't be long before your little one wants a REAL Jeep. The Power Wheels Jeep is also quite capable, but those stock plastic tires offer no grip. We use those same motors in robotics, so I know how powerful they are.
Finally back from vacation. Seemed very long without my jeep being with me. Bought the car and only had a day to drive it before i went away. Drove it around all day today to make up for lost times and relized how much this baby likes to eat gas for a living. Worth every penny of gas you put in though, even with the prices being so high. Can't wait to bring her up to Vermint this weekend to visit some friends. A lot of places to bring her off the paved roads and on to some dirt. I have a couple of questions for ya. When you park, is it better to keep the car in 1st gear or neutral. Also, I was looking around for hardtops online today, and was wondering where a good place to look for them online. Also, does it come with a rear wiper with the hard tops, or is that all optional. Thanks for all the help.
Tampa, If u can & have the room, you should go for the dual top option. That what I did. I have the Hardtop hoist, I raise it off "TAZZ" during the summer then use the soft top during the summer. The soft top doesnt take long to put back up, after u do it a few times. I am glad i got the dual top option. It works well for me. Im in Alabama, I beleive me the AC works GREAT even in all our humidity.
Jefferson, My Son & Daughter want a JEEP powerwheels. IM gonna try to get them each one. We will be a total "JEEP" family.
Always keep the Jeep (or any vehicle) in gear when it's parked. Should the E-brake slip, the engine will hold it and prevent rolling. Either 1st gear or reverse is best.
Glad you and your Jeep are re-united! That must have been real tough on ya.
You ALWAYS want to park with the manual tranny in gear. If you leave it in nuetral, the only thing holding it is the emergency brake. Emergency brakes, especially on the Wranglers, are notorious for becoming very weak due to the self-adjusters not working very well.
I have heard two versions of which gear to leave a vehicle in: 1) always leave it in reverse, and 2) leave it in the lowest gear in the direction that it would roll. I use choice (2), the lowest gear in the direction the Jeep would roll if the e-brake failed to hold it.
Hope we get some input from others on the above.
I also like to make sure the steering wheel is turned so that the Jeep would hit something before rolling too far and getting up too much speed. Out on the trails on steep ground, I sometimes park within just a few inches of a good size tree that would stop the Jeep if it rolled. If I can't park right by a tree, I at least turn the wheel so that the Jeep would hit the nearest tree. In town, you can turn your steering wheel so that the Jeep would hit the curb before rolling down a hill very far.
I also try to chock the tires with a big rock or something when I have to park on extremely steep ground when wheelin'.
Bottom line is ALWAYS use your emergency brake, but NEVER trust your emergency brake.
Thanks for the post re the hard top . SO you use the hard top most of the winter even down south ? I like the idea of the dual top, i am just worried about the months of july/aug here when a rain shower is on you before you blink ! I guess its a little disadvantage to be had for so much fun though. Thanks for the info i am going to the dealership today to check them out.
I like the idea of a cover . The weather here can change really quickly. I saw a lot of jeeps parked up yesterday with the tops down but pretty wet inside following a quick heavy downpour. Are the covers a jeep accessorie or did you get it custom made ?
Jeep covers are after market items that can be bought various places. They make some that cover the entire vehicle and some that cover only the cabin.
I bought a full cover from quadratec for $100.
Although it "ain't fun" to sit in a wet seat, Jeeps can get drenched when the top is down and not suffer any real damage. They have floor drain plugs, the carpet is indoor/outdoor and not damaged by getting wet, the seats will dry out and be good as new, and the electrical stuff is pretty well sealed. You might have some quirky stuff going on with electrical accessories for a while after the Jeep gets wet inside, but that will only be temporary. Probably a good idea not to use the stereo equipment until things dry out.
Sorry I left out the vital stats: soft top, dark gray, cloth seats / 5 speed / Bright Silver / 30" w/ all the trimmings (ravines, shocks, axle). My first bike as a kid was silver, so I figured my first new vehicle should be silver too.
As for price, yup, stuff has gone up. 1st, in California, the base price has a $200 surcharge (probably for emissions). Some of the options have gone up too (the side steps doubled form 03 to 04). My base is $19,675.
Plus all the options, at invoice, and including the Nat'l Advertising cost, it comes out to 23,380. Add $100 over that, and its 24,480. Then there's license and registration (now tripled thanks to Gray Davis), plus California's steep sales tax (I saved like half a point by buying in Sand Diego and not L.A.). All told, I'm expecting between 26 and 27K.
That sounds like a real deal to me. The Sahara is the next step above a Sport. The Saharas have a little wider flares, and the flares match the body color, while the flares are black on the other models. The seats are different also in the Saharas. The Saharas have some things standard that are options on the Sport.
Really, the differences between the Sport and the Sahara are only cosmetic. They have the same engines, the 4.0 I-6. Not sure, but it might be that the Saharas have the stronger axle (Dana 44) standard.
If the Jeep checks out OK, that would not be a bad price.
Check the "used car" guide here in Edmunds to get an idea of what that Jeep should sell for.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
P.S. Be aware that there is a $1000 rebate or incentive financing in effect for brand new left over 03 Wranglers, so you might want to see if any of those are available before you buy. Officially the rebate ends today, but I'll bet it has been extended or even increased.
Great . I will check it out this evening. I am going to look at it this evening after i have gone to the dealership to check out the new models. I think it sounds like a good deal though and may be what i am looking for.
Sloppy math due to hasty post. 23,380 is invoice, and 23,480 is what they're charging me. Plus 10 percent for tax and license brings it to less than 26K.
FYI, there's a story on the wires today about all new Chrysler financing beginning tomorrow. Here's a quote:
"Chrysler's deals on its 2004 models are slightly less generous than what it offered on 2003 models. But Elshoff said buyers could still get rebates of up to $3,000 on many new cars, trucks, minivans and sport utilities and zero-percent financing for up to five years. Chrysler is also extending incentive offers on its 2003 models through Oct. 31, Elshoff said."
I just saw a tourism commercial on tv that features "the colors of fall in Missouri". One of the brighter colors is Wrangler Red, they show a nice red Wrangler sitting by a scenic lake. kind of makes me want to vacation there! tjray
After all the hot and heavy posting, we seem to have hit a lull. It happens that way a lot it seems.
Tjray, that's cool that they are using a Wrangler in a tourism commercial! Guess I haven't seen that one, but I never watch TV (too busy hanging out in here).
Like I've said before on here have been jonesin' for a Jeep again. I really like the '03 Canyon's over the '04 Ravines though. However I want the automatic I think and was thinking maybe the '04 model may have more of the kinks worked out of the new automatic tranny than the poor reports I've heard about the '03s. Any thoughts?
to Grand Teton and Yellowstone National Park. I was able to procure a jeep rental for the week. Depending on availability its either a wrangler or grand cherokee but was told the wranglers go fast so expect a jgc. Either way im still in a jeep and off to one of the most interesting geological areas in America and oh yea fishing.... ;-)
the 03 incentives here in DFW area are much the same with the grands 3,000 off 0% int. for upto 60 mo., lib $1,000 with 0% int. up to 60 mo. but the wrangler incentive has actually increased to $1,500 0% 36mo, 1.9% 48 mo and 2.9% 60mo. Also, all of these have the $500 military discount and $500 for members of the National Assoc. of Realtors. Its either or on these two discounts i tried to use both and was told this. I used the military discount on my 03 grand purchase. FYI i was never asked to present my DD 214 discharge papers for the discount but was requested to show my NAR membership card which was at the office, go figure, lol.
In my neck of the woods we sometimes have junior truck pulls for kids and their Power Wheels. My local auto parts store has prepared several modified Power Wheels for these competitions-rewound/upgraded motors, high-current batteries, etc. They enhance the traction of the plastic tires by molding grooves into them using a soldering iron. It's somewhat of a delicate procedure since you can poke a hole in the tire if you aren't careful. FWIW, my son has a PW Wrangler(now outgrown). For over three years he drove it up and down our 1/2 mile gravel farm road on nearly a daily basis. During that time it blew one fuse and I had to replace one switch in the speed control. He kept it in nearly concours condition and plans to keep it for his kid(s). It's one of the few toys we bought him that was worth every penny we paid.
I decided to check if the dealers here in Canada had any new incentives to entice potential buyers. The situation has improved, but not enough yet... Rates are 0% for 36, 2.8% for 48 and 4.8% over 60 months (I don't recall what they have for 72). The only incentives are $1000 for "recent" grads (going back to '98) and $2,500 for outright cash purchases.
Another month or two and hopefully that 0% will make it to the 60 month term and then that rubi is mine... okay, must concentrate and keep calm...
I go away for a few days and there are tons of posts to get caught up on! Love it! Welcome to all the new and potential Wrangler owners - they are fun little vehicles. Mine will continue to sit for another week or 2 and I'm sure it is getting lonely. When the price of gas drops a bit I'll try to talk my other half into taking it into work. I can't believe that gas is still $2.00 a gallon, and with such a thirsty engine, I'm not driving it much.
Have fun in Yellowstone and the Grand Tetons. I haven't done any 'wheeling in that area, though there are certainly huge number of dirt roads! It is so beautiful there, and would certainly be cooler than it is here at the moment. One of these days I'll head that way with my Noble Black Steed.
Well, I've finally pulled the trigger on some fixups for my daughter's 97 TJ SE. We've ordered a new sailcloth top (black), tan/black seat covers to cover the ripped seats (which are quite comfy), got some grips for passenger seats, installing Alpine stereo, Kicker amps and speakers into a EdgeAuto.com 6x9 soundbar, added a fire extinguisher as well.
I still plan to add tubular bumpers (any recommendations?) and some bigger tires/wheels. Anybody got some canyons or ravines they want to get rid of?
Tom, I know you told me about tires/wheels earlier, but I can't find the post. What would you recommend for tire wheel size w/o having to add spacers? I was thinking about something the size of the stock sport or sahara, but I'm rethinking that I'd like to get just a bit bigger to lift the jeep up a bit. What kind of offset would I need?
What wheels do you have? I've looked on Tirerack for wheels for my TJ SE (97), and it only shows 4 options. I am sure there are more than that. Would this be a case of calling and speaking directly with a Tirerack rep?
I came across this today. Its a web site that shows the work of sand sculpture artist. These guys are the ones that are working with DC at the auto shows and camp jeep around the world. I watched them at camp jeep 02 and they are very good as can be seen in the photos.
Tom's wheels are American Racing 767's. There are many more wheels that will fit a TJ out there, but not shown on tire rack. One thing to keep in mind is that the stock backspacing is 5.5", so if you are not going to be adding a lift, make sure you stay pretty close to that backspacing. For example, Tom's wheels have 4" of backspacing and if you had that with no lift, they would rub the flares pretty bad. You may want to look on quadratec for some wheels. I am not sure what they have on the website, but there are quite a few in the catalog.
I noticed some of the Rubicon wheels on eBay. Would they fit a TJ SE?
After I had posted the question to Tom, I remembered they had American something for a name so I was able to track them down.
eBay seems to have quite a few Jeep wheel kits, but I've never bought new wheels for a car. Is there an easy way to determine the lug nut pattern/spacing?
To fix the rubbing w/o having to lift, would I need to change the flares to a different style? I apologize for the remedial questions, but I just want some nice wheels and tires to swap with those U-G-L-Y stock SE wheels. *UGH*
Sorry I couldn't answer your post from work today, but I was a little busy. They have their nerve over there! Expect me to actually DO someting sometimes.
I'm not sure what the backspacing is on your SE wheels. Kevin said 5.5", and he may be right. I know the Canyon wheels have 5.5" backspacing, and I believe that is true of the Grizzly, the Ravine, and the Moab (Rubicon wheels). Regardless of what the backspacing your current wheels is, just remember that you don't want more than 5.5" on the new wheels.
Remember, backspacing is the distance from the back side of the center section (mounting plate) of the wheel, where the lug studs go through, to the inside edge of the rim. In other words, if you took a wheel with no tire mounted on it, laid it flat on the ground face down, laid a straight edge across the top of the wheel, and measured down to the back of the mounting plate, this distance would be the backspacing for that wheel. As this distance gets greater, the tire is pulled in more toward the center of the vehicle, and as this distance decreases, the tire is pushed outward.
So, the backspacing of the wheel has to be in the proper range for the width of the tires that will be mounted on them.
For example, with my stock Canyon wheels, and with the BFG 31 x 10.50 All Terrains I had changed to from the factory 30 x 9.50 GSA's, I was pretty close to rubbing the rear spring perches with the inside of the rear tires.
I didn't have to add spacers to my steering stops, but some people with the same set up had to do so, because at full turn their front tires would rub on the control arms. Guess I must have been close to having that problem, but I was OK.
Now when I got my AR767s, I went with 4" backspacing, and I put 31 x 10.50 BFG Mud Terrains on them (same width tire as the All Terrains I had before). I now have plenty of room inside and am not close to rubbing in front or back. What this did, though, was make my tires stick out past the flares, which I don't mind a bit. I actually like that look.
You also said you would like bigger tires, and I assume you mean bigger diameter. That has less to do with the wheels than it does with the amount of room you have in your fender wells, which in turn depends on how much lift, if any, your Jeep has. With no lift at all, a stock TJ can handle up to 31" tires. Even then, if you go off road and disconnect your front sway bar to allow more axle travel, you will possibly get some rubbing on the flares when the tire is suffed to the max.
I get some rub at full stuff on Thelma Jane, unless I keep the wheel perfectly straight. My tires tuck inside the flares when the wheels are straight ahead, but I rub if I turn the steering wheel.
I don't care. Let 'em rub. (It has distorted my flares a little, though.)
I have a bud at work with 31 x 10.50 BFG Muds on the Grizzly wheels, which have 5.5" backspacing, and he has no lift at all. He gets away with disconnecting his sway bar, but he doesn't get as much axle travel, since he doesn't have the longer springs and shocks like I do because of my two inch lift.
You can see from the picture below how my right front tire is stuffed way up inside the flare, but you can also see how it would rub the flare, if I turned the steering wheel.
Any more questions, just ask away. Hope you get a real nice set of wheels for that Jeep, Paul.
Heh...I saw this on JeepsUnlimited (Sorry, Steve. :-( ) somewhere... they took the regular everyday PowerWheels Jeep and turned into a little mini monster Jeep. Best I can tell you is to retrofit some go-cart wheels/tires. I mean, the stock "tires" are made out of plastic...and almost ALWAYS slip no matter who/how many kids are in the Jeep. I used to think that was fun though. :-)
As of today, my Jeep is officially on order. 6-8 weeks and I'll be out there driving around with the rest of you. Is this what it's like to be an expectant father?
Comments
30" Wheel Group
7 Speakers
Add-A-Trunk
Side Steps
Leather Wrapped Steering w/ Speed Controls
Sentry Key
Mirror w/ lamps/compass/temp
Lockinng Fuel Cap
Floor Mats
4 Wheel Disc
Trac-Lok Differential
Air Conditioning
They were applying the incentive financing to all Wranglers on the lot (03 and 04). But APRs apparently apply to when you take delivery. I at least want to get down around 4. Not 6.
Thanks!
Is the 30" tire package the AAS package that gets ya the Ravine wheels, gas shocks, and the Dana 44?
Also, what color body and top?
See, I gotta know ALL the details.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
BEEN a long Weekend for me. Just now catching up on ALL the post.
Love to see someone getting JEEP fever.
I still have mine, even if its a little different from the other jeeperd here. We are one family here.
You guys will get TONS of info. From our President TOM.. I guess MAC would be our Secretary of Defense.
I looked at a Rubicon on Friday.. It was tempting to trade up. The dealer was offering 0.0% And he was gonna give me 2000 over payoff on TAZZ.
All u guys know i can never part with TAZZ.
KEEP JEEPIN & ROLL TIDE
BAMA
http://www.geocities.com/bamatazz2001
I found the post where I told the details of my deal on Thelma Jane, and her invoice price was $21,883.00. That was EVERYTHING on the invoice, including destination charge and the ad fees.
Over and above the $21,883, I had to pay tax and license, the stupid "processing fee" ($149), and the $200.00 over invoice that we had agreed to.
Now you are getting some things that I didn't get, but I got the hard top, which I believe was over $800 (invoice, not retail). I guess the disc brake option and the Trac Loc are fairly expensive, though, and I didn't get them. The rear disc brakes were not an option for the 01s.
Check to be sure you are not getting charged twice for the Dana 44 (if you ARE getting it as part of the 30" tire package). One of the dealers that I checked with when I was getting ready to order Thelma Jane tried to charge me for the Dana 44 when I was asking about Trac Loc (ended up not gettin trac loc anyway), even though I was already getting the Dana 44 with the AAS package. There was a requirement for the 01s, I believe, that you had to have the Dana 44 to get Trac Loc, so one of the options was Dana 44/Trac Loc together. Well, if you are getting the AAS, then you just need the Trac Loc added, not the option that has the Dana 44 AND Trac Loc.
Maybe the Jeeps have gone up a lot since the 01s?
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Anyone else remember that exciting time???
I currently drive a PT Cruiser but like the look of the Wranglers. I live in Florida and mainly do about town/ beach road driving.
I have a few questions :
1. The weather here can change quickly. Is it difficult to put the soft top up. How long would it take ?
2. If i get a hard top are they a once a season change over or do you guys change more often from hard top to soft top ?
3. I assume a Sport would be best for my style of driving (i.e around town).
4. Any options a must have ?
I saw on here a guy bought a 2002 sport for $16,500 thats a big depreciation from new. I only do approximately 6000 miles a year would it be worth me checking out the used market
Really appreciate any help.
thanks
David
I don't think I would call $16,500 a big drop in value from new. The 04s are out now, so the 02 would be considered two years old. You know how much a vehicle loses as soon as it's driven off the lot: about a fourth of its value I would guess.
Jeeps actually are known for holding their resale value much better than most other vehicles do.
I have the hard top only, so someone else will have to answer your question about soft tops. You did ask how hard it is to take the hard top off, and I can sure fill ya in on that.
The hard top is really not all that difficult to remove, if you have a second person, and I wouldn't even TRY to remove it by myself. I have heard of people doing it solo, but they must be a heck of a lot stronger than I am: the top weights 140 or 150 lbs (forget which, but think it's 140). Besides its weight, it is very hard to handle, since the weight is almost entirely in the back end, and there are only so many places to get a grip on it. The people that do it without anyone else to help get inside the cargo area and raise the top with their backs, sort of duck walking with it to get it off.
There are six torx bolts to loosen, three on each side, and the two latches about the windshield. You also need to disconnect the electrical connection for the rear wiper and the hose for the rear washer.
It's also a good idea to remove those rubber grommets in the corner of the tub where the doors close. They might get lost otherwise, and the top does not fit properly without them. Those things slip right off, and they can be stored in the center console or anywhere you want to keep them where you will be able to find them (same with the torx bolts).
I would NOT want to take the top and doors off every couple days, but it's not the end of the world if you have to put the top back on for a little while and then take it back off. I just did that, since it was raining Saturday, and I wanted to go wheelin' without getting drenched. I put the top and doors back on Saturday morning, and I just took them off while ago.
I LOVE TOPLESS/DOORLESS JEEPIN!
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I guess the way to go for me may be either the soft top or the dual top.
Can I ask what model you would suggest for my type of needs. (town driving and beach road cruising), not going to off road at all.
i guess your right about the resale. i was comparing it to the 2003s and thought it was a big depreciation but on reflection you are right.
thanks again.
You won't be disappointed when you get that Wrangler, if fun is what you are after! Hope you are able to getcha one before TOO long.
Hang out with us during your wait. You can at least TALK Jeep until you are able to get yours.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I guess the way to go for me may be either the soft top or the dual top.
Can I ask what model you would suggest for my type of needs. (town driving and beach road cruising), not going to off road at all.
i guess your right about the resale. i was comparing it to the 2003s and thought it was a big depreciation but on reflection you are right.
thanks again.
They have increased the horsepower of the four cylinder engine from 120 to 150 beginning with the 03s. The torque came up some too, but I don't know how much.
You can't get the Dana 44 rear end in the SE, but you said you would not be offroading anyway, and that's where the D 44 is really most needed.
Another option for you, if you want the 4.0 six cylinder is the X model. This gets you the six cylinder engine without your having to pay the higher price for a Sport. The X is priced between the SE and the Sport.
There is VERY little difference in fuel economy between the four and the six: maybe a couple miles to the gallon at most. If you can swing the initial cost, the six is definitely more fun to drive because of its extra power (190 HP).
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I am going to my local jeep dealer tomorrow to check them out.
I think your suggestion re the X makes a lot of sense to me, definately worth the research for sure.
Thanks for spending the time.
Click on the chat tab at the top of the home page.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I hang my windows in my garage when the top is down. It takes me a little less than five minutes to put it down. This includes the little extra time to tuck it in around the inside of the tub so it folds down as low as it will go. Putting it up Probably takes seven or eight nimutes. The extra time is getting the zippers started and the windows fitted around the door frame. If you are concerned about getting caught in a quick shower, you can easily get the top up enough to keep most of the rain out in less than 30 seconds. This assumes you are at the TJ when it starts raining. To give me piece of mind when I am away from mine with the top down, I bought a cab cover which fits just over the cab from the windshield to the back of the tub. Takes about a minute to put on. I folds small enough to fit in a small sports bag which I throw in the back.
By the way, I have air conditioning, which works well with the soft top (it gets pretty hot in Chicago). Also, the heater does not have any trouble keeping up in the winter.
Terry
Now, I long for a life size Jeep. :-)
Hug your Jeeps for me! :-)
Marlon
Can't wait to bring her up to Vermint this weekend to visit some friends. A lot of places to bring her off the paved roads and on to some dirt.
I have a couple of questions for ya. When you park, is it better to keep the car in 1st gear or neutral. Also, I was looking around for hardtops online today, and was wondering where a good place to look for them online. Also, does it come with a rear wiper with the hard tops, or is that all optional.
Thanks for all the help.
If u can & have the room, you should go for the dual top option. That what I did. I have the Hardtop hoist, I raise it off "TAZZ" during the summer then use the soft top during the summer.
The soft top doesnt take long to put back up, after u do it a few times. I am glad i got the dual top option. It works well for me.
Im in Alabama, I beleive me the AC works GREAT even in all our humidity.
Jefferson,
My Son & Daughter want a JEEP powerwheels.
IM gonna try to get them each one.
We will be a total "JEEP" family.
Keep Jeepin
BamaT
-twylie
You ALWAYS want to park with the manual tranny in gear. If you leave it in nuetral, the only thing holding it is the emergency brake. Emergency brakes, especially on the Wranglers, are notorious for becoming very weak due to the self-adjusters not working very well.
I have heard two versions of which gear to leave a vehicle in: 1) always leave it in reverse, and 2) leave it in the lowest gear in the direction that it would roll. I use choice (2), the lowest gear in the direction the Jeep would roll if the e-brake failed to hold it.
Hope we get some input from others on the above.
I also like to make sure the steering wheel is turned so that the Jeep would hit something before rolling too far and getting up too much speed. Out on the trails on steep ground, I sometimes park within just a few inches of a good size tree that would stop the Jeep if it rolled. If I can't park right by a tree, I at least turn the wheel so that the Jeep would hit the nearest tree. In town, you can turn your steering wheel so that the Jeep would hit the curb before rolling down a hill very far.
I also try to chock the tires with a big rock or something when I have to park on extremely steep ground when wheelin'.
Bottom line is ALWAYS use your emergency brake, but NEVER trust your emergency brake.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I like the idea of the dual top, i am just worried about the months of july/aug here when a rain shower is on you before you blink !
I guess its a little disadvantage to be had for so much fun though.
Thanks for the info i am going to the dealership today to check them out.
Are the covers a jeep accessorie or did you get it custom made ?
I bought a full cover from quadratec for $100.
Although it "ain't fun" to sit in a wet seat, Jeeps can get drenched when the top is down and not suffer any real damage. They have floor drain plugs, the carpet is indoor/outdoor and not damaged by getting wet, the seats will dry out and be good as new, and the electrical stuff is pretty well sealed. You might have some quirky stuff going on with electrical accessories for a while after the Jeep gets wet inside, but that will only be temporary. Probably a good idea not to use the stereo equipment until things dry out.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
As for price, yup, stuff has gone up. 1st, in California, the base price has a $200 surcharge (probably for emissions). Some of the options have gone up too (the side steps doubled form 03 to 04). My base is $19,675.
Plus all the options, at invoice, and including the Nat'l Advertising cost, it comes out to 23,380. Add $100 over that, and its 24,480. Then there's license and registration (now tripled thanks to Gray Davis), plus California's steep sales tax (I saved like half a point by buying in Sand Diego and not L.A.). All told, I'm expecting between 26 and 27K.
Thanks.
A private seller is selling a 2002 sahara for 16800 firm.
15,000 miles on her.
Looks to me like a good deal, is there anything i should look out for and how does the sahara compare to the X or the sport ?
thanks
Really, the differences between the Sport and the Sahara are only cosmetic. They have the same engines, the 4.0 I-6. Not sure, but it might be that the Saharas have the stronger axle (Dana 44) standard.
If the Jeep checks out OK, that would not be a bad price.
Check the "used car" guide here in Edmunds to get an idea of what that Jeep should sell for.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
P.S. Be aware that there is a $1000 rebate or incentive financing in effect for brand new left over 03 Wranglers, so you might want to see if any of those are available before you buy. Officially the rebate ends today, but I'll bet it has been extended or even increased.
I think it sounds like a good deal though and may be what i am looking for.
thanks again.
FYI, there's a story on the wires today about all new Chrysler financing beginning tomorrow. Here's a quote:
"Chrysler's deals on its 2004 models are slightly less generous than what it offered on 2003 models. But Elshoff said buyers could still get rebates of up to $3,000 on many new cars, trucks, minivans and sport utilities and zero-percent financing for up to five years. Chrysler is also extending incentive offers on its 2003 models through Oct. 31, Elshoff said."
Tjray, that's cool that they are using a Wrangler in a tourism commercial! Guess I haven't seen that one, but I never watch TV (too busy hanging out in here).
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I would assume that you would be better off getting an auto tranny now than you would have been when the 03s first came out.
Hope ya get yer Jeep!
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I decided to check if the dealers here in Canada had any new incentives to entice potential buyers. The situation has improved, but not enough yet... Rates are 0% for 36, 2.8% for 48 and 4.8% over 60 months (I don't recall what they have for 72). The only incentives are $1000 for "recent" grads (going back to '98) and $2,500 for outright cash purchases.
Another month or two and hopefully that 0% will make it to the 60 month term and then that rubi is mine... okay, must concentrate and keep calm...
Andrew
I have never been to either Yellowstone or the Grand Tetons, but I would sure love to get out there sometime.
Hope you get the Wrangler for your rental.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Have fun in Yellowstone and the Grand Tetons. I haven't done any 'wheeling in that area, though there are certainly huge number of dirt roads! It is so beautiful there, and would certainly be cooler than it is here at the moment. One of these days I'll head that way with my Noble Black Steed.
I still plan to add tubular bumpers (any recommendations?) and some bigger tires/wheels. Anybody got some canyons or ravines they want to get rid of?
Tom, I know you told me about tires/wheels earlier, but I can't find the post. What would you recommend for tire wheel size w/o having to add spacers? I was thinking about something the size of the stock sport or sahara, but I'm rethinking that I'd like to get just a bit bigger to lift the jeep up a bit. What kind of offset would I need?
-Paul
-Paul
http://www.teamsandtastic.com/jeep/
After I had posted the question to Tom, I remembered they had American something for a name so I was able to track them down.
eBay seems to have quite a few Jeep wheel kits, but I've never bought new wheels for a car. Is there an easy way to determine the lug nut pattern/spacing?
To fix the rubbing w/o having to lift, would I need to change the flares to a different style? I apologize for the remedial questions, but I just want some nice wheels and tires to swap with those U-G-L-Y stock SE wheels. *UGH*
-Paul
I'm not sure what the backspacing is on your SE wheels. Kevin said 5.5", and he may be right. I know the Canyon wheels have 5.5" backspacing, and I believe that is true of the Grizzly, the Ravine, and the Moab (Rubicon wheels). Regardless of what the backspacing your current wheels is, just remember that you don't want more than 5.5" on the new wheels.
Remember, backspacing is the distance from the back side of the center section (mounting plate) of the wheel, where the lug studs go through, to the inside edge of the rim. In other words, if you took a wheel with no tire mounted on it, laid it flat on the ground face down, laid a straight edge across the top of the wheel, and measured down to the back of the mounting plate, this distance would be the backspacing for that wheel. As this distance gets greater, the tire is pulled in more toward the center of the vehicle, and as this distance decreases, the tire is pushed outward.
So, the backspacing of the wheel has to be in the proper range for the width of the tires that will be mounted on them.
For example, with my stock Canyon wheels, and with the BFG 31 x 10.50 All Terrains I had changed to from the factory 30 x 9.50 GSA's, I was pretty close to rubbing the rear spring perches with the inside of the rear tires.
I didn't have to add spacers to my steering stops, but some people with the same set up had to do so, because at full turn their front tires would rub on the control arms. Guess I must have been close to having that problem, but I was OK.
Now when I got my AR767s, I went with 4" backspacing, and I put 31 x 10.50 BFG Mud Terrains on them (same width tire as the All Terrains I had before). I now have plenty of room inside and am not close to rubbing in front or back. What this did, though, was make my tires stick out past the flares, which I don't mind a bit. I actually like that look.
You also said you would like bigger tires, and I assume you mean bigger diameter. That has less to do with the wheels than it does with the amount of room you have in your fender wells, which in turn depends on how much lift, if any, your Jeep has. With no lift at all, a stock TJ can handle up to 31" tires. Even then, if you go off road and disconnect your front sway bar to allow more axle travel, you will possibly get some rubbing on the flares when the tire is suffed to the max.
I get some rub at full stuff on Thelma Jane, unless I keep the wheel perfectly straight. My tires tuck inside the flares when the wheels are straight ahead, but I rub if I turn the steering wheel.
I don't care.
I have a bud at work with 31 x 10.50 BFG Muds on the Grizzly wheels, which have 5.5" backspacing, and he has no lift at all. He gets away with disconnecting his sway bar, but he doesn't get as much axle travel, since he doesn't have the longer springs and shocks like I do because of my two inch lift.
You can see from the picture below how my right front tire is stuffed way up inside the flare, but you can also see how it would rub the flare, if I turned the steering wheel.
Any more questions, just ask away. Hope you get a real nice set of wheels for that Jeep, Paul.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Hug your Jeeps for me!
Marlon
-Mike