Lexus IS 300

riez · March 2004

pjj14... I have two IS300s, an '03 automatic and an '04 manual.

If snow and ice are huge concerns to you, get winter snow tires.

Wife and I survived this winter in Iowa and Nebraska on all-season tires. Both our cars have the optional LSD. Get LSD!!!

Wife took her's to upstate NY in December/January. She put over 3,000 miles on the car and had no problems.

Test drive both cars. Thorough test drives.

Read the published reviews. See March 2004 C&D (IS300), October 2003 Automobile (IS300 and TSX), July 2003 MT and C&D (TSX).

sorter · March 2004

I read news out of Dallas dealer conference about ES330 manual, and IS 300 coupe and convertible coming this fall. I don't think those vehicle has to be brought out for Major model.

pjj14 · March 2004

Thanks for the information, Riez. Do you have any experience with the Sport Design Edition, i.e., is it worth the extra money? I suspect that it's not because most of the differences seem to be cosmetic, except, of course, for the suspension modifications.

However, I have been told by the two biggest dealers in the Metro D.C. area that full-leather is very rare on the 5-speed models. And I was not impressed by the ecsaine, so this is also a concern.

riez · March 2004

pjj14... My wife's '03 IS300 automatic has the escaine. My '04 IS300 manual has the full leather. Both had the related value package. Her's also has VSC, which is only available on the automatics. Both have LSD.

I think both the leather and escaine are great. (But I also like cloth seats.) You won't go wrong with either.

Have your local dealer do a dealer locate to find the color and options you want.

I have only seen pictures and read about the Sport Design Edition. My local dealer hasn't/doesn't have one. I've asked him to call me if/when he does. I concur. Appears to be cosmetic mods that likely aren't worth much. But reportedly the manual transmission model has a more aggressive suspension set up. Only thorough drive would tell.

lenscap · April 2004

A Forbes article on Lexus states the LF-C concept that will be at the NY show is a prototype for the next-generation IS coupe they hope will provide a youthful, sporty image. Here's what they say about it:

1. The V8 is meant to signify the new IS will be even more sporting than the current IS and is an acknowledgement of America's love of cubic inches.
2. As a coupe it helps reposition the IS as a sportier car (although there will be a sedan).

The article also says the current IS buyer's average age is 30, the youngest for any Toyota/Lexus. Also, Toyota is dramatically rethinking the next IS because of its poor sales.

riez · April 2004

lenscap... What is the date of the article? Page number? Title? Is it on their web page? If so, please post the link.

Latest issue of AutoWeek, 4/5/04 issue (p. 4), has a tiny article with a tiny painting, in the News Flash section. Says Lexus not saying much about the LF-C, but "Lexus promises a 'high-output V8' powering its concept luxury sports coupe model.

lenscap · April 2004

Here's the link. Sorry for not posting it earlier. The article is titled "A Sexier Lexus" and the date is March 29, 2004.

http://www.forbes.com/2004/03/29/cx_dl_0330vow.html

cc12359 · April 2004

Mine is a Manuel, the shift knob is so hot on day time.
Any sugggestion for a Lexus leather shift knob?
Any one know anything about the short shifter?

thanks

jmess · April 2004

Interesting stats on final drive ratio diff between e-shift and manual.

*****
Manual Final Drive: 3.727
Automatic FD: 3.909

5th Gear overall ratio:
Manual Final Drive: 3.727 * 0.850 = 3.17
Automatic FD: 3.909 * 0.753 = 2.94

Manual dif + automatic trans: 3.727 * .753 = 2.81

So the automatic turns fewer rpms in 5th gear than does the manual

******

riez · April 2004

jmess... Believe the EPA ratings are 18/25 manual and 18/24 automatic. My '04 IS300 manual turns over about 2,950 PRMs at 100 kph. My wife's '03 IS300 automatic turns over a bit lower, maybe 2900 RPMs.

kyfdx · April 2004

I think this is true for almost every car that offers both manual and automatic. I think the IS300 has one of the smallest differences that I have seen.

The reasoning I've most often heard, is that an automatic can have a lower RPM at cruising speed, because a downshift for passing is available just by pushing on the accelerator. Versus a manual with a low cruising RPM would have to be shifted (duh, isn't that why they call them manual shifters?).

I always thought that when six-speeds came out, you would have an ultra tall cruising gear, which would be great for interstates. But, it seems most six-speeds run at the same RPMs as the five-speeds they have replaced, just moving the gears closer together.

regards,
kyfdx

riez · April 2004

jmess... What the 6th gear gets you depends on the manufacturer. Previously, most (though not all) BMW 5-speed manuals were direct drive (non-overdrive) but (believe) all their 6-speeds have been overdrive.

Europeans tend not to like deep (numerically low) overdrives. They don't seem to want to downshift much at speed. But why they just don't downshift and enjoy a deeper overdrive that gets them higher highway fuel economy and more relaxed long distance cruising. Americans love overdrives under 0.75:1.

I often think Acura has it right. They tend to use very, very numerically high final drives (say 4.11 and up) but very, very deep overdrives (say 0.50:1 and down). Gets you great initial acceleration and great relaxed high speed cruising.

The IS300 really needs at least a 0.75 overdrive in order to get better fuel economy. No reason it shouldn't get 27 mpg or better on highway!

cdnpinhead · April 2004

ratios are interesting, but the real driver is the differential. A sufficiently tall rear end yields a perfectly acceptable overdrive in sixth gear.

The only downside is running in a non-direct gearset most of the time if you're an around-town type of driver.

All that matters, for fuel economy, is the final drive ratio. The overdrive gearing is combined with the differential. Always has been. Always will.

riez · April 2004

cdnpinhead... What matters is the (a) the power curve of the engine and (b) the overall ratio of each gear (which is the product of the individual ratio and the final drive--notice the final drive is a constant in the equation...). Key is to maximize the relationship of the chosen gearing to the engine. (Of course, things like drag co-efficient, tires, etc. also impact highway/high speed fuel economy.)

In both automatic and manual models, the IS300 uses a pretty low (numerically high) final drive. But Lexus then fails to use a high enough (low numerical) final drive to offset the final drive to improve highway efficiency.

Yes, Lexus could numerically lower the final drive, but that would hurt acceleration in all gears. Better to do what Acura does and offest the final drive using a deep overdrive. Gets you great initial acceleration (something the IS300 could use more of) and better highway/high speed fuel efficiency (also something the IS300 could use more of).

riez · May 2004

Motor Trend has a small article in the June issue, page 39 titled "Future Lexi". Color sketch of the reported '06 IS Coupe. MT claims next generation IS will come in sedan, SportCross, coupe, and convertible models. AWD and 4.0L V8 will be optional. No info on pricing.

jatdee · May 2004

Took my 2003 IS in for 15k service and this time got an 2003 ES for a loaner. Of course I took it to my favorite road for a little comparison. It was surprisingly good for a luxury car - got a little floaty and some front tire scrub - not very sporting, but still impressive compared to boats of yore. (I tried some 20mph posted curves at 50 and did not have any real frights). But I found the seats less comfortable than my IS and the console rubbed my leg. Also it has a serious lack of power - though maybe 2004s have more. Back in my IS the difference really jumped out. I love that car -it practically sings and dances when you are letting it out and driving something like the ES for a while really brings it home. One bummer. Someone door-dinged the ES while I had it and they are charging me 70 bucks to fix it. I guess I'll pay the insurance coverage next time.

saz1861 · May 2004

I recently came across an article in Consumer Reports dated April 2004. I have not seen posts on the subject so I wanted to tell fellow IS owners the good news.

The Lexus IS 300 was not only the number one rated vehicle in its class, upscale and large sedans, but the #1 vehicle overall in their ratings.

The ratings take into account both crash test results and accident avoidance. Accident avoidance is based on factors that contribute to the car's accident-avoidance capability; Braking, emergency handling, acceleration, driving position, visibility, and seat comfort.

The crash test ratings are based on the most recent independent crash-test results from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, a government agency, and from the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety, which is sponsored by the insurance industry.

It's great to know that not only is the car fun to drive but it is the safest car overall on the road, at least for those that CR tested.

2004 BSM Sport X.

riez · May 2004

Is too bad Lexus doesn't market the IS300. TRD won't hardly make any performance parts. Lexus dealers only want to push SUVs and ES. No wonder IS300 is the forgotten car. At least CR and others recognize how good it is!

nethopper · May 2004

My daughter wants a Lexus IS 300 used. Seems as though the safety rating are good, but is it too much power for a newer driver? Also the one she is looking at has 3 doors that have been keyed(scratched)
and would need repair. It is a 2001 with 25000 miles and in good mechanical shape I was thinking $21,600 would be a fair price, any thoughts??
Thanks

kyfdx · May 2004

A lot of car for a newer driver.. and a lot of money.

'01 came out in April of '00. It is possible that the warranty has expired or is about to. I'd want to know how long I had on the warranty.

Nobody is beating the doors down to buy these cars.. I would bargain very hard, if that is indeed the car you choose.

regards,
kyfdx

riez · May 2004

nethopper... Unfortunately, the IS300 has a rather high insurance cost. My rate rose almost 50% over my former BMW 323ia. Whatever else you do, ask your insurance agent for a rate quote!

Consumer Reports has highly rated the IS300 ever since it came out. Very reliable.

Interestingly, the average age of IS300 buyers is 30. This is the lowest age of all Toyota products, including Scion!

How old is your daughter? If under 21, I think the IS300 is probably a lot more car than she needs. You might be better off with a brand new Hyundai Elantra, Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, Ford Focus, etc.

nw1997 · May 2004

Nethopper,

I would agree with the many posts already. A new driver most likely will have minor fender benders maybe from just parking the vehicle. The maintenance of this vehicle would be much higher than simply purchasing a Hyundai Accent/Elantra. When she becomes more experienced then she could look at a better quality/costly vehicle. Too much power and too much car for a new driver is what may happen. Also, keep in mind the IS300 is a rear wheel drive vehicle and may be tricky to handle in foul weather, e.g. snow and wet roads, especially since she is a new driver. Good luck, and I am sure whichever vehicle you get her and being it would be her first, I am sure she would still like it.

maxhonda99 · May 2004

The Hyundai or Civic is also going to tank in value after a few years because it would be brand new, whereas the used IS300's initial drop in value was eaten by the first owner. I think that would kind of offset the increased maint. costs of the IS300.

Also, there is no way I would put my kid in a tiny Hyundai. Those cars aren't safe at all compared to a IS300. One car is like a tank the other is like a tincan.

The IS300 also doesn't have too much power. It may have 215bhp, but alot of that gets lost by the time it gets to the pavement. A automatic IS300 does 0-60 in about 7.8 seconds. That's not exactly quick these days.

And trac/VSC should help in the sticky stuff.

riez · May 2004

maxhonda... I own two IS300s (an '03 and an '04) as well as a '00 Hyundai Sonata (GLS V6 5-speed manual with ABS/TC). The Sonata has about 53,000 miles. Runs like a top. Wife, kids, and I use all three.

You can be sure I'm going to encourage my kids to think about a Hyundai for their first new car! I wouldn't encourage them to buy an IS300 for their first car. Too expensive.

I'd rather my kids have a much less expensive new car with full warranty than a used car with partial warranty.

The biggest depreciation hits are: (1) time of purchase, (2) after 2 years, and (3) after 5 years. That '01 IS300 will be hitting 5 years in no time.

kyfdx · May 2004

Not that I would buy a Hyundai, if I were worried about depreciation... but, the '01 IS300 value is getting ready to "fall off the cliff". It is right at the tipping point now. Four years old is about as far as a luxury brand buyer is willing to go, I think, and with the value still being over $20K at this point...

My guess is, 3 years from now, you will be lucky to get $10-12K for that '01 IS300. For a teenager (or anyone, for that matter), with $20K to spend, they would be much better served with a new Accord. Not that I would spend that much on a teenager's first car. Easy for me to say, though.. my child is ten.

regards,
kyfdx

nw1997 · May 2004

riez,

I have to agree with you. It's not a bad idea for first time drivers to have a new Hyundai, warranty is great and they are getting more reliable every year. A well equipped Elantra with side and front air bags, ABS and traction control can be found for less than $14K. Service is very easy compared to the cost of servicing a vehicle that is already 5-years old, because you count the year that the vehicle is "01" to now is 5-years. Can you imagine the service fee when that IS 300 reaches 30K. Lastly, for a teenager bells and whistles are probably not needed, their first priority would normally be basic transportation.

nethopper · May 2004

Thanks, you are all giving me things to think about. I have to add, my husband and I are putting up the first $8000 . The rest comes from her, she has been thinking and saving and baby sitting etc. for a car since 2nd grade!! I tried to encourage her to a used Accord or maybe a new Civic and to not spend so much of what she has accumulated, but she test drove quite a few different cars, Jetta, AudiA4, Mazda3, Acura rsx, Accord and a few more I can't even remember (she has 2 friends with Hyundai not even considered) and the IS 300 is the one she keeps returning to. She has a good driving record, no tickets no fender benders, so I am giving her more leeway in this choice than I would if I were paying it all (which I would not). Again thanks.

argelius · May 2004

I currently have a BMW330xi, the lease for which will be up next June. I've heard rumors that a new Lexus IS is coming. Does anyone have an approximate idea when the next generation IS will be available? (I checked out the "The Next IS300" forum, but most of the folks there are just sniping at each other...couldn't find out what the latest ETA prediction is).

Thanks!

wale_bate1 · May 2004

It's going to be a MY'06.

If you're lucky (assuming you actually like it), it may just coincide with the end of your lease!

lenscap · May 2004

"It's not a bad idea for first time drivers to have a new Hyundai, warranty is great and they are getting more reliable every year."

Personally, I think an Elantra is a terrible idea for any driver. The safety rating is one of the worst out there. For example compare the Elantra at hwysafety.org to either the Corolla or Camry and you'll see the difference.

lenscap · May 2004

The Lexus GM has said the next IS will come out roughly six months after the next GS. Since it is confirmed the GS goes on sale March 1, 2005, expect the IS to be in showrooms right around September 1, 2005.

birdman579 · May 2004

Just thought I would add that Hyundai was recently named the second best car manufacturer in initial quality by JD Power. Its only slightly behind Toyota and tied with Honda. Pretty impressive. If you look at specific brands, Hyundai beats supposedly reliable brands including Toyota, Infiniti, and Acura. Considering this is a Lexus board, I should share that Lexus is the best overall brand.

kyfdx · May 2004

Initial quality... If I was only keeping it for 90 days, Hyundai would be at the top of my list.

maxhonda99 · May 2004

Hyundai has truly been making great strides in quality the last few years. It's good to see they putting quality/reliability as one of their top priorities.

I still wouldn't go buy a Hyundai though. 90days is only 90days. Long-Term durability study says alot more. That's where Hyundai has to show big improvements.

lenscap · May 2004

I wouldn't trust a Hyundai long-term either. Besides, quality doesn't equal safety, and according to hwysafety.org Hyundai has one of the worst-rated cars compared to its Toyota and Honda competitors.

itsmeehkyle · May 2004

GO ahead dude treat your daughter to one of the most safest vehicle out there .... so wat it's kinda pricy but i'm pretty sure your daughter is worth it to be in a medal box and a tin can right? I purchased my is when i turned 19 going on 20 now... if your daughter shows maturity and willing to give up on things just to get that vehicle? i'm pretty sure she will take care of it. plus that vehicle will last her throughout college and grad school pretty much. sighz... parents just dont understand how appreciative to us that if give have to give up alot of things for wat we wat WE GOTTA TAKE GOOD CARE OF IT!
just me kyle laterz

itsmeehkyle · May 2004

p.s daddy make sure she can work for maintence.... oil change here is 40 bucks in houston but it's for 5k not normal 3k

comes with a car vaccuum and car wash with no spots! tee hee

jmess · May 2004

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/hl/04is300.htm

fredmcmurray · May 2004

From that article:
"The inline six/rear drive configuration is a time-proven tradition thanks to BMW..."

What the heck does that mean? Toyota has been making inline six/rear drive vehicles for decades, as have many other companies. Why is BMW being given all the credit for the inline six/rear drive configuration?

riez · June 2004

fredmcmurray... Just look at how many BMWs have had I6s going all the way back to say 1970. Then compare that to Detroit. Detroit pretty much gave up on I6 for V6 in the 1970s and early 1980s. Japan Inc. built some I6s (Nissan 240/260/280/300Z, Toyota Cressida & Supra, Infiniti J30, etc) but built more I4s and then, in conjunction with the move to FWD platforms, switched over to V6s.

That famous British user of I6s--Jaguar--pretty much abandoned them after Ford bought them out. Sad! Heck, the X-type uses a Ford V6s!!!

Audi has been using V6s for a long time. They, like Volvo, even were using horrible I5s.

MB pretty much gave up on I6 for V6 in the late 1990s--though their new 3.2 I6 turbo-diesel is a wonderful exception, much to be recommended!

If you run the list of I6s in USA you won't find many. Volvo still has the FWD S80, Suzuki added the FWD Verona. There is the IS300. The MB E-class diesel. GM has their 4.2L I6 in SUVs.

BMW pretty much has I6s in nearly all their products, except 6 and 7 Series. You can get I6s in 3 and 5 Series sedans, coupes, convertibles, and wagons. The Z4 roadster. The M3 coupe and convertible. Plus the X3 and X5 SUVs. Heck, BMWs most sophisticated engine, the M3's 3.2L is an I6. Cranks out over 100 hp per liter!

Most sadly, Lexus is abandoning the I6 in the next IS. It will be V6 and, possibly, V8.

nyccarguy · June 2004

I got an email notification that told me if I test drive an '04 IS300 before the end of this month that I'll get some free songs from a new music download service from sony. I may just have to take them up on that offer. Plus I'd like to test drive an IS300:)

fredmcmurray · June 2004

Certainly BMW makes the maximum use of a couple of I6 engines on two vehicle platforms to create a large number of models but I can't concede that BMW is responsible for the "time-proven" nature of the I6/rear drive configuration. Too many other companies have sold too many cars of this type for too long to allow that this is somehow a BMW property. Yes, many companies have gone to the V-6 for their bread and butter models but Toyota has had I6/rear drive vehicles available in the US continuously since before I care to research. In additon to the Cressida and Supra, there is the GS300 and SC300, not to mention the stalwart Landcruiser.
It just kind of irks me when the BMW nuts almost imply that Toyota developed the I6 for the IS just so it would be like the 3 series. This is a bunch of hogwash as Toyota has been building great I6s for a long, long time.

riez · June 2004

fredmcmurray... Great marques like Jaguar and Toyota have built a ton of great RWD cars with I6. But as I said, Jaguar (foolishly) abandoned the I6 and Toyota has built far more I4s. Just compare the percentage of I4s in Toyota products over the past 35 years to the percentage of I6s. Or even V6s. For every one Cressida, there were how many Camrys? For every one SC300, how many ES250/300/330?

Both the I6 Cressida and I6 Supra are long gone from our shores. That leaves a soon-to-be abandoned I6 in the IS and GS. Both go to V6 and V8 in next generation. Sad but true. After that, BMW will still be making as many as half a million I6s annually in 3 Series, 4 Series, 5 Series, X3, X5, and Z4. BMW sells well over 100,000 I6s in USA alone annually. Toyota doesn't come close.

sunrisewatcher · June 2004

Hi, I am in the market for a new IS 300 5-speed manual in silver metallic. An Internet Manager quoted me $27,232 via email including the following options:

Power & Leather Package
5-spoke Graphite Wheel and 17" summer performance tires
Rear Spoiler
Limited-slip differentials
Wheel locks
Cargo Net
Trunk mat

Is this a good deal or should I bargain for more?

SW

erk5 · June 2004

depends... where are you located?

riez · June 2004

sunrisewatcher... What is the MSRP? Compare that to the invoice. Lexus appears to have some factory-to-dealer incentives, and some financing specials.

I think that is a pretty good price for a brand new '04 IS300 with those options. (My '04 is equipped like yours, though I do have the heated seats. A truly fun car to drive.)

You should check out the cost of insurance with your carrier. Unfortunately, the IS300 is a bit expensive to insure.

kyfdx · June 2004

Did I read correctly? Did your wife trade her '03 IS300 for a Sportcross?

regards,
kyfdx

riez · June 2004

kyfdx... Yes, she did trade in her '03 IS300 automatic sedan (silver with black leather/escaine interior) for an '04 IS300 SportCross (Absolutely Red with tan full leather interior). I've ordered black floor mats for her's as the tan are just too light and show every last speck of dirt.

She wanted a bit more trunk room and had started falling for SUV. She was bugging me about an X3. I didn't want an SUV, any SUV, not even a BMW or Lexus SUV. The SportCross the next best thing. Her's has LSD, VSC, and summer high performance tires, along with heated seats and the leather value package. A beautiful car that is a blast to drive and very, very practical for its size!

She put 12,000 miles on it since late last August, 2003, when she bought it.

I still have and love my '04 IS300 sedan with LSD and manual transmission. Put 330 miles on her yesterday and will put another 120 miles on her today. I have almost 11,000 miles since I bought her last September, 2003.

kyfdx · June 2004

Very nice.. the black floor mats will look good with tan interior... Lots of people have done this.

nyccarguy · June 2004

are you going to swap her high Performance Tires for your All Seasons when she's not looking:)

Congrats on yet another IS300. You are very knowledgeable and passionate about cars and the fact that you've bought 3 IS300s in the last year or so is truly a credit to the IS.

Lexus IS 300

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