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Just got off the phone on this Good Friday after some heated conversations with telephone companies, charges for local LD and Intrastate LD for two business phones; that somehow were being serviced by three phone companies. So, we now have only two companies doing that job and somebody just threw in 1000 free minutes.. A free lunch??????? Stand tall!!!
Let's go to cars.. The press/media has totally skipped the new I-6; for they only understand V-8..
GM needs to wake up and get rid of the fumbling image; before they find themselves in the same boat as Chrysler. Ford has interested leadership and is doing an excellent job of supplying vehicles that fit. They may not have the best engines, suspensions, or the highest tech image; but they are holding their own against the world..
GM should be embarrassed to still have the 3.8 engine as a mainstay and seem to have lost their way with the mainstream buyer of cars.. No (4) valve V-6, and Caddy seems to be the big future product with RWD and a new Catera.. Blotted SUVs that are made for backwoods, muddy fields, foraging streams and pulling stumps. The Asian wannabes are SUVs that are refined and civilized, driving like cars and afraid of the forests..This country is no longer the wild, wild West..
GM management is based on a four year cycle and the only thing they are good at doing is changing the game plan while digging a deeper hole. Olds has cost the stockholders some $3billion in costs and management feels good about wiping out a division to get refocused; personally I think they are a little late and have started the decline to extinction..
Did you all see the new Infiniti I-30 2002 model will have the Altima 3.5 engine. The pricing difference between the two models starts to sound like GM branding--maybe the French Govt thinks GM is growing..
The last time I looked the Intrigue was still in the garage..mine.. Taking bids..
In any case, I personally think the Olds engine is the better of the two because it still has room for improvement... in a good way. The Intrigue puts out 215 HP and 230 lb/ft of torque. The luxury Acura RL has the same displacement and cranks 225 horses and 231 lb/ft of torque.
The numbers are similar although the Acura puts out 10 more horses and 1 more lb/ft torque. But here's where the Olds shines: the RL uses variable valve timing and the output is only marginally higher. The Olds doesn't use ANY high-tech toys to do the same thing! Instead, Olds engineers went with a longer bore stroke. The principle is exactly the same as using a longer screwdriver or wrench vs a smaller one. More power, easier to move the screw. The result is that the Olds 3.5 allows similar power to the VVT-i RL without extra stuff.
Now, just imagine how much more power the Olds 3.5 would put out with VVT-i?!!! Then ask what Acura has to do to increase the output of their engine. In any case, if the Olds engine received the same modifications that the Acura engine uses/will use, the Olds engine will always put out more power.
Ironically, Wards Autoworld feels the same way. That's why it didn't make it on the list the third year. They feel that it is indeed a great engine. But they also feel that GM needed to push the envelope more.
But GM will probably kill it after 3 years of real road testing. So don't expect to see a VVT-i 3.5 w/250 horses. Ain't gonna happen.
I just read a nice post from sp01 in the "Ugly New Cars: Why?" forum.. check it out.
Totals
#2301 of 2301 Strut Tower Brace by vcjumper Apr 13, 2001 (04:44 pm)
vcjumper - the link you used would have allowed someone to be logged in as you, so I removed your post, copied it here and fixed the link.Ok just finished putting on the rear one, time to go gas up and test it out. Took about 40 minutes, would have taken less than half an hour if I didn't have to relocate some audio equipment.
I just read a nice post from sp01 in the "Ugly New Cars: Why?" forum.. check it out. I have to agree with the top 7, they all have something that makes them pretty ugly.
Totals: sp01 "Ugly New Cars: Why?" Apr 9, 2001 2:01pm
The best thing to do when linking a post is to right click on the post number, copy the link, and then paste it into your message. This way, when someone follows the link, they arrive logged in as themselves. I think you copied the link from the address bar - that was the problem.
Hope this makes sense - sorry I had to delete your post, but you don't want people running around posting as you! :-)
Pat
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JR
I have to say for a $20 piece of metal, the brace does make a nice difference. The steering response just feels quicker and it is hard to describe but the rear end feels tighter. Now I can't wait till I get a front one put on. Then I'll have to work on making it oversteer!
The main theme of the article is that Oldsmobiles are flying out of the dealerships because of all the incentives.
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A7649-2001Ap11.
By the way, Intrigue with the 3.5l engine is optimized for highways. Probably the best midsize car for those who make 25-30k miles per year. It will be 250,000-300,000 miles after 10 years. For mostly short trips I would prefer the older 3.8l engine, available with Chevrolet Impala / Monte Carlo, Buick Regal, and Pontiac Gran Prix.
Ghostz... The WS6 package is no longer available on the Formula, only the TA. It consists of 17" wheels and tires, power steering cooler, and Ram Air induction. But, yes, you're right, I don't think it's worth the $3600 they charge for it. BTW, if you want an F-car and wait until 2003 you may be searching for a leftover 2002... GM is not planning on bringing the F-body up to crash standards which change on January 1, 2003. This means no more production after December 31, 2002. The LS1 was refined some for 2001... it got the LS6 (ZO6 'vette) intake for better breathing and cam from the 6.0 liter truck engine for better mid-range torque. The 2001 also doesn't have EGR and they tightened the tolerances on the main bearings to prevent a cold-start rattle that plagued some '98-'00 LS1's. The exhaust system is pretty tepid, though. Once my bank account recovers, I'm probably going to do something about that.
It will definitely use a 3.2L version of the Opel V6, probably with 230 hp. Eventually there may be a supercharged version with 270 hp.
The Shortstar will start to replace the 3.8L OHV across the board. The Grand Prix will get it for 2003, then expect to see it in the 2004 Regal, 2005 Impala, etc. when each are redesigned and put on the "Mid Lux" platform.
A smaller DOHC V6 will debut in the 2004 Chevrolet Malibu, when it goes to the Epsilon platform. The Grand Am and Saturn L series go to the Epsilon platform for 2005.
I bought my 2000 SE for just under $16K this January. It's got the 3.8 series II, the nice buckets and console, a great ride, 30 mpg on regular gas - how can you beat it?
Just a suggestion - I'd love an Aurora too - wish could have both!
Ken
Regarding parts. Even in the worst case scenario, (and the 3.5 is an engineering dead end), you could get reconditioned parts from junkyards in a few more years as Intrigues start showing up in them. It's even possible that the Intrigue could have enough of a cult following (sort of like the Corvair, or the El Camino) to keep a fair number of them maintained, despite the unique parts content. There's always a group of people out there who want to be "different" from the crowd...
The real key is how long do you want to own your car and how much inconvenience you're willing to put up with while owning it.
Final comment, although the 3.5 is a well thought design with a lot of potential, I'd agree that it's a bit diminiutive for the base Aurora. This is not the price range for "adequate" performance.
Would have to find someone who wants to sell theirs though as GM charges what, $350 or so a wheel for replacements?
The wife and I were talking about the new mid-lux platform. She recommended waiting to get one of the cars from the mid-lux platform. But I pointed out that if I don't like the look of the new cars I blow the chance to get the Intrigue I want.
Therefore, has anyone seen any spy photos for any of the cars on the new platform? We've been talking a lot about the engine but don't know what the cars look like. I'm afraid that the spec sheet will look great but the implementation will be crappy. Reference: Pontiac Aztec.
www.aint-it-cool-news.com/image/m2cadillac2.jpg
For me, i very much like the new 2002 altima, but i am still leaning towards another intrigue. It just has more room than just about any car i have been in.
But interioir room was one of the main reasons I went for the Intrigue over the Alero. Dimensionally, both cars are pretty close, and the Alero isn't a small car. But it just felt more confining inside. My head could easily "clunk" against the left side glass, or brush the roof if I lean forward. For some reason, climbing out of the car felt uncomfortable.
GM operates with little flexibility in their system and if they misjudge something it takes four years to phase it out. What we will get from them is a copy of a current BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes..Since I am a Caddy owner my hype factor should be bubbling over; but I assume all we have in store for the RWD is some warmed over Opel derivative like the current tank called "Catera".
Took the wife's Northstar for the 100 mile run to our Easter brunch and forgot how smooth it was at speed compared to the harsh/loudmaster critter called Intrigue. Not that I am a big Caddy fan but my GLS is sheer commotion..Maybe there are some medical benefits available to Intrigue owners..
Let's face it sportfans---the car is fun to drive but the quality of refinement is missing, and dealer assistance in troubleshooting since the Dec announcement is really shameful.. This is the week I may cancel my extended warranty w/o penalty..
Has anybody heard from rbb2 and his rackety Intrigue?????The last fix his dealer came up with was to deflate the tires!!!!surprising statement after the Ford/Firestone fiasco!!!!
swagled, I like the idea of the cult following. Don't know if Intrigue owners will be as cult like as El Camino or Airstream trailer owners, but you must admit, we are an active and vocal bunch. Just look at the number of posts on this thread and before when Edmunds would start a new thread after about 500 posts, we were up to 7. I don't think owners of Tauruses, Camrys, and Accords are anywhere near as enthusiastic about their cars. Too bad GM didn't realize that. Like an old Cinderella song from the 80s says; you don't know what you got till it's gone. Anyway, hope all had a good Easter.
6363/1415/71ss: I posted this earlier today in response to one2one. But here it is again. Go to the "Cadillac CTS 2003" thread and click on the link in post #1. If it drives as good as it looks. Caddy has a winner.
swagled: There aren't any midsize import cars that feel as roomy as the intrigue. There may be some that have a little more rear seat room.
None have the open greenhouse of the intrigue. For me, the intrigue has no blindspots and the windshield header is not in my forehead.
Camry pic 1
Camry pic 2
Oh, with all the rain we had today I noticed on the passenger side in the trunk I had a ton of water. My wife states this isn't the first time. Not going to let it bother me because the Intrigues days in my garage are numbered.
bz4----saw my handle mentioned and anything connected with the CTS/Catera program is a waste of money, its hype babble..
etharmon-----we have been down the Caddy road a few times and somehow I get the impression you believe it is really the highest automotive standard..It's larger and quieter; but it ain't worth the dream of total excellence.. The local Pontiac dealer still has the 99 Aurora w/16k miles for 19,995.. It appears to be a straight car.. I would take the Intrigue down for trade; but he already has 2-99s on the lot. The Aurora is worth about 18k..
Filled up the Caddy, first stopped at a interstate
BP station off I-94 in St. Clair county for the top price was 1.75/gal., assumed it was prem., however when I got to the pump it was mid-grade and the prem was 1.89/gal..Left the station and got down the road another 5 miles and prem was 1.74/gal..
The gas pricing is headed to recession for the oil companies along with OPEC have figured out the way to keep a tight control over inventories by holding back production using lack of refining capacity as the culprit..We are screwed and the ecomony will hit the toilet for the domestic guys since 50% of their sales are SUVs.. This sharp energy increase in the USA will gut things--too bad. The last eight years we were living in lalala land..
At the same time, bad news like that from whistle-blowers many times tends to be true, especially when the company either denies or refuses to comment on it. As some have said, it would be foolish to kill the engine after 3 years of road testing. As far as being too expensive to build... it's a twin cam for goodness sake!!!! Of course it's going to cost more to build than a pushrod that has been in production for almost 40 years!! If that's GM's reasoning, they must think we're REALLY stupid.
Plus, if you go to the official Intrigue site and read the News section, you'll see at the end of one article that back in 99 they said they were already at work on modifying the engine. If GM is working on a 3.2 engine, they would have been developing it at the same time as the 3.5. If the only reason they were developing it was for Oldsmobile, then that was really stupid and shortsighted. But they did make the 4.0 exclusively for the Aurora so stupidity isn't out of GM execs scope.
Only time will tell. As I said earlier, if they use only VVT-i they push the 3.5 into V-8 power territory. Save the 3.2 and 3.0 engines for smaller cars like Grand Am and Century.
Flickering headlight question - Anyone with this problem notice any signs of leaking above the alternator?
The alternator is in a very awkward location subject to lots of dirt from road condition and diffcult to replace due to underside of block.. Don't tell us that oil from the valve covegaskets is leaking onto the alt...
Got to be another Olds first..
Dropped the wife off at work and passed an AutoZone. Noticed that the car would idle a little rough at times and was a little sluggish moving from a dead stop. Usually changing the air filter fixes the problem.
So I stop in and, of course, they don't have a filter the for 3800 Intrigue. However, I remember etharmon said that the Regal filter would fit. Plus the last time I was in Pep Boys I cross referenced the Olds and Regal numbers in the book. This store did have the Regal filter. I sized it up with a Fram paper filter just to make sure it was the right fit.
I must say, the K&N made an immediate difference. The idle smoothed out so much that, dare I say, it's *almost* as smooth and quiet at idle as the 3.5. Operative word: ALMOST. But it's pretty darn close. Maybe it's because of the even air flow the K&N provides. As far as increased horsepower, I haven't put it on the highway yet so I can't comment on that. But torque/low-end response seems to be improved. But that could be just because I'm using a clean filter. Also noticed the car started smoother. But I can't say that can be credited to the filter as I only turned it on once. And we all know how inconsistant the starting situation can be. Will expand on these thoughts later after some more driving.
b4z, you made a statement a while back about what to expect from the installation of a K&N. Can you fill me in again? I want to remember that you said that I might even loose horsepower in the 3800. Even if performance doesn't improve dramatically, at least I won't have to change the filter for a long time. At $8 to $12 bucks a filter, $40 for a K&N that won't have to be changed for 2 to 3 years turns out to be a bargain.
It just chaps my butt, and I am certain it will get over the $2.00 mark this summer. And to boot Exxon/Mobil have one of their most profitable years on record. The BIG oil companies are just gouging the heck out of us consumers.
We're following up with our dealership today. He was supposed to have talked to the zone manager on Friday to find out the latest news on the "new-new" alternator. I'll let you know what we find out.
Here's an interesting article that was in the paper this morning:
http://www.azcentral.com/business/0416oldsmobile16.html
You will gain several horsepower in the higher rev ranges.
The same would hold true for a large diameter exhaust system.
one2one-----You should get the SLP cat-back exhaust system and the Intrigue will really rock and rock..
jgriff-----Prices must go up every year 10-15% for the Petrol guys to increase earnings so we are headed to new heights..
jjpowell2----You are in the Tucson area???
Update: The zone manager said there are many alternators floating around out there now that are the same update as the last one they put in our car. He talked to GM this morning and ordered one of the latest fixes directly from them. It should be received by 4/18......