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Comments
Mark
With that in mind, I can't help but think, at some point, the base WRX will also get a 2.5 turbo. My guess is that it would the same (state of tune) as whatever the Legacy 2.5 GT gets, which will probably be ~ 250-260 HP. It will probably show up when the Impreza gets redesigned for MY06 or MY07.
Bob
That was one of my guesses too. I see you were also over at the i-club thread regarding the 2.5 turbo Forester:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=297476
I was having a debate with another i-clubber about the possibility (and praticality) of having a 2.5 turbo WRX.
Since emissions is a big hurdle for Subaru, I think it actually might make sense for Subaru to put the 2.5T in the WRX and turbo Forester also. Plus, the 2.5T will help address the low-end torque needs as well. I don't think the material cost of the 2.0T and 2.5T would be that much different either.
The fellow I was debating with said it doesn't make sense to have several models with the same engine tuned to different levels. As we've seen with Volkswagen-Audi and Nissan, using the same engine with different tuning does work quite well.
I think the turbo Forester will tell us a lot about the upcoming engine configurations for SOA. If it indeed comes with a 2.5 turbo, then I wouldn't be surprised if the WRX eventually made the switch too. Why have only one trim in a model line using a unique engine?
Ken
My response: "Not with a teenager on my insurance. Besides, I'm waiting for the B4."
His answer: "We're expecting them in the fall of 03. Want to place an order now?".
Dear Santa, what I want next Christmas ....
Jim
I think it wouldn't be out of the question to see a turbo Legacy GT between now and the redesign. Sure, the engine is new, but with the WRX, STi and now Turbo Forester, the Legacy GT line will be hurting bad for some power.
I wouldn't be sure if the Legacy GT turbo would get a 5MT (or at least the current one), but the sport-shift 4EAT and VTD would be a nice match.
Yes, it is kind of tempting!
Ken
I'm hoping that the Chicago show will be where they decide to reveal any plans for the Legacy. A LPT 2.5H4 would be just dandy, although I wouldn't care if they happened to through the H6 in instead. I'm getting very anxious about this whole thing now!
maybe if everyone says it with me...dark blue B4, dark blue B4, dark blue B4...
-Brian
B
I bet eventually we will see the 2.5t in 3 states of tune: High-boost (STi). Moderate boost (WRX, Legacy GT turbo). And low-boost (Forester and Baja).
It makes sense, from a production standpoint, for SOA to streamline the engine lineup. Doing away with the 2.0 turbo, from North America, I think makes a lot of sense.
Also, if you remember, in the FHI 5-year plan, there was mention of a new small car, beneath the Impreza lineup. Is this to replace the Justy, which is still sold in Europe? Or will it replace the Pleo? Or will it replace both? My guess is that it's replacement for the Justy. If that's the case, I can see that vehicle becoming Subaru's future rally-car platform, and could get the 2.0t, as the top model.
Bob
I agree 100%. The R&D for the 2.5T is a sunk cost. It would make sense for Subaru to capitalize on it and streamline by removing the 2.0T. I just wonder if the H6T is now going to happen.
Ken
Bob
-mike
Bob
Keep in mind, those markets use a 2.0L engine, not a 2.5L engine, and some models have the dual-range transmission.
Bob
http://www.autonews.com/article.cms?articleId=41995&a=a&bt=legacy+turbo&arc=n
Does this mean it's "official" now? :-)
-Dennis
-mike
I think the the Turbo Forester/Baja/Legacy rumors you can take to the bank. I'm certain the US-spec Forester and Baja will get turbos for '04; less certain about the Legacy for '04 (yes for '05 however), but getting more confident each passing day.
Bob
More interesting is the fate of the Baja and Legacy turbo. It sounds like they may(?) be introduced at the same time, which leads to the next question...
'04 or '05 model(s)?
Originally it was reported that the new Legacy would be an '05 model. More recently I've been hearing rumors that it may be introduced in Japan this spring. I understand there will be a Toyko Motor Salon coming up soon. Will it be introduced then? If that's the case, might we get it this summer as an '04 model?
Even more interesting is the Baja. If an all-new Legacy debuts here this summer, would Subaru put that turbo in the current body? Or would the turbo Baja also be built on the all-new Legacy platform?
This I find hard to believe. I can't see Subaru spending all this money on the (current) Baja for just a 1-year model run. Unless the (next) new Baja shares a lot of parts with the current model; which would make it really not all-new, now would it? Hmmm...
Bob
-mike
-Dennis
Ken
-Brian
Anyway don't want to seem like a traitor but I just had to sign up for their contest to win one.
TWRX
-mike
the STi shouldn't be heavier than the standard WRX, but don't expect it to be significantly lighter either.
-Colin
I also have it from a VERY reliable source that the reason the STi doesn't ship with a sound system is that the weight of the sound system puts it into the next weight bracket, which adds to the import cost.
I may have the chance to drive one around may, so I'll do a review if that comes to pass (it should).
http://www.subaru.net/usproduct/2004/Stiinitspec.asp
Pixs From Detroit
http://www.subaru.net/events/2003/Detroit/set/index.htm
STi, WRX, Baja Sport, moonroof, Baja hard bed cover, WRX seats, 17" (not BBS) optional WRX wheels on wagon, etc.
Bob
-mike
I'm...speechless.
-juice
Wouldn't it be great if we could use that word —complete—when talking about other Subie vehicles? Some are close (WRX), some have a long way to go (Baja), the rest fall somewhere in between.
Does that mean I want to see 300 HP and Brembro brakes on every Subie? Not at all. What I'm saying, given the particular audience and/or market slot of any specific model, that it be as "complete" as possible, whatever that means.
I'd love to be able to some day say, regarding every Subie vehicle: "Don't touch a thing, it's perfect as is!"
Bob
The more focused one's target customer/intended application, the easier it becomes to deliver a product that has features that have near-unanimous approval. Products like the Legacy, Forester and Baja will have a much greater challenge satisfying it's broader cross-section of customers. It's a tougher proposition.
One way to get to near "completeness" for a broad audience is to offer lots of options so vehicles can be mass customized. The funny thing is that consumers often look down on that type of product structure as the auto manufacturer nickel and diming for every option!
Ken
My sense over at nasioc is that, Subaru has achieved 90-95% agreement on the STi—as is. On the other hand, the Baja (over there) has 5% agreement (if that!) as it stands. Here, my guess is the Baja achieves perhaps 30-40% agreement???
Bob
-mike
But it's easier to do so at a higher price point. Or, looked at another way, I'd argue that the Legacy L/SE is complete given its price range. For $20 grand you get ABS and AWD, CD and power everything. At that price some Camcords lack ABS.
Diesels, eh? Definitely need those for Europe, so it'll be interesting to see what they do. I doubt they'll even be boxers. They'll probably just license and build Isuzu's small engines.
I like the stepped roof, I hope the new Legacy has good head room. Though that means maybe they can fit the huge moonroof from the Forester instead of the double small ones.
But yeah, tach in the center and all, the STi will be schweet. Trim rings around the gauges, they're even getting the details right.
I think Patti is in the dungeon, though I'm really proud that she took one for the team and got us everything we wanted.
Does it really have climate control, though? Seems odd to have that and then delete a radio.
-juice
Bob
http://www.apexjapan.com/
Bob
• The Forester will be sold in India—under a GM nameplate!
• Lots of work going on with CVTs.
http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=4340
Bob
Cheers
Pat
Jim
A very bad sign. Will I have to buy my next Forester at a GM dealer? Will I have to take it to Mr. Goodwrench? Not comforting thoughts.
Ed
-Frank P.
Thanks for your response,
CUSAFR
I'm hoping the Forester turbo replaces the Premium models in the lineup, with a price close to those, maybe a grand higher. Subaru should price it carefully, it's a compact SUV.
If FHI introduces the new Legacy in the summer, we still won't get it 'til next year. That's probably the intro date for the japanese market. Still, it'll be nice to preview it.
-juice