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Comments
BTW, we were looking at Volvo V70s when we rented an OB. But we ended up with the GT as we really didn't need the ground clearance, liked the handling better, and wanted the dual moonroofs. No regrets. Fun to drive and stands out from all the OBs out there.
bit
Thanks again from Pat. I can assure you if I can be of any help to anyone on these posts I will jump right in.
John
John: drive one and see. They're fun. An H6 would be heaven. So would a turbo.
-juice
Cheers,
-wdb
Craig
--Wagons--
Height, GT/OB: 59.6/63.3
Ground clearance, GT/OB: 6.3/7.3
Front headroom, GT/OB: 38.5/38.5
(For the headroom #'s I used OB Ltd. because it and the GT both have the moonroofs. Overall height was reported to be the same for all Outback wagons.)
So! An inch more ground clearance, undoubtedly due to the difference in tires. And yet the overall height difference is 3.7". Because the interior headroom is the same in the GT and OB Ltd., that means the difference is either suspension height or... blast, that's right, roof rails. Who knows how much effect they have on overall height? It's probably not 3.7", so my guess is that the differerence is in the suspension, and therefore the driver of an OB will sit roughly 3.7" higher than the driver of a GT. No wonder the GT handles so much better ;-)
Cheers,
-wdb
Craig: dealers seem to have to few, you can't even blame customers. You could even say the same about certain models with 5 speeds.
Actually, the tires make up 0.88" of that, and taller springs make up the rest.
The seat itself may be mounted on tracks that set it higher. Anyone know for sure?
-juice
Cheers,
-wdb
FWIW, the Forester's seat isn't that high either. SUV shoppers actually find that's a nit they like to pick, though I prefer the more stable seating position it has.
-juice
Stephen
Stephen, I had an Integra as well. Always had to be careful when parking in a spot with a curb.....
The Forester plows right through at twice the speed with less drama.
-juice
Ross
-juice
Is hard to remind yourself that you have to slow down for some dips (indentations, not other drivers) w/the Miata vs the Forester? I drive my housemates Camry once in awhile and sometimes I forget....but don't tell him! :-)
Stephen
For something new to do...When it snowed I dropped it to 27 front / 26 rear and drove around in the mud/snow and the difference was huge. I know most people depressure for sand but it make a big difference in the mud/snow too. I would not drive on the highway with it that low but its pretty cool in the mush.
Only problem....I did not get the car washed (remove mud) before my wife got home. She is still a little upset about that.....ooops.
nematode: take any muddy photos?
Just remember to air back up, and don't drive on pavement with low pressure (29psi and up is good).
-juice
One plus for the Outback: heated seats. This comes in the All Weather Package, which includes heated mirrors and the heated wiper area of the windshield.
-brian/subearu
-Glick
Here's a nice review of the GT wagon:
http://www.epinions.com/auto-review-7412-BACE6BB-39C393E8-prod1
bit
This link has the full details on the recall.
Cheers
Graham
I'm an SUV lover who can't find any good options in the mini-utes. I really like the Mazda Tribute but am concerned about the reliability since it's a first-year model that already has had 5 recalls.
The Outback Ltd has the higher clearance and rugged looks that I want (although the SUVs are still better), but my concern is buying a station wagon. Is it too much of a family car? Are there other singles out there with the Outback?
If you can put the (debatable) "mom/dad-mobile" image aside, I think you will find an excellent automobile in the Outback, or any Subaru wagon for that matter.
Have you considered a Forester? It's more SUVish than the Outback. It's also a bit more nimble and quicker than the H-4 Outback. The Outback H-6 is quicker, however.
Another suggestion is the Legacy GT sedan or wagon. Its image is a bit more "Euro" than the Outbacks or Foresters. It also drives more "Euro" too.
Bob
1- H6 does not come in manual tranny.
(I must have a stick)
2- first year model was a concern.
3- I thought with all the OB Lmtd had to offer, that H-6's are a bit pricy.
This is my 2nd outback, they are great & fun.
Good luck!
-Glick
From my driving perspective (previous car was a Honda Prelude), the Outback rocks! I actually think most SUVs are as exciting to drive as a granny-mobile, and wouldn't be caught dead in one. This notion was confirmed when I test drove an XTerra, supposedly the most butch SUV out there for those of us in the active set. It has all the driving dynamics of a pickup truck, which is to say, NONE. Same goes for the other SUVs I drove. The OB (and Forester) are actually cooler in my opinion, just because they handle and drive so much better than the typical SUV.
I agree with Bob, check out the Forester -- it handles even better than the OB, and is a tad faster. Looks a little sportier too.
Don't worry about the wagon image, just concentrate on the driving experience. From my driver's seat, the OB (and Forester) are loads of fun!
Craig
Car is fantastic.
Cons:
- Soundproofing of $40K+ car
- Athletic suspension (supple but controllable)
- Amenities (everything is heated).
Pros:
- lumbar support isn’t sufficient (is it really so hard to make this simple device effective?)
- auto climate control. It simple refuses to maintain desired temperature. It continually blows cold air when set to 84F with outside temperature is 32F :-) I hope it’s simply broken and I’ll fix it next visit to dealer. If it’s a design flaw, it’s perfect example for ASAP manufacture recall.
I made few accelerations from 65 MPH to 95 MPH and H6 felt impressively strong. It hit ~5800 RPM only once when I was executing the same maneuver uphill at about 4000ft (I had 2 adults + kid + luggage).
Regards,
Nikita.
I found it interesting that you didn't mention the power dropping off at altitude, something that gets mentioned in regards to the H4. The climate control complaint has been heard several times before, so I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually becomes a recall. Let us know what was wrong and how they fixed it! Oh, and "pro" means "good" .
Cheers,
-wdb
I would have gotten a GT if the dealers didn't have 5-speed L's in stock.
If you are *really* into looks, go to some aftermarket places to replace the air-dam/rear bumper and add side skirts. I accidentally found www.cobbtuning.com and they have all kinds of stuff to make your Subie look different (good or bad is subjective).
Haven said all that about looks, has anyone tried to double-clutch and toe-and-heel on a Legacy? Double-clutching should work on all 5-speeds anyway. Turns out the Legacy padels are also set up for toe-and-heel shifting. It works even for my tiny 7 1/2 sized feet
I do agree with most posters about the lack of H6 with 5-speed. *Sigh*!
--Tak
As a sport-wagon, the GT wins hands down. For a sport-utility-wagon, the Outback (or Forester) is the way to go.
Craig
Probably I was too tired after the trip.
Nikita.
Thanks again.
Pat.
the url is http://www.qsubaru.homepage.com/.
Site has some parts and pricing but no full catalogue of parts and prices.
Tom
Thanks again Pat.
It has been a while since I checked out the postings here, so I only checked the last 195 of them. I am wondering is anyone has noticed the following noises in their Y2K OB's.
- Creaky suspension. Especially in cold weather.
- Creaky seats. Again, this may be a cold weather phenomenon.
- Squeaky brakes. I think this is a Subaru feature. If anyone can confirm that it would be appreciated.
Thanks.
-andyt.
Cheers,
-wdb
Andy: I'd ask a dealer to look at those. Your sway bars may need some lithium grease, front and back, on the bushings.
First I've heard of seats making noise, but have a dealer check and lube if needed. Brake pads can be scuffed if they are glazed. You have a 12k miles adjustment period, so ask them to look at these issues.
Darlene's site has a sample of Subaru OE goodies, but she carries everything Subaru offers. Touch-up paint, filters, wheels, accessories, and even clothing.
David: no off road? Legacy L or GT. If you can afford the GT, it handles really nice and comes with nice wheels and a moonroof.
Jagsfan: I think the OB has a pretty good image. It's very recognizable and popular. My dad has one and loves it.
Still, if you think it's too wagony, or doesn't have enough power, check out the smaller, lighter Forester. It's short wheel base makes it fairly nimble and it looks more "trucky" withouth the penalties that come with actually being a truck.
The Forester S Premium has heated seats, huge moonroof, alloys, and a nice monotone look. The OB LTD is similarly nice.
Happy shopping.
-juice
Creaky suspension: Nope. Ours is dead silent there. You can hear the keys gingle when you are driving and at low speeds thats all you hear. At highway speed (70mph) its mostly wind noise from the mirrors. Over bumps you can hear the suspension give but no other noises. I see that juice suggested the same cure I would have so I can officially second that.
Creaky seats: Nope. I have complaints about the height of the passenger seat (its too low) and about the lumbar adjustment (its not very useful) on the drivers side but no noises to date. Do you have the leather seats or the cloth?
Squeaky brakes: Yup. When cold, ours will sqeak for a few stops and then go away.
Do you have the ticking noise from the dash when you use the defroster on cold days? He have that.
I still dont have any significant complaints about the car. Lots of minor ones but nothing major.
Tom
1) When your other car (my car) is a 11 year old Ford Taurus...my wife is not too keen on leaving her OB anywhere in the winter when we (commute together) need it.
2) I'm the only one in this family who cares about the ticking. My wife, friends, dog, and cats dont care at all.
3) You can reproduce the ticking by pressing on the dash really hard so its probably do to heat expansion/contraction.
4) All the OBs seem to do the same thing.
I'm glad that you will have it looked at. Please post the dealers opnion/solution to the noise. After my Ford Contour nightmare I cant believe that I am complaining about a little ticking/popping noise.
I get my black Legacy dash pieces to replace the GT plastic wood today. Will post the install pics when I get a round to doing it.
bit
Still, if you have issues, I'll put you in touch with someone at SoA and make sure you get taken care of.
bit: in the Forester, at least, you start at the back of the center console and work forward.
-juice
Let us know how it goes!
Cheers,
-wdb
CONS:
1) One warranty repair to replace a leaky o-ring seal on the A/C system which caused it to not cool as it should. (after about 500 mi.)
2) Gas mileage is not what I expected. Averaging 19-20mpg in hard city driving & 24mpg. in mixed city/highway driving. Have yet to take it on an extended "all highway" trip yet thought, so I'll reserve complete judgement till then.
3) I wish that the ignition switch & door buttons were lit at night, as they are in the wife's Honda Accord. Also, the switch operations are backwards from the Honda, which takes getting used to. (up to lock, down to unlock vs. vice-versa in the Honda).
4) The horn is a bit touchy. If you barely bump the edges of the wheel, you inadvertently beep at the guy in front of you!
4) Leg room may be a tad tight in the rear seat with the front seats slid backwards completely & slightly reclined.
PROS:
1) Service at the dealer was outstanding (in/out in only a couple of hours), especially considering that I brought it in around 2pm. BTW, they also gave me a loaner car overnight when I had to leave it w/them (after work one nite) the week before to have the spoiler/sec. system installed the next morning. I plan on mentioning their excellent customer relations on my soon-to-be-completed company survey.
2) I LOVE smooth ride, particularly on the highway, and good braking.
3) The gated shifter -- it took some getting used to, but it really grows on you.
4) Since it never rains in Fla. anymore (where's a good T-storm when I want one?), I had to resort to dirt/sandy roads to try out the AWD and I was VERY impressed. However, I must remember to plan these outings a little better next time, as it was too cold outside to wash it myself for 2 days afterward!
5) I get TONS of looks/stares from other drivers and lots of compliments (particularly on the Wintergreen color) & questions, including the standard "how do you like your Subaru/AWD?" and "I've never seen one of those before, did you get it here?" It's great to be unique in an ocean of SUVs & mini-vans.
BTW, JAGSFAN: Don't worry about the "image" you're afraid you might project if you drove a wagon. I live in Jacksonville and am proud to say that I have 2 single women in their 20's in my office that now think I have the coolest car in the building. (& one of them drives a Mazda Navajo (aka. Explorer) too!). I also, was originally looking at the Tribute before I got my OB and am so thrilled/relieved that I went with the Subaru. Go drive a Forester AND OB (make sure you drive each of them in both the 5spd & the Auto) and do your homework. It's worth the effort & I think you'll be impressed with the results.
As for the ongoing 5spd/Auto debate: Yes, I agree that the 5spd has a little more pep from the starting gate than the Auto & may be a little more fun to drive because of it, but after driving in gridlock for the last 2mo. in my Auto after having standard transmissions my whole life, I'll probably never go back. Long/short of it: If you don't have gridlock/traffic issues, get the stick. If you do, save your leg cramps for other, more enjoyable, kinds of workouts.
Stephen (SE)
Stephen: So you're in Jacksonville? As you can tell by my name, I'm a big Jaguars fan, although I live in the Northeast. Not a good year for us Jags fans but we've been spoiled...
Has anyone been able to get invoice or close to invoice on a Limited?
Did you buy your OB from Subaru Regency? The owner also has a dealership in CT where I bought our '98. Good guy and gave us a good price.
Jagsfan, where in the Northeast? Since we have so many dealerships up this way I find they have to give you a fair price just to compete. The only down side is if live and buy in New England you are subject to Subaru of New England pricing (not SOA) which is higher than the rest of the country. For example destination charge is $550 as opposed to $495 and I have found after looking at three dealer invoices the base OB is $50 more than what is listed at sites like KBB or Edmunds.
So getting invoice or close to invoice in NE can be done. Just make sure you have the dealer show you their cost. Good luck with your purchase. Winter Green is a great color.
Glick, I'm jealous. I was so close to going to Fitzgeralds myself. At the time, they were offering OB's $300 under invoice! My trade in was the deciding factor to stay local. Who knows, Fitsgeralds probably would have offered me the same price.
Tom