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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?
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I don't put much stock in CR anyway. When I bought my 2005 Passat TDI in Oregon, I printed out all the ARCO stations on the route back to San Diego. We did not come right down Interstate 5. We wandered for a week along the coast and then inland to avoid Los Angeles. I picked ARCO at the time as it was the only brand selling ULSD in CA. It was a year later that it was mandated. The first tank was a bit close as we went from the dealer's to Santa Rosa CA almost 700 miles. Had less than a gallon left in the tank. Since then never an issue with our Mercedes RV and now our Touareg. Try to find the cheapest Shell or Chevron.
Oh, 12 oz left instead of 6 oz !!??? Oh the horror !!!!
Even IF I came close to that in the VWT TDI, @ 35 mpg a tank (26.4 gal) would yield 924 miles. Realistically, I'd be ok with ONLY 910 miles.
I have had experiences of notable misses (anecdotally) following CR auto recommendations. While should hold it against them, I do not. FF to nowadays, almost EVERY publication have consumer product evaluations, , Almost ALL products have multiple spin offs.
I got steered wrong by CR in '74 shopping for a canoe. That grudge has been going as long as my Volvo one.
Here's your chance for you entrepreneurs - invent a gizmo that lets you use the big nozzle without spraying yourself down with diesel fuel. Dieselfunnel.com is available for the taking too.
My 2014 VW TDI with Nav has an option for Diesel Fuel Stations in the POI. On my recent trip to NM, I found that the ULSD was widely available.
Yes, with all the information available, I just scratch my head on that one. Even my (the) Costco special, (read CHEAP) GPS. has diesel station information.
Speaking of fueling close to M/T, I was trolling for the closest and cheapest station (along the way of a 46 mile errand path) which happened to be one of the ones I normally use anyway, the low fuel lamp lit as I pulled into the station for ULSD ($3.99) So working back wards, I filled 14.8 gals /15.6 gal (.8 gal left) @ 549 miles, for 37 mpg.
Get the expensive GPS and maybe the POIs will tell you the size of the diesel nozzles.
Actually, it is pretty much a no brainer. (DIESEL) TRUCK stops tend to have high flow nozzles with some pumps that DO have PVF nozzles !!!!! This is even better, as not many diesel cars tend to go to truck stops, aka little to NO waiting. Most truckers don't like to take on 250 gals+ of diesel fuel (normal capacity) dispensed with an "eye dropper".
Any NON truck stop that sells diesel has 100% "PVF" diesel nozzles.
Aren't diesel prices usually better at the truck stops? That's often the rule with gas.
Maybe that's mostly an Interstate thing.
Yes and yes/no !!
TMI:
There are also stations like "COMMERCIAL" Fuel Network, like CFN.
http://www.cfnnet.com/index.html
Before I clicked your link I assumed you were talking about those usually unattended spots where you have to have a card reader to pump the fuel. I've stopped at a lot of Flying J's (and Petros and Loves). Never checked out the pumps though, and usually the semis have their own plaza at the big places.
Even the pros sometimes have trouble figuring out which nozzle goes where.
Oops! QuickChek pumps diesel into regular gas cars (app.com)
Yes.
Yes the semis also need two tank ( and 2 nozzle) filling. AKA one high flow nozzle per 125 gal per tank.
TMI beyond TMI: I have also been to a number of (N/A) INDIAN truck fuel stations.
Every truck stop I have gone by has a low Cash price. They charge extra for CC which kills my 3% from AMEX. Not to mention they stink and I have to watch out or will walk through diesel spills. Usually the stations in town away from the Interstates are less expensive. Of course we are usually on those roads less traveled so find the bargain priced fuel. Truck stops have likely turned off more potential diesel car buyers than anything else.
When we had the Sequoia I did fill at the Flying J outside of Albuquerque. It was the best MPG of the trip. I have found NM & CO gas give the best gas mileage. Not so with Diesel. I have gotten my best mileage so far with Shell ULSD. Worst with two tanks of Mobil ULSD. Must be why the Walkers and Gerdes use Shell.
Yes, I think it is really a question of whether or not going to truck stops is in most folks comfort zones or are they willing to push their limits a bit.
In that sense, Shell seems to have anticipated the ULSD/diesel PVF market shifts and have positioned (in more RUG/PUG retail markets, concept rehab) to capture their market share to EXPAND it. I personally prefer ULSD in a separate area, but that does not keep me from using "normal (PVF) fuel" stations, multiple hose positions. . Chevron's seem to be on bigger properties. (which I like also) The local indy ( that I use) has a HUGE PVF area, (aka, NEVER had to wait) and separated from the truck stop portion by a food and snack and other travel essentials sales store.
I hit quite a few trucks stops on our travels and don't find myself paying more for using my credit card (usually it's the Shell stations that pull that trick so I mostly avoid them). Nor do I wind up wading through diesel swamps or having to hold my nose when I go inside. Not only do they often have cheaper prices on fuel, they usually have a lot of pumps so no waiting for one to open up.
Seems to me the smaller the town or more remote the area, the more expensive the gas is.
That's another thing about hitting the chain truck stops. Chances are their gas is pretty fresh since they're moving more of it.
Head scratcher, I am not sure why this financial publication did a 14 VW Jetta diesel REVIEW !! ??? There has to be a better tie in to VW, Toyota, GM in a WW 3 way tie to sell 10 M vehicles each.
Testing America’s Best-Selling Diesel Car, the 42-MPG VW Jetta
BY Anton Wahlman
http://www.thestreet.com/story/12845576/1/testing-americas-best-selling-diesel-car-the-42-mpg-vw-jetta.html
Interesting article on the Jetta. I got a laugh out of how much he slammed it for the bluetooth problems. He should have at least read the manual, or talked to the dealer before he got that bent out of shape.
Last year, when I bought my 2013 F150, I did everything (and I do mean EVERYTHING) to try and resolve my problems with the Ford Sync system. Which included reading the manual, searching online, talking to the dealer, and two trips to the dealer service department (one lasting 2 weeks). Having been through all of that, I feel very justified in saying, "Sync Sucks!". (smile)
This guy should have at least talked to the dealer before blasting the Jetta so hard over bluetooth connectivity.
Fun review from the WSJ.
"An enduring mystery to me is why Americans don't care. Diesel market penetration continues to bump along the bottom in the U.S., at just over 3% in 2013. And this year there is a Noah's Ark of awesome diesels arriving from Germany. Lots of Audis and BMWs with four or more seats can be had with a diesel-engine offering."
BMW 535d: This Eco Car Is No Diesel in Distress
Search the headline if the link doesn't work for some reason - it was "free" at the time of posting.
He appears to answer his own question with this (his own) statement:
..."The diesel also has an absurd advantage in torque: 413 kb-ft. at 1,500 rpm, as compared with the gasser's 300 torques." ...
The issue would seem to be, a lot of "sophisticated" drivers/would be owners do not really have a CLUE what that means.
Further, it appears to be "game, set, match" with this parenthetical take:
..."(5.8 seconds as compared with the gas-burners 5.5),"...
..."Diesel advocates, the true believers, scare me. They have an agenda and dwell in tunnels between gas stations."...
Someone like me would appear to be his huckleberry and (Hamas) tunnel digger
What amazes me is Japan builds the largest diesel engines in the World and struggle to get a diesel that will pass California emissions.
http://www.vincelewis.net/bigengine.html
Fuel Price Snapshot:
-RUG: $3.899
-PUG: $4.259
-ULSD: $4.199
That's what I noticed as I pumped close to 20 gal of RUG into wifey's Pilot. (Got $.10 off for Stop & Shop grocery points & $.10 off for AMEX) so I paid $3.699. 15.4 mpg
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Left coast snapshot:
RUG $3.77
PUG $3.99
ULSD $4.01
I paid $3.14 for RUG a few days ago. No discounts, no points. But this is in Houston, next door to the refineries.
$3.19/$3.49 for RUG/PUG in Jackson, NJ this morn. Was a nice surprise for me after returning from the West where we paid about $3.79 for RUG on average the past 2 weeks and about 7 gas stops.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I am glad that (in your case) proximity to "the refineries" is of benefit.
The prices @ the posted location has a refineries COMPLEX app 50 miles up the highway.
I get the feeling IF the "locals" had their way, they'd close the whole "refineries" complex down. We'd (USA) all be speaking JAPANESE (if not GERMAN and Italian) if not for that refineries complex !!!! We would NOT have been able to successfully fight WW2 in the Pacific Theater, if NOT for the complex, 74+ years ago. If the Japanese made any mistakes, it was not hitting this complex (after the DAY IN INFAMY) .
FF to the "good old days", fuel prices shot up .50 cents in one day when a critical piece of pipe (less than 3 ft long I have read) corroded and failed. ( Imagine the effects/affects, if they were able to shut it down !!! )
It is also curious that the "enviro" conservatives are fighting and (successfully I might add) a billion dollar +PLUS (Chevron) UPGRADE, which has been planned for more than a decade and has been tied up in the courts for @ least that long. The upgrades would environmentally clean up both the (Chevron) products and upgrade the refinery operation that provides it !!!! Naturally the LONGER the project is delayed, the more it normally costs, and the more technologically out of date the proposed upgrades become. So in this specific case, they are trying to upgrade 50's/60's technology (55+ years old) with 1990's technologies (optimistic) .
Yet (oxymoronically, in these parts) Chevron Brand is known for some of the BEST ULSD products in the western USA.
On the other hand, here is a snap shot of 76 years of governmental oil policy meddling and government oil field management by "our" (more northernly) southern neighbors.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanielparishflannery/2014/08/18/will-security-problems-hamper-mexicos-energy-boom/?partner=yahootix
Hold your WILD LIFE on solar, or is that vice versa !!! ???
http://news.yahoo.com/emerging-solar-plants-scorch-birds-mid-air-054013072.html
All the powers that be want everyone to be on the grid; better to put that stuff on your house or in a small community system and forget the grid. Ditto those humongous wind towers.
And don't forget the small diesel producing algae pond out back.
Indeed, it is WELL, WELL, WELL, known the grid is in DECAY and needs MASSIVE rehabilitation (locally, $$$ billions, USA $$$$TRILLIONS) , not to mention even more $$$$'s (billions and trillions, stop with the Sagan numbers already) NEEDED for UPGRADES to deliver power for PROJECTED growth in electrical demand . Yet power and grid companies DESPISE localized power generation.
One simple regulation could solve most to all of the issue/s. Here is conceptual one:
ALL new construction is to provide local power generation (on site or GANGED) to be able to supple a percentage ( i.e., 50 to 100% ) of (on site) electrical demand. Overages can be sold to the grid. The if, and's or buts are just filler.
The corollary would be: anyone with half a brain will put a minimum of 200% over foreseeable (peak) demand to be able to sell back (to the grid or whomever) and amortize the costs.
One EMP will "solve" all those issues.
Of course, it'll fix your inverter as well.
Indeed, EMP weaponization used to be a closely guarded secret.
But really no matter. Some time ago, we had a multiple assault rifle attack on a silicon valley, CA electrical substation. They basically drilled holes in a cooling and wire conduit mechanisms and the resulting heat build up caused a meltdown. Nobody really knew, saw or heard anything (it was also hushed up) and long AFTER the scheduled event, nobody really cared. The incident later hit the local rag. Ex-Navy seals from a security consulting firm were said to have studied the site forensically. They concluded it was a professional "hit". The local police are having their own "issues". It appears they could not be bothered. The FBI was brought in and "the domestic terrorism case" or maybe they label it "TAGGER art" remains unsolved, or so they say.
More to the point, they either can't or will not fix or upgrade localized transformers that are normally the cause of on-time, on-scheduled power outages (29 straight years that I know of) !!! ??? Now that in itself does NOT cost billions and trillions to fix.
Yeah, there's been a few of those iirc.
Diesel prices reach another record-low for the year (landlinemag.com)
It's only over $4 in California.
Yes I posted the local prices.
So using those prices @ 36 mpg @ $4.01/21 mpg PUG@ $3.97 that is per mile driven .1114 cents/.189 cents.
PUG costs 70% more.
Mercedes introduces hi-tech pistons made from steel
By Nathan Velayudhan
August 19, 2014
3% better mpg?
http://www.gizmag.com/mercedes-steel-pistons/33415/
(Admittedly this is speculation, there are no stats or specifications on Edmunds.com) , BUT IF the 15 MB E 350 EPA will post EPA 47 mpg (for a V6, 3.0 L TDI or T TDI, Fintail can confirm the E250 is a I4, 2.1 L T TDI) mated to a 7 speed A/T, (with no 4 matic penalties) this is HUGE GOAL changer for the SEGMENT (: 4 door 5 passenger midsize or bigger sedan) !!!!
So for example, this blows out the Camry Hybrids 38 H EPA by 24%
So for example, I have 4 matic (mpg) penalties imposed by the STATE. They of course are happy for the extra taxes. The hybrid competitors in the (CUV compact/midsized) ) group cost more and get slightly to a lot worse mpg than diesels.
The 10 automotive species on the verge of extinction
By Steven Lang
1 hour ago
Motoramic
Not sure if this article related or not. https://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/the-10-automotive-species-on-the-verge-of-extinction-205155538.html
..."In a first, Americans will likely buy more crossovers than midsize sedans this year — unseating the 4-door car as the default vehicle of choice. The crossover has become the family wagon equivalent of today, with hybrids and compacts SUVs expanding as the cars of choice for young singles, couples and families."...
The upshot is the CUV crossover section can certainly do better with more diesel models. (strictly my .02 cents) That being said, I am pretty happy with the two CUV's T TDI / TDI's (compact/midsized) that I happen to have.
So IF natural gas is supplied LOCALLY, this might be a HUGE HUGE HUGE game changer ! ? http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/Natural-gas-to-1-gasoline-5701521.php
..."Siluria Technologies says it can produce large quantities of gasoline, diesel, jet fuel and chemicals at a lower cost than traditional refineries and chemical plants. At today's natural gas prices, Siluria's technology could make gasoline at roughly $1 per gallon, according to the company."....
..."Siluria's process doesn't require intense pressure and heat. It uses a chemical catalyst to take methane molecules from natural gas and combine them into ethylene, a hydrocarbon widely used in the chemical industry. The ethylene can be sold as its own product, or it can be processed with other catalysts to produce liquid fuels. The catalysts stitch together carbon atoms from the ethylene to create gasoline or diesel or jet fuel.
"With a refinery, you're essentially boiling oil and separating it out," Iyer said. "We're building new molecules that weren't there before."...
The only reason I got a 4 door sedan back in '82 was because I couldn't afford the wagon.
Sad to see small minivans and small pickups go. Then again, we thought the Mazda 5 was a bit cramped.
I don't see increasing diesel vehicles causing people to downsize either - why bother if your mpg goes up with the big 'uns?
I am fine with folks paying more for hybrids, new fuel efficient gasser CUV's and getting less mpg than diesels (in this case TDI/ T TDI CUV's) !! Defacto, so are over 95% of RUG/PUG owners of the PVF (US passenger vehicle fleet, aka 2012, 265.647 M @ NHTSA !!
I have used the VW Touareg hybrid (+15k) and MB GLK 350(+500) examples already, so I don't want to be redundant, redundant. One redundancy is enough !
One of the articles' glaring "comparison" omission:
..." Siluria's technology could make gasoline at roughly $1 per gallon, according to the company."...
Whsle gasoline is @ 2.5877 per gal., per Aug 22, 2014 WSJ . So IF this is a direct comparison, normal refinery gasoline is 2.59 TIMES more expensive.
Large scale wars have been launched for delta's far narrower than this.
Slow news diesel day on upgrade (mountain road peak of 7,388 ft) leg of the SOS/DD trek (209 miles). Started the leg with a 1/2 (partial) tank. Filled with 12.6gal /(15.6 gal capacity) gal on 438 miles @ $3.95 per gal. Woo Hoo with a .40 cent per gal discount !
Cable TV is reporting on the Nap, CA 6.0 rolling earthquake. Didn't feel a thing in the Lake Tahoe, CA area. Thoughts and especially prayers go out to folks feeling the effects of the earthquake.
Nothing on diesel topic, but it is raining right now with predictions of 1 in in 30 mins. NWS "torrential rains, " so far hail, thunder.
We managed to miss the rains, so far. Sounds like y'all really need some.
Diesel got high again (SD - $3.93).
Diesel is a bit more now than RUG. When you look at what they put in RUG you can see why. Ethanol, the cheap poor substitute for real gasoline. Another great reason to buy a diesel vehicle. Will E15 become the standard???
Most stations sell E10, or 10% ethanol. But the handful of stations that sell E15, which made its debut two months ago, generally dispense it from the same pump as E10. Problem is, anyone who fills up with E10 after an E15 buyer could get as much as a quart of residual E15, American Motorcycle Association spokesman Peter Terhorst told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.
But those who purchase just a few gallons from motorcyclists to folks with lawn mowers could damage their engines and void their warranties. Hence the 4-gallon rule.
The EPA's rule should help mitigate this, to be sure, and most critics contend that the rule reflects bad gas in the first place. The EPA certified vehicles back to the 2001 model year for the 15% ethanol blend, but automakers have demurred. The Auto Alliance, a trade association that represents 11 major automakers, raised concerns last May about potential engine failures. "Automakers did not build these vehicles to handle the more corrosive E15 fuel," Alliance President Mitch Bainwol said in a statement.
Look for E15 to become the standard soon.
Supreme Court won't block sales of 15% ethanol
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2013/06/24/ethanol-gasoline-damage-cars-motorcycles/2451971/
The EPA, (defacto) has made an almost air tight case for LOWER MPG !! ??
Looking at it backwards, what would be the MB 350's EPA mpg BE on PUG only ???? (sans E10/E15)
We already have real world ( fuelly.com) figures of 21. on current E10.
So a E15 (greater concentration) should drop that to 20. (19.95) mpg.
The GLK 250 BT (diesel) remains @ 32 mpg, diesel being 60% better.
Also the newer E15 standard decreases both reliability & durability for engine and fuel systems. It also Increases manufacturing costs to upgrade those systems to withstand the increased corrosive effects.
I think I will remain on the diesel side.
On a diesel note: Consumer Reports crowns Ram diesel as best pickup
http://www.freep.com/article/20140826/BUSINESS0103/308260076
For all the vilification VW has taken, (some of it well deserved) taking third place in customer satisfaction, along with LEXUS has to be a pleasant surprise and constant improvement efforts & goals recognized ? ! Further surprising, for Lexus is also known for outstanding dealer customer service and VW, ...not so much. Lexus is also the symbol of the Japanese luxury segment and VW, ah NOT (luxury segment).
Needless to repeat, I can see why MB took first place. I am happy with the MB 250 BT.
For the lack of a TDI option and mostly CVT transmissions, second place Subaru would be a deal breaker for me. Here is the rest of the story.....
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/mercedes-ranks-number-1-customer-154520964.html
It is further insightful that the WSJ LIVE did a video news clip with the customer satisfaction data and TOTALLY ignored the OTHER 3rd place brand: VW $$ and went on and on about LEXUS, the $$$$$ LUXURY brand. They then went on on on about "LUXURY" and when asked about what brand to buy for those that could not afford $$$$$ luxury, again IGNORED VW and said to do ones' homework, citing www.edmunds.com as one homework source.
In fact, the #2 Subaru and the #3 VW were according to the data @ least 2 of the top 3 "LOGICAL" choices. The graphic tables certainly smacked one on the head with the data.
I probably should post the link, but I think subscribers only.
Often you can net search the headline and read the text. Assuming there is any text and it's not just pure video.
I hope everyone had a pleasant and safe Labor Day.
I had a few surprises.
On the downgrade portion of the SOS/DD trek, the MB GLK 250 B/T, T TDI posted 51.4 mpg (computer screen, this has been the BEST so far given how I drive and the environmental conditions) on the mountain portion, to app the 100 mile mark !!!! The rest of the 109 miles were successful in erasing that posting ! ?? Inadvertently, we had also left the A/C on ????
The mpg was posted in spite of (or maybe because of) a 10 to 20 min accident delay on the two lane mountain road (one lane each way, single car accident? Toyota Camry rollover/turn over) The full compliment of emergency vehicles seemed to have showed: 2/3 ambulances, 4 SUV Leo trucks, 1 fire, 1 rescue, 2 tow trucks and a whole CA Trans roads (closing/detour) crew/s were present. I was not sure what other emergency vehicles had come and gone prior. The debris seemed to have EXPLODED all over the landscape and roads. I arrived in the cue, just as they blocked traffic to let two ambulances off and running, and quick and dirty hand sweeping of car path ways. The engine was left running.
The more mundane surprise was on th upgrade leg of the trip, while (doing one) passing on the left, (wow what a rarity) I was the "road" boulder @ 90 mph. However, the car at my six was patiently waiting for me to complete the pass, so no road rage issue. Discretion being the better part of valor, I moved to the extreme right lane @ first SAFE opportunity.
He zipped on by and pulled into the right lane also.
Nephew traded his leased GLK 350 on a GLK Bluetec and loves it. Lower payments and more miles per year. I told him about a year ago to test drive the GLK diesel when his current lease was getting close. Winning people over to diesel one at a time.
Electric vehicles are not doing so hot. I think they have saturated the possible buyers by now.
http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-hy-electric-vehicle-sales-20140903-story.html