Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi Dennis. Honda is actually being pretty tricky with its recently advertised Odyssey lease. Much like the advertised lease payment that it is touting for the 2003 Accord, the current ad for the Odyssey is calculated using American Honda Finance Corp.'s standard lease program. The only Honda model that has special lease money factors on right now is the 2003 Civic. Having said this, Honda's standard lease program is actually pretty decent. Please see my previous post for the Odyssey's current lease program.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi lordbyron. Unfortunately where you lease this vehicle does not matter nearly as much as where you live. Banks are only concerned with the state that their potential lessee lives in because that is the state's laws that they have to abide by. Unfortunately as you may have already heard, many banks have completely stopped leasing to residents of New York, or have at least significantly increased their lease acquisition fees for NY residents, because of the vicarious liability laws that exist there.

Let's take a look at the specific deal that you were quoted. BMW is providing special lease money factors on the 2003 325i for leases of up to 42 months in length right now. So I definitely would not lease this car for longer than that if I was in your situation. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2003 BMW 325i with an MSRP of $32,970 and a selling price of $31,575 through BMW Financial Services this month for 42 months with 12,000 miles per, its zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $387. If you were to put $1,000 down, this payment would drop to around $362 or so. The payment that you were quoted definitely does not look like a good deal to me, even if it includes tax. Consumers should be able to lease any vehicle without making any sort of down payment. Generally the only things that lessees have to pay at signing are their vehicle's first month's payment, a security deposit, and their bank's lease acquisition fee. The acquisition fee can even be baked into their vehicle's price and not paid at signing. Also, in the past, BMW has waived the security deposit requirement for returning BMW FS lessees. I would definitely do some comparison shopping with a few other BMW dealers in your area if I was in your situation.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi "T". It sounds to me as though the person who you are working with is being honest. Unfortunately, for some unknown reason Toyota Financial Services calculates leases a little differently than many other banks do. It often does not allow options to be residualized. Strange but true.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi 2003help. I really need the full MSRP and selling price of the vehicle that you are interested in to calculate a lease payment on it. So, for now I will calculate a sample lease payment for you, based on the full MSRP and True Market Value prices that are listed here at Edmunds.com for this car. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a typically equipped 2003 Nissan Altima 2.5S with an automatic transmission (MSRP: $21,446 / Cap. Cost: $20,092 - Edmunds.com TMV) through Nissan Motor Acceptance Corp. this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $272. If you were to do an otherwise identical 4 year lease of this car, the payment would drop to around $260 per month. I definitely would not put $2,000 down to lease this car if I was in your situation. I say this for two main reasons. One is that if your vehicle is stolen and never recovered or totaled in an accident during your lease term, your insurance company pays off the bank that you are leasing it through and your down payment essentially disappears. The other main reason is that down payments on leased vehicles do nothing to reduce their lease-end purchase prices. So this car's lease-end purchase price would be exactly the same, regardless if you were to put $5,000 down or if you mad absolutely no down payment.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

I am sorry to hear about the bad situation that you had, normalo. I really don't think that there is any more that you can do as long as you told the manager about your situation. If there has been a long history of complaints against this particular salesperson or if they are not selling many vehicles they could be in trouble. However, if they consistently sell a lot of vehicles then nothing will probably happen to them. You didn't really didn't lose on anything here, other than your time, because BMW's July lease program was scheduled to run through September 2nd. Rather than wasting effort trying to get the salesperson in trouble, I would try to focus my efforts on something constructive like finding a different dealership if I was in your situation.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi vpotluri. Unfortunately, I have not seen Subaru's August lease program yet. Sorry that I could not be of more help.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Greetings mrtruman. I would be more than happy to help you out, but first I need you to tell me how long you plan on leasing this vehicle for and how many miles per year you need to be able to drive without having to pay a lease-end penalty for excess mileage. Once I have this info I will post the numbers that you are looking for. Talk to you soon.

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mrtruman · August 2003

Thanks the details are as follows:

36months
15k

No money down except fees and security and first month.

This is what I was told:

MF: .0010 or 2.4%

Residual: 58%

Is this correct.

PS: Thank you for the help. Im sure that more people than you know benifit from your advice.

mzinzi · August 2003

CarMan...

I'm looking for lease numbers for a 2003 Jeep Wrangler Sahara...

10k miles/36-39-42 months

Thanks in Advance!

hartt · August 2003

You said that Toyota Financial Services often doesn't residualize options. Does the same go for other lenders? Should the dealership be able to find a bank that will residualize the options?
I asked the dealership to run the numbers through another institute that will residualize the options and they told me that by doing so would lower the residual.
Does Honda do the same thing?
One last request. Would you please provide the August MF and residual for a 3yr/15000 mile a year lease for the following:
Honda Pilot EX and EX-L
Toyota 4Runner Sport Edition V6

Thank you for your help Car_man.
Tim

jratcliffe · August 2003

American Honda Finance Corp. doesn't residualize dealer options (i.e. decklid spoiler, splashguards, that sort of thing), dunno about factory options though (my Honda didn't have any factory options available, so it didn't come up).

g17 · August 2003

Just wanted to say a quick thanks for the info regarding the C230K I inquired about in early July. I was able to work a fair deal with your help! I'll need your expertise in about a month, when my wife narrows down her new SUV choices. Thanks again.......

kyfdx · August 2003

AHFC residualizes the MSRP bottom line... However residual percentages are less for models that have navi or RES.

kyfdx

cehenke · August 2003

Car_man, I am getting ready to start shopping for an '04 Toyota Sienna, either an XLE or XLE Ltd. - can you shed some light on the latest residuals and money factors please? I'm in the Midwest. I saw your post about a month ago about the Sienna numbers, just wondering if those have changed any? Thanks. Chris

stargazer0791 · August 2003

Hello Car_man,

I'm looking to lease a 2003 Land Rover Freelander (either a SE or HSE model).

Term 39 months
For both 10k/12k miles per year.

Can you please provide me with the residuals and money factor? Also, what is the standard Land Rover Lease Acquisition Fee?

Many thanks for all your help. This forum is probably the best auto consumer forum on the net.

Xmonger

2003help · August 2003

Car_Man
Well the wife went out Sat. and leased a Nissan 2003 2.5S with Auto trans., mud guards, air filter, floor mats. If I remember correctly the MSRP was 20,094.
Found out why she was in such a hurry to get a car. The lease on her Sentra GXE and she wanted a larger car. She was paying 225 a month for the Sentra.
The deal she made was, she put 1,000 down, 12,000 miles a year, they made the last payment on the Sentra and her monthly payment is 257 and change.
Does that seem to be fair or could she have done better?
She seemed to be happy when she got home.
I didn't see what you wrote till today.
Any feedback Car_Man.

new5er · August 2003

Car_man. I've found the car and found the deal. $42,370 MSRP, cap cost of 38000,
(I had to roll in my last two lease payments on my existing 325) 51% residual,42 mos/12000 miles. What should the BMWFS lease payment be in Alabama.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hey mrtruman. The lease money factor and residual value that you were quoted are right on the money. This is a good sign that the dealership that you are working with is being very straightforward with you. As long as you can come to an agreement on this truck's price, I don't see any reason not to lease from them.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hello mzinzi. DaimlerChrysler never provides any sort of special lease money factors on the Jeep Wrangler. The bad news is that this is the case again this month. If you were to lease a 2003 Jeep Wrangler Sahara through Chrysler Financial this month for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00260 and 51%, respectively. The numbers for otherwise identical 39 and 42 month leases are .00260 / 48% and .00260 / 46%. The good news is that DaimlerChrysler is providing $1,000 lease cash and an additional $500 bonus cash ($1,500 total) on this truck that may be used to reduce its capitalized cost.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

You're welcome, Tim. Toyota Financial Services' option residualization policy is different than most other banks' policies. I am sure that there are many independent banks out there that one can lease Toyotas through which allow the residualization of most options. Your dealer will likely run this 4Runner lease through whichever bank provides the most attractive monthly payment in an effort to win your business.

Here is the specific lease information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Honda Pilot EX without navigation through American Honda Finance Corp. this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00210 and 60%, respectively. The lease money factor for an otherwise identical lease of a 2003 Honda Pilot EX-L would be exactly the same, but the residual value would fall to 58%. Toyota's July incentives were scheduled to run through the end of yesterday. As a result, I have not had an opportunity to take a look at its new August program yet. If you still need the lease info for the 4Runner, please feel free to check back with me in a few days. Talk to you then.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

I'm glad to hear that everything worked out well for you, g17. Let me know when you need information for your wife's new ride. Enjoy your CLK!

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi Chris. I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what Toyota's current lease program is like on this vehicle. However, its July incentives were scheduled to run through yesterday and I have not had an opportunity to see its new August program or if its standard lease money factors have changed for August yet. Please feel free to check back with me in a few days and I would be able to shed a little more light on this situation for you.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Good morning xmonger. I am glad that you like this discussion so much

. Here is the information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Land Rover Freelander SE through its captive finance company for 39 months with 12,000 miles per year, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00033 and 48%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of a 2003 Land Rover Freelander HSE should currently be .00293 and 50%. If you were to lease either of these models with only 10,000 miles per year, its residual values would increase 1%. According to the most recent information that I have seen, Land Rover's base lease acquisition fee is $495.

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tmn39 · August 2003

Carman Have you heard any official lease numbers for the new Audi S4, I know they just released pricing numbers to dealers. Thanks in advance.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Congrats on the new car, 2003help. It's difficult for me to evaluate this deal without knowing the car's actual selling price or how long the lease is for, but the monthly payment looks attractive when compared to the lease that Nissan has been advertising on the 2003 Altima 2.5S lately.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Nice choice in cars, tmn39. I actually have seen Audi's current lease program for the '04 S4. I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what it is like if you let me know how long you plan on leasing it for and how many miles per year you need.

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tmn39 · August 2003

Thanks Carman, I will probably be looking at the 39 month lease, with 10k per year.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hey new5er. Let's calculate a sample lease payment on this car for you. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2003 BMW 525i with an MSRP of $42,370 and a selling price of $38,000 through BMW Financial Services this month for 42 months with 12,000 miles per year, its zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $522. I have to say though that given the fact that BMW is currently providing $3,500 dealer cash on this car, if there is any competition for your business in your area you should be able to negotiate a lower selling price.

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tmn39 · August 2003

Thanks Carman, I will probably be looking at the 39 month lease, with 10k per year.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Here's the information that you are looking for, tmn39. If you were to lease a 2004 Audi S4 through Audi Financial Services right now for 39 months with 10,000 miles per year, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00155 and 55%, respectively. This lease program only runs through August 5th. On the 6th, Audi will publish a new one, though I don't expect the lease program for this particular model to change much, if at all.

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rttucker · August 2003

Car_Man,

As always, you give extremely informative and valuable information.

I am inquiring about lease variables (money factor and residual) for the Saab 9-5 Aero Wagon (2003 model) for the month of August (say 3 years and 15,000 miles per years). Furthermore, what are the current incentives Saab is providing for the 9-5 Aero wagon (financing, cash back, etc.)?

Thanks once again, Car_Man.

Best Regards,
Ryan

delrick · August 2003

Car-Man

Have enjoyed your efforts for quite some time.

My lease question is a little different.

Are you aware of any sites that provide information about residual rates for all vehicles?

Something like the used car guides that would provide a starting point in selecting which make and model of vehicle would provide an optimum value.

For instance, I am considering leasing a new small vehicle for my teen age son. I am pretty open to any car or small truck but payment will be a primary consideration.

I know that all things being equal, the vehicle with the highest residual rate to MSRP will provide my best deal.

Just don't know what that might be, and it would be a waste of your time for me to scattershot all the candidates that might fit my parameters.

Can you refer me to a comprehensive source, or, just off the top, what would you be looking for given my needs?

tbwill · August 2003

Car_Man:
Could you please tell me what the money factors and residuals would be for 36 & 39 month/15k year leases for Audi A4 (both 1.8T & 3.0 Quattro sedans) in California. Thanks.

Tom

howac · August 2003

Hi Car_man,

I have read this board for quite some time and I want to thank you for your invaluable service for us consumers.

Anyway, we stopped by the local Mazda dealer (to look at a Mazda 6) and my wife fell in love with the new RX-8! Now I'm doing our homework. Would you happen to have the lease info (money factor and residual value) on an RX-8 6MT with Sport and GT packages? We're curious whether this car's residual values are better than those of other Mazda vehicles. The term we're interested in is 36 months and 12k miles per year. We are in northern California. Thanks in advance!

Howard

rjwatl · August 2003

Very much enjoy the site. Can you give me the August numbers for an Audi A6 Quattro with the Premium Package and Bose Stereo? Numbers are for Atlanta, Georgia. The dealer has quoted July residual at 49% (through August 5) with a very attractive money factor of .00025. He has told me that he thinks Audi's captive finance numbers may end up being better as of August 6. Can you help?

2003help · August 2003

Car_Man these are the figures off the contract she worked out.
New 2003 Sheer Silver Nissan Altima 2.5S (4 door)
OTD Price - 20,050
1,100 down
They pick up the last 225.25 Sentra GXE payment
12,00 miles per year
42 Months
Monthly Payment is 257.47
Capitalized Cost Reduction - 1,401.22
Adjusted Capitalized Cost - 18,648.78
Residual Value - 10,172.46
Could she have done any better?

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Thanks Ryan. Here is the information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Saab 9-5 Aero Wagon through Saab Financial Services Corp. this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00047 and 49%, respectively. In addition to this special lease money factor, Saab is providing $2,000 lease cash on this model that may be used to negotiate a lower capitalized cost. If you are not completely sold on leasing this vehicle, Saab is also offering 0.0% special financing for up to 60 months and 1.9% financing for 72 months OR $5,000 dealer cash on this model.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

I'm glad that you enjoy this discussion so much, delrick. I am not aware of any Web sites out there that provide the actual residual values that are used by banks to consumers. However, if you are really interested in vehicle's residual values, there is one Web site that you should check out, www.alg.com. This is the home page for ALG, Automotive Lease Guide. They are an independent company that calculates residual values for vehicles. Even though they do not lease vehicles themselves, many banks base their resids on the numbers that ALG publishes. Unfortunately, its site is not free any more, but if you are really interested in finding out approximate residual values for vehicles this is the place to go.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hello Tom. You're in luck, Audi's new lease program just started today. Here is the information that you are looking for, hot off the press. If you were to lease a 2003 Audi A4 1.8T Sedan with quattro through Audi Financial Services in CA this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00080 and 55%, respectively. This car's 39 month factor would be exactly the same, but its residual value would drop to 53%. If you were to do an identical 3 year lease of a 2003 Audi A4 3.0L Sedan with quattro, its numbers should currently be .00050 and 53%. Again its 39 month factor would be the same, but the residual value would fall to 51%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Thanks for the compliments, Howard. I actually think that Mazda did a nice job with the RX8 as well. Neat car. Unfortunately, it is such a new model that I have not seen any lease program for it yet. Let me do some digging and see what I come up with. Please feel free to check back with me in a few days and I will be more than happy to share what I have been able to find out for you. Don't hold your breath for a great lease program though. Brand new models, especially ones that will likely initially be in high demand and low supply, usually do not receive any sort of lease support. Well, talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Good morning, rjwatl. I would be more than happy to help you out. Your dealer is right. Audi just introduced a new lease program today. In order for me to tell you what this car's current base lease money factor and residual value are though, I need you to tell me if you are interested in the 2.7T, 3.0L, or the 4.2L. I also need to know how long you plan on leasing it for and how many miles per year you need. Once I have this info I will be able to give you an idea of what this car's current lease program is like.

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rjwatl · August 2003

Here is the additional information that you requested. Looking to lease a 3.0 for 39 months at 12K miles per year. Can you let me know what the new Audi lease program numbers look like? Thanks.

mysticblue · August 2003

Car Man,

I've noticed alot of posts about the '03s, but not the '04s. Do you have the residual and money factor for a 15k miles/yr lease on a 2004 BMW 325ci.

Also, I've noticed that alot of the deals I see posted don't work out when I put the actual numbers into a lease calculator. For instance these are the numbers I was able to find:

'04 325ci lease

Metallic Paint, Sport, HK Sound, Moonroof, Xenon, Nav

MSRP $36,595
invoice $33,525

selling $34,866 (4% comish)

so with:

0.0022 MF
58 residual ($21,225.10)
36 mo
6% tax
zero down

the payments come out to
$502.31 before tax
$532.45 after tax

Now I've had people tell me that they got the same car for $480/mo after tax and that works out to a selling price below invoice. Am I doing something wrong or are they just trying to make themselves sound good?

Thanks for any help!

jeffmust2 · August 2003

CarMan -

Still shopping this month for a FWD RX330, Nav, via 36-month lease with 15k miles a year.

Last month the rates from Lexus Financial were 55% residual and a MF of .0019.

Any changes announced for August?

In advance, thanks! Best site in TH, hands down, with "Real World Trade-In Values (?) #2. Sorry Terry!

jdehass · August 2003

Car_man-

Shopping for a 2004 Acura TSX lease, and dealer gave me the following figures with Acura's lease program (in August). Are these numbers accurate?

MSRP $27,339 (dealer added "protection pkg)
Cap Cost $26,839
15K miles/yr
MF .00255
Residual 62%

and for 17K miles/yr (same MSRP and Cap Cost)
MF .00255
Residual 59.77%

Thanks for your help.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Thanks for the additional information, rjwatl. If you were to lease a 2003 Audi A6 3.0L Sedan with quattro through Audi Financial Services this month for 39 months with 12,000 miles per year, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00010 and 49%, respectively.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Hi mysticblue. Yes, I have seen the lease programs for an increasing number of 2004 models. If you were to lease a 2004 BMW 325Ci through BMW Financial Services this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should currently be .00205 and 58%, respectively. If you were quoted a factor of .00220, there is a good chance that the dealership that you are working with is trying to mark up this car's base factor to add additional profit to your deal. Here is a sample lease payment on the car that you are interested in. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2004 BMW 325Ci (MSRP: $36,595 / Selling Price: $34,866) through BMW FS this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per using its base lease program, its zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $494 or so. Just to see if the payments that others have mentioned are possible, I calculated an identical lease on this car, based on a selling price of $33,525, its dealer invoice and this payment came out to $454, so their numbers are possible.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Thanks for the compliment, jeffmust2

. You actually are in luck, Lexus enhanced its lease program on all of its models, even the brand new, popular RX330 for some reason, for the month of August. Here is the new info. If you were to lease a 2004 Lexus RX 330 4WD with Navigation through Lexus Financial Services this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00180 and 56%, respectively. It's tough to say, but I personally have a feeling that this may be as good as the lease program on this model gets all year.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2003

Good morning, jdehass. You never mentioned how long this lease was for, so it is tough for me to tell you what this car's residual value should be like. I can tell you though that American Honda Finance Corp.'s base lease money factor for this car should currently be .00205 for 36 - 39 month terms and .00190 for 48 month terms. The factor that you were quoted looks little high to me. Your dealer may be trying to mark up AHFC's base factor to add additional hidden profit to your deal.

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jdehass · August 2003

Car_man-

Both quotes were for a 36 month lease. My apologies for not adding that number, there are a lot of numbers to juggle.

I thought the numbers seemed a bit high based on other posts. Thanks for the information.

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