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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

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Comments

  • dash5dash5 Member Posts: 421

    @justg0 said:
    I use Navi too - but not the factory installed as they get outdated and are not as good as Google Maps. Google Maps on my Android device automatically picks the best route for me out of the possible 3 options I have to work based on the traffic conditions. And it keeps recomputing in realtime as I am driving. It tells me if alternate routes will be X minutes faster or slower. Maps are always up-to-date. It has information of road closures, accidents, everything I need.

    And since it is on my phone or my computer (same Google maps), I can lookup the route beforehand to plan ahead and I see the same route in my car.

    With Ok Google Now, I rarely need to type in the address or destination. The voice recognition is pretty good and I can lookup and navigate to addresses and destinations.

    The phone connects via Bluetooth so all the voice turn-by-turn directions are played via the car speaker system. If I have music playing (again via bluetooth audio), it will pause the music to speak out the directions.

    And all of this is Free.

    I don't think I can every go back to factory installed navi.

    I do the same. Google maps and OK Google ... It's great and I'm not going back. Same with a back up camera by the way. It's a must for me now.

    I just wish they would let bluetooth stream the map/route to the cars screen so I wouldn't have the need for that suction cup thing on my dash to hold my phone.

  • justg0justg0 Member Posts: 70

    @dash5 said:
    I just wish they would let bluetooth stream the map/route to the cars screen so I wouldn't have the need for that suction cup thing on my dash to hold my phone.

    Yeah, that would be cool. I have heard rumors that Apple has been working on tighter integration with phone in the car. Hopefully we see that happen sooner than later...

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    Here's the latest on Apple's "CarPlay" (Siri integration).

    http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/A/apple-carplay.html

    Still trying to figure out how this will work.

    Via Bluetooth, I can already use my iPhone's phone functions. I can also get the spoken Buetooth directions through the TL's sound system via maps. I can ask Siri questions and get answers via Siri connected to bluetooth.
    So, if they're planning even more integration (say, just having a screen where an iPhone displays it's maps and bluetooth where the directions can be heard), I'm thinking onboard Nav systems may be a thing of the past.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • justg0justg0 Member Posts: 70

    Take a look here: https://www.apple.com/ios/carplay/

    You can see that the touchscreen in car shows the phone icons. And the screen in the car also display the Apple Maps & turn-by-turn directions.

    Looks like it is up to car manufacturers to integrate car play in the car. For 2014 the list includes Ferrari, Honda, Hundai, MB and Volvo. Others are listed in future.

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited August 2014

    I think virtually the entire in-car "avionics" or "carvionics" should be able to be updated by BlueTooth streaming from (why not) a smart phone. New features and functions could be loaded into the dash's brain just like an app can be downloaded into your smartphone.

    Certain things, I'm sure, would require hardware upgrades, but heck, make everything a module (as if it isn't already in a lot of cases) that could be plucked out like a radio head unit and replaced with new technology. And, why not make things at least one, if not more generations backwardly compatible (with some loss of functionality).

    Right now I want to update (replace actually) that piece of crap Audi Connect "hardware" that apparently, forces me to have but ONE choice, other than to go without -- T-Mobile. I go less than 5 miles and the connection drops to 2G, which totally kills Google Maps and the eye in the sky-view on the screen. Even 3G isn't all that great.

    Yet, right there, on the showroom floor is an A3 with 4G LTE -- which is pretty much like being there (and the carrier is AT&T which works about 98% of the time compared with T-Mobile's 70% of the time.) There must be a "module" under the dash that is nothing more than a "smart phone" without the phone case.

    Or, why not allow the "phone" to be "unlocked" and allow, via software, me to use another, more reliable carrier.

    Heck, for all I know T-Mobile is great (just not in Ohio), elsewhere.

    Update-able tech, that's what's next -- or at least it should be. Of course, I think EVERYTHING should be standard on the car as it comes from the factory. Then, if you want the option, you pay for it -- you don't get rid of the car. This could even be done for many engine performance enhancements -- base cars comes with 200HP and 200 ft/lbs of torque. Pay the man (the dealer) to turn on the next level up the performance ladder and the engine now cranks out 250HP and 275 ft/lbs., etc etc.

    I'm not suggesting a basic BMW 3-series come to market equipped with a software hobbled M3 powerplant -- awaiting someone to pay for the upgrade to have the secret code entered. More like what IBM does with some of their hardware that can be upgraded for the end of month processing -- for a fee and then returned to normal for the routine daily processing of data.

  • andys120andys120 Member Posts: 23,370

    Our Epic ELLPC Road Trip

    My wife and I recently completed an extensive motor tour of the Intermountain West in our 2001 BMW 330 Ci Cabriolet. Sometimes in this topic we lose sight of the fact that these cars aren't just about high tech features and luxury appointments, they're about enjoying driving . I thought I'd give you some impressions about what it's like to take one of these ELLP cars on an extensive road trip.

    I'm not going to give you a travelogue of what we saw and did but talk about the journey, which, if you love to drive, is as important as the destinations. I'm well aware that the convertible version of the Three Series isn't the sort of vehicle most would choose for such a trip, in fact the default choice for such long-distance touring is a motor home/RV or Fifth-wheel trailer. I understand the appeal of such vehicles but pros get paid good money for driving large heavy vehicles because driving them is a chore, at least IMO.

    If you love driving and haven't driven in the Far West you should put it on your bucket list. You can really drive out there, speed limits are high and traffic enforcement is light. The roads (with some notable exceptions*) are in beautiful shape and even the Interstates have dramatic curves, steep grades (up to 7%!) and the most spectacular scenery you'll see anywhere.
    Our 14 year old Bimmer performed beautifully without any problems other than a healthy appetite for 91 Octane (we averaged 28 MPG) and took to the highway as an autobahn-bred car should. We always had more than enough power and brakes to handle anything and the sublime steering made every mile a pleasure.

    The major drawback of course was the small size, it wouldn't be suitable for more than two on such a long trip. We took advantage of the feature that allows one to flip away the recess where the top goes when it's down which greatly increased luggage space but robbed us of the ability to cruise topless until had we offloaded the bags. I've been a convertible guy for a long time but I wouldn't care to go more than two or three hours w the top lowered anyway. Thanks to the well-designed top, the Three-er Cabrio makes a very nice Grand Touring coupe w the top in place
    .
    After 20 days, 4500 miles and 8 states (AZ/UT/ID/OR/MT/WY/NV) we arrived home tired but satisfied after a great drive in a wonderful car.

    *Western roads are generally in fine shape with a couple of notable exceptions (mostly in Montana and I-40 in Western AZ is surprisingly bad give the state's rep for good roads) but they are littered with "Road Alligators", shreds of truck tires, one of which tore up the lower front grille and left side fog light. This is surprising in light of the proliferation of truck inspection stations. Don't they ever notice that the tires on these big rigs are crap?

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,314

    Nice write up Andy; it's good to remember it's about driving- not leather upholstered electronic gadget dens...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    I think the back up camera and the Navigation are tied together with the Audi S4, so it's like $3K to get the two features. NO thank you. I know a guy with a 2011 S4 and he was using his back up camera while backing up and it caused him to wreck his side mirror housing on the right side. The problem is the screen doesn't show your sides, only the rear.

    I forced my insurance to replace the aluminum side mirror housing due to a chip from my accident in March. I now know why they ignored the small chip originally, as the part is $500 and nearly $600 installed.

    My money was better spent getting the 3.0T, the S-Tronic DSG, the Sport Diff, and the Nappa Leather than on Navigation or backup cameras.

    Some people don't want to spend $50K, let alone MORE THAN $50K to get a great vehicle.

    P.S. You have to turn off the ESC to use launch control.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310
    @andres3‌ - I think the back up camera plus beeping things are a great help in my s4 - but the camera and the beeps are just an aid in backing up. Sorry to hear about the friends situation but hard to blame a camera for user error. To each is own on optioning a car but cameras should and will be standard on all cars- fact is they help and the govt has taken notice and I'm sure insurance companies are going to be happier too.
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @andres3 said:

    I forced my insurance to replace the aluminum side mirror housing due to a chip from my accident in March. I now know why they ignored the small chip originally, as the part is $500 and nearly $600 installed.

    What been the outcome in getting the insurance company to give you diminished value on your car?

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    Was doing a search for a MB W126 and I came across information on the ordering guide on the MY 15 C Class interesting reading.

  • carnaughtcarnaught Member Posts: 3,497

    @flightnurse said:
    Was doing a search for a MB W126 and I came across information on the ordering guide on the MY 15 C Class interesting reading.

    >

    If there was a hybrid or diesel model I'd be interested; looks nice.

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @carnaught said:
    If there was a hybrid or diesel model I'd be interested; looks nice.

    I am surprised that they have brought over oil burner myself. Wondering if they are waiting for mid year release or MY 16. I think the currently 2.1l d is too much for the C class..

  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310
    I was wondering and doing a search on the nissan A35. Seems like Nissan has forgotten its roots. Maybe turbo 4 / 300hp awd,or diesel awd with stick option would be cool- but I'm dreaming. Looks like 2016 for those who care.

    A35=maxima for those not up on car codes.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @flightnurse said:
    What been the outcome in getting the insurance company to give you diminished value on your car?

    I finally stopped being cheap and hired the collision claims consultants that were recommended to me for a professional unbiased independent diminished value appraisal that finally happened mid-August. It refutes the DV appraisal Mercury (at fault insured's company) paid for where they claimed my car sustained no structural damage (what about pulling an upper right rail isn't structural)? claimed it could be a certified used Audi still (no dealer I talked to seems eager to Certify a $22K+ repair billed S4. Car Max saw bolts spun on the hood and fender and that was enough for them to only offer wholesale price at $37K. They claimed they'd wholesale it, but part of me thinks they'd turn around and list it for $10K more at $47K.

    Based on their "outside the ballpark of reality" DV report, Mercury only offered $1K for DV. They upped it to 1.5K in a fake attempt to settle the claim.

    I've now sent my demand based on a "REAL" report that seems to be in the ball park of reality at $8850 DV amount. Plus the $445 fee and the $2,400 for rental car and insurance deductible expenses. I know they only have a $10K pot to pay out, so I'll settle for $10K total. They just want to delay this claim forever, and their tactics to frustrate me worked. I should of hired this DV Appraisal company from the beginning; I was wasting time without their help.

    I now have 20 boiler plate letters to refute the predictable excuses and false claims/reasons they can't pay my demand. It's kind of hilarious the letters I received answer and refute some of the BS reasons I've already been given.

    Each letter gives them 15 days to respond in writing which is more than reasonable. I predict they will offer to split the difference between their $1K DV report and my 8.8K DV report. One of the 20 letters is ready to go on that excuse. Their report is just so inaccurate, and the CarMax appraisal will help show that if need be.

    Could take 4 to 5 more letters going back and forth before I get paid, or worst case scenario, I have to take them to small claims court for $10K. The thing is these letters help build a "bad faith lawsuit/claim" if they refuse to pay up, so maybe a lawyer would take my case at that point. No lawyers seemed interested in talking to me over a potential $15K property damage claim.

    Next time someone hits me my neck and back is going to hurt a lot.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @andres3 said:
    Could take 4 to 5 more letters going back and forth before I get paid, or worst case scenario, I have to take them to small claims court for $10K. The thing is these letters help build a "bad faith lawsuit/claim" if they refuse to pay up, so maybe a lawyer would take my case at that point. No lawyers seemed interested in talking to me over a potential $15K property damage claim.

    Next time someone hits me my neck and back is going to hurt a lot.

    The insurance industry at times have created business to help those who are bring screwed by them... Most of the time if you have enough proof of "bad faith" and file a law suit in small claims court, the insurance company will pay up, the last thing they want to do is go in front of a judge and explain to them why they haven't paid the claim.

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    Andres....man, that really is a hassle. I know I'd be steamed, as I'm sure you are.

    Sounds like you have enough evidence right now to take them to small claims court. Expect them to ask for a delay. Get them on the 2nd trip. Should be done with a check in hand within 60 days.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    They may offer an arbitration. If so, you and your appraiser should be VERY careful whom you choose--in most cases, do not accept the arbitrator offered by the insurance company. Corruption is rife in this business.

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,314

    I'm surprised you can't find an attorney to take the case. In most states the insurance bad faith statutes provide for recovery of attorney's fees.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Just read that Infiniti is going to bring back hydraulic steering to the Q50s because so many complaints about electric assist. Wonder if anyone would consider it?
  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310

    Sneak peak at the new 1 series. Going to be interesting to see bmw takes on the other German who launched early.

    http://www.caranddriver.com/news/2016-bmw-1-series-sedan-spy-photos-future-cars

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited September 2014

    When I pulled up to the sidewalk and parked in the No Parking zone, the boys’ bicycles were on their kick stands under the porte cochère at the back of the public library where the night drop off for books and, in my case, DVD’s is located. The library wouldn’t be open for more than an hour, so I assumed the boys were just there to get out of the hot morning sun. I put the DVD’s into the slot, nodded at the boys and turned around heading back to my idling car. Just about when I got to the driver’s door, one of the boys said “How much did that [car] cost?” I replied, “How much do you think?” The young man and his friend yelled back in unison, “A lot!” I told them it cost about $57,000, and I heard oo’s and ah’s in response. I drove off, giving them a quick honk and a wave.

    What’s the point?

    The point is, I’ve been thinking, saying and writing about what I assumed is the pending death of the automobile as most of us here know and love it. I’ve been of that opinion because it seems to me that virtually anyone under the age of 35 (or maybe under-30) seems as if they could care less about cars beyond them being appliances or means to get from point-to-point. These “young people” wouldn’t or couldn’t talk about cars if you threatened them with pain and death, and wouldn’t even bother to feign interest to win the new not-yet-released iPhone 6, so little interest do these folks seem to have in cars. These two young men gave me hope!

    Now, I’ll bet when you and I were in our formative (‘tween through teen-age) years, we had but several topics we cared to opine about: Cars, Girls [or boys] and Sex. I my case, I was a budding audiophile, too, which kind of rounded out the whole emerging nerd stereotype. Had there been personal computers (of any stripe) or video games available (it was the early to mid-60’s and such tech had not yet been introduced to the mainstream market), I most certainly would’ve been into them; but instead I was into “stereo” in addition to cars, girls and sex (talking about sex, not actually having it, of course).

    So when I was with my buds, the topic was often the “cars we were gonna be driving” as soon as we turned 16. We were dreamers, of course – we, then, were the kids sitting at the library entrance (where else?) watching the guy drive up in his new 1965 Bonneville pillar-less four-door painted in dark blue metallic with a ton of chrome accents and shiny chrome hub-caps and big ol’ tires (white walls, of course).

    “Hey mister, how much did that thing cost?” The reply, at the time, was “About $4,000,” and of course we then obliged by making the same oo and ah sounds like the ones I heard the other morning.

    My overarching point to this erudite group of auto enthusiasts here at Edmunds is that I believe we are pretty much smitten with cars and everything to do with them – but that we’re also mostly predisposed to acquire one of these Premium (or near-premium) Class cars based on history, loyalty or perhaps even looks. I would submit if you’ve had more than one representative of the same brand (back to back), that your next car is perhaps pre-ordained to come from that manufacturer. Loyalty to a brand is – along with several other characteristics – another sign that you are passionate about cars. You’ve come to identify yourself with BMW’s (a quite common occurrence here in Cincinnati) – you are a “BMW guy”. My friend, now President of his second software company had an Acura when I met him. In our times in the car often driving from Cincinnati to Chicago or to Bowling Green (KY), he would go on and on about what I’m convinced must be the best car in the world – at least he certainly thought so: the BMW M5. This guy was about 10-years my junior.

    Thankfully he didn’t have to keep the Acura long – so less than a year after I met him he leased his first (of many) BMW’s – a 3-series. Followed by a 5, then a 7 then one of the “Z” car convertibles (he called that one Penis).

    I submit that most of us here are (or want to be) “XXX” guys (intended to be gender neutral, don’t you know). You’re a Mercedes maven, you’re a BMW bigot and I’m an Audi aficionado. No matter what “empirical” data is brought to bear, you’re sure your new IS 350 F-Sport is superior to that guy’s BMW 328 – after all, Car & Driver says so; and, you just know you can run circles around the Bimmer’s 4-cylinder, turbo and all.

    So it is with the foreknowledge that no matter how much evidence I can produce to the contrary, you will remain steadfast that your own sagacity has been validated and put on display for all to see by your choice of the latest and greatest Volvo S60 (or whatever).

    So where does that leave us?

    With hope, I hope.

    The upcoming generation still needs to ratchet up their passion for all things automotive – or we could be doomed to forever being but passengers in our autonomous vehicles. But, I think there is some evidence, not much, but a little, that there are kids who are just as interested in cars as they are video games, social media (and, hopefully, sex).

    There may be some hope, too, that those of “us” who may not as of yet yet been inculcated by a Brand of automobile, may find our personal automotive archetype and to coin a phrase, “Live long and prosper.”

    I’ll close by saying this: While I still remain convinced that the Audi S4 is the best representative of the Entry-level Luxury Performance Sedan (and for the money it damn well ought to be), I must say, after having visited the Acura dealer to “See what’s new,” that the new TLX SH-AWD in Advance trim (the one with the 6-cylinder), ought to be this category’s leader if “price” (MSRP) is factored in. If you haven’t checked out this exact configuration (I can’t offer the same praise for the lesser TLX’s), I urge you to do so before you spend one dime on a new ELLPS car – this thing (the 2015, to be clear) is IMPRESSIVE!

    "Cut me some slack, Jack! Chump don' want no help, chump don't GET da help!"

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,441

    If it makes you feel better, both my kids (23 YO son and 18 YO daughter) are obsessed with getting new cars.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    Mark....I wish I could be as eloquent with thoughts and words as you are.

    BTW...I do agree that the new TLX is a very nice piece by Acura. Not in the market, but in a couple of years, it will be on my shopping list.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,441

    I need to take my old TL in this week for an oil change. I am sure I will take a TLX out for a drive to help pass the time

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,499
    edited September 2014

    Business is excellent in Cincinnatti.

    Good to know.

    Brevity is the soul of, well, many things.

    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310
    edited September 2014

    The new TLX is interesting as most articles I've seen prefer the 4 as the engine --but people also love Acuras poorly named Awd system because of its sticky ness. No awd with the 4.....Some wished they had a manual, even thou Acura killed it(rightfully so..look at the sales numbers.) This on paper looks like a nice car but if you don't go Awd it seems you could prob find more sport elsewhere- (my opinion ) That being said the written reviews have been positive.

    Check out the new 3 fighter Jag here

    http://www.caranddriver.com/news/2016-jaguar-xe-sports-sedan-photos-and-info-news

  • carnaughtcarnaught Member Posts: 3,497
    edited September 2014

    Mark, I had to laugh at the one guy's name for his car, the "p-word". I've always looked at some cars, like a Porsche Carrera Turbo as being a "$140,000 p-word".

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373

    Well guys, it has been real. For the past 2 1/2 years I've had the honor and privilege to drive an Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedan. I've literally LOVED every second behind the wheel of my 2011 328xi. The lease is up on 9/22 & I've decided to go a different, less expensive route. Today I put a deposit on a 2015 Subaru Legacy. I'll still be here lurking as a former and hopefully future owner of one of these fine sedans.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310
    edited September 2014

    @nyccarguy‌ - you will be missed. Hear good things on the legacy- it's a nice looking rig, good luck. Make sure you have all season or you will be forced to swap if you get slicks even with awd

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,314

    @nyccarguy- The Subie is a great car, and you also have a Prelude that is probably more fun to drive than anything south of $40k...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373

    @sweendogy‌

    Thanks! It does come with All Seasons which should get me by NO PROBLEM with the AWD here in Southern CT.

    @roadburner‌

    The Prelude is still and always will be "my car." Once it gets new shocks & springs next week, it will be AWESOME!

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,441

    at least soon I will have someone to give honest feedback at living with a Legacy. Assuming of course I am still diddling about on the buying front!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • laurasdadalaurasdada Member Posts: 4,688

    Well, Mark. My daughter is certainly no Car Guy, but I have hopes for my son. So far, he said when he turns 16 at the end of the year, he expects me to give him my Jag XF. Which he prefers over Mom's 535xi. I, of course, (in his grand plan) am free to use the '02 RX300. Cuz that set of wheels ain't cool for his school. I am blessed. B)

    '21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    Bradd....very cool. I don't know much about Subies, other than those I know who have them, love them. So, I'm betting you'll love yours. There we have it...."another punch"!

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,314

    @laurasdada said:
    Well, Mark. My daughter is certainly no Car Guy, but I have hopes for my son. So far, he said when he turns 16 at the end of the year, he expects me to give him my Jag XF. Which he prefers over Mom's 535xi. I, of course, (in his grand plan) am free to use the '02 RX300. Cuz that set of wheels ain't cool for his school. I am blessed. B)

    My son attended the Teen School at the BMW Performance Center as well as Street Survival. While he's driving an X3 at present, he has made it clear that his next car has to be suitable to take to BMW CCA HPDEs. He's leaning towards a ZHP or maybe a GTI Performance Pack.
    Also under consideration in an E36 M3- a good choice as it has a true LSD and no overly intrusive electronic nannies(my 1975 2002 spoiled him with respect to an unadulterated driving experience).

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited September 2014

    Another One Bites the Dust

    This is gettin' serious now: "Nissan Plans to Make Autonomous Driving Common by 2016"

    -- Motor Trend, October 2014; Pg - 26

    You know what Pogo said: "We have met the enemy and he is us."

    Well "us" -- and we know who we are -- killed (or at least put it on its death-bed) the stick shift. Now, of course that's only partially true -- at least if you even a tiny bit agree that the DSG (aka PDK) dual clutch 'automatic manual' transmission is (and I hate to say this) equal to or better than the best manual transmissions ever made. But so few of "us" actually have these marvelous inventions -- and, I'll wager, the number of folks with the excellent 8-speed automatics available is also still somewhat small.

    I can only sort of forgive YOU and hold my head up high with righteous indignation: Because god knows my wife and I did our parts to preserve the manual transmissions going so far as to custom order nearly 2-and-a-half-dozen German cars with stick shifts since 1977 (we finally quit this practice out of the sheer futility of the act when we realized that [most of] the rest of YOU -- overwhelmingly -- had given up on stick shifts years earlier). And, my wife was appalled to read some of lame excuses, most of them blaming "the wife" for her inability to pilot a car with a stick shift.

    Of course, there is always that nagging feeling that the mobile phone also played a big part in killing the stick shift; even today it seems I don't have enough digits to count the number of cars I see being driven down the road with the driver holding a cell phone to his or her ear. So what? I forgot to mention the "phones in the ear" (thus requiring one free hand) I am counting are for the drivers' of cars that I know have Bluetooth! These drivers should be forced to ride the bus for one-full-year or pay a 5-figure fine (or both). This morning, in fact, I saw a woman (phone in ear) in a very young Maserati (with temp tags it was so new) pulling into Starbucks. I could only wonder if she was going to attempt to be on the phone and drink coffee all the while driving in rush hour traffic here in River City.

    The point? Qwit yur complainin', for the Market has spoken.

    But this latest outrage -- autonomous driving (by 2016 no less) -- is, some will say, both inevitable and welcome. Perhaps. It is also inevitable that we will -- eventually -- run out of fossil fuel. But we're talking decades and decades if you believe many of the scholarly studies from think tanks like the Rand Corporation to name one.

    Mean time, WHO (among us) is asking for self-driving cars? I'd rather pay more taxes (and I can't believe I said that) if some of them could be earmarked for public transportation infrastructure improvements and additions. A one-person (or 4 person) public transportation vehicle (manifested in the form of a self-driving passenger vehicle), is not something I want to sign up for.

    On the other hand, I do want driver aids: laser headlights, night-vision, "city safety", all around-view cameras, rear cross traffic alerts -- even automatic cruise control for those 100+ mile stints behind the wheel that are part of my weekly routine trips between Cincinnati and Columbus or Cincinnati and Louisville or Indianapolis.

    I want a connected car (better even than that which is in my 2014 S4: "Audi Connect"), but I still want to press the pedals (most of the time, anyway) and turn the steering wheel myself.

    I am [now, happily] resigned to allowing my dual-clutch 7-speed automatic manual transmission to do the rowing for me, but I am far, far, far from wanting my car to drive itself. Indeed, I'm mostly sure I don't even want the thing to park itself, thank you very much.

    The only good news in the Nissan announcements (if you can call it "good") is that Nissan claims they will NOT ELIMINATE the need for human interaction (like some competitors -- gulp).

    "There is no need to sally forth, for it remains true that those things which make us human are, curiously enough, always close at hand. Resolve then, that on this very ground, with small flags waving and tinny blast on tiny trumpets, we shall meet the enemy, and not only may he be ours, he may be us."

    Drive it like you live -- but do drive it yourself.

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,314

    @cdnpinhead said:
    Brevity is the soul of, well, many things.

    And it is essential in my line of business...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    If it doesn't have 3 pedals, it's an AUTOMATIC. Call it what you will, couch it in Teutonic techno-babble, whatever. You aren't fooling me.

    Of course, sometimes I do wonder if some automakers made their shifters so clunky deliberately, to wean us off them?

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    A seven speed manual would be interesting to compete on fuel economy with the 7 speed DSG/S-tronic. Gas is too expensive to entertain the thought of settling for the available 6-speed manual S4 which is still available (probably only by special order). Audi probably thinks the only people that'll order a manual will do so despite the mileage penalty, and there's so few they won't bother developing a 7 speed with 3 pedals.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    Got my S4 back today from the body shop, 4 trips total, 68 days total in the shop, and the car is looking and driving great. I think I finally got them to do it "right." Still not perfect mind you, but good work that should of been done the first time without repeated return trips to correct deficient work.

    I just don't think they have enough "skill" in their work force Still, for my money I think the "body shop" in Ingoldstadt is superior and better. Audi proved to me they do tremendous quality control with this S4 at the factory. They obviously build them to appease guys like me that notice when gaps and panels are off by a MM or two.

    This last visit was to correct inconsistent gaps with the front hood, lack of buffing/polishing on the front fender and front quarter/fender panels, and 2 bad paint edges at 2 locations on the hood (which was replaced).

    I drove a new NON SH-AWD 6 cyl. TLX and wasn't impressed at all. The transmission is lazy, why'd they give the 4 cyl the better tranny? Why no exhaust? Why less HP than the outgoing TL SH-AWD? This is your Camry/Prius-like TLX.

    Perhaps the SH-AWD is another animal? Admittedly, putting the transmission in sport or sport+ mode made it less lazy, but still lacking. I heard the dual clutch still has a torque converter. NO NO NO Acura... no no no.

    Oh, and the moon roof cover is cardboard covered in vinyl.....compare it to the S4's and you'll believe me that the TLX is an overpriced Accord.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343

    @andres3 said:
    A seven speed manual would be interesting to compete on fuel economy with the 7 speed DSG/S-tronic. Gas is too expensive to entertain the thought of settling for the available 6-speed manual S4 which is still available (probably only by special order). Audi probably thinks the only people that'll order a manual will do so despite the mileage penalty, and there's so few they won't bother developing a 7 speed with 3 pedals.

    =====
    The number of years before the literal elimination of manual transmissions even from some of the performance stalwarts is damn few. The number of years before the virtual elimination of manual transmissions is even fewer, and some would say that time has already arrived.

    The truth (my truth, at this point) of the matter is that the 7-speed (and most of the German/European 8-speed versions) is (are) so good, I only miss shifting for sentimental reasons.

    I don't think I ever was as capable (and certainly not as quick/fast) a shifter as the S-Tronic in my S4. And, the tuning of my wife's 8-speed in her SQ5 is very very close to that same ideal.

    Sentimentality is a [non-permissible content removed]. :'(

  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,147

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

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  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729
    Test Drove the S3 today. I like the light feeling A3/S3 chassis, but my general impression is that the S4 is the closest to perfect car for Audi. The S3 is just missing something. Well, it's missing several things or doing serveral things not quite right.

    I didn't get to really wring it out though as it had 5 miles worth of fuel and went to zero before the test drive was done. All new cars seem to have a "break-in" lower power period these days too. I want to test drive one with 1,500 miles on the clock already.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    Kirstie_H said:

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

    Doesn't everyone here do that? I'm not in the market, but find myself looking on my iPhone for pricing info anytime I take my car in for service.

    :)
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,147

    Kirstie_H said:

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

    Doesn't everyone here do that? I'm not in the market, but find myself looking on my iPhone for pricing info anytime I take my car in for service.

    :)
    Maybe not here, here. In CCBA? I wouldn't be surprised if people were shopping in their sleep. :)

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    Kirstie_H said:

    Kirstie_H said:

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

    Doesn't everyone here do that? I'm not in the market, but find myself looking on my iPhone for pricing info anytime I take my car in for service.

    :)
    Maybe not here, here. In CCBA? I wouldn't be surprised if people were shopping in their sleep. :)
    Yeah....probably right, Kirstie. Fact is, I was looking at my TL's value on my iPad the last time I got an oil change. My sales guy happens by, greets me, looks at my iPad to see I'm looking at trade value and invoice numbers on the TLX. He laughs and said, ".....TLX is too new for a GG type deal. I'll call you in 6 more months, though. We van hammer something then when the supply catches up with demand."

    That put's us right after the New Year. They're really nice cars. Acura has done a nice job.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,180

    Kirstie_H said:

    Kirstie_H said:

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

    Doesn't everyone here do that? I'm not in the market, but find myself looking on my iPhone for pricing info anytime I take my car in for service.

    :)
    Maybe not here, here. In CCBA? I wouldn't be surprised if people were shopping in their sleep. :)
    Yeah....probably right, Kirstie. Fact is, I was looking at my TL's value on my iPad the last time I got an oil change. My sales guy happens by, greets me, looks at my iPad to see I'm looking at trade value and invoice numbers on the TLX. He laughs and said, ".....TLX is too new for a GG type deal. I'll call you in 6 more months, though. We van hammer something then when the supply catches up with demand."

    That put's us right after the New Year. They're really nice cars. Acura has done a nice job.
    And yet there is someone in another thread who would absolutely not consider the new TLX because of the commercial Acura created for it.

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    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 19,034
    Michaell said:

    Kirstie_H said:

    Kirstie_H said:

    A reporter would like to speak to a recent car shopper who has used their mobile device to look for car inventory, compare pricing, look at trim packages, etc. while on a dealer's lot. If this is you, and you'd like to share your story, please send your daytime contact info to pr@edmunds.com no later than 1 p.m. PT/4 p.m. ET on Thursday, 9/11/14.

    Doesn't everyone here do that? I'm not in the market, but find myself looking on my iPhone for pricing info anytime I take my car in for service.

    :)
    Maybe not here, here. In CCBA? I wouldn't be surprised if people were shopping in their sleep. :)
    Yeah....probably right, Kirstie. Fact is, I was looking at my TL's value on my iPad the last time I got an oil change. My sales guy happens by, greets me, looks at my iPad to see I'm looking at trade value and invoice numbers on the TLX. He laughs and said, ".....TLX is too new for a GG type deal. I'll call you in 6 more months, though. We van hammer something then when the supply catches up with demand."

    That put's us right after the New Year. They're really nice cars. Acura has done a nice job.
    And yet there is someone in another thread who would absolutely not consider the new TLX because of the commercial Acura created for it.

    In fairness, I am seeing a number of non-professional drive reports from interested parties/potential buyers that are not at all positive, so that weighs heavily against it too. Could Acura have badly missed the mark?

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,441
    overall the in depth reviews seem to be positive. as always, especially with individual opinions, you will find people all over the spectrum. Always need to try for yourself!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

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