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Comments
"hard start in morning, engine temp running high and going through some coolant, little chugs and other quirks"
I'm not a mechanic either, but I can understand how the engine can perform badly if the computer isn't accurately receiving some of the inputs it needs (O2 and coolant temperatures) to control the combustion process (fuel flow rate etc.). Since you've replaced the 2 "bad" sensors, and the error codes are still popping up, it makes sense that the ECM is itself bad. But does your above statement imply you are losing coolant?
Appreciate your response. The tend to confirm some of what I am thinking as well, but just not too confident of my own opinion in this area. Thanks for taking the time to help a guy out!
If you do not see a coolant leak, I would be very concerned about where it is going.
Let us know what you find.
Some of these jokers who posted to just ignore the light have no clue how the system works and what it does.Sure,the engine may run fine,but have you ever seen an engine torn down that has been run lean for 10,000 miles?It ran great for those 10,000 miles until the pistons burnt thru.The O2 sensor had gone and the guy was too cheap to find out what the problem was,so instead of spending $50 for the diagnostics and $85 for the sensor,it cost him $2000 for a new engine.Still think ignoring it is a good idea?
Anyway,it should be under warranty,so why not get it fixed?
Does anyone know of a way to do this now? Particularly on a 2000 Honda? Or is a scan tool absolutely required with OBDII?
gditullio,
DTC P0440
Description
The EVAP Large Leak Test is based on applying vacuum to the evaporative emission (EVAP) system and monitoring the rate of vacuum decay. The powertrain control module (PCM) uses the input from the fuel tank pressure (FTP) sensor in order to determine the rate of vacuum decay. At an appropriate time, the PCM turns the EVAP canister purge valve ON (open) and the EVAP canister vent valve ON (closed). This allows the engine to draw a vacuum on the system. At a calibrated time or vacuum level, the PCM turns the purge valve OFF (closed), and tests the system vacuum. If the system is unable to achieve the calibrated vacuum level, the PCM will set DTC P0440.
Conditions for Running the DTC
DTCs P0107, P0108, P0110, P0112, P0113, P0115, P0117, P0118, P0121, P0122, P0123, P0125, P0443, P0449, P0452, P0453, P1106, P1107, P1111, P1112, P1114, P1115, P1121, or P1122 are not set.
The system voltage is between 10-18 volts.
The startup engine coolant temperature (ECT) is between than 4-30°C (39-86°F), but the start up ECT is not more than 8°C (14°F) more than the startup intake air temperature (IAT).
The startup intake air temperature (IAT) is between than 4-30°C (39-86°F), but the start up IAT is not more than 3°C (7°F) more than the startup ECT temperature.
The fuel tank level is between 15-85 percent.
The barometric pressure (BARO) is more than 75 kPa.
The vehicle speed sensor (VSS) is less than 75 mph.
Conditions For Setting the DTC
The EVAP system is not able to achieve or maintain vacuum during the diagnostic test.
Action Taken When the DTC Sets
The control module illuminates the malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) on the second consecutive ignition cycle that the diagnostic runs and fails.
The control module records the operating conditions at the time the diagnostic fails. The first time the diagnostic fails, the control module stores this information in the Failure Records. If the diagnostic reports a failure on the second consecutive ignition cycle, the control module records the operating conditions at the time of the failure. The control module writes the operating conditions to the Freeze Frame and updates the Failure Records.
Conditions for Clearing the MIL/DTC
The control module turns OFF the malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) after 3 consecutive ignition cycles that the diagnostic runs and does not fail.
A current DTC "Last Test Failed" clears when the diagnostic runs and passes.
A history DTC clears after 40 consecutive warm-up cycles, if no failures are reported by this or any other emission related diagnostic.
Use a scan tool in order to clear the MIL and the DTC.
Diagnostic Aids
Use the EVAP pressure/purge diagnostic station in order to pressurize the EVAP system to aid in locating intermittent leaks.
Move all EVAP components while testing with the ultrasonic leak detector.
A temporary blockage in the EVAP canister purge valve, purge pipe or EVAP canister could cause an intermittent condition. To repair a blockage in the EVAP system refer to Evaporative Emission (EVAP) System Cleaning.
S.DiTullio
~Jevin111
Sounds like you have some experience in this area. Can you recommend a decent hand-held model that can be used on all makes and that can monitor signals and not just 'get codes'? Graphing ability and/or interface with a PC is also desireable.
A couple of us discussed this about the scanners,there are links to the scanners too.
Can someone knowledgeable enough to tell why the engine check light on is on though the car is running normal, and temp. is reading normal? I am not sure if i wanna bring it to the shop, please give me suggestions what i should do
thanks
FYI: Mits. Eclipse GST 41,000 miles
S.DiTullio
I'm guessing your Eclipse is fairly new with only 41000 miles (97 or newer?). You'll probably have to hook a reader up to determine what the trouble code is. On older MY vehicles, it often possible to get the code yourself (key sequence, terminal short, etc).
Your best bet may be to just call around and ask what someone would charge you to just read your trouble code. Go to the least expensive (none should really be very expensiv anyway) and then come back here and post what the code is. Guys like 0patience can then let you know what it means and how important it is to get it fixed.
Of course, even if it turns out its fairly benign, you probably still want to get it fixed so that next time, when a trouble happens that is critical, you'll be aware because the CEL came back on. If you're driving around with the CEL on all the time you wouldn't know.
If there is another dealer near you,I would suggest going there.This dealer does not want to deal with you.Whether the light is on or not,the codes will be stored for a number of restarts,usually 10-20.If OnStar can pull the codes,then the dealer should have had no problem getting them.There are times that it will turn the light on with a temporary fault code,but that isn't the way the system is designed.
3:00 customer service calls. I explain everything to them. They said they would check it out.
3:15 customer service calls back and said that they talked to the service manager and that they agree with him that unless the light isn't on they can't figure out what is wrong. That I should just drive it till it comes back on. I told them I want a list from the service manager on everything they had supposely checked so when I call GM I can tell them what they did. Customer service said okay.
3:25 Service manager calls and said that the check engine light came back on and that they have p0442. And that they will have my car ready in an hour. When questioned about how this could happen in 10 minutes he said well sometimes this is how things happen. My final line to him was:
I might have been born at night...but not last night. Did they fix it? I don't know.. Will I take it back to them? I looking for a new Olds service department. I was thinking of still contacting GM's Olds division and ask them if they could recommend a dealer. Will keep you updated...Thanks to all
S.Ditullio
If you want to e-mail me the VIN number,I will see if the same info comes up.They have to be using the same system,so I don't see how they could come up with different info.Hmmmmmm.
I checked thru all of the software and manuals I have for your vehicle and can't find a P1710.
It wouldn't be a P01710,as the zero is not used on the 1000 codes.But,if the mechanic wants to replace the sensor because of the code,ask him if he tested the sensor.If the fault was a problem fault,it would have illuminated the check engine light again,even if he cleared the codes.
If the O2 sensor is bad,then performance and fuel economy will suffer.
S.DiTullio
Are you saying your engine overheats in 4wd, but not in 2wd, going up a long steep slope?
I did say that actron was an adequate scanner.
AutoXray will show realtime moniter modes.
Actron won't,but it will do everything else.
AutoTap is a PC based program that will pull the codes,clear them and moniter,but it is also about $400 for GM,Chrysler and Ford capabilities and the other manufacturers aren't available yet.And it will probably cost over $100 for the upgrades to the other manufacturer's.
I use Snap-On's MT2500 scanner and OTC's scanner at work(they both are in the couple thousand dollar range) and an AutoXray scanner at home.
I have had to deal with numerous scanners and have found bad ones and good ones.The ones I listed in posts 276 and 278 are ones that I would recommend,but that is my personal opinion.
What will happen by driving it with the faulty O2 sensor.
Click on This link and ask "wire",give him as much information as you can on it,he is the only mechanic I would have work on a Mercedes.If you can provide him with the info of trouble codes and such from the work order,he will be able to assist you better.
butch11,
just because the code came up for the O2 sensor,it is a circuit fault,which could be the sensor or the circuit.Running with the O2 sesnor not working will put it into a "limp" mode and if you run too long that way,it will eventually take it's toll on the engine.What was the code?Maybe we can help you test it.Also,a $90 sesnor is cheaper than an engine rebuild.Check Expressautoparts.com for pricing.
modst1,
Need to know what the codes were to help you.
I am worried about one thing, 'Check engine light' glowing up everytime i start my vehicle, and then it goes off after some time, is this a problem or is this the way it is supposed to be...
Someone please help me out...
thanx
Its there for about 10-15 seconds.
Maybe, then its just a lamp check... please confirm.
If you are in an area that does emission tests,you are not in a very good condition.It is illegal to alter emission controls on vehicles and it carries a hefty fine.
The only way that you are going to cure the problem and get it running right,is to replace the bad converter.
There is no way to adjust the computer,it is the PROM(Programmable Read Only Memory) that tells it what to do.And unless you know someone that can reprogram them and is willing to take the liability of the fine on the off chance that DEQ decides to check it,there isn't much that you can do.
I'm not that knowledgeable on your vehicle,but if a sensor was incorperated in the exhaust system by the manufacturer,it was put there for a reason,whether it wsa to make it meet the emissions specs or to make it run better,unless you are exactly sure what you are doing,making modifications to these newer vehicles will give you nothing but headaches.
The days of modifying engines on shoestring budgets are just about over.
These computer systems are real touchy about having things changed on them,they deal in a range of absolute values and modifying them changes those values.
I wasn't happy when electronic distributers came out,these computers are much worse.