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Real-World Trade-In Values

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Comments

  • thelthel Member Posts: 767
    I had very good luck selling my Miata to Carmax. They were quick, efficient, and best of all, they gave me more $$$ than anyone else was willing to. IMO, it was well worth not having to go through the hassle of selling the car myself (which I've done several times).

    In the end, it only takes them about 30-45 minutes to tell you how much they will give you for you WRX and there is no pressure, so why not just go down and see for yourself.
  • stevesteinstevestein Member Posts: 263
    of what you call "a superb and wonderful 5 liner Ad" You give that advice frequently and I'm curious what you think fits that bill. Pick a car fome here or make one up, but please show us how it's done.
  • cwrigh01cwrigh01 Member Posts: 23
    Nick, you can get on Carmax's website and it will estimate what the will offer in person. In my case, they offered within $500 of the website.

    Chris
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    Howdy. I live in Des Moines, Iowa and was wondering how much I am likely to get for the following trade-in: 1999 Ford F-150 4X4 XLT, short bed, regular cab, 17" wheels, bright red in color, 54,800 miles, am,fm,single cd, roll-up tonneau cover, auto trans, paint and body is in super glossy condition, but the paint in the bed is scratched up by hauling loads. I am the second owner of the vehicle...it was originally an off-lease truck. Thanks a million for your help! Tim

                   ==============

           Howdy Tim, hows the weather and the politics in Iowa ..? ..

             V8 5.4, right ..? .. F150 XLT, short bed with a Reg cab and we have the 4x4 with auto, red in color and 55k, and the bed is all gaffed up with scratches, no kisses, no repaints, no I love those guard rails, right.? .. the miles are low for the year, sounds like a pretty nice little truck, I would grab a new or used bedliner for a few bucks and get that part handled .. trade side, in and around the high $10's, low $11's, if it's super nice and ultra clean you "might" see a little more ..

                    Let me know how it goes Tim ..

                            Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ....... No such thing as a "Starmark" salvage, rebuilt anything .. MB is Very strict and really do a heck of a job with their inspections, has to meet ALL factory the specs ...... :)

                          Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ....... The color and the miles are right for the area .. if it's a nice one, no Oh oh it's Maaco, interior doesn't have that 1985 look, service is all there .. then trade side, in and around the mid to high $15's, maybe the low $16's ...

            Heck yeah, check with Carsmack you never know ... me personally, this would hit Retail Rd, I would make this pup glow in the dark with a great detail, drop a super Ad in the largest paper in the area, 18,9 *asking* and say "see ya" at the first $17,5/$18,5, these are real popular and won't last long in your area ....

                     Let us know ..!

                          Terry.
  • lancerfixerlancerfixer Member Posts: 1,284
    My quest for another Swedish car continues unabated. Where would you hit this, retail?

    '98 Volvo S90, dark green over tan leather.
    56,800 miles, CD, cold weather pack. It's at a non-local (Ford) dealer in central IL ('bout 3 hours from here.) They're asking $10,995, but judging by the on-line pic (looks like it was taken in the summer,) it's been there a while. What does the Oracle say?
  • driftracerdriftracer Member Posts: 2,448
    the "Starmark" thing was a joke - ease up off the caffiene...
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ....... I .......am .......... not ........ on ........ tooo .... much caffieeene ..

             (I didn't think you knew about Starmarks) ........... :)

                        Ttttteeerrryyy.
  • driftracerdriftracer Member Posts: 2,448
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ......... I think were you might be getting confused, is the pricing between the *asking* price of the used VS the new prices ..

             Dealers want to sell them, as long as their making a profit .. there is 3 prices when you sell a vehicle:

    1.) There's an "asking" price (the ultimate figure that you would Love to get)

    2.) There's a "liking" price (a figure you would be happy with)

    3.) There's a "taking" price (a figure a dealer will take to sell the vehicle for, probably not happy with, perhaps a unit thats been sitting for awhile)

                  The FX's are popular, but I'm sure you can find a dealer that will cut a pre-owned for a fair price for the both of ya, no matter what they are *asking*, it's January, even in Georgia .l.o.l.. ... you should be able to purchase one for "around" $2,000ish over the figures I gave you ........ :)

             Plus, sometimes if a dealer smells a trade coming at them, they might be reluctant to show the discount because you might have been reading one of those crazy info sources and want $13,000 for your $9,500 vehicle .l.o.l...

                          Terry.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    *Removes Terry's coffee and replaces it with water* Easy there boy, I don't want to have to leave the land of snow and ice to peel you off the ceiling.

    Speaking of peeling things, I had to go to town today. Almost kissed the guardrail, that new Explorer is a handful, I NEED winter tires. Saw a bad rollover on the way back, I don't think I went over 45. Visited my friend at the Mazda dealer and he bought me lunch. :-)
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ....... Water, hell .. a giant Scotch might be a little tasty ...

          **I NEED winter tires .... How can you need new tires ..? .. you just bought it..! .. what? did you run it over bear, rock formation, creek, fallen tree, practice mine, tree stump, Eskimo, baby seal between Anchorage and Fairbanks ....?

                  I can see another vehicle in the short future ......... :-$

                         Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ......... ES base ...? .. You mean no big Infinity, no leather, no slider, no power in the passenger, no wheels base ....?

                           Terry.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    Let me edumacate you on the finer points of winter driving.

    All season tires are *ok* in all seasons but excel in none. WINTER tires are the BOMB for slick roads. I had 2 sets of wheels and tires for my 97 Explorer, one summer and one winter. I run Bridgestone Winter Duelers in the winter and whatever in the summer. I sold the winter set of tires from the 97 since they won't fit the 04.

    The 04 Explorer has Michelin Cross Terrain tires on it and they are HORRID on the ice. I will be purchasing new winter tires for it in 2 weeks. As for a new vehicle, um, nope, not only would hubby not buy it, but about 10 of my friends would stand in line to kick my glorified rear end.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    One more thing if you don't mind......

    My dad wrecked his truck last night and he wants to trade it in after its fixed. He lost control of it and hit a small car. Anyway, no body damage, just damage to the steering and front end. Its getting fixed right now.

    So, what's he looking at trade now? 2001 Ram 2500 qcab, long bed, 4x4, cummins, auto, red/gray, SLT, power everything, am/fm/cd. Needs tires, has about 40k on it. In good shape except for what was noted above (but is being fixed) and a few yuckies in the interior (nothing bad). Anyway, I don't want him to get taken to the cleaners.
  • jlawrence01jlawrence01 Member Posts: 1,757
    ......... ES base ...? .. You mean no big Infinity, no leather, no slider, no power in the passenger, no wheels base ....?

    No infinity.
    AM/FM Cassette
    No power in the passenger
    Nothing

    Nothing going for it really.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    .......... Well, thats about as base as a base can get, should have bought an SE and saved the ghee whiz ...

               I don't think this will make your day .. the miles are kinda almost maybe somewhat ok, kind of - your getting no help from the color this time of the year and your in competition with the SE's, minus the motor .. trade side, in and around the high $7's, low $8's depending on the condition and the dealer ..

                        Let me know ...

                            Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ...... The Benz is sitting at $10,2 with 17hrs to go .. I see he has a few ringers in the mix, I doubt any dealer would be bidding, unless they were online to - Pump YOU Up.! or so our boy Aaarnold would say .l.o.l. .....

                         Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ...... It's kind of hard to say what he has in it, if he has had it since July . l.o.l .. (I will never understand that stuff)

                   These are nice vehicles .. well the miles are low for the year, we have the cold pack and some tunes and it's a Rwd in snowland, if he ran it through the auction he would "probably" see in and around that $7,5ish figure right now ... at $10,9 he's not asking the moon, but $8,9/$9,5 would be all the denaro on your side, it will depend on the history and how much you like it ...

                            Terry.
  • jlawrence01jlawrence01 Member Posts: 1,757
    >>.......... Well, thats about as base as a base can get, should have bought an SE and saved the ghee whiz ...<

    I would agree. Had my predecessor been more worried about the resale of the vehicles than "following the rules to the letter", I would not have HALF the problems I do in getting rid of some of the vehicles.

    I always add options to the vehicle when I feel that without the options the car is going to be more difficult to unload. That means luxury cars get leather, all cars get CD stereos, Explorers get 3rd row seats, etc.
  • butchbr73butchbr73 Member Posts: 325
    Terry,
    what would you peg this one at, just curious... local lot has an '01 GS430, silver w/ black guts. normal options, no NAV or Mark. 17" rounds. just strolled past 50,xxx. Interior looks decent from the outside, driver seat had a little wear on it.. definately not a top notch, clean one. a little bit of this and that on the outside. in Tennessee.

    Now, the interesting part. After taking a closer inspection late last night (thanks to the education I have received here from you and Bill), guaranteed re-paint on, at least, front right quarter panel, the passenger door doesn't line up exactly at the top with the rear door, some of the crhome around the passenger window is a little looser than you expect on any Lexus... not sure of the exact nature of any damage other than that (gotta give me a little break,it was dark out), but lets say it was just cosmetic damage on the right front half of the car, nothing replaced, just repainted, how bad does this hurt the value.... what would one of this nature run at the auction w/out any repaint,($25k'ish?) and what would this one bring as a repaint? What happens, if we start replacing quarter panels on it, etc... I'm just curious as an fyi to the diminished values....

    As always, thanks for your time.
  • bno1bno1 Member Posts: 1
    I have a 96 Jetta GLX with leather interior, 120K miles, body is in very good shape (minor scratch on a door) and i'm hopeful for another perspective on what a fair price is for the vehicle.

    I'll be going to Carmax's site as well as Edmunds, but i'm looking for the price i can expect for a trade in to simplify my life.
  • butchbr73butchbr73 Member Posts: 325
    ps - the GS may have recently came from a Lex auction in cheese country (Milwaukee?)
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ..... Good job, a little Inspector Clouseau action going on ...

              "Sounds" like a little more than just a little repaint ..

               >>front right quarter panel, the passenger door doesn't line up exactly at the top with the rear door<<..

                "Maybe" more of a "oop's slide down the side and there is some fill in the 2/3" of a five/seven foot scrape from the headlight to the rear door" .. those seams on a Lexus are Pretty Darn Tight (if I'm understanding the description correctly) .. you need to look in the daylight when it's clean, silver can sometimes hide work because of the shape of a GS .. also look at the pass side front lens, those are sealed and very hard to paint around ..

               If there was no work done, just a scattered touch/paint then it's worth "around" $25/$26ish wholesale .. if it has been worked, then maybe $22ish (without seeing it), plus the 50k doesn't help ... did you pull a history on this bad boy.?

             Milwaukee auction, you got the Vin# ..?

                          Terry.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Member Posts: 465
    Are you still visiting us up here in cheese country once in awhile? Give me a shout the next time your around I'll buy you a cocktail for all of the laughs and help you give us here in the townhall. :)
    Porknbeans

    Grand High Poobah
    The Fraternal Order of Procrastinators
  • butchbr73butchbr73 Member Posts: 325
    >>"Sounds" like a little more than just a little repaint .. <<

    I think you got that right... next clue was paint overspray on the rubber seal next/below where the front right quarter panel, windshield and hood come together.

    JT8BL69S510002138

    don't think Carfax shows anything.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    .... Problems Checked: Results Found
    Accident Data No accident data available
    Corrected Title No Corrected Title Record Found
    Driver Education No Driver Education Record Found
    Duplicate Title No Duplicate Title Record Found
    Emission/Safety Inspection No Emission/Safety Inspection Record Found
    Fire Damage Incident No Fire Damage Incident Record Found
    Lease Lease Record(s) Found
    Lien No Lien Record Found
    Livery Use No Livery Use Record Found
    Government Use No Government Use Record Found
    Police Use No Police Use Record Found
    Rental/Fleet No Rental/Fleet Record Found
    Repossessed No Repossessed Record Found
    Taxi Use No Taxi Use Record Found
    Theft No Theft Record Found
     
     
     
    Below are the historical events for this vehicle listed in chronological order. Any discrepancies will be in bold text.
    Report Run Date: 01/15/2004
    VIN JT8BL69S510002138 2001 Lexus GS 430
    Event Date Event Location Odometer Reading Data Source Event Detail
    10/11/00 MI MOTOR VEHICLE DEPT. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL (Leased Vehicle)
    10/31/00 MI 126 MOTOR VEHICLE DEPT. TITLE (Leased Vehicle) (Title #: 263L2850506)
    11/09/01 MI MOTOR VEHICLE DEPT. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL (Leased Vehicle)
    11/26/02 MI MOTOR VEHICLE DEPT. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL (Leased Vehicle)

             **01/07/04 MIDWEST REGION 50,252 AUTO AUCTION REPORTED AT AUTO AUCTION**

               Yep, thats it .. paid $23,5 for it, add the auction fee $300ish, transport $300ish, a little this and that $400ish, probably hitting the table at $24,5ish ..

                He probably woke up after it hit detail and said: "how the hell did I miss this one" ("perhaps" if you look at em' before you buy em' it might help .l.o.l.) .. $26,000 or much less would send this one home .. personally I would pass, Lexus like Benz just don't do well with those hit and run types ...... :)

                        Terry.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    Joe's body shop and bunny boot sales around here its easy to spot paint work. I can usually see if from 5 or 6 feet away.

    There's a body shop (and I say that sarcastically) in Fairbanks that takes 2 wrecks and cuts them in 1/2 and welds them together, along with other *interesting* repairs. He's always got something for sale on the corner. I've seen his work in progress (little brother worked there before he woke up and smelled the roses), its a very scary deal. Ah the joys of living in Alaska.
  • butchbr73butchbr73 Member Posts: 325
    As always, thanks. I'll definately take your advice and pass on that particular one. Just from that quick look at it last night, I think its been thru a pretty big oops...:) I'll keep an eye out on it and see how long it takes them to move it and let you know.

    So, what do you think about the new GS?
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,242
    A newspaper reporter is looking to interview someone who bought a car within the past six months. Please respond to jfallon@edmunds.com with your daytime contact information, make and model of car, and incentives applied to the purchase by 10 AM Pacific on Friday, January 16, 2004.
    Thanks!
    Jeannine Fallon
    PR Director
    Edmunds.com

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ........ I'll make ya a deal ..

              You give me a good description, stuff like color, tranny, sunroof option, service history, where it hangs out and I can give you a more accurate figure .... right now it sounds like in and around $2grandish ..

                           Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ........ Thank you, I will do so (in the spring .l.o.l.) .. your the Arcahtek, Archatech, Arkatech .. hell, your the guy that designs and draws things, right.?

                           Terry.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    Its cold, I need a vacation and my dad sends me out to look at a car.......what the heck??

    Anyway, he's borrowing his g/f's car (since he wrecked his truck) and he's thinking he wants to buy it, if not him than the fire inspector is looking for a car. Anyway.....

    1993 Honda Accord LX, 2-dr, its that weird tan/gray color with red guts, VERY good condition inside and out, non smoker, looks/runs like an 01, knee deep in rubber, 5-speed, 4-cyl, 125k, spoiler, power locks/windows/mirrors, a/c, cruise, am/fm/cd. What's a fair price for everyone? I'm thinking around $3k, but maybe I'm low, it is a nice car. I haven't told him anything yet.

    Now, one more since this one bugs the heck out of me. There is a firefighter there that's been trying to sell his car FOREVER, practically since the day after he bought it. He's asking $12k for it, at least that was the last number I heard after his initial $15k (and yes, they paid full pop for it).

    2001 Ford Focus SE, 5-speed, alloys, good rubber, black/gray, spoiler, 16k, power windows/locks/mirrors, a/c, am/fm/cd. Car is in good shape on the outside, inside is ok (they have kids). I'm just shaking my head on this one.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,733
    well, obviously that shadey seller didn't think $12K was enough for a salvaged Benz. He ended it at 12:30am last night (eastern time) and the highest bidder in the history list was $12K. People still astound me.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • thelthel Member Posts: 767
    Around here, that Accord might bring the high $2k range in the local paper if its really nice. The whole coupe/5-speed/LX thing keep the value down a bit.

    That Focus could be bought (around here mind you) for $8k all day long....tons of them around. If he's really asking $12k and has had it a long time, I hope he's prepared to have it a lot longer. I think you could almost get into a new one for $12k.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ........ Yeah $3grand sounds about right, it's 11 years old, 125k, it's a handshaker and it's a coupe ... it's a just an old Honda not a Hublot watch ..

                 01 Focus SE, meat cleaver, 16k, we got the power pack and he is asking $12 Large ...

                 Sounds like he's been hanging around those Asbestos fires too long, $12 grand ....? .. you can buy them new for almost that, dealers are paying $6ish for 01's and you can buy clean -03- 8/9kers SE's for $9,900 on the retail side anywhere in the lower 48 .... $12 ..? no wonder he has had it FOREVER, it's a $7,9 maybe $8,5 *asking* price vehicle ..

                $12 grand ..? .. tell him to go to Home Depot, grab 300lb's of potting soil and make a planter out of it, at $12 he's going to have it til' the second coming of Jesus ....... :)

                          Terry ;}
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    >>The seller ended this listing early because the item is no longer available for sale<< ..

               Why doesn't that surpise me .l.o.l.. OFF to the auction ....... :)

                          Terry :))
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ...... You probably mean the 05/06 GS ..?

              I'm kinda weird, it takes me time to "like" "love" a vehicle .. when the new Camry body style came out, I immediately thought it was Super Cool, then after seeing 3,0/4,000 of them roll by I kinda lost that lovin' feeling (I like the old body better) ... I prefer a GS as my personal driver, I like "that" size (mid size), the interior room, the trunk space, it's quick, quiet, holds 4 sets of golf clubs, easy to park, looks good, I don't fight with it, it doesn't try to outsmart me .l.o.l... I have to be around a vehicle for awhile, different colors, different lights .. as far as the "new New" GS, I dunno .. I like the new G35, put 1,200 miles on the last one and they are Nice vehicles, probably has the folks at BMW tripping over each other .. I bet that new TL will do well also ...

                          Terry.
  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    Thanks, I'll let my dad know. I kinda cringe at the thought of him buying it, he doesn't do too good with FWD, then again, as he proved last week, he doesn't do too good with 4WD either. :-)

    As for the other guy, yeah, well, he'll have it until the cows come home, pigs fly, well, you get the idea. I know he owes a lot on it. I just shake my head and laugh.

    I seriously need a vacation......anyone in a warm climate need a cook or something?? Its 45 below zero this morning.
  • butchbr73butchbr73 Member Posts: 325
    yes, the '06, I think they have revised the release date/year. I'll have to see it in person, but from what I have seen, I think I like it... Hearing a lot about it looking like the new Maxima, but what some people don't realize is the new Maxima/G35 have an awful lot of current GS's curves and looks in their new bodystyles.

    I'll agree with you on the G35, two good friends have one, very nice car. Haven't driven the new TL yet, mom-in-law has an '01, nice car, so I am guessing the new one is out of this world. Looks a little smaller though.
  • tiredofmanualtiredofmanual Member Posts: 338
    I held back a few tears and waved it goodbye yesterday. You hit the price dead on, in fact the selling price was in the upper part of the Retail Rd. range that you gave me.

    I took advantage of the after-Christmas sale at Autotrader and got it listed there. And they let you get more than 5 lines in...

    The new owner is probably showing it off to his wife right now. In Minnesota. Gotta love the internet. Local guys all wanted it for thousands less than asking. Out-of-staters all thought they were getting a great deal at the asking price.

    You're probably going to groan when I tell you that the new one will come with... are you ready... a handshaker. Test drove a Mazda3 the other day and I have to admit that the shifter is about 10 times better than in my Audi. Very, very nice. It's like driving a Honda, except the whole car is fun. Mazda is going to sell a ton of 3's. You heard it here first.

    Thank you for all your help :)
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,733
    that is a pretty interesting assemblage of information. I think that may spur its own thread. I have a hard time believing some of it (Honda is UNDERappreciated? if it were appreciated any more I think the universe would implode! Same goes for Acura. And if Isuzu is OVERappreciated, why don't they sell better and why is their resale in the crapper?) But I digress. Dont' want to get too far into it on this board. Although my Isuzu comment is somewhat on topic. :)

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    I looked at the Mazda 3 and of course the 03 P5 before I bought my Explorer. If it wasn't for wintertime up here I would most certainly have bought a Mazda 3 or a leftover P5. I love how they drive, so crisp shifting. *sigh* Maybe when we move I'll be able to have a neat little car again. Ah well, I'm happy with my Explorer.
  • seekaineseekaine Member Posts: 8
    Looking at a 2000 Mustang GT Gold color 5sp 20000 miles in DC area. What is the trade in value and what would be dealer retail? Also, a 2001 Lincoln LS Dark Gray 5sp 45000 miles only option sport package.
  • mahujamahuja Member Posts: 7
    Terry,

    I am back again in the market, this time buy a conv for sure, won;t chicken out and buy a 4 door car like last time.

    Still stuck on slk230 or a miata, anything within my budget with an open top. Somedays even think about wranglers.

    what are the price ranges for these pretty vehicles. (auction/retail)

    Interested in a 2000-2002 slk230 30 to 40K miles.
    Preferably silver/grey color. Similar deal for mazda as well. Any price ranges to help me shop.
    Location is austin, texas.

    Thanks a million in advance..
  • lancerfixerlancerfixer Member Posts: 1,284
    What can you tell me about

    YV1KS9607W1128859 ?

    Thanks a million.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ...... Hmmm, lets see .. it's got 17 digits, 3 ones 2 eights - it would make a Great poker hand .....!

                   Anything else ..?

                            Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Member Posts: 9,332
    ...... Well I'm glad things worked out, sounds like you did the big money ..

                 Sometimes you can never tell where the buyers might come from .. I had a 01, 17k 740iL, silver, just off lease, the guy had detailed it before it came in ...

               I mean this thing was cleaner than the Board of Health and twice as sanitary , 6 oil changes, the 15k was done, puuuurfect, it sat for 6 weeks and it didn't sell, so 3 days before it was going to the auction some guy called me from Raleigh and he wanted it ...

                The crazy part was: when he was in FL he saw the ad, he had crumpled it up into pair of shorts, the friggin' Dry Cleaner took the ad out when he got home and wanted to know if they should save it for him ~ he had been lookin' for it the whole time ... Ya never know.!

                       I love Dry Cleaners ......

                         Terry :))
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