Postwar Studebakers

fintail

The midsection looks especially interesting. Some customizer with a bottomless bank account should bring it to life.

Kind of reminds me of a fintail prototype blending a sedan and coupe:

bhill2

uplanderguy said:

Don't normally get into 'what coulda beens', but I do like this rendering a fellow did called the "1964 Gran Turismo Hawk Executive Sedan":

Wow! I find that treatment remarkably attractive and well-proportioned.

uplanderguy

Friend forwarded me these pics from a local cruise-in he was at a couple nights ago, about an hour away from where I live. Same year and model as my current Studebaker...1966 Cruiser. Only 1,844 built so to see two 54 years later an hour apart is saying something.

I paid several hundred more for mine in 2017 than this seller is asking, although my car had 25,700 miles at the time.

Mine, as was the '66 I owned prior, has been updated to the chromed extractor vents about the taillights, which Studebaker started installing on all cars Jan. 1, 1966 (both my '66's were built prior to that). I have to say I prefer the painted ones to the chromed ones. I have the painted ones that were on my car, but they are chipped and would need painted to match the slightly-faded original paint on the rest of my car.

fintail

I think you got a better deal - of course, these days especially, asking prices are probably quite negotiable, if the seller is serious anyway.

Was the brocade-style interior standard or an upgrade?

uplanderguy

On the Cruiser, it was standard.

uplanderguy

Twenty-five mile drive in the Stude today; old cars like this coolish weather and so do I. So glad to be able to buy ethanol-free this year in nearby Stow.

Can't wait to be retired next year, so I can have some stuff done to the car without it being a major interruption of workdays. I plan on taking it to the international Studebaker Drivers Club meet in Indianapolis next year. Planning on driving it there without wheelcovers, and think I might have the car judged; first time ever for this car I think and first time for me with any Stude in probably 20 years. I want to display it with the factory wire wheelcovers it was sold new with (not the regular '66 covers it's wearing now). The wire covers weigh a ton, seem to me they'd come off easily, don't have a hole for the valve stem to come through to check air, and frankly, at a big Stude meet, I could see them potentially disappearing in the hotel parking lot overnight. But they are a rare sight.

imidazol97

Beautiful.

fintail

I can't imagine a better color for it.

uplanderguy

Thanks. If I were ordering a '66 Studebaker, the exterior and interior colors on this car are what I would've ordered. I'd have probably gotten the Daytona (two-door) Sports Sedan, which had the Cruiser's interior, but I'm thinking the interior was same pattern, but in all vinyl. I do like the brocade.

I noticed a half-hour ago, when pulling out of the drive in my Cruze, that the Stude was missing its gas cap (duh). Drove back and it was right where I left it--on top of the pump. Luckily the tank was only about half full, so no apparent spillage.

uplanderguy

From FB--Rose Mist '63 Gran Turismo Hawk at the Beverly Hills Hotel. My favorite '63 Studebaker color.

Gran Turismo Hawks are my favorite Studebakers, although I'll probably never get around to owning one.

There's DNA from the '53 coupes under there.

fintail

The A-pillar shows the DNA most. By avoiding wraparound/dogleg windshields, the cars ended up looking more modern over time.

uplanderguy

I have seen a photo of a '53 or so coupe out at the Proving Ground 'graveyard' as it's called, that was prototyped with sheetmetal showing they were thinking about doing a wraparound windshield. I'm glad they resisted that trend as it totally changed (negatively IMHO) the styling.

fintail

Loewy might have known it would be a fad.

I noticed a local used car lot has a Hawk, but it appears to be somewhat decrepit.

uplanderguy

Saw a '63-model-year ad this morning I'd not seen before. Unusual for an ad then to not show the car, and lean 'techy' I think.

imidazol97

I wonder if that ad's cost was partly or wholly born by the company making the brake parts for Studebaker? I can't read the text to see if a brand name was mentioned, but that would seem to be the reason for no particular model's being shown even as a small picture along with the Studebaker logo.

uplanderguy

Good point. Bendix made the brakes. Bendix was also located in South Bend.

uplanderguy

Really nice '53 hardtop on 'Barn Finds'. I'll be starting a 'GoFundMe' soon! LOL

So completely different, and trim, from everything else that model year.

I really have no idea of any pricing history on these cars.

https://barnfinds.com/1953-studebaker-commander-starliner-survivor/

uplanderguy

1963 Chicago Auto Show; '63 Lark Regal two-door sedan with supercharger (seen underhood; also has the "Avanti Supercharged" front fender badges indicating this).

Most people think the first time a big engine was put in a lighter-weight, cheaper car, was the '64 GTO or '68 Road Runner, but this car would qualify IMHO.

Also note the sign indicating the M-B 230SL being premiered.

ab348

uplanderguy said:

Really nice '53 hardtop on 'Barn Finds'. I'll be starting a 'GoFundMe' soon! LOL

So completely different, and trim, from everything else that model year.

I really have no idea of any pricing history on these cars.

https://barnfinds.com/1953-studebaker-commander-starliner-survivor/

My goodness, that is one handsome-looking car! Almost looks like someone did a mild custom and de-trimmed it, but no.

omarman

Nice car at the Chicago auto show. Looks like it's wearing the official U.S. racing colors so I wonder if it had a racing history or still is in a collection somewhere?

First big engine in light weight car was the GTO with a 389 V8 in the A body platform for 1964.

A small block 289 V8 tuned for performance in a light weight car was the 1963 Shelby 289 Cobra Mk II. The earliest test drive I can find online is this link to Motor Trend Road Test: 1963 Shelby Cobra.


"Shelby sold 655 1963-1965 289-cid Cobras and 356 1965-1967 427-cid versions--the ultimate Cobra."

uplanderguy

You could get 289 hp out of 289 CI in the cheapest, lightest Studebaker Lark two-door sedan in '63.. Bump that up to 335 hp (conservative by people that have them, with optional items more like 400) for the '64 model year--in a Studebaker Lark. And even in the cheapest, lightest model and bodystyle...a la Road Runner several years later.

Of course, and I get this--middle-America wasn't looking at Studebaker then.

And Avanti set records at Bonneville; it was "America's Fastest Production Car" at the time.

uplanderguy

Here's an R2 at the Pure Stock Muscle Car Drags, beating a '70 GTO. Here is where they inspect your car beforehand and you have to show them documentation that what they're looking at is stock. There is some leeway in tire size, but if you don't meet their standards, you're disqualified. One R3 that shows up there has done even better. And this red R2 Lark is owned and driven by a mild-mannered retired shop teacher who was in his seventies at the time this particular video was shot. I have heard that in some years a Big Three guy or two was heard as saying he would not go up against the Studebaker; image thing. LOL

The owner calls this car the "Stude Tomato".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrcmjCjAjcU

uplanderguy

My goodness, that is one handsome-looking car! Almost looks like someone did a mild custom and de-trimmed it, but no.

On the '53 and '54 coupes and hardtops, my eyes are immediately drawn to that delicate V8 emblem on the rear quarters--perfectly-styled and perfectly-placed, to my eyes.

fintail

Always comes too mind with the early Loewy coupes:

uplanderguy

That is an enjoyable movie; one of those ones most everybody can agree on.

That coupe is pretty, but it's a bit of a hybrid....wheel opening moldings and that wide band of trim above the rear window, from later models.

uplanderguy

The '53 was bid to $28,000; reserve not met.

kyfdx

For sale in Lexington, KY

https://lexington.craigslist.org/cto/d/versailles-1955-studebaker-commander/7209221881.html

uplanderguy

Thanks, but.....ugh!

kyfdx

uplanderguy said:

Thanks, but.....ugh!

Yup

imidazol97

Bad picture, but interesting car. The hood is down.
I have pictures from a car show a few years ago of this but the hood was UP.
I probably posted picture then. From Portland IN area.

I wonder what this car is worth in its apparently restored original-looking state?
Mecum auction: https://www.mecum.com/lots/FL0118-313025/1958-packard-hawk-sport-hardtop/

uplanderguy

It's funny. The long-standing lore is that this is the worst-looking Hawk. Shifty used to lather, rinse, and repeat that line. But my experience in looking at what Hawks do at auction, these generally bring the most of any Hawk.

I grew up GM as you know, but is this car really worse than what GM was turning out in 1958? I don't think so. I don't care for 'toilet seat' on the trunklid, but I guess really that was cribbing from Mopar.

ab348

It's sort of like having an ugly cat or dog as a pet. After it's been around for a while and you see it all the time, it starts to become cute.

uplanderguy

I do think once you see six figures of something produced, it begins to look normal....thus, the '59 Chevy.

Only 588 Packard Hawks made, and I think a good percentage survive.

imidazol97

If I recall correctly, that Packard is a rich brown. Beautiful color. With a light tan accent for the roof and
tail section.

The driver's outside rear view mirror looks to be in an awkward position, but that was characteristic
of mirrors in that time period. Placement varied.

bhill2

ab348 said:

It's sort of like having an ugly cat or dog as a pet. After it's been around for a while and you see it all the time, it starts to become cute.

I hear you. When I was a teen, my father bought an English Bulldog. Of course, when he got it, it was a puppy. As hard as it may be to comprehend, even a Bullpup is cute.

imidazol97

uplanderguy said:

Only 588 Packard Hawks made, and I think a good percentage survive.

I have only seen one (1) in all my car show visits. I wonder how many 10's of thousands of cars I've seen, and only one Packard Hawk.

uplanderguy

I've probably seen four or five over the years, but I hang out at Studebaker events.

The Studebaker National Museum has a really nice charcoal gray one that they rotate in and out of basement storage and the display floor. I'm partial to both the color and that it has correct-width whitewalls for the era; not narrow nor the type that are almost as wide as the sidewalls.

Found this 52-second video of the museum's car, including some driving video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggcb4inUpo8

imidazol97

uplanderguy said:

The Studebaker National Museum has a really nice charcoal gray one that they rotate in and out of basement storage and the display floor. I'm partial to both the color and that it has correct-width whitewalls for the era; not narrow nor the type that are almost as wide as the sidewalls.

That is a beautiful, rich gray. I like the accent colors on the fins and how it matches the interior.

After the video played, youtube offered other videos including this one of a Parade Red Hawk with some jerky photography. Car came from Indiana according to the verbiage in the audio part. From a museum to some kids to this owner.

I can't imagine a museum in Indiana parting with a one-year specialty Packard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=ou5aWqAimms&feature=emb_rel_end

fintail

That Hawk was in the basement when I was there (note the prototype beside it):

uplanderguy

I'm sorry that when you were there, they had a bunch of non-Studes up on the main display floor. I get it, but you didn't get the full "Studebaker National Museum" treatment then I don't think. And even in the basement, they shouldn't have a piece of cloth on a car like that Avanti prototype.

Long story short, I've sat in that prototype. There was that one, and a black one. A 1971 Automobile Quarterly article showed a pic of them covered in dust and bird crap in an upper floor of the Avanti building (where Avanti II's were being built at the time). When Avanti moved to Youngstown, OH in the mid-eighties, those two prototypes went there and a friend who worked there took me through the plant on a Saturday and I saw those cars. When Avanti in Youngstown went away, for awhile those cars went AWOL. Long-story short, a different friend of mine was aware where they were and was a middleman-of-sorts for the Stude Museum to buy them. They were shipped from NE OH to Indiana.

That said, I think they're hideous looking, LOL! There was some talk of Studebaker's whole line being Avanti-influenced. I love the Avanti, but I couldn't stand the basic sedans looking like one. Those prototypes are two-door styling on one side and four-door on the other.

I wish the Stude Museum had one more floor. And I could do with fewer carriages. That said, I think for what was the Number Five domestic automaker in 1963, it's a pretty nice museum and the archives are amazing as to what didn't just get thrown in dumpsters.

uplanderguy

That very 'Parts and Service' sign (well, not that exact one, but just like it) is hanging on the side of the building in 1966 photos of my hometown dealer.

fintail

It was a cool visit, even as-is, I am sure the museum does what it can with what it has, can't be an easy go of it not having an official manufacturer for a sponsor. Maybe in the future they can have an exhibit of the M-Bs Studebaker-Packard distributed in the late 50s and early 60s.

The Avanti prototype definitely loses something in the transition from coupe to sedan.

uplanderguy

I think they could definitely tie-in a M-B display of late fifties and early sixties cars!

uplanderguy

I can't imagine a museum in Indiana parting with a one-year specialty Packard.

Yeah, me neither!

I thought that color was 'Shadowtone Red', unless 'Packard' had a different name for it.

Listening to the owner and the photographer talk--whew, there was some BS flying there, LOL!

Thanks for posting!

uplanderguy

BTW, that seating leather in the '58 Packard Hawk (and also the '57 Studebaker Golden Hawk 400) was like buttah.

uplanderguy

Here's that Avanti prototype in fin's post a few up, from the 1971 Automobile Quarterly article about the remains of Studebaker:



It was upstairs at the Avanti II plant. I'm sure Studebaker stuck them there and they were probably there until Avanti moved to Youngstown.

When I first started going to South Bend for events in the mid-1980's, I realized that even a small carmarker is still a large company. Most of the southwest quadrant of South Bend was Studebaker buildings, which largely looked as they did the last day of production.

As a buff, I thought it was cool, but locals didn't.

I remember a letter to the editor in USA Today in the early '90's probably, commenting on their earlier article about the Rust Belt. A South Bend resident said when visitors would come, and they'd drive down Main St., they'd ask, "What are those old buildings?" and the writer said, "Oh, those are from Studebaker. They closed in 1963". I do get that. Most of the buildings are gone, and of the few that remain, most are presentable. The Body Building, multi-story, has been turned into IT business buildings and some rental residences I'm told.

uplanderguy

I found a book that the South Bend Tribune had put out a decade or so ago, called "Studebaker Remembered". It was put together from local photographs contributed to the book. I always thought this picture was peculiar. The second fellow from right was a graphic artist in Studebaker's Advertising Department. I wonder if he kept the sign's contents hidden until after the photo was taken.

ab348

I find it peculiar that they are smiling.

A graphic artist could knock out a sign like that in 5-10 minutes.

uplanderguy

Came across this handout that was given out at various auto shows. I like the message. I've not seen one of these ads in person.

uplanderguy

On eBay now--looks nearly identical to my first Stude, which I owned 23 years, although unfortunately this one is a six and also doesn't have the Skytop.

All 1963 Lark two-door hardtops were Daytonas. Only 3,763 assembled. It was priced almost identically with the Chevy II Nova two-door hardtop.

This one passes my fussy authenticity eyes though. Small things people often re-do and miss, are dead-on on this car--wheels are off-white; interior is original if not NOS; bumper guards are in the correct position; no emblems missing.

EDIT: I take that back. The 'floating' Lark bird in the center of the steering wheel is missing; the front grille emblem is trimmed in red. Two easy, cheap fixes.

The white vinyl inserts were standard and "matching inserts" were a no-cost option. Mine had the matching inserts, even on the production order, but I like the white inserts better.

The taillights look a bit weird to me--like they're dirty, or clouded. Excellent reproductions are available and reasonably-priced, so I don't understand this.

All the love I have for the car, with a six I doubt he'll get his asking price. I'd love to see what the true market value of a car like this is.

A certain moderator here used to flatly say there was very little reproduction available for sixties Studes, but he seriously could not have been more wrong.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1963-Studebaker-Lark-Daytona/124437531196?hash=item1cf90e0a3c:g:WW4AAOSwY2tfrezn