Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
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Dealer's Tricks - bait & switch, etc.
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This technique you speak of is common here in Ohio but I have seen first hand the effect a letter or phone call from the AG can have on a dealer principal.
Just for grins, think about sending a copy of your letter to the local dealer's association, the local newspaper, and even the offending dealership.
Also, why not post the dealership name here?
I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the name (the host can delete my post if he/she wants).
Grr!
Believe me, I wish that it was a simple error, but I have a hard time believing it. I guess that it's possible that they are three weeks behind in updating their personal website and the two classified ads (being such a large dealership), but since the car's "sold status" has been called to their attention several times, I'm just a bit skeptical...
It's almost depressing...
: )
Mackabee
NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ERRORS OR OMISSIONS
Didn't think so. Landru is right. Besides, goddess says that they have been told at the dealership about the ads still running and the dealer saying that the car is sold. I would expect more professionalism from such a "huge" dealer to follow up and make sure that any misleading ads were removed from print and the website.
Plus it sounds like anyone at the dealership would know about "this" car. Not sure what Mustang GT's are going for, but I am sure if landru's lot had one advertised for $5000 below the normal price, he and every other salesman at his dealership would know about it.
Now I would assume that both federal and state and/or provoncoal governments would have their own limitations as to what an error or omission might be and how much a dealer is or isn't responsible for.
That said, the exampple here seems pretty blatant.
It's the huge places that have more BS because the nut they have to crack every month is so huge. They'll just about say and do anything. I've worked for both big and small, made the same amount of money at both, but enjoyed the small dealer atmosphere and didn't miss the back stabbing and political tensions of the big place.
Oh, an no-one ever answered my email or my two phone messages... What a shock!
: )
Mackabee
"Gee, Gene, we can't take your call now. The mail has really picked up down here at Mike Calvert Toyota."
$20,800 over 60 months at 4.00% is $383 per month.
$22,795 over 60 months at 3.65% is $416 per month.
$22,795 over 60 months at 4.00% is $419 per month.
On that amount of money the change in interest rate lowers the payment by only about $3 per month. There is no way that $1995 could be added and keep the payment the same. It looks like that warranty was in there right from the start.
If you keep reading the warranty documents, I'm sure there will be instructions on how to cancel it. Of course, any refund will go to the bank (since they're the ones that have paid for it, so far) and your loan will be a little shorter.
That's just as much part of the problem.
"it makes it that much harder to figure out a deal because when they come back with a rate and your monthly payment you dont know if that is with the any warranty, etc before you head into the f&i office"
No, Its not hard at all. You already discussed price and settled on a number. You know how much you are going to finance before heading into the F&I office. Once you are there READ the documents before you sign to ensure that the numbers you agreed upon earlier are the same numbers in print.
Car_man
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Smart Shoppers / FWI Message Boards
only posting part of it(excluding the poster),
i think they have been banned.
I often wondered just how much my customers knew about the inside tricks in the car business. There were always a few that had heard of certain tricks, but consumers are taken advantage of every day and I know some things that may save your hide. And your wallet. I now work in consumer fraud and consumer law and one of my favorites was the "leg" (short for legroom) built into a payment. This only applies if you're financing at the dealer. Let's say the car your negotiating on is $15,000. Just using round numbers, a payment (with money and interest only) is $300. The salesman shows you $400. You go back and forth and "close" on $360. When you go into the finance office, the F&I guy has at least $2700-2800 worth of warranties, credit life, disability, mop and glow, fabric sealant, etc to include in the payment. Let's say he does $3500 worth of aftermarket stuff - he can offer you all this protection for only $20 month and your payment is $380. The catch is, you haven't been bumped $20, you've been bumped $80! It happens more than you can imagine.
Can you tell I didn't enjoy a large part of the car business?
Car_man
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Smart Shoppers / FWI Message Boards
When I bought my Maxima just recently, I got pre-approved at 4.99 from my CU, went in, told them twice when asked to fill out a credit app that we would do that if the price on the car was acceptable. Once we reached agreement, I told them that they could only run my credit app if they could be fairly sure they could beat it. I told the F&I guy my salary, debt level, and My FICO (got that off Myfico.com). Based on that, he said he thought he could beat it. So I then gave him my SSN, and they gave me 4.75.
Do your research, make your game plan, and you'll come out alright.
Duncan
1. Read Read Read everything
2. Read it again
3. Buy and inexpensive calculator that calculates monthly payments based on interest rates, length of financing and amount financed (and learn how to use it.) My wife laughed at the F&I guys face when I pulled my finance calculator out of my pocket.
4. Read again (ask questions)
5. Don't forget, the selling is not over until you are in the car and on your way home.
Hope this helps someone
i will stop selling when my customer stops buying.
as long as you know this about your dealer, everyone can enjoy themselves.
For example, when we bought our 1999 Accord, we made it very clear in writing that we wanted two additional keys for the car.
They accepted our OTD offer, but just before we were to sign the bill of sale they said those keys would only be for the doors, which meant the keys would not have the computer chip set so they could be used to start the car. We are glad we were alert to catch this subtle meaning of their comment.
Of course this was unacceptable, so we got up to leave. They quickly changed their mind and agreed to give us the keys we wanted. I guess the thought of not getting our money made them panic. We then gave them a check and drove the new car home.
On the CSI survey I gave them the lowest possible marks for honesty and several other categories.
When we bought a new car last October, I made sure that I wrote down that we wanted two extra keys that could be used to start the car. That car buying experience was very enjoyable and I gave them the highest possible CSI scores.
However, if they say Yes, then you have the car you want at a price you find acceptable. What more can you ask for?
Hey, I have actually been to Midland. I played there in a junior golf tournament in 1963 and Byron Nelson himself gave us a clinic.
I'd like to say your last post was specious at best...but you insisted you would walk out on a deal over an additional dollar.
I dont know anyone who would make a purchase from ANY business that treated them poorly, lied too them, or whatever.
Why suggest rewarding a business with a purchase after being treated like preacher was???
I guess with you its "all about the Benjamins".
"Clever Advertising Or 'Bait & Switch'?
Target 5 Reports On 'Clown Cars' That May Lure Buyers
CHICAGO -- In response to consumer complaints, Lisa Parker conducted a Target 5 investigation into the car-selling techniques of a local dealer.
'Is it clever advertising or 'bait and switch'?' Parker asked about using 'clown cars' to lure buyers.
Dealer Accused Of Bait & Switch
'Anyone in the market for a gleaming new Chevrolet Aveo should expect a basic price above $10,000,' Parker said. '(But) anyone opening Chicago newspapers recently might jump to see the Aveo offered at $7,295 -- more than 20 percent off the lowest list price.'
Yet that was the 'astonishing deal' offered by a major player on Chicago's car scene -- Grossinger Chevrolet, a family business that owns four dealerships, one of which is making a stir with its 'rock-bottom' ad prices.
'So how can one dealer sell so cheap?' Parker asked.
The low prices lured a Buffalo Grove family to the Grossinger Toyota showroom. A late February ad offered a new 2003 Camry at a great price. A call to the dealership assured them there were three in stock.
'I wasn't crazy about the colors, but for that price I would have taken any one of them,' Marge Rothman told Target 5.
But if the ad was the 'bait,' Rothman said, the 'switch' came when they walked into the dealership.
'He (the salesman) came back in 10 minutes and said, 'We don't have those cars in stock. All we have is one with manual transmission,'' Marge's son-in-law, Craig Neustadt, recalled. 'And I said, 'You just told me on the phone.''
Rothman and Neustadt said they could not get what the ad promised, so Target 5 decided to send a producer into the dealership with an undercover camera to see if she could get the bargain-basement Aveo listed in the current week's paper.
When the Target 5 producer took the undercover camera out to see the 'new' car, a salesman showed her a 2004 Aveo with two colors on its vinyl roof -- half pink, half green. It was referred to as the 'Clown Edition.'
The salesman on the lot assured the Target 5 undercover producer and photographer that it might be fine for teenagers. He then offered to show them other Aveos, with regular features and much higher prices.
'That's a classic bait and switch,' Attorney General Lisa Madigan said. 'An advertisement is published, people see a great price, they get to the dealership and see a clown car. You don't want a clown car! You want a good-looking car -- just like they advertised!'
The clown-car tactic was just one of several Grossinger violations recently alleged by the attorney general's office, which said that omitting important facts about a car is deceptive advertising.
'We have laws that protect consumers, and they protect consumers from false advertising,' Madigan said.
'I don't believe it's a tactic,' Grossinger attorney Stuart Gordon told Parker. 'I think it's more of a marketing device.'
Grossinger admitted no wrongdoing but paid $30,000 to resolve the attorney general's case. The $30,000 was a 'slap on the wrist,' according to other area dealers, who declined to go on camera but called the clown car a 'hoax' and 'the purest bait-and-switch out there.'
'The fact that they are successful indicates they are selling cars at lower prices than their competitors,' Stuart Gordon, Grossinger's Attorney, said.
But it also indicates they are selling features which are clearly visible from the sky, in an aerial view, but not always in the ads, Parker said.
As a result of the attorney general's case, Grossinger is now required to say in its ads if a new car has been modified. Ads reviewed by Target 5 last week did say that some vehicles include a 'vinyl roof' but did not say if the roof is pink and green.
The Better Business Bureau asked Grossinger to resign its membership.
'As for the Neustadts' complaint, Grossinger said the Buffalo Grove family read the ad wrong,' Parker said.
Parker added that a dealership representative said its customers love the multicolored roofs, and Grossinger sells about 100 of them per year."
Those of you who are interested can check out the full test of this article by clicking on the following link: NBC5.com Consumer Reporting. Please feel free to use this discussion to post your thoughts on this situation or on dealer tricks in general. Thanks.
Car_man
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Smart Shoppers / FWI Message Boards
Happy is good enough for us.
If we get another Honda, I would prefer going to another dealer. But if the 1999 dealer is the only one with the options we want, I wouldn't hesitate to go there and make an offer.
" We bought a Honda from a dealer who was dishonest and tried to cheat us"
I guess PRICE is all that matters, huh?
Personally, I would have walked out and found an honest dealer even if I had to pay a bit more.
But that's me...
Later I thought about the transaction, and I wondered if we should have walked out.
If we had it to over again, I would have still have bought the car. I think I take pride in having the attitude that other peoples actions do not affect my decision making. It is the old control thing - the only thing that affects my decisions is what I feel like doing.
We wanted that car and were willing to pay a certain price. Whether the salesman is a lying, cheating jerk or a wonderful person makes no difference. Their attitude has nothing to do with me getting what I want.
If they had wasted much of our time, that would have been different. But the time from their trying to cheat us to giving in and doing things our way was about 5 minutes.
That was 5 1/2 years ago. I just waxed the car on Sunday, and it still looks very nice.
I accept the fact there are bad things in this world and I try to learn how to deal with them insead of whining about how awful everything is.
That's the part I don't understand.
I would have rather had the new car than my $20300 and he would have rather had the money. We were both happy with the deal.