Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

Mr_Shiftright · February 2019

I predict that analog will never go away. The human brain requires them.

fintail · February 2019

I think some higher end cars have moved to all digital gauges (save for the clock) - that way for S-class since MY 2014 anyway.

steine13 · February 2019

"Analog" display will -- hopefully -- not go away, I agree with Shifty there... but it'll only look analog and come from electronics. Which is really the most reliable part of any car, usually.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2019

Yes that would be fine--electronic analog. I think the brain needs to see incremental progress of an event to truly understand what's happening. I suppose one could argue that digital bar graphs do that, but not really. It's a compromise at best.

Some automakers have chosen the worst of both worlds--they degrade the analog gauge--like when your heat gauge shows C - N- H but in reality doesn't move in increments from N to H. The gauge is actually lying to you.

tjc78 · February 2019

Fully "digital" analog gauges aren't really new at all.

The Lincoln Continental had them in the early 2000s

Mr_Shiftright · February 2019

I suppose that things like a digital tachometer might be necessary, because with a few of today's engines, an analog tach just can't respond fast enough to the rate of acceleration.

texases · February 2019

Tachs are funny thing - critical when needed, but I bet 90%+ are never, ever used.

explorerx4 · February 2019

Topic on Hemmings or 'Original' vs 'Survivor'.
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2019/02/04/ask-a-hemmings-editor-what-constitutes-a-survivor/

xwesx · February 2019

explorerx4 said:
Topic on Hemmings or 'Original' vs 'Survivor'.
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2019/02/04/ask-a-hemmings-editor-what-constitutes-a-survivor/

I judge it on the standard of my C20. If it isn't at least as unmolested and in as good of condition as my truck (and with at least as original of components), then it is either not a survivor (even if a plausible candidate for restoration) or not original, or neither. But, that's a fairly self-centered way of looking at it.

Which means I'm right, of course.

qbrozen · February 2019

tjc78 said:

Fully "digital" analog gauges aren't really new at all. The Lincoln Continental had them in the early 2000s

My ‘85 300z had digital gauges.

@Mr_Shiftright in my Z, it always felt like the tach lagged, and the speedo readout jumped in 2 mph increments in the low range. My brain just couldn’t adjust to not having sweeping needles.

berri · February 2019

Each type of gauge has an advantage. Digital gives you a quick, accurate reading. Analog is better at showing you change over time. Glass now often gives you a digital look on an analog performing gauge.

omarman · February 2019

Mitsubishi Cordia was one of the first mass produced passenger cars with a digital readout dash. I think this was from a 1983 non-turbo Cordia.

When I Build My Spaceship, It Will Be Equipped With This Mitsubishi Cordia Instrument Cluster.

explorerx4 · February 2019

188 kph with the passenger door open?

tjc78 · February 2019

qbrozen said:

tjc78 said:

Fully "digital" analog gauges aren't really new at all.

The Lincoln Continental had them in the early 2000s

My ‘85 300z had digital gauges.

@Mr_Shiftright in my Z, it always felt like the tach lagged, and the speedo readout jumped in 2 mph increments in the low range. My brain just couldn’t adjust to not having sweeping needles.

Full digital has been around since 1980 or so. What I’m referring to is the analog look (dials) but actually digital. The first car I can think of with that is the early 2000s Continental

I had a full digital dash in the 04 Marquis. I kinda liked it, but that car even being a 2004 felt like something from the 80s anyway.

tjc78 · February 2019

omarman said:
Mitsubishi Cordia was one of the first mass produced passenger cars with a digital readout dash. I think this was from a 1983 non-turbo Cordia.

When I Build My Spaceship, It Will Be Equipped With This Mitsubishi Cordia Instrument Cluster.

Lincoln had them in 1980 on the Mark VI. Pretty sure some other Fords too. The Thunderbird comes to mind

omarman · February 2019

explorerx4 said:
188 kph with the passenger door open?

...and in a 1983 non turbo Mitsubishi?

texases · February 2019

And BMW's 2019 3er has non-round digital dials:
https://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/3-series/sedan/gallery.html#!/the-3-series-gallery/20

stickguy · February 2019

cool. I know right where they were by BMW HQ based on the navi info.

xwesx · February 2019

When people talk about digital gauges and how well they work, all I can think about are the -20, -30, -40 days where it takes a long time for the LCDs to warm up enough to function real-time, and how annoying it would be to drive blind during those minutes.

As long as they do continue to work, though, I suppose all is well in the end.

qbrozen · February 2019

tjc78 said:

Full digital has been around since 1980 or so. What I’m referring to is the analog look (dials) but actually digital. The first car I can think of with that is the early 2000s Continental

I had a full digital dash in the 04 Marquis. I kinda liked it, but that car even being a 2004 felt like something from the 80s anyway.

I don't think I'd ever know that was digital

fintail · February 2019

The cool wacky futuristic wedge Aston Martin Lagonda was another early one with digital gauges. These started in 1979, I think:

xwesx · February 2019

fintail said:
The cool wacky futuristic wedge Aston Martin Lagonda was another early one with digital gauges. These started in 1979, I think:

LOL Looks like a crazy video game console!

omarman · February 2019

But where's the horn button? Oh wait I see the lever now...

fintail · February 2019

Stalk horn, something Ford also got into around 1980 IIRC. Not sure if I'd want a digital dash made with 1970s British electrical bits.

The digital display in that Grand Marquis is amusing - they simulated needles (I assume, must be a very rare option), which is high tech, but then have an old school pixelated display at right that looks like something from the 90s at best.

explorerx4 · February 2019

It's been warm the last couple of days, so yesterday I took the cover off the Mustang and hooked up the battery charger. Let it run until I left for work today.
Took 1/2 day PTO and plugged the charger back in when I got home.
After an hour or so, battery was fully charged.
Put a trouble light under the oil pan for 1/2 an hour or so.
Unplugged the ignition and turned the engine over until the oil pressure gauge moved up.
Started right up after that. Let it run for 20 minutes or so to dry out the exhaust.
Still sounds good.

tjc78 · February 2019

fintail said:

Stalk horn, something Ford also got into around 1980 IIRC. Not sure if I'd want a digital dash made with 1970s British electrical bits. The digital display in that Grand Marquis is amusing - they simulated needles (I assume, must be a very rare option), which is high tech, but then have an old school pixelated display at right that looks like something from the 90s at best.

That was a 2002 Continental (Glorified Taurus)

Pretty sure it was standard as I’ve never seen one without it.

tjc78 · February 2019

While we are on the topic... forgot all about these

This one from 1990

fintail · February 2019

I had no idea an 02 Continental/Taurinental had virtual gauges like that. Pretty cool, and an odd vehicle for it, seeing as 99% of the customer base probably either couldn't have cared less, or was put off by it.

The latest pic looks like GM fonts.

omarman · February 2019

Picture caption states: The trip computer package with digital speedometer and readout became optional on all Seville models in 1978, as shown on this ’78 model.
Back then all I wanted was the Gucci edition with matching luggage.

tjc78 · February 2019

The image above is a 90 Buick Reatta

I thought maybe Caddy had it on the Seville, probably not a popular option. I’ve never noticed one for sale with it. Starting in the 80s it really took off.

ab348 · February 2019

tjc78 said:
The image above is a 90 Buick Reatta

I thought maybe Caddy had it on the Seville, probably not a popular option. I’ve never noticed one for sale with it. Starting in the 80s it really took off.

The Cadillac wreath and crest on the steering wheel would suggest otherwise.

texases · February 2019

That Caddy dash - back when Pulsar watches were cool...

fintail · February 2019

Interesting, never seen a 70s Seville with that either. I'd have imagined they'd try it in a Corvette or something more exciting first.

tjc78 · February 2019

ab348 said:

The image above is a 90 Buick Reatta

I thought maybe Caddy had it on the Seville, probably not a popular option. I’ve never noticed one for sale with it. Starting in the 80s it really took off.
The Cadillac wreath and crest on the steering wheel would suggest otherwise.

I was talking to @fintail about the Mystery dash I posted. C’mon now I know my Caddies and Lincoln’s!

berri · February 2019

I don't recall the exact years, but sometime in the 80's when GM re-did and kind of downsized again the personal luxury cars, I recall a lot of electronics and digitization for the times in the new release Riviera and Toronado. I also seem to remember there were more than a few issues, which may not really be surprising because GM seemed to be pushing the envelope a bit.

ab348 · February 2019

The '83 Seville had a digital IP:

tjc78 · February 2019

No comment

https://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/d/columbus-1985-tiffany/6811841528.html

berri · February 2019

OMG, where's grandpa Munster

xwesx · February 2019

Hahahahah! I'll be in Columbus in a couple of weeks; let me know if you want me to look at it for you.

Mr_Shiftright · February 2019

10 years? They build the Golden Gate Bridge in under 4.

explorerx4 · February 2019

Everyone who wants to be the 'Right Person' for that car, hold up your hand. Oh, never mind.

fintail · February 2019

Too bad the bustleback didn't have those gauges for MY 1980, the one with the good engine. Always had a guilty pleasure from those cars, I liked them when I was a kid.

Tiffany decimal place is off by one or more.

stickguy · February 2019

I can't even imagine what my wife would do to me if I dragged a mutt like that home, put it in the garage, and spent all my time (and money) working on it.

xwesx · February 2019

stickguy said:
I can't even imagine what my wife would do to me if I dragged a mutt like that home, put it in the garage, and spent all my time (and money) working on it.

My guess? Nothing; she wouldn't be there to worry about it!

qbrozen · February 2019

tjc78 said:

No comment https://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/d/columbus-1985-tiffany/6811841528.html

Does pushing it out of the way once a month to cut the grass under it count as “working on it”?

ab348 · February 2019

fintail said:
Too bad the bustleback didn't have those gauges for MY 1980, the one with the good engine. Always had a guilty pleasure from those cars, I liked them when I was a kid.

I think I mentioned this previously here, but way back when I first started working back in 1980, a (temporary) boss had one of the early bustlebacks. The company owner went to lunch with him one day and they dragged me along for some reason I didn't understand initially. I was a bit intimidated but soon learned why I was there - it was to be a boozy lunch for them and I was to drive them back to the office afterwards.

I got them into the Seville after a few hours and headed back to the office. The main memory of it I have was that it had the lightest power steering I have ever experienced before or since. I had driven Dad's '71 Monaco with Chrysler's infamous no-feel power steering but this one was in another class altogether. I was as if the steering column wasn't connected to anything ahead of the firewall. I guess Cadillac thought their owners wanted that back then. I recall that the power brakes were also very sensitive, and it was very floaty over undulations in the road.

tjc78 · February 2019

That's how box Panthers (79-91) drive as well. Pinky finger steering and over boosted throw yourself through the windshield brakes.

I've driven quite a few 80s Cadillacs and the feeling was very similar.

fintail · February 2019

Sounds like I'd hate driving one, maybe even a seasick ride in one of those. Design-wise anyway, they are uh, interesting. I also like the Eldo of that era, and maybe it has a more grounded ride.

I remember the 66 Galaxie in the family had really light power steering too, easily steered with a finger.

ab348 said:

I think I mentioned this previously here, but way back when I first started working back in 1980, a (temporary) boss had one of the early bustlebacks. The company owner went to lunch with him one day and they dragged me along for some reason I didn't understand initially. I was a bit intimidated but soon learned why I was there - it was to be a boozy lunch for them and I was to drive them back to the office afterwards.

I got them into the Seville after a few hours and headed back to the office. The main memory of it I have was that it had the lightest power steering I have ever experienced before or since. I had driven Dad's '71 Monaco with Chrysler's infamous no-feel power steering but this one was in another class altogether. I was as if the steering column wasn't connected to anything ahead of the firewall. I guess Cadillac thought their owners wanted that back then. I recall that the power brakes were also very sensitive, and it was very floaty over undulations in the road.

fintail · February 2019

This guy's excitement for the mundane amuses me - of all the cars to love, but I guess everyone loves something (beware, the narrator swears, if this offends you, don't click

)

stickguy · February 2019

nice car for the money.

Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

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