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Comments
..Mike
..Mike
Anyway, since then I have not been able to find any further information on the Exiga / Sportvan. Has anyone else heard of it and Subaru's production plans for it? Seemingly it has been canceled.
http://www.irvinesubaru.com/tomorrow/exiga.htm
Bob
I would, however, like to see them build on the idea of 3 rows of seats, perhaps on a hybrid based on the Outback, but taller. Call it the Forester Plus or the Grand Forester.
Note the cool, integrated seat belts, the swivel rear seats, and the raised roof that hints at the Outback.
-juice
I could also see a larger hybrid, about the size of an RX 300. But please don't call it a "Grand" (whatever). That word, along with the word "Limited" should be banished from automotive lexicon. They're both so overused, that any meaning is completely lost.
Bob
Jeff
Or go into www.INFOSEEK.com and type in a search for SUBARU EXIGA SPORTVAN. The first or second link will take you there @ NEWS & REVIEWS.
Jeff
After GM bought into Subaru, it'll be unlikely to see Subaru venture (pardon the pun) into minivan territory.
But a hybrid with 3 rows, I can see. Once the Pontiac Aztec bombs (we know it will) they may give that mid $20s hybrid niche to Subaru to exploit.
-juice
PS Anyone else see the Legacy ads touting IIHS safety scores? They show the Malibu and say that the competition is banging their heads up against the wall. Has GM seen this yet?
The Streega came next, and the Forester was based on that concept.
-juice
The following is the link:
http://www.subaru.co.jp/
Please note, I had trouble loading a number of pages from this site. They just redesigned the site, and it must still have some cyber-bugs in it.
Bob
Just took a look at the Subaru of Japan's website. The site is pretty slow, but I managed to get some of the highlights:
Options:
- Only the new Legacy Lancaster-6 gets the H6
- The H6 is available only in AT (4-speed), but it comes with a low-range
- VTD 4WD (similar to a Torsen differential) is standard with the Lancaster-6 and VDC is an option
- Standard Momo steering wheel
- Standard 6-speaker CD changer audio, optional McIntosh system
- Standard ISO FIX child seat attachments, optional side air bags
Stats:
- Fuel milage 10.4 km/l (vs. 11.4 with the 2.5L SOHC)
- Compression ratio: 10.7
- Max Power 162kW(220ps)@6000RPM
- Max Torque 289 N-m (29.5 kg-m)@4400RPM
Here's a cool graph with the torque and HP curves for the H6 and H4 superimposed:
http://www.subaru.co.jp/legacy/l_caster/img/lc_dr01p.gif
Here's a cool split-schematic showing the H6 and H4 to demonstrate how the H6 is only 18mm longer:
http://www.subaru.co.jp/legacy/l_caster/img/lc_en04p.gif
Low range, momo,...man, they always get the good stuff.
ISOFIX is the new child seat attachment standard. It's basically a metal bar that seats will clamp onto, eliminating the frustration with belts. Good to know Subaru is on the ball. This should trickle down to other models within a year.
The compression ratio is higher than ours (10:1). No wonder premium is recommended (though not required).
Oddly, the graph shows it makes less torque than the 2.5l until 3500 rpm or so.
Mileage drops 8.7%. Lessee, it's 22/27 for the auto now, so that's about 20/25 mpg. Not bad, that's actually what my guess was!
-juice
pistons is reduced. Just out of curiosity
will this effect the noise level of the new
H6. Will we hear more engine growl or tapping?
Does anyone know if this engine will run hotter
than the H4 due to it's density being increased
over the H4?
Thanks for the Link Bob.
Anyone?
I was able to find the the "Spec" page where they listed all the various Lancasters, and if I'm not mistaken, the H-6 didn't offer the low range.
Bob
I was also suprised to see that torque is lower than the 2.5L. I wonder how that would translate into the driving experience.
http://www.subaru.co.jp/legacy/l_caster/lc_data/feq_seid.htm
juice -- On the engine spec page, both the H4 and H6 have premium fuel as "recommended". There's a note on the bottom that states that you can use regular but at the expense of performance.
What then would be the effect of using premium in the US version H4?
Ken
I know that VDC, which we're just getting, has be available from day one on several of the high-performance Japanese-spec Legacys.
Bob
not at all, why would you think so?
if you want a real world example, try the vw vr6. it innovated the close bore spacing that actually worked without overheating.
-Colin
Thanks for the post.
Perhaps I'm relating larger W/ louder. That question was somewhat impulsive.
OK, that answers my question "close bore spacing"
Hmm...YOU FOLKS KNOW YOUR STUFF.
All ears on this subject from now on!
Later
Drew -- Yeah, I get that comment all the time. Imagine if I bought a Grand Vitara or something. True story, but when I was growing up there were virtually no other Japanese-Americans in my home town of Brooklyn, let alone Suzukis. We would occasionally get phone calls from people asking if they could bring in their motorcycles for repair. Of course, they wouldn't believe us when we told them that it was a residential listing.
On another note, I downloaded a fair number of racing video clips (of stock Japanese cars) from a Honda website a few months ago. I wish I could understand what the drivers are saying though (it's all in Japanese) because they get pretty excited at certain points. Oh, and I just recalled that they race a white Subaru WRX (I think) against about 5 or 6 other super cars on a race track. Guess who won? The Subaru, of course! It's too bad that I can't remember where I downloaded these clips from, because I'm sure that you guys would get a kick out of it.
Download the video clips under the Tsukuba Challenge. I guarantee that any Subaru fan who watches these video clips will get a huge kick out of them. Also note the very fluid heel-toe accelerator and brake maneuvers that the drivers use.
Enjoy!
Drew
A 6 cylinder engine will make more noise than a 4 cylinder engine, all things being equal. See the paragraph above for reasons why. Modern, well designed and executed motors such as the H4 make darned little noise however, so my guess on the H6 is that darned little + a little more is going to = darned little still. As for the famous boxer grumble - I'm looking forward to it!
Cheers,
WDB
That Suzuki story cracked me up.
-juice
PS I'll have to check out those clips when I get the chance
Along that same thought, I've often wondered, when seeing anything in writen Japanese, as to why there is often "English" words/letterforms (and numbers) mixed in with the Japanese letterforms? Are there no direct Japanese translations? I'm especially interested as to why numbers are not shown in Japanese? I find it hard to believe that there are no Japanese number/letterforms. How do Japanese express mathematics in writing?
I have (as I'm sure others have) been frustrated that the Japanese Subaru site is not offered in English, as well as Japanese. I know there is an "English version" that you can choose, but it is of Euro-spec Subarus, not Japanese Subarus.
I have e-mailed SOA several times regarding this matter, in hopes that my message would get to the right parties. So far nothing has happened.
I would think the Japanese web site offers a way to offer comments and suggestions. Is that something you can do? Would it require that your computer needs to be able to set Japanese letterforms, or can it be done in English?
Bob
Subaru WRX Impreza (twin turbo, of course)
Honda Integra R
Mitsubishi FTO Version R
Honda Civic R
Toyota Levin BZ-R (racing version of a Corolla)
Honda Civic SiR
Mitsubishi Lancer Evo IV
Note that I got this off the very last clip.
Based on the drivers' comments, I would guess that they all kind of know one another since many of the comments are pretty funny. The commentary seemed to focus on the Impreza and Civic R. Basically, the Impreza kicks the Civic R's butt on the straightaways -- the Civic R driver comments that he looses on the straightaways while he's waiting for VTEC to kick in.
Let me know if there's any particular 'scene' you want translated.
Ken
Well Bob, I don't know anything about Japanese so let me speculate
Many webpage editors are written by English-speaking programmers (USA, Canada, UK, Ireland, India). I'm guessing the webpage editor in which FHI wrote (developed) the site forces you to write the original copy in English, then translate it to other languages like Japanese, English, or whatever. On the FHI & Subaru sites, most of the English text is on menus or tables, whereas the Japanese text is in the "free form" areas containing "simple" copy (i.e., it's not used for navigating the site).
It's possible that the author of the webpage editor is busy adding features instead of fleshing out the nuances of the translation functions (which ought to be done). I could be totally wrong but hey, I develop software. Developers are lazy (actually a good thing but I won't digress); developers are constantly pressured by the marketing folks, who are pressured by the, well, market.
Drat, no Subaru content again!
..Mike
..Mike
It really amasses me SOJ has not done a direct English translation of their home site. Most companies that have a large international presence, offer two versions of their web sites: one for the native audience, and the other English. English is, after all, really "the" international language.
Bob
Bob
- JDM (Japan Domestic Market) [you know but others might not] site in Japanese
- SoJ site in English for mostly North American models (because many think English = NA)
- SoA, SoC, IM (UK), SoAU, etc. for models available in each respective country
That being said, I agree with you SoJ ought to translate the site to English (might even be the push of a button!), and not just for enthusiasts.Ken, Interesting comment that it's considered more 'fashionable' to have English words peppered through product descriptions. Those fool marketing types again
..Mike
..Mike
So the Japan-spec Forester are the C/20 (2.0l), S/20 (2.0l), T/25 (2.5l VVT), and S/tb (2.0 turbo)? Do they give power ratings? Guess it would be metric, actually.
Bob: I figures out the mystery! They don't WANT us to know they have variable valve timing and turbo models at home!
Brazil is the same way. English words get thrown in all the time, especially in marketing. The top selling cigarrette is called "Hollywood" and it's pronounced oh-lee-UU-jee.
-juice
Any word if the 2.5L is going to gain 10-13HP as mentioned in the auto mags a few months ago? Believe I read it in the caption for a Soobie show, not positive though...
Finally, Subaru release any specs on the supercharged engine that have in the STX Brat Wanna-Be show vehicle?
-beanboy
Well, having looked at the SOJ web site, here are some more observations: (Ken, I may need your help here)
The home-market Legacy sedan is offered in three models: B-4, B-4 RS, and the range-topping twin turbo B-4 RSK. It appears that the base-level B-4 is much the same (content-wise) as our base Legacy GT. There doesn't appear to be a Legacy "L" level sedan sold in Japan. (Ken, am I right?)
The Legacy Wagon in Japan is known as the Touring Wagon. They offer nine variations of this wagon. I can't speak to trim levels of the various Touring wagons, but I would assume there is a base-level choice among the nine models. (Ken -- HELP!)
The Lancaster Wagon (our Outback) is offered in four different trim levels, topping out with the recently added H-6. The H-6 appears to be very similar to to our new H-6 VDC. (Ken, need your help with trim levels -- is there an entry-level Lancaster that matchs our base Outback?) If you include the the nine Legacy Touring Wagons, Subaru offers 13 Lagacy-based wagons for this tiny island's home market. Boy, talk about over-kill!
Granted, Subaru's home market needs are different than ours, but perhaps an international marketing trend can be spotted here?
Bob
Bob
The ST-X adds an Eaton supercharger to the 2.5l Phase II for 230hp. Sounds like fun! Hope they sell it like Toyota does with TRD, i.e. as a stand alone add on, dealer installed. Hey - you guys need a guinea pig? Anyone out there? Hello?
Yeah, the 2.5l will probably creep up in power, though don't expect anything too dramatic. Should offset weight gain due to higher equipment levels, and then some.
-juice
strength-wise when a supercharger or turbocharger was added.
You might check out the last few issues of Sport Compact Car's project Impreza RS. The long and short of it is that if you tune it properly and keep detonation at bay, the EJ25 is strong.
-Colin
..Mike
..Mike
I was on vacation for the last two weeks and didn't get to respond to your post #256 regarding various Legacy trims in Japan.
No, there isn't a base Legacy sedan sold in Japan. Like you wrote, there are only three trims available (RS, RS Type B and RSK). The main differences between the three is the engine and AWD system.
As for the Legacy Wagons, there are 9 different models with the TX being the most basic. The TX comes only with a 2.0L engine and has very few options. On the other end are the GTs with the dual stage turbos and "European tuned" suspension (Bilstein shocks).
Finally, for the Lancaster wagons, there really isn't one that matches our base Outback. The standard Lancaster is the closest, but it comes with the 2.5L DOHC engine with variable valve timing.
Hope this helps,
Ken
Bob
-juice
The 2.5L engine in the Legacy Lancaster comes with DOHC. The stats are:
Max Power: 123kW (165HP)@6000RPM
Max Torque: 235N-m (173ft-lbs)@6000RPM
Displacement: 2457cc
Compression ratio: 10.7
Unfortunately, I couldn't find any detailed info that would address timing belts or chain usage.
I noticed it was tuned for extra torque.
The ADA sounds a bit like the adaptive cruise control I believe Mercedes (?) offers.
-juice
Bob
Mind you, I feel the same way about Cruise Control.
Just my $.02
Randy