I agree with Juice on the scoop issue. On the GT or larger car the crowd they are trying to reel in isn't one that like scoops. I personally like it but that's me.
I think they should really focus on getting the H6 or H6t into a larger good handling GT to win over those new customers. After owning the SVX now, if I were buy another subie it would have to be an H6 or H6t and I bet there is a significant crowd out there who are used to torque monsters out there that would not like an H4t no matter how it was tuned.
Tweak the current H6 to make 240hp, slap that in a GT. With 7% quicker gearing and less weight, it'll be the quick car the VDC isn't.
Volvo's LPT still takes some rpms to get going, I don't believe their claims about peak torque being so low. Same with VW. They say torque peaks at a plateau starting at 1750rpm. I say no way.
Try this, get a VW and measure 0-60. Then measure 0-60 with shifts at 3000rpm (so that it drops to about 1750 rpm) instead of red line. If torque is truly at its peak, it should be just as fast, but I bet it's not.
it will be the one shown in the current issue of R&T, in the "Ambersand" section. There is some very subtle lettering on the front door which leads me to to think that this is the "real deal," and not just another Photoshop effort.
My thinking is, if this is another Photoshoped image, why go to the trouble of indicating this tiny lettering on the door, when everybody seems interested in only the front end?
quote: Try this, get a VW and measure 0-60. Then measure 0-60 with shifts at 3000rpm (so that it drops to about 1750 rpm) instead of red line. If torque is truly at its peak, it should be just as fast, but I bet it's not.
you are overlooking the role of gearing in acceleration. even when you're out of your torque peak due to gear multiplication it usually is faster to stay in the lower gear longer.
Bob -- Yeah, I noticed that photo in my issue of R&T. I guess there has to be some level of credibility if they publish it.
Colin -- Your post brings up an interesting point that car manufacturers sometimes gear their vehicles so that they hit 60mph in 2nd just around redline just for the all-so-important 0-60 stat.
dudes, my other vehicle is a 99 astro van good grief! everything fits pretty well though i must say, but along the lines of subaru's attracting new blood they should have an AWD minivan or suv that seats seven comfortably and has plenty of room for strollers, coolers, strollers, diaper bags, playpens and trikes. did i mention strollers?
My parents have owned 4 of them, and yeah, they have great room and decent power, but they have that suck-all GM reliability. We've had everything from flywheel teeth being knocked off to numerous electrical problems and air conditioner systems being out of whack.
Mike- the astro has a powerful enough engine and room for people and stuff but in the three years we've had willermina there have been 3 actuator failures, the rear AC was non-functional on delivery, the tiger paws had serious handling issues, the vinyl on the driver's door armrest shredded, rubber inside and out misplaced, the top hatch in the rear got "misaligned" somehow and would not open, the on board computer never worked right after the first month (except the temp), serious vibration coming from under dash somewhere which is loud and annoying, and then there is a strange thing going on with the accelerator and brakes which i need to check out pronto. it has about 50k. almost forgot the limited driver leg room which has its impact on long trips. most of this stuff is minor, but it does add up. the gas also adds up. i have mixed feelings about willermina nonetheless.
juice- is that a subie in 2005? where can i get more info?
The only experience I had was renting several of them over the years. They all had about 5-15K miles and were ok. Never lived with em on a daily basis so didn't realize the reliability factor.
A front-mounted intercooler could be easily damaged in a fender-bender. Its surface area and plumbing would compete with the radiator and AC condenser. I think the current bonnet scoop and firewall location is a good engineering solution (I haven't looked at the current plumbing, maybe it's awkward).
This "more mature crowd" member likes the bonnet scoop, even though it's not stealthy. IMO Subaru implements the B4/GT-B scoops tastefully. I dislike non-functional scoops.
jorge: right now it's just a rumor, and yes, for 2005. In fact lately we heard that it will not be based on a GM platform, so it's early enough that there could be major changes in design.
Mike: is that a sneaky way to say we're geezin'? ;-)
I'm OK with it, just put a big fat intercooler underneath!
mike, I thought about that, too. An intercooler and metal plumbing has less flex (e.g., in an accident) and is more expensive and than a radiator w/rubber plumbing (yes?). Mitsubishi Lancer Evo and other successful WRC entrants have front-mounted intercoolers, so they certainly work (well enough to win WRC, anyway ). I'm suggesting a top-mounted intercooler is a good compromise.
I just like total sleeper looks in my cars, so a FMIC would be my choice. Heck a FMIC, 16" steelie wheels, a scratch or 2 down the sides, and 310hp under the hood Yum Yum.
I see you've been stirring things up over the the News & Rumors forum at i-club!
At this point, I'm going to believe the sketches simply because it's also backed by the two photos we've seen of the WRX with the Legacy-like headlights plus the round projector lens near the grille.
I think the jury's out on the tail lights, though.
Yeah, I think the facelifted WRX will be like that sketch. No word on the rear though...
I'm hoping the rear license plate is moved up on to the rear deck, and off the bumper, like what they did with the new Forester.
Why? It's a design trick. When you move the license up, like I suggested, it help reinforce the rear-to-front "wedge" profile, that is so popular in today's automotive design. Your eye starts high (at the rear) and continues downward towards the front. When the rear license is down low (on the rear bumper), that counter-acts the the wedge theme.
Almost without exception, cars (IMO) look better (more aggressive) with the rear license mounted (higher) on the rear deck, than (lower) on the rear bumper.
"Almost without exception, cars (IMO) look better (more aggressive) with the rear license mounted (higher) on the rear deck, than (lower) on the rear bumper.
Paul Hansen is the artist who did the sketch of the new Impreza on Apex.com, which I posted earlier today. He's seen photos of the new car, which is what the sketch is based on. He's also a participant over on the I-Club (aka shirokuma). Here's a thread he started on the new facelifted Impreza:
<< Official press photos have gone out to various news organizations. The embargo is until the 28th, though I predict they'll show up on the 26th, the first day of the Paris Motor Show.
IMHO, Subaru did a very good job, and nobody has anything to fear.
Cheers,
Paul Hansen
ps: No.
pps: No.
ppps: No. Don't go filling my PM box asking, either. >>
I guess because the bug eyes were such huge news and target for criticism. From what I've read (i-club posts), sales outside of N. America were down. It's such a huge cult car and anything they do to it will be huge news.
Yeah, I'm for the bug eyes. Let the clones have the new design! I'm much too opinionated about the WRX...I feel if the looks prevented you from buying then you missed the point entirely, and you probably should buy something like a Neon SRT or such! There, mini-rant done! :-)
Apparently, there is a loophole around copyrights if you "sketch" the image. The image is the property of the artist. That's how Paul Hansen was able to escape the dungeon gaurds.
In the yellow photo (bottom of pg 1) on the i-club post, the fog lights look like they were crammed in as an afterthought. IMO it's too busy. I think the MY02 light design is fine (like a MB E-class) but I understand the value of common visual details among the Legacy, Impreza, and Forester. This front end looks more like the Legacy.
There appears to be a subtle sculptured crease around the headlights that sweeps up into the hood. So far, I like what I see. It doesn't look like the rear license plate has moved however. Oh well...
I'm **liking** the way the facelift looks. The headlights and foglights look sweet. I think the CarTop magazine cover is as legit as it's going to get.
Comments
Bob
Bob
Interesting that the turbo has smaller displacment, must be for durability?
paisan mentioned that as a concern.
-juice
I think they should really focus on getting the H6 or H6t into a larger good handling GT to win over those new customers. After owning the SVX now, if I were buy another subie it would have to be an H6 or H6t and I bet there is a significant crowd out there who are used to torque monsters out there that would not like an H4t no matter how it was tuned.
-mike
Volvo's LPT still takes some rpms to get going, I don't believe their claims about peak torque being so low. Same with VW. They say torque peaks at a plateau starting at 1750rpm. I say no way.
Try this, get a VW and measure 0-60. Then measure 0-60 with shifts at 3000rpm (so that it drops to about 1750 rpm) instead of red line. If torque is truly at its peak, it should be just as fast, but I bet it's not.
-juice
Just a week away from the Paris Auto Show and yet no credible spy photos of the Impreza facelift! Subaru really has kept the lid on this one!
Ken
My thinking is, if this is another Photoshoped image, why go to the trouble of indicating this tiny lettering on the door, when everybody seems interested in only the front end?
Bob
you are overlooking the role of gearing in acceleration. even when you're out of your torque peak due to gear multiplication it usually is faster to stay in the lower gear longer.
-Colin
-juice
Colin -- Your post brings up an interesting point that car manufacturers sometimes gear their vehicles so that they hit 60mph in 2nd just around redline just for the all-so-important 0-60 stat.
Ken
-juice
good grief! everything fits pretty well though i must say, but along the lines of subaru's attracting new blood they should have an AWD minivan or suv that seats seven comfortably and has plenty of room for strollers, coolers, strollers, diaper bags, playpens and trikes. did i mention strollers?
jorge
LOL, it's a free country, you can own whatever you want and/or need. I'm interested in the 2005 Big SUW myself.
-juice
-mike
most of this stuff is minor, but it does add up. the gas also adds up. i have mixed feelings about willermina nonetheless.
juice- is that a subie in 2005? where can i get more info?
best, jorge
-mike
This "more mature crowd" member likes the bonnet scoop, even though it's not stealthy. IMO Subaru implements the B4/GT-B scoops tastefully. I dislike non-functional scoops.
..Mike
..Mike
I see it as Subaru's performance *signature,* and not at all boy-racerish.
Bob
-mike
Mike: is that a sneaky way to say we're geezin'? ;-)
I'm OK with it, just put a big fat intercooler underneath!
-juice
juice, I quoted you, dude!
..Mike
..Mike
-mike
Bob
http://www.apexjapan.com/
-mike
I see you've been stirring things up over the the News & Rumors forum at i-club!
At this point, I'm going to believe the sketches simply because it's also backed by the two photos we've seen of the WRX with the Legacy-like headlights plus the round projector lens near the grille.
I think the jury's out on the tail lights, though.
A couple more days!
Ken
Yeah, I think the facelifted WRX will be like that sketch. No word on the rear though...
I'm hoping the rear license plate is moved up on to the rear deck, and off the bumper, like what they did with the new Forester.
Why? It's a design trick. When you move the license up, like I suggested, it help reinforce the rear-to-front "wedge" profile, that is so popular in today's automotive design. Your eye starts high (at the rear) and continues downward towards the front. When the rear license is down low (on the rear bumper), that counter-acts the the wedge theme.
Almost without exception, cars (IMO) look better (more aggressive) with the rear license mounted (higher) on the rear deck, than (lower) on the rear bumper.
Bob
-mike
Bob"
Totally agree, Bob. :-)
Stephen
http://forums.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=248358
And a quote from his most recent post:
<< Official press photos have gone out to various news organizations. The embargo is until the 28th, though I predict they'll show up on the 26th, the first day of the Paris Motor Show.
IMHO, Subaru did a very good job, and nobody has anything to fear.
Cheers,
Paul Hansen
ps: No.
pps: No.
ppps: No. Don't go filling my PM box asking, either. >>
Bob
Bob
I wonder what the main topic of conversation will be? Hmmm...
Bob
-Dennis
Happy with the bug-eyes :-)
Stephen
I agree with you guys and all bug-eyeophiles..they give the car character and distinction...love'em.
I see a little of the old Corolla, but pulled back more, for a nice overall look. Not too conservative, either.
The bug eyes will just be more unique, if you like yours rest easy because they're being immortalized.
I have to call about 3 people that will probably go out and buy one of the face-lifted ones...
-juice
Apparently, there is a loophole around copyrights if you "sketch" the image. The image is the property of the artist. That's how Paul Hansen was able to escape the dungeon gaurds.
Ken
http://forums.i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=249497
Notice the small type at the bottom of the picture, saying it has a more upscale interior?
BTW, I saw that post earlier this afternoon, but I couldn't get the link to work. I see someone else posted image below my complaint.
Bob
Someone help me picture the purported new design in a wagon... I can't say I like it.
-Dave
..Mike
..Mike
http://www.scoobynet.co.uk/bbs/thread.asp?ThreadID=134930&ForumName=ScoobyNet%20General&ForumID=1
There appears to be a subtle sculptured crease around the headlights that sweeps up into the hood. So far, I like what I see. It doesn't look like the rear license plate has moved however. Oh well...
Bob
Ken
Face lift looks good. I hope the grille details sort out nicely.
-juice