Store Bought Waxes Part II (No Zaino Posts)

alanwagen · April 2001

I have two cars the same color, just a year apart.
Tried a new bottle of Turtle wax Extreme on one and Nu-Finish on the other.
The Turtle wax was extremely hard to remove and get a consistent glaze, I guess the name implies.
The Nu-Finish easy. I put the Nu-Finish over the the Turtle wax just to clean it off. Also the Nu-Finish had a better shine. Live and learn I guess but now I am out of five bucks as I tossed the Extreme.

bretfraz · April 2001

"forbidden product". I like that! I'm gonna start using that phrase if you don't mind.

But seriously, I don't recall saying anything bad about that product except that I think it's pricey and I think it's a complex usage process for a novice or casual enthusiast. But those are my opinions, for what they're worth.

Since I've never used the "forbidden product" I can't really offer an honest opinion of it but I do have experience with products very similar to it so I don't feel the need to shell out the mega$$$ to satisfy my curiousity. I've read all the proclamations here in TH and other sites and I'm sure it performs like everyone says it does.

Thank you for the compliment. I'll continue to provide as much insight as possible for all of us who use "Store Bought Waxes".

bretfraz · April 2001

Great post. Believe me, I've been there. Good for you that you're only out $5.00. I've spent 10 times that and tossed out the product after one application.

If the NuFinish is workin' fer ya, I say stick with it.

dhanley · April 2001

I have tried the "forbidden product" and i really do think it's a regular polish with a funky ad campaign. It surely did not do anything more than nu-finish did for me.

I'd rather not get in a big debate over it; if you want to talk about it, i'll come over to the "other" topic. Just e-mail me.

dave

armtdm · April 2001

I currently have Collinite, # 26 yellow wax and the "other product" . I have not as yet used the other as recommended, only over a previously waxed car with Collinite. Shines are very similar, really hard to distinguish, I have no doubt the other will last longer as carnuba wax does not have the long lasting ability like polymers. # 26 I find harder to get off then Collinite. Also, the other polish is not really difficult to put on and take off, actually easier to buff off but it just takes longer to set. My true test will be on a car with no wax/polish on it and go the recommended route. The shine really is great though!

Will see.

kebbat · April 2001

Hello - I'm new to the board and new to being committed to REALLY keeping up the appearance of my new car.

My question regards the use of a California Car Duster. I understand that it uses a Parafin wax - will that help / hurt my clearcoat finish. Am I just going to end up having to spend more time cleaning / waxing my car if I use the CCD?

This is my first new car and I get a real thrill with how shiny and clean it looks. I'd like to maintain the look in the easiest manner possible.

Any help?

joe166 · April 2001

The "easiest" way to keep up the appearance of your new car is just simply to keep up with it. It really doesn't matter (within reason) what you use as long as it works for you and it isn't too hard for you to do so that you skip treatments to avoid the work. The California duster works fine for what it is supposed to do. I use one to pick off tree debris (pollen, seeds, leaves, etc). I would hesitate to use it if the car was really dusty as it implies you can. I would think if you could see the dust, it is thick enough to see, it is thick enough to scratch the surface even with the soft yarn on the duster. If it is dusty, spray it with water, get the dust off and then dry it with a clean soft, 100% cotton towel or an absorber, or with the California blade AND a towel. Isn't it funny how every innovative auto tool has something in the name implying that those really neat people we see on TV from California use them? Anyway, read back in this and other forums, but I think you will find that if you keep a protective coat of wax (or polymer if that is not wax), just squirting your car will clean off most dust and leave the car shining ready to be dried. That is the best way in my opinion. Try what you want after you read this and other forums (including the forbidden subject), and make up your own mind, try more than one if you want, find something you like, find something that you will keep using, find something that lasts as long as you need it to and stick to your guns. For example, you will find many people that love Nufinish. It is easy to use, and it lasts a long time, but some think it doesn't have as good a shine as others. Read and try. It is really an interesting subject that has raised tempers sometimes, but probably, in the big scheme, shouldn't.

pjyoung · April 2001

<< It is really an interesting subject that has raised tempers sometimes, but probably, in the big scheme, shouldn't. >>

But kudo's to all on both boards - good discussions have prevailed both places.

bretfraz · April 2001

I've used them for a long time and still do. Like Joe says, they're fine for light dust, pollen, or the like. But you have to determine whether your car is dirty or just dusty. The rule of thumb I've always used is that if the duster can do the job in one swipe, then its fine to use. If it takes two or three swipes to clean an area, the car should be washed or at least rinsed off.

If you keep your car waxed and wash it once a week or so, the dusters work great. Pollen is a big issue here in Georgia during springtime. This year was unbelieveable - pollen counts over 3000 when 300 is considered high. Everything had a light green dusting. My car is dark green so I was giving my duster a workout every day.

Whatever you do or use, regular maintenance is the key to keeping your car looking sharp.

kebbat · May 2001

My car is less than 1 week old so it's not dirty just yet, but I do park underneath a tree that's just now putting a layer of pollen on everything in sight. I'd like to use the duster to get rid of light dust and the like. Thanks for your insight.

My major concern with applying a multi-step cleaning/waxing system is that I will screw up and do more harm than good. I'm not talking about a very expensive vehicle (Focus ZX3) but it's all mine and I want it to look good and be protected.

The posts are helpful, but there is SO MUCH information that it's also somewhat confusing.

I don't require a "show car" finish, I just want protection and some shine.

Again, thanks for your help.

pjyoung · May 2001

The thing to remember is this - if you're willing to spend a couple of hours on a weekend once a month - your car will end up looking like a "show car". It's a very small price to pay for a very large boost to the ego.

bretfraz · May 2001

Check out this link:

http://www.meguiars.com/collections/tuner.cfm

All you need are a few more tools and you'll be set.

britton2 · May 2001

I can relate - I also have a new car - an economy car - but it's new nonetheless and it's probably what I'll be driving for the next 10 years or so and I am going to try to maintain the finish as best I can - here's what I bought: Meguiar's gold class car shampoo, One Grand Wash and Wax, Turtle Express Shine (spray), Meguiar's Quick Wax (spray), Blitz paste wax and some other stuff - wash your car at least every 2 weeks - be sure to dry it pronto or you'll have water spots - at Wal-Mart you can get a drying towel called "The Absorber" for about $9 - after it's dried, apply the Blitz paste wax with a foam applicator or the flannel cloths, which you can also get from Wal-Mart - follow the directions on the back of the can - this should protect your car's finish for about 2 - 3 months and you won't have to hand-wax it again for about 2 or 3 months - in the meantime, I'd wash and dry it and then (if you want to) use either the Turtle Wax Express shine ($5) or the Meguiar's spray wax (or quick wax, whatever it's called) (also at Wal-Mart) I don't thing you have to spend an arm and a leg to keep your car looking new!

britton2 · May 2001

sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the Blitz paste wax was available at Wal-Mart, but the 100% flannel cloths are - I ordered my Blitz wax from carcareonline.com - they have alot of stuff - check it out

jkidd2 · May 2001

This is probably Car Care 101 to most of you, but I have a couple of questions, I hope you can answer easily.

I have not read the hundreds of posts to see if this info is in here, so forgive me if I am asking a redundant question too.

First, what is the difference between waxing your vehicle and polishing your vehicle?

Second, I just bought a new '01 Nissan Crew Cab SE. How long do I wait before I wax it or polish it? Which one do I do first?

Third, I have two other cars, a '99 Grand Am SE and a '99 Prelude. Normally, I take these cars to local car washes and have them cleaned there, so I have never hand waxed/polished either of them. So, if I want to start cleaning these on my own, do I wax them or polish them?

I dug around in my garage and found the following wax/polishes:

Zymol/Cleaner Wax....see this is where I get confused. It says on it..."cleaner wax" and then it says "rated #1 car polish". So is there a difference?

Armor All Car Wax/Liquid.

Any recommendations of these two...they are fairly new...I got them as gifts back in December.

Your feedback is appreciated!

Thanks.

britton2 · May 2001

I didn't know beans about washing/waxing/polishing cars until just recently, I had to do some reading since I got my new Corolla - I believe that "polish" has some level of abrasiveness (like polishing your teeth) - and it would be used to prep your paint before waxing - I might be wrong about this - I waxed my car with a paste wax (Blitz) because based upon what I had read - my car's finish was in new condition and did not need to be cleaned - I think the cleaner/wax is a one-step process whereby you are cleaning and waxing your car's finish at the same time - I know, this is confusing - don't quote me on this - I know there are products that are made specifically to remove swirl marks, light scratches, etc - the wax is the final process to protect the finish - even though my car is new - I did notice some very light "spider web" scratches and swirl marks that were probably caused by the dealer - this had me freaked out for about a day- then I got over it -
you can't really notice them unless you put your nose right up against the paint - if I were you, I'd contact the folks are carcareonline.com - they advised me on getting the Blitz wax - I think they or the knowledgeable people on this board can help you with your older vehicles - I don't think you would need to do anything with your new Nissan except to apply a good coat of wax - hope I didn't confuse you more

bretfraz · May 2001

Britton's post was a good one. With all due respect to Britton, I'll expand on your questions a little.

In a literal sense, "waxing" is the process of using products and techniques to apply a protective coating on your paint. "Wax" itself is a natural product derived from parrafin, bees, or the carnauba palm tree. Carnauba is considered to be nature's hardest wax and is in all the expensive top-quality products like One Grand Blitz (which is fabulous, btw).

"Polish" is the process of using products and techniques to restore and enhance the shine, depth, and gloss of your paint. There are hundreds of polishes out there from mild to aggressive.

Most folks use the terms wax and polish interchangeably, as a verb not a noun. Many car care companies also toss around the term. Don't worry about it too much, though. It's just one of those things.

Many products have both polish and wax in them. They're called "one-step" products because they polish and protect in one step. The two products you have are one-step's.

Without going into a whole dissertation of Zymol's history, its a better product than the Armor All which is better than most of those $5 products. For fun you may want to use one product on one of your cars and the other on the other. Well, that's my idea of fun.

Unless your Nissan just came off the assembly line, its ready for wax/polish/whatever. Your Honda and Pontiac will prolly needs some TLC since it sounds like they've never been waxed. Don't be afraid to experiment. The two cars will prolly need a couple applications to look really good. One appication should do the trick on the truck.

Finally, I highly recommend that you spend some time in here scrolling thru posts. There's all kinds of advice and tips from big mouths like me, links to great websites like CarCareOnline.com, and references to excellent products. If you have cable modem or DSL, start at the beginning of the discussion, but at least go back 100 or so posts. You'll learn a lot. And don't be afraid to ask questions.

Have fun!!

protegextwo · May 2001

What is your opinion of an orbital buffer for a detail newbie? I really enjoy detailing my pair of Protege's. However, if I can work smarter that is a good thing, too.

-Larry

bretfraz · May 2001

Larry,

I'm all for orbital buffers. They make life so much easier and will encourage you to wax more frequently.

Please buy a good one, not one of those cheesy cigar-lighter plug in ones. Spend $50-100. Waxmaster makes good ones. The one I've had for almost 20 years I got from Sears but its made by Waxmaster. Actually I have three buffers, but that's another story ;-)

Gem makes the double-throw-me-down professional orbital buffers but they're more like $150.

jkidd2 · May 2001

Thank you for the feedback!

I will try your recommendations and see what comes of it. Unfortunately, waxing/polishing my car's is about as much fun as painting my house to me.

I'm trying to turn over a new leaf and start doing some things for myself instead of hiring them done.

The Crew Cab is fresh off the line..it was built in March 2001.

Best and thanks again!

pjyoung · May 2001

I always thought that one of the problems at dealerships was that the "prep" guys didn't know how to use an orbital buffer, and as a result, would put "swirl marks" on the finish. Have they changed that much - or should a novice exercise extreme caution when using one?

bretfraz · May 2001

Well, I remember back in the day, when I was a little bretfraz, dealership prep dudes used rotary buffers and wool pads. Their job was to bang out the cars ASAP. Toss in some too-aggressive polish and you've got instant swirl marks.

I've bought 4 new cars since 1995 and none of them have been buffed; just washed. All needed wax immediately. My neighbors new F150 was run thru the dealership car wash before delivery. So I guess its a case-by-case issue.

I agree with you that novices should be cautious when using buffers but orbitals are pretty easy to use. Maybe practicing on an older car before working on the brand new one would be prudent.

protegextwo · May 2001

Thank you for the feedback. I'm going to purchase an orbital buffer and I'm going to take the time to learn how to use it properly. I hope, I might be able to ask you an occasional question in regards to the best results with an OB.
Well,... here is the first one. Where do you reccomend I start shopping for an orbital buffer?

Thank you Bret!!!

Respectfully,
Larry

bretfraz · May 2001

Start here:

http://www.waxmaster.com/WaxcoaHome.html

All kinds of buffer info.

Just for grins (and the good stuff) go here:

http://www.topoftheline.com

Go to Detailing Equipment. This is all the stuff the pros use.

bretfraz · May 2001

OK, here's an article that will tell you most everything you wanted to know about buffers. Its from Professional Carwashing and Detailing online.

http://www.carwash.com/article.asp?IndexID=6631154

kebbat · May 2001

....so many times in my life!

They're actually right across the street from one another so I first going into PepBoys and look in the car care section, then go across the street and look in their car care section. Then I get confused as to what to buy .... I've shelled out about 75 so far and I'm still not even sure of how this will turn out.

So far I've bought:

California Car Duster
California Blade
Absorber
Meguires Cleaner/wax
Meguires Showcar Glaze
Meguires #26
Mothers Metal polish
Armor All Natural low gloss interior cleaner
Wheel brush
Terry cloth covered foam applicators
Several 100% cotton made in USA towels
"lint free" cotton towels to clean the windows

Am I a sucker or what? It's like when I get into the store my eyes get very big and glazed over and I just start buying stuff.

britton2 · May 2001

britton2 · May 2001

you sound like me, from your list, I have also bought these items:
CA car duster, Meguiar's #26, foam applicators, terry towels, CA water blade, The Absorber...no, you're not a sucker - I think I've spent about $175 so far on stuff - I also have purchased 2 wash mitts (one sheepskin, one cotton chenile), flannel cloths, Pinnacle Crystal Mist, Pinnacle bodywork shampoo, Blitz paste wax (have used once, recommend), chamois, AmorAll wipes (don't recommend, they leave lint!), One Grand Wash & Wax, and the list goes on - so far, I have washed my car 3 times (in 5 1/2 weeks) and have hand-waxed it once with the Blitz and sprayed it once with Turtle Wax Express Shine - it's kind of addictive, buying all of this stuff - I never knew all of this stuff existed - not to the extent of the number of products and different kinds of products - I'm sure you'll do fine keeping your new car looking good

protegextwo · May 2001

Thank you for all the on-line links for detail equipment, you are VERY helpful. Have a great weekend, my friend.

Respectfully,
Larry

pblevine · May 2001

Question: Is it any good? And is it made of that foam stuff with a stiff inner (middle) layer or is it made of flexible rubber?

britton2 · May 2001

I bought the CA Water Blade - along with numerous other products - I used it to dry my husband's car - as a "test" - it worked well - but I read that if a little dirt or something gets under it, you will be scratching your paint while dragging it across - one thing: wet it before you use it - and just make sure your car has been rinsed throughly first - Motor Trend picked it as one of their top 10 products - that's a pretty strong recommendation - it's made of a flexible, soft rubber I think -

bretfraz · May 2001

I use one and love it. I only wish I had it all the years I owned an SUV as it would have made drying a ton easier.

The blade is silicone impregnated rubber and is super smooth and pliable. It conforms to the contours of your car and is especially good with the large panels like the hood and roof.

I cannot imagine a way the blade itself can scratch your car. If it does pick up a piece of grit I think the damage will be manageable as you are "flinging" the water off the car and not dragging the grit like you would a towel or wash mitt. Little scratches are easy to fix.

It's prolly not a product for the purist but for us regular folks its great and I highly recommend it.

kebbat · May 2001

I used it again last night - I think the first time you use it it may not work very well as you keep thinking "this HAS to be bad for my car", but once you see how quickly it flings the water off of your car you'll be hooked.

The key is to only use it on a freshly cleaned car - if you just rinsed the vehicle then there shouldn't be any grit or grime on it.

alex18t · May 2001

i have plenty of swirl marks and i want them out. how do i go about this in your opinion?

when you talk about dawn/clay/dawn what is this clay you are talking about? is it essential in a new car with new paint?

what do you know of the simoniz pure carnuba wax? i mean the stuff that has been around since 1910 and when you apply it you cannot allow it to dry before you buff it, you must buff it off immediately. you know what i am talking about? what are the results from that product? does it remove swirl marks? thanks!!

achenator · May 2001

Anyone use a product by 3M called Refresh? It is a vinyl/rubber protectant I saw at a local auto parts store. It comes in a couple different scents and is a thin creme. Any ideas on this?

armtdm · May 2001

Yea, I have used Refresh. It does have an odor that lasts about a day. Seems to work okay and better tehn Armor All . Very creammy texture to it. Try it, seems okay.

jster · May 2001

swirls: In order to get rid of them you might want to use a product like 3M Perfect-It or Meguiars Swirl Remover. These are slightly abrasive products that also contain fillers that will reduce their severity, if not get rid of them entirely.You would apply these by hand and either finish up with a glaze type product like 3M Imperial Hand Glaze and then a wax --or just finish up with a wax or sealant.

There are also various mild paint cleaner-type products (too numerous to mention--check through the old and archived messages in this forum) that will reduce and fill swirl marks.

The best way to get rid of swirls is to use an abrasive machine polish and a rotary buffer--but this is not something you want to do yourself on a decent car, unless you are experienced with a rotary buffer.

3m Refresh: Was recently reading about this product on another forum. It contains the same type of protectant chemical as products such as Vinylex, 303 Protectant, Zaino Leather Protectant, etc, etc--but with a bit less percentage than those other products. A good product for the price, I guess.

pjyoung · May 2001

I'm a user of the "forbidden" product, and I think it's great stuff, but I've got chrome wheels on my car and this past winter has been a salty, slushy mess. Consequently, I've got some "spots" on the chrome - not a lot mind you, but enough for me to notice. Since the other guy doesn't make a chrome cleaner, do you know of one that might get rid of these spots? Thanks in advance for any info.

zeke707 · May 2001

Had my vehicle "Minged" last summer. Should I wax and if so, what is a good choice?

bretfraz · May 2001

Wassup?

spots on chrome, eh? Well, there are lots of chrome polishes on the market that will prolly take care of the problem and make the wheels sparkle.

Currently I use P21S multi-finish polish which comes in a tube and is rather mild. I also use Eagle One billet polish for something more aggressive.

Mother's mag & aluminum polish always works well. And you can buy it anywhere.

Try this trick: Buy some #000 steel wool and use it with the polish. The spots and crud should come off quick.

Best of luck!

suzzzie · May 2001

I think I've finally read all of these posts and am ready to get to work.

Here's my brief history - I exclusively used Liquid Glass on my last car for 10 years. I usually put it on 2-3 times per year and a couple coats each time. If I wouldn't have traded it in this past spring I would have needed to strip, polish and wax. I was very happy with Liquid Glass - very easy to apply, long lasting and good beading. I hand-washed my car as much as 2-3 times per week the 1st several years and at least once every 2 weeks towards the end. The last few years have been in MN so it was often washed at the car wash during 1/2 the year.

We bought a used Red Cherokee that needed TLC. We used Meguiar's Professional products and brought the paint to life. I don't remember all the steps we used in the beginning. I do know we used clay and while it was time consuming it worked wonders. I had no idea we'd be able to make the finish that smooth. We use #26 (apply 2-3 coats by hand per year), Final Inspection and Rubber Bumper Treatment and a few others.

It's been a long winter and we're getting ready to strip and polish and wax the jeep as well as give our new Stratus R/T (Silver) it's first wax.

I've been reading the messages on this subject for the last couple weeks and think I've made up my mind. We're going to stick with Meguiar's because we've been very happy with the products. We just bought new bottles of #26 and Final Inspection. We're also adding the polishing step to our process for the 1st time and are going to use Showcar Glaze #7. We had to buy 3M's clay because the paint store didn't have Meguiar's Clay.

I've got a few questions:

Do I have the steps right? Wash / Clay / Wash / Polish / Wax

About the new silver Stratus. Should we use the same process? Is it necessary to polish a new car? This is a new step to me, and one that makes me nervous. I don't want to hurt the finish in any way. Should we expect the same results with #26 on silver as red?

Does anyone have any favorites for bug and tar removal? I can't believe how much tar is on both vehicles from the last few weeks.

Finally, I've been reading messages about detailing, visited site recommended by you and haven't decided what to do with the vinyl, leather and tires.

I'm very interested in your ideas about any of this. Thanks a lot!

daverose · May 2001

The initial wash should be with blue Dawn or other liquid alkaloid soap without lotion or perfumes to totally remove the old wax so you're not wasting the clay's lifespan and properties on dirt and other "contaminants" that could be removed by other means before you use the clay.

You don't say what material you are washing your vehicles with; it should be 100% made in the USA white cotton towels in both the loops/nap and backing material. I recommend a hand size towel wrapped around a sponge for washing.

I would not use abbrasive polish on a new car.

suzzzie · May 2001

daverose,
left that out - -
While I know this is controversial, I must admit that I've always used dish soap and I think I've most always used yellow Dawn. I read about the blue dawn and will give that a try. We also removed tar before using the clay.

We have a nice set of inexpensive white cotton towels and washcloths.

Thanks for your input!

adam68 · May 2001

Just bought a new BMW 2001 black 325Ci...any recommendations on a single step wax?

Thanks..

adc100 · May 2001

I am certainly not an expert. I read a couple of places that Avon's Skin-So-Soft (yes really) was good for tar. I tried it and it's really great. I'm glad to hear someone else likes the #26. I have never used "good/professional" products before a couple of months ago. When I got my new Sentra I immediately gave it a shot of the Meguiars Cleaner/Wax (dumb-before I knew any better) I folllowed it with a couple of coats of the #26. Looks great. I used the #7/#26 on my '94 Toyota 4x4 which had not been waxed for two years and I am more than pleased. Just for the heck of it though I did half of the hood with the #26 and the other half with Medallion Premium Paint Protection. I'll post results.

armtdm · May 2001

Actually the cleaner wax is greatr for removing minor scraches and hard to remvoe dirt as it has the slight abrasive to it. The # 26 is great, I find it a little more difficult to remove then Collinite but looks great. I still use the Cleaner Wax on occasion when grime does not wash off.

mike_542 · May 2001

Congrats on your new Bimmer! I am sure you will enjoy driving it for years!

I have a few reccomendations for one-step waxes:
#1.) Klasse AIO- A very durable acrylic imported from Germany. Klasse provides a reflective, but natural wet look. However it is pricey at about $25 for a 16.9oz jar.

#2.) TIE- Malm's Formula 10 Polish and Glaze- A non-greasy, durable carnauba with a mild polishing agent. Formula 10 provides a deep shine that only a carnauba can produce. ($11.95 for a 1/4 pint)

#2.) TIE- Pinnacle Creme Glaz- A non-greasy, carnauba with non-abrasive cleaners. It provides a better results compared to Malm's Formula 10, but doesn't last long at all. Luckily, it is VERY easy to use- wipe on, wipe off. No buffing or rubbing.

Notable:
-NuFinish (durable, abrasive, cheap)
-Collinite Liquid Insulator Wax (durable, ok shine)
-Liquid Lustre (durable, nice shine)

bat1161 · May 2001

Has anyone heard of a product called "Ultra Finish". Its sold mostly at car shows, and a friend of my dad's swears by it. Like most of the other top products, it is supposed to be put on only a few times a year. Anyone know anything about it?

TIA
Mark

adam68 · May 2001

Mike,

Thanks for the info. I'll give the Klasse
all in one a try. Seems long lasting and very
easy to apply. I'll let you know how it comes out..

Adam

alex18t · May 2001

it is abrassive and will cause swirl marks. especially on bmw soft paint and especially on black. a new car only needs to be stripped of the old wax with dawn and then waxed with carnauba. mothers has a good carnauba wax.

Store Bought Waxes Part II (No Zaino Posts)

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