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Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy



  • vindog45vindog45 Posts: 35
    My dealer says baffles between door and quarter panel are just hang there?...he said he checked other new vehicles on lot ...same....has anyone had this problem fixed by dealer...or themself?
  • jadavisncjadavisnc Posts: 8
    I'm not sure if I jinxed myself by spending too much time on this board or if I was destined to feel everyone elses pain.
    02 Bravada with 3500 low miles (purchased 10/01) pulled the dreaded delayed acceleration trick on us yesterday - no power at all and a roar from something other than the engine. Up to now, I've had most of the minor issues which have been fixed without too much pain by the dealer leaving me feel fairly confident in the vehicle.
    It seems like the 3000 mile barrier is when some of the major problems start to surface with the engine and/or computer controls.
    As with most of you, I'm armed with TSB's and part #'s. Without them, my dealer has been plead the 5th. With them, things get fixed.
  • jimc18jimc18 Posts: 1
    My 2002 Trailblazer's Content theft deterrent Alarm does not work as described in the owners manual. The "SECURITY" light is supposed to flash when the key is removed from the ignition and the drivers door is opened,it doesn't. The dealer claims that this is normal and the owners manual is incorrect. The rest of the system works as described in the manual. Does anyone else's work this way. This vehicle has been in 5 times for putting itself into various modes of 4wd and has had an engine replaced due to the cylinder liner issue. I'm wondering if there more electrical problems with the vehicle
  • rjsnyder2krjsnyder2k Posts: 10
    quality1, I gave them the list from jljackson #5398 (see below)

    # ID Description
    1. 12575262 new software to correct case learn issue
    2. 12575727 new calibration to correct problem
    3. 12575341 new calibration to address delay in transmission downshifting
    4. 09351581 speedometer calibration
    5. 12576361 enhance ev fan calibration for cooling fan noise reduction
    6. 12571574 electronic throttle control calibration

    However, after reading the "all or nothing" posts from "gator38" and "medolark" #5538, and looking at the lack of (update detail) on my workorder after the work was completed, I think the specific update #'s are insignificant.

    I did however insure their TEC tool was at the appropriate level (thanks to gmdrone) post #5516 were he said: "If you have had the PROM reflashed,make sure that they use GM-VIS TIS 2000 Version 8.5/2001"

    The only difference with our two LTZ's is build date. My build date is 06/01 (yes... I ordered early. When I jump in its with both feet :-) )

    I am on the 3rd tank now am still at 16.+. Hope this helps.

    PCM update 12575341
  • jw4gmjw4gm Posts: 27
    Several earlier posts complained about missing covers for front seat mounting brackets. I finally got them installed yesterday on my Envoy. The part number on the actual part is 1507333. I checked and they don't show, but the dealer can order.
  • dammitjim1dammitjim1 Posts: 95
    Just a couple of months from the end of my 300M lease. I love the 300M, but with the lousy residuals DC is applying to new leases, a new lease on a 300M is not an attractive prospect.

    I had also been very interested in either the Envoy SLT or the TB LTZ, and wanted to hear from any people currently under lease, what the leasing costs were. Any comments on how satisfied you are to date with your trucks would also be appreciated.

    Thanks in advance...
  • pepper50pepper50 Posts: 195
    I have an Envoy, but I assume they would be similar, but not sure. Like you, my security light does not automatically blink when I remove the key and open the door, even though the Envoy manual also says it should (as a reminder to activate it). It won't flash until I arm the system by pressing "lock" on the remote with the door openand then shutting it. If I lock the door with the remote with the door already closed, the security light will come on, but not flash. In either case, the security light will go off in a few seconds once armed. So it sounds like yours works in this same way, but maybe some TB owners will confirm. I'm not sure why our manuals says it blinks "as a reminder" when it automatically arms anyway if you use the remote or the driver powerlock.
  • mspdrivermspdriver Posts: 5
    I am leasing a 2002 SLT Envoy 4WD. To be honest - the lease rates are not good. The residual (money factor) on mine with a 3 yr 15k mi/yr was like .42 Compared to most cars which should be over .50. There is another board here with Leasing Questions - where I posted the specs (car/mdl/yr/cost/terms) and a moderator/drone helped by posting what I should pay/rates/invoice etc. This was informative. It turned out to be off a bit (he quoted a residual of .44) but none the less - more info. If you want 3 yrs - or so - with the GM Buypower deal ($200 over invoice) You can expect $550-600 a month with $1000 down - 3 yrs 15,000 miles. Have them check and recheck the finance companies - GMAC and others. That is what I paid anyways. (before tax/lic of course).

  • crj1crj1 Posts: 70
    The residual is 52 for a 36 month lease and 59 for a 24 month lease. You can lease a envoy SLT for under $500 with $1000 down. I work for a GMC dealer in michigan and have never seen a 42 residual on an Envoy. And its 48 on a 3yr. for a Bravada
  • cwhawkcwhawk Posts: 38
    Has anyone heard a whine from their vehicle at around 50 mph? Sounds like a rear end or wheel bearing noise.
  • I took my Envoy in for TSB fixes and some other minor repairs. I took copies of the TSB's that I downloaded from the GM site when it was up. I wanted to fix the roof rack, the heater baffle, the tailgate gasket, the air compressor hiss, and the transmission reprogram. Also wanted to have them fix my broken tailgate strap (stupid design) and change the oil. I was careful to only pick issues that I felt I had experienced.
    They seemed amenable to fixing everything except for the reprogram on the PCM. They fought me saying there were no dtc error codes stored and so they wouldn't reprogram without error codes. I was however informed that the codes are only stored for 50 key inserts and then lost. I don't think I've had the problem the last few weeks so previous error codes may have been lost. Anyway I tried to suggest that if the software was updated and improved that it seemed logical to upgrade the PCM anyway even without the codes. They did not want to do this. Is my logic flawed? If my computer software has an upgrade I usually install it, why should a car computer be any different. If things have been improved and fixed with newer software, why shouldn't I get the update. I was also hoping that the upgrade would also help my mileage (13-14 average mixed town/highway). By the way, no parts were in so everything had to be ordered and I have to take it back in. They seemed to concede that they might reprogram the PCM with the other repairs.
    My one recourse it that the President of the Dealership is my patient and would probably help me out if I really couldn't get this resolved. I'd rather not bother him however.
  • medolarkmedolark Posts: 93
    If you look at the TSB regarding fan noise on Tim's site you will find VIN cutoff values. If your vehicle has a vin lower than the cutoff value your dealer will surely apply athe new programming for you. I had the dealer verify my programming was per the TSB even though my vin was past the cutoff. He had no problem doing that for me - didn't even write up a work order. Seems like you could request verification as I did.
  • medolarkmedolark Posts: 93
    I finally decided to check the baffles as many folks have mentioned them. Sure enough I have a loose floppy one on the passenger side. I just reached in and pulled it back into position and it seems to stay there at least around town. They are not supposed to just hang there and you can prove it by pulling on the baffle until the lip the fits up against the body (not the fender side) of the vehicle is visible. You should find some adhesive on that edge. I think it is designed to be glued just on the inside edge and the fender side floats. Anyway after I moved it back into position the squeak that has been bugging me off and on for awhile seems to have disappeared. My guess is that the mispositioned baffle was pushing something else around (like maybe the plastic innner fender liner) causing it to rub and creating the squeak.

    Right now this is a minor annoyance to me and I'll probably wait until I take the vehicle in to have the license plate gasket installed and ask them to reglue it while it is there. I might even decide to do it myself since I think loosening the inner liner on the fender would provide enough access to get a tube of adhesive in there.
  • I should have mentioned that my Envoy falls within the VIN cutoff (08/01). The service manager voiced concern about introducing new problems with the upgrade.
  • tlaurotlauro Posts: 504
    I agree with crj1...never seen a residual for the triplets below 48%. Keep in mind that 48-52% is realistic. Not sure where the rates are at today, but at least you'll be able to get out of it easily and perhaps make money.

    My advice is to never put a dime as a down payment. See the leasing section of my site. If the payments are pushing your budget, you need to buy a less expensive vehicle.

    Again, zero cap cost reduction. Just put a Security Deposit...may be waved if you've leased from the lending institution before...make your first payment of course and pay any taxes, etc...perhaps only pay the Aquisition Fee..but that can be rolled into the lease too.

    former dealer
  • envoyenvy1envoyenvy1 Posts: 22
    The dealer won't find dtc error codes, since the equipment is operating as programed, out of calibration (follow that logic!) If you look at the reprograming info, it recalibrates (adjust)the settings of several elements. My dealer stated the same thing the first time I took my Envoy in for a fix. After some persistance, and several examples of people having the same problem (from this board) they did the reprograming.

    Unfortunately my fix only lasted about a month and then I had several repeats. Of course now that I want to take it in again, the problem has disappeared. Been another 4 days without any fan noise or acceleration problem???

    Maybe before you get it reprogramed it would be interesting to find out from the others on the board that have had this done, who has had long term success. Mine is about 5 weeks old, failed again after four weeks, but now seems to be random. Everyone else???
  • envoyenvy1envoyenvy1 Posts: 22
    For those who don't have this info. There is a web page where you can input your VIN number and get all of the calibration info. Here's the actual data from the site.

    Obtain the latest engine controller calibration information for your vehicle simply by entering the vehicle's 17 character Vehicle Identification Number (VIN).

    Vehicle calibration information includes any 1993 or later model year GM vehicle equipped with a reprogrammable engine controller (PCM or VCM).
  • sweiblingsweibling Posts: 5
    I used that site a couple of days ago and when I entered my VIN it listed "new calibration to address complaints of fan noise" under the system calibration section. Is this a fix that eliminates the fan problem, or does it still occur? I have had the fan come on in the garage in the morning twice, but it turned off after driving for a minute and hasn't happened in over a month. It hasn't been taken to the dealer for this. The build date is 1/02.
  • edl55347edl55347 Posts: 46
    Envoyenvy1 and Sweibling,
    Can you please post the web-site where you can enter this data??
  • saknstlsaknstl Posts: 4
    We have had our 2002 Bravada since Aug 01 and have considerable quality problems. Some classic examples are listed below:

    Blown Powertrain Control Module (PCM) - within the first month we were stranded on the highway when the PCM was fried. We got a Check Engine Soon warning but the folks at On Star said to look into before a week or so. Throttle Control Module and PCM module were replaced and reprogramed. Similar problem a week or so later. Seems there was a voltage surge problem from the Air Compressor from the rear suspension system. An electrical filter was added and this problem seems to be fixed.

    Fan Roar on Cold Starts - intemittent problem. Dealer says this is "normal". Our PCM has been re-programmed sevearl times in the last few months so the early TSB that addresses this problem doesn't seem to solve the problem. Since this problem is also tied to high RPM and reduced engine power, this cannot be "normal".

    Malfunctioning Memory Mirrors - dealer replaced memory modules first and then the mirrors. Still not fixed. GM says a fix should be available by the end of May (sure hope so, I'm afraid that we'll wear out the mirror adjust switch from overuse).

    Rain Sensing Wipers - would come on during sunny days. Dealer intitally said this is normal to "let you know that you are in the rain sensing mode". Later admitted there is a problem and replaced both wiper motors. Still had the problem. Replaced the moisture sensor and the problem seems to be solved.

    AWD Transmission Surge - intemittent problem. Most of the time a takeoff from a dead stop is smooth, but sometimes there is a hesitation and sudden surge as if something slipping finally takes hold. Dealer did a "re-calibration" that did not fix the problem.
    There were several other minor problems: L/H door handle fell off, loose sun visor, loose nut on air inflator valve, etc.

    Bottom line. Nice design, lousy quality.
  • cf52cf52 Posts: 1
    My 2002 Envoy was whining between 45-60 mph, but loudest at 50 mph.

    I took it to the dealer last Thursday, and was told they would need it until Friday (waiting on parts).

    On Friday, the dealer called, saying the ring and pinion needed to be replaced due to a factory installation problem. However, they didn't have the parts. In fact, there weren't any parts in all of the Dallas-Fort Worth area.

    Apparently, there's a process the dealer can use to notify GM when they have a vehicle down due to parts availability. This initiates a nationwide search for the needed parts.

    Monday, the dealer called saying GM would have to "make the parts", and it would probably be next week before they would arrive.

    Tuesday at 4:00 pm, the dealer called saying my Envoy was ready! The dealer said he was surprised when the FedEx package showed up Tuesday morning with the needed parts.

    The whine is gone. Life is good.
  • jwinkyjwinky Posts: 59
    I just wanted to find out from everyone when talking about the roaring engine/fan with delayed acceleration and high RPM's, what you are considering to be high RPM's. I have noticed on cold starts with my one and a half week old Envoy that there is some elevated noise levels coming from the engine area and that RPM's are elevated but not what I would consider high.

    I am talking about 1200-1300 versus the normal 700-800 when the engine is warm. Is this what you are considering high, or is the engine really racing? I am not noticing any delayed acceleration.

    I wouldn't say that the noise I am experiencing is a 'roar', but the fan is definitely running.

    The reason I ask, and I am not trying to downplay the issues folks are experiencing, is all of the cars that I have owned have had an increase in RPM's on cold start-up until the engine reaches operating temperature.

    If I am way off-base, let me know, and I will shut my pie-hole.

  • saknstlsaknstl Posts: 4
    The "high RPM" is in the 1200 RPM range.... and the engine doesn't really make much noise at 1200 RPM.

    If you ever experience the "Roar" from the coolant fan, you will know it. It sounds as if it is an airplane is ready to take off.

    The coolant fan is just another of the many items that are controlled by the PCM. Micro-processor controlled devices are great .... if the programming is correct.

  • mytrip2mytrip2 Posts: 12
    I heard the same thing on my Envoy last Sunday while driving in some hilly country. I can cut it in and out with the throttle. Figured it was the rear end, but it's not doing it on level road that I can here. Will have to wait till it get's worse before I take it in. It's in the shop now for air suspension leak down. Replaced the compressor last week,still the same air loss.
  • medolarkmedolark Posts: 93
    When my envoy is cold it doesn't shift from first to second until about 2700 rpm. I have seen it go to about 3500. That only happened once, and it definitely seems too high. After it warms up a bit it will shift at much lower rpm, but not usually as low as 1200-1300 unless I encourage a shift by releasing the accelerator.
  • rbaker377rbaker377 Posts: 7
    I am also getting the rear end whine between 50 and 60. I posted this a few weeks ago and there were no other comments. I haven't gotten around to taking it in; but plan to soon. Its good to know at least one dealer agreed to fix it. It only happens during acceleration or deceleration; if you let off the gas gently it goes away.

    This is the only significant problem I'm having at 4000 miles.
  • dshepherd3dshepherd3 Posts: 194
    Per GMDRONE"S post recently, if the pcm is not "reset/cleared" during the reprogramming, it looks like the default settings will return, of course non of us know if this was done correctly. Unless of course the problems never re-occur.
    The noise at 50, whining, is distinctly a differential noise, but the growl felt in the body of the truck at 58-62 appears to be exhaust resonance or engine harmonics, transmitted thru the engine mounts or of course the exhaust system.
  • bdschmidtbdschmidt Posts: 3
    In my experience, when this intermittent problem happens on my envoy there is an huge increase in fan noise and it simply doesn't go anywhere when you push accelerator. I can be at 3000 rpms and barely be going 10-15 mph. I am not experiencing the hesitation either, as I would define hesitation. That is, the vehicle definitely has no power when you give it gas, but it continues to go no where until the problem magically corrects within a minute. In will know if it happens.
  • biggie4852biggie4852 Posts: 37
    Envoyenvy1 please post the link for check Vin#.
  • byrd17byrd17 Posts: 4
    Could someone please help me. Took my Envoy to the dealer today for a couple of TSB issues. I do not have running boards, but do have front stone guards. Told service advisor about paint on leading edge of rear wheel opening. I believe this problem was previously discussed, but I can't find it. I suggested re-painting area and a protective covering (Rhino Guard?). They told me good idea, however I would have to pay for it. Told me that this type of stone chipping is normal and GM would NEVER pay for it. This is my families'9th car from this dealership. Called GM cust. serv. and got a number. Awaiting their reply. Has anyone else gotten GM to pay for this type of repair? If so please advise, I need the ammo to blast my dealer with. Thanks!
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