Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

tidester

stick a little closer to the topic and back off on the sparring!

tidester, host

cbwilsha

Amen!!!

gam2

It's not a bulb problem. It took the dealer 2 days to fix it (for the second time). I am not alone here as GM's customers are going away in droves, despite hugh rebates. Toyota will soon overtake them as the #1 car maker in the world. Wall street agrees with me as GM's bonds are barely above junk status. I do this in the vain hope that someone from GM actually reads this and will try to save a sinking ship.

Oh, $38K was list on my Envoy. I didn't pay that as GM traded it to me to replace a lemon Bravada. OK I'm done now. Sorry for the ranting.

GAM

elevatorguy

raleigh or anyone else that knows,
At the Auto Show in Motion, do they have any special offers? The Show is here in my area, and if they have anything worth going for I will go. I am looking at a new TrailBlazer, and if they have any coupons for "bonus cash" or any offers to "top off" GM Card points if you buy a new truck, I would love to hear about it.

Thanks,
Todd

macatowa

I'm looking for some feedback on whoever has or had rust fixed on their 3X, I have some bubling on the rear inside bottom edge of doors. I dont see any on the liftgate or anywhere else. The warranty states corrosion protection for 3yr/36 mo and outerbody rust through (a hole ) 6yr 100k. Because I'm past the 36k miles and I don't want to wait for a hole, what have some of you seen or heard about body work, paint touch up. It looks like you could hit it with a wire wheel and some good primer and maybe then stem the tide of what may happen. I do keep it waxed, even on the inside of the door! I've always heard GM was the best at rust prevention? Thanks,

01_hoe

You should be able to qualify for supplier pricing. The '06 TB's will offer the 5.3L engine in LS and LT SWB. Check gmbuypower.com if you haven't already for rebates, etc. in your area.

dmathews3

You're killin me here! Hyundai is better than GM? Not on this planet. And honestly, I don't know why you paid $38K. Must have made the salesman's day! He could have bought himslef a Hyundai with the fish he reeled in!

AMen, he thinks GM is the only vehicle with problems. The All Mitey Toyota Prius which can't even back up a steep driveway. Now I got a big laugh out of that. :lemon:

gam2

I have the rust on the inside of my rear doors also. The dealer just told me they would reapair it to the 6yr/100K mark but I'd take it in ASAP and see what they say. Take it to another dealer if they refuse. They told me they wire bush it and apply a rust preventative before they repaint it.

GAM

b36

Its been a few months since I last posted about the gas odor on cold start of my 04 envoy. I thought it was a winter only problem. I was wrong . It does it on start up with ac on. The dealer had the envoy for 3 days and installed a blower module that made the blower run after the truck was turned off for for 45 minutes and then ran every 10 minutes for 10 seconds at a time for who knows how many cycles. It did not solve the gas odor problem. I did not like having a motor running when the truruck was in the garage. I had them remove the module.
I still have gas smell. I know other tb and envoy owners who have this problem but most of them have never complained. Me I want it fixed. Has anyone had it fixed? The dealer service manager said they are positive there is no fuel leak. They also said they have had only one other customer with this problem.

hammen2

I believe that you get either a $500 or $1000 Auto Show In Motion certificate for attending. You can probably pretty easily get a GM in the Driveway certificate which entitles you to GM Supplier pricing - this is a fixed price, no negotiating on the price of the vehicle (except for the price of your trade, if you have one). Google for "GM in the Driveway" or "GMID" (you have to get this certificate from a GM employee)...

--Robert

imadad2

www.strategicvision.com rated the Buick Ranier and the GMC Envoy 2004 models top in quality for the mid size SUV segment. The TB finished near the top as well. So, it seems that the bugs are being worked out quite well on the triplets. Hopefully word of mouth will help GM sell and recapture lost market share. Some good news for once.

jwinky

Been away for a while but the Envoy is back to acting up.

A couple of things. I had my front stabilizer links replaced at about 12k because they had worn out, and the rear ones replaced at about 32k. I now have 50k on a 2002 Envoy and the front ones are going again. Regardless of what some think this should not happen this quickly or often. I drove this car on-road only in an urban area. Thankfully I have an extended warranty, but I am seriously considering unloading this vehicle before my extended warranty has expired.

There are 2 more issues that the service guys can't seem to figure what the problem is, and until last night, I though they were unrelated. At highway speeds, I would notice that the car would kind of jerk, like the engine was losing power for a split second. The other problem would be that I would notice my tires binding as I was making a low speed turn, I would look at the transfer case switch. The TC would jump from 2Hi to 4Hi and even 4Lo by itself while the switch was still in 2Hi.

Last night, I happened to look at the TC switch when I felt the car jerk at about 70MPH and the switch was in A4WD, but I suspect that the case was actually in 4Hi. Has anybody else experienced these problems, and if so have they been resolved, and how?

Thanks,
jwinky

spdmtr5

sure glad I traded the TB on a Jeep. :shades:

01_hoe

Moog makes aftermarket stabilizer links for the TB and Envoy. Maybe they would last you longer.

jwinky

01_hoe,

I realize and understand this, and I understand that these are suspension parts that will eventually wear out. However, I do not believe that it is unreasonable to expect them to last more than 30k - 40k. I personally think they should last 75k at a minimum, especially in an urban landscape -- its not like I am beating the heck out of the thing by stump jumping.

I could understand one or two lots of defective parts causing a premature failure in a small set of vehicles, but when my replacements fail after 35k, responsibility moves from the parts manufacturer to the engineers who designed the suspension (or the accounts for cost-cutting reasons). Thankfully, I do not have to cover the cost (yet).

All vehicles cost a significant amount of money these days, and at least in this case the quality is lacking. Did I expect a perfect vehicle? No, I was wishing for one, but I am a realist and I can handle a few items needing replacement under warranty. But I do expect that a problem not be a recurring one, and I do expect the service department to be able to diagnose and fix a problem, which isn't always the case.

Sorry for the frustration-induced rant, I will get off my soap box now.

jwinky

hardhawk

My 02 Envoy SLT 4WD has just started with the every once in a while jerk on the highway. I will look at the TC switch next time. I have already had that switch replaced once several years ago for switching on its own. Also still have the every once in a while jerk when the car is cold and I am stopped at a stop sign or light. It acts as if I have been tapped from behind by another car. I have the extended no deductible GM warranty so even at 45,000 miles and 4 years I'm covered. Have another 2 years to go on the warranty. Still like the Envoy despite all of the into year minor irritants. Would like a new Envoy Denali but bought a new Dodge Magnum RT instead and kept the '02 Envoy. The Hemi is sweet and still gets 25 MPG at 70 MPH on cruise control.

raleigh

Todd - No bonus cash or other offers that I noticed. There were a ton of bright, young people running the show. I got the impression that this was like a traveling circus. The idea was to drum up interest in GM products, not necessarily to sell something on the spot.

elevatorguy

$500 or $1000 certificate sounds GREAT! Anyone have any details about the restrictions on these vouchers? I will be attending the Massachusetts ASIM.

Thanks,
Todd

ficuss

congratulations, you have hit the target I have been trying to paint on the General for 2 years. To anyone listening, IT's the engineering. If GM wants to get out of the mess they are in now, get a clue GM, hire new engineers.

01_hoe

Real easy to blame the engineers. You could have a 100% engineering turnover and not have any better product when the engineers have to design with cost reductions mandated from the bean counters.

ross1962

.....you have hit the target I have been trying to paint on the General for 2 years.

Well, at least you've finally admitted why you are on this board well after selling yours. Just to bash GM. That is not the purpose of this board. Why don't you go over to the Explorer board and bash them? You don't own one of those either!

ficuss

Actually, I currently own 2 Ford Econoline 150 cargo vans. They are in steady use 6 days a week. The GM owners on this board do enough Ford bashing for everyone. Constructive criticism is useful if the right people get it. Besides, 4.5 years of Trailblazer ownership should give some rights to criticise.

jwinky

All,

My original post (before I edited it) blamed the engineers only, but I changed my thought. I am a mechanical engineer by my schooling, and most engineers do not want to be associated with a poorly designed part. I could get into a discussion of life cycles and factor of safety related to our schooling, but I won't.

Ultimately, it does come down to accounting determining what the engineers can and can't do based on how it affects the bottom line. I would imagine that the engineers are frustrated by having to go with a part that fails prematurely, than having a bullet-proof design.

GM is in the business of (trying) to make money, as are all companies, and the bottom line tends to drive everything else. You could make the argument that they are sacrificing long-term profits (from customer loyalty) for short-term gains by not allowing the engineers to fix the problem.

I did not intend to start an engineers v. accountants war, but merely wanted to get a little frustration out.

So, moving on, anyone have any thoughts on the transfer case issue? Hardhawk, thanks for your input. I am going to try and get the Envoy in soon and I will be sure to keep you informed of the information I gather.

jwinky

scottc454

If I had a vehicle I didn't like from a company I didn't like, I'd dump it at wouldn't look back. Ficuss's continues rants prove that he really loves GM and that's why it hurts so much.

gmfan

Are stabilizer links and sway bars the same? Are the stabilizer links the rubber rings that connect to the sway bar? Maybe it's just a matter of time for me, but I have 67K on my 02 TB and things are very solid. What were the symptoms of a bad "stablizlier link"?

-gmfan

hardhawk

The symptom I experienced was loud clunking noises when going over bumps, etc. on the road. Even going over small bumps sounded like the front end was loose and about to fall off. The new links/bushings made it sound and drive like new again.

longdistancetb

Criticize away! I guess some of us might think it's a little obsessive of you to keep returning. It's like you ditched your girlfriend and now you follow her around telling her (and everyone else) she's a slut. We all hope your relationship with Ford works out. Try not to look at all the faults and enjoy the good points of Ford. Don't expect Fords to be perfect, just learn to love their little quirks and maybe you can finally develop a long term, lasting relationship. In the meantime, get over your failed affair with your TB. It has moved on, and so should you. Maybe your old TB is the TB of someone else's dreams...... :P

rickinma

I've had my '05 Rainier for just over 3k now and I really couldn't be happier. I'm a huge fan of the v8 on the short wheelbase and there are little things that I really didn't think i'd care about that have actually surprised me....(xm, quiet ride, etc)

now that I've said that.....I'm due for an oil change...I used Mobil1 in my last car - do you think it's too early to switch the Rainier to synthetic? any other reg. maint. thoughts or suggestions?

sabotage

I switched my 04tb to mobile 1 at 1500 miles....It will not hurt a thing!!! Only the besy\t for my CHARLENE!!!

snoking

I have to agree, we bought a 2004 demo with V8 AWR two months ago, with basically everything but the DVR and Nav system. This is wife's Rainie, but she lets me drive it from time to time. Had it at the dealer today for a few TSBs. Thump in HVAC still has no fix, but GM is working on it, but we did get the nice running boards installed as part of the paint chipping TSB (as a proactive move, as I asked to not have to wait for the paint to get chipped next winter while skiing). They installed the nice ones with the SS outer rail. We tested the I6, but there was no turning back after driving the V8. We had the front door windows tinted a little lighter that the back ones. SNOKING

01_hoe

Your timing is very good to move to the Mobil 1. Glad you like your Rainier.

st1100v4

"but we did get the nice running boards installed as part of the paint chipping TSB (as a proactive move, as I asked to not have to wait for the paint to get chipped next winter while skiing). "

There was a dark blue '02 Bravada for sale on EBay last week. It didn't have mud flaps or running boards and the paint in the vulnerable area in front of the rear wheels was completely gone! I mean completely. There was a triangular area on each side that was white/gray in color; down to the primer I guess. Maybe the owner lived on a gravel road?

2k_impala_ls

I also have the door rust and stopped at the dealer. My 3/36 waranty is up in july and they are going to fix it before then. They also told me that they will re-fix it if the rust comes back. They are going to grind it down 1st. I just hope they dont effect the outside door paint.

dmathews3

Vettes come with synthetic right from the factory.

gam2

Just curious, what door/doors are rusting? Only the passenger rear on mine. Paint has bubbled along the entire seam at the bottom, flaked in some areas w/visible rust. Repair shouldn't affect the outside.

GAM

macatowa

I have a lot of rust at the bottoms of both rears and now it is traveling around the curve of the wheel well. The fronts also have in the same spots but not as bad. Also in further checking the rim of the hood is also begining to start. truck was made 01/03 so needless to say I'm very disappointed. The TB has 60K on it so we'll see what the say. I can't let it go another winter without fixing and priming it.

gam2

Absolutely disgusting!

GAM

sabotage

How do I get off the power side mirror's????? is it easy??? Plz help a bruhta out!!!!

gam2

Anyone have a surging problem during acceleration? It happens during moderate acceleration in second gear. Feels like a tooth is missing from a gear in the rear end, although I know they are fine. Maybe it's the tranny slipping. Other gears appear to be fine. It happens in 1/4-1/2 second intervals.

GAM

gmfan

I used to notice a smalls surging problem, but it no longer bothers me. Sometimes during acceleration, the a/c compressor will cycle and it feels like a small surge. How many miles do you have on yours? I read on the transmission post yesterday that someone had their 02 TB tranny quit at 82K mi. I have 67K on mine and I need to get her in there. Is your check engine light on? What happens when you gun it? A mechanic told me the other day that we need to run these engines once a week. I always punch it when I fill up on a new tank of gas. Does the surging occur during at all RPM's or just a certain range?

dawn217

Recently noticedmy ac was not working. Had a problem with the heat this past winter because the person that flushed the radiator put the wrong antifreeze in. They unplugged the compressor because they said it was running all the time then plugged it back in and now it is not running at all. I get hot air blowing out of the vents. Anyone have any info on what I can do?

gam2

Feels like the tranny slips for a microsecond every at 1/4 to 1/2 second intervals.
Happens at half to full throttle in second gear. Truck has 30K miles. I wonder if it has something to do with the sensors that govern the auto 4WD feature.

GAM

ross1962

I was able to remove one of mine by simply backing out of the garage too close to the door jamb.

01_hoe

The side mirrors are held on by three nuts. If you open the door, you can see one of them. To get to the other two you will need to take off the interior door panel. Two screws hold the door panel on. One is next to the arm rest, the other one is concealed by the switches that control the power windows and seats. To get to that one you must carefully pry up the switch panel. Once the switch panel is off, you will see the second screw. After the screws are removed, there are nine or ten clips that must be released on the trim panel that attaches it to the door. When the panel is free from the door you lift straight up on the door panel to remove it. Then you can get to the two remaining nuts to the mirror.
When reassembling, make sure the trim panel is in the ledge correctly at the base of the window.

01_hoe

Amazing how quickly a vehicle can be "customized" by getting too close to the door jambs.

macatowa

New Moog Links installed on front and rear, WOW !, much better ride now, forgot what it was like when it was new. The ride and smoothness is what sold me on the truck 2 1/2 years ago. Now if they will fix my rust I'll be a happy camper.

01_hoe

Was this a DIY or did you have a repair shop install? Do the new ones have any grease fittings?

macatowa

Where I work we have fleet service with a full time mechanic so after hours he'll work on our cars for $30 /hr. I did not look real easy even on a hoist with air powered tools. I suppose with a lot of sweat and swearing you could do it yourself, probably take an hour or less for each. parts were my cost with our company discount about $85. They have two grease zerks per link and we use a special grease. Long term we'll see how they do. Must tighter feel of wheel and steering, NO MORE CLUNK CLUNK RATTLE RATTLE, maybe GM could over this as an option, and say for $50 more they will actually last more than 30k miles.

Kirstie_H

A reporter with a national newspaper would like to speak with current SUV owners who previously owned a more fuel efficient car. Did they buy the SUV several years ago when SUV gas mileage wasn’t a big concern? With the high gas prices now, are they rethinking their SUV ownership? Are they considering trading in or selling their SUV for a more fuel efficient vehicle? If you fit what the reporter is looking for, please email Kirsten Holguin at kholguin@edmunds.com by May 27, 2005.

jbuch

My 2004 Envoy with 14,000 miles recently developed a similar problem. n fact, the only time water seems to leak in is when it rains and the car is sitting in the driveway. Did you find the source of the leak and if so, how was it fixed?

Jim