-June 2024 Special Lease Deals-
2024 Chevy Blazer EV lease from Bayway Auto Group Click here
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee lease from Mark Dodge Click here
2025 Ram 1500 Factory Order Discounts from Mark Dodge Click here
2024 Chevy Blazer EV lease from Bayway Auto Group Click here
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee lease from Mark Dodge Click here
2025 Ram 1500 Factory Order Discounts from Mark Dodge Click here
Options
Ford 3.8 head gasket, AXOD transmission failures Windstar Taurus Sable - Ford secret warranty?
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
I don't think that Ford Motor Company would like a featured story on "60 Minutes" regarding these problems, do you?
At approximately 38,000 mile I began noticing oil spots in my garage. My local mechanic told me it was the main engine seal. I brought it in to Colonial Ford for service again. This time I was quoted a cost of $1200.00 to repair it. I believe that the engine had to be pulled to do this repair. After complaining vehemently to the Customer Assistance Center (and I am not sure what justifies their existence) , Colonial Ford's Service Manager , who in turn he was addressing the concern with some Regional Rep. ... Everyone finally agreed that I should be responsible for $190.00 and that Ford / The Dealer would cover the rest.
Now, at approximately 50,000 miles my transmission has to be replaced. The cost is $2400.00. The dealer will not assist, and I have been told that the Regional Rep will not assist. I once again called the Customer Assistance Center (CAC), and they (Debbie id # 2226) were absolutely no assistance. Not only did they not help, they would not put a supervisor on the phone and told me that my only course of action was to write to you, the CEO of the company.
I spoke with the Regional Rep, Laurie Leslie, on November 2. She stated that Ford will not assist in the cost of repair. I told her that I would like to speak with her manager, she said that she reports to Detroit, and that I could write the CAC. Once again, the CAC is useless.
I will never by another Ford again.
At approximately 11,000 miles the transmission
stopped shifting. I had it towed to Colonial Ford,
Danbury, CT for warranty service. They held it for
a few days (they were nice enough to loan me a
vehicle while they had the van). They 'cleared the
memory on the computer that controls the
transmission'. A week or so later the same problem
happened again. I had to have it towed back to
Colonial Ford again, where they had to fix the
computer again.
At approximately 38,000 mile I began noticing oil
spots in my garage. My local mechanic told me it
was the main engine seal. I brought it in to
Colonial Ford for service again. This time I was
quoted a cost of $1200.00 to repair it. I believe
that the engine had to be pulled to do this After complaining vehemently to the Customer
Assistance Center (and I am not sure what justifies their existence) , Colonial Ford's Service Manager, who in turn he was addressing the concern with some Regional Rep. ... Everyone finally agreed that I should be responsible for $190.00 and that Ford / The Dealer would cover the rest.
Now, at approximately 50,000 miles my transmission
has to be replaced. The cost is $2400.00. The
dealer will not assist, and I have been told that
the Regional Rep will not assist. I once again
called the Customer Assistance Center (CAC), and
they (Debbie id # 2226) were absolutely no
assistance. Not only did they not help, they would
not put a supervisor on the phone and told me that
my only course of action was to write to you, the
CEO of the company.
I spoke with the Regional Rep, Laurie Leslie, on
November 2. She stated that Ford will not assist in the cost of repair. I told her that I would like to speak with her manager, she said that she
reports to Detroit, and that I could write the CAC. Once again, the CAC is useless.
I am now drafting a letter to the Ford CEO.
I will never by another Ford again.
"Government engineers analyze the problem. If warranted, the manufacturer is asked to conduct a recall. If the manufacturer does not initiate a recall, the government can order the manufacturer to do a recall.
We do not have to receive a set number of reports before we look into a problem. We gather all available information on a problem. Your report is important to us."
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/
"Government engineers analyze the problem. If warranted, the manufacturer is asked to conduct a recall. If the manufacturer does not initiate a recall, the government can order the manufacturer to do a recall.
We do not have to receive a set number of reports before we look into a problem. We gather all available information on a problem. Your report is important to us."
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/
It covers the 96-97 Thunderbird, 96-98 mustang, WINDSTAR, 97-98 E150,f250,f150 and 96-97 cougar.
"Issue
Engine coolant may be leaking into the engine oil on some vehicles. The internal coolant leak may be difficult to identify. This may be caused by the lower intake manifold side gaskets and/or front cover gaskets allowing coolant to pass into the cylinders and/or the crankcase.
Action
Revised lower intake manifold side and front cover gaskets have been released for service. Refer to the following text and Application Chart for details"
I've talked with a mechanic at Ford who says the intake gasket was redesigned with this fix because it wasn't able to withstand the heat. If you redesign something, doesn't that mean the first one wasn't designed properly? And shouldn't anyone who has to replace an engine because of this error, be reimbursed? (I know, I'm talking to the choir) It sounds like this may be Verse 2 of the head gasket problem. It may answer why the 96/97 Windstar are having problems even after the head gasket was redesigned.
As I'm searching the net tonight (12/13/99) looking for information on the 2000 Windstars, I just happened to fall unto this chatroom. When I started reading I couldn't believe what my eyes were seeing - I had just picked up my 1996 Ford Windstar 3.8L van from the Ford dealer for the very exact problem y'all have been writing about!
Would you believe that I have had this van at the Ford dealership since September 30th!!!! My wife and I were heading to Northern Wisconsin for a little R & R when the van blew up! After sitting for almost 2 hours waiting for a tow truck, we headed to the local Ford dealership in Portage, Wisconsin, about 15 miles north of where the van crapped out. This is about 2 1/2 hours from our home. The dealer's service manager was kind enough to look at the van for us (it was almost quitting time). Upon examination, I was told that the engine block heater plug (?) blew out. When I asked what caused it, they gave no explanation. After an hour the plug was replaced and the engine was started up and within a couple of minutes it blew out the new plug. I was then told that my engine had a blown head gasket. So it started, $120.00 shot down the drain... and it wasn't fixed.
The dealer had my van for almost a month before he got around to fixing it. I had to drive north to pick it up, and didn't get more than an hour and change down the road and the engine light went on. Contacting the dealer that next week he told me that he didn't know what could have caused this and we agreed to take it to my local Ford dealer in Elkhorn, Wisconsin. They looked at and determined that there were more problems. I then called the Ford dealer that had supposedly fixed it and made them come and pick it up and drive it back to their shop. After a few more weeks of screwing around, they determined that there must be something wrong with the cylinder head, so off it came again! After pulling it apart it was determined that one of the valves wasn't seating properly - why it happened, I never did get any explanation. So a few more weeks in the garage.
We drove back the 2 1/2 hours to pick it up and this time only got about 45 minutes down the road when the "check engine" light came on again. So another trip down by the dealer to pick up the van! They kept it this time for sever more weeks to determine that there was a cracked vacuum hose - figured it happended because of all the times they took the damn engine apart!!!
I just picked it up two days ago and so far the light hasn't gone on. However, now I have a crazy brake light coming one whenever it feels like it for no apparent reason. So again, tomorrow I will call my local dealer to check it out! I'm sure it has nothing to do with the head gasket thing, but why does it now pop up after they've had the van for months and months. Remember, I had the orginal problem on September 30th, and picked it up on December 11th! Gee, it's only taken over 2 1/2 months for a little repair job! And almost $1,500.00 for the repair.
Oh ya, I do have an extra vehicle that we've been driving during this mess... guess what it is - a 1996 3.8L Ford Taurus!!!!! I had just placed an ad in the newspaper to sell this vehicle when my van broke down, and after $170.00 to detail it for sale, and $150.00 in ads, I had to pull the ad so we could use the car. (Another $320.00 down the drain.)
Almost forgot, I too called Ford Motor Company after a friend of mine who is a service manager at a Ford dealer in Illinois told me about the head gasket problem and that they've changed dozens and dozens of them, I got absolutely nowhere with them. The lady on the phone was pleasant, but gave me no help at all. And, she acted like this was the first time she'd heard it!!! Ummmmmm.
Anyway dear 3.8L Ford motor buddies, after my lovely experience and reading all of your lovely Christmas greetings on Ford's problem, I can tell you that not only am I going to sell the Taurus, the van is going ASAP. I was originally thinking about replacing it with a 2000 Windstar (before I started reading these emails), but I'm so fed up with Ford, and believe me, my family have been extremly loyal Ford owners since the 30's, I think maybe I'll go back to Honda. Their new Odyssey looks like a real winner!!! I owned a 91 Honda Civic and it was one of the best cars I've ever owned. I think it's time to try another.
One last thing, I was told by a very good source that works with Ford (that service manager friend of mine from Illinois) that Ford is so damn big they don't care about the individual buyer. Well, now I believe him since I'm living the hell of the 3.8L mess! Good riddens to them. If they can't step forward and accept the fact that they screwed up and stand behind their products, then we as consumers should not stand, but get our feet to do the walking.... right down the block to their competitors, I am.
Sorry for the long letter, but I felt it important to give you all another example of how the big boys in Detroit can stick it to the little guy. Sort of like the government...
Good night and Merry Christmas!
Dear General Motors Customer:
As the owner of a 1992 or 1993 Chevrolet Cavalier equipped with a 2.2L engine, your satisfaction with our product is of the utmost concern to us. Your vehicle was provided with a new vehicle warranty, which covers certain parts of your vehicle for a specified period. These warranties are of considerable value to you if you should experience problems with your vehicle.
This letter is intended to make you aware that some 1992 and 1993 Chevrolet Cavalier models with 2.2L engines may develop a failure of the Cylinder head gasket that allows coolant to leak from the cylinder head gasket To engine block joint. Early evidence of this would be a loss of coolant in the coolant reservoir and an odour of coolant from the engine compartment, or a low coolant lamp. There may also be visible coolant deposits
at the cylinder head to engine block joint.
General Motors of Canada Limited is, therefore, taking the following action:
We are providing owners with special coverage. If the above-mentioned condition occurs within seven(7) years of the date your vehicle was originally placed in service or 160,000 km, whichever occurs first, your vehicle will be repaired for you at no charge.
This special policy applies only to repairs requiring cylinder head gasket replacement as a result of cylinder head gasket failure that results in an engine coolant leak. It does not cover engine damage from continuing to operate the engine in an overheated condition after loss of coolant.
This is not a recall campaign. Do not take your vehicle to your GM dealer as a result of this letter unless you believe that yourvehicle has the condition as described above. Keep this letter with your other important glove box literature for future reference.
If you have already paid for some or all of the cost to have the Cylinder head gasket replaced and in-service time was less than seven(7) years and 160,000 km, you should contact your GM dealer. You may be eligible for partial or complete reimbursement costs if genuine GM parts were used in the repair/ If the work was done by someone other than a GM dealership the amount of reimbursement may be limited to the amount the repair would have cost GM to have it completed by a GM dealership. Please provide your dealer with your original paid receipts or invoices verifying the repair, the amount charged, proof of payment, and the date of payment of those charges by March 1, 1997.
Repairs and adjustments qualifying under this Special Policy coverage must be performed by your GM dealer.
*** end of letter ***
GM offererd a 7 year, 100K mile warranty for the problem. Ford extended the warranty to 5 years or 60K miles. And, they didn't notify all the owners...some sort of "selective notification" was used.
Ford should look at how GM handled a problem...the above example may be one of the reasons that my charts show few complaints for GM in the NHTSA database...they took care of the customers.
I can see why it has such a good safety rating. It's never on the road long enough to be in an accident. I do have to admit that the service department is friendly and helpful. But I purchase a vehicle in hopes it would be reliable enough to take my family on short trips. My confidence in Ford products has been shaken up from this experience and I will think twice before I buy another Ford Product.
this. Contacted Ford. He acknowledged this is their problem, however, they say the time for the "extended"warranty evoked by this problem expired 12/98 or at 60k miles. The estimated repair is about $2000. It wasn't my
action or inaction that caused this failure, and Ford acknowledges this and that their faulty head gasket caused this.
Ford claims they "weren't aware of any problems" with the 3.8 V6...and you are not alone in having the head gasket fail twice...check out this web site to find that you are in good company:
http://home.att.net/~ccatanese/ford
There are lots of links for you and others to read up on "Job 1" at Ford.
Head gaskets in 3.8 V6's were a problem at Ford from the late 80's thru 1996. Check out the links, and good luck (but don't hold your breath).
As I think back on this I have own 3 Fords (1966, 1978 and the 1995) and everyone of them had transmission problems. I guess the saying Fix or Repair Daily is true. Ford has lost a customer forever after this last experience.
I just bought a new VW Jetta and love it. I have owned VW's and Toyotas and never had any major problems with them and look forward to long and reliable service from my new Jetta, something I never got from my Fords!
It's interesting how all of these problems (according to the other posts) start happening around the 67,000 mark. Very suspicious. How much money can I expect to be out? I live in Tulsa and all Ford dealerships here are owned directly by Ford (Tulsa Auto Collection). Do you think that would help in me getting them to pay for the cost of repair?
Comments/Thoughts are appreciated. Thanks.
I can't help but think Ford does meticulous "wear engineering" on their parts, they seem to have it timed so they crap out just after the warranty runs out....
Ford/Mercury shame on you!
Unless you got an extended warranty, forget about getting any assistance from Ford. I'm afraid you'll be in the same boat I am when the head gaskets blew in my 3.8L 93 T-bird. They "weren't aware" of any problems with those either. The best I could do was hit myself upside the head and say "Wow...I shoulda got a V8!"
Well there's no class action lawsuit or hidden warranty for my problem however ya'll older models may still have an option.... go to http://members.aol.com/MKBradley/index.html . They're filing a class action lawsuit. GOOD LUCK!!
I dropped my car w/Sil-Terhar whom informed me that my head-gasket needed to be replaced. I drove my car off the lot and it misfired all over the place (not the car I dropped off). When I confronted the service manager he told me it *was* my head gasket.
I was flabbergasted to think my car's original problem was a gasket and could only think that Sil-Terhar themselves must have caused the problem, why else would it run so bad?
The second day I talked with another service manager whom informed me that the plug was "bad" and Sil-Terhar would fix it at no cost to me (after laughing when I asked them was tests they performed on my engine to cause such a problem). They also informed me that they have enough business leaving me with the distinct impression of "we don't care".
Not only had Sil-Terhar must have damaged my plug upon inspection but they were more than happy to have me shell out $1400 based solely upon a visual inspection of a single spark plug.
Strike 1 againest Ford - their dealers.
I then took my car to a reputable (non-Ford) shop
where they confirmed the head-gasket by running a chemical test on the coolant itself, a complete inspection of the engine itself, and a serious of follow-ups questions about the cars behavior.
He also informed me that the 3.8L had a reputation for the head gasket (Sil-Terhar also stated they worked on 3-4 heads a week).
Strike 2 againest Ford -- their product.
I then proceeded to talk Ford's customer care 800 number, what a waste of time. I first talked to someone that told me that there was no warranty or recall at this time. I asked to speak to someone in charge and I was told someone would contact me within 24hrs.
46 hours later I called again and complained. An hour later "Annette" called back. I explained the problem with my car, and their dealer, and that this was my 4th Ford product. I also told her that I was looked to buy a mini-van and her decisions could seriously affect my future Ford purchases.
She told me repeated that Ford would offer no assistance and that was Ford's FINAL statement on the matter (but she *was* documenting everything).
I asked to talk to her supervisor or someone who could make an informed decision and she:
would NOT pass my name to anyone else
would NOT have anyone contact me
would NOT provide the name of anyone else.
Strike 3 -- Ford's customer service
I have always felt strongly about Ford products but never again.
- New head gasket (with associated other things that fail)
- New water pump
- New radiator fan
- New power steering pump
- New transmission
- New power antanae
- Blown AC - (not covered due to failure of a non covered hose)
- New rack and pinion gear
- Frequent and unsuccessful attempts at alignment to fix tendency to pull right (at 2 different dealers as well as independant shops)
- Broken $1 part in steering column causing $400 repair so car could be turned off.
- New belt idler
This car replaced an 87 Accord which was wrecked. I thought I'd give FORD a try. Never again for their automobiles. I do however own a 98 F150 which has been great so far - I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this won't be the lemon the SABLE was.
I had the van in 7/98 for the recall!!
So, like the rest of you, I am stuck and looking for a new van. I put some BARS into the radiator and it sealed the gasket for the moment. FORD SUCKS!!! I wish we could start a class action suit about those head gaskets. Ford knew about them and refused to fix them. I kept up my part of the warranty and they didn't uphold theirs!!
Buyer beware!!
We called Ford Customer Care, who told us that at 60,001 miles, Ford would charge FULL price for new head gasket. I called back the next day and was told that Ford would offer me a "Financial Incentive" if, in fact, it was the head gasket that blew. He stated that depending on inspection of my van's head gasket, Ford may pay one-half, 75%, or even the entire amount, since Ford is well aware of the head gasket problems on the 95 Windstar and I was just over the warranty miles.
I towed my van towed to the nearest dealer, who informed me that they have NEVER heard of Ford offering a financial incentive. They told me that I am over the 60,000 mile warranty, and would have to pay in full for new head gasket.
They told me that the person at Customer Care had NO BUSINESS making that statement to me. They stated that Customer Care is there only to refer customers to the closest dealers.
Two days later, Ford called and told me that they would replace my head gasket, timing cover gasket, water pump, hoses, etc for the price of an extended warranty, that being $ 495. They told me my oxygen sensors were blown (2 x $75) and that my radiator was needing attention, both of which were not covered under this price.
After stumbling across these postings while my van was in the shop (3 weeks), I went out van shopping the next day. Within two days, I leased a Toyota Sienna, and traded in my Windstar.
I also wrote FORD and received a call from the great customer service ctr which gave the standard "we'll document everything but right now there is nothing we can do"
I'm thinking about joining a class action suit, but there is one thing I can do which is NEVER EVER BUY ANOTHER FORD AGAIN, and I will also strongly discourage family and freinds from doing so.
By the way I also own an Isuzu Oasis/Honda Oddessey for 3 years not one problem. They did send me a recall that notified me that I will have to bring the car in after 50K for service on the emission system, but they will give me a free oil change and tune up. Now that is customer service.
Bottom Line - If you thinking about buying a FORD product don't do it. They may be cheaper than honda and toyotas but you will end up saving time and money in repairs.
your new host, Bruce
Also, if your "Check Engine" light comes on, it's your head gasket. DON'T let the dealer tell you it's the oxygen sensor (our mistake). Replacing the oxygen sensor will get the light to turn off for a while, but that's a pretty sure sign that your gaskets are getting ready to go. Also, it's a whole lot better if you can get them replaced before they blow out on the highway. Ford won't cover the cost of other damage caused by the gasket failure. If your over 60K miles, they won't cover your head gaskets either.
Do I understand correctly that the engine and transmission are under warranty for 60k miles? I couldn't find any transmission warranty coverage in the owner's manual.
Where can I run to and get the engine and transmission checked? Seems like NOT a local Ford dealership!