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What about VW TDI engine?
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Comments
ekkoh99:
There may be some good news after all. I read on Fred's page (www.tdiclub.com) that a 2001 Passat TDI is due next year. Hope its true. Meanwhile, I ordered the 2001 Honda EX V6 Coupe, since it was no comparison to the Jetta. My only regret will be when I go to gas station...
At 10,000 miles I added a performance chip which gave it a total of 115 h.p. and 185 ft.lbs. of torque and the car is a real blast to drive. It has surprised many other gas powered 4cyl. and 6 cyl. cars.
I consistantly get 47-52 m.p.g. out of every tank of both city and highway driving and I have a heavy foot.
I have never owned a car that has given the satisfaction that this Jetta T.D.I. has. Every time I get behind the wheel I can't seem to drive it enough. It has been 100% trouble free and can't wait until the T.D.I. Passat arrives here if it ever does.
VW has just began producing this same 1.9 litre engine in Germany with 150 h.p. and lots more torque, hope that it makes it over here.
thanks..........
Next question: will it continue to pass CA emissions tests if and when they get more stringent?
When I was searching for my car I found dealer names at the VW web site. You could enter your Zip and the distance you were willing to travel, and it would give you names, phone numbers, and addresses. From there I used their names to find websites so that I could use email or toll free numbers (not everyone had those). I found a number of friendly dealers throughout the country.
Thanks!
Quinn
Regarding jellying of fuel, it's a good idea to add a few oz. of Power Service diesel fuel supplement (available at Wal-Mart & other places) in each tankful. You'll quickly get in the habit.
Believe everyone when they say how great this engine is. It's true!
TDIs are perfectly legal in CA and NY. But carmakers have to meet "fleet" emissions standards as well as certifying individual engines. VW was having difficulty doing so. The TDI represents such a small percentage of their sales in North America that I suspect this was more of an indictment of their gas engines than the TDI. But for whatever reason VW has told their dealer network to refuse to sell TDIs to residents of CA or NY. If you can find a dealer willing to break that rule you'll have no problem registering it in any of the 50 states, including CA and NY. (Used TDIs above a certain mileage don't count against VW's corporate numbers.) This is VWoA's story. Take it with a grain of salt. I've also heard that TDIs are once again on the lots in NY, and that a limited number will be available in CA so keep your eyes peeled.
TDIs start and run just fine in cold weather. The glow plugs are a relatively new design, and heat up very quickly. If you get in the habit of putting in the key and turning on the plugs before you put on your seat belt the plugs will always be hot by the time you can get strapped in. It's absolutely NOT a big deal. "Winterized" diesel is sold during cold months where appropriate. This is a mixture of normal #2 diesel fuel and lighter #1 fuel. This will protect you from fuel problems down to near zero degrees F. or lower, depending on the mix. (Refiners mix for the local market, so if you fill up in a warm climate then drive to a cold one be sure to add plenty of anti-gel additive.) With the use of a winterizing additive there isn't a climate on earth cold enough to bother a TDI. They do tend to warm up slowly, which is simply a side-effect of their amazing thermodynamic efficiency. Any engine that cranks out as much torque as a TDI with that little fuel consumption will produce very little excess heat. But this is also No Big Deal...it's about like waiting for a big V8 gasser to warm up. You can also buy oil pan heaters for winter use. Unlike old-fashioned diesels they are NOT required to start the engine...they're just for your personal comfort in the morning.
VW would have you believe that a TDI is practially maintainance-free. This is obviously nonsense. But the timing belt issue has been exaggerated. The latest word is that 5-speed TDIs need belt changes every 55,000 miles and the automatics every 40,000. (Due to the higher injection pressures of the autos...something to do with emissions.) To put that in perspective, the 1.8T Turbo gas engine needs a belt every 60,000. The 2.0 base engine needs a belt every 90,000. All current VW engines, with the possible exception of the VR6, are "valve benders" and will suffer severe engine damage if the belt fails. In fact, most current automotive engines from ANY manufacturer are valve benders, so this is certainly not a "diesel problem." When you factor the extra cost of belt changes in a TDI remember that you need to allow for the cost of changing them in the gas engines too! And don't pay a VW dealer to do the changes. Any experienced do-it-yourselfer can handle the job. It's time-consuming, but not complex. Any competent independent mechanic can easily handle the job, and probably for a lot less money than the dealer. (No, you don't have to pay the dealer to do it to maintain your warranty.)
Gassers need oxygen sensors periodically. Ever priced one of those things? It's pretty ugly, and each car has at least two of them. Gassers have more complex systems to make the engine run...diesels have no need of an "ignition system" at all, so all that complexity is eliminated. If you plan to keep your car for the long term bear in mind that diesels, on the average, last approximately 40% longer than comparable gasoline engines. That's no small item...ever priced a new engine? Meanwhile, your direct-injection turbodiesel is using about 40% less fuel per mile than a gas engine of comparable displacement and power output.
Speaking of power: Do you want a 120hp 2.0 gasser or a 90hp TDI? The 2.0, right? WRONG! "People buy horsepower, but they LIKE torque." The TDI makes 155 lb*ft of torque at a low, low 1800 rpms. That's far more than the 2.0, and at a much lower rpm. Remember that horsepower is just torque multiplied by RPMs and divided by a constant. Horsepower is a function of torque! What's really important to your driving experience is how much TORQUE the engine makes and at what engine speed that torque occurs. When you test drive a TDI don't rev it up like a gasser. You're used to having to rev small displacement gassers like mad to get them to make any useful power. With the TDI it's running out of torque at about the same rpm the 2.0 gasser would be starting to sing. Shift EARLY...no later than 3500 rpms if you really want to make time, but more like 2500 for everyday "keeping up with traffic." Don't be afraid to let the engine do some work! When cruising on the freeway in top gear stomp the pedal to the ground without downshifting. Feel that? That's called "acceleration"...IN TOP GEAR! TDIs are absolutely miraculous on the open road. Acceleration is effortless and the well of torque seems to go on forever. Don't get the idea that I'm comparing a TDI to a race car, mind you, but it's by far the most powerful and flexible "ecnomy" motor you'll every drive. Try one!
Somebody here at Edmunds was complaining that TDIs need an $800 intake system "cleaning" every 20,000 miles or so. I tried to find the exact thread so I could laugh at that fooling notion but couldn't dig it up. If you see it, ignore it. The EGR valve does cause a diesel's intake manifold to build up a thick coating of very nasty-looking goo. And it doesn't take very long for it to happen. However, the goo will not seriously affect the engine's performance for a VERY long time. (Some of our memebers at the TDI Club have over 150K on their engines. The gunk is horrific to look at, but the engines run just fine.) When you do finally decide to have it cleaned out it's a matter of removing the intake manifold and soaking it in solvent for a while. Yes, a dealer would probably charge you $800. And they'd probably sell you a penny gumball for fifty bucks if you're dumb enough to pay it. Get an independent mechanic.
-mickey
p.s. The place to be is www.tdiclub.com if you have any other questions. We can tell you all about maintaining TDIs. We can tell you how to soup them up into 50 mpg VR6 killers. We even have a section devoted to such scintillating topics as the length of your toenails. It's all there! Check out the TDI Forums. And try not to pay too much attention to that "mickey" guy. He's pretty annoying.
Regards
carlady/host
You are correct the moonroof is only an option if you buy the GLS trim and AT transmission. Check out the details here:
VW TDI Jetta
Jim
With manual transmission you may get the luxury package as option which includes the moonroof and alloy wheels. But, you may not get the moonroof (by itself) with manual trans..
I have verified this with my own eyes at dealerships with actual cars and on VWoA website.
Also, with automatic TDI the alloy wheels are standard equipment.
668, do you agree with the above?
TDI
(2) belts $46.00 each
(2) fan belts $17.00 each
(2) tensioners $78.00 each
(1) water pump $80.00 each
(1) Thermostat $12.00
(5) qts of coolant $8.00
(6) injection pump pulley bolts $.90 each
(6) fuel filters $42.00 each
(6) air filters $22.00 each
(6) pollen air fitlers $15.00 each
(12) oil filters $7.00 each
(49.2qts) of synthetic oil $6.00 each
(2666) gallons of fuel 45MPG average with a chip (so far for me anyway) $1.30 Chicago fuel prices, Currently at $1.23
Labor costs $75.00
(.6) 10K oil change and service
(1.2) 20K oil change and service
(1.8) 40K = 20K+Brake fluid change
(4.1) 60K service including timing belt
---------------------------------------------
Total labor for TDI over 120,000 miles is 16 hours labor cost
Labor $1,200.00
Parts $1,240.60
Fuel $3,456.00
_________________
Total=$5,896.60
Here is my opinion of the Jetta TDI.
Drives wonderfully. Fun and performance is more than adequate.
The front end is too low to the ground and this results in damage (cosmetic and structural).
Should have a standard CD player instead of cassette in $20,000 car.
Very, very safe car in crash test results.
Quality is not equal to Toyota and Honda but is still good. Consumer reports rates the VW Beetle as used car to avoid and Jetta with worse than average reliability. This corresponds with what I have read on www.tdiclub.com and www.vwvortex.com in reading about the problems experienced by the TDI owners. That said, almost all of the owners are happy with the TDI.
Most important, the TDI will not save you money compared with a high MPG gas car such as Civic or Corolla unless the cost difference between gas and diesel gets much larger.
The main reason I didn't buy the car was its soft suspension tuning, and I didn't like the driving position/forward visibility. But I would consider it again in the future if/when I need a commuter car.
I've owned Toyota's and they were the most dependable car I've ever owned. I now own a 00 Golf TDI (German built) and it's WAY more fun and solid than my Toyotas. Gas(?) mileage? Who knows, it's so damn good I don't keep track, just hit the truckstop every 2 or 3 weeks:). Only time will tell if it ends up being as dependable as the toyotas, but at 17,000miles all is well. Worth the extra few grand. (Auto trans, BTW).
Happy Motoring..............
In Jan, 2000, I went to Greenwich Ct, thinking I could test drive one. Once the salesmen learned I was from LI, he totally refused to even let me quickly test drive one. What a shmo! So on the way back I tested a regular 4cyl at Bayside, but it was auto and had the power of a hampster wheel.
I emailed the NYDMV about TDI registration. The reply they sent me may have well been written in Russian. It gave me no clear answer.
Thanks for any info! Gary
1. VW will not sell new TDIs in NY or CA because any appreciable sales will bring their corporate motor vehicle emissions standards into the penalty fine zone.
2. TDIs cannot pass NY's motor vehicle emission requirements. Therefore, you cannot get an emissions sticker to accompany your registration, so you cannot register a new TDI in NY.
3. There is one way to do it. You must register the new TDI legally in another state. That usually means you have a residence there and unless you are in the military, pay taxes there. If you can do that, and avoid having that state declared as your primary residence for tax purposes if you don't want it to be, you can register it in NY used after you put 7,500 miles on it or own it for several months or a year...I forget. Right now, this is the only way to get it done. Hope this helps. On a side note, don't think you will save a ton with the TDI, even with gas prices where they are. TDI routine maintenance is very high, and includes mandatory use of synthetic oil at several bucks a quart. I know the engine will/should last longer, but do you want a car with 300,000 miles on it?
I always want something I can't have.
Something only few other people have.
Do I need therapy?