Volkswagen Passat 2005 and earlier
L8_Apex
Member Posts: 187
in Volkswagen
Welcome to the continuation of the VW Passat -
Part VII topic. Those of you joining us from that
topic are welcome to continue your discussion.
If you're new to this topic, you may want to
follow the above link for additional archived
posts.
Thanks,
L8_Apex
Sedans Host
Part VII topic. Those of you joining us from that
topic are welcome to continue your discussion.
If you're new to this topic, you may want to
follow the above link for additional archived
posts.
Thanks,
L8_Apex
Sedans Host
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I bought (and likely overpaid) for an A6 4.2 several months ago at this local dealer but fully expect him to turn his nose up at the cash deal I'll offer tomorrow. Based on what I've read, $1000 over invoice should be plenty to get this deal done but he's asking for more than $3000 over invoice. $30000 plus tax should be more than enough to get this car, no??
I know how to walk away - but where to? Anybody know a dealer a little hungrier within a few hundred miles of east TN??
BTW, I love the Passat. Drives like the worthy younger sister to our A6. I feel great about the value but would be happier with a longer warranty.
Thanks!
Jim
Passat Website a few weeks ago. At that
time it was only available in German. It
appears VW has released the site in English
as well. Enjoy:
http://www.passat.com
I would say that it sounds pretty normal, but have your mechanic check it just to be sure.
I have narrowed down my car choice to 2001 VW Passat GLS V4 4-Dr Sedan with Tiptronic Auto Transmission and 4MOTION - Blue Anthracite/Black Velour. I do NOT want any other packages on the car. I am sticking to my price of $25,063 + $525 dest charge. Anyone recently bought this car around my estimated cost ? Please let me know !
Also, I am having LOT of difficulty in locating such a car. Most of the Passats come loaded with some package or the other !! A VW dealer told me that the current 2001 Passat's body-style is no longer in production and hence they cannot factory-order it for me!! A second body style is being added to the VW production line-up.
Is this true ? Are there any InterNet links that I might look up to find more on this ?
Thanks in advance !
Ajeet.
This may explain your difficulty in locating the vehicle you want. I had to settle for purchasing a '99 Passat I found via a broker. Paid 21,500 for a 1.8T w/tip, luxury pkg., leather and 4K miles.
Good Luck!
Any clues?????
Thanks,
Gregg
One of them is in the front right dash area....I think it is the gloovebox door, but I'm not sure. Any ideas?
The other rattle is somewhere in the rear of the cabin. I have no idea what is shaking over bumps. I have poked around and don't see anything that looks like it could make the noise. Are there many components for the sunroof up in the headliner that are likely to shake? Any suggestions?
What is the best way to get these identified and fixed by a dealer? Do dealers create more problems by ripping stuff up to look for loose stuff? Are rattles covered under warranty since it is not a mechanical defect, but just an annoyance?
Thanks
At 31k miles, my Passat is still rattle free. I do get the odd groan on very cold mornings though.
Aside from that, 107,000 trouble-free miles on my car, and 62,000 trouble-free miles on my wife's Passat.
MSRP for the car I'm looking at is 30,900. Any help is greatly appreciated.
TS
Zup
ZUP
Thanks, -Chris
It's an option and it's one I jumped all over.
Best of luck to you
How will it compare in performance and cost to one of the A6 models (2.7T or 4.2)?
Is 4-motion in VW-speak the same as Quattro in Audi-speak?
Thanks....good luck with ur new Passat, I'm going out this weekend to find a deal on a silver/black/GLX if I can find one in South Florida before the supply dries up, I can't wait for March, I need to get a replacement car now.
BTW to the question about the 2001.5 version....VW factory guy (I believe a good source) said new cars will be shown at Detroit in January, a few cars will be delivered to dealers in Feb and more in March. Factory has just about ended production of current version and is tooling up for new one. He expects a month or two of NO Passats except those sitting on dealer floors. I was in Louisville recently where there were more Passats than you knew what to do with them. A rare silver/gray was at a dealer in Indiana just over the river ready for someone to take home.
Phil
you bought a *mutant* and that there was $1000
Dealer Incentive program that made your *deal*
possible. Please do not insinuate that what you
got; everyone will get...that is not fair to the
Town Hall member.
audiandpassat...I hope that there is another VW
Dealer in your area that can service your New
Silver Passat GLX 4MO, because this guy is probably
going to be out of business before you read this post. I would not sell this car to my mistress
for that money; that is not to say that I have one
but you get the idea... A Silver/Grey, 4MO, GLX
for $150 over? Good for you... As to your *holdback* ploy... This sophisticated site, basically states...*don't even go there*, but you
showed someone that you knew better...every dealer
will negotiate *holdback*...You, SIR, are a master
negotiator, and I beg you to tell us all how you did it...what skills did you employ that we are
unaware of?, what power do you posess that turns
normally sane people into fools & pushovers?
280bhp engine, with 4MO standard and will cost less than it's Audi counterpart...that is the
point...these cars stair step...see a post from
Passat Part VII
Holdback does matter because holdback is part of your (oftentimes substantial) profit margin--and therefore fair game in any negotiation.
You know better than anyone that values for "new 2000s" (that are already ONE YEAR OLD) and the new 2001s are starting to fall because of the redesigned Passat 2001.5s that will be coming at some point next year. Cars have a limited lifecycle--especially when automakers keep on redesigning new models to entice new buyers. Autos have a limited shelf life.
Sorry to sound so snippy, but I hope that people realize that dealers, in some cases, frequent these sites to learn how to design increasingly sophisticated scams...
If I had wandered onto your lot during my shopping, my special discernment powers would have told me to get off your lot quickly. I wouldn't have trusted you to work with me. I've read dozens of your posts and though you many times provide great factual information, you, sir, are a dealer's dealer, a salesman's salesman. I'm not surprised you wouldn't sell a car at a great price to your mistress or anyone else. Why is it that you are spending so much of your time guarding the Passat shopping flock anyway?? Business slow? Or does VW pay you for your time to make sure buyers don't get too many ideas about how to negotiate in their best interests? A wolf in sheep’s clothing. You and many of your comments don’t really fit what I understand to be the purpose of this forum. Your intentions are easy to me to read . . . but then again I have supernatural powers as you have rightly deduced.
I got a good deal because I was persistent, did my homework and used some basic negotiating strategies to my advantage - like walking away from a deal I was not yet satisfied with. I've got too much appreciation and respect for the dealer who made this deal for me to tell everyone where the deal was given. Perhaps he *would* go out of business if he sold every car for this amount. I simply made the best deal I could for me - and he did make the $150 plus 2% for a few hours of working with me. He did not seem to be drugged or under unusual coercion. He didn’t *have* to sell me the car for that price, so I have to assume, sir, that he made out just fine and is not endangering his business.
I took the time to post the information about the holdback and my deal to encourage others to not fall for dealer rhetoric and whining (like they likely hear on your lot) that they "can't" make a deal.
Josephf1:
Not sure how many posts you’ve read to come to your conclusion. There are a lot of really satisfied Passat owners who haven’t had problem one with their cars. For example, look back at Passat - Part VII. Now that I have my car, I can’t imagine why I would come back to this forum again if I have good experience with my car. It is much more likely that the few who have problems come to this site to complain. I’m glad they let us know of their troubles as it helps us know what to look for, but it cannot be said that their experience is representative of the entire population of Passat owners.
My wife was Toyota’s most loyal customer until she test-drove the Camry, Avalon and Passat back to back to back. It wasn’t even close. The Passat drive is a much more satisfying experience and it seems like a much better value. Can’t tell you yet that we will have years of trouble-free driving like we’ve had with our Toyotas, but we both love the Passat and were willing to take the risk.
Don’t let VWGUILD’s attitude scare you off of the car. I think there are some nice folks at dealerships. They just want you to pay as much for the car as you will let them get away with. That’s their business. Good luck.
I just bought my Passat yesterday. I opted to buy it in Central Florida, because the dealers in Miami are very Greedy. A firend who works in a car dealer called some friends for me and told me what a fair offe for the car was. He recomened 500 over invoice. the dealers in Miami laughed at me. In fact the sales manager at Esserman VW called me rediculous. I also has my secritary call the dealership before i got there and ask if they had the car on the lot, they said yes. When I got there the car was no where to be found, and in fact they said it would take a week to get. The best price I got in Miami was 3% over invoice plus a 200 dollar dealer fee.
It is going to cost me 35 dollars for a train ticket and 10 dollars for a cab in order to pick up the car. The money I saved is going to make this trip more than worth it, and the dealers were much nicer and more acomidating than the Miami dealer.
Zup
Also, when I lived in Miami, I think there was a VW dealer in Ft. Laud. somewhere. I think the name was Gunther VW/Mazda. I bought several Mazdas from them and always had good luck. I'm almost positive they sold VWs but I'm not sure. You might want to try them for servicing, etc.
Enjoy.....
JOhn
purchase. Contained in that response you will find one of the answers to your question...
"Why is it that you are spending so much of your time guarding the Passat shopping flock anyway?"
Please take note...that is a direct quote...
Here is another direct quote from post #18 of #31,
"Just got my Silver/Grey 2001 GLX 4M for about $150 over invoice."
And then there is this direct quote..."I simply made the best deal I could for me - and he did make the $150 plus 2% for a few hours of working with me."
I detect here a small inconsistency...There is a
slight difference between the $150 that you said
you paid and the $731.06 that you really paid. Hard invoice on a GLX 4MO is $29,053 including
$525 Destination...2% over is $581.06 + $150...
well, you get the picture, and I hope everyone else does as well. I must say that if you paid
$731.06 over on this car you got a great deal, but
you made a statement that was inaccurate, and that is why I take the time to make these posts.
Getting a new car should be a wonderful, happy
experience; for most, it is the 2nd most single
most expensive investment a person makes, and by
making even one person believe that they can do
something that they cannot do sets them on a course that can only lead to a frustrating, time
consuming odyssey that results in something that is certainly less than fun.
Going back to the beginning of your post...If you
had "wandered onto my lot" you would have never
met me. I am the Internet Sales Manager, and do
not "take ups".`If you went to my website, you
would find there my entire inventory...all priced
basically in accordance with Edmunds *TMV*. True,
there are variances, but they are both more and
LESS, depending upon availability.
As to my intentions, they are really quite simple... to provide, as best I can, information
that is clear, concise, and factual...to provide
advice that is is sound and practical...and finally to protect people from information or
statements of fact that are untrue.
I participate here without the cloak of anonymity,
and I believe that, for the most part, I have responded to requests for assistance in a timely
and professional manner, whether that be on the phone or email or fax.
The internet provides a forum for a multitude of voices, and for the most part without prejudice,
but with that freedom also comes responsibility...
I believe that I participate here in a responsible way...I hope that I am not scaring anyone by being candid and forthright.
$25,090 Invoice Price
$ 1,000 Holdback
---------
$24,090 Adjusted Invoice Price
$24,190 Purchase Price
---------
$ 100 Over invoice purchase price
4MO, no roof, no wheels, and cloth. Invoice on that is $24,770 plus $117 for Port Prep, and
Destination $525. = $25,412. You paid $24,190...or $1222 back of invoice. And now that I think about it, the Dealer Incentives did not apply to 4MO.
Holdback is 3% of MSRP...$806.25 Destination not included.
Dennis, I've said it before, you got a great deal on this very unusual Passat. And you said it yourself... you took what was in the showroom.
Nothing special...They took a real loss on this car, as you can see, secondary to bad ordering, and I am sure that whoever ordered it got an earful from the Owner, but you two have the Passat
that works for you and that is the most important part...PS
making "$150 plus 2%." I was referring to what I
had been led to believe was the 2% holdback. Just
above you said it was 3%. Whatever. I just know
that the dealer acknowledged that there was a
holdback when I included it in our conversation as
to how much money the dealer was making on our
deal.
I know I paid only $150 over the invoice because I
saw the invoice. There was no "dealer fee" added.
I am again taking the time to respond to your post
because you are inaccurately correcting me. I hope
you and everyone else gets the picture.
I agree that $700 or $800 over invoice would have
been a good deal. I just got a great deal. The
dealer did have a lot of Passats in stock and it
was near the end of the month and the dealer knew
I was going to buy a car within 24 hours. It was
just a matter of from whom. I gather that within a region dealers are very competitive and don't want a rival getting a sale. I presume allotments of new cars the next month depend on sales the previous month. Maybe I got a dealer in exactly the right situation for a savvy buyer. I'm not sure how or why I got such a good deal and don't mean to imply that everyone could end up with as good. But I took time to post it to let others know that they should try taking a fairly aggressive negotiating stance.
I must say your tone has been quite moderated from
your first sneering, inflammatory comments to me.
That's nice and I assume that will work better for
you in the long run. Maybe you should refrain
from posting here when you've had too much coffee - *especially* if you only do your business through the internet.
So please just give me credit for negotiating
aggressively and quote me correctly. Once you do,
I can forever stop checking this site and go out and have fun in my new Passat! My only intention in being here in the first place was to pass the word that great deals are possible. Have a nice and polite day.
of your enjoyment of your new Passat. I had just
returned from Volkswagen de Mexico, in Puebla at
around 3:00AM; so a good nights sleep would
probably been a better use of time. I any event
enjoy your new ride...
pride get in the way...At VW, Customer Loyalty
and Value are the cornerstones of what we do everyday. For one of our dealers to treat our
Flagship Product like distress mechandise is appalling.
After our more extended exchanges it seems that
you are a reasonable and thoughtful individual, and that if you say that is the deal you got, then
I believe that is the deal you got. But no wonder
he had a lot of Passats on the ground...Out here
we cannot get enough of them, and thus it is
very hard to comprehend giving them away. In
addition, that policy takes away all Value.
As I mentioned last night, there has to be a fair amount of oneupmanship being posted and that
really does set the stage for customer disappointment when that individual can't replicate the deal that they read about...no one
wins...unless, of course, they find out where you
got yours...
So, once again, drive and enjoy...I will attempt
to be a little less enthusiastic in my responses
in the future, keeping in mind that as hard as some of us work to create a more professional,
value oriented environment, that there are still
a number of dealers who believe it is business as
usual. Making up what they lost on your deal by
trying to bury someone else...sad.
Take care...PS
We also drove Nissan Max., Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, and numerous other brands. After driving all, we came back to the Passat wagon. At this point, and I stress at this point, the car is GREAT! Probably the best car I've (and my wife) owned (although I'm a truck man). The bottom line: my wife loves it.
By-the-way,,,,,,the staff at VW are outstanding so far. Good luck.
John
John
Bob
I understand your sensitivity about oneupsmanship on this site, but bragging had nothing to do with why I wrote about my deal. More to help others know that they can negotiate successfully. It's a matter of helping each other, no?
Now that we've made up, I'm going to keep my promise about doing something else on the internet in the future rather than checking in on Passat VIII. Good luck all.
will be the first in a series of stair step
products from VW/Audi and Porsche...The Passat
Plus will be first then the Porsche built SUV that
we will share and finally the D1 Varient. If you go to vwvortex.com ...news archives for Oct./Nov
1999, there is an interview with Herr Neumann from
the Frankfurt trade show...pretty interesting
stuff...then check out *timeline* at the same site. No smoke...just better value...
It will be interesting to see if VW can pull off this migration up-market with the Passat plus and D1.
Saturn has done pretty well (via their no-haggle pricing) at overcharging people who don't mind paying more for that "feel-good feeling" that you claim the act of buying a car should be all about.
Unfortunately for most people, BUYING a car isn't much fun at all--DRIVING a new car can be--but actually walking into dealer after dealer to find both a fair deal and a pleasent salesman is a difficult and often lengthy process. That, precisely, is why forums like these exist--for people to share their stories and exchange information.
Well, why don't you join in. Perhaps you could share your side of the story regarding the interest-rate padding scam that was just discussed on 20/20 on Friday. Is it true, as 20/20 and the New York Times claim, that dealers consistently bump-up the interest rates they get back from the bank and pocket additional profits? (i.e., Dealer Dan says to an hopeful customer: "The best the bank can do given your relatively poor credit is 13.5%"--when in fact the bank actually came back with 10.5% and the dealer just added a 3% interest rate markup!)
If you are an honest, upstanding dealer, I think that all of the consumers at this site would appreciate your insight into how to avoid the various scams that other dealers employ. I suspect that this would probably be much more helpful for us than what you appear to be saying in your last few posts--which is basically: "Don't go into a dealer with any hope of getting a great deal."
oh well...I am sorry that the 20/20 piece and
that of the Times has come to you so late...I believe that practically every major forum has
advised that the customer arrange their own financing before going out to buy a car...not unlike getting a pre-approved mortgage. This sane
advice, pretty logical too, helps the less disciplined not to look beyond their means. I have already addressed this issue when I stated
a few posts back, that practically every customer
I have comes in with a loan already approved. This is generally through their business related
credit union or a FCU/Bank. Or they are *one pays* personal check, etc. I also mentioned that if Volkswagen Credit is offering a better rate; I
will give them the opportunity to take advantage
of same. The 2000 Buildout rates etc., that were
offered during August & Sept. were coupled with
Incentive cash to the dealer, HOWEVER, the customer could only avail themselves of one or the other; not both. A customer either got the rate 3.9% for 24mos, for example or an additional
$1000 discount from the dealer...whichever the
customer found more favorable to their situation.
Have you every seen an add for companies that say
*rent to own*? If so...you will find there the
folks that are the most typical *victims* of this practice...they are also the the folks that pay 19%-21% for their credit cards, they probably
have a *repo* on their credit report or collection, collection, collection, collection, collection, collection, discharged, collection.
Like everything in a free market society, an
individual pays for services rendered, and this
is one of the fees that the less responsible
among us pay.
On the other hand, their are those who have been
responsible with their purchases, paid their bills
on time, have a little money in the bank, and a
computer in the den, and KNOW what rates they
are entitled to. Almost catagorically, every
dealer will roll a car based on an *either or*...
short for either our rate or yours. If a customer
can get a better rate, then, that is honored...if
not; the either prevails. Automoblie Dealers
work very hard creating relationships with lenders;
that work allows them to get loans approved for
people that other wise couldn't finance a ham
sandwich...and for this, the dealer can elect to
compensate itself for that influence and effort.
To be *PC*..."those with less than perfect credit" pay more...always have and always will...
no one in this country is rewarded for being
irresponsible.
Finally, as reluctant as I am to even acknowledge
your first and last...let me suggest that you go
to my site...I believe that it is possible to
provide a customer with a fair price...no hassles,
no haggling, no back and forth to a Manager...I are one, and to have a great experience. Exactly
what you are suggesting in your Paragraph #3. If the Internet Prices posted there are not enough
the customer can go elsewhere and go into the
trenches...and rid themselves of the great experience part, as well as the no hassle, no
haggle.
VWGuild: I seem to disagree with one of your core beliefs--I do not think that the auto industry should prey on the weak, even if we do live in a "free market." Your defense of the usury practiced in these instances by your industry (in collusion with the banks) is a classic attempt to "blame the victim." Of course the buyer should beware, but that doesn't excuse the deception.
The Edmund's True Market Value often exceeds the prices from other internet buying sites because it takes into account what some people have *overpaid* for a particular model. Those who want a good deal should use the TMV as one of their many references, but they also should also shop around, pitting dealer against dealer.
By all means, go check out Mr. VWGuild's site, but don't assume it's a good deal... After all, the bricks and mortar dealer that employs him wouldn't want his internet prices to undercut their lot pricing by too much--or else people would think that the lot was charging way too much.
I would think it much more effective to shop an internet site bid around to several dealers and see who wants to do business.
Can't wait for the 2001.5 Passat! In case you forgot what bb this was... ;-)
there is *Snippy*. And according to Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary...USURY is interest in excess of a legal rate...
And, sir, I do not equate *the weak* with the
irresponsible. And I do not know who the *victims
are that are being blamed*, nor for what...
Dealer, or you can order direct from VW.COM
under accessories