I forgot to mention, if the FWD turbo torque steer does not bother you then go test drive a Mazdaspeed3. You get a lot more space and nice handling and acceleration for less money - and probably more reliable. No free maintenance and less MPGs, however.
You could probably swing a new S2000 as well. RWD drop top that is quick handles super and returns 24 mpg around town.
Here is what I paid for my 2007 Cooper S a few months ago:
MSRP: $25,800 3 yr / 36K mi lease / $291 per month Chilli Red with Black Bonnet stripes Premium Package Cold weather package Anthracite roofliner Brushed alloy interior 16" bridge spoke w/ performance tires
$2500 out-of-pocket includes first month's payment, security deposit, tax, title, fee, etc.
I remember I checked every dealer along the North-East coast and no one was willing to give that deal except Habberstad Mini NY. Talk to Maureen there (if you wish to go to NY).
Yesterday placed our order for a 2007 Mini. Dealer said it was his "last slot" for ordering a 2007. Managed to get it at $500 under MSRP.
6 Speed Manual Pepper White w/ Black Roof/Mirrors Cold Weather Package Premium Package Sport Package Xenon Headlights Auto Dimming Rear View Mirror Universal Garage Door Opener Chrome Line Interior Cream White Color Line Piano Black Interior Surface Carpet Floor Mats
MSRP $23,445 Purchase $22,945
Hopefully it will be here just in time for Christmas!
Pretty sad state of affairs when we have to brag about getting $500 off full price . How much is the dealer's doc fee? That probably made up for a large chunk of the $500 savings, I would bet :-( .
The main thing is you got to order the colors and options you want and DID get some discount. Enjoy your new car when it arrives.
I hope this is the correct forum for this question. If not feel free to move it. I am wondering about Edmunds True Cost to own. The Depreciation has a graphic with a slider bar $--------^---------$$$ Now the way I see it is if you have $------------------^$$$ You LOSE less at resale If you have $-^-----------------$$$ You lose More But the Mini always has terrific resale value and I figure I must be incorrect. can some one set me straight? Which is more preferable for depreciation the ^ to be more towards the $$$ or the $? Is that confusing enough? :confuse:
That's a really good question.. To me, the graph reads that the more the arrow is to the right ($$$).... the higher the depreciation (which is bad).
I think they are looking at the raw number on depreciation, not a percentage. So, even though the MINI might retain a higher percentage of the purchase price, it's depreciation rating is not any better than it's lower priced competitor, because of the actual depreciation in dollars.
But, I can look at two different cars, whose raw depreciation numbers are similar, and they have two very different ratings, so I'm at a loss to explain why.
That's a really good question.. To me, the graph reads that the more the arrow is to the right ($$$).... the higher the depreciation (which is bad).
Yeah that's how I'm reading it too, but I'd like to see Edmunds make it clearer so that $$$ = bad $ = Good Something like this Depreciation $Good----------^----------$$$Bad since it's in the middle in this case it's average. It just doesn't make sense with some cars tho. Honda Civics are rated average to worse than average yet they sell very well and don't lose a lot of money from new so that means they should be closer to the $--^-----------$$$ end of the scale but very few cars actually are. I'm baffled. :sick: Maybe Edmunds can clear it all up by changing it to
Depreciation Screwed---------^-------Great!
Something so that we know which end of the graph is the one we want to be on.
your question is a little unclear, but if you are asking which options are good--I can weigh in. I bought the car off the lot so it had more options than I thought I needed/wanted. And it turns out I was introduced to some that I love and others that I thought that I wanted that I totally wouldn't want now.
EXCELLENT OPTIONS: comfort access, autodim mirror and automatic headlights--all excellent and you'll be glad you ahve them. the rearview mirror in particular, it doesn't make things smaller liek it does when you just flip the mirror,
bluetooth is GREAT--when it works. Although I can always hear perfectly, people I speak to say the quality is terrible. and I've called my own answering machine and left a message and it is pretty bad. If this improves it's worth it, if not..it's a feature that's helpful in an emergency but I end up not calling people because they complain about the quality--it drives them crazy, the static/in-out reception etc.
UNNECESSARY fancy steering wheel. I never use the steering wheel--or rarely. since all the radio info is about two inches away from your right hand it's easier just to do it all from the radio/stereo buttons. both for the phone and the stereo controls it's MUCH easier to just do it all from the radio--and it's not like it's a stretch==you're in a mini
I never use cruise control. I don't know if you still have it without this steering wheel, but when I"m on the highway, I like to monitor my speed myself anyway.
arm rest: I was all gungho on the arm rest but it's such a TERRIBLE armrest, it's not worth the 200 bucks. IT's too low to 'rest' on, and the storage is terrible. Maybe one of those aftermarket armrests you can buy are bigger and better, this one is useless
fancy colors on the inside. I have interesting details--chrome mirrors, some color stuff on the insdie of the car. at first this was nice, now I hardly notice it' unless you are totally into the details, not worth the extra money, the car is already cute as it is.
sunroof--I hate my sunroof and I would not get one again. when you are on the highway, you can hear wind noise coming out of it--the car would be nice and quiet without that, and it doesn't block the sun during the summer--so you get uv rays on your face--if you want to avoid wrinkles like me, this is a pain. I ended up putting some cardboard between the net thinga nd roof to block the light all the summer anyway. I rarely use it and when I do I really can't tell a difference. You get more of a 'wind' feeling from rolling down the windows.
As far as being more spacious inside, the car is already roomy, so unless you are VERY tall in your seat, I can't see how the sunroof makes much of a difference. Also, since I live in NYC, the last thing I want to do is ride around town sucking in more pollution into my lungs by being more exposed to traffic.
I have the basic mini, not an S. I have not driven an S but the mini is just fine for highway. It goes faster than I intend often--like suddenly I'm at 80 before I realized it, so I don't feel like there is a lack of power. I'm a girl and not a car person so I'm no expert. But, really, the basic seems like plenty of zippiness.
oh, and in retrospect I wish I had gotten stripes of some sort. At first I thought they were too tacky. but then the mini is like such a little toy car and so cute, it reallyd oes call out for stripes! I may return this one after my 1 year lease and buy a new one and if so I'll probably get stripes.
There is probably something wrong with the bluetooth on your car if you have frequent problems. I use the bluetooth built in to my portable nav without complaints, so one built into a car should be better, not worse.
Most people are going to want cruise control unless all they do is drive in the city. It makes long highway trips much more comfortable. Its also nice to keep both hands on the wheel while driving even if the radio is within arms reach.
i am looking for an automatic minicooper S 2008 or 2007 (which year is recommended? 2008 is pricer for a mini cooper S options)
I am also looking for a list of options i should consider.
i live in Los Angeles.... so, do i need a sunroof?
I'm considering a premium package, i love the comfort package with the key less access key. my questions is: do i need this stuff? leather or leatherette or cloth? dynamic suspension necessary?
i am trying to keep this car as close to 24,000 as possible as it is my budget.
i am also considering the MINI Select option. Is this form of financing recommended? why or why not?
what colors look best, stripes combo? i love the white but i worry its too bland. black, i worry would get me killed on the fwy at night.
I've decided that long beach mini is the best deal for me. I'll let the forum know how that goes.
i did, however, go to assal mini in Monrovia for a test drive (that i had to push to get). and the ppl there don't know what they're doing and the sales manager is an [non-permissible content removed]. first, they told me that i couldn't order a 2007 anymore, which i can. secondly, they insulted my budget set for this car and then offered to throw in free mats. then, the sales manager pretended not to know what a mini select is.
i took the sales managers card. when i get my wonderful deal, I'll call him and let him know what i exactly think of him. maybe ill call tomorrow
so, ppl of the forum, i would really appreciate some input. I need help to buy my first car!
The dual panoramic moonroof is nice - except when you don't want the sun beating down on you. I have a convertible for when I want to be in the breeze. In a non-convertible I would like the choice of being in or out of the sun and the "holely" inner sun screen on the MINI is a major disappointment . I love having a moonroof, but having test drive a MINI on a hot, very sunny day (even with shades on) I can't say I would want to own a MINI with that moonroof in it. I think there is an aftermarket shade kit available to "solve" the problem, but I have not researched the price or how much trouble it is to install.
I would not waste your time with a dealership that did not treat you well. They really will not learn anything from you calling them back - if they have been in the business for a while they should know better.
so u are saying that a moonroof option isnt worth it because it makes the car too hot and the drive isnt shady enough. i noticed that.
congrats on the convertible! sounds like my mini will not have a moonroof. i'm okay with that. i dont want to squint while driving, it would be a waste of an excellent driving experience.
1. Because of the heat 2. Because it adds weight/chassis flex 3. Because it throws off the balance 4. Because it's too expensive for what it does 5. Worried about breakage
If you live where it gets sunny and hot, you would need to seek out an aftermarket shade for the moonroof - I would think. Or you will need dark sunglasses and extra time to cool off the car. The backseat is about unusable, but even more light/heat gets in back there too.
A quick google shows some cloth things you can Velcro up to block all the sun, not sure how well they work or not - but I am positive there is something out there.
You do a good deal of complaints out noise with the roof open, probably more so on the MINI with just a large opening - but that is sort of par for the course with most moonroofs.
I have optioned out a Mini using Edmunds based on a 2007 model and of course performance matters to me. So this is how I optioned it out, based on my needs.
2007 MINI Cooper S (1.6L 4cyl Turbo 6M)
ZSP Sport Package (w/White Web-Spoke Wheels) 226 Sport Suspension 322 Comfort Access 2TA Limited Slip Differential 4BE English Oak Interior Trim 473 Center Arm Rest 384 White Alloy Wheels 327 Bonnet Stripes White 382 Roof/Mirror Caps in White Total with Options $25,659 Color: Chili Red
I might rethink the arm rest and the oak interior I'd have to see those in person first. The dealer is just so far away. :sick:
Sunroofs can be a problem for all the reasons mentioned. Premium Pkg is ok if you want that. Leatherette is a personal choice but you will cough up a lot for leather which must be maintained with cleaners. For me Leatherette which is vinyl, really wears a lot better IMO. As far as performance enhancing things why buy a Mini if you don't get them? Fuel economy has me looking at the Mini as it also offers good performance. Might have to buy a Prius if gas keeps going up.
I had always owned leather until the mini and i love my leatherette. I can get out of the pool/ocean, toss my scuba gear in the back, hop in the front with a wet suit and never worry about hurting anything. Go ette!
I get 30 MPG mixed, driving hard with my 07 Cooper S. It's not prius 45 mpg on 87 octane but smiles-per-mile are way higher!
I get 30 MPG mixed, driving hard with my 07 Cooper S. It's not prius 45 mpg on 87 octane but smiles-per-mile are way higher!
I bet your MINI dealer isn't 1.5 hours away either. That's why I just don't bother because MINI has no interest in expanding their dealership network. So if you have a problem you are screwed. I can't take a day off of work to get my car serviced. The Prius I haven't driven, and yet next month I probably will try one out. Thing is I drive so much highway I wonder if it will really be worth getting and I've had lots of cars on long commutes and once you hit 70mph the fuel economy drops off. The MINI has a tall 6th gear so that really helps. I do tend to actually drive my cars and I get lower mileage as a result. I can't stand hypermilers they might save a few pennies a day but annoying to be stuck behind them unable to pass. They want to save the environment but how much extra fuel is used in passing them?
I do tend to actually drive my cars and I get lower mileage as a result. I can't stand hypermilers they might save a few pennies a day but annoying to be stuck behind them unable to pass. They want to save the environment but how much extra fuel is used in passing them?
I am the same way, I drive the cars as intended and the heck with the little extra cost . Someone in the xB mileage forum mentioned they were getting nice mileage but they were shifting at 3k! The xB does not have much power to start with, but shift that early and you are not seeing much of it.
I can get 24-25mpg in the S2000 around town with the top down driving it like I stole it and about 28mpg on the highway with the top down.
The MINI, I am told, does nicely even if driven with spirit but all require premium fuel. The biggest problem for me is the much more desirable S has way too much torque steer when you mash on the go pedal - they need to make a RWD MINI .
As far as the hypermilers go, when they tailgate someone to improve THEIR mileage does that not cause the person dragging them along to have worse mileage? And as you said, when they keep a constant throttle then you have to pass them going up hills and they may coast past on going down. Having to go around them over and over surely does not help your mileage any.
My mini dealer is 45 minutes away on a Saturday at 6 am. With traffic it's at least 1 hour on weekends and about 1.5 hours on weekdays.
For me to get my car serviced I schedule it weeks in advance and take the car in at the for 7 am on a Saturday and either get a loaner or go for a really, really long walk.
I've totally ignored some recall notice regarding a dash storage compartment as I don't keep anything in my car and I'm not blowing 4-5 hours of any day on something I'll never use.
Come on, premium is 20 cents more per gallon. With regular at 3.20 a gallon, spending $3.40 a gallon is inconsequential. Really, the old premium v. regular argument held water when gas was around $1 but now that gas is over $3 a gallon, it's a drop in the bucket.
I don't know what's going on with people that they experience torque steer to such a degree in this car. My wife will attest to the fact I drive my Cooper S like a mad-man and yet never have torque steer issues.
1. Do they press the S button? 2. Do they try to do WOT from a dead stop? 3. Do they not hold the wheel?
Accelerate hard with FWD and the weight shifts back, thus you end up with several problems that can be avoided The lack of weight on the front tires/axle causes a loss of traction (with a Mini Cooper S the engine can easily spin the tires, lessen the pressure over the tires and that's even more pronounced). Steering, even with S-button action, will feel lighter in this situation as the contact patch is low and momentum/weight is on the back of the car, giving the illusion of loose steering. Torque steer will feel more pronounced in this situation now as there is so little contact/weight over the front axle, there's less to keep the wheels from moving naturally to the right. Quite simply applying throttle in the wrong way for a light FWD car like this creates torque steer.
This isn't some 4k lbs caddy STS. Roll off the light and apply steadily increasing power. You can easily smoke just about every normal person off the line still. By 4k you should be nearing or at WOT. Hit the 1-2 shift, now go ahead with WOT as the weight won't be thrown off - weight over the front tires, good contact patch, zero torque steer, zero wheel spin.
I don't even like FWD but all this whining about torque steer from Edmunds.com and others makes me wonder how people are driving any car that's FWD.
Drive into MINI dealer in a RWD S2000, drive out in Cooper S for an extended (solo) test drive, drive back to dealer and drive out in S2000 and re-drive the test path. Thoughts: Yes, there are gobs of torque steer and with the suspension pack the ride is rougher than the S but cornering speed is lower. Really not an acceptable combination of handling and ride compared to my S or the RX-8 for that matter (or even the 330i or M5 - which were a lot more bucks). The Mazdaspeed3 has some torque steer but not nearly as much and is a quick car than handles well - not as tossible as a MINI but pretty nice for a FWD car.
My snow day xB even has some torque steer but with a lot less ponies under the hood not enough to bother me.
Cars should be RWD or at least AWD - once you have driven performance RWD cars getting in any FWD is a compromise and it really "glares" in the S with a manual tranny. If you are used to FWD then it just more of the same and may not bother you as much. Good thing I didn't drive the demo with all the JCW stuff on it .
I understand the differences - I've gone from two BMW 330is (e46 ZHP 6MT, e90 ZSP 6MT) in a row to a R56 Cooper S 6MT. I didn't experience any torque steer with a Mazdaspeed3 but then again, unlike in a RWD car, I won't punch WOT unless I'm over 15-20 mph because quite frankly WOT in a powerful FWD car is pretty illogical. Heck, even in a cheese Chevy rental with a 4 pot and 4-speed auto WOT from a standstill can attempt to wrench the wheel.
I'm not a FWD fan - as I clearly stated in my original post to you - but I don't think it's the least bit difficult to retrain your foot to massage the throttle from a standstill. Hell, you have to enter corners in a totally different way too. Press the S-button, massage the throttle, brake extremely late into corners...part of the R56 driving experience and 180 degrees from pushing an S2000 hard. You can't use the throttle to steer with a FWD...unless you want to end up in a ditch.
My mini dealer is 45 minutes away on a Saturday at 6 am. With traffic it's at least 1 hour on weekends and about 1.5 hours on weekdays. For me to get my car serviced I schedule it weeks in advance and take the car in at the for 7 am on a Saturday and either get a loaner or go for a really, really long walk.
So you are in about the same position I am in, distance wise. Is it worth going through all that for it?
Shrug. The car's really fun and it should only need service once a year. So far I've had to run by the dealer twice within the first 9 months but not for anything major. Overall it's been far better than my BMWs in terms of reliability.
Shrug. The car's really fun and it should only need service once a year. So far I've had to run by the dealer twice within the first 9 months but not for anything major. Overall it's been far better than my BMWs in terms of reliability.
Thanks, I've heard some horror stories and if something bad happens it's a lot of back and forth. I agree it shouldn't need much if all is well with it.
I would like to thank MINI for finally chasing me off...I have been tinkering on their website for months building a MINI. I would love to own a MINI, but they have officially priced them out of reach. I was waiting for 2008 changes, and I just built a new model and discovered they had changed their packages and inflated option prices (as if they were not outrageous to begin with). I can now buy a Lexus IS for the same price I can build a MINI and have a dealership in town. Their pricing is nuts. I am all about a fun car and something different than the neighbors, but $2k for leather? $1K for bluetooth? Maybe MINI hasn't heard, but technology is cheap, labor is expensive. I love the MINI's, but common sense may prevail with my next purchase.
Lexus IS250 - V6 RWD Cannot be ordered to spec Similar horsepower to the Mini, but 500+ lbs of extra weight Expensive maintenance from day one Decent resale Hard to find a manual Soft suspension/handling Luxury car features Luxury ride Semi-Luxury branding Bottom model of the brand
Cooper S Turbo 4 Included maintenance for the first few years, expensive thereafter FWD Exceptional resale totally customizable Cult-like brand Little to no luxury Exceptional handling Harsh ride Great gas mileage
The cars/brands are designed and marketed to very different personality types/market segments. Heck, throw in an Eos and complete the trifecta of cars in massively different segments being forced to compete.
I believe you have completely missed the point and in the process made mine...
Two completely different segments, MINI in the "cult-like" brand with small car performance, no luxury, and good mileage bumping up to entry luxury car costs.
Trust me, I would love to buy a MINI...I would like to think it fits my personality more than a Lexus, but I do want some things I consider basics such as leather, a sunroof, wheels. I am glad to see that car companies realize their is a market for people who don't need bigger cars, but still want to be able to have nice features, etc. rather than buying Hondas. But am having a real hard time pulling the trigger on a $30K MINI.
Maybe get fewer features? Avoid the sunroof - it hurts handling, weight, performance, etc.- and you'll shave 1200 off the purchase price.
Where are you finding an IS250 for only 30k? For that price, that IS250 lacks a sport package and xenon headlights - two things you're definitely finding in a Mini for 30k.
Like I said, they're different types of cars aimed at an entirely different segment.
Also blame the dollar free falling relative to the British Pound. We are starting to have the same problem with the Land Rovers. Land Rover has been steadily increasing prices to try and compensate for the falling dollar and they have trimmed our margins on the car as well. They have raised the invoice price more then the MSRP.
Can two people have a conversation without shouting while driving on the highway with the roof open? I am debating getting the premium on the 2008 (it's my first mini). I know I want a cooper S with the sport and cold packages. But I am not sure about premium now after I hear negative comments about the moon roof. I am in New York City area.
If you are zooming down the highway with the roof wide open, it will probably be noisy. It would also be noisy if you zoomed down the highway with the windows down. You can test drive to see exactly how it is.
- i've chosen to not add a sunroof for all of the listed in the above posts.
its just not worth the price. the 2008 models price a sunroof @ 1000. that is insane. it was 850 on the 2007. all the prices are going up on the 2008 as well as the package contents are changing. the premium is missing a few things as are other packages.
if i were u, id find a mini S 2007 (no technical changes btw 2008 and 2007) with the features u want or close to it.
i wanted the keyless access comfort feature, astro black, dynamic stability control and instead i've settled for Astro Black, xenon lights & arm rest. i guess i wasnt asking for much to begin with but i've settled on a compromise that is going to get me a car that is fun to drive and still affordable.
as much as i'd love to get anything i want, it is too easy to build a mini S into a 35k + car. too easy, really.
keep it basic. just ask yourself if you really need all that stuff. i have a car that has none of that, i wont miss it at all.
I am ordering a 2008 Mini S, and I'm debating about the value of the premium package with the sunroof. I saw a couple of postings that indicate it may not be worth it. I'm used to power sunroofs on Hondas and those have been nice, but the inability to completely shut out the sun might get old quick on the Mini. What are your thoughts? I'm thinking that the $1000 would be better spent on the comfort access entry and the stability control.
Also, I fell in love with the combo of sparkling silver body color with the tan leather seats. I realize that they will take more care, but can someone with the tan leather seats tell me how you like them and how they are holding up.
I could go for fewer features, but I have the cash if I want the options, problem is I personally can't get past the price of a MINI. I want someone to tell me it is "OK" to buy one when I could get an IS instead. It is the practicle side of me holding me up. As far as an getting an IS around $30K, I believe I can get a dealer to come down to $30K and yes, it would have no extras, but the standard items are comparable to the MINI built the way I want it. (I.e. -Standard wheels are 17's, sunroof, 6 disk CD, Leather, you get the picture). I don't know what I am going to do...I might just buy a bus pass.
The bus pass is a smarter investment. I really wish I lived in a city with real mass transit! A used car is also a far better idea than either of these cars.
I live in NYC and having a Mini over taking the bus/subway/taxi has improved my life tremendously!! Especially travelling at night for social reasons. Taxis keep going up and up and pretty soon to go from uptown to downtown it's easily $20 each way in a cab. Plus you can't always get a cab, esp on a weekend night, or if it's raining.
I do not like my sunroof at all. I don't think it's worth the 850 bucks on my 07. I got it cuz I bought off the lot but if I reorder after my lease is up I will DEF> NOT get it again. You get more breeze rolling down the windows and the air comes thru (a tiny bit, granted) but stillmakes noise on the freeway. Going on a long drive it's nice to feel peaceful in the car, not like you're on the road, if you know what I mean. I also have a 17 year old cat I travel with. He's already freaked out by being in the car and this little bit of noise makes the difference. Of course it depends on how good/bad the roads are too and a smooth road makes no noise but overall I'd NOT get the sunroof--although I know that some people love theirs.
ALSO, if you have the choice--TOTALLY get Comfort Access!!!! It is the BEST feature ever, and I got it by accident because it was with the car. I can't tell you how many zillions of times you're carrying something and the last thing you can do is dig for your key--or if you're in a hurry to get in--or if you're in a dark, scary parking lot--basically yuou simply open the door by pressing the button on the handle--so you can get in fast and lock it fast when you get out too. IT's the best.
I would NOT get the arm rest. It sucks. I was 300% into this darn arm rest initially and it was making or breaking my choice of cars I looked at on the lot. Now I realize it's such a terrible armrest I shouldn't have bothered. First of all, it's too low to 'rest' on. I NEVER use it to hold my elbow on. I'm a female and 5'6". Maybe if you are super tallwith long arms it would work, but generally it doesn't function as a 'rest'. As far as storage, it sucks too. There is enough room to fit a few coins in there, and maybe a pen or pencil. It's a very flat space and you can't even open the space up properly, the top slides back, but not all the way, so you only can access the front part easily.
I've seem some of the aftermarket armrests that look like big, roomy kind. If you are going to have one there, why not have one that actual does all you need it to? For 200 bucks it's certainly not worth it. Seems weird to have an empty space there but it's really not doing much anyway. I'd skip that, get Comfort Acess, and if you can afford it, get the aftermarket bigger arm rest. As far as the cupholder--both arm rests I believe block it, but really, you don't use this cupholder much anyway. I use the front too--one for change and the other for drinks--but it's small and doesn't fit most of the drinks you might get anyway. That back cupholder is not so useful except for people in the back.
GET COMFORT ACCESS!!! You WILL NOT regret it! I promise!!!
My other FAVE unexpected feature is autodim rearview mirror--it's the BEST.
My local MA offered me a 2007 Cooper S manual to lease for $400 a month for 36 months with no money down and 10k miles. the car includes sport package, premium package and leather seats. The MSRP was 27K.
This sounds about average price?
(i leased because i am reluctant buying such a small car but its too cool to ignore!)
It depends on what you are looking for but they are very different types of cars and one is RWD and the other FWD. I think you need to specify what your needs are and what you want in a car and then it's easier to answer your question.
I ordered my new MCs today. I have been building it online for over a month and of course I had all kinds of trouble making up my mind....color, options, etc. I chose MY with white top and stripes, white lenses, CWP, DSC, Auto, Bridge Spoke wheels, and a few other things. I didn't go overboard, just things that I wanted. I have two MG's with sticks so I felt that I could go with the AT with shift paddles seeing as my biggest nightmare is bumper to bumper traffic. Two weeks ago I test drove the Cooper and the "S" back to back and because I drove them cautiously I couldn't tell too much of a difference except for the fact that the "S" had 17's and I could feel and hear the road more. Anyway today I went back and drove both cars again only harder and yes the turbo sold me so I ordered it with the 16's and hope that they are a good compromise between the noisy 17" runflats and the 15's. My salesgirl was young..23.. but very nice and knowledgeable, not pushy at all. I have been reading many message boards and checked with Edmunds about pricing so I knew that a Mini let alone an 08 would sell for list so I asked for free rubber mats for the front and boot to seal the deal. The manager was nice but said that he would only give the fronts. I said "What!! I'm spending $25000. on a car and you wont give me that boot mat?" He wasn't really looking at me eye to eye until I said that and then he relented. I swear to god I was going to walk! I know they are a hot item and sell for list but hey this is America and you have to give SOMETHING in a transaction to make the buyer feel some satisfaction in the transaction right?
I have '08 model on order for a couple of weeks and, hopefully, by the end of January, it will be available for delivery. This is going to be a basic MC model with automatic transmission, BRG color with white roof and mirrors, no stripes, Premium and Sport packages, 16 inches tires and a couple other things, including Alarm System, front/rear Mud Flaps and a basic optional GPS. I have decided do not take the CWP. Price is MSRP with a some discount for the accessories. This is going to be my first experience with the MINI Cooper. Do you know if the standard MINI Cooper has a tinted glass? Are you going to utilize a premium or regular gas? My dealer told me that, after first 1.5K miles, I can safely fill it up with a regular gas. But, it could be very much just a "sales" trick. What do you think about this issue?
Comments
You could probably swing a new S2000 as well. RWD drop top that is quick handles super and returns 24 mpg around town.
Dennis
MSRP: $25,800
3 yr / 36K mi lease / $291 per month
Chilli Red with Black Bonnet stripes
Premium Package
Cold weather package
Anthracite roofliner
Brushed alloy interior
16" bridge spoke w/ performance tires
$2500 out-of-pocket includes first month's payment, security deposit, tax, title, fee, etc.
I remember I checked every dealer along the North-East coast and no one was willing to give that deal except Habberstad Mini NY. Talk to Maureen there (if you wish to go to NY).
6 Speed Manual
Pepper White w/ Black Roof/Mirrors
Cold Weather Package
Premium Package
Sport Package
Xenon Headlights
Auto Dimming Rear View Mirror
Universal Garage Door Opener
Chrome Line Interior
Cream White Color Line
Piano Black Interior Surface
Carpet Floor Mats
MSRP $23,445
Purchase $22,945
Hopefully it will be here just in time for Christmas!
The main thing is you got to order the colors and options you want and DID get some discount. Enjoy your new car when it arrives.
Dennis
I am wondering about Edmunds True Cost to own. The Depreciation has a graphic with a slider bar
$--------^---------$$$
Now the way I see it is if you have $------------------^$$$
You LOSE less at resale
If you have $-^-----------------$$$
You lose More
But the Mini always has terrific resale value and I figure I must be incorrect. can some one set me straight?
Which is more preferable for depreciation the ^ to be more towards the $$$ or the $?
Is that confusing enough? :confuse:
I think they are looking at the raw number on depreciation, not a percentage. So, even though the MINI might retain a higher percentage of the purchase price, it's depreciation rating is not any better than it's lower priced competitor, because of the actual depreciation in dollars.
But, I can look at two different cars, whose raw depreciation numbers are similar, and they have two very different ratings, so I'm at a loss to explain why.
Does that help? :surprise:
kyfdx
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Yeah that's how I'm reading it too, but I'd like to see Edmunds make it clearer so that $$$ = bad $ = Good
Something like this
Depreciation
$Good----------^----------$$$Bad
since it's in the middle in this case it's average.
It just doesn't make sense with some cars tho. Honda Civics are rated average to worse than average yet they sell very well and don't lose a lot of money from new so that means they should be closer to the $--^-----------$$$
end of the scale but very few cars actually are.
I'm baffled. :sick:
Maybe Edmunds can clear it all up by changing it to
Depreciation
Screwed---------^-------Great!
Something so that we know which end of the graph is the one we want to be on.
Thanks for your explanation
most of them are nightmares!
also, i want to know what a good buy $ is on a minicooper s
auto
black or white
premium package
comfort package
any good ideas?
monthy payments?
EXCELLENT OPTIONS:
comfort access, autodim mirror and automatic headlights--all excellent and you'll be glad you ahve them. the rearview mirror in particular, it doesn't make things smaller liek it does when you just flip the mirror,
bluetooth is GREAT--when it works. Although I can always hear perfectly, people I speak to say the quality is terrible. and I've called my own answering machine and left a message and it is pretty bad. If this improves it's worth it, if not..it's a feature that's helpful in an emergency but I end up not calling people because they complain about the quality--it drives them crazy, the static/in-out reception etc.
UNNECESSARY
fancy steering wheel. I never use the steering wheel--or rarely. since all the radio info is about two inches away from your right hand it's easier just to do it all from the radio/stereo buttons. both for the phone and the stereo controls it's MUCH easier to just do it all from the radio--and it's not like it's a stretch==you're in a mini
I never use cruise control. I don't know if you still have it without this steering wheel, but when I"m on the highway, I like to monitor my speed myself anyway.
arm rest: I was all gungho on the arm rest but it's such a TERRIBLE armrest, it's not worth the 200 bucks. IT's too low to 'rest' on, and the storage is terrible. Maybe one of those aftermarket armrests you can buy are bigger and better, this one is useless
fancy colors on the inside. I have interesting details--chrome mirrors, some color stuff on the insdie of the car. at first this was nice, now I hardly notice it' unless you are totally into the details, not worth the extra money, the car is already cute as it is.
sunroof--I hate my sunroof and I would not get one again. when you are on the highway, you can hear wind noise coming out of it--the car would be nice and quiet without that, and it doesn't block the sun during the summer--so you get uv rays on your face--if you want to avoid wrinkles like me, this is a pain. I ended up putting some cardboard between the net thinga nd roof to block the light all the summer anyway. I rarely use it and when I do I really can't tell a difference. You get more of a 'wind' feeling from rolling down the windows.
As far as being more spacious inside, the car is already roomy, so unless you are VERY tall in your seat, I can't see how the sunroof makes much of a difference. Also, since I live in NYC, the last thing I want to do is ride around town sucking in more pollution into my lungs by being more exposed to traffic.
I have the basic mini, not an S. I have not driven an S but the mini is just fine for highway. It goes faster than I intend often--like suddenly I'm at 80 before I realized it, so I don't feel like there is a lack of power. I'm a girl and not a car person so I'm no expert. But, really, the basic seems like plenty of zippiness.
Good deal on a Cooper S is a bit off MSRP - great deal is $500 off MSRP. Just order your mini.
Most people are going to want cruise control unless all they do is drive in the city. It makes long highway trips much more comfortable.
Its also nice to keep both hands on the wheel while driving even if the radio is within arms reach.
i am looking for an automatic minicooper S 2008 or 2007 (which year is recommended? 2008 is pricer for a mini cooper S options)
I am also looking for a list of options i should consider.
i live in Los Angeles.... so, do i need a sunroof?
I'm considering a premium package, i love the comfort package with the key less access key. my questions is: do i need this stuff? leather or leatherette or cloth? dynamic suspension necessary?
i am trying to keep this car as close to 24,000 as possible as it is my budget.
i am also considering the MINI Select option. Is this form of financing recommended? why or why not?
what colors look best, stripes combo? i love the white but i worry its too bland. black, i worry would get me killed on the fwy at night.
I've decided that long beach mini is the best deal for me. I'll let the forum know how that goes.
i did, however, go to assal mini in Monrovia for a test drive (that i had to push to get). and the ppl there don't know what they're doing and the sales manager is an [non-permissible content removed]. first, they told me that i couldn't order a 2007 anymore, which i can. secondly, they insulted my budget set for this car and then offered to throw in free mats. then, the sales manager pretended not to know what a mini select is.
i took the sales managers card. when i get my wonderful deal, I'll call him and let him know what i exactly think of him. maybe ill call tomorrow
so, ppl of the forum, i would really appreciate some input. I need help to buy my first car!
astro black
mini 2007
automatic
sunroof ( i live in la, it would be a waste not to)
comfort keyless entry
msrp: $25,000 - w/out tax & lic.
anyone think i can get tax etc and the car out the door for 25,000 ?
:confuse:
anyone know where i can get a deal like that? :surprise:
I would not waste your time with a dealership that did not treat you well. They really will not learn anything from you calling them back - if they have been in the business for a while they should know better.
Dennis
so u are saying that a moonroof option isnt worth it because it makes the car too hot and the drive isnt shady enough. i noticed that.
congrats on the convertible! sounds like my mini will not have a moonroof. i'm okay with that. i dont want to squint while driving, it would be a waste of an excellent driving experience.
thank you for the advice.
2. Because it adds weight/chassis flex
3. Because it throws off the balance
4. Because it's too expensive for what it does
5. Worried about breakage
If you live where it gets sunny and hot, you would need to seek out an aftermarket shade for the moonroof - I would think. Or you will need dark sunglasses and extra time to cool off the car. The backseat is about unusable, but even more light/heat gets in back there too.
A quick google shows some cloth things you can Velcro up to block all the sun, not sure how well they work or not - but I am positive there is something out there.
You do a good deal of complaints out noise with the roof open, probably more so on the MINI with just a large opening - but that is sort of par for the course with most moonroofs.
Dennis
So this is how I optioned it out, based on my needs.
2007 MINI Cooper S (1.6L 4cyl Turbo 6M)
ZSP Sport Package (w/White Web-Spoke Wheels)
226 Sport Suspension
322 Comfort Access
2TA Limited Slip Differential
4BE English Oak Interior Trim
473 Center Arm Rest
384 White Alloy Wheels
327 Bonnet Stripes White
382 Roof/Mirror Caps in White
Total with Options $25,659
Color: Chili Red
I might rethink the arm rest and the oak interior I'd have to see those in person first.
The dealer is just so far away. :sick:
Sunroofs can be a problem for all the reasons mentioned.
Premium Pkg is ok if you want that. Leatherette is a personal choice but you will cough up a lot for leather which must be maintained with cleaners. For me Leatherette which is vinyl, really wears a lot better IMO.
As far as performance enhancing things why buy a Mini if you don't get them?
Fuel economy has me looking at the Mini as it also offers good performance.
Might have to buy a Prius if gas keeps going up.
I get 30 MPG mixed, driving hard with my 07 Cooper S. It's not prius 45 mpg on 87 octane but smiles-per-mile are way higher!
I bet your MINI dealer isn't 1.5 hours away either.
That's why I just don't bother because MINI has no interest in expanding their dealership network. So if you have a problem you are screwed. I can't take a day off of work to get my car serviced. The Prius I haven't driven, and yet next month I probably will try one out. Thing is I drive so much highway I wonder if it will really be worth getting and I've had lots of cars on long commutes and once you hit 70mph the fuel economy drops off. The MINI has a tall 6th gear so that really helps.
I do tend to actually drive my cars and I get lower mileage as a result. I can't stand hypermilers they might save a few pennies a day but annoying to be stuck behind them unable to pass.
They want to save the environment but how much extra fuel is used in passing them?
They want to save the environment but how much extra fuel is used in passing them?
I am the same way, I drive the cars as intended and the heck with the little extra cost . Someone in the xB mileage forum mentioned they were getting nice mileage but they were shifting at 3k! The xB does not have much power to start with, but shift that early and you are not seeing much of it.
I can get 24-25mpg in the S2000 around town with the top down driving it like I stole it and about 28mpg on the highway with the top down.
The MINI, I am told, does nicely even if driven with spirit but all require premium fuel. The biggest problem for me is the much more desirable S has way too much torque steer when you mash on the go pedal - they need to make a RWD MINI .
As far as the hypermilers go, when they tailgate someone to improve THEIR mileage does that not cause the person dragging them along to have worse mileage? And as you said, when they keep a constant throttle then you have to pass them going up hills and they may coast past on going down. Having to go around them over and over surely does not help your mileage any.
Dennis
For me to get my car serviced I schedule it weeks in advance and take the car in at the for 7 am on a Saturday and either get a loaner or go for a really, really long walk.
I've totally ignored some recall notice regarding a dash storage compartment as I don't keep anything in my car and I'm not blowing 4-5 hours of any day on something I'll never use.
I don't know what's going on with people that they experience torque steer to such a degree in this car. My wife will attest to the fact I drive my Cooper S like a mad-man and yet never have torque steer issues.
1. Do they press the S button?
2. Do they try to do WOT from a dead stop?
3. Do they not hold the wheel?
Accelerate hard with FWD and the weight shifts back, thus you end up with several problems that can be avoided The lack of weight on the front tires/axle causes a loss of traction (with a Mini Cooper S the engine can easily spin the tires, lessen the pressure over the tires and that's even more pronounced). Steering, even with S-button action, will feel lighter in this situation as the contact patch is low and momentum/weight is on the back of the car, giving the illusion of loose steering. Torque steer will feel more pronounced in this situation now as there is so little contact/weight over the front axle, there's less to keep the wheels from moving naturally to the right. Quite simply applying throttle in the wrong way for a light FWD car like this creates torque steer.
This isn't some 4k lbs caddy STS. Roll off the light and apply steadily increasing power. You can easily smoke just about every normal person off the line still. By 4k you should be nearing or at WOT. Hit the 1-2 shift, now go ahead with WOT as the weight won't be thrown off - weight over the front tires, good contact patch, zero torque steer, zero wheel spin.
I don't even like FWD but all this whining about torque steer from Edmunds.com and others makes me wonder how people are driving any car that's FWD.
My snow day xB even has some torque steer but with a lot less ponies under the hood not enough to bother me.
Cars should be RWD or at least AWD - once you have driven performance RWD cars getting in any FWD is a compromise and it really "glares" in the S with a manual tranny. If you are used to FWD then it just more of the same and may not bother you as much. Good thing I didn't drive the demo with all the JCW stuff on it .
Dennis
I understand the differences - I've gone from two BMW 330is (e46 ZHP 6MT, e90 ZSP 6MT) in a row to a R56 Cooper S 6MT. I didn't experience any torque steer with a Mazdaspeed3 but then again, unlike in a RWD car, I won't punch WOT unless I'm over 15-20 mph because quite frankly WOT in a powerful FWD car is pretty illogical. Heck, even in a cheese Chevy rental with a 4 pot and 4-speed auto WOT from a standstill can attempt to wrench the wheel.
I'm not a FWD fan - as I clearly stated in my original post to you - but I don't think it's the least bit difficult to retrain your foot to massage the throttle from a standstill. Hell, you have to enter corners in a totally different way too. Press the S-button, massage the throttle, brake extremely late into corners...part of the R56 driving experience and 180 degrees from pushing an S2000 hard. You can't use the throttle to steer with a FWD...unless you want to end up in a ditch.
For me to get my car serviced I schedule it weeks in advance and take the car in at the for 7 am on a Saturday and either get a loaner or go for a really, really long walk.
So you are in about the same position I am in, distance wise. Is it worth going through all that for it?
Thanks, I've heard some horror stories and if something bad happens it's a lot of back and forth. I agree it shouldn't need much if all is well with it.
Lexus IS250 -
V6
RWD
Cannot be ordered to spec
Similar horsepower to the Mini, but 500+ lbs of extra weight
Expensive maintenance from day one
Decent resale
Hard to find a manual
Soft suspension/handling
Luxury car features
Luxury ride
Semi-Luxury branding
Bottom model of the brand
Cooper S
Turbo 4
Included maintenance for the first few years, expensive thereafter
FWD
Exceptional resale
totally customizable
Cult-like brand
Little to no luxury
Exceptional handling
Harsh ride
Great gas mileage
The cars/brands are designed and marketed to very different personality types/market segments. Heck, throw in an Eos and complete the trifecta of cars in massively different segments being forced to compete.
Two completely different segments, MINI in the "cult-like" brand with small car performance, no luxury, and good mileage bumping up to entry luxury car costs.
Trust me, I would love to buy a MINI...I would like to think it fits my personality more than a Lexus, but I do want some things I consider basics such as leather, a sunroof, wheels. I am glad to see that car companies realize their is a market for people who don't need bigger cars, but still want to be able to have nice features, etc. rather than buying Hondas. But am having a real hard time pulling the trigger on a $30K MINI.
Where are you finding an IS250 for only 30k? For that price, that IS250 lacks a sport package and xenon headlights - two things you're definitely finding in a Mini for 30k.
Like I said, they're different types of cars aimed at an entirely different segment.
I am in New York City area.
You can test drive to see exactly how it is.
its just not worth the price. the 2008 models price a sunroof @ 1000. that is insane. it was 850 on the 2007. all the prices are going up on the 2008 as well as the package contents are changing. the premium is missing a few things as are other packages.
if i were u, id find a mini S 2007 (no technical changes btw 2008 and 2007) with the features u want or close to it.
i wanted the keyless access comfort feature, astro black, dynamic stability control and instead i've settled for Astro Black, xenon lights & arm rest. i guess i wasnt asking for much to begin with but i've settled on a compromise that is going to get me a car that is fun to drive and still affordable.
as much as i'd love to get anything i want, it is too easy to build a mini S into a 35k + car. too easy, really.
keep it basic. just ask yourself if you really need all that stuff. i have a car that has none of that, i wont miss it at all.
mini is a fun car. enjoy it and good luck!
btw, my car is coming in on the 4th!!!!
Also, I fell in love with the combo of sparkling silver body color with the tan leather seats. I realize that they will take more care, but can someone with the tan leather seats tell me how you like them and how they are holding up.
thanks!
I could go for fewer features, but I have the cash if I want the options, problem is I personally can't get past the price of a MINI. I want someone to tell me it is "OK" to buy one when I could get an IS instead. It is the practicle side of me holding me up.
As far as an getting an IS around $30K, I believe I can get a dealer to come down to $30K and yes, it would have no extras, but the standard items are comparable to the MINI built the way I want it. (I.e. -Standard wheels are 17's, sunroof, 6 disk CD, Leather, you get the picture).
I don't know what I am going to do...I might just buy a bus pass.
I do not like my sunroof at all. I don't think it's worth the 850 bucks on my 07. I got it cuz I bought off the lot but if I reorder after my lease is up I will DEF> NOT get it again. You get more breeze rolling down the windows and the air comes thru (a tiny bit, granted) but stillmakes noise on the freeway. Going on a long drive it's nice to feel peaceful in the car, not like you're on the road, if you know what I mean. I also have a 17 year old cat I travel with. He's already freaked out by being in the car and this little bit of noise makes the difference. Of course it depends on how good/bad the roads are too and a smooth road makes no noise but overall I'd NOT get the sunroof--although I know that some people love theirs.
ALSO, if you have the choice--TOTALLY get Comfort Access!!!! It is the BEST feature ever, and I got it by accident because it was with the car. I can't tell you how many zillions of times you're carrying something and the last thing you can do is dig for your key--or if you're in a hurry to get in--or if you're in a dark, scary parking lot--basically yuou simply open the door by pressing the button on the handle--so you can get in fast and lock it fast when you get out too. IT's the best.
I would NOT get the arm rest. It sucks. I was 300% into this darn arm rest initially and it was making or breaking my choice of cars I looked at on the lot. Now I realize it's such a terrible armrest I shouldn't have bothered. First of all, it's too low to 'rest' on. I NEVER use it to hold my elbow on. I'm a female and 5'6". Maybe if you are super tallwith long arms it would work, but generally it doesn't function as a 'rest'. As far as storage, it sucks too. There is enough room to fit a few coins in there, and maybe a pen or pencil. It's a very flat space and you can't even open the space up properly, the top slides back, but not all the way, so you only can access the front part easily.
I've seem some of the aftermarket armrests that look like big, roomy kind. If you are going to have one there, why not have one that actual does all you need it to? For 200 bucks it's certainly not worth it. Seems weird to have an empty space there but it's really not doing much anyway. I'd skip that, get Comfort Acess, and if you can afford it, get the aftermarket bigger arm rest. As far as the cupholder--both arm rests I believe block it, but really, you don't use this cupholder much anyway. I use the front too--one for change and the other for drinks--but it's small and doesn't fit most of the drinks you might get anyway. That back cupholder is not so useful except for people in the back.
GET COMFORT ACCESS!!! You WILL NOT regret it! I promise!!!
My other FAVE unexpected feature is autodim rearview mirror--it's the BEST.
This sounds about average price?
(i leased because i am reluctant buying such a small car but its too cool to ignore!)
thanks for your thoughts.
It depends on what you are looking for but they are very different types of cars and one is RWD and the other FWD. I think you need to specify what your needs are and what you want in a car and then it's easier to answer your question.