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Comments
The Trooper is a much larger, and more expensive truck-based SUV. It's a good value, as Piason will atest to. But it is a truck, so you get all the good (and bad) that comes with the territory.
As a daily driver, the Forester is much more fun to drive, and certainly more economical. The biggest complaint about the Forester is that the rear seat room is a bit on the small side. If that's a concern, I would look at the larger Legacy or Outback. They're much roomier than the Forester - and great in the snow too.
If you plan to do any moderate towing, the Trooper would be better suited for that.
Bob
How many Crew members have already driven in snow or ice this year? My winter tires are stacked in the garage and ready but lately it hasn't been below 60F. Today was 50 and rainy.
I think I'll mount my wife's winter tires this weekend, getting surprised in the Miata won't be cool at all.
-Colin
Fred: Trooper or Forester? Boy, they're very different animals. Get the Trooper if you want the Sidekick squared. More power, more space, more quality. More everything.
The Forester is different. It's lighter, more nimble and car-like. If the Sidekick made you tired and uncomfortable, this would be the direction to go.
No snow yet. Very mild fall so far here in DC.
I have an admission to make. With the dream of the WRX blown (budget won't nearly cut it), we picked up a used "toy" car instead.
Can you guess what it is? It has a longitudinally mounted engine. A rear viscous limited slip differential. Built in Japan. 4 wheel disc brakes, alloys, 5 speed. 4 cylinder, 16 valves.
Another hint: it's not FWD.
-juice
They handle well, with mild upgrades of course.
-Colin
-juice
I was going to guess a Subaru Impreza 2.5RS, but the Subaru doesn't have a longitudinally mounted engine.
Drew/aling
Townhall Community Leader/Vans Conference
Besides that I'm stumped because it's quitting time and I'm outta here...
-Colin
The first one is a 40mph offset crash test between a MB S-class and a MCC Smart. FYI, the Smart is about half (or less) than the curb weight of the S-class. Watch the windshields of both cars for damage (or lack thereof).
The next two are of the new '01 C-class (the wagon version out next year will be a VDC H6 wagon competitor). One 40 mph offset and the other 35 mph full width flat barrier. Note that in the offset crash test, the C-class's windshield does not even crack. Damage is limited from 6-8 inches ahead of the windshield, hence besting the BMW 3-series's already excellent offset crash test results, just as MB said it would.
The last clip is of the Black light/water flow test that MB uses to test that the shape of the car doesn't leave it unnecessarily dirty after driving in the rain.
Note that for the .MOV files, you'll need the free Quicktime player, or you may have an error opening the file.
Enjoy!
Drew
My hood deflector was back-ordered too. I waited for about 6 weeks from Darlene.
-Tony
Now what do I do?...I'm in Canada...I have read hours worth of amazing advice on this website, but it is all is US dollars. How can I find the invoice prices on the new family of Subaru's? Any recommendations for me - I drive 20 kilometres everyday on a bumpy road. Gas mileage is a big issue. Definitely need the FWD.
I believe there are one or two Canadian internet sites that have invoice prices, I don't have them handy now, but I'll look.
As a quick remedy though, find any American invoice price as a percentage of retail, then use that percentage against the Canadian retail.
This will usually work out to about 9 to 12% under retail, depending on model and options.
Good luck.
Randy (Winnipeg)
Hope this helps!
Drew/aling
Townhall Community Leader/Vans Conference
01 OB Wagon with:
- Auto
- Air Filter System
- Single CD
- Speaker Upgrade
- Tweeter Kit
- Auto Mirror
- Rear Spoiler
- Mats, crossbars & tray
- Cargo Net
Numbers look like this:
Vehicle Price: $22905
Dealer Profit: $100
Dealer Admin: $199(I know it's "added profit" but dealer won't back off on it)
Taxes, Tag/Title Transf., State Fees (Batt Disp, Lemon Law): $1535
TOTAL Out the Door: $24,739
What do all of you recent OB purchasers (& other soobie experts)think? Take it & drive, or do you think I could do better?
I live in Northeast Florida & this is the only dealer in town. The nearest other dealers are 75-100 miles away, however I'm willing to go approx. 200 miles or so if the savings were significant enough.
Thanks for your input everybody.
Stephen
Ross (Vancouver, '01 Forester S)
If you do not receive a survey, call us at 1-800-SUBARU3. A Rep. can check into it for you. You may also get a survey after warranty repairs (randomly selected). I really encourage folks to fill them out so we can focus on improvements.
Thanks!
Patti
Thanks!
Stephen: the deal sounds good. More importantly, it would be nice to have a good relationship with the only dealer near you, if only for future service purposes.
Drew: DING-DING, we have a winner. Picked up a "poor man's WRX" on Friday. We were saving up for one but some times life throws you a curve ball (wife not working), you know?
So we picked up a 1993 Mazda Miata MX-5, C package, 5 speed, 1.6l 16V DOHC, rear-wheel drive. Perfect, just 26k miles, really! Viscous rear limited-slip differential (Colin's right, I think the Torsens came in 1994). Loaded up, too, with leather, CD, tape, PS, PW, A/C, 4 wheel disc brakes, and alloys.
Blue Book retail is $11,400, wholesale $9,700. This guy didn't realize how low the miles were and what that did for its value, and gave it away for $7,800. No body damage, and it passed inspection on the first shot.
It's not a Soob, but Subaru doesn't make a roadster, or even an RS I could get that cheap. Hey, at least it's not FWD, and has better than one wheel traction (rear LSD).
Drew: I believe you made an uncharacteristic mistake - all Soob boxers are laid out longitudinally, not transversely. It's the H pattern that allows it to fit nicely.
-juice
What about the moonroof deflector? As mentioned in threads in the Future Models section regarding the Forester moonroof, the open moonroof on my wife's OB Ltd is also rather loud. Is the deflector worth it? I've read about leaks in other forums because water can't flow out easily.
Opinions?
Thanks,
Dennis
Maybe someday . . . sigh.
Craig
I had major buffeting on my aftermarket moonroof, so I got the deflector and it's done its job well, though you may still have to open the rear windows or experiment with the fan settings. It's much less buffeting than before, for sure.
I imagine the Subaru OE deflector would help as well. And remember if it doesn't come that way from the factory, they can always call on Darlene.
The Miata is a lot of fun. It's a toy compared to the Soob, totally impractical, very loud, cold (I only drive it top down), and cramped inside. It drives like a go-kart and you can't help but smile, though.
-juice
-Colin
Sorry, Kate, a WRX just wasn't in the budget for now. Wife was laid off and is enjoying the baby WAY too much!
Besides, it's a fair weather 3rd vehicle. Sandy has primary duties. Guess that makes Blanca my mistress!
Back to Soobs, here are photos of the Fall Folliage tour from this weekend. Follow the link on that page.
Also check out Dale's and Bob's new rides, plus Mike's newly enhanced license plate frame. You guys like the boxer joke?
-juice
No problems like that in my Impreza, but it doesn't handle like a gokart. It does have torque though.
-Colin
Stephen
The US GTs did not have the cold weather package available in 2000. I doubt it changed for 2001. It would have been nice. I would also order the LSD and the charcoal air filter options as well. The Subaru wheel locks are made by McGard. They might be worthwhile in the NYC area. I also bought the rear diff protector.
Don't get any additional rustproofing or undercoating treatments. Subaru already applies extensive rust prevention and sound proofing treatments at the assembly line.
2000 Rio Red GT Ltd.
Hammersley, how the heck did you get a 2" receiver on your 97 OB? Isn't that a Class III type hitch rated for 5000 lbs? The new OB hitches are 1-1/4" Class I rated for 2000 lbs and 300 lb tongue weight, which means I can only use 2-bike hitch racks. Saris claims 3-bikes, 70 lbs maximum is okay.
Anyhow, I'm a bit worried about damaging the frame, and maybe bending the hitch too. I'll be putting on much less than 300 lbs, but at a point much farther out than the hitch ball normally resides, so there is a lot of torsion placed upon the hitch.
Have you placed 3 or 4 mountain bikes on the Thule and have found no visible frame warpage?
Thanks!
Dave C.
It's designed for two, but I took my little bro to the Gettysburg meet and we took 3 bikes with us, the 3rd kind of strapped onto the 2nd.
No problemo on my Class I.
-juice
Also, thanks Ross, for the 90.5% tip, I will try that, but need an america zip code to enter into the formula. Don't I? Do I? Any zip codes out there I could try? (Am I getting too personal here, asking for zip codes??) I'm on Vancouver Island, I guess Washington State would be my closest neighbor.
You'll be hearing from me again - I like this!
Ross
On page 59, they have a small side bar called "Expert's Top Choices" that feature some of Consumer Reports top picks for safe vehicles.
The Forester and RX300 are the two listed under SUV!
Alarm: He offered a basic one that only kills the ignition/starter for $199 and a Subaru one (which he said is made for the dealers vs. the one that's considered an option when ordering the car) that is sensored to everything with ignition/starter kill for $399.
Extended Warranty: $885 for 6 yrs through Warrantech Automotive.
Thanks in advance-
-Jeff
Plus, OE systems, statistically, prevent theft better. If he won't install that one, order the kit from Darlene and have your favorite shop install it.
I'd get the extended warranty through Subaru (if at all). Ask them to match that price quote; they probably will. I've never even heard of Warrantech, and who knows if they'll be in business 6 years from now.
Colin: yes, torque, or the lack thereof. The Miata peaks at 5500rpm, with just 100 lb-ft. Luckily it's light and likes to rev, but now I know what they mean by "drive it like you stole it".
-juice
Juice is right about the alarm, and you can get it from Darlene for about $120 and install it yourself. I think it's pretty easy (it comes with detailed instructions). Otherwise, did you even want an alarm before the dealer suggested it? They may have just been trying to pad their profit.
As for the warranty, I don't think you will need it if your Subaru is as good as most. Historically, extended warranties are a scam on most products.
Craig
As for an alarm, they are all a waste of money, save your money. All alarms are basically useless . The best bet is a cut switch from a small manufacturer, and that comes from a professional car theif who's been convicted of Grand Theft Auto! The worst alarms are the ones with the combination locks on the door cause the manufacturer keeps a database of the PIN #s, the theif carries a laptop, punches in your VIN and bam he's in the car. The most outrageous theft was someone had their BMW stolen out of their driveway by having the theives greese up his driveway under the wheels and a flatbed just pulled the vehicle up onto it.
I drive all my cars like I stole em, all the time... Drive it like you mean it!
-mike
-juice
Also, I've added a page with Bit's GT, check it out.
-juice
Mike: I'm in Forest Hills, can you recommend someone for the cut switch you mentioned?
-Jeff
I ordered my Forester with the OE alarm but afterwards learned that Subaru's have one of the lowest rates of theft so I probably don't need it.
-Frank P.
BTW enjoy the car!
Mark
Drew/aling
Townhall Community Leader/Vans Conference
I got mine for $75 installed at a small alarm/stereo place on Staten Island. I can get the specific info from my dad. Basically it put a keypad on the dash with a combination on it. It looks totally cheezy, but my grandfather had his car broken into 4 times after he had it installed and they never could start the car.
Bat,
Make sure that SI Subaru sold you the Subaru warranty. My buddy got his Impreza there and just realized (6 months later) he didn't get the subaru ex-tended warranty.
-mike
Look at it this way, if your Soob is stolen you can just get a new one!
-juice
They did sell me the Subaru Gold warranty. I received the contract in the mail, and all is kosher. Thanks for the heads up.
Mark
Softride makes the Access LT bike rack that fits this hitch. It has two vertical supports that are tied together like a parallelogram - when you extend it, this design holds the bikes parallel to the ground, instead of letting them tilt. This rack holds 4 bikes (150# max), has an anti-rattle feature that works well, and costs about what the Thule and Yakima racks cost. It also accepts other accessories for ski's, etc. I found it at Sportsrack.com.
No affiliation with either product. Thought someone out there might want to know....