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Comments
I suspect that the mod x gives more even wear,but that front to back is easier on the tire body, and leads to less separations, pull and noise.
Where's Bret? He should be able to throw some light on the question.
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Wow, me too!
I wasn't even sure I was remembering it right.
Who knows the difference between "X" and "Modified X"?
Does modified include the spare?
I not only remember those days, I was running a tire store at the time radials were introduced domestically. BFG was the first (then) US manufacturer to build radials for consumer use, and they were pushing them to gain advantage over Goodyear and Firestone. The addage at the time in the business was that BF Goodrich invents it, Firestone takes credit for it and Goodyear sells it! Guess the succeeding years proved that to be approximately true.
In the early radial days Goodyear was vocally against them until they got their own radial products on-line - then they took over the domestic market, as usual. But they couldn't stop Michelin, who had been building radials for years and knew how to do it. Being a Goodyear marketing partner Chrysler actually recommended against radials on their cars for a number of years.
I also had Firestone 721's on my 85 Corolla. Those things lasted a pretty long time.
Same thing happened with 2-ply tires. Before belted tires and radials came to the US tires were of either 2-ply or 4-ply construction. The 2-ply tires were for lighter-duty applications, and so became associated with "cheap" tires. Actually a 2-ply carcass had the same cord count that 4-ply's did, and because of fewer ply layers they tended to build up less heat. Some very high quality 2-plys were made, but the public wouldn't accept them.
When belted and radial tires came along they all had (have) 2-ply carcasses to minimuze heat build-up. That tended to poison them at first, that and the "bulge" on the radials that consumers meant for sure would result in more curb damage, etc. The resistance disolved quickly, however, when people started reporting 2-3 times the treadware of the old tires. Within 5 years essentially the entire tire market changed over to radials.
The current subject is one where I need to do a little more research. Clearly 21st Century tire technology has created some tire-specific and car-specfic rotation needs. On some cars no rotation is even possible (Corvette, Viper, etc).
The only comment I can make right now is to follow your owners manual recommendation. If I dig up more definitive info I'll try to answer some of the questions. Sorry, I'm not nor never was a tire installer like TIREGUY so I can't speak from experience.
But have a look at this link for some info:
http://www.yourtireprotection.com/about_tires/rotation.htm
Doesn't matter the tire brand or the driver.
the driven axle.
In an x rotation, all wheels cross on the way to the opposite axle. If you do this patern twice then the tires wind up back where they started.
Back to the mod-x, if you use this patern the wheels visit all 4 positions over the next 4 rotations.
Depending on your wishes, if you have a full service spare, it can be included in either patern.
It should be obvious that the mod-x would lead to the most even treadwear and we are talking two wheel drive vehicles. My concern is if rotation is put off say 10k miles in our desert climate, does the stress of changing rotation direction (always happens when you x) hurt the inner workings of the tire more than the even wear helps. BTW, the mod-x is fine for 4wd vehicles operated mainly in 2wd.
Tire Rack doesn't carry Coopers so they aren't in their data base.
Anyway, keep on givin' the good advice. You sure helped me last year.
Noelle
The BFG's may be better in braking but every one else says they are not sat for everything else. Yet CR chose them as best. Sounds like Nokian NRWs got the CR axe because of braking too.
Need some help on replacement tires. I currently have Pirelli's P4000E 225/60/16ZR 98W.
I was told by some tire guys the "98" is the weight load and is more important than the speed rate. Other tire people told me that it really only matters on trucks.
Is my speed rate on my current tires "W"? If so, what does the ZR stand for?
I've been looking at the Bridgestone Turanza LS-Z's. They got great ratings on tirerack.com. My question is that the weight load is 1609 and I think the weight load for 98 is 1653. Does anyone think this matters?
Does anyone have any experience or know someone who has these tires? I believe they just came out this spring. They make them in H, V or Z. I was leaning toward the Z because the V and the Z both have 40,000 mile warranties. Thought the Z would give a softer ride, and also one reviewer on tirerack.com switched from the V to the Z and was happier. The tire guy said I'd get more mileage on the V's, but I don't drive more than 8,000 miles per year, so I'm not that concerned.
Any opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
Leslie
P.S. When shopping for tires, the prices are very negotiable. Went back and forth between Firestone retail shop and Tires Plus. They try to beat each other's price. Price for the Turanza's started at 194.99 each and ended up to be $139.99!!! It pays to shop!
Secondly, you can search by car to find all of the tires they carry that will fit your car.
Thirdly, but less important IMO is that you might find a better deal than in a local tireshop. But it's worth checking.
Thanks again.
Leslie
The 98 is the load index. You need a table which translates into kilograms (or pounds). I do not know why this wasn't listed directly, but it wasn't.
The load index on a tire is a function of the size, so if you stick with the same size you'll get the same load index. Be aware that P metric tires (starts with the letter P) and hard metric (no letter) are slightly different, but can be used pretty much interchangeably.
The W is the speed rating. In earlier times, the speed ratings stopped at V (up to 149 mph) and Z was open ended (the top speed of the vehicle), so you had to be careful to select tires that were at least as capable as the vehicle, which wasn't a problem at the time, because there so few vehicles capable of speed higher than 149 mph.
Times have changed and it became apparent that they needed some closed ended speed ratings in the upper ranges. So ETRTO (European Tire and Rim Technical Organization, the tire standardizing body in Europe) created 2 new speed ratings - W (up to 168 mph) and Y (up to 186 mph). Since you can't change the past, Z was left at open ended with the 149 mph lower limit.
The intent is to allow all the tire manufacturers time to do some testing, redesign, and to change the stamping on their molds. In the meantime, tires can be marked Z with or without the W or Y rating.
Hope this helps.
FYI, a quick approximation is to just MULTIPLY the number of kilograms by 2 to find the number of pounds.
If you need more accuracy, MULTIPLY by two then ADD 1/10 of that to find the number of pounds.
tidester
Host
SUVs; Aftermarket & Accessories
"FYI, a quick approximation is to just MULTIPLY the number of kilograms by 2
to find the number of pounds."
Just so there is no confusion - one Kilogram = 2.2 pounds (or thereabouts)
BUT
100 Load Index equals 800 KG or about 1760 pounds
AND
90 Load index equals 600 kg or about 1320 pounds.
In short, you still need a table to translate Load index into KG's and pounds.
Anyone have either of these tires or other suggestions.
Thanks
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
- - Bret - -
Steve, Host
Was going to get the Dunlop SP A2, but they were out, and the guy said these are even better.
I paid $49 per tire before add'l costs.
How'd I do?
This is for a 1996 Jetta.
This being a Michelin MXV4+, at $115 a pop, I'd like to salvage the tire if possible and SAFE to do so. Can this tire be safely patched from the inside???
The RMA is the collective voice of the rubber industry and reflects their considered advice.
IMHO, 5/8" is way too large to attempt a repair. The tire is likely to fail at some later date. I would not take the risk, if I were you.
BTW, NTB stands for National Tire and Battery.
Hope this helps.
It states the typical customer match as, "value conscious first time replacement buyers interested in good mileage and comfort".
http://www.toyo.com/tires/tire_lines/conven_as/spectrum.html
Seems like a good choice vs. Firestone, General, Uniroyal, Kelly, etc.
My four on the ground are approaching the wear bars and since I don't need an all-season tire, I'm considering the Sumitomo HTR 200 for my '01 LX Accord. I have no experience with this manufacturer, but the Tirerack description seems to fit my needs.
Any feedback on this tire would be greatly appreciated.
So I stopped by some of the local tire dealers and whse. clubs to see what they were offering in 215/55-16. Here's what I found:
Firestone
Bridgestone RE950 - $99.99
Bridgestone Turanza LSH - $99.99
Goodyear
Dunlop SP Sport A2 - $99.00
Dunlop FM901 - $89.00
Amazingly they didn't suggest a Goodyear tire! I asked about the F1 GS-D2 but they couldn't give me a price as they are being discountinued (I knew that and was hoping for a great deal)
Sears
Michelin XGTV4 - $164.99 (on sale)
Yokohama A550V - $124.99
Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus H rated - $172.99
Dunlop SP Sport A2 - $165.99 (uhhh... just a bit overpriced....)
Needless to say I will not be purchasing at Sears.
Sams Club
Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus H rated - $125.32
Goodyear F1 GS-D2 - $136.04 (great price!!)
Mounting & balancing is $9 per tire.
Costco
Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus H rated - $135.99
Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus V rated - $146.99
Michelin Pilot Sport A/S - $184.99
Michelin Pilot Primacy - $185.99
Bridgestone RE950 - $114.99
Mounting & balancing is included.
Kaufmann Tire (local chain)
Toyo Proxes FZ4 - $119.99
They only offered me Toyo and Mastercraft eventhough they are a Pirelli dealer too. The salesguy was the only person who pointed out that since my car came with V rated tires that's all they would sell me due to potential liability issues.
Clearly the Firestone dealer had the best prices as long as I wanted Bridgestone. He highly recommended the Turanza and said he's been installing lots of them on high end cars with very satisfied customers.
I still haven't made up my mind nor am I finished shopping but I thought I'd share these prices with y'all. Comments, questions, ideas welcome.
actually, you can do the research for me. I have a Mxima with 39k on it, and the OE Toyos are running short on tread. Pefectly even wear on each tire, no problems at the edges. My car wears the same size as yours, and there aren't usually too many choices.
I did look at tirerack recently, and they had Yoko Avids (touring or H4, not sure which) for about $65, which is probably what I would go for, since I hope to get new wheels in the spring, and may not make the winter on these tires (they are lousy in the wet).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Great research on the tire prices, Bret - thanks!
Steve, Host
I had some prior generation to those Sumitomo's and loved them.
Great performance and decent wear for a performance tire. Don't expect them to be good in snow. I'd get snow tires for Thanksgiving through April here in Taxachusetts anyhow. I generally find "all season" tires to be a compromise in all 4 seasons.
I did all the research and just put the Bridgestone Turanza LS-Z's on my 1998 XJ8L Jaguar yesterday.
Don't put anything less than a V on your car! You'll get better handling on a higher speed rated tire because the sidewall are stronger. Read about tires on tirerack.com. I learned a whole lot!!!!
I chose the Z's because of the reviews on tirerack.com. (One guy had originally bought the LS-V's and switched to the Z's. He said they handled better).
My decision was also between the Michelin Pilot Sports A/S and the Bridgestone Turanza's. The Turanza's have a 40,000 mile treadwear warranty where the Pilot's don't. The warranty is the same for the LS-V's and LS-Z's, so I got the Z's.
The Turanza's just came out this spring and have the newest technology.
One thing you should know is that tire prices are very negotiable. I paid $134.99 finally after first being quoted $194.99 (retail price).
It may be cheaper for you, as it depends on tire size. My tire size is 225/60/16.
I first got a quote from Tireplus.com on the internet. Then I went to a Tireplus and they gave me an even better price. I then went to Firestone who beat Tireplus's price. Once you decide which tire you want, shop it for price.
I just got the tires yesterday, but they are quiet and handle well. The Turanza's are Grand Touring All Season tires, which is what I wanted for the Jaguar.
Good luck.
I would NOT put a "H" rated tire on the car. Don't go below the lowest recommeded speed rate of "V".
The best tires in your size would probably be the Michelins Pilot Sport A/S.
Hope this helps!
Leslie
But, I'm also looking at the Bridgestone RE950 and the Dunlop SP A2 like others.
I'll be doing something soon because all 4 MXV4+s are near the wear bars at 79k. The Michelins were nice interstate cruising tires on smooth roads, but their wet traction wasn't great. I think I may be able to find better traction for less $ and not give away much in noise and handling.
Anyone out there have Sumitomo HTR200s on a 98-02 Accord?
I'm leaning towards another set of Michelin MXV4's from Costco to take advantage of the rebate. It would put me at the same price as the Turanza LSH and RE950. A set of Pilot A/S even with the rebate would run me $725 installed and that a bit steep for me. But I agree, the Pilot A/S is the ultimate tire of its type on the market and the best stuff is always gonna be pricey.
Can't hurt to shop once you know which tire you want!
Good luck!
Leslie