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any help you can provide would be helpful. My mother owns a 1999 Infiniti I30 sedan in great shape with 54000 miles on it. Bought new from the Infiniti dealer. Runs great, interior and exterior very clean, detailed every year, leather, heated seats, all the goodies. She is thinking about buying a new car (her friends are buying new cars and she wants one).
Any idea on a trade value. Edmunds says approx. $6000 on a trade in, dealer retail at over $8000. I'm thinking that the trade in value is light.
Thanks for your help
John in Dayton
Friend is squabbling with insurance company over this car:
1989 Mercedes 560 SEC AMG, Euro car, 75,000 miles, in California. Looks like a real AMG to me, not a clone.
insurance company says $8,000 bucks. I'm thinkin' all the money could be $12.5K--$15K (it's a nice car), owner thinks $20,000, I think owner is Pollyanna with bells on her shoes.
My impression is that AMG cars, while very expensive when new, depreciate heavily, and also that Euro cars, despite great performance, are a liability in the US.
Opinions anyone?
Even though Ohio allows tax credit on trades, this is vehicle that should easily sell privately and net more money. Suggest you put it on craigslist for 8.
If it was an I30T, I might be interested myself!
Thanks...
Base? Touring? Limited? COlor? Location?
Irrespective... I'll assume it's a Limited in a good color. $6kish is about right, maybe $7k.. but there's not a huge demand for 9 year old I30s.
$19ish.. give or take $500.
In the late 80s/early 90s when these were used cars, grey market was the kiss of death. Nowadays? Sheesh.. it's a huge help. And this is an AMG car to boot! Euro tuner cars are especially hot... there's a handful of mid-80s Alpina B7s and B9s in America, E28 Chassis cars. A decent driver is $20k now, concours cars are up to $30-40k.
In the BMW community, Euro cars frequently bring a huge premium, E28 M5s are a perfect example.. they've gotten very valuable very quickly. I know of a PERFECT 1985 M5 that just sold privately for approx $40,000.
See, now that the enthusiast crowd is getting into these, the prices are skyrocketing. Forget DOT/EPA.. I'd MUCH rather have a Euro 560 with the lights that you can actually see at night with, the engine that actually makes power, the sleek bumpers, etc. Lots of people spend a fortune retrofitting Euro bumpers and lights.. look at the pics of my M5
Will it ever be an investment? No. Buy a TR6.
53,000 miles
Dark green exterior, tan leather.
No Nav
Very nice condition. Single small ding on door.
Regular maintenance. Tires and brakes only 20-30% worn.
No accidents or body work.
This is a nice driver with a lot of life left, I'm just ready for something else.
Still, I think it's a $8500-9k car if it's clean. Also might try $11,900obo in the local autotrader, it's a nice low-mile Luxury car for short money.. might grab someone around 11/11,500.
Nice cars!
RE: AMG cars. I dunno, you can't compare them to the M cars from BMW because the M cars are factory built and the AMGs were just tuner cars back then.
I'm seeing two different animals here....
The trick with old SECs and SELs is that they will bring ALL the money under very limited circumstances, the car has o be absolutely Cherry, low-miles, accompanied by a raft of service records and be a no excuses car.
I've seen very low-mile 91 560SELs break $20k before, but they have to be the right color, and borderline perfect. I could have had a Black/Black 1991 560SEL with about 30k on it for $21,500 which I thought was well worth it, I should have bought it... original paint, at the dealer every 6 months for whatever it needed, original owner.. just a flawless perfect car with NO mechanical needs, no leaks, no problems. Fresh Michelins too.
But that's a needle in the haystack car, most of them are $3-4k beaters. IMO the 560SEL might be the best production Luxury car ever made.
But he says it's an AMG.. does that mean a set of wheels, some aero piece and that hideous steering wheel or does it include the AMG engine and suspension?
And one sale one time doesn't make a market.
As for Alpinas, these cars seem so different to me than stodgy old Benzes that are hot-rodded. I mean, who is really going to fling a 560SEC around the track?
But thank you for these interesting points of view. Makes me want to look for more info to support or contradict my own opinions.
I can't find AMG comparables anywhere for 80s cars.
And yes, I can't decide if I want an Alpina B7 Turbo or a 356B... IMO, the fun factor is pretty close on either!
Agree totally on the typical car, the 126s that are worth big money are VERY rare. Now, how nice was your friend's car?
And, ya know, if he REALLY felt it was worth $20,000 he should have insured it for that. I have my 88 M5 insured for $12,500.. anyne with a classic M car ought to do the same.. look at TMV on an E30 M3, you might laugh as hard as I did! I can just imagine, some clown on a cell phone in a Suburban rear-ends it, totals it and their insurance company calls me up "Hey, great news! We can give you $4,000 for that old BMW!" So they can send it to Copart and sell it for $5,000!
Metro NY area
4WD
60k miles
green with tan leather interior. Sunroof and extra side airbags.
Scratches on hood (wife used shovel to get snow off!!). Small tear in rear bumper.
Interior is perfect.
Want to trade it on a Tundra or Siverado
2025 Toyota Crown Signia Hybrid, 2022 Ram 2500 Laramie 6.4 Hemi, 2007 Mazda MX-5 Miata PRHT
Location: Southern Delaware/the beach
Year/Make/Model: 2004 Chevrolet Suburban 1500 LS 2wd
Body Style: 4-door full-size SUV
Engine: 5.3L Flex Fuel V8, 4-speed automatic
Driveline: RWD
Mileage: 50,000
Color: Summite White w/ 2-tone Gray cloth
Major Options: Front buckets, 6-CD 9-speaker BOSE, locking differential, OWL tires, full roof rack, rear net & cargo cover, liftgate/liftglass, steering wheel audio controls, power pedals, and Homelink.
Condition:
-Outside: Washed weekly and fully detailed every few weeks. Paint, ALL trim, wheels, and glass indistinguishable from new except for some pinpoint hood face chips. Original tires still have about half tread and brakes far more than half.
-Inside: Again, immaculate, with the OEM floor mats covered with custom rubber mats immediately, clean and unworn seats and no faded or broken pieces--only flaw being paint flaked off the radio power button.
-Mechanical: Oil changed every 3k, chassis lubed every few times, and tires continually rotated. Everything works and sounds just like when new, with no issues.
Other: Never any damage or repairs, and no dings or scratches.
Considering trading for a GMC Acadia or Saturn Outlook (still looking), and trying to get a better price idea. With the '02 Avalanche we had before, we got the Edmunds used vale DEAD on immediately, and here it's $16,550...so wondering REAL-WORLD.
2004 Chevrolet Malibu Maxx LS 1SB
5 Door/Hatchback
3.5L V6
FWD
27600 Miles
1SB package includes side airbags, rear audio controls
Blue exterior, neutral interior
Clean, couple minor surface scratch on the outside, no dents, etc
Tires at about 50%, New pads, no damage
Other one, for my parents who are also looking to trade
2004 Subaru Forester 2.5X
32500 Miles
2.5 4 cyl
AWD/Automatic
Red/Beige interior
No options
Little weltish ding on the outside, not particulary noticeable on the upper pax door-maybe quarter sized
Absolutely immaculate inside
Been babied, washed, great maintenence, tires and brakes still good.
Usually that's a $17,500+++ or so unit... but... green isn't much of a help, hood needs paint, rear bumper needs work.. I am not looking at it myself, but my gut is around $16/16,500 maybe a tad more.
But you forgot to tell me what CDs you have in your glovebox.. shame on you!
The only real Caveat I have, is that this is a 2WD in an area where fluffy white stuff can fall from the sky... that can hurt it.
I'm gonna peg it around $13k where you are.. might try $15,900/obo on Craigsautotraderlistnewspapercars.com
Immaculate original owner cars are always an easy sell.. also, you ever get down to the Carolinas or south? Reason i ask this, one of my neighbors moved up to here New Jersey from SC and had a 2WD Navigator he wanted to trade once.. ended up trading it down there and got an extra $1700 for it... something to consider.
Just kidding!
The Malibu is $9k trade and you can try $10,900/bo in the usual places.. shoot to take in the mid 10s for it, real money.
Subaru should do in the $11,500 neighborhood, $13,900/bo in the local paper/white house bulletin board, etc.
hope this helps!
Even on the Euro spec cars.
Does your friend have the AMG specs for that car?
Personally, I think it's a $10-12 grand car.
Unfortunately for me, I don't have to just imagine it, because that happened to me a few years ago with my '88 low-mileage (50-60K) M6. Then I pulled into a gas station to call the cops, & then the Idiot in a Jeep pulled in & started laughing with the gas station guys after rear-ending my car.
And it just got worse from there--I waited 4-5 mo. to get it into a great body shop, then 8 mo. for them to fix it, waiting on a bumper from Germany, etc. etc. My ins. co., State Farm, was great, paying for over $10K in body work, but honestly, it should have just been totaled.
Because after all the grief, waiting, sweating, driving crappy rental cars, it was again a great looking M6, but with major repaired body damage. And later I wound up selling it for around what the ins. co. would have paid for a total, maybe $11K-ish I think.
But if I hadn't had good insurance, it could have been a lot worse. I guess.....
It does snow, SOMETIMES, usually no more than 2" max a year, and usually just once--we are right on the bay and minutes from the beach, after all. Back when we were looking for an Avalanche, only one dealer had 2wd's, and they had (4)--we bought one of those. Then with the Suburban, no one locally had any, so it had to be located and came from the Virginia Beach area. From what I've seen over the years, as far as 2wd's, you don't find them as common until you hit the VA beach line, and then BAM--everywhere, and often even more than 4wd's. Yet, we have identical weather here.
More and more, local dealers are finally actually starting to stock a 2wd unit 1 or 2 at a time, but still 4wd's that never get used--for weather or off-road--prevail.
Good info, though. With our Avalanche, I had just freshly (as it pretty much always was) cleaned it, and had paper covering the cleaned mats, and the two salesman that appraised it were just enamored--a big reason, I think, why they came back with a top Edmunds trade number on the first try.
Now it's just to see if the Queen Mother REALLY likes a new Acadia or Outlook enough to give the big white barge up, when she drives one.
But you are correct. Most cars advertised as "AMG" in the 1980s range are fakes.
My reasoning was that if a cherry STOCK 560SEC can be worth $12.5K as "all the money", then a real AMG version should be worth more. But maybe that's just wrong?
I think buyers are hesitant about Euro spec cars, even if they've been converted.
The problem with this AMG is that the front bumper was damaged and no replacement part is available. So you'd have to MAKE a new front bumper. You can guess what THAT costs. Insurance company doesn't want to touch it, they want to total the car.
So, as usual--TOTALLY spot on. Wife kind of has the bug (uh oh...I wish there was an antidote for new car disease), so I took ours (Chevy) down to CarMax today.
They offered $9500. Figure $9 for a "normal" dealer then. Actually held value better than I would have thought. We paid $16997 for it new...I'll take 55% in 3 years for a GM product. Too bad its not paid off!
The Subaru for the 'rents--CarMax offered $11.5, Fitzgerald $11.3--Fitz reported it as $12.2 KBB but $11.35 at auction and Grey Book.
I'll leave it up to them on what they want to do--personally I wouldn't trade theirs unless it was a 2.5x with the premium package.
For us...well, we probably can't afford it, but now we're looking for more space...looked at a few things, lets just say the CX-9 is something to aspire to.
Other specs:
FWD
1.8L Turbo engine
43k miles
5-spd Auto (Tiptronic)
Interior: Leather (with woodgrain trim), in immaculate shape
Moonroof
Monsoon audio
Steering wheel-mounted audio and cruise controls
Exterior: silver-blue color; a few chips on the rear bumper, plus a dent in the plastic on the lower bumper.
Tires are good (2 new at 35k)
Alloys with minor scrapes on the rears from curb contact.
Any thoughts on the value? I see these private-party retail for $15-16, and dealer sales up to $18,500. I'm looking at another VW so hope to deal with one dealership. How does that work with a trade-in that's not paid off?
Thanks!
There's an "Alpina" Euro 635csi on eBay right now... it's not a real one. It's a Euro 635 with Alpina open-Lug wheels (Which, to be fair, are worth about $1200) an Alpina Steering wheel ($300) and I think an Alpina chin spoiler.
Of course it has a dogleg gearbox, they all did, mine (1980 635csi) has one too.
It doesn't have a Stroker or turbo motor, it doesn't have Alpina suspension, it doesn't have Alpina upholstery, it doesn't have the plaque or VIN of a real Alpina... still, it's past $6500 last I recall.
Does she have any documentation on the car? If it has a real AMG engine... then it's worth saving. Also, those front bumpers are stock bumpers with a lip molded into the bottom of them, I'm sure it's not that huge to have one sorted out.
What are you doing buying brand new anyways? If budget is a concern, why not look at something that's maybe a year or two old? Talked a friend of mine into a Caddy SRX (WONDERFUL Vehicle BTW.. absolutely fantastic) and then convinced him to go used.
He snagged an '06 Black/Black V8 AWD with about every last option you can think of, think it even had a microwave oven and a Jacuzzi with 15k on it.. hard to tell it from new, got it for $36,500 with the original $60k or so sticker still in the glovebox. Even assuming you get $7500 off a new one, that's $16,000 in savings... for a year. More for 2 years.
You can pick up an '05 SRX V6 in the $23-24k range, and you're....
a) Driving a Cadillac.
b) Driving what's about the best Luxury Soft-Roader on the market. Only the newest MDX beats it.. it got rated higher than the New X5.. by Car and Driver no less.
c) Laughing at the guy with the new CX9 who paid $10,000 more and is sitting on cloth.
That's what I would do if I were you.... don't see how you can beat it for the money.
Check AutoTrader.. some dealer in Easton, MD has a CPO 05 V6 SRX with 35k on it for $23,995
I don't agree with $12,500 with the miles.. 11,500-12k.. KBB is high but not too terrible here.
Considered a private sale? Ask $15,000ish and look to actually get in the 14s?
I need a small travel scooter and it doesn't quite fit in the truck so we assumed we could trade it in and add some $ to buy a bigger used car.
2005 white 4 door Hyundai Accent sedan. Air, power windows/mirrors, auto trans, CD. exceptional condition, located in NJ (driven in rural PA/NJ). It has 3,400 miles - mom was in her late seventies and drove it very locally.
So off I go with my scooter to the nearest Hyundai dealer yesterday, who said it was worth 3k trade-in. He then "liked us so much" he upped it to 4.5k.
Is this the real world trade-in value here in North Jersey? Would it be worse if we wait? :confuse:
But we looked at an '07 Pacifica Touring AWD with all the option packages that stickered at $35k which is going for around $28...if you try finding a used one with all those toys, you're still looking at low 22-23, and you're getting a far inferior powertrain/transmission combo. And, of course, say 25k miles which is a couple years for my wife. Is it worth it to save $5k? Maybe to some people, but not me.
I watch my coworkers go buy 1-3 year old Accords and Camrys for maybe $500-$1k less than what you could get a new one for--but they don't even shop it because they assume new costs a lot more. And that's not even factoring it the better financing. And I'm not even talking about the fools (no offense to anyone out there) who buy at the massive CarMax down the street...
So I guess it just depends on the situation.
As for the SRX--totally sweet ride, but I'm just not going down that path again--I'm one of those suckers who kept getting drawn into the GM stable by what looked like good vehicles (my Intrigue, for instance) and solid reviews...only to watch them fall apart at an alarming rate. Over and over and over and over. I'm done. Not to mention the company treated me like crap and kept putting faulty parts on my car until it was out of warranty when it wasn't their problem anymore.
I'm telling you--when I bought my Camry Hybrid last year, I felt like I was an abused spouse who finally broke it off with the dude that was beating her up.
My wife liked the Pacifica, sure, but even that...I think I'll pass. I know any car can be a :lemon: but...I'm going to do whatever I can to improve my chances.
Am I right that the dealer would apply whatever trade-in value we settle on toward the price of the car?
Wow! $4,500!!! how generous of them! (That's a free scooter and $4,500 cash back, right?)
$4,500 is what it's worth as a trade, if you swap the 3 and the 4 and add a zero to the odometer.
But then again, what's a scooter store going to do with a Hyundai?
Car's worth $2k more than that, easily. Dunno where you're located in our great state, but ifn it were me I'd do one of the following...
1) Trade it in and get the $6,500-7k that you SHOULD get for it... truth be told, the right buyer could throw $7,500 at this car and be safe. Failing that, start shopping it to Hyundai dealers.. tell em it's like new, no paintwork, no scratches, flawless and has 3,400 miles. Nobody will hard commit to a # over the phone, but start calling and asking to speak with the used car manager.
2) Throw it in the paper.. autotrader.com, etc...
"2005 Hyundai Accent Sedan. 1 elderly owner, White with whatever interior, only 3,400 miles, automatic, power windows, locks, cd, flawless condition, cannot be told from new. Selling due to bereavement, $10,900/best offer. Call oldinjersey at 201-123-4567"
And grab $10k or better for it.
Do a quick scan on Autotrader.com, you'll find em, with 10-20k miles or more priced at $10,900.. with your miles someone will buy it quick...
Keep me posted how ya make out...
Bill
Some cars you just don't buy used.... I can remember watching 2 year old M3s bring within $2-3k of original invoice at auction, so yeah, that's silly.
Now, read back a bit.. there's some cars that if you buy new you will get yelled at for doing so. Pacifica is a great example.. trade it in in 2 years with around 20k on it and lose big.. right now if you had an 05 Touring with, say, 20k on it you'd be in the 15-16k range.. that's a fair amount.
You might want to seriously reconsider that SRX.. I have an 06 STS, which is same bat engine, same bat platform, same bat electrical system, etc.. and it's flawless. I have been Mr Eurocar for years.. been on these boards for about 8 years now and people were shocked when I got the STS. But I LOVE it and it won't be my last caddy. And I never wanted to actually shell out for one before. I'm mr Hyper-Critical of Detroit, but they are finally getting their act together. "Hey look, we build good cars and all of a sudden they sell! Wow!"
At LEAST Drive one... it's a FAR better vehicle than anything else you're looking at. And get a certified one, you're gonna trade in 2-3 years regardless so you'll have warranty.
Ya forget that the single biggest consumer expense is generally new car depreciation. I leased my car because I can write it off, otherwise I'd have bought used.
I dislike kbb.com for a good reason, they don't really help anyone.. dealer has to battle to do a deal, customer gets upset.. its no fun.
And yes, the dealer will apply trade equity to the new car sale price. If payoff is $10k and trade value is $12k, you have $2k positive equity. If Trade is $5,000 and payoff is $7k, you have $2k negative equity. If you have negative equity. In cali tho that neg equity of roughly $1k in your case will be negated by the $800-900ish tax savings.. which si worth considering.
Even the special editions. They did one every single year. Add them all up and there are probably 5000 or more special edition models, too.
So don't hold your breath waiting for them to gain significantly in value.
I have a 93 C package. It does only lose very little value each year. I got it with 26k miles when it was 8 years old for $7800, book was around $11k+.
Look for a deal like that. Several years later I could probably get $4-5k back for it, costing me next to nothing.
I think a 99 for over $10 grand is suicidally high. The hard top does add maybe $800 to the value. But that price sounds way high to me. I've seen 2006s dip to around $16k. There's no way I'd even consider a 99 in the same ballpark price range.
I know its a bad word around here, but Consumer Report's reliability ratings of the SRX are pretty bad, so that would be a concern. I'm the kind of guy that subscribes to C&D and MT, as well as CR so I do look at more than one source for things, but with a young family, reliability means more now than it did.
I know there are whole discussions on edmunds related to it, but real quick since you're such a great source--what do you think of leasing, in general? It looks like you'd advocate buying used instead, but I'm kind of peering into the leasing option for the first time and I'm struck by the wide variances in deals out there--its an odd situation where according to what I'm seeing, you can lease an Acura TL (not that I would) for less than say a Veracruz, even though you couldn't purchase one for less...
Leasing wouldn't work for me (I drive 25k a year), but for my wife, who would be the daily driver of whatever crossoverish vehicle we ended up with, maybe it would...
Sport Package
Premium Package
Rear Climate Package
Premium Audio w/ DSP
Xenon Headlights
49k miles
Regularly maintained. Beautiful except for a small ding and minor scuffs. Probably due for 3 new tires
Going minivan!
If she's looking to trade every 3 years or so, doesn't drive a lot.. then yeah, leasing can be a great way to go. I know Mazda has a great program on the CX9 at the moment.
Let's face it, ya buy it and trade it every 3 years.. what's the difference anyways? (Other than paying all the taxes and having the unknown of resale value).
The factors that come into play on leasing are way different than buying... market conditions, resale value, etc.
Assuming it isn't a weak one... you ought to be in the mid-high 19s maybe a smidge more but that oughta kill it.
Now, it better not be gold or green or burgundy....
I believe that when it applies to cars, that color is appropriately spelled "burgandy".
More than half the time, that's how I see it spelled ;->
-Mathias
As bland as it's possible to order.
You're golden.
Any color anyone actually likes is poison when it comes time to sell.
Go figure.
I live in the land of white vehicles (given the hellish climate -- Phoenix), yet many drive black. Makes no sense, but the people who drive them certainly enjoy. . .what?
Not being bland would be my put.