Pontiac Grand Prix - 2000-2005

snaab

impala is nicer??? oh man oh man!

regfootball

well, neither has a pleasing interior if you wanna get to the point. The Intrepid has a nicer interior than both.

And haha no one disagrees that the MatrixVibe has a nicer interior....LOL

johnclineii

Which is kind of funny since GM designed the interiors on the Matrix/Vibe. See, they CAN do it (then of course, Toyota probably had input into the quality of materials and cost targets)...

dindak

You take the Intrepid, I'll take the GP thanks.

evandro

I just love this car, but only from the outside... A big turn off was indeed the hard plastic all-around and the cheap fabric, the same things that kept me away from the previous GP. Otherwise, with the right engine, it's a nice full-size car with the best dependability in Dodge's line-up.

regfootball

Tell you what dindak. I will take the GTO instead.

98+ Grand Prix
exterior style - pretty good (even in spite of having SOME cladding)
interior - not good
power - good but still pushrods

04+ Grand Prix
exterior - regressed (looks like Grander Am)
interior - not enough improvement
power - more power in the GTP

but unfortunately still doesn't give me any desire to part with the over 30k sticker for the GTP.

The Mazda6, Saab Linear, Maxima, Altima, Accord and a lot of others would be ahead of it on my shopping list.

I found the 98+ exterior style attractive enough to put it on the check it out list.....but the 04 restyle interior and exterior is the complete deal breaker. No sizzle in the steak.

fred707

Let me first say to anyone who worries about a plastic dash kit for a radio is first off lost. I have never seen a car buyer buy a car because the dash was appealing. That is like saying you know what the picture on the TV is like crap but I really like the remote. Get in the car and drive it. I was at 115 mph in 3rd gear. 115 in 3rd gear. again a 3rd time 115 in 3rd gear. When cruising at this speed knowing I had a 4th to go was I looking at the dash and saying man look at those stacked radio and climate units. No I was looking at the hud and watching the punk in his V6 04 Maxima try to catch me after he first cut me off to be cool. He wanted to play but he could not handle the truth, when I passed him.

BTW - Wait til the Borla exhaust and air intake system are installed.

Buy what you want, say what you want, it's all in what you feel when you drive it. Change the channel if you want but I'll take my plasma (GTP) TV over an analog Honda Mazda any day

richm4

While dash layout is not my number one priority, it is certainly very important since that is what you are looking at most of the time you are in the car.

That said, I own the 04 GTP and while the dash and interior quality isn't up to what I really wanted (I considered the Accord, ES300, and CTS), the overall package and versatility of the car won me over.

dindak

I would be looking at a GT-2 not a GTP. While the GTP would be nice, I don't have the money at this point. Compared to any V6 sedan it's nice to look at (a lot better than the Accord) and has a good interior with better seats than anything out there. I have yet to test it though and that could make or break the car.

johnclineii

It's all a matter of opinion, but compared to ANYTHING out there?

I beg to differ,

I have, you see, seen a Mazda6.

Would that I could see a hatchback at Ye Olde Dealer in the USA.

If I could, I would no doubt be driving one.

fred707

I not only have seen a Mazda 6, I test drove one and it broke down. I not only had to walk 4 miles back to the dealer, but was told we can find you one that does not break down. I asked well is this a common problem. I was told it's happened before. I do not buy a car because I am a fan of a manufacturer. I buy it for how it feels and what I get out of it. I to this day have 1100 miles on my GTP and loved every one of them

orwoody

I like the new 04 GP but I've been spoiled by the rebates and incentives. The 04 GP is nice, but not that nice if I have to pay full price.
I'm betting that by late summer or fall GM will start kicking in the rebates, low interest options for the GP.

regfootball

yeah, right (said) fred. Walked 4 miles back....hmmmmm.....that's a new one.

You need to bring your cell phone with.

regfootball

While the GTP will no doubt have horsepower, the 6 is a nice tight car but I actually enjoyed the Saab 9-3 Linear more than the 6.

Really the driving improvements sound good on the GP but I can't deal with the afterthought interior and Grand Am styling.

ab348

Richm4, I think you've probably accomplished a major milestone. Your case must be the first time in history that someone cross-shopped a Lexus and a Pontiac!

Let me join in the shouting-down of the hype over the Mazda 6. A nice body design but a subpar interior and Ford mechanicals keep me from getting too excited over it.

Give the new GP some decent upholstery and upgrade the dash materials and I'll be there (apologies to Chevrolet for stealing their slogan).

fred707

The dealer refused to pick me up... If you want the name of the dealer to confirm. I will give it to you. The only reason I went back was to throw the keys at them and pick up my car that was there from the test drive. Sad thing is I was going to buy the car I was driving until it died. Later the dealer claimed it was due to a poor PDI. Mazda has improved tons over the years. But that experience left a bad taste in my mouth. Blame the dealer, but remember they represent the manufacturer.

fred707

I like the interior. They don't use that nasty wanna be leather stitched door trim any more as they did on the 97-03. The grand am looks nothing like the grand Prix. Lots more plastic on the Grand AM. Put them side by side as most dealers would let you. And if you like the 9-3 not a bad choice. At least GM will get money from you there.

fred707

WHY WAIT FOR INCENTIVES. If you shop around you can get a great rate. I was able to 3.9 from my credit union on my 04'. And if you try really hard a car for $100 over invoice with a 3.9 rate which by the way could go to 72mos. not too bad. I think late summer you may get a deal. The current incentives go to the end of June.

fred707

the only huge difference in the pocket book from the gtp and gt-2 are a few dollars. $35 to be exact. WHen you take it at a monthly rate. Thats only $9 dollars a week. So you only eat steak 3 out of 4 weeks.

dindak

Reg : I can't see how the 04 GP looks at all like the Grand Am. Aside from the basic Pontiac nose design, there is nothing in common.

Fred : With rates as low as they are, o% is not as big a deal as it used to be. The FED could lower rates again if the U.S. economy doesn't kick into gear soon.

ab348 : I agree with you on the Mazda 6, nice looking car but I'm weary of the mechanicals. As for the GP, I will agree with you to some degree on the base upholstery, but I can forgive it as the seats are soooo comfortable. Dash materials are fine IMO.

fred707

See i like instant gratification. I need it now. I love it now if you have not seen mine i have pics.. And in 6 weeks my exhaust will be here... 30 more hp...
 My wife says I am obsesssed. She's right

montanafan

Latest from the dealers is now "Late September" for orders with the side impact air bags.

regfootball

"Aside from the basic Pontiac nose design"

at the pontiac lot I could barely tell them apart from the nose. The side window profiles vary a bit but the back ends still both have big garish tailights and the character of the body lines are still the same molded coke bottle look that is SO NOT IN right now.

Maybe not to you, but to ME the NEW 2004 GP styling is already dated looking.

dindak

"Maybe not to you, but to ME"

Only you Reg, only you.

oogilieorang04

Thanks montanafan, for the update. I guess we'll go ahead without them after all:(.

dan165

After negotiating with my boss to take over the lease of my truck, I went to the Pontiac store last night an bought a Red GT-2. The only upgrade I got was the stereo cassette add on. MSRP with freight was C$32050 and they gave it me for C$29500. It should be ready Monday as it's coming in from another dealer. I am very excited!!

While I like the Honda Accord V6 and found it to be a touch more refined, the Grand Prix is more fun to drive, has better seats and just plain looks much better. The Accord's rear just looks like it is sagging with the way the tail lights are designed. Regardless of what some say here the GP's new interior is very nice and has comparable quality. The fold flat seats are a big plus though my wife has an SUV anyway. I'll let everyone know how it goes next week.

dindak

Congrats!

I would have gone with the same in Polo green.

Let us know how it goes.

oldsman01

I've sat in an 04 GP twice now and I don't understand what the deal is with all the complaining about the interior(other than the cloth seats). It's no Caddy or Lexus but again, we're not talking Caddy or Lexus prices. Granted it is a bit racy looking compared to your stalwarts like the Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, and Chevy Impala but after all, this is a Pontiac. I have an 01 Olds Intrigue and found the new GP's interior to be pretty much equal with some better quality plastics in some areas while lacking a few features the Intrigue has(i.e. climate control). Speaking of cheap interiors, anyone sat in a Nissan Altima lately? Nice power from the available V6 and yes, the ability to get the 6 with a manual but the interior quality is much lower than previous Nissans. The Mazda 6 is MUCH better in this regard. I have test driven a 6 and it has a decent interior although it too lacks a few key features I like. I like the new GP quite a bit and may take GM up on their new 24 hour test drive offer.

ab348

There is no comparison between the Accord interior and that of the GP. The GP looks positively bargain-basement by comparison. It seems GM will never learn.

johnclineii

In fact, there is no contest between the new GP interior and the Altima's interior. I recently rented a 4 cylinder Altima for a week. I found it FAR preferable to the much more expensive 04 GTP. Would I buy an Altima? No way. But I would buy one long before I bought a GTP. And I had a 98 GTP.

The simple story is I need to haul people in the backseat. Adults, even. And that backseat is just plain uncomfortable.

I'll be shopping the Mazda6, probably the hatch as soon as it is available.

orwoody

This is the Grand Prix board.... let's talk GP
IS the 2004 GP an improvement over the previous generation?
my opinion:
styling --> 2004
ext color choices --> tie
int color choices --> previous
front seat comfort --> 2004
rear seat --> tie, both marginal
dash --> 2004
steering wheel --> previous
PW/PDL switches & layout --> previous
Engine/ power --> 2004 for sure
handling --> 2004
ride --> 2004
road noise/wind noise --> 2004
versatility --> 2004
I'm afraid that value for the price available(including incentives) the 2003 wins.

ab348

I pretty much agree. The best-looking GP I've seen recently was a dark blue 2003 Limited Edition package model. It had attractive seats and overall was a very appealing package.

With all of the Lutz-hype, GM was expected to hit a home run with the '04 GP. As I see it, I'm not even sure it's a ground-ball single up the middle.

dindak

ab348 : Not sure what you find "bargain basement" about the dash, can you elaborate on what you find so cheap because you have lost me?? It's may not have the design you may prefer in the Accord, but in the mid-size arena the 04 GP is just fine. In term of exterior style, the GP is miles ahead of the Accord sedan though the coupe is nice.

johnclineii : Mazda 6 is nice, but it's smallish for a midsizer and the Ford mechanicals scare me, especial after our friends Mazda 626 nightmare.

ab348

Dindak, I was looking at another '04 today. I don't mind the IP cluster, though it's a little boy-racerish for me, but I could live with it. However that plastic panel around the top half of the center stack just screams cheap-looking. The one I looked at today didn't even fit properly, and was shiny black grained plastic that just looks awful. Plus I don't care at all for the inside door handle receptacles and door pulls. Then of course there is that horrid patterned cloth upholstery; even the normally hated gray mouse-fur cloth would be an improvement. It just looks like something we would have mocked Korean manufacturers for doing 10 years ago or the Japanese 20 years ago.

Exterior style is another matter; I agree with you on the Accord. I do like the sheetmetal on the '04 GP but the interior is lousy on those I've seen.

dindak

I'll give you the door handles (odd) and the pattern in the seats, but IMO the great seat comfort makes up for that and I could always go leather (which is very nice for 04).

As for the center stack, the bubble display on top is a bit strange, but I didn't find any of it to be cheap. It's not top of the class quality but it's better than the Altima. In terms of it being "boy-racer", that's subjective.

I guess we have to agree to disagree. I generally like the car a lot though like I said, I still have to test one. I tried to Thursday night but the dealer I went to in Mississauga only had 1 on the lot and it was sold.

oldsman01

Other than the cheap looking cloth seats, I still do not see what the deal is with the new GP's interior? I guess it doesn't "fit the mold" that midsize sedans are "supposed" to look like so it gets criticized. First off, I do like high class interiors as I tend to favor high end cars. As I said before, the new GP is no Caddy or Lexus but it's no bottom feeder either. The previous GP had a far worse interior. When I bought my Intrigue nearly two years ago I seriously considered a GTP coupe as I had always wanted one since they came out in 97. I loved the power, I loved the coupe look, and liked the handling. The one thing I could not get past was the interior. This is why I ultimately ended up with the Intrigue. Had the 01 GP had the interior the new one does, I very likely would have gone that route. And guys, what cheapness the GP may have in it's interior, it makes up for under the hood! 260 hp and the new TAP-shift feature make a GP a tempting alternative for me.

johnclineii

In my case it has virtually nothing to do with how the interior "looks," at least not quality wise. I use my car for business and for personal travel. The back seat of my 98 GTP was inhabitable by adults. The cloth seats were suitable for business use.

The 04 GTP back seat is NOT something I am going to subject lawyers, business clients, friends and kin and kith to. It's too low, slab-like and extremely uncomfortable. And that isn't even to mention the HORRID cloth patterns. Don't even mention leather to me. I do NOT want it. Hot in summer, cold in winter, difficult to maintain, and there are animal rights issues with some of my clients.

So, the GTP was crossed off my list. A pity. I liked the performance. It was only the interior that struck the car from my list.

I am waiting for the Mazda6 hatch.

ab348

Oldsman, I guess we are missing something, because I like the '03 interior even with its shortcomings better than the '04. The '04 cabin looks like it was a class project for an 18 year old supertuner wannabe.

When is the Buick version of this platform due out? With Olds gone, it's the only GM division that comes close to appealing to me - not cheap like Chevy, not overdone like Pontiac. Of course if Olds was still around they would probably have been the ones to get it right in terms of design.

oldsman01

I'm not trying to be insulting toward you, but it sucks that you have to buy a car based on whether others are going to find it comfortable. I can't say how the rear seat comfort level in the new GP is, but don't be so quick to dismiss leather. I've owned several cars with leather seats and even here in the good old southeast with it's hot and humid summers, I prefer it. And the new GP's leather is of much better qaulity than previous models. I really found the driver's perch very comfy.

ab348, I would have loved to have seen what the 03 Intrigue would have been like had GM not axed Olds. Considering than the Intrigue was always(IMO) a cut or two above the old GP and considering what an improvement the new one is over the old one(again IMO) I can only imagine what the next Intrigue would be like. The next generation Buick Regal is due out for the 2005 MY so my guess is it will come out early in 04. It was supposed to be out for 04 but Lutz put the brakes on it not long after he came to GM because he didn't like what he saw. Hopefully the delay wil be worth it.

dindak

oldsman : I agree. We had a 98 Grand Prix and it was totalled. When we went looking to replace it in 2000 I fell in love with the interior and motor in the Intrigue so we switched over. I actually like the dash of the GP better in many ways. It's not top of the class, but it's good. Wouldn't be surprised if you see different seat material for 2005. The leater is very good though!

johnclineii : I didn't think the 6 had a very big back seat either. You aren't gaining much if anything in the 6 and the hatchback stigma will be added.

glenmc

Hey all - looking at buying a 99 GTP Supercharged with about 55k on it. Any comments about fuel mileage (Cdn mpg) with this engine, as well as about supercharger reliability? Thanks!

johnclineii

It isn't the size of the GTP backseat I have a problem with. It is how low the Pontiac backseat is to the floor and the fact it is essentially a slab (as if GM only put it there on the off occasion you might have a passenger). Believe it or not, I have been told many times that my 98 GTP backseat was far more comfortable than the one in the 00 Impala I now own.

GM dropped the GP coupe, making coupe buyers unhappy. This sedan buyer is just as unhappy.

And the Mazda6 backseat was fine, and the hatch does NOT look like a hatch.

dindak

Seats fold flat as a pancake so they had to be a bit lower. Coupe hardly sold, no big loss.

Hatch is a hatch, even in the Mazda 6. No big deal to me but some people down at them.

ruski

I drove cars with leather up in NY, I now drive cars with leather down in South Florida now, and I don't have any problems with it being too hot or too cold. And the animal lovers can stuff it where the sun doesn't shine (is it too hot or too cold there?)

oldsman01

I'm not a hatch fan myself, but could care less if people look down upon them. People probably look down on guys like you and I because we drive an Oldsmobile rather than the status quo but I could care less.

ruski, LOL on the animal lovers stuff:) Nothing like sitting on some nice cow hides. My Intrigue is black with a dark grey leather interior and it does get a bit toasty after sitting in the TN sun on a summer afternoon, but I've never found the seats uncomfortable even wearing shorts. One thing not to do is confuse leather with vinyl as vinyl seats are horrible in the sun. Leather breathes so it is not as hot. Heated seats in the winter are great!

johnc.., good luck on finding the right car for you. The 6 is not a bad car and it is on my "next new car" list although the new GP is above it. I guess being single and 27 I'm more concerned with the 260 hp V6 and TAP-shift than rear seat comfort.

Bushwack

<http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=6017&sid=180&n=157>

The Car Connection rarely (if ever) has a 'negative' to say about a car it reviews. Not that the Grand Prix has any flaws (cough)..but their reviews make Motor Trend seem controversal. Nevertheless, the link above is for your reading pleasure.
 
..and to add my two cents, I am not impressed with the new '04 model. Still too many plastic buttons (I haven't like their design since the '97) and the exterior doesn't look complete (though its' presentation is not as 'toyish' as last year's model). Also, this car (like the Regal) should have a navigation systen available as an option. It would fit very nicely beyond the "two o'clock" position of the Grand Prix. I have slight envy of the 260 hp SC vs the 240 hp SC in my '00 Regal GS. Then again, a K&N filter would nearly meet that number on a Series II engine. Besides, I'd rather have seen a boost in torque.
 
Don't misunderstand. I'm not bashing the new Grand Prix in as much as I'm disappointed that other then the sheetmetal, little else has changed. Maybe that's the plan on the GM drawing board as they wheel in the GTO.

dindak

"Still too many plastic buttons"

What should the buttons be made of then?

oldsman : Like I said, I have no problem with hatchback, but I know a lot of people won't touch them. Big stigma which is why you see so few. As for the Oldsmobile, my import only friend totally looks down on my car but he also has less disposable cash because he is always buying imported everything that cost twice as much. If he could import Coke from Europe he probably would.

ruski

yeah I had the same question about your "still too many plastic buttons" comment.

Do you like your buttons made out of ivory?

dan165

Pretty decent review.

I think the people who say the dash is "cheap" or whatever generally just don't like the design more than anything. The dash is not cheap by current midsize standards but the design is a little more sporty looking than some people like. I think it's very well laid out and the driving feel and position are excellent. Test before you judge I always say.

I will be picking up my car tonight. Anyone thing I should get the extended warranty? I'm thinking no, but I always worry about a new model.

evandro

Where did that moron get that any '04 GP is powered by the 3.1 V6???

This is exactly the kind of review I despise: is there any hint in the text that the guy actually drove the car or instead just looked at pictures and at the press release just in passing before darting to "review" the car?

This kind of bad reporting couldn't result in anything more stupid than concluding that the GP is an alternative to an SUV! :-P