Toyota Prius (First Generation)

1…457910…29

Comments

  • wmhpowellwmhpowell Member Posts: 15
    Thanks for the enlightenment Cliffy!
    I was lead to believe, by someone I suspect "might know" that "woe" is the dealer caught (complaints??) gouging on Prius.

    Meantime my local dealer is selling MR2 at MSRP with mandantory LoJack and Appearance package - or - you can order one at MSRP and wait.

    One question I couldn't get a clear answer on
    - Is there such a thing? :-) -
    Does the purchaser have the "right" to "move" their Web ordered Prius to another dealer (delivery agent?)?

    I have read (on one of the groups or mailing lists I read) that someone reported settling on slightly (not much,...) under MSRP for a Prius.
    Strange - as you said - there isn't a lot there and it's long in coming.

    Thanks again!
    Bill Powell
  • theboothsdadtheboothsdad Member Posts: 3
    Cliffy, there is no need to delay entry of an online purchase request. If a customer chooses 'visit dealer' instead of telephone or email contact, he or she is not required to choose a dealer immediately.

    Also, I think the $1100 figure may be a little understated. According to Edmund's, invoice is $18534 or $1461 under MSRP, plus dealers are credited with a holdback of 2% of base invoice, or $370.68. A dealer selling at MSRP can make $100 on the overpriced CD deck and $27 on the floor mats. All of this totals $1958.68 minus the advertising charge (which is how much???). Not to mention that Prius sales this year may count toward increased Prius allocations next year, if they switch to an allocation system. Further, dealers incur virtually no cost until the car comes in, while earning interest on the deposit.

    It would seem that it would be in any dealer's best interest to discount a little (if only by selling the accessories at cost, but preferably by also knocking something off the base MSRP) to increase sales. $600 each on ten cars would be better than $1100 each on five cars.
  • theboothsdadtheboothsdad Member Posts: 3
    I made an error on the closing time of Toyota's manual order center. It closes at 4:30 PM PT.

    Sorry.

    theboothsdad
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    The $1100 figure is accurate in the Central Atlantic region where the advertising charge is about $380. Yes, we do get the holdback but very few salesmen have a pay plan that pays them on this. The $1100 is the "gross profit" which is not to be confused with net profit which includes the holdback but also take all variable dealer expenses into account such as my commission, salaries, taxes, advertising expenses and such.

    The advertising charge is levied at the regional level and it is less in some parts of the country and more in others.

    Right now, we have 9 outstanding orders and have delivered 7 or 8 to date. Our latest orders indicate a 3 to 4 month wait time and until that drops substantially, I don't anticipate dropping below MSRP.
  • dupiedupie Member Posts: 22
    Thank you for the great response to my question about the battery located in the left rear wheel well.I have followed your answers to many a question at this Town Hall Talk and find you very informative in the workings of the Prius.
    dupie
  • shomrighausen1shomrighausen1 Member Posts: 3
    I noticed in a poll for mileage on eGroups that there are two 'groups', one group that gets mid-40s, and another group that gets 55+ MPG. I remember reading somewhere that there are two electrical systems in the Prius (two separate electrical service manuals). Could this be the cause for the difference? Is it highway driving vs. city driving? Are some people 'just lucky'?

    Another thing that I wonder is if anyone knows about the expansion ratio for the bladder in the gas tank. The manual says something about 14 degrees F causing a 1.3 gallon reduction in the tank. Does anyone know what temperature it is 'full-sized'?

    Is everyone using the computer when reporting the mileage, or are some people using the fill-n-spill method?

    I have a 120 mile round-trip commute, mostly highway (105 miles or so). According to the computer, I'm getting ~46 MPG. I drive with a 'light' foot, and stay within a couple of MPH of the 65MPH speed limit.

    Just wondered what the 'real' story was with everyone's mileage. I would love to be in the 55+ MPG range, but know that it's probably impossible with my drive.
  • stevens4stevens4 Member Posts: 10
    I've now driven my new Prius over 1,000 miles in southwestern Michigan and recently celebrated by getting a second tank of gas (8.3 gallons) for a total of 18.4 gallons of 87 octane gas purchased since getting the car in August. I went to the same gas station with nearly the same outside temperature as the first fill up. The combined city/highway fuel economy for the first 1,000 miles is 54 mpg. Readings to determine the mpg are from the odometer & gas pump at the time of fill up. I used to get 230-270 miles on 18 gallons in the V-8 SUV. The Prius is delivering over 3 times greater distance on the same amount of fuel. In city driving it's over 4 times greater fuel economy.
  • davidfsdavidfs Member Posts: 12
    I have over 2000 miles on my Prius and have experienced a similar mileage confusion. The computer is constantly telling me I average 60 mpg between 475 mile fill ups. However, the fill n spill method is telling me I am getting 43mpg. I do quite a bit of highway miles and city miles.

    Also is it just me or is anyone else here experiencing the following: My LCD screen display is CONSTANTLY freezing up where it stops showing where the power is going. At the same time the outside temperature reading dissapears. It is really frustrating.

    Otherwise I am still in love with this car.
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    I will be on vacation for the next week and a half. I may be checking in from time to time but I don't know how often. I don't want any of you to think I am ignoring your questions.

    See ya'll when I get back on the 26th.
  • eorreorr Member Posts: 1
    My husband and I are seriously considering purchasing a Prius but there are a couple things holding us back. Maybe those of you who own one can help. 1) We are concerned about power, whether or not you can accelerate in a quick spurt to avoid accidents or to pass on the highway. 2) We are concerned about the limited trunk space. 3) Is it easy to find mechanics who know how to service it? Are parts and labor more expensive since so few are sold? 4) Finally, my husband would like to feel a bit higher off the ground than he does in most sedans. Do the seat adjustments and height of the car give you some height?
    Thanks for any responses.
    eorr
  • wmhpowellwmhpowell Member Posts: 15
    Hi!

    I STRONGLU urge you to take an extended test drive in a Prius. If your local dealer has two TRAC Prius', they should be willing to "rent" one for a few days.
    1-(Acceleration) From my test drive experiences (waiting for my Prius to show up) and the comments of owners - it has very good pickup in the 30/40 to highway speed range.
    2-(Trunk) Well - an SUV it isn't but consider trunk space in other cars off it's class. Also consider that there IS a max weight limit.
    3-(Service) In the us, at least, Prius is 3/36 ALL INCLUSIVE so there is NOTHING to worry about for the first 3/36. I STRONGLY urge you to spend time on the Prius site: http://prius.toyota.com
    4-(Height) That was mu biggest surprise: it "feels" like sitting in a mini-van. Refer to answer 1; there's NO substitute for putting miles in it.
    Bill Powell
  • andrews15andrews15 Member Posts: 2
    Do you have any idea of a price for an extended warrenty on a prius?
  • ontariocapriusontariocaprius Member Posts: 16
    I was originally tole the Canadian 6yr/160,000km warranty was 1299.00 + tax. They were pricing it at a Corolla level because they had been given NO info on PRIUS pricing. They told me that once Toyota determines the price (and it was expected to be higher than this) we wouldn't be able to get the lower price.

    I even had the dealer write this info on the purchase agreement.

    Later they called me back to say they made a mistake and the pricing was 1699.00 (Pricing should have been based on a Camry V6?). I told them since ext warranties are negotiable, we need to do so since THEY had made the mistake. They agreed to 1599.00 + tax. Since this was their only mistake at that point and the sales had been EXCELLENT, we took it.

    The ECP also included the first 3 oil changes.

    The only problem we have had is the date they have on their books. For some reason the dealer registered it July 28 so it expires July 28, 2006. I have tried unsuccessfully thus far to get this corrected. Somewhat of a beauracratic run-around!

    We don't have a clue how they got July 28 since we did the purchase agreement July 28 but the ECP wasn't included, other than the pricing comment. We took possession of the car Aug 3 and I have 'explained' to a number of Toyota folks that 'logically' a warranty shouldn't begin until the car has been paid for, ownership registered, and taken possession of.

    We didn't do any of that until Aug 3. Even the registration date on the ECP is listed as Aug 3 which is when we paid for and signed the documents!
  • texterratexterra Member Posts: 1
    Have read all of these responses. Have test drove the Prius 10 miles. I want this vehicle but do not want to be forced into a nonrefundable deposit. What are my options can I order from another dealer.? The dealer never mentioned a deposit to me and said if I ordered tomorrow the Prius will be in 4-6 weeks. Does this sound accurate for the current date? Thanks.
  • bbrazybbrazy Member Posts: 5
    I took a short test-drive a few weeks ago, and merged onto Interstate 880 at the beginning of rush-hour traffic. The acceleration was terrific, especially as "normal traffic flow" is 65mph-70mph including tractor-trailers, and the car handles well even though I'm used to my '90 Corolla. My commute is only 15 miles but involves 2 freeways.

    The real downside is the braking power, which is not as good as my Corolla. Will this be improved in 2002 model? Is there a way to give Toyota feedback that will be listened to? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, and thus subject to heavy traffic.

    Incidentally, California requires that something like 3% of all cars sold be alternative energy by 2003. I may be off on the year and exact percentage, but there is a big incentive for Toyota to sell this car.
  • shomrighausen1shomrighausen1 Member Posts: 3
    The brakes feel different because of the regeneration. I've noticed that seem a little light at highway speeds. In-town speeds are another story - you can stop in a hurry! I remember reading somewhere that the 60-0 distance is 137 feet. It might take longer than some cars from 60-45, but I don't know that there are to many cars out there that could out brake one of these. Just my $.02 worth.
  • miltkomiltko Member Posts: 15
    The previous reference to www.howstuffworks.com with a search into Prius, (I lost the direct page) has a marvelous automated gif (www.howstuffworks.com/gif/hybrid-car-gear.gif) that illustrates how the continuously variable transmission operates with the motor/engine and generator. The transmission variable speed is to match the nearly constant speed engine to the current motor speed, while integrating the generator as a motor starter (?). Since the diagram shows the motor driving only the drive ssahft and the generator, up to a speed of 15 mph (before the engine starts) are the generator field coils keep open? I don't see how using the motor on battery power can efficiently power the generator to put a recharge to the battery. That's running around in circles.

    Also, switching subjects to the independent 12v battery, if one inadvertently leaves your car interior lights on over an extended period and the 12v battery discharges, you can still move the car of the main battery but won't get lights until until the car hits 15mph and the engine/alternator starts.

    This car is technically very interesting.

    Milt
  • rvsteelervsteele Member Posts: 1
    Test drove Prius yesterday. We found the car quite interesting! Questions for drivers: 1. While driving an uphill grade at about 65 mph, the motor could not seem to make up its mind as to where the RPM wanted to be. Has anyone experienced this behavior and do you know the cause? 2. How do you feel about Prius acceleration? 3. Low resistance tire availability and cost. And finally, battery replacement cost.
  • sciencemvsciencemv Member Posts: 2
    Hello to all the wonderful informants,

    I test drove the Prius but have not ordered one. Will order one soon. Living in the Northeast, could I buy one from Canada and get the options not offered here in the U.S.? IF so what dealer is suggested.Closest Canadian city, Montreal. Thanks.
  • shep5shep5 Member Posts: 2
    I just checked the Cal DMV website. Hybred cars are specifically excluded from receiving the decals to travel in the HOV lane with one person. (unless they also use an alternative clean fuel such as compressed natural gas) I;m waiting for my Prius which is not due till next January.
  • wmhpowellwmhpowell Member Posts: 15
    >miltko said
    >Also, switching subjects... 12v battery...
    As I understand it - All of the ECUs and the THS control circuitry run from power supplied by the 12V battery - solid-state electronics not being especially fond of 288V. :-)
    If the puters don't work - the car won't start.
    There are specific steps in the owner's manual, as well as in the FAQ?? that describe how to "jump start" a "flat" 12V battery. This lets the ECUs run and, in turn, lets the 288V battery pack start the engine.
    NOTE - if the 288V traction battery pack goes completely(??) dead - you have to tow/flatbed it to the dealer. How dead is DEAD? Don't know. Any volunteers? :-)
    Bill Powell
  • ontariocapriusontariocaprius Member Posts: 16
    The dealer said if the battery was completely discharged it goes to the recycle bin. He added that Toyota had told them to replace it for customers if this happens FOR NOW! They mentioned this in conjunction with the warning not to run the car in N for extended times as this was the way it could be completely discharged.


    Take it for what it's worth because they also told me it had an electric heater so instant heat in the Winter.

    After my PS experience I realize it is important to talk to the right person but even that person could be wrong.
  • bbrazybbrazy Member Posts: 5
    Thanks for the input. By braking I mean how the car feels at highway and in-town - it does brake, but the way a heavier car feels. I could get used to it, sure, but this is a safety issue for me, especially because I have a small child. Although I drive defensively, we have a lot of traffic and impatient drivers. Can the braking power be boosted?

    As for a new car, my choice is between a Prius or a one-year-old Camry. Guess I should test-drive a Camry, too.
  • dianne4toyotadianne4toyota Member Posts: 343
    where do you live? around here, Prius at $20450 is MORE than the average loaded LE Camry.

    Dianne
    dianne@earthlink.net
  • agtabbyagtabby Member Posts: 28
    Toyota loses a ton of money on each one they sell, this is a new technology and is spread over few cars.

    Yes the camry is a much better car for about the same money, the only advantage is the the prius will save you about 3 - 400 bucks a year in gas. The real appeal of the prius is that it is "cool" that is different, and some people don't mind paying extra for perceived eco benefits.

    So don't compare the prius to the camry, it is not intended to compete in the practical transportation category. It is intended to give Toyota good publicity, to help Toyota gain experience with the new technology, and to provide a few people with "cool" cars. Nothing wrong with that, geeze, some people pay 50,000 for a car just because it goes fast.

    Andrew

    Andrew
  • andrews15andrews15 Member Posts: 2
    I have two questions; #1. I was trying to find out how much a battery would cost after the 8 year warranty runs out. The salesman at the Toyota dealership didn't know, only that it was expensive. How expensive is expensive, does anyone know?
    My second question; Does anyone know how a Prius would stand up to a Minnesota winter. This is the first year that the car has been out in the US, and Japan doesn't have as harsh of winters as the upper midwest, and Canada. If anyone has any idea how the Prius handles our winters please let me know. Thanks!
  • dupiedupie Member Posts: 22
    Your cost for a battery replacement is, are you sitting down? $ 5,000.00 I also am considering a Prius and live in Minnesota, "E" mail me at:
    ddvet61@aol.com
  • dupiedupie Member Posts: 22
    Has any one priced out other replacement parts for the Prius? If the battery is $5,000.00 I can't
    think of what the electric motor must cost, or a set of sun gears for the transmission, tires were mentioned in a article about the Prius in Motor Trend, QUOTE don't blow a tire because there are no replacements in the USA.
    Are dealers stocking any replacement parts for this car? Any idea how long a person would have to wait for a radiator to be shipped from Japan?
    Even a small fender bender may cause radiator damage.
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    Most dealerships will offer a refundable deposit. If yours does not, find another dealership. This is too big an investment to risk things but you should be pretty committed to the car before you spend your salesman's time to order a car.

    If your dealership thinks delivery time is 4 to 6 weeks, they have not ordered many of these. The current delivery time is 3 to 4 months for orders placed now. You will get an e-mail from Toyota after your order is confirmed by your selected dealership.
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    Right now, the battery would run about $4000. As more of these are built and the supplier is able to recover development costs, the price will drop. I am guessing that within 4 years, the cost should be under $1000. This is only a guess but an educated one.

    BTW, vacation is great. I'll be back to work on the 26th.
  • stevens4stevens4 Member Posts: 10
    My new Prius has just reached 1,500 miles and a third fill up (10.4 gallons after driving 505 miles), for a combined city/highway average of 52 MPG for 1,500 miles (28.8 gallons purchased since August). The quiet ride quality, superb handling and performance continue to amaze. Getting lots of favorable comments from people here in southwest Michigan. The Prius is saving us over $1,500 a year in fuel costs when compared to the former V8-SUV, and delivering greater performance, 58-65 mpg in the city, upper 40s on the highway.
  • abbanatabbanat Member Posts: 57
    We recently had a Toyota technical trainer come and give us a presentation and Q & A and the topic of battery replacement costs came up. Here's the deal: Yes, they are expensive to replace. Yes the price will come down. The battery is warranted for 8 years or 100,000 miles. In the event the batteries die, the whole pack does not need to be replaced. It is more than likely that only one module of the battery will be replaced at a time, so the cost will be much lower. They've had these on the road in Japan for 3 years now without any battery failures. The 8 year battery warranty should alleviate fears of potential consumers. They are without a doubt, the most technology per dollar you can buy, right now. Finally, electric motors are extremely reliable and would not likely need to be replaced within the vehicles lifetime.

    -Brian
  • ybronybron Member Posts: 2
    I read earlier (in another forum, I guess, because I can't find it now) that somebody had to get their Prius towed to the dealer for "a charge" upon their return from vacation. Somebody else here (whmpowell) mentioned that if it ran down completely, it would have to be replaced.

    Where is the fine line between re-chargeable and completely dead? And how long would the Prius have to sit unused for the battery to discharge so completely? Perhaps the first poster was referring to the 12V system (required to start the car).

    Also, is there a "standard" Prius FAQ somewhere, and if so, where? :)

    TIA

    -/\/ (Eagerly awaiting the arrival with manual in hand)
  • dupiedupie Member Posts: 22
    (wmpowell) In an article in Motor Trend the person
    doing the test driving stated. When driving at high speeds for an extended period of time the (turtle light) came on, when the light came on he slowed the car down to about 70 MPH. He said it took about 10 minutes for the light to go out.
    He further commented that at very high speeds the generator is not working to charge the battery,
    therefore at extended high speeds drains the battery, and does not permit the generator to charge the battery pack. Mr. Powell what is your comment to this statement made by the reporter covering this story? I want to buy a Prius but being retired and on a fixed income I can not afford high maintenance costs after the 3 year warranty period. My wife and I usually keep a car for 10 years before trading. I have followed your interest in the Prius for the past 2 months and we are still debating about a purchase, yes we have driven the car from the local dealership for an extended period of more then 2 hours and we love hoe the car rides, drives and the overall performances.Thank You
  • wmhpowellwmhpowell Member Posts: 15
    Hi!
    >... mentioned that if it ran down completely,
    >... it would have to be replaced.
    Nope - not replaced but RECHARGED - and ONLY dealers can do that RIGHT NOW.
    However, discharge the 288V battery pack often enough and you are setting yourself up for a possible replacement scenario.
    Bill POwell
  • wmhpowellwmhpowell Member Posts: 15
    Dupie,
    Please re-read the article - the author was driving a Japanese Prius (only 58? HP, smaller motor & generator - different gearing, COMPLETELY different programming...), at _ILLEGAL_ speeds ("...slowed the car DOWN to about 70 MPH..."), for an extended distance.
    Given the 8 year, 100K warranty on the electronics as well as "traditional" Toyota longevity - I'd guess it's life-cycle is going to be a lot like the Corolla.
    Or
    I could be wrong...
    But - whatever the case, I'm planning to keep my Prius at least 3 year.
    Bill Powell
  • dupiedupie Member Posts: 22
    Thank you for your response to my concerns about the battery discharge in the news article.
    This old retired guy and wife don't drive anywhere near the speeds mentioned in the Prius article.
  • jay1000oaksjay1000oaks Member Posts: 2
    Did anyone get a factory installed CD with their Prius? Did you also get a cassette player or did the CD just replace it? Anyone get a multi-disk CD player installed? Where did it get installed?
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    The Cd player does not replace the cassette. It is in addition and is mounted in the cubby hole beneath the main unit. I have not seen a changer yet but on our other cars, a 6 disc changer will fit in the same space as the single unit.
  • fnguyenfnguyen Member Posts: 5
    When driving at high speeds (ie. >70mph) with other accessories (AC, etc.) on, the battery should be in a discharging mode. All of the available gas engine energy is used toward propelling the car, not to the charging of battery!

    It is important to note, as many others had pointed out, that the Prius is targeted toward CITY DRIVING. That's where its features are most valued for. It is not built for long distance travelling, nor for hwy racing.

    I don't think people really understand this, because some folks are asking for a cruise control. Cruise control is for vehicles that are designed for cruising, which is not what the Prius was designed for.

    So if you want a muscle car, get a 300M or a BMW M5 or a Porche...

    Again, Prius is meant for people who live in metropolitans. It's meant for stop-and-go trafics.

    Cheers!
  • stevens4stevens4 Member Posts: 10
    I've driven my Prius across southwestern Michigan on the freeway at 70 mph with no loss in battery power or capacity. Last year Toyota brought the Japanese version of the Prius to the U.S. for evaluation. Following the evaluations Toyota increased the engine(s) power to overcome long distance travel limitations. I'm getting between 58-65 mpg in the city, upper 40s to low 50s on the highway. There hasn't been any battery power loss on the long distance cross country freeway drives. After 1,700 miles we're getting a combined highway/city average of 52 mpg, traveling twice as far on 1/4 as much gas as the former V8-SUV, and saving over $1,500. a year in fuel costs.
  • chanuschakchanuschak Member Posts: 4
    clive@priusenvy.com
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    Thanks for posting the story. With the exception of the fact that your salesman should have known what to do before you called, that is exactly how the process should always work. I've delivered 5 of these cars so far and have 3 more ordered. The dealership has 15 more on order and they all work like clockwork.
  • chanuschakchanuschak Member Posts: 4
    On p28 of the owner's manual, it says "Power windows--Key off operation: If both front doors are closed, they work for 45 seconds even after the ignition switch is turned off. They stop working when either front door is opened."

    On my Prius, the windows stop working immediately after turning off the ignition, even if the doors are still closed. Is this working as designed, or is the manual incorrect?
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    Good question. I know the "power retain feature" works on all our other cars but I have not tried it in the Prius.
  • tgranttgrant Member Posts: 1
    My wife and I are thinking about the Prius. We are
    concerned that the acceleration may not be adequate
    for freeway merging. Are there any specs for
    0-60MPH? Would it be less than 10 seconds? For
    those who drive on the freeway, can it go 70 miles
    holding the speed of 65MPH? Are hills a major
    problem?
  • stevens4stevens4 Member Posts: 10
    Today we drove 240 miles on the freeway across southern Michigan at an average speed of 70 MPH. In heavy freeway traffic the Prius provides a solid ride with plenty of power available at all times, easily maintaining speed going up and down hills. During a stop in Indiana we purchased 9.3 gallons of 87 octane gas, having traveled 485 miles since the last fillup, for a fuel cost of $13.00 The first 2,100 miles with the Prius have provided a 52 MPG city/highway average.
  • shomrighausen1shomrighausen1 Member Posts: 3
    I haven't done any timing for 0-60, but I can tell you that this car will hold it's speed for extended periods of time. I've taken it out on the interstate, and kept it in the 75-80 range for about two hours. Mileage suffers if you are going at this speed (in the low 40s), but it is still better than any other car that I've driven.

    Another thing that I've noticed at 'highway-speeds' is that the CVT gives great 'passing' power and acceleration.

    About 70-80% of my commute is 65MPH plus driving, and I've averaged 46MPG over the last 2000 miles.
  • sciencemvsciencemv Member Posts: 2
    Hello to all the owners of the Prius

    If you bought a Prius in Canada please respond. Where can I purchase a Prius in the area round Montreal?
  • andyjfandyjf Member Posts: 1
    Does anyone know why the gps navigation system cannot be upgraded on the 2001 models once it is available on the 2002? The response from Toyota was a short 'no'. Also, has anyone seen a feature or option list for the 2002 model yet?

    Thanks,

    Andy
This discussion has been closed.

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles

Your Privacy

By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our Visitor Agreement.