If you read through too many of the posts here, you probably won't want to buy a triplet.
Keep in mind, people with problems are MUCH MORE VOCAL than those that are happy. My wife loves our Envoy SLT (she is the main driver). Our only problem so far was the paint chipping on the tailgate. A minor problem although it was a bit of a challenge to get it fixed. Now, it will be easy since the fix is out in the open.
I think the vast majority of the people posting problems here would not change their decision to buy given the option.
So, my advice (as an owner) would be, drive one and if you like it, go for it.
Just been looking at a company that makes Synthetic oils/fluids and other stuff and I was toying with the idea of replacing the petroleum based transmission fluid in our new TB with synthetic. Anyone here tried this or know of someone that did. The company is AMSOIL. I've heard of them before but don't know much about their products. Any thoughts. I'm not trying to address any issues with tranny problems I've been reading here, just want to get the most out of the equipment.
I agree with pauleul. There is little reason for people who are happy with their product to post. Fortunately happy folks do post periodically
I would bet (and I don't know the answer) that if you chose almost any discussion forum on here of other models, you would see people posting questions about problems they are having with them, moreso than people praising them. I think it's helpful to read the threads for a while before purchasing, though, since you will start to get an idea of the situation and put it into perspective. And it gives you ammo for questions to ask your salesman, and like we've seen above, you can find out about TSB's, etc. even before the dealer's service dept.
What worries me about all these late model vehicles is the extent to which they rely on computers. I tend to drive a car "forever" and in very hot weather. I'm wondering how well all the computer modules are going to work in year 7,8,9, etc. I bet they will be very expensive to replace then.
The GM site that displayed the tech service bulletin was great. The first question the dealer asked was when did I get this. He was unaware of the fix. He will order parts and fix on Saturday. Does anyone know why the parts on the bulletin do not match the numbers for the parts listed in previous posts? 6500 miles on GMC to date. What satisfaction has anyone gotten for the paint problem on the leading edge of the rear wheel openings? I do not have running boards and the paint has been blasted off. Re-painting will not fix the problem. Thanks.
Well, the reason why the part numbers in previous postings doesn't match the TSB issued by GM is that the previously posted numbers were for the entire mirror assembly replacements (both left and right), at least that's what the numbers bring up in the parts department in addition to what my service advisor mentioned as well. The numbers listed in the TSB are for the mirror actuators, not the entire mirror itself. Hope that helps!
Also, EnvoyEnvy1... thanks for the clarification. I think that both you and I have different issues with the cold acceleration problem. Fortunately, my Envoy does not have the engine fan issue which causes the delayed acceleration, instead it just suffers from delayed acceleration (ha,ha). Well, my vehicle is still in the hands of the service department, so I will let you know if they were able to drum up anything concerning this problem. Thus far, it seems as if only Medolark and myself are experiencing this "unique" problem. Anyone else out there notice a delayed acceleration problem in the early mornings (not related to the engine fan being engaged at that time)??
iexplore2: My TB LTZ hesitates too. It is more pronounced when cold than when warm, but it still has some hesitation when warm. Mine is on its second engine, I don't remember the first engine doing it. I brought it in today for several things, that being one of them. I'll report the outcome in a few days. One other thing for us northerners, when the doors are unlocked with the keyfob and the seat/mirror reposition function is on, look out for ice damage to the mirrors when they try to reposition and are iced up. One of my mirror actuators ground itself to death trying to position a mirror frozen in place. The same applies to rain sense wipers. If they are left in the on mode at night, and you start the car in the A.M with ice on the windshield, good by wiper motor. The wipers also come on when going through a car wash if they are not fully in the off position. Now you have to check the position of the wiper control each time you start the truck. By the way, my milage increased about 2 mpg when I turned off the air by hand. I don't know if it was on all winter when using the auto temp mode. Does anyone know if the air is running full time in the winter in the auto temp mode. I think too much was left up to the computer programmers to design. Their product seems to show they do not have a lot of real world experience. Many of these problems should have been figured out before the first truck pulled off of the assembly line. If someone at G.M. is reading this, a reply would be welcomed. We won't engage in name calling or anything, just discussion. There are too many little problems and not enough solutions coming out of G.M. I am getting to know my service manager better than any other manager in 36 years of driving.
There is a TSB, print the whole thing out and show it to your dealer. Email me at jonaa@earthlink.net if you want the link (I don't want the moderators yelling at me).
On that subject, I don't think posting a link is a violation of copyrights any more than giving somebody directions to a library....and hitting "cancel" isn't exactly hacking. If that site wasn't supposed to be viewed by us they could have easily made it that way. Unless, of course, the people doing their web design were the same brilliant individuals that programmed my mirrors....
I've done a fair amount in my TB and it does just fine. It's a bit low on ground clearance (obviously) so just use your head. I can go anywhere my dad's 1-ton Silverado Diesel can go. Traction (I have the BFG "Rugged Trails") is great. Just watch your approach angles and don't try to stradle anything too high. For "trails" with mud, etc, it'll do just fine.
On the ground clearance, I've scraped the bottom of mine a bunch of times without hurting anything. Mine had all the options I wanted except the "Underbody shield package" so I had them add that right after I bought it. The lowest part between the wheels is the frame rails which makes the whole thing look really low. Some 4x4's look like they have a ton of ground clearance but then they have the transfer case hanging 6" below the rest of the vehicle.... The tranny, transfercase, etc is tucked up well above the framerails on these things.
That said, it sure could use some more ground clearance. I'll be lifting mine 1 1/2-2" and adding bigger tires (nobody's heard of wheelspacers?) in the next year or so. I'll let you all know how I did it when I do.
I've found one of the most dangerous things is the suspension is too good at soaking up bumps. I'll find myself going well over twice as fast as I can go with the 1-ton (without my head banging off the roof). That can lead to driving much too fast for the conditions which can mean broken parts if you hit something really nasty while going much faster than you should have been.
Oh, the lack of a locked 4WD and low range are definate disadvantages for the Bravada.
Links are ok - it's the cutting and pasting of big chunks or entire pieces of copyrighted work that we frown on (instructions on how to hack a "secure" site would be frowned on too).
Link away! Steve Host SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Sorry, I guess I missunderstood. That makes sense.
Here are some links! (Cut and paste these into your browser, then print them!) These should help some of the most common problems I've seen listed here:
On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) System Improvements (Reprogram PCM) - Service Engine Soon Light On, DTC P0014, P0116, P1683, Delayed Transmission Downshift and/or Excessive Fan Noise #01-06-04-052
Windnoise or Gap Between Luggage Carrier Side Rail Front Cover and Roof Sheet Metal (Secure Front SIde Rail Corners and/or Reposition Cross Bows) #01-08-58-004
Whine Noise from Power Steering (P/S) System During Vehicle Start-up at Low Ambient Temperatures (Flush/Bleed P/S System, Change P/S Fluid) #01-02-32-005
A word of caution, guys. Before you print these out and slap them on the dealer's desk, make sure they apply to your vehicle. For example, the first one I listed has a specific VIN cut-off. If your vehicle was built after that, it has the new programming and the TSB will do nothing for you. Or, for the rear gasket thing...make sure you don't have it before you tell them to install it (I know it seems obvious, but you never know). Just use some common sense....
and are tired of the login-password popup...go to IE Tools Menu, internet Options, Advanced Tab...scroll down to multimedia and un-check the Show Pictures Option. This will prevent the annoying pop-up from showing
All... I was away on business Sunday and Monday and didn't realize the mess I caused until this morning. Host, you are absolutely right and thanks for removing my post.
After talking about this for over 5 months and having a fix from the authoritative source I got abit over zealous with the "cut and paste" routine before looking for the copyright.
Looks like(eyeball and tape estimation)the wheel wells will handle another inch in tire diameter.The factory skid plates are excellent and by paying attention(use a spotter)the TB will handle anything but a rock crawler course.The rear muffler is the worst problem;but I'm sure the aftermarket will soon offer a fix for that.
I just installed 18" AT Italia wheels with 275/55-18 Michelin Cross Terrain tires at all four corners and they fit perfectly with no rubbing. I have photos, so email me if you want to check them out on my 02 Envoy SLT 4x4. SBindley@aol.com
After you 'un-check the Show Pictures Option' and go to one of the links with pictures (you can not view them at this time) reverse the procedure and check the Show Pictures Option again. This allows you to roam freely through the links, view the pictures and still avoid the pop up until you close your browser. Don't know if it will work for all but works with IE6 on my computer.
Repainting will repair problem but needs to either put the running boards on or legnthen the GM mudflaps by adding aftermarket flaps that will hang lower and wider than the GM ones.
After reading some sections of this site -- specifically HVAC (and not understanding a great deal!) -- I am amazed by the technology. For instance, it sounds like the steering wheel control buttons for the fan speed and temperature send out radio signals to the main control panel (serial board?) to make adjustments! Overall I believe GM took a giant step forward in designing/executing their mid-sized SUVs and did a great job. I'm glad I have and enjoy my Envoy.
Wow... thanks for the info cmack4. Actually I am printing off the service bulletin for the air hiss now. I am going to take it over to the dealership that currently has my vehicle in order for them to add this fix to their list of "to do's." I will let you all know how this turns out as well.
Sbindley: Is is possible for you to e-mail me your pics with the new wheel/tire combination? I would love to see it!
Is there much wheel to edge of tire distance lost with 18 in. tires and wheels?This is the area that soaks up rocks and the like.Would they air down as much as a 16in.tire? Thanks for the post;can't afford new wheels but in time I will need tires.
Good luck finding off-road tires in 18" 18" is more like bling bling to me! Heck most true off-roaders harder core than I use 15" steelies for their off-road tires!
What size wheels did you have before? Did you have to adjust the computer to compute new mileage and speed? How much extra ground clearance did you get?
Is anyone having wiring problems in steering column that causes the lights, wipers, and cruise to malfunction? I just saw on Car and Driver news that NHTSA is investigating this on the triplets.
If you want Bigger Tires, go with a steeper sidewall height... For instance, my stock Bravada uses the Michelin Cross Terrain's in 255/60/17... You could bump up to 255(width)/75(sidewall height)/17 (rim diameter) on the same rims and effectively have another 3" (32" vs 29") of diameter for your tires! I had 15" steelies on my old FJ40 and the tires were 33" ... Talk about some tread!
I purchased my White 2002 Envoy SLT 4X4 from Bommarito in St. Louis in March 01. Patrick Bradbury was my salesman. Bommarito has been very good to me when it comes to any problems. The service men have always been helpful. My major complaint was when GM took it back after I had it for only 4 days. But that was because of the recall. If you decide to go to Bommarito in Ellisville, talk to Patrick he will be really great to work with. Tell him Debbie sent you. I have purchased other vehicles from him, and have never had any problems. The service department has always been courteous and helpful.
When my 91 Van, several years out of warranty, broke down on the highway, I call them and they help me get it towed in. I discovered that when a pulley bearing goes out and breaks the surpentine belt, your stuck.
By the way, I love my Envoy and wouldn't trade it for anything, but maybe a new one in a few years. It handles great even when towing, and definitely get the BOSE. My last long distance highway drive was over 22 mpg.
Mike, do you have the factory running boards or an aftermarket board? And do you know the brand or source of the aftermarket flaps that are wider and hang lower? Thanks.
I've had my TB for about 1 month. The more I drive it, the more it hurts my back. SERIOUSLY! The left and right front bottom cushions both lean in towards the console. After a while behind the wheel, it starts to be quite hard on my back. My local Dealer says that he has heard several people complain of the same thing. At this time he says it's a characteristic of the seats and that there is NOTHING they can do! Does anyone else have this problem? I'd like to know how wide spread the problem is. I may have to end up banging my head on the wall with GM to get some kind of results. I know it took a while for GM to release the fix for the rear deck license plate housing. Maybe if this problem is wide spread, GM will figure out a fix for the seats. Thanks for your time!
I got out of a Subaru because the seats were extremely uncomfortable for me. Most others thought they were great. My Bravada seats are good for me. I took a LONG test ride to make sure.
My Bravada is in the shop for several things, the most important the binding on sharp turns. At first I got a "can't duplicate". I told them to keep trying. After awhile, they got it to lock up and bind in a sharp turn. They called the tech adviser and told me it's a tranfer case problem. Maybe it's not the rear end after all. Time will tell after I get it back. They are replacing a squeaky serp belt, and ordering the infamous tailgate gasket. He also said they are downloading many computer upgrades. Maybe everyone can cross their fingers and chant to the auto gods that this will fix my problems!
I found the Mobil-1 filters in a local Kmart, but they don't have the book; and the Mobil1 site doesn't have 2002 models. Does someone know which filter to use?
sbindley and others...if you would like, I would be happy to post links or pics on my site.
I'm moving forward into getting links and pics of other owners here and other places and would be happy to post links, details and pics whatever....I have plenty of server space.
Basically I just want to get the aftermarket awareness up like happend with the GTP clubs I'm a part of.
The seats in my Envoy don't seem to be leaning significantly, but I have had the seat bottoms in and out several times working on the cushions, and I think it would be quite easy to add a shim or washers to correct this. The seat cushions are held to a frame with 4 bolts (13mm deep socket needed) and are easy to remove. There are also some screws that hold the plastic panel having the control switches; and there are some cable clamps attached to the bottom of the cushion assembly that are a bit of a pain. I would think that your dealer could fix this; or if you are willing it is not a difficult diy.
I reworked the cushion in mine and, for me, it is much better. I just cut and added foam in just the right places, which took some experimenting. The seat cover comes right off after getting the seat bottom assembly out. There is no needle and thread required.
My dealer was not willing to help either. The upholstery shops also didn't know what to do; so I had no choice but sell it or fix it.
Thanks for the info on the dealership. Just curious on what kind of deal you made. Would you mind posting your MSRP and what you paid for vehicle after rebates? How much over invoice was it? Thanks JJ
Looking at GMC Envoy XL's in the mix with several others. Appreciate it if any Envoy XL owners post prices paid. I'm looking for 2wd SLE with Pro technology option (DVD, etc). Really like the reviews and the Envoy styling. Have never owned a GM product, but this one really looks good.
You've got 2 choices. Either use their cross reference chart to find an M1 filter that matches an AC Delco PF58 or PF59, or find a vehicle in their catalog that uses the AC Delco filters and what M1 filter to use.
I'm about 80% sure I know what your turning bind problem is--a wheelspeed sensor. Have them check it out.
Here's why:
You seem to be describing the kind of binding you get with any 4WD that locks the front and rear driveshafts together. If you put a TB or Envoy in 4HI you'll get the same binding--that's why you don't leave them there on pavement. Your Bravada shouldn't ever do that.
Your Bravada should operate much the same way the others do in A4WD--the front driveshaft isn't engaged until it senses the rear wheels spinning. Then it will increase the torque of the front clutch to engage the front driveshaft.
If you have a wheelspeed sensor giving bad information, the computer will think you're spinning your wheels and lock you into 4WD. When I had a sensor go out, I would get the same binding in A4WD as I did in 4HI. After they fixed it, A4WD feels just like 2HI in tight turns even on dry pavement. But 4HI still binds up--as it should.
Anyway, no guarantees (like I said--only 80% sure) but it's something to have them check out if they're stumped. Other than that I'd look to the transfer case control module being bad or needing a reprogram. For some reason it's applying alot of pressure to the front clutchpack when it shouldn't be.
But most importantly, don't give up! Stay on them until they fix this or you will tear up your entire driveline very soon.
switch dealers if necessary. Espcially cause there are tons of GM dealers if a dealer gives you a "cannot find" or a brush-off as not caring, there are probably 5 more dealers in the area!
When I test drove a TB I thought the seats felt a little like I was on the verge of rolling off. And yes it felt like they were tilted in towards the console. The Envoy (which I bought) and the Bravada have a slight bit more contour to the seat bottoms which helps some. I haven't actually sat in the Bravada, but have heard others say it has the most comfortable seats.
After reading your post, I actually took a level to my seats. They don't lean or tilt in, they are level. They aren't the most comfortable but I can live with them. You may want to check out Envoy and Bravada and see if they don't feel better to you. Swapping out seats would cost less than selling your truck if there is enough of a difference to you to satisfy your needs.
You can bet GM isn't going to do anything no matter how many complain. They will probably make a change to the design in the next model year and provide more of a bucket seat.
Any ideas on what type of seat to upgrade to. Or is this something that can be done easily. I have TB and the seat are not that good. So I would invest in my rear end before buying new tire and rims.
I've printed most of the information in .pdf format. Shame on GM really....nothing there we as consumers shouldn't be allowed to have.
If someone there is getting this...open it back up and deal with it. You're just going to end up having it released somewhere anyway. Can't keep everyone quiet.
The local van conversion shops told me there were no aftermarket seats for the triplets because of the seatbelt design (tied to the seat back). I'm not sure its true, but I gave up and re-worked the drivers seat. I wouldn't say it was easy. But cheaper/easier than trading off the vehicle.
I think it relates back to Aadland's earlier "common sense" message. GM's fine print said that the info didn't necessarily apply to your vehicle or your problem.
You see the same problem with folks getting a TSB off the net and then demanding that their dealer "fix" something that may not even be an issue with that particular VIN. Follow the money - this info can cost the service writers bucks dealing with people wanting "bug fixes."
But it was nice while it lasted.... Steve Host SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Comments
Keep in mind, people with problems are MUCH MORE VOCAL than those that are happy. My wife loves our Envoy SLT (she is the main driver). Our only problem so far was the paint chipping on the tailgate. A minor problem although it was a bit of a challenge to get it fixed. Now, it will be easy since the fix is out in the open.
I think the vast majority of the people posting problems here would not change their decision to buy given the option.
So, my advice (as an owner) would be, drive one and if you like it, go for it.
I would bet (and I don't know the answer) that if you chose almost any discussion forum on here of other models, you would see people posting questions about problems they are having with them, moreso than people praising them. I think it's helpful to read the threads for a while before purchasing, though, since you will start to get an idea of the situation and put it into perspective. And it gives you ammo for questions to ask your salesman, and like we've seen above, you can find out about TSB's, etc. even before the dealer's service dept.
What worries me about all these late model vehicles is the extent to which they rely on computers. I tend to drive a car "forever" and in very hot weather. I'm wondering how well all the computer modules are going to work in year 7,8,9, etc. I bet they will be very expensive to replace then.
Amsoil: Great products a lot of the subie guys I hang with swear by them. Very helpful in MTs for cold weather chattering.
-mike
Also, EnvoyEnvy1... thanks for the clarification. I think that both you and I have different issues with the cold acceleration problem. Fortunately, my Envoy does not have the engine fan issue which causes the delayed acceleration, instead it just suffers from delayed acceleration (ha,ha). Well, my vehicle is still in the hands of the service department, so I will let you know if they were able to drum up anything concerning this problem. Thus far, it seems as if only Medolark and myself are experiencing this "unique" problem. Anyone else out there notice a delayed acceleration problem in the early mornings (not related to the engine fan being engaged at that time)??
Thanks!
IExplore2000@aol.com
One other thing for us northerners, when the doors are unlocked with the keyfob and the seat/mirror reposition function is on, look out for ice damage to the mirrors when they try to reposition and are iced up. One of my mirror actuators ground itself to death trying to position a mirror frozen in place. The same applies to rain sense wipers. If they are left in the on mode at night, and you start the car in the A.M with ice on the windshield, good by wiper motor. The wipers also come on when going through a car wash if they are not fully in the off position. Now you have to check the position of the wiper control each time you start the truck.
By the way, my milage increased about 2 mpg when I turned off the air by hand. I don't know if it was on all winter when using the auto temp mode. Does anyone know if the air is running full time in the winter in the auto temp mode.
I think too much was left up to the computer programmers to design. Their product seems to show they do not have a lot of real world experience. Many of these problems should have been figured out before the first truck pulled off of the assembly line. If someone at G.M. is reading this, a reply would be welcomed. We won't engage in name calling or anything, just discussion. There are too many little problems and not enough solutions coming out of G.M. I am getting to know my service manager better than any other manager in 36 years of driving.
Frank
There is a TSB, print the whole thing out and show it to your dealer. Email me at jonaa@earthlink.net if you want the link (I don't want the moderators yelling at me).
On that subject, I don't think posting a link is a violation of copyrights any more than giving somebody directions to a library....and hitting "cancel" isn't exactly hacking. If that site wasn't supposed to be viewed by us they could have easily made it that way. Unless, of course, the people doing their web design were the same brilliant individuals that programmed my mirrors....
On the ground clearance, I've scraped the bottom of mine a bunch of times without hurting anything. Mine had all the options I wanted except the "Underbody shield package" so I had them add that right after I bought it. The lowest part between the wheels is the frame rails which makes the whole thing look really low. Some 4x4's look like they have a ton of ground clearance but then they have the transfer case hanging 6" below the rest of the vehicle.... The tranny, transfercase, etc is tucked up well above the framerails on these things.
That said, it sure could use some more ground clearance. I'll be lifting mine 1 1/2-2" and adding bigger tires (nobody's heard of wheelspacers?) in the next year or so. I'll let you all know how I did it when I do.
I've found one of the most dangerous things is the suspension is too good at soaking up bumps. I'll find myself going well over twice as fast as I can go with the 1-ton (without my head banging off the roof). That can lead to driving much too fast for the conditions which can mean broken parts if you hit something really nasty while going much faster than you should have been.
Oh, the lack of a locked 4WD and low range are definate disadvantages for the Bravada.
Link away!
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Here are some links! (Cut and paste these into your browser, then print them!) These should help some of the most common problems I've seen listed here:
On-Board Diagnostic (OBD) System Improvements (Reprogram PCM) - Service Engine Soon Light On, DTC P0014, P0116, P1683, Delayed Transmission Downshift and/or Excessive Fan Noise #01-06-04-052
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=831229
Uncommanded Movement of Outside Rearview Mirrors (Replace Mirror Actuator) #02-08-64-008
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=873047
Paint Rub Through on Liftgate around Edge of License Plate Housing/Pocking (Install Insulating Seal/Gasket) #02-08-66-004
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=876572
Windnoise or Gap Between Luggage Carrier Side Rail Front Cover and Roof Sheet Metal (Secure Front SIde Rail Corners and/or Reposition Cross Bows) #01-08-58-004
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=818804
Erratic Instrument Panel Indicators/Gauges (Needles/Pointers) When Vehicle Ignition is Switched On (Reprogram Instrument Panel Cluster Software) #01-08-49-006
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=797026
Whine Noise from Power Steering (P/S) System During Vehicle Start-up at Low Ambient Temperatures (Flush/Bleed P/S System, Change P/S Fluid) #01-02-32-005
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=802042
A word of caution, guys. Before you print these out and slap them on the dealer's desk, make sure they apply to your vehicle. For example, the first one I listed has a specific VIN cut-off. If your vehicle was built after that, it has the new programming and the TSB will do nothing for you. Or, for the rear gasket thing...make sure you don't have it before you tell them to install it (I know it seems obvious, but you never know). Just use some common sense....
Hope that helps everybody!
and are tired of the login-password popup...go to IE Tools Menu, internet Options, Advanced Tab...scroll down to multimedia and un-check the Show Pictures Option. This will prevent the annoying pop-up from showing
tim
After talking about this for over 5 months and having a fix from the authoritative source I got abit over zealous with the "cut and paste" routine before looking for the copyright.
I am however, glad that we can ALL get this (and other annoyances) behind us thanks to http://service.gm.com/servlets/SMSCTSrv?&year=2002&make=Chevrolet%2FGeo&model=Trailblazer+-+4WD&cfg=&mfmyrcgkey=0 This will give us time to talk about mods and such for these great vehicles.
After you 'un-check the Show Pictures Option' and go to one of the links with pictures (you can not view them at this time) reverse the procedure and check the Show Pictures Option again. This allows you to roam freely through the links, view the pictures and still avoid the pop up until you close your browser. Don't know if it will work for all but works with IE6 on my computer.
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=834313
That's one thing you gotta give GM credit for. Even though it ain't necessarily broke, if enough customers complain... they always come up with a fix!
Sbindley: Is is possible for you to e-mail me your pics with the new wheel/tire combination? I would love to see it!
Thanks!
IExplore2000@aol.com
Thanks for the post;can't afford new wheels but in time I will need tires.
-mike
When my 91 Van, several years out of warranty, broke down on the highway, I call them and they help me get it towed in. I discovered that when a pulley bearing goes out and breaks the surpentine belt, your stuck.
By the way, I love my Envoy and wouldn't trade it for anything, but maybe a new one in a few years. It handles great even when towing, and definitely get the BOSE. My last long distance highway drive was over 22 mpg.
No Start, Turn/Hazzard, Interior Lamps, DIC, Radio, Theft Alarm, Wipers, Cruise, Shift Interlock, Horn and/or Key in Signal Inoperative (Repair/Insulate Steering Column Wiring Harness) #02-06-03-001
Go To:
http://service.gm.com/servlets/BlobShtml?ShtmlFile=848403
2002 Chevrolet and GMC S/T Utility Models (TrailBlazer, Envoy)
2002 Oldsmobile Bravada
Built Prior to VIN Breakpoint 22238123
Sounds like this is what you are talking about.
The left and right front bottom cushions both
lean in towards the console. After a while behind
the wheel, it starts to be quite hard on my back.
My local Dealer says that he has heard several
people complain of the same thing. At this time he says it's a characteristic of the seats and that there is NOTHING they can do! Does anyone else have this problem? I'd like to know how
wide spread the problem is. I may have to end up banging my head on the wall with GM to get some
kind of results. I know it took a while for GM
to release the fix for the rear deck license plate
housing. Maybe if this problem is wide spread, GM
will figure out a fix for the seats.
Thanks for your time!
Matt
My Bravada is in the shop for several things, the most important the binding on sharp turns. At first I got a "can't duplicate". I told them to keep trying. After awhile, they got it to lock up and bind in a sharp turn. They called the tech adviser and told me it's a tranfer case problem.
Maybe it's not the rear end after all. Time will tell after I get it back. They are replacing a squeaky serp belt, and ordering the infamous tailgate gasket. He also said they are downloading many computer upgrades. Maybe everyone can cross their fingers and chant to the auto gods that this will fix my problems!
GAM2
I'm moving forward into getting links and pics of other owners here and other places and would be happy to post links, details and pics whatever....I have plenty of server space.
Basically I just want to get the aftermarket awareness up like happend with the GTP clubs I'm a part of.
Just email me or post your thoughts and ideas.
tim
I reworked the cushion in mine and, for me, it is much better. I just cut and added foam in just the right places, which took some experimenting. The seat cover comes right off after getting the seat bottom assembly out. There is no needle and thread required.
My dealer was not willing to help either. The upholstery shops also didn't know what to do; so I had no choice but sell it or fix it.
Good luck.
If you look closely, the gap is so wide you can see how the fender is bolted to the body.
Thanks!
Tim
Here's why:
You seem to be describing the kind of binding you get with any 4WD that locks the front and rear driveshafts together. If you put a TB or Envoy in 4HI you'll get the same binding--that's why you don't leave them there on pavement. Your Bravada shouldn't ever do that.
Your Bravada should operate much the same way the others do in A4WD--the front driveshaft isn't engaged until it senses the rear wheels spinning. Then it will increase the torque of the front clutch to engage the front driveshaft.
If you have a wheelspeed sensor giving bad information, the computer will think you're spinning your wheels and lock you into 4WD. When I had a sensor go out, I would get the same binding in A4WD as I did in 4HI. After they fixed it, A4WD feels just like 2HI in tight turns even on dry pavement. But 4HI still binds up--as it should.
Anyway, no guarantees (like I said--only 80% sure) but it's something to have them check out if they're stumped. Other than that I'd look to the transfer case control module being bad or needing a reprogram. For some reason it's applying alot of pressure to the front clutchpack when it shouldn't be.
But most importantly, don't give up! Stay on them until they fix this or you will tear up your entire driveline very soon.
-mike
After reading your post, I actually took a level to my seats. They don't lean or tilt in, they are level. They aren't the most comfortable but I can live with them. You may want to check out Envoy and Bravada and see if they don't feel better to you. Swapping out seats would cost less than selling your truck if there is enough of a difference to you to satisfy your needs.
You can bet GM isn't going to do anything no matter how many complain. They will probably make a change to the design in the next model year and provide more of a bucket seat.
Good luck!
At least I printed out what I was interested in.
I'll get us a password and log on. Several Probably.
I have plenty of connections
tim
I have been using the Mobil One synthetic filter # M1-206. Hopefully this helps you!
Good Luck!
IExplore2000@aol.com
If someone there is getting this...open it back up and deal with it. You're just going to end up having it released somewhere anyway. Can't keep everyone quiet.
You see the same problem with folks getting a TSB off the net and then demanding that their dealer "fix" something that may not even be an issue with that particular VIN. Follow the money - this info can cost the service writers bucks dealing with people wanting "bug fixes."
But it was nice while it lasted....
Steve
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