2013 and earlier Volkswagen Passat Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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Comments

  • ffxvwffxvw Member Posts: 93
    Snurple, I'm not sure about the accuracy of those "declining lease projection" numbers. I know I'm still learning the auto business, but I think I have a fairly logical brain. Now finance companies and automakers both make a large chunk of their money from leasing. A lease, especially short term, makes it much more likely that a current customer will become a repeat customer.
    Don't you think they will just keep adding more and more lease incentives if there starts to be a slowdown?
    Jason

    P.S. I don't know about a global slowdown, but this month has certainly been pretty molassic (word invention? lol).
  • carguy5000carguy5000 Member Posts: 146
    You are right...you are still learning. The fact is banks and finance "arms" are loosing HUGE time on leasing. Look at the number of banks that removed this business from their portfolio in the last quarter alone. GE Cap is just one example. They were leaders in the business at one time until they began to loose on the residual game. While you are correct that it brings the customer back in a specified period of time, they come back at a high cost.
  • ffxvwffxvw Member Posts: 93
    That doesn't seem to jibe with what I'm seeing here. It seems like almost all of the VWs I'm seeing come off of leases are worth pretty damn close to their ACV's. Are you saying most leases are not like this?

    Jason
  • carguy5000carguy5000 Member Posts: 146
    Absolutely..for every VW figured correctly, there are 1000 Ford Taurus units that are worth $1000-$2000 less than their contracted residuals.
    I am not picking on the Taurus in particular, it just offers a larger sample size to look at.
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
    Facelifted 2001.5 Pricing guide and *What's New*
    available by fax...email me.
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Hello all,

    Im looking to lease a Passat very soon. I went in today to look at a VW Passat GLS sedan. This is the deal I came up with after some negotiating. I went with a 10k mile lease because thats all Im going to need. I would like to know if the following offer that I got is a "good" deal:

    2001 VW Passat GLS
    Leather package
    Luxury package
    Monsoon sound sytem
    Automatic

    1500$ down (includes first payment)
    39 month lease
    10K miles per year
    299$ monthly payments (does not include tax)

    Please let me know how good of a deal this is. I need to make a decision fairly quickly.

    Thanks very much in advance,

    David
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
    David, the bottom line is that there is no
    one here that is going to have the pleasure of
    driving your Passat...as well, there is no one here that is going to write the check that makes your
    lease payment...The important thing is whether
    YOU are happy and comfortable; not anyone here...
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    hi,

    thanks for the response. The only reason i asked about this potential lease deal is to get some opinions from you guys if i was getting a fair/good deal compared to whats going around in other parts of the country.

    david
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    vwguild, your post #409 speaks volumes!
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    Good for you David! You want to know if the lease deal you've been presented with is a good one. Not sure how much you know about leasing...Edmund's and the January issue Consumer Reports both have some good info that may prove helpful.

    First of all, I wouldn't feel rushed.
    Second, have you shopped around for a better deal? Here's a mind-boggling stat--only 38% of those leasing talked to more than one dealership in search of the best terms.
    Third, you say that you negotiated--what exactly did you negotiate? I can think of three things to watch for:
    1) The Price--at this point in the model year, your "price" for the vehicle should be very near to invoice. Don't let the dealer convince you that leasing and buying are different in this respect. The street value of the car should provide the basis for the lease arrangement.
    2) The Residual--in an attempt to slice you both ways, they may be utilizing an extremely low residual (precisely because the car is "older"), which means that you will be paying for a lot of depreciation (couple that with a lease based on MSRP and you're really screwed!).
    3) The Fees--question all fees. If you shop around, you may find that certain dealers add in fees--now how could that be? ;)

    I am sure that other people can chime in with their current lease stats--but the best way for you to know if your numbers are good is to walk them to at least two other dealers. Good luck!
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    snurple,

    Thanks for ur response. I have shopped around other dealers for similarly priced cars than the Passat. I went to Nissan to look at the Maxima. The Maxima GLE and Passat I want have about the same MSRP.

    Beleive me, when I was in VW, the salesperson kept asking me "what do u want ur monthly payments to be", I responded by saying "monthly payments are not my main concern, I could make the monthly payments 10$ if I wanted to, but I would have to put down 10,000$"

    The basic details I got from VW is that the residual on the Passat would be around 57-59% for 39months lease. Compared to Maxima GLE that retails at around 26.5K$ like the Passat I want, Nissan wanted 1000$ (includes 1st payment , fees, tag, ect..) for 36months was 450$ a month. Now the Passat which is around the same retail price as the Maxima GLE, VW was asking 1500$ down (includes 1st payment, tag, ect..) 39months, 299$ a month. Neither of the monthly prices included taxes. I think I would be getting the Passat at around 1000$ under invoice according to my calculations.

    From the looks of it, I think Im getting a decent deal with VW. Im going to go into the dealership today and try to work on the price a bit more, but if this deal stands, according to the facts mentioned above, is it a "good" deal?

    david
  • maddog16maddog16 Member Posts: 4
    I'd like to buy a Passat GLX and have called various dealers. I'm getting "the manager drove this car and it has 6000 miles on it." For the same car, I've seen a price range of about $2000. How much should one expect to pay for a used "new" car? What does "the manager drove it" translate to? Does it mean the manager drove it to work or home? The manager test drove it all around the country? Or lots of people drove it?
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    That's really the key to getting a good deal.
    For you to compare lease deals across models doesn't really help you to get a better deal on either one. If you have decided on the Passat, take that deal to two other VW dealers and ask them if they can do better.

    And, in order to compare efficiently, you should have all of the elements of the lease written down. You say that you "think you'd be getting the Passat at around a $1000 under invoice according to your calculations"--sounds dangerous! If they haven't given you a sheet of paper with that amount as the price (BEFORE subtracting your cap reduction, etc.) than you'll want to confirm this. Make sure that the dealers you talk to are giving you all of the relevant information, Price, Residual, Money Factor (interest rate), Fees, etc. You'll want to double check everything on a printed up contract before you sign--makes sure that everything checks out!

    Leasing is very complicated--the federal government has stepped in multiple times in the last few years to protect consumers against a variety of confusing practices that they considered scams. In general, leasing is an expensive way to "save" money. I trust that you've already decided against buying for some solid reasons--the key now is to make sure that you get the best lease possible...
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    snurple,

    Thanks for ur response. I have shopped around other dealers for similarly priced cars than the Passat. I went to Nissan to look at the Maxima. The Maxima GLE and Passat I want have about the same MSRP.

    Beleive me, when I was in VW, the salesperson kept asking me "what do u want ur monthly payments to be", I responded by saying "monthly payments are not my main concern, I could make the monthly payments 10$ if I wanted to, but I would have to put down 10,000$"

    The basic details I got from VW is that the residual on the Passat would be around 57-59% for 39months lease. Compared to Maxima GLE that retails at around 26.5K$ like the Passat I want, Nissan wanted 1000$ (includes 1st payment , fees, tag, ect..) for 36months was 450$ a month. Now the Passat which is around the same retail price as the Maxima GLE, VW was asking 1500$ down (includes 1st payment, tag, ect..) 39months, 299$ a month. Neither of the monthly prices included taxes. I think I would be getting the Passat at around 1000$ under invoice according to my calculations.

    From the looks of it, I think Im getting a decent deal with VW. Im going to go into the dealership today and try to work on the price a bit more, but if this deal stands, according to the facts mentioned above, is it a "good" deal?

    david
  • maddog16maddog16 Member Posts: 4
    I'd like to buy a Passat GLX and have called various dealers. I'm getting "the manager drove this car and it has 6000 miles on it." For the same car, I've seen a price range of about $2000. How much should one expect to pay for a used "new" car? What does "the manager drove it" translate to? Does it mean the manager drove it to work or home? The manager test drove it all around the country? Or lots of people drove it?
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    for some reason my message got double posted, weird. anyways, i am about to head off to VW right now, ill let u guys know what happens later today.
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Hi,

    I went to shop around my Passat lease offer to a couple other VW dealers. Both dealers said they couldnt even come close to the lease deal the first dealership offered me. One of the salesman actually told me "to be honest with you, if i was you and u can get that lease deal for the Passat from this other VW dealership, i wouldnt even think twice about it". He actually said he didnt understand how they could give me such a deal and still make money.

    Ive also done a lot of research using the Lease Wizard program. This sounds like a great deal, Im probably going to go into the VW dealer to sign the papers.

    Ill keep u guys updated.

    David
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
    Michael...I refrained from telling you this earlier because Mr. Snurple would have told you
    to research and compare this deal until you don't
    need a car, but a walker...

    Once again...you are the one that this deal has to please...not anyone here...if you are comfortable with the numbers and the people ...get
    the car and go home, and don't look over your shoulder.

    I have posted here, several times, that this whole
    process can really be over done. If you like the car, and it is within your budget; that is all that
    matters...I am not saying that anyone should pay
    more than they believe to be a fair price, but if
    YOU feel that it is; be done with it.
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    BUT if you told that first VW dealer that under no circumstances were you buying a car that day or they got that impression then they probably gave you a LOW BALL number. Based upon your conversation that you did share this would seem to be the case.

    The fact that the other VW dealers said they couldnt match that deal or do better reinforces that belief.

    299 a month lease for 3 years with 1500 down on a 25K car is amazingly low.

    My bet is that when you post next after having gone to that dealer is that they gave you a low ball number so you would have to come back and then they will tell you how they "forgot" something.
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Well, Im heading off to the dealer in 30 minutes. I will let you know if the those numbers were a low-ball figure or not. I will post the results tonight.

    Thanks for your input,

    david
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Well, I just got back from the dealership. I decided to throw in an old car that I owned as a trade-in. I got a very fair price on the trade-in.
    I also decided to add the Monsoon system to the Passat along with some other accessories.

    Here is the official offer that I signed today and will finalize on monday:

    2001 Passat GLS
    Leather
    Luxury Package
    Automatic
    Monsoon Stereo

    MSRP: 26,475$
    Cash Down: $1500 (includes 1st payment)
    Trade-in: $2000
    Total Cap reduction: $3500
    38months/ 259$ per month

    Im pretty happy with this deal, and I cant wait to pick up the car next week.

    David
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    Guess I was completely wrong. Congrats on a nice car and an amazingly low lease payment.
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    Unfortunately David, since your lease is based on the MSRP, you wound up getting a bad deal.

    The Invoice price on the car you are leasing is about $24,000. Based on posts on this and other forums, 2001 Passats are regularly being sold for a few hundred $ over this invoice price. But in your case, your dealer sold you a Passat for full MSRP, for $2500 over invoice. As a result, your lease payments will reflect another $2000 + interest of "artificial depreciation." Any lease based on MSRP, especially at this time of the year--and at this time in the Passat model year--is a bad deal. Your trade-in added another layer of icing to their cake.

    I assume you came to this forum asking for good advice. If you only came here for blind emotional support--that's another matter, and another forum, altogether. Of course, you can still enjoy your new car, and, hopefully, in another 38 months you will negotiate a better deal...
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    In response to a poster's questions about a deal, vwguild sez: "If you like the car, and it is within your budget; that is all that matters..."
    [Translation: "Don't worry about whether or not your deal is financially sound--if it FEELS right to you, than that is all that matters..."]

    After the poster has made a bad deal, afk_x sez: "Congrats on a nice car and an amazingly low lease payment."
    [Translation: "$249/month for a Passat? Sounds fantastic! Don't bother me with any of the other deal points because that low monthly payment sounds so good I don't want to hear anything else..."]

    Any deal can be made to sound good if you don't examine it too closely. Here are two different ways to get great monthly lease payments on a Passat:
    1)Put $10,000 down and lease for 60 months. OR
    2)negotiate a financially sound deal.
    Which would you prefer?

    Leasing is confusing as hell--and it's a poor financial move for most people. But don't take my word for it, read most any half-way decent consumer advice source. Unless you can write-off the cost of a lease as a business expense, leasing amounts to a "grand financial illusion."
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Hi,

    I was not sold the car at MSRP, I was just quoting the MSRP to let you guys know how much the car was worth. I use "LeaseWizard" to help me out, and according to that program there is no way I could have gotten the deal I got if they were selling me the car at MSRP. Anyhow, I asked them to give me the "negotiated price" that they are selling me the Passat for and the money factor, before I sign the official lease deal. I wont sign anything official until I have those 2 numbers. Using "LeaseWizard", I figured that they have to be selling me the car at around invoice, or else the numbers wouldnt add up to 259 per month with 3500 down. I will know on Monday.

    Thanks guys,

    david
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    Thanks for the clarification. But see, this is what I mean about leasing, it's such a pain in the a-- to lay out all of the relevant details. I wonder where they are getting their residual numbers from? And, I wonder if they are getting lease incentives? The number at the top of the lease is important, but so is the residual--they could be lowering the negotiated price in conjunction with an artificially high residual...

    Hopefully you're getting a good deal :)
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    you are 100% right, these dealers are magicians with numbers and I dont doubt that. Thats why Im not signing anything until I get a negotiated price, residual price and possibly a money factor for this deal. If I get some information today, Ill post it. The reason why Im on this message board, is not really for emotional support, Im looking for advice from people who are familiar with the Passat and its pricing.

    Thanks

    david
  • dniehusdniehus Member Posts: 83
    I am considering a variety of car-based SUVs or wagons up to the low $30's. Long term reliability and resale value are quite important. Obviously, also features/value/styling/safety. I have only recently added the Passat wagon to my list of possible vehicles. However, the shameful 2 year/24000 mile warranty is a MAJOR turnoff. Doesn't VW stand behind its products? This is the worst new car warranty I am aware of. How can they get away with this in this competitive market place? At this point I am leaning toward either a certified pre-owned Lexus RX300 or a Subaru Forester S premium package.
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    Leasing is NOT a bad financial move in general. To be good or bad leasing must be compared to something else. It also depends upon individual driving habits of the individual. For many drivers leasing is MUCH better than purchasing.

    With a payment of 249 including tax on a 39 month lease with 3500 down the car is obviously being sold close to invoice with a low money factor and high residual. Why did you think I didn't consider these kind of details? Do you think you have a monopoly on thinking?

    My concern would only be who the lease is through and their provisions for wear and tear.
  • tcasboytcasboy Member Posts: 214
    If you are going to lease anyway, 259 sounds pretty good. Putting a reasonable amount down and financing at a reasonable rate for as short a term as you could would obviously be cheaper in the long run, unless business or tax issues are a factor in the lease question. Leasing was developed by dealers and finance companies looking for ways to move pricier cars under the guise of a good deal to people who would rather rent a more expensive vehicle for a couple of years instead of buying something they can really afford. The dealer moves more profitable cars and the turnover insures repeat business in shorter time frames. Its a vicious cycle to enter. I would worry about end of lease fees and wear/tear assessments that you are powerless to affect. Not to mention paying taxes for and insuring a car that you don't own. Take the low price, find a credit union rate and buy the car. If you don't want it after 3 years sell it and take the money to put down on another purchase. Most people agree that buying a house is more financially sound than renting one yet for some reason we go hook line and sinker for leases instead of buying. Hmmm.
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    Compared to buying, leasing is a pretty bad idea for most people.

    Every checklist you see on "Is Leasing Right For You?" begins with two telltale questions:

    1) "Do you like to have a new car every few years?"
    2) "Do you like the benefits of an expensive car without the expensive monthly payments?"

    If you answer "yes" to both of these questions, you are entertaining a devil's bargain. Leasing is a temptation straight from the pit of hell.

    And, anyone who disagrees with me is speaking for SATAN himself ;)
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    when I read through my previous post.

    I apologize for any unintended overstatements...
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    The reason why I was interested in leasing is because I didnt want to put too much "cash" down and I didnt want large monthly payments. For me, the pleasure of owning a new car every 3 years is very rewarding. Your car is going to depreciate wether you own it or lease it. Anyways, if I really like my leased car and the residual value is interesting, I can always purchase the vehicle at the end of the lease. Of course, buying a car in the end might be more financially advantageous than leasing a car, but you only live once, and if you do your homework and shop around you might end up with a pretty good deal leasing a car.

    david

    ps: still havent got the numbers on the lease from the VW dealer (negotiated price, residual and money factor), I will post when I get them.
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    I do apologize for anyone coming here for Passat pricing only to find this post on leasing. However the mis-information being spread in a self-righteous manner needs to be rebutted.

    Would you believe that sometimes it is actually LESS money to lease and then buy at the end than it is to conventionally finance from the beginning?

    Sound to good to be true? It isn't. When you lease you pay for the first half. (assuming a 50% residual) Then you can buy the rest at the end. If you have a low bank fee in a lease with an extremely low lease factor this can be the case. ESPECIALLY when you take into account the time value of money, or the opportunity cost of your down payment on a purchase.

    People who say leasing is bad do not understand how it works. Leasing has a huge number of advantages over purchasing. Purchasing has only one over leasing, which is under MOST circumstances you would have saved money by buying via conventional financing over leasing vs purchasing.

    As far as paying taxes and insuring a car you dont own, this is laughable. Until you have the pink slip you don't own anything. Also comparing renting a house to leasing a car is completely wrong. 99.9% of cars will depriciate. Houses will usually hold their value.

    I will no longer post off topic.

    That is all.
  • tcasboytcasboy Member Posts: 214
    I am too interested in Passat prices, but I feel that discussing lease deals in response to questions is pertinent to the process of buying a car. And as you said, buying only has one advantage over leasing, that being "... under MOST circumstances you would have saved money by buying via conventional financing over leasing..." That sounds like a pretty BIG advantage to me, and the purpose of this discussion is to help mamamia123 ascertain whether or not they are getting a good deal, ie: saving money. So I think the lease discussion is germane to the questions on the board. IMHO mamamia123 should strongly consider purchasing the vehicle and taking advantage of the current interest rate incentives from VW. Eventually you then own the car and don't have to worry about getting zapped with a bunch of mileage and wear/tear fees when you turn in the car.
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
    I would love to be able to answer all of the above
    however; as I've said this is an individual question, and you have really responded to most of
    the negative stuff...you have your own reasons for doing what you are doing which is all that really matters.

    Having said that...I do have one very serious concern...The only Volkswagen Credit *subvented*
    programs in place right now deal with 5 Speed
    Transmission cars. And it is across the board, New
    Jettas, Passats(except 4Mo), Beetles and Golfs.

    The Residual on a 39 Month (Special Time frame along with 42Months)is 55% with a Factor of 0.00245. This is Based on 15,000 Miles and an
    Acquisition Fee of $490.

    This is not available for Tiptronic Passats, and I
    believe that you are looking at a Tip...So be
    CAUTIOUS...
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    if he thought leasing was a prudent financial move, do you really think you would get an honest answer?

    The numerous fees and poor interest rates in most every lease makes serial leasing more expensive than financing a car over five years at 8% (Especially if you keep a car for another year or two w/o payments!). After three years of buying a car, you can also "simply walk away"--but you will be able to apply your thousands of $$$ of accumulated equity to your next purchase.

    Better yet, instead of leasing a car in the $30-40K range as many do, smart people can scale back a bit and finance a $20K car over perhaps four years. Why would anyone want to let $15,000 drain out of their pocket over three years--and then sign up for another round and another and another...

    Buying a home and buying a car are considered smart; renting a home and leasing a car are not considered smart. Cars DO depreciate. But that's the point--they depreciate the most in their first few years--which means that the lessee gets to pay for ALL of this steep depreciation while reaping NONE of the benefits of ownership.

    To bring it around to the topic at hand: Everyone interested in leasing a Passat should take another look at buying a Passat over five or even six years. If the payments are still too high, they should consider buying a less expensive auto.
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    If I could show you a lease example where it is cheaper to lease and finance the residual vs conventional financing at 8% would you then forever worship my financial godship?
  • snurplesnurple Member Posts: 130
    Hopefully it will take you a very long time to track down this super-duper leasing/financing deal--that way you won't be leading as many people into your Leasing Pit of Hellfire...
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Its interesting, my lease offer for a loaded Passat (MSRP 26,450$) with 1500$ down and a 2000$ trade-in for 39months at 259$/month has gone from an "amazing deal" to a horrible "satan" like financial deal according to some on this message board. It's good for me to hear from both sides. Oh well...Im going back to the dealer tommorow, I will get more details about the lease (negotiated price, residual and money factor), if things look "good" I will probably sign the paperwork...Ill keep you guys informed.

    Thanks,

    david
  • ffxvwffxvw Member Posts: 93
    Wow...what a lot of activity there has been on this subject. Couple of points:

    Leasing can be a tricky minefield to negotiate. Here are some groups of people that leasing may be preferable to:

    1. Mr. KeepupwiththeJoneses - The person who has to keep up with the latest and greatest in everything. This person, regardless of their choice of financing or leasing, will want to get a new car in 3 or 4 years, so leasing may be a better way to go, especially if they don't have a lot of money to put down.

    2. Mr. NegativeEquity - Leasing is a much easier format to "hide" negative equity without the customer having to pay a large amount out-of-pocket.

    3. Mr. Only"OK"Credit - If your credit is in the middle ranges, you may have to pay large interest charges to finance a car. However, you may be able to qualify for a lease, and then you're paying the same lease rates as Bill Gates would pay.

    Mamamia, the only advice I'd like to give you is that you should re-think putting as much money up-front as you are doing. One of the major reasons to put money up-front (besides lower payments) is to keep yourself in a positive equity situation. In a lease, GAP insurance is standard, so in the event of your car being totalled, you just walk away. Think about it.

    Jason

    P.S. I'm in a Demo now, which is probably the Ultimate lease situation, and the majority of the salesman here who own cars are in leases, so I don't think leasing is quite up to the "infernal" level. Its just a more complex equation.
    P.P.S. I believe VW Credit just extended the lease rates to all non-4-motion Passats.
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Hi,

    From what I understand all leases through VW include gap insurance. This is good. I would have put down only 1500$ for the lease and paid the 300$ a month, but I had a trade-in that was falling apart and was losing value, so I decided to throw it in the deal to lower the payments. If I didnt have this trade-in, I wouldnt have put down more than the 1500$ that was demanded for the special lease offer. I agree, one should not put down too much cash on a lease.

    Im going down to sign the papers tommorow and pick up the car, Im pretty happy. Im going to be riding a 26K$ for 259$ a month...according to most people I know, they all told me I got a "good" deal. Anyways, I love this car and Im just glad I will be able to enjoy it for the next few years. BTW, I got VW to throw in a Passat car cover for free (retail cost is around 220$) :)

    david
  • ffxvwffxvw Member Posts: 93
    Sounds great to me. Make sure its the high quality car cover, there is also a cheaper one.
    Enjoy your car!
    If you really don't want to put that money down, just have them use your trade as your downpayment and keep ALL of your money in your pocket. I've even cut people checks for their car when they didn't want to put money down. {shrug} Its up to you.

    Jason
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    Hi,

    I want to add an in-dash cd player to my Passat. Tho Ive heard that adding aftermarket stereo components to the Passat, especially head-units, can be quite a pain in the butt especially if you have the Monsoon system. Can anyone recommend an in-dash cd player that will fit and look well in the Passat? By the way, my Passat will have the Monsoon system.

    Thanks

    david
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Vwguild, Volkswagen recently expanded their subvented lease program on 2001 Passats to include models with automatic transmissions. Even though I generally advise consumers to keep their lease down payments as low as possible, I just ran a few numbers in my lease calculator and David's deal is very possible.

    Despite the fact that the purchase vs. lease debate that has been happening in the last several posts in this discussion is slightly off topic, I thought that I would throw in my two cents. This argument is not nearly as black or white as everyone makes it out to be. The answer to which is better, leasing or purchasing, is very simple... it all depends upon the deal and your personal driving habits.

    Over the past several years, many banks offered consumers relatively high residual values on many of the vehicles that they were leasing. By taking advantage of these mistakenly high residuals consumers were able to get great deals on leases and save themselves a great deal of month in the process, provided that they were going to get a new car or truck every two or three years any how. Unfortunately, by setting their residual values too high these banks were setting themselves up for a big fall. When the vehicles eventually began to come back off-lease they were not worth nearly what the banks had estimated that they would be and these financial institutions took huge losses. To illustrate, last quarter DaimlerChrysler had to take a $500 million charge against its earnings to cover Chrysler Financial's residual value exposure.

    It seems as though most banks have now realized that they were setting their residual values at unrealistically high levels and have lowered their residuals across the board. These lower residuals have on average made leasing vehicles more expensive. Still, there are bargains out there is you know where to look.

    There are two factors that would make leasing a vehicle more attractive than actually paying cash for it. They are if the vehicle has an unrealistically high residual value or if a manufacturers' captive finance company is offering lease money factor support (low interest rates on leases), but the automaker is not providing equivalent support in the form of cash or special finance rates.

    Another seldom thought of advantage to leasing is that, if you are in a serious accident and you have your vehicle repaired properly your bank can not hit you up for diminished value. You can just walk away from it squeaky clean at lease-end. Conversely, if you actually owned this vehicle and had to sell it on your own you would take a substantial hit by disclosing that it was in a major accident.

    If a car or truck's residual values are set properly and one was going to finance a new vehicle every couple of years, they would come out dead even if they leased their vehicle and just turned it in at lease-end or if they bought it and sold it after a couple of years.

    Car_Man
    Host Smart Shoppers / FWI Message Boards
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    This has been a very informative discussion, and I think anyone coming on this message board feels the same way. Its great to get everyone's input on this topic. Tho I wouldnt make a decision based on a single post from a message board, these messages as a whole have helped me a lot.

    Tommorow is the day I will drive my car off the lot and sign the official lease papers. But, I could still decline the offer if I dont like the
    actual selling price of the vehicle when I see the paper work. If I think its too high, I might try to throw in a late negotiation :)

    Ill post all the official figures tommorow (actual selling price, money factor, residual). Thanks for all your posts, this has been great.

    Ill be here tommorow,

    david
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    I posted an example of how a car can actually cost you less to lease than buy than to conventionally finance. To keep this topic more on topic, I created a new topic.

    Topic is a funny word isn't it?

    afk_x "Lease vs Purchase" Jan 22, 2001 10:06pm
  • vwguildvwguild Member Posts: 1,620
    See how fast things change...I have been out with the flu since Friday...Am on my way to the store;
    will update Residual & factors later...

    Found the rest of the post on leasing very informative...Thanks
  • mamamia123mamamia123 Member Posts: 30
    I finally picked up my new Passat today (silver/black leather- luxury package, monsoon system, automatic). Im very happy. I got the final numbers today:

    MSRP was: 26,475$
    I got the car for: 24,300$
    Money factor: .0026

    Im very happy with this deal. I do have one technical question. When Im in the car and its running, how do I turn on my interior instrument lights (radio, ac controls, ect..) without having to turn on the headlights outside? I tried everything, is it even possible?

    Thanks,

    David
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