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I am surprised, both have stopped ???? Last I checked, the " sin" and emigration are not against the laws, even in WA !
Just watched a CR video.
consumerreports.org/cro/news/2013/07/talking-cars-our-experts-discuss-the-tesla-battery-swap-diesels-and-some-disappointing-test-results/index.htm
Long story short: in winter the 300 mile Tesla BATTERY range drops 33% to app 200 miles range. Comparo with diesel: 600 mile range in winter, 600 mile range in other 3 seasons (ho hum, zzzzzzzz....). If the 33% ( fuel, aka mpg) ) drop was true of diesel products, they would be crucified with RUSTY nails !!
Surprising (to me) diesel take.!!
On another CR podcast about Acura MDX "impressive fuel mpg @ 20."
consumerreports.org/cro/news/2013/09/talking-cars-episode-12-video-podcast-american-cars/index.htm
lol, even my 15 year old minivan is still getting 21 combined.
(Yep, 15 - it had a birthday yesterday).
From elsewhere on the forums - A Subaru-Powered Hybrid Truck May Replace The US Army's HUMVEE. (diesel/hybrid).
lol, even my 15 year old minivan is still getting 21 combined.
My wife's 24 year old LS400 still gets 17 MPG on Premium. Not bad for 90% city freeway driving. Been driving it more to take pressure off the Nissan PU. My insurance is based on less than 7000 miles per year. Kind of crazy to go over on one and way under on the other.
About the HumVee, I don't think the $7500 tax credit would push me to buy one. I just hope the diesel hybrid will be built in the USA. Though unlikely without the needed resources for batteries and electric motors.
Looks like it has a killer sound system inside..who wudda thunk??
I wonder why the boxer engine design? You wouldn't think that that slightly lower engine config COG would make that much difference..mind you 40º side sloping is pretty amazing given its wheel stance. Interesting the type of battery use. I hadn't heard of a Navitas Li-Iron Phosphate Battery before.
Maybe that's where Tesla has gone wrong with their (predictably) poor cold wx performance...using meager ol' fashioned lithium ions.
I had a chance to go out in Fintail's neck of the woods in the literal "BUSH" in a diesel humvee with app $250,000 worth of communications equipment loaded in, a few years ago !? Man, talk about sensory overload.
Maybe that's where Tesla has gone wrong with their (predictably) poor cold wx performance...using meager ol' fashioned lithium ions.
If they are similar to the Li-Ion batteries in the Leaf, they will lose capacity quickly in hot places like AZ.
I hadn't heard of a Navitas Li-Iron Phosphate Battery before.
I think those are the latest in Lithium battery technology. Not sure who has the patent on them. Navitas ended up with the military branch of A123 when the Chinese bought the main part of the company. It is probably A123 that developed that technology. They just did not last long enough to make any money on it.
Tesla buys their Cells from Panasonic. So made in Japan. GM buys theirs from LG out of Korea.
There are HUGE HUGE HUGE downstream consequences to the "natural" loss of lithium ion battery energy. Did I mention HUGE? HUGE ? HUGE? . CR in a pod cast noted 33% loss due to weather! Even CR really did not make a big deal about this issue. It was almost like a footnote about the "quirkiness" of the energy source. So in addition to the MPG varying due to driver and environmental variables, the energy content and COSTS varies also.
Perhaps an illustration is in order. I won't bore folks with the diesel side calculations except to say @ $.4 per gal, 30 mpg posts .1333 cents per mile driven. RUG @ $3.49 @ 20 mpg (like model gasser/gasser hybrid VW T) posts $.17.5 cents per mile driven. So assuming the cost per mile driven (EQUIVALENT) is higher for electrical (@ 30 cents per KWH), a 33% energy loss would push the cost per mile driven to higher than .232 cents per mile driven. (75% more (than diesel) per mile driven) As a minimum a 33% loss raises the cost per KWH from .30 cents to .40 cents. The real difficulty here is no one posts mpg, gasoline/diesel equivalent ELECTRICAL costs. So this is @ at best an UNDER estimate !!!!!!
To put a scale and reality to this, this is on a HUGE HUGE HUGE high tech break through on the lithium jon battery milestone of 300 miles on "one fill" I am really surprised @ how matter a fact the envirocons are to this MASSIVE and ongoing losses. A 33% loss is 100 miles or only a max of 200 miles.
The dead calm SILENCE on this issue is ABSOLUTELY deafening !!!!! If gassers or more specific to this thread DIESELS were to do this, we would tar and feather each and run them out of town on the proverbial rails.
The dead calm SILENCE on this issue is ABSOLUTELY deafening !!!!! If gassers or more specific to this thread DIESELS were to do this, we would tar and feather each and run them out of town on the proverbial rails.
All part of the Green Agenda to diminish any negatives associated with the latest and greatest in alternatives. If my new Touareg TDI were to drop a third down to 17 MPG I would be real upset. The Media would have it front page Diesel loses one third its energy.
Thanks, Steve, but I don't think that was what was going on, as expanding the box before I even start has been my usual practice. Since, I have never seen the issue again. On thinking about it, I think I had used Firefox that day.
Regarding using the Save button, is this a way that I could save someone else's post like we used to be able to do? i.e. do a quote that has the content you want saved of someone's post, then hit Save Draft. Will it always be there in Drafts, or will it post like-it-or-not, the next time you hit Post Comment?
Ironically enough, and as an indication of just how pleased you are with the VW T, IF it actually did only deliver 17 mpg, you STILL would be more pleased with it than you ever were with the Sequoia. If I have interpreted your comments about the T correctly, it has better sound, better seats, quieter, better handling, more range (even if 17 mpg) and more urge. About the only thing lacking compared to the Seq is a bit less cargo room.
Considering that it gets near 30 mpg average with your usual habits so far, is it any wonder you are absolutely thrilled with it?
Does Mrs. Gary drive?
Hm, this might work for you. When you like a post you can hover down to the right of the Flag/Quote and then click on Insightful or Awesome. Then you can go to your Profile and click the Insightful or Awesome or LOL link and all those marked posts will show up.
To kill one you didn't mean to mark Insightful, you can hover over the post in your Profile and click Insightful again and that'll remove it from your list.
Not sure what you mean? I tried right clicking the date and get 5 or 6 options which I can't remember now what they are. None had a save option..one did say "bookmark the link". But do you mean I would have to make my own folder somewhere and save all the individual links?
As for bookmarking a discussion, how could that possibly be helpful to find a specific post in a discussion that is already bookmarked like this one, that has thousands of posts?
With the old site, I remember I had saved one of your posts with a link about how to find gas stns without ethanol. And had lots of other random saved posts that had info I knew I would want to refer back to at times when trying to help someone troubleshoot a car issue etc. I do miss that ability. I also miss that the posts are not numbered. Even if not being able to directly quote, it becomes confusing when you are reading 'old' posts that have been regenerated and it shows someone replying to 'someone' but of course we have no idea now who they were replying to now. One of them actually said.."in response to post xxx" which of course is also no help now. I know, life is full of compromises..and I get that these must be some that come with the new platform, but am mentioning so that you guys know what things are important to members, because as Karen (I think) or Kirstie said, that some features are not activated yet until we find our feet...or something to that effect.
Don't mind me, I'm still in edit mode.
Try the new version of my post, lol.
The one, two, three, devastating punches are that the (real) electrical energy consumption in the subject scenario is many more times consumptive and POLLUTIVE ! This is so over RUG/PUG and even higher over diesel !!!!! ?????
Yet, the assumption is that MY and YOUR TDI double handedly causes all the smog in San Jose and San Diego !
It is also mention by some on this board that it is not cost effective !! ??
Ironically, the Tesla plant is literally up the street, down the road !! I can again literally bike there !
Interesting. So I tried that..hit Insightful on your post, then went to my profile (mine right?) and hit Insightful, but it took me to a post that Karen had marked one of my posts Insightful.
Hm, maybe it doesn't work the way I think it does. Will have to mull on that one for a while.
10-4
**Considering that it gets near 30 mpg average with your usual habits so far, is it any wonder you are absolutely thrilled with it?
Does Mrs. Gary drive?**
She drives it once in a while. I would not have sold the Sequoia and bought the T-Reg, if not for the improvement in mileage. All the other things like acceleration, handling, comfort, music, quiet, etc etc were icing on the cake. Unlike the Tesla, I don't have to worry about losing MPG in the future. VW has engineered the vehicle better than Tesla has their battery powered EV.
>
While that is true, on (strictly) a technicality, your mileage will probably drop. First it will probably go up a bit during the first 70k miles (assuming you never suffer the unfortunate purchase of less than nice clean fuel...depending then wholly on the filter systems). Then, as injectors and system pressurizing pump etc all age a bit then fuel won't be atomized as well etc. But..like I say, the drop will be a non-issue and only mentioned as a strict technicality. I knew, you knew that..or at least a very safe assumption.
On a different note..very interesting read on one of the other forums where you were discussing wx conditions and that Russian ship becoming icebound. Not your everyday common request on their part to be sure. Was cool you were able to offer some help.
Dang cold up here..has been -12 the last few nights and not gotten above 0 thru the day. Been going through my nice fresh (12 mo old exactly) red oak at a rate that I'd be perfectly happy cutting in half or less still
.
Got my eyes on another big guy (also red oak) that was suppose to be a veneer log (about $900-1200/section, and had two sections up to about the 22' mark) but last night I heard some LOUD snaps
It woke me right up..cuz the dang frost just took that veneer log and turned it into a saw log (or firewood) in about .25 seconds..
You give a "new high tech" meaning to that concept about "money growing on trees".
. On the other hand I like 6 in high hardwood baseboards. 
Ya...the trick is knowing when to harvest. I'm actually a bit too far north for ideal harvesting. Not only are my temps here too cold and increase this risk of frost splitting the tree, there is actually quite a bit of mineral that can vein through the tree too..although I have not seen much of that on any of my trees..not sure why but it's ok with me..
Three years ago I decided to harvest but the wx conditions weren't conducive to protecting my forest floor, so held off. Decided to see a guy who uses horses (Clydesdales) but he was booked for the rest of that season. Now the poor guy is having health issues too, so my trees are still there for the taking. Pricing has to be right too, and there is a discouraging amount of importation happening from overseas. Those guys undercut ANYTHING and EVERYTHING..:(
I like hardwood trim too. If I ever get the house finished, I plan to use hardwood floors and trim.
Hope I live long enough (and my back will see me thru) to see it happen..
It is Global Warming that causes the temps to drop early in the winter and split your hardwoods. The liars in the NWS are telling everyone how warm it is in CA. Yet the thermometer and the old bones know better. Not too worried about long term mileage loss on the Touareg. I would imagine the vehicle will get traded before it hits 70k miles. I have a 24 year old Lexus with 106k miles on the odo.
I would agree. For as much as some have vilified diesel passenger cars ( for environmental reasons), to their "counterintuitiveness," diesels actually contribute to "the CLEAN cause". It is almost sheer delusional lunacy to say or think that those not in the the far left envirocon fringe want dirty air and water. In fact in CA, MTBE which was rammed down the proverbial throats of CA by the "LEFTIES" made DIRTY water a natural result !!!!!!!! BILLIONS of regulatory and remedial DOLLARS later, we taxpayers are still suffering and paying for this DUMB and misguided environcon legislation and enforcement. Indeed DESPITE millions more "PRIUSes" etc., there are more "spare the air" high pollution days than BEFORE !
If the ultimate goal is to dense UP already high density cities, (so called: getting rid of cars), there are a host of disadvantages far worse than a few more g/miles of emissions.
Same here! LOL
I like red oak, and have purchased my fair share of it for cabinets, trim, etc., so I'm doing my part to keep you in (possible) business and me poor.
This has to be an interesting irony! Even unions are distrustful of .... UNIONS unions !! ??
Fiat stock soars on Chrysler deal but unions worry
By Frances D'Emilio
Associated Press
mercurynews.com/business/ci_24835450/fiat-stock-soars-chrysler-deal-but-unions-worry
Reminds of of that old newspaper (black and white) cartoon "SPY vs SPY."
With the so called "BAD GUY's" defined as the ONE percenter%'s, rapidly running out of folks to BLAME ! ?
The "old" Chrysler is keeping Fiat afloat.
Not sure what this has to do with diesels though.
I wonder if the cash cows Jeep & Ram will still be made in USA now that FIAT is fully in control. I was looking forward to both offering diesels in light duty vehicles. If the Italian Unions are as repressive as the UAW, this will give FIAT more flexibility to move production around. They are also the biggest in Brazil a growing market. Will be interesting to watch.
I am not sure as to your first sentence. I have just read that FIAT is buying the 41.5% the UAW's UNION Pension Fund owns, for between $3.5 to 4.4 B, US.
Well, I think (discussion)"OPTIONS" might "FLOW" from both new (Italian) ownership, coming back from the "brink", and some other things, that I am probably not privy to.
As it applies to diesels, Chrysler has always had BIG TDI's in (heavy) "light" trucks. They have also not reversed the Dodge Sprinter TDI's (MB's leftover legacy?) . OFF again, ON again Jeep TDI's is off to a rocky start. In addition, the Dodge RAM will come out in 14 MY with a 3.0 L TDI !! So to make a longer unfolding story short, they might continue with at worst, the current diesel line and at best, expanding the diesel line. The American taxpayer has already done a bail out for them. If they get into trouble or crap out again, the safety net will undoubtedly be US again !! ??
However, I am mindful that MB was on the whole, not successful in making a functional "frankenstein hybrid" company work. My take is they exited glad that most body parts were still intact, aka not bleeding massive cash. How will the new Italian ownership do? Ah, remains to be seen.
Reminds of of that old newspaper (black and white) cartoon "SPY vs SPY."
HEY! "SPY vs SPY" was in the distinguished periodical MAD Magazine.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
I think VW has a supply problem. I think TDI sales have taken VW by surprise. Though they use the same drive train in several Audis and the Porsche Cayenne. It would seem they probably get first shot at the supply.
Volkswagen’s high-mileage, TDI® Clean Diesel models totaled 95,823 units for the year accounting for 23.5 percent of sales in 2013 and 17.8 percent in December. Since 2,000, Volkswagen of America has delivered over 500,000 TDI® Clean Diesel vehicles.
Sales mix for Audi A6 TDI finished the month at 12.5%, for the Audi A7 TDI at 11%, for the A8 TDI to 12.8%, the Audi Q5 TDI at 16%, and for the Audi Q7 TDI at 28.7%.
All those models use the same V6 TDI engine transmission. No wonder, it is a great choice. VW does not seem concerned about less sales. I cannot imagine buying a VW that is not diesel.
I would not be surprised VW A will probably report another profitable year. Given those numbers and a banner new car sales year, (est 15.5 M) VW (brand) would be projected to have 2.6 % market share @ 407,758 units, total production. VW diesels would be .0062 % OF new car yearly sales. (less than 1%)
Good chart showing the sales by VW model at autospies.com. Not further broken down by fuel unfortunately.
December was a bit of a meltdown for most manufacturers.
I think overall the auto market paints an interesting picture. I see Mercedes up 14% on the year topping all other luxury brands with 312k. And a much larger emphasis on diesel. Audi is up big in December and YOY. They went into diesel in a BIG way. BMW is up 9% YOY with no mention of their diesel percentage. BMW did not have a good year selling SUVs. Maybe they need to offer more diesels. It looks to me like the cheap B&B vehicles from the majors did ok and the Luxury did great. Which kind of gives you a picture of our economy. The rich did very well. The poor did ok on welfare and the middle classes picked up the tab.
A very interesting observation/narrative about the "inverse" view of the US economic MIRROR through the auto industry. (sort of like radar pinging)
So while 10.5 M vehicles were sold @ one of the heights of the 2009 economic decline ( or should I say ) @ the depth of the trough, 15.5 M PROJECTED sales in 13 MY is both complex and telling. To project yet again, 2014 is anticipated to post even higher sales, @ 16.5 M.
Specifically to diesels, it would seem to (continues to) have very very high bars to entry ($$$'s, legislative and regulatory to boot) into diesel markets. Once inside, customer expectations are VERY VERY high, and on many levels AND @ ALL price points.
VW may be soft because "cheap" gas has tempted people to buy more trucks and SUVs. Looks like everyone is blaming the weather for the fall in December sales. (bostonherald.com).
RIGHT, all this midwestern to eastern GLOBAL WARMING !!!!!
While very counterintuitive to me, and perhaps a conscious or unconscious revolt against enviroconistic jack boot CONTROL, albeit to jack boot UNION control, it might be reflective of what is happening IN reality. That is as real or as wacked out or a combination there of as that might be.
The part that gives me pause is: if VW is selling 23.7% diesels, the other hand clapping is 76.5% or the MAJORITY selling are VW gassers.
The so called energy CRISIS/armageddon has been discovered as being DEAD a LONG time ago. The new US energy DOMINANCE has been put down at EVERY turn, even as those same oppressors mouth the dawning of the US energy self sufficiency. As a result this "REVOLUTION" rates barely a yawn, competing for the ADD news attention.
Real World news has long since mimicked Hollywood FICTION !!!!!
Looks like Subaru had a good December in spite of the weather. Or maybe because of it. I could really like the Forester with a diesel and non CVT transmission. The Forest was up 51% in December and 61.9% for the year. I think that speaks highly of the looks as well as practicality. The CVT in the Outback could be why it's sales are flat. Subaru should use an Aisin 6-8 speed transmission to mate up with their diesel and put it in the Forester. They are really limiting their diesel sales around the world with only a 6 speed manual. I know a few posters here would be happy with one. Then maybe they are selling all they can build right now.
@ruking1, I still don't get your rant about the UAW in a diesel thread. VW is mostly union in most of the world. And the big 3 diesel passenger truck makers are all UAW, at least in the US and Canada (probably MX too). Did something change since 2007? (greencarcongress.com)
You shut down the UAW thread and VW is the premier diesel auto maker in the USA. With the UAW chomping at the bit to sink their teeth into VW & destroy the entire US auto manufacturing business.
We can reopen it again, but there rarely seems to be any union related talk on it.
Actually it is open. I'll cc you on your deleted posts and you can repost them over there.
Then we'll just flag the off-topic ones for abuse.
I am scratching my head here. Not too long ago we had almost all the big three fall off the proverbial CLIFF and the US taxpayers et. al had to bail most out. The unions got considerable stock, control and concessions etc. and I am RANTING ?
What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?
Funny that people who can as far as I can tell benefited from union largesse or were public sector "workers" in their prime complain about the abuses, real and imagined, of the UAW. Glass houses, stones, and all that.
But to answer the question, for newbie diesel owners, more predictable and defendable deltas in RUG vs diesel might help. RUG is up to 3.43 at my local Chevron, diesel holds at the same 3.99 where it has been for 6 months or more. Not much incentive for the typical Camcord buyer.
I would take the bait. However we now have our UAW thread back. I would be glad to explain the dynamics of keeping a Union sound.
I was "ranting" about CVT transmissions !? Perhaps a good reason why current oems don't do them on diesels?
latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-hy-nissan-rogue-20140104,0,2922716.story
I did not realize that Subaru has kept a 4 speed auto in their Forester vs a CVT in the others. Could be the reason it is their best seller. I thought they all had CVT. My daughter was going to buy the Outback until she drove the Forester and liked it better. Could it be the rubber band and screaming engine in the Outback turned her off? For such a well run company it seems crazy they cannot keep up with the times and get at least a 6 speed auto that can handle the torque of a diesel engine.
From the Brits that have choices:
You can forget this because you don’t want a Lineartronic gearbox anyway.
Why?
Because it’s a CVT automatic, and therefore awful. OK, it’s tolerable in manual mode, but when so many rivals have excellent autos, this isn’t good enough. That Subaru has chosen it as the sole transmission for the 237bhp turbo petrol is a major disappointment.**
So you’d have the diesel?
Not to put too finer point on it, yes. From any normal standpoint it’s the only one that makes sense. Don’t have the base 2.0-litre 148bhp non-turbo petrol. It’s not really man enough for the job. The 145bhp diesel, with 258lb ft of torque and a perfectly acceptable manual gearbox, is in many ways just as enjoyable to drive.
Another related point about turbos (might be TMI to some) is that the majority of turbo DIESEL configurations seems to bypass a lot of the oil "consumption issues" that GASSER turbos seem to have more OF. A lot of dealers either buy into the mantra or say it to keep folks from "EXCESSIVE" complaining, that 1 liter/quart consumption per 1,500 miles is "NORMAL". The nexus here is the so called "rubber banding" in CVT's, meaning the engine seems to hit higher rpm for many more times and LONGER in so called "normal" to testing operations. This kind of operation would tend to exacerbate oil consumption in addition to an engine that might be prone sans a CVT to oil CONSUMPTION.
Now for the greater audiences, this is NOT to say that the majority or a higher percentage of GASSER turbos do !! It just seems to be ONE of the major issues, when the discussion comes around.
As it applies to diesel turbos, I made sure to check for the chances of oil consumption and how much,for each engine that I buy, so far turbo diesels': 1.9 L, 2.0 L, 3.0 L. (all being VW turbo diesels). Related transmissions are 5/6 speed M/T, 6 speed DSG, 8 speed A/T.Observed/anecdotal miles is app 300,000.
So far oil consumption is app 4 to 16 oz in OCI's of 30,000 miles. Now I do not know if this is good/bad. It does however set the bar so to speak. I would be inclined to have serious reservations about a diesel or ANY other fuel sources, if it consumed anything close to 1 qt./l per 1,500 miles. I routinely take the rpm's to 75% to 78% of red line's. (5,100 rpm)
Now I am curious about gas/hybrids,i.e., Priuses, as that issue never seems to come up.
Your 30000 mile OCI always tend to shock me. Only because you seem to get away with it on vehicles in your fleet that have a high number of miles on them and seemingly still get good enough mpg that premature engine wear from not having (what some may consider to be) enough fresh oil in the engine to get to those high miles.
How many miles on the Civic? I think that one has the lowest miles right? Surely you don't make it endure those extended OCIs too? Cuz I think if you do, as the miles start to creep up you will probably be reporting back to us that it too is using (too much) oil between changes.
I guess I was confused. The 2013 Forester which my daughter bought is a 4 speed auto. The new 2014 Forester went to the Awful (As the Brits described it) CVT. So much for ever owning a Subaru diesel.