Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Hello again Don. I am not personally all that familiar with what the 2006 Lexus GS 300 is selling for right now. Knowing Lexus dealers and given the fact that this is a brand new model, I am sure that they probably are going fairly close to full MSRP. Again though, I am not all that familiar with what the market is like for this car. The money factor that you were quoted for this car looks great, but the residual value may be a little on the low side. Do you happen to know what this car's residual value percentage is?

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CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Hi Dean. While many banks increase their lease acquisition fees for New York residents, I think, but am not positive, that Toyota Financial Services does not charge a higher lease acquisition fee for New York residents. You are right about it being a long drive from New York to Florida though. I drove from New York to Miami once and definitely would want to avoid doing so again unless it was completely unavoidable

.

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CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Hi testykaren. I have not seen the Mercedes-Benz Credit lease program for the 2006 ML 350 yet. Sorry that I could not be of more help.

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CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Hey kyfdx. In the market for a new car? Let's take a look at the lease program for the model that you mentioned. According to the latest information that I have seen, if you were to lease a 2005 Saab 9-2X Aero through Saab Financial Services Corp. right now for 2 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00109 and 64%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical 3 year lease should be .00096 and 53%. Saab is providing $1,000 bonus cash, but no lease cash on this car. The only lease cash that id available on the 9-2X is $1,000 on the Linear model. This is interesting because consumers who don't lease have the option to choose 0% financing for 5 years or $4,500 customer cash.

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CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Welcome to the wonderful world of leasing pumpkinjack. Since you have never leased before, you definitely should check out the following informative articles that are available here at Edmunds.com prior to visiting any dealers: 10 Steps to Leasing a New Car and Calculate Your Own Lease Payment.

In response to your questions about the advertised Nissan Murano lease, always keep in mind that consumers are free to lease any vehicle they want without making any sort of down payment. The only reason why manufacturers usually base their advertised lease payments on the assumption that several thousand dollars is being put down is to make vehicles' monthly payments more attractive.

I am not personally all that familiar with how sales tax is calculated on leased vehicles in Pennsylvania, but you may be able to find out more information on this subject by visiting one of the following sites: Pennsylvania Driver and Vehicle Services or Pennsylvania Department of Revenue.

Manufacturers' special financing rates are different than their lease money factors. Furthermore, as is the case with the 2005 Nissan Murano, customer cash incentives often cannot be used in conjunction with manufacturers' special lease programs.

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CarMan@Edmunds · April 2005

Hi markrogo. As one might imagine with a new, popular vehicle like the 400h, Lexus is not providing any sort of lease support on this model at this time. As a result, if you were to lease one through Lexus Financial Services, you would have to use its standard lease program. The last time that I saw it, LFS' base standard money factor for consumers who qualify for tier "Sign and Drive+" credit tier was .00225. Its 3 and 4 year, 15,000 miles per residual values for the 2006 400h without the rear entertainment system are 62% and 50%, respectively. If you were to lease with only 12,000 miles per year, its residual values would be 2% higher. I believe that you should be able to put multiple security deposits down when leasing this model, but you should check with your dealer to be certain.

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dwynne · April 2005

Holmes Honda in Shreveport is very aggressive, from what I hear. They were quoting $200 less than my best deal last month on an LX for my wife - but $200 was not nearly enough for me to make the trip to "LA" to get the car.

Check out the Accord Prices paid forum (I will try to post a link) - and do a search and/or ask about other deep discount places. There is another I know of in the Atlanta area and maybe another in KY and one it TN that will give a decent deal.

See if this link works to get you to the forum:

Honda Accord: Prices Paid & Buying Experience

Dennis

dwynne · April 2005

Several months ago, Lexus already had over 14,000 RX400h trucks pre-sold. So at a lot of dealerships there will be no hybrids to be had - and any that do not go to pre-order folks will be full MSRP or higher.

Why folks insist on being "first on the block" and paying full price or more for something just amazes me. One local Toyota dealer loads up their Prius orders (leather, NAV, etc) then jacks the price up $3,500 or more over MSRP. They have people fly in from out of state, pay the price, and drive them home. Most folks may never recoup the hybrid purchase price in gas savings - for sure ones that pay way too much for it.

Of course the Lexus hybrid is like the Accord - a "performance" hybrid and is not supposed to sip at the pump like an Insight....

Dennis

jsjgatlanta · April 2005

I just leased a Honda Pilot EX (cloth) with splash guards, crossbars and paint protection (sure!) for $309 per month, 36 months, 12,000 mile/yr. and $700 total due at signing which included the 1st months payment. Did I do OK?

kyfdx · April 2005

Uh.. yeah.. you did okay..

Great, actually...

pumpkinjack · April 2005

Thanks Carman, just one other question. Even with the special lease reate/special financing rate it is still based upon the same critera such as selling price (hence if you negotiate a lower price it would make for a better lease) and residuals, etc, right?
Thanks

kyfdx · April 2005

Hey kyfdx. In the market for a new car?

Perpetually!!

So, if I buy the 9-2X Aero, I get the $4500 customer cash plus the $1000 bonus cash ($5500 total), but if I lease, I only get the $1000 bonus cash?

Normally, I would never purchase a Saab (maybe a Saabaru), but in this case, it seems so much better than the lease deal, I don't think I would lease it.

The wife thinks I probably don't need to worry about it.. thanks for the info, Car_man!!

regards,
kyfdx

dwynne · April 2005

3rd party lease? Get the cash and the lease.

Dennis

kyfdx · April 2005

Good point... you would think the Saab dealer would have access to the 3rd party leasers as well.. I know Volvo is big on this.. Large cash incentives and using independent banks..

kappajen · April 2005

I'm going to be leasing soon (first time), but I will definitely go over the 15,000 limit. Here's my question: Should I buy the miles upfront (10,000/yr) or wait until the end of the lease? I am getting quoted really high payments buying the miles upfront beacause it lessens the residual so much. On the other hand, I'll get a decent monthly payment but pay more per mile at lease end. I've heard that some people have actually waited till the end to pay, but would put whatever amount they went over by per month into a savings account to gain interest? Has anyone done this? Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!

kyfdx · April 2005

I just ran the numbers both ways.. Assuming MSRP of $31,800, and pre-incentive sale price of $30,800.

For the best 36mo/45K lease on leasecompare.com, the payment is $417/mo.. Money factor is higher, residual is lower, acq.fee is higher.. all bad.. but, the extra $4500 in customer cash helped a lot... Residual is $14,220

Using the factory lease.. MF is lower, residual is higher.. all good, but incentives lower by $4500, resulting in a payment of $421/mo.. Residual is $16,854.

So, leasing is a wash either way, unless you are planning on purchasing the car at the end of the lease (much better with 3rd party).

However, if you purchase, the pre-tax amount financed would be $25,300 ($30,800 minus $4500 cash, minus $1000 bonus cash) $25,300 at 4.9% for 60 months is $477/mo...

For a $60/mo. difference, I'll buy instead of lease.. (in my own little dream world here).

regards,
kyfdx

dwynne · April 2005

I forgot to mention, any special "to you" rebates and stuff MIGHT not qualify if you did a 3rd party lease. For example, the BMWCCA reward for buying or leasing a new car will not work with a 3rd party lease. The lease bank or broker is buying the car and leasing it to you, so you actually would not be buying it so no reward. If you lease with BMWFS then this would qualify for the BMWCCA reward.

Just something else to watch out for.

Dennis

nospam · April 2005

Hey Car_man,

I talked to a friend at work today who owns a G35x - her and I have been talking for a while since I finalized on the car.

She said she has seen TV commercials advertising a $349/month lease - a $50/month savings over what they were offering last month.. I have yet to see these commercials.

Do you know anything about this? As I have been thinking for a while - with gas prices these cars were moving slowly, and I would not be surprised by this incentive. I'm in NY.

kurb · April 2005

MSRP is 32350... tax is 6%, I don't have a negotiated price.. I'm just trying to determine if this is a good price to target... I'm going to wait until the last day of the month and see what I can get..

jim53 · April 2005

Car_man,

can you tell me the residual and money factor for a 24 month and 36 month lease assuming 10K miles per year?

kurb · April 2005

Dwynne, I only want to pay first payment up front..

kyfdx · April 2005

A good deal would be about $423/mo+ tax.. or about $448/mo all in..

$32350 MSRP
$28350 Selling price (MSRP - $2500 incentive- $1500 discount)
$28675 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee)

3yr/45K lease

Residual 55%
MF .0024 (including security deposit waiver)

So, shoot for $450/mo. or less on that car.. with only 1st payment and license upfront..

regards,
kyfdx
(not the expert)

kurb · April 2005

thanks kydfx..question... on the car their is a sticker that says original msrp 35,000 new reduced price 32350... does this already represent the incentive..are these cars really selling for $28350.. I might consider purchasing the car if that is the case..

kyfdx · April 2005

Well.. that would be different.. There should be an actual Monroney sticker on the car with the MSRP..

My guess is the $32,350 is their suggested sale price.. Which wouldn't be much of a deal considering the $2500 dealer cash on the car..

Assume a sale price of $31K (same $4K discount as before), and an MSRP of $35K, and the numbers change to $466/mo. + tax, or $494/mo.tax included.. with all of the other parameters the same..

You need to see the actual sticker to determine the MSRP.

regards,
kyfdx

jon219 · April 2005

I have never leased a car before. I have inquired with a BMW dealer on the special lease promotion for a BMW X3 3.0 with auto trans and a couple of options. MSRP is $39036.15. Sale price quoted me is $36,700. With a $2500 cap cost reduction, 36 month/12K miles per year lease rate is $425 @ month; without paying the cap cost reduction, lease is "just under" $500 @ month. Is this a reasonable lease rate? Would taxes be included in this rate (I live in Maryland and tax is 5%)? What other questions should I be asking? Thanks very much.

carnag · April 2005

Thanks Car Man for the reply. I was wondering where to begin if I plan to lease. Do I contact dealers for quotes acting interested to buy to get a price quote, or do I let them know Im interested in leasing (since I want the lowest selling cost either way)? Also I can't really seem to find out why IL is bad for leasing, the only thing I seem to get is that it involves the taxes. I want an '06 BMW 530, but would settle for an '05 530 since the '06's seem to steep for me due to the MF. The MF for an'06 is 0.0025 vs. 0.00125 for an '05. My question is do you have any idea whether or not BMWFS may lower the MF later in the year for the 06 models, and if so when approx. If not, do you know of any place to finance a lease with a money factor of 0.00125 fot the '06? Thanks again

dwynne · April 2005

In IL (like in TX and some other states) sales tax is due on the full selling price of the car - not just the depreciation part or the payments.

So if you lease $50k car with a 50% residual and your tax rate is 8% then you owe $4,000 in sales tax on the car - just like you purchased it. Folks in more lease-friendly states would only owe $2,000 in tax with the same sales tax rate OR would pay 8% on the monthly payment (which includes depreciation and interest). I think the rate in Chicago is close to 9% - which is a lot of tax on the full price of a lease car.

You can pay the tax up front or roll it into the lease, but neither is that nice an option.

If you buy the car at the end of the lease? IL makes you pay sales tax on the purchase price then as well.

There is a good reason BMWFS will give you a MF on the 05 that is 1/2 the 06 - same reason the dealer will give you a better price - they want you to take the 05. At some point, the 06 MF may fall but it will not be likely while they still have 05 cars to move.

You decide on one of the other and make your best deal, then tell them you want to lease at the buy rate. It may be hard to get the buy rate from most BMW dealers, however.

Dennis

dwynne · April 2005

car_man said:

I believe that Mazda's lease cash on the 2005 RX-8 is up to $3,000 in April, $1,000 customer lease cash, $1,000 dealer lease cash, and a $1,000 bonus for unsupported leases of this model through Mazda Credit.

It looks like the extra $1,000 is:

2005 Competitive Lease Conquest Direct Mail Program $1000 Customer Cash

So unless you get the direct mail coupon, then they are still stuck on $2k in lease money

Dennis

guido2004 · April 2005

Nissan is currently offering $1,500 rebates on Armada's. Do you know if this is only on purchases or if it is available on a lease deal as well? The leasing would go through Nissan as that seems to matter based on previous posts.

Thanks...

cgr45 · April 2005

Hey Car Man,

Just wanted to run this offer by you and see what you think.
This for a 2005 Acura RSX Type S.

For 12,000 miles for 36 months $285
For 15,000 miles for 36 months $299
MSRP $24,240
Negociated Price $22,600
Residual for 12k 58% & 15k 56%
$1500 Down
Money Factor 0.00051
No security deposit, last payment waived on my current lease and free proctection package.

I ran the numbers myself and I got about $5-$10 less than what they offered.
Also, is GAP insurance included on Acura cars?

Thanks

carnag · April 2005

Thanks Dwayne

Do you think it would be wiser for me to go to IN or WI to lease then? I'm only 40 min from IN border and about 1.5 hr from WI.

Also, how to I get started negotiating. Should I go into the dealer and see what numbers they give me (what exactly am I looking for), or start by getting some quotes over the internet? BTW tax here is 8.75% way too high!! I've looked over the calculations her at Edmunds and am still a little confused how everything works. According to my calcs I'm paying around $210/mo in tax for a 36 mo, 62% residual, MF of 0.0025 $54,020MSRP '06 530. Does this sound right? Around $540/mo pre tax and $780/mo post tax.

Thanks, Carnag

ronald15 · April 2005

Looking to lease a Honda Civic with value package for 3 years with 12,000 miles with no money down. Based on current Honda program, what is a fair monthly payment?.

marcroz · April 2005

I've looked at the 2.5T and have been offered the following terms on a lease:

36 month, 12k miles
.00205 money factor
47% residual

48 month, 12k miles
.00190 money factor
38% residual

Do these numbers look okay? I could also buy the car for 5.49% for 60 months, but due to incentives to lease, the price is $3000 more.

Would appreciate your input.

Thanks

dgurney · April 2005

Hello,
My question is if I own my own business, not incorporated (sole proprietor), can I deduct part of or all of a auto lease payment if the vehicle is leased in the business' name?
Thanks!

dicky · April 2005

Any idea if Honda is planning any lease deals on the 2006 Ridgeline? I am also interested in maybe obtaining a lease from somewhere other than American Honda Finance.

Thanks

jbaer · April 2005

Car_man -

Can you give me the latest residuals and money factors on a 2005 Passat GLS? I am looked at 15k/36 months and 12k/36 months with no down payment. I have also heard something about 2k in dealer incentives? I tried to look back and see if you had posted recent numbers on Passats but I couldn't find any. I am trying to decide between the passat and the accord ex. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.

dwynne · April 2005

With about every lease bank, it is going to be "where is the car garaged" to determine the proper tax situation. For example, I have leased cars from dealers in WI, GA, and OH but I still have to pay TN tax. I am afraid you will be in the same boat - live and park the car in IL and pay IL lease taxes.....

I would try the BMW 5 series prices paid and buying experiences forum here on Edmunds and see if someone can point you to a BMW dealer close by that is known to deal on cars and give buy rate on lease. I know of one in GA, but that is long way for you to go.

See if this link works for the 5 series buying forum:

Click Here

Then you just decide what you want and what options, and try to work up from dealer cost to a price they will accept.

Then you tell them you want to lease at the buy rate and see if they will let you.

Some dealers have really nice Internet departments and quickly respond to quote requests and e-mail. Many just never do. Most all of them have a fax machine and fax line, so you can fax over and quote request that way. Always ask for the cost of the car including destination and any dealer fees. My local BMW dealer gets $300 for a "doc" fee, for example.

Dennis

carnag · April 2005

Car_man

I have an offer on an '05 530 with cold/prem./sport package, xenons, satelite radio and auto for $51,523.(MSRP of $54,095) The lease terms are 10.000mi/yr for 36mo. MF=0.00165 and residual of 63%.

I live in Chicago Suburbs. Paying all taxes and fees up front (around $5,000) nets a monthly payment of $645.80, if I don't pay tax up front it's 748.25/mo.

Does this sound like a good offer?

ae5555 · April 2005

Dear Car_man!

I am trying to lease a 2005 Acura TL with Navigation System in NYC.

The best deal i got so far is for 36/12K lease with $1000 due at signing (includes first payment, dmv and security deposit) with $490 monthly afterwards including the 8% tax.

The money factor they used is 0.0024 and they say that this is the actual rate for AHFS for april for this car. I have seen in these forums that the rate is actually 0.0022. The residual was 59%. Can you please clarify and tell me if this is a good deal? I know my credit history is excellent.

Thank you very much!
-Alex

nospam · April 2005

In NY State - I thought you had to pay the tax up front, for the total amount of your lease payments over the course of the lease ??

carnag · April 2005

What do you mean by "buy rate" on the lease? I just posted an offer I got today, does it sound good?

ae5555 · April 2005

Not that i am aware of. I currently lease Mercedes E320 and did not have to pay taxes upfront.

dwynne · April 2005

What do you mean by "buy rate" on the lease? I just posted an offer I got today, does it sound good?

The buy rate or base rate is what the money costs the dealer - the lowest possible rate you can get. The dealer is allowed to mark this up my a certain amount for extra profit for the dealership. The finance departments at BMW dealerships are notorious for always doing this on every lease or purchase deal - the one here let me "walk" rather than give me the buy rate.

In your case, the price on the car looks nice. I added up the options you list and ended up with an MSRP about $500 higher than you show, so either they have had a price increase since the car your got the quote on arrived or something is off. Double check the exact options - without that being right the true dealer cost will not be. The invoice on that car will be around $50,000- $50,500, so your price quote sounds pretty good for a BMW dealer if it includes any dealer or doc fees.

The "problem" is that the buy rate on that lease is 0.00125 and they marked it up. You can check for yourself what this does to your payment. If they just will not give you the buy rate, you can try other dealers or just hammer the price down on the car so it "does not matter".

Dennis

carnag · April 2005

Thanks. I was actually "crunching" some numbers myself.
I came up with $625/mo with what he quoted me, not knowing exactly how all the taxes will work. Then I tried using the base rate of 0.00125 and purchase price of $50.800 and have $570/mo which is more in my range.

I have a dealer friend who reffered my to the BMW salesman so I would've hoped to get a good deal. From the sounf of it I'll need to look at some other dealers as well as negotiating with him.

BTW are there any "hidden" costs I should be looking for? What exactly should I be payng? Ex. 1st payment, sec. deposit, plates, doc fee, etc.

Thanks again

kingalls · April 2005

Car man

I'm considering leasing an 05 Avalon at 33k for 48 months and 12k miles. The dealer offering me a 2.9 Money Factor. How do I know if this is good? I know it translates to 7% and that sounds high especially with my good credit.

dwynne · April 2005

I think BMW dealers can jack up the acquisition fee as well, someone here will post what it is supposed to be ($595?).

With BMWFS you can pay a slightly higher rate and they wave the security deposit, which is normally due at signing (monthly payment rounded up to the nearest $25 or $50 increment). You can also do multiple security deposits for a lower rate, they are pretty flexible

It is possible the quote you got was with the waived security option. Some folks want to to a "sign and drive" type lease and will roll all the fees into the lease - sometimes even including the first month's rent.

I always re-work the numbers myself to make sure nothing has gotten added to the deal. There will likely be some "doc" or dealer fee, tags, taxes, title, security deposit, acq fee, first month's rent - and that should be it.

FWW, I am on my 2nd BMW (car) now and if I was thinking on getting a 530i right now, I would run (don't walk) to the Acura dealer and look at the new RL, then hurry to the Infiniti dealer and look at the new M35 and M45, then rush over to the Lexus dealer and look at the new GS300 and GS400. The captive lease rate is not going to be a nice as the BMWFS one, but I think at this point for MY $50k I would rather have one of those than the new 5.

Dennis

dwynne · April 2005

0.00215 is the buy rate money factor on the Avalon lease (any term, any model). This is 5.16%

I assume the dealer quoted you 0.00290 ? Which would be 6.96%?

Looks like they are just jacking up the MF for extra profit. I checked at leasecompare.com and an Avalon LTD 48/48k lease is 0.00192 MF . The "gotcha" will be the ALG residual (which all 3rd party banks use) is probably going to be several points lower than the captive residual - so the payment may not be any less. If the dealer will not give you the buy rate, then check and see if the leasecompare payment is less. If so, just lease it from them - they buy the car from the dealer and lease it to you. You can also get a quote from lease-by-tel and other 3rd party lease brokers.

Dennis

smjbh · April 2005

Car Man.

I'm looking to lease a 2005 Audi A4 1.8T Quattro and keep hearing different money factors. Could you tell me what the current money factor is for a 3 year 36k or 3 year 30k? Is there a certain term that is a better deal right now? I've been hearing anywhere from .00045 to .00135 as lease factors from dealers.

Could you also work out some numbers for me based on the following deal:

MSRP: 36,620
Negotiated Price: 34,126 (200 over invoice)

Does 200 over invoice sounds about right for a 2005 a4?

Thanks.

rickva · April 2005

Car man

I am interested in leasing a M35 x from a northern Virginia dealer. What are the current rates for 36, 39, 42 month leases from IFS. Could you please provide the residuals as well.

Thanks in advance

minn55441 · April 2005

I just left the dealership and wonder if I was offered an acceptable deal. The vehicle has a MSRP of around $33,500, the price I agreed on with the salesman was $27,595 after all rebates. I think this is a great price. The problem is that I have a trade, which most sites I have visited value at $10,500 as a good trade in value (ie kelly blue book). The last time I checked (Dec) my credit score was 780.

Now for the offer they gave me. They will write me a check for $10,000 for my trade. I write them a check for 895.01 and sign a lease for 433.01 per month. This is for 15,000 miles per year for 39 months.

Do the numbers add up on this transaction? What amount can I realistically expect back in cash to keep my payments below $400.

Thanks for your help.

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