Subaru Crew - Future Models II

bat1161 · September 2005

I know this is a limited edition. I wonder what kind of premium that brings to the price?

Too bad no wagon

Mark

p0926 · September 2005

Colin- the red leather doesn't do anything for me either (too loud). I'd rather have a more conservative color with perhaps contrast stiching (and a Bean type logo). Also agree about the quality of the pics (heck even I could have done a better job!).

Craig- Bob probably just assumes that everyone has a 20" high def Apple monitor :-)

-Frank

rsholland · September 2005

The red seats are probably the same kind of red often found on sports cars (Porsche, etc.). I'm assuming it's more of a brick red, rather than a fire engine red.

The images came directly from the SOA media site. I didn't do anything to them, other than copy and paste.

Bob

ateixeira · September 2005

Poor Bob got blamed for the poor quality pics.

Can't wait to see them in person.

Hey Subaru, send me one for a year and I'll do a daily blog on it, promise!

-juice

locke2c · September 2005

hehe, no I wasn't blaming Bob. I knew they were the originals as provided by SOA. I'm saying that it surprised me that SOA would put out something of that quality. :lemon:

~Colin

rsholland · September 2005

Keep in mind that these images are large in size, but low-res (72). Everything that you grab from the Net is low-res.

What designers like myself do, is open the images in Photoshop and up the resolution to 300 (high res), if you plan to use it in a brochure, magazine, etc. In order to do so without increasing the file size, the image will get much, much smaller. When images get smaller the quality increases dramatically, or perhaps better put, the imperfections are much harder to see.

That's why on a media site the images are always so large, because they will be res-ed up, and end up much smaller.

Bob

kens · September 2005

Colin,

If you were shopping for another vehicle and the Spec B came with normal grey/black leather seats would you consider it?

I remember you wrote that the main reason why you voted the Legacy GT off your list was the lack of a sport suspension.

Ken

rsholland · September 2005

and see the new '06s, including the Spec B!

http://content.subaru.com/mailings/pjr/05_09Motorsports/index.html

Bob

locke2c · September 2005

Would I consider a Legacy GT spec B? It depends on the a few things..

1. Price. We've all seen that if you're willing to wait a few months or even travel a bit, you will have no problem finding a new Subaru for a little over invoice.

2. If the suspension was truly sporty. The current Legacy GT is quite cushy and understeers like a dog. I believe it's meant to be and that is a reasonable niche for it to occupy considering Subaru does have the WRX STi.

~Colin

ateixeira · September 2005

That's not quite Solberg, but she is cuter!

Single guys, head out there!

-juice

locke2c · September 2005

thanks for making me open the link, juice.

there was a contest to be the ESX driver, and julie stepan was definitely one of the best looking who could drive a bit, too.

~c

ateixeira · September 2005

LOL

Beauty contest, or a test of skill?

I was gonna go, purely in the interest of the Crew of course, and my wife started beating me over the head with a stick, so I changed my mind.

-juice

ateixeira · September 2005

A chop, but it might look like this...

Those are Tribeca rims.

The door handle is much bigger than the side mirrors, and way out of proportion.

The shadow above the rear bumper looks wrong. The Tribeca's rear is sort of "shaved", the bumpers don't jut out, so who knows what this will look like.

The top of the c-pillar also looks all wrong.

Still, I like it, though I think a 2 door is a bad idea.

-juice

rsholland · September 2005

If you want a 5-speed L-GT with a manual tranny, go to Canada.

Canada has the following '06 Legacy GT models:

Cloth:

GT Sedan 5MT or 5EAT.

Leather with moonroof:

GT Sedan 5MT or 5EAT.
GT Wagon 5MT or 5EAT.

Bob

jimmyp1 · September 2005

That just makes the fact that we can't get a manual with leather (short of the Spec

even more confusing to me. Anywho, I like my STi.

Jim

jimmyp1 · September 2005

Wait, we can get 5 speed LGT's can't we? Both Limited and non-limited. It's the NAV / 5 speed combo we can't get, right? I've confused myself.

Jim

rsholland · September 2005

No longer can we get a 5-speed "manual in the L-GT wagon. That's the gripe.

Bob

dino001 · September 2005

Yeah, it blows. Some genius in marketing. A "sporty" wagon without manual available :sick: . Another reason to stay with my WRX for one year more. Maybe they come to their senses next year, but who knows. So far the tendency is to limit choices, not expand them. The best part is in their press release the called for "expansion" of Legacy line :confuse: Don't they get it? Auto is nothing like manual!

If I'm not mistaken, as last resort, Outback XT Ltd will be still available with MT. Not the same thing, but may pass for some. I'm not much into those SUVish looks, but if buying now, it would be my choice.

ateixeira · September 2005

Not really, they added the NAV option for autos, and the Spec B, but that's it. They deleted the cloth GT, cloth GT wagon, and all 5 speed wagons entirely.

Seems like a step back.

-juice

sweet_subie · September 2005

subaru sucks. they experiment too much with customers, changing the package each year. this is crazy. Still we are loyal, we must be CRAZIER !!!!

why can;t they offer cloth & moonroof, leather, MP3, VDC, heating package as separate options ?

ateixeira · September 2005

The honest answer is probably volume. They don't have the economies of scale that, say, Toyota has, to allow and a-la-carte ordering system.

Even that might not fix it, for instance, try finding a Camry CE or LE 5 speed with ABS. They don't exist! Dealers still offer the models that sell in volume, which means automatics, price leaders, and if you want ABS you want it loaded, right?

Wrong, but that's how Toyota does it.

-juice

dino001 · September 2005

Yeah, it's all true. But how can you aspire to "upscale" name if you take choices away from your customers. I think this upscale thing is a big joke, anyway, but supposed they are serious.

What hurts most is that even in the luxury market you have volumes of cars being sold in typical configurations and manuals are becoming more sparse

But at least you may special order manual 325xiT or A4 3.2 Avant, if you really want one. Not every single year, but it usually comes around one way or another. And you know those guys have a plan: first year get something typical on the market and then start enriching it with more and more configurations. Subaru, on the other hand, looks like they're completely lost: one year this, another year that, then they cut real choices calling it expansion. Just sucks...

Who does marketing research for them? I want a name so I can send him/her a thank you note :mad:

robr2 · September 2005

Perhaps they mean the special edition package for the base Legacy - power seat and moonroof??

Also, I find it funny that the Subaru website hasn't been updated yet for the 2006 models. They've been out for weeks - or am I wrong.

ateixeira · September 2005

I don't think deleting the manual wagon hurts their upscale image, though it might hurt their sporting image.

I'm against because I'd rather see Subaru promote sportiness over luxury.

Even the SE isn't really expanding the lineup. When they offer an SE model, they basically stop producing the "base" 2.5i model, except for a few special orders. So even that is not really a new choice, just different.

-juice

dino001 · September 2005

Amen to that. I think that "expansion" thing was just a smoke screen. They just couldn'd admit "we don't sell many of those so we cut costs here". Rather, because they add SE, which is exaclty new base making base "value edition" using oher manufacturers' languege, they effectively cut choice, not expanded. Not the first time black is called white and vice versa. Not the last, either...

ateixeira · September 2005

If I were in Subaru PR, I would have said they had expanded availability of the H6 on Outback models (cloth is now offered). At least that's true.

-juice

red927 · September 2005

I sent an e-mail to Subaru on the same topic and they replied saying that the website is updated on a preset schedule and when the time comes it will be done. Pretty lame answer :mad:

Phil

robr2 · September 2005

I sent an e-mail to Subaru on the same topic and they replied saying that the website is updated on a preset schedule and when the time comes it will be done. Pretty lame answer

I think they took the web site money and spent it on Tribeca commercials.

dino001 · September 2005

If so, it looks somebody stole half of it. I can't stand this song anymore.

ateixeira · September 2005

I think we're all tired of Dust, it was cool the first 500 times, but enough already...

-juice

declansdad · September 2005

I'm pretty tired of it too!

Maybe Subaru should rehire Lance and have him team up with his current gal pal Cheryl Crow. They could sing a song about the beauty and performance of Subaru.

No more Dust, Think.Feel.Drive for me.

Michael

rsholland · September 2005

on the Euro-beca, next 9-2x and Subaru diesels.

http://www.itv-motoring.com/features/industry/2005/7000.asp

Bob

once_for_all · September 2005

keep the diesels coming, IMO. Gives them a chance to work the bugs and emissions out for an '07 US market debut (still dreamin', California style...).

John

rochcom · September 2005

Just read the article linked above. When we first saw pictures of the Tribeca, I mentioned that the grill looked like that of the old Saab 96. I posted links to pictures of both vehicles. Now, here is the word that the Tribeca will also be marketed in Europe by Saab as the 9-6X. Now the grill makes sense. This was planned all along. Some Sherlock Holmes fan at Subaru or Saab was giving us a hint.

jeffmc · September 2005

Every image I've seen of the 9-6 has been a 3-door. This story says it's a 5-door vehicle. Wonder what it'll really be.

Thanks for the link, Bob.

c_hunter · September 2005

All the 3-door images have been Photo-shopped, so they are not reliable. I would bet it's a 5-door. There is really no market for a 3-door (plenty of failures already).

Craig

cptplt · September 2005

given the grille is now standard on all Subarus I doubt that was the rational behind it!

rsholland · September 2005

I think juice owes me a lunch. Check out the B5-TPH.

http://www.autoindex.org/news.plt?no=1233&nl=y#

Bob

bat1161 · September 2005

That B5-TPH looks very nice. I wonder if we would ever see that here in the US? I'm not surprised that it has the hybrid technology - Subaru had to come out with something hybrid.

Mark

rsholland · September 2005

I suspect it could very well hint at what the '08 Impreza might look like. Think overall shape more so than design details such as tail lights, etc. There have been rumors that there might be a hatchback offered, and that's what this is.

BTW, I find the way the hatch opens to be rather visually interesting, with the way it wraps down on to the side glass. I don't think I've seen that done before. I very much like what I see here.

Bob

once_for_all · September 2005

I like it too (much more than the RE1).

The hatch reminds me of the mid 70's Porsche 941 (not sure of that number, there were a couple produced back then front engine with the rear tranny and the driveline harmonic issues between the two. Didn't last very long).

John

rsholland · September 2005

Actually, the proportions reminds me a lot of the 2-door Saab hatchback concept they showed last year at the auto shows. Hmmm...

Bob

rsholland · September 2005

http://www.subarunews.net/news/news20050928.htm

B5 looks very good in profile. Very interesting door cut lines. Also note the hatch roof cut line, which is at the back edge of the "B" pillar.

Bob

once_for_all · September 2005

now, wack the hatch off and we have the next gen Baja (j/k).

John

ateixeira · September 2005

I like it, to me it actually recalled the Chevy Nomad concept from last year's Detroit Show. You'll recall I wanted to see Chevy build that car (sharing a platform with the Solistice).

That is neat. Some details are pure concept fantasy, but a practical small hatch shape plus a hybrid powertrain are interesting.

I lose, big-time, Bob. Bon Appetit!

Note the theatre-style seating, the 2nd row is much higher than the first.

-juice

rsholland · September 2005

now, wack the hatch off and we have the next gen Baja (j/k).

Actually that's not a bad idea! I could certainly see those hatchback cut lines applied to the Baja, and get rid of those sport bars.

Bob

once_for_all · September 2005

I wouldn't mind a 2 seater Baja, as 99% of the time I am solo in my work. This would make it similar (at least, in profile) to the 2 door FWD Dodge car/pickup that was around in the 80's.

But I think the market place will call for a 4 + 1, crew cab.

John

ateixeira · September 2005

That Blitzen Touring Wagon is HAWT!

But I bet they'd give us the Edge costmetic packages for the Forester and Outback instead. Do those really need 400 lbs of shiny metal ballast?

B5 TPM looks good overall, but some of the details are a bit Pruis-ish. By that I mean it seems like they tried to make it stand out as a non-standard gas car, to earn Greenie points, perhaps.

-juice

jeffmc · September 2005

Well, it certainly looks aerodynamic, and it's different from anything Subaru offers. I agree, Bob, very Saab-like look (mostly to the top half). Overall, I don't seem to have the same excited reaction everyone else is having so far. I thought the B9S & B11 were much more exciting to look at. Lots of details on the B5 I don't like, most of which probably wouldn't make it into a production version, anyway.
The rear end to me is awful. I know it's a concept, but I dislike the tiny lights (unsafe size? turn signal not at the corners?), dislike the gaping angled square exhaust (though it mimicks the flow of the dark gray surround and helps that surround from looking too massive), dislike that dark gray surround (maybe if it didn't encompass the lights), dislike the lighter gray center (although if you have a personalized plate, it'll really emphasize it nicely), and it's ridiculous to have the liftover height for the trunk be at the beltline of the car. Lack of bumper is disturbing. I think making the lights larger and uniting them into one piece would go a long way toward improving the rear's look.

Moving to the front... all is good for me except that grille. Frankly, I like Tribeca's better. Taking too many tips from Nissan, I think. Looks cheap, not upscale. Don't like the emblem on the hood, and I wonder how much it costs to replace the entire front bumper and front quarter panels that are all one piece. Like the front fascia, like the headlight shape integrating into the bumper shape and that line flowing down the entire car.

Profile is almost all funky goodness. Like the mirrors, but where's the integrated turnsignal? I, too, like the way the hatch wraps into the B-pillar. That B-pillar is distinct (reminds me of my del Sol) and makes me think of a chopped B5 as more of a modern rendition of the Brat than the Baja. Adds a bit of sporty feel, oddly. The C-pillars are really thin, which makes me think visibility will be great. I have no problem with the strange cut of the door opening, as it seems to start the eye moving up toward the rear, but wonder if the shape would make it even more difficult to step into the back seats. So do you guys think the Subaru emblem on the B pillar is some sort of door handle that's not attached to the door? How do you get in to this thing?

I can't tell how big B5 is. Is there a market for a pseudo-lux hybrid coupe/hatch Legacy-sized or larger? Seems to me those who want 2 and 3 doors generally want smaller, sporting cars, so I hope it's an Impreza-hatch.

I'm really rambling on and on, but one more thing... B5 really needs B11's frosted glass roof.

ateixeira · September 2005

Agree, especially about the profile being its best angle (by FAR).

But this is a concept, half that stuff is just to get attention. It would be toned down significantly.

Wonder if that 2.0l Miller cycle turbo requires premium fuel?

-juice

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