I know what you mean. I was very impressed w/the Hyundai XG350 that I saw at the Seattle Int'l Autoshow back in Nov. I also really liked the looks of the new Tiberon (sp?). Looks like a smaller Ferrari model...nice job. The content and execution of the XG was very impressive. I liked the change to 16"wheels and tires...it was needed IMO. The Kia Optima and Hyundai Sonata were nicer than I expected. I didn't care for the Santa Fe, mainly because I felt the exterior styling was over the top, like it was trying too hard to stand out. My advice to Hyundai is relax a bit on this one, :-). The Landrover Freelander left really no impression on me which, I guess, is a bad thing. I did wonder why anyone would seriously buy it over more established and better value brands. I liked the Mazda P5 and the felt the new Audi A4 looked much better in person. I liked the Mercedes-Benz c230 a lot. The back end looks less bizarre in person. The Acura RSX left me cold. One surprise for me was how well I liked the new T-bird in person. Now, if Ford can keep it from experiencing embarrassing quality glitches they may just have a semi-classic on their hands (not holding my breath or anything though). I don't think it deserved car of the year, thank you Motortrend. The Buick Rendevous looked cheap in person, especially the inside. I would never own one.
on the new Lexus GX 470, which I suspect is the Lexus version of the '03 4Runner. I spoke to a Toyota rep the other day at the Washington DC Auto Show, and he mentioned that the new 4Runner would have the V8 as an option.
Just a note, when they get around to redesigning the legacy, For Gods sake ask them to lose that stupid mud trap at the end of the rocker panel and ahead of the rear wheel.
This may seem like a small niggle but that shelf is about two and a half inchs wide. mud and snow pile up in there like you would not believe, to me this is a rust hole waiting to happen.
The worse part to me is that this ledge does not need to be nearly this wide, on every other car I have checked that has the rear wheel well finished this way that ledge is much narrower.
Yup, I liked the new Tib, too. Hints of Ferrari and the Toyota Supra, but smaller in scale. Not bad cars to be compared to, eh?
I agree 100% about the XG, and the Santa Fe. It's a shame, they did try too hard, and overdid the styling on the Santa Fe. There are unneeded curves and accents, bulges and flares, inside and out.
P5 is nice but small, more for young singles. A4 is still quite small, too, not feasible for a two kid family IMO. Same with 3 series, X type, and even the C class. Even the C wagon is too sporty, not boxy, and lacks the room I'd need.
I drove the Rendezvous, it's nothing special. It deserves a better drivetrain for the stylish interior.
I sat in a T-Bird a couple of weeks ago. The seats are spongy, with too much lumbar support.
I had the same problem with the Kia Sedona minivan. The EX has a lumpy seat, and the LX was actually more comfy, but it lacks captains chairs.
CR-V: same cheap carpet, sun visor, headliner as the Forester and RAV4. I noticed my headliner from 1998 is actually nicer (padded with fabric) than the newer ones. Cost cutting?
Any how, the hole in the fenders is a huge, gaping hole. Looks like maybe some of the steering mechanism goes through there, but you can see clear through to the other side. It's wild.
The plastic on the lower half of the dash is shiny and hollow, and they use it throughout the whole interior. Though honestly the Forester is only a tad better in its quality of plastics.
Likes: huge rear seat, biggest in class, bigger than many mid-sizers. Great packaging. They move up, fold, remove, nice. Looks like the spare could actually fit inside like the Forester, why don't they do it?
Ergonomics are odd, which is strange because Honda invented them. But it's wierd stuff works, like the brake and auto shifter. Manual shifter is too far a reach, and auto lever gets in the way of the radio. At least the steering wheel is straight now.
Doors feel more substantial. Roof rails feel cheap, the cover looks like it would pop off. No cross cars, no fog lights, no mud guards, no cargo cover, lots of accessorizing is needed.
Cargo space is good, but not deep unless you move the seats forward. You have either big cargo space or big passenger space but not both.
It's cleaner underneath now. The exhaust no longer protrudes, so it really does have 8" of clearance this time. Engine sits very high and fore of the front axle though.
I looked closely at all the small utes, back to back. I also looked at many vans back to back, so I walked around a lot.
I should be more specific on the Freelander. I like its tidy size outside, and room is fair inside. The thing is ALL the plastics are hard. Upper and lower dash, nothing is padded. Usually at least the upper part is padded, even in cheap SUVs. Luxury means both are soft and textured, but the Freelander had neither. The font on the speedo and tach were hard to read. It reminded me of the IS300 in that it does not try to be luxurious, but perhaps sporty? The fabric on the door is similar, for example. But the IS pulls it off due to the car's character, while the Freelander doesn't.
On the plus side, styling is great, even better in person. It has cachet, and there were small crowds there to see it.
Lots and lots of options now. I guess the thing is nothing stood out in my mind, there is no clear class leader, like the Forester was back in 1998 (with only RAV4 and CR-V as car-like competition). Now it's a close call.
But my conclusion was there is nothing that I am dying to buy. I'd rather pay to fix my wife's car and keep driving that. Camry is nice but nothing special, certainly not for the $28k price loaded. LL Bean is nice but she does not want wagons, and the sedan is tight. The Avalon is high on her list, but again it's a bit pricey for FWD. Odyssey is probably closest to nailing the target, but full MSRP and a short warranty are a bad, bad combination. So nothing out there makes we want to commit and put my money down, so we may wait to see the next round of new vehicles, like the Accord, Sienna, and Forester. We'll see.
I love car shows. You can make so many conclusions even without driving the cars.
if '03 North American Imprezas will get the revised grille that all Japanese Imprezas now have?
From what I can tell from the Internet images, it just makes the front of the vehicle look "different," not "better." Maybe(?) it looks better in person...
Aside from the "blister" on the sedans's rear doors, these doors appear to be identical to those used on the wagon. So, I'm wondering if the wagon also had blistered fenders, like the sedan, would the current sedan doors bolt right on the wagons. As I said, other than the blistering, they appear to be the same.
Why am I asking such an obscure question, you ask? If you recall last month, it was announced that Prodrive would facelift the current Impreza for the '04(?) MY. In that news release, it was mentioned that every exterior panel, except the roof and doors would be changed.
So, if the sedan's rear doors might fit the wagon, if the fenders were blistered, it's also possible that the wagon might get the sedan's wider track and fenders?! I hope it happens. It would certainly streamline production a bit, as well as improve the wagon's handling and looks IMO. And... by doing this, they wouldn't be changing the doors at all, they'ed just be adding the already "existing" sedan doors to the wagon.
In any case, we have a couple of years to think about it.
I thought you would prefer the the blistered fenders. They afford a wider track, thus improved handling, something I thought you might desire. Interesting...
I like the blistered look, although I'm sure colin will point out the blisters and slightly wider track are negligable IMHO compared to other factors as far as handling. My favorite cars always have blistered fenders: Starion/Conquest, Porshes (with those huge fender flares), 99/00 Monteros, 1st Gen MX6, SVX...
on this has always been: this is a car at marketed at a very specific "price point." Subaru is trying to get the maximum you can in this vehicle within the desired price range. It seems to me that having two different suspensions and different miscellaneous body parts is a rather "luxurious" undertaking considering what Subaru is trying to sell the vehicle for.
Simply put, it would be cheaper (to manufacture and inventory) to have the wagon and sedan share these components, whether they have fender blisters or not.
All this talk about car shows is getting me pretty excited about upcoming updates from the Detroit show, as well as my home-town Denver show, though that isn't until late February/early March.
As some may recall, I replaced my 98 Legacy GT with a 00 Passat GLX a year ago. I am thoroughly enjoying the Passat. The 2.8 V6 mated with the manual makes me look forward to driving every day and some of the "luxury items" I didn't think I needed, such as auto climate and power/memory seats, have proven to be handy features. Let's hope their handiness is not negated by alleged VW electrical problems in the future. To be honest, though, I've had fewer problems in the first year of ownership with the Passat than we did with the Legacy. I may be biased, but I don't think Passats have been as prone to problems as some other VW models, perhaps due to the different factories that Passats and Golfs/Jettas come out of (hint to Juice - consider adding the Passat to your list?).
Given that, I do miss my Legacy for its inherent "Subie-ness" and look forward to hearing about the updates to the 03 model, as well as the predicted all-new 05 model. Assuming increased power, and continued use of a manual transmission, I imagine I'll become a Subaru owner again in late 04 or 05! Plus, no offense to current owners, but maybe they'll finally change the GT wheels by then! I mean, they're nice wheels and all, but, in my opinion, the introduction of the new '00 model should have come with new alloys. And, as I'm sure current owners will attest, they're a pain to clean. Perhaps this will be addressed by the '03 facelift.
mike called it-- the difference in track between the sedan and wagon is neglible. someone that thinks they feel / notice a difference is probably feeling the wagon's added weight although it's a fairly modest increase.
and I do like some blistered fenders, I just don't like the way Subaru did it on the 02 sedan. bleh. Ford Focus, Mustang, Cougar-- also bleh. the starion's fenders were very modest, much less than Camaros or even Supras of the day.
Midgate on the Baja, yes please. People want function to go with the style. It'll lead the compact Crew Cab class if it has it. Maybe not in sales, but in ratings and reviews.
I like the flared fenders, and a wagon with those would look particularly sporty. But only if you can keep the wagon $500 cheaper. I would not pay $500 just for the wider track and flares.
That's typical of VWs - they do well in short-term surveys like JD Power Initial Quality, and less so in long-term durability and CR's reliability ratings. I hope yours is an exception.
The 4Motion is pricey once you option it out, and does not have the stability control that Audi/VDC offers. So I compare it to the LL Bean, and it isn't as good a value, IMO. It also does not meet my fuel mileage target, 20 or better city mpg, and that's with premium to boot (so is the H6, but at least it breaks 20).
On the other hand, the Passat does use very high quality materials and construction. I guess the bottom line is I don't trust VW, not yet. Too many horror stories. Seems like most owners are perfectly happy, but the few that suffer major problems scare me off a bit.
I drove an A4 with the 190hp V6 at the Mercedes Power Trip event, and it was okay but nothing special IMO. The V6 really had to spool up to make power. This was mated to an auto. I drove a 1.8T a while ago with a manual and actually preferred that, plus it's chip-able. But - that's FWD only.
But the bottom line is the wife isn't crazy about VW's, so the price premium (perhaps justified to many people) doesn't fly with her.
I just got back from some New Year's grocery shopping with the wife, and noticed that there was a Chevy Avalanche parked near our Forester on the Safeway's parking lot. Also on the a way home, which is maybe 10 miles, I saw 3 or 4 more Avalanches. Those things are selling like hotcakes in my neck of the woods!
I just reread the "Prodrive Announcement" in Wards, and it states that the rear fenders will not be changed either. So, it looks like the sedan will remain with the wider track and blistered fenders, and the wagon won't. The following is their wording:
"involve every exterior panel except the doors, rear fenders and greenhouse."
is an "IVT" the same as a "CVT?" Sure sounds like it, and if so, they're now testing them in the full-size the Ford Expedition and the Chevy Silverado! This sounds like the IVT/CVT may be getting ready for "Prime-Time."
Don't know if this is the right place to ask, but does anyone know about the 2003 Forester? I read somewhere it would be new. What I was really wondering is if it will be larger? We are looking for a 4WD/AWD SUV. I like what I have read about Subaru, but the present Forester looks a little too small. Anyone know?
IVTs and CVTs, it seems that there is little need for having a tachometer on vehicles thusly equipped. The tach no longer would serve any useful function, and it would be pretty boring to watch, given that the rpm will remain relatively the same during operation.
Only IVT/CVTs with a manual shift override would have any use for it, and as far as I can see this manual override is pretty much useless anyway.
Would the override be useful for providing engine braking (as opposed to engine breaking)? I found driving Rufus (my 1st A/T) rather terrible in certain circumstances until I got used to manually downshifting as needed. I'm assuming that there would be very little engine braking with the IVT in the normal operation mode.
... that would be the only (and valid) use that I can think of. Especially if you're descending a steep, slippery hill. If the Audi 3.0 CVT is any indication, it is much *slower* in the manual mode.
Is it OK to manually shift an automatic? I guess in these days of electronic controls, the lever doesn't really downshift but suggests to the computer to do so. So the computer downshifts in a way that is safe to the tranny. Am I guessing right?
I've heard conflicting opinions, but I guess the opinions against it are based on old-style mechanical controls. Edmunds test drives very often involve manual shifting for performance tests, including non-manumatic transmissions.
Speaking of tachometer on a CVT car, I think it would be a techie thrill to see it stay in one place! :-) Also, I assume the transmission selects RPM's based on momentary demands, so the driver could learn how to control the RPM's that the transmission settles on.
Avalanches are plentiful in my 'hood also. But then again, it's so massive they are hard to miss, so perhaps I just notice them more. At the DC Auto Show it didn't really have crowds around it.
I told you Piech was having a power trip - the Phaeton name is just stupid. D1 was fine. D12 is a rap group, though. ;-)
if the type about this IVT is true, what it will do to the transmission *landscape* in ten years or so. Consider the following:
• Will IVTs be the final nail in the coffin for manuals? This IVT (apparently) eliminates all the advantages of a manual, and can be fitted to almost any engine, since torque limitations are no longer an issue. Manuals may still have a "fun factor" edge, but will that be enough for manufacturers to continue there production? Only if there is enough demand, but that's sure to taper off when it becomes common knowledge that a ITV can match a manual for performance and efficiency.
• While watching the WRC marathon yesterday, you couldn't help but notice that many of Subaru's problems this past year were transmission-related. Would a (strong reliable) ITV be a better racing solution? It may be just a matter of time before we see this type of tranny on the racing circuit...
• Are man-u-matics just a passing fad? It seems most people prefer a fully automatic transmission. Everyone who has driven a manumatic says that it's not as much fun as a "pure' manual—and if IVTs are faster, who cares about the manual capability?
Manuals are already only on something like 7% of the vehicles sold in the US. Some would argue they are already dead.
BMW has a 6 speed auto, so even the torch carrier of manual trannies may dump them eventually.
I have yet to drive a manumatic that I liked better in manual mode than in auto mode. They are almost always slower, so why bother with the extra cost?
What a great idea -- I hope these transmissions catch on across the board. A lot of this will depend on how people react to the feel and performance. If you've never driven one, it sort of feels like a manual transmission with clutch slippage at times, since the engine RPM can quickly outpace the apparent "speed" of the vehicle (unlike conventional transmissions, where RPM and speed have an audible/sensual connection). With a little experience, I think most people will accept the CVT.
The big factor in my opinion is reliability. Every CVT on the market thus far has been phased out due to problems with the belt. Audi has a new design, and we'll have to see how that holds up. We've also got the CVT in the Honda Insight and Saturn VUE to watch. Time will tell.
The IVT (not CVT) apparently has none of the CVT's limitations, but it does have all of its pluses. The IVT does not use a belt or chain, but instead, it has a variator comprising toroidal or convex discs and rollers which can infinitely vary the transmission ratio within a certain range. Also, there is no torque converter. Do CVTs still use a torque converter?
Check out the link I posted early on this topic on this thread.
not really. turbo lag plus torque converter lag is annoying, but you will still have turbo lag no matter what sort of transmission it's hooked to. the turbo doesn't make boost unless there's load, so if you're cruising at any time you're probably in vacuum or low boost. you don't make full boost until sometime after the pedal goes to the floor, there's not much you can do about it especially if you're not tuning for running at WOT all the time (like racecars).
Bart - I've been trying to find out the same thing but have not had any luck.
A friend of mine with an Accord destroyed his tranny that way. I also read a post on the i-club and someone else's friend destroyed their Honda's tranny as well. I'm not talking about an occasional drop into 3rd either. :-)
I test drove an auto WRX that was hard to shift into "1". My guess was that it had been thrashed pretty hard.
True, they should call it throttle lag, instead of turbo lag.
Funny note about our year-long car shopping saga: the wife was fiddling with the HVAC controls in Sandy, and I caught her saying "our next car will have climate control". I pointed out the LL Bean, which has it. I'm telling you, that's the Subie for her (only because the VDC is too pricey, she thinks).
She's the type that cranks on full heat, and then overcompensates by making the air cold, and so on.
Still have to get her over the "but it's a wagon" hoop, though.
AN says the STX will debut in production form in Detroit. Jan 6 is the first press day, so we'll likely find out details on Monday. They say it gets the midgate - sweet!
Comments
I know what you mean. I was very impressed w/the Hyundai XG350 that I saw at the Seattle Int'l Autoshow back in Nov. I also really liked the looks of the new Tiberon (sp?). Looks like a smaller Ferrari model...nice job. The content and execution of the XG was very impressive. I liked the change to 16"wheels and tires...it was needed IMO. The Kia Optima and Hyundai Sonata were nicer than I expected. I didn't care for the Santa Fe, mainly because I felt the exterior styling was over the top, like it was trying too hard to stand out. My advice to Hyundai is relax a bit on this one, :-). The Landrover Freelander left really no impression on me which, I guess, is a bad thing. I did wonder why anyone would seriously buy it over more established and better value brands. I liked the Mazda P5 and the felt the new Audi A4 looked much better in person. I liked the Mercedes-Benz c230 a lot. The back end looks less bizarre in person. The Acura RSX left me cold. One surprise for me was how well I liked the new T-bird in person. Now, if Ford can keep it from experiencing embarrassing quality glitches they may just have a semi-classic on their hands (not holding my breath or anything though). I don't think it deserved car of the year, thank you Motortrend. The Buick Rendevous looked cheap in person, especially the inside. I would never own one.
Stephen
What did you think of the new CRV juice?
Bob
Bob
http://www.lexus.com/about/news/popups/pr_2001/pr_2001_12_17.html
This may seem like a small niggle but that shelf is about two and a half inchs wide. mud and snow pile up in there like you would not believe, to me this is a rust hole waiting to happen.
The worse part to me is that this ledge does not need to be nearly this wide, on every other car I have checked that has the rear wheel well finished this way that ledge is much narrower.
Cheers Pat.
I agree 100% about the XG, and the Santa Fe. It's a shame, they did try too hard, and overdid the styling on the Santa Fe. There are unneeded curves and accents, bulges and flares, inside and out.
P5 is nice but small, more for young singles. A4 is still quite small, too, not feasible for a two kid family IMO. Same with 3 series, X type, and even the C class. Even the C wagon is too sporty, not boxy, and lacks the room I'd need.
I drove the Rendezvous, it's nothing special. It deserves a better drivetrain for the stylish interior.
I sat in a T-Bird a couple of weeks ago. The seats are spongy, with too much lumbar support.
I had the same problem with the Kia Sedona minivan. The EX has a lumpy seat, and the LX was actually more comfy, but it lacks captains chairs.
CR-V: same cheap carpet, sun visor, headliner as the Forester and RAV4. I noticed my headliner from 1998 is actually nicer (padded with fabric) than the newer ones. Cost cutting?
Any how, the hole in the fenders is a huge, gaping hole. Looks like maybe some of the steering mechanism goes through there, but you can see clear through to the other side. It's wild.
The plastic on the lower half of the dash is shiny and hollow, and they use it throughout the whole interior. Though honestly the Forester is only a tad better in its quality of plastics.
Likes: huge rear seat, biggest in class, bigger than many mid-sizers. Great packaging. They move up, fold, remove, nice. Looks like the spare could actually fit inside like the Forester, why don't they do it?
Ergonomics are odd, which is strange because Honda invented them. But it's wierd stuff works, like the brake and auto shifter. Manual shifter is too far a reach, and auto lever gets in the way of the radio. At least the steering wheel is straight now.
Doors feel more substantial. Roof rails feel cheap, the cover looks like it would pop off. No cross cars, no fog lights, no mud guards, no cargo cover, lots of accessorizing is needed.
Cargo space is good, but not deep unless you move the seats forward. You have either big cargo space or big passenger space but not both.
It's cleaner underneath now. The exhaust no longer protrudes, so it really does have 8" of clearance this time. Engine sits very high and fore of the front axle though.
I looked closely at all the small utes, back to back. I also looked at many vans back to back, so I walked around a lot.
I should be more specific on the Freelander. I like its tidy size outside, and room is fair inside. The thing is ALL the plastics are hard. Upper and lower dash, nothing is padded. Usually at least the upper part is padded, even in cheap SUVs. Luxury means both are soft and textured, but the Freelander had neither. The font on the speedo and tach were hard to read. It reminded me of the IS300 in that it does not try to be luxurious, but perhaps sporty? The fabric on the door is similar, for example. But the IS pulls it off due to the car's character, while the Freelander doesn't.
On the plus side, styling is great, even better in person. It has cachet, and there were small crowds there to see it.
Lots and lots of options now. I guess the thing is nothing stood out in my mind, there is no clear class leader, like the Forester was back in 1998 (with only RAV4 and CR-V as car-like competition). Now it's a close call.
But my conclusion was there is nothing that I am dying to buy. I'd rather pay to fix my wife's car and keep driving that. Camry is nice but nothing special, certainly not for the $28k price loaded. LL Bean is nice but she does not want wagons, and the sedan is tight. The Avalon is high on her list, but again it's a bit pricey for FWD. Odyssey is probably closest to nailing the target, but full MSRP and a short warranty are a bad, bad combination. So nothing out there makes we want to commit and put my money down, so we may wait to see the next round of new vehicles, like the Accord, Sienna, and Forester. We'll see.
I love car shows. You can make so many conclusions even without driving the cars.
-juice
Sounds like the Baja will have some sort of midgate.
Bob
http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=1255
From what I can tell from the Internet images, it just makes the front of the vehicle look "different," not "better." Maybe(?) it looks better in person...
Bob
Aside from the "blister" on the sedans's rear doors, these doors appear to be identical to those used on the wagon. So, I'm wondering if the wagon also had blistered fenders, like the sedan, would the current sedan doors bolt right on the wagons. As I said, other than the blistering, they appear to be the same.
Why am I asking such an obscure question, you ask? If you recall last month, it was announced that Prodrive would facelift the current Impreza for the '04(?) MY. In that news release, it was mentioned that every exterior panel, except the roof and doors would be changed.
So, if the sedan's rear doors might fit the wagon, if the fenders were blistered, it's also possible that the wagon might get the sedan's wider track and fenders?! I hope it happens. It would certainly streamline production a bit, as well as improve the wagon's handling and looks IMO. And... by doing this, they wouldn't be changing the doors at all, they'ed just be adding the already "existing" sedan doors to the wagon.
In any case, we have a couple of years to think about it.
Bob
-Colin
Bob
-mike
Simply put, it would be cheaper (to manufacture and inventory) to have the wagon and sedan share these components, whether they have fender blisters or not.
Bob
-mike
As some may recall, I replaced my 98 Legacy GT with a 00 Passat GLX a year ago. I am thoroughly enjoying the Passat. The 2.8 V6 mated with the manual makes me look forward to driving every day and some of the "luxury items" I didn't think I needed, such as auto climate and power/memory seats, have proven to be handy features. Let's hope their handiness is not negated by alleged VW electrical problems in the future. To be honest, though, I've had fewer problems in the first year of ownership with the Passat than we did with the Legacy. I may be biased, but I don't think Passats have been as prone to problems as some other VW models, perhaps due to the different factories that Passats and Golfs/Jettas come out of (hint to Juice - consider adding the Passat to your list?).
Given that, I do miss my Legacy for its inherent "Subie-ness" and look forward to hearing about the updates to the 03 model, as well as the predicted all-new 05 model. Assuming increased power, and continued use of a manual transmission, I imagine I'll become a Subaru owner again in late 04 or 05! Plus, no offense to current owners, but maybe they'll finally change the GT wheels by then! I mean, they're nice wheels and all, but, in my opinion, the introduction of the new '00 model should have come with new alloys. And, as I'm sure current owners will attest, they're a pain to clean. Perhaps this will be addressed by the '03 facelift.
2024 Audi Q8 e-tron - 2017 911 C4S - 2025 BRZ - 2023 A6 Allroad - 2024 Genesis GV60 - 2019 Cayman
and I do like some blistered fenders, I just don't like the way Subaru did it on the 02 sedan. bleh. Ford Focus, Mustang, Cougar-- also bleh. the starion's fenders were very modest, much less than Camaros or even Supras of the day.
-Colin
I like the flared fenders, and a wagon with those would look particularly sporty. But only if you can keep the wagon $500 cheaper. I would not pay $500 just for the wider track and flares.
That's typical of VWs - they do well in short-term surveys like JD Power Initial Quality, and less so in long-term durability and CR's reliability ratings. I hope yours is an exception.
The 4Motion is pricey once you option it out, and does not have the stability control that Audi/VDC offers. So I compare it to the LL Bean, and it isn't as good a value, IMO. It also does not meet my fuel mileage target, 20 or better city mpg, and that's with premium to boot (so is the H6, but at least it breaks 20).
On the other hand, the Passat does use very high quality materials and construction. I guess the bottom line is I don't trust VW, not yet. Too many horror stories. Seems like most owners are perfectly happy, but the few that suffer major problems scare me off a bit.
I drove an A4 with the 190hp V6 at the Mercedes Power Trip event, and it was okay but nothing special IMO. The V6 really had to spool up to make power. This was mated to an auto. I drove a 1.8T a while ago with a manual and actually preferred that, plus it's chip-able. But - that's FWD only.
But the bottom line is the wife isn't crazy about VW's, so the price premium (perhaps justified to many people) doesn't fly with her.
-juice
Bob
As far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter. Either way is fine—just whatever you do, do it to both the sedan and wagon.
I'd much rather see the extra $$ allocated for having both blistered and non-blistered fenders, etc., go to offering a 6-speed instead.
I just see offering two fender designs as a poor way of spending money on a product that is so price-sensitive.
Bob
I just reread the "Prodrive Announcement" in Wards, and it states that the rear fenders will not be changed either. So, it looks like the sedan will remain with the wider track and blistered fenders, and the wagon won't. The following is their wording:
"involve every exterior panel except the doors, rear fenders and greenhouse."
Bob
Bob
http://TheCarConnection.com/index.asp?article=4505&sid=192&n=158
Bob
http://www.torotrak.com/press20010710.htm
Can I get one to rig up to our OB?
-Brian
Thanks,
JJ
That's all we know to date. There are several rumors floating around however.
Bob
Bob
http://www.gulf-cars.com/wagsearch.php3?mode=Review&ReviewID=109
Ross
Bob
..Mike
..Mike
Only IVT/CVTs with a manual shift override would have any use for it, and as far as I can see this manual override is pretty much useless anyway.
Bob
Ross
-mike
Bob
I've heard conflicting opinions, but I guess the opinions against it are based on old-style mechanical controls. Edmunds test drives very often involve manual shifting for performance tests, including non-manumatic transmissions.
Speaking of tachometer on a CVT car, I think it would be a techie thrill to see it stay in one place! :-) Also, I assume the transmission selects RPM's based on momentary demands, so the driver could learn how to control the RPM's that the transmission settles on.
--Bart
LOL!
Bob
I told you Piech was having a power trip - the Phaeton name is just stupid. D1 was fine. D12 is a rap group, though. ;-)
-juice
PS Did the LA Show start?
Bob
OK, that was lame.
-juice
• Will IVTs be the final nail in the coffin for manuals? This IVT (apparently) eliminates all the advantages of a manual, and can be fitted to almost any engine, since torque limitations are no longer an issue. Manuals may still have a "fun factor" edge, but will that be enough for manufacturers to continue there production? Only if there is enough demand, but that's sure to taper off when it becomes common knowledge that a ITV can match a manual for performance and efficiency.
• While watching the WRC marathon yesterday, you couldn't help but notice that many of Subaru's problems this past year were transmission-related. Would a (strong reliable) ITV be a better racing solution? It may be just a matter of time before we see this type of tranny on the racing circuit...
• Are man-u-matics just a passing fad? It seems most people prefer a fully automatic transmission. Everyone who has driven a manumatic says that it's not as much fun as a "pure' manual—and if IVTs are faster, who cares about the manual capability?
Bob
BMW has a 6 speed auto, so even the torch carrier of manual trannies may dump them eventually.
I have yet to drive a manumatic that I liked better in manual mode than in auto mode. They are almost always slower, so why bother with the extra cost?
-juice
The big factor in my opinion is reliability. Every CVT on the market thus far has been phased out due to problems with the belt. Audi has a new design, and we'll have to see how that holds up. We've also got the CVT in the Honda Insight and Saturn VUE to watch. Time will tell.
Craig
Check out the link I posted early on this topic on this thread.
Bob
-juice
Bob
Bob
-Colin
A friend of mine with an Accord destroyed his tranny that way. I also read a post on the i-club and someone else's friend destroyed their Honda's tranny as well. I'm not talking about an occasional drop into 3rd either. :-)
I test drove an auto WRX that was hard to shift into "1". My guess was that it had been thrashed pretty hard.
-Dennis
Funny note about our year-long car shopping saga: the wife was fiddling with the HVAC controls in Sandy, and I caught her saying "our next car will have climate control". I pointed out the LL Bean, which has it. I'm telling you, that's the Subie for her (only because the VDC is too pricey, she thinks).
She's the type that cranks on full heat, and then overcompensates by making the air cold, and so on.
Still have to get her over the "but it's a wagon" hoop, though.
AN says the STX will debut in production form in Detroit. Jan 6 is the first press day, so we'll likely find out details on Monday. They say it gets the midgate - sweet!
-juice
Bob