Lincoln LS

ezaircon4jc

After almost 2 years with The LS Grin firmly etched in my face at well above the posted speed limit, I finally got caught. I was "cruising" down the I5 along the desolate stretch by Camp Pendelton, not paying attention, my first mistake. My second was not realizing that that IS300 that was trying to keep up with me, was now just a speck in my mirror. Then I saw the motorcycle headlight and "knew" I was had. A quick look at my speedo (as I was frantically trying to slow down in 4th without applying the brakes and alerting "the headlight" that I was slowing, in case it was a CHP) showed close to 90! YIKES!! As I changed lanes to the right, the red light came on. And with she-who-must-be-obeyed in the passanger seat . He said I was doing 97 (I guess the 245/45/17's make the speedo VERY accurate as I was close to that magic triple digit number!)! He took pity on me (he gave me credit for slowing down as I approached traffic, like what else could I do?) and wrote me up for "only" 85 in a 65. Now I have to work the 4th of July to pay for my slight indiscretion. Lesson learned? Well, yea. Pay more attention! Slow down? Well, we'll see .

swauger

Sorry to hear about the "tax" you had to pay (like speeding tickets are about anything but money generation on interstates or most highways). That's one "problem" about the LS, my V8 Sport seems to have a natural tendency to creep up to about 100 mph as it's cruise speed that it seems to feel most comfortable at. It likes 80 mph, but if you don't watch it it'll creep to 100 or more without you noticing it.

Great car for crusing the West, cruise on 100, sit back and watch the nothingness slip by.

JS
LLSOC Charter Member

wesley1der

Any one have this problem?
Right rear door locked, can't unlock from inside or out. Something may have broke. First problem with an LS. I had a 2000 sport and now a 2002 Premium.

markls8

I think that engine would be accurately described as a "double vee 8" as opposed to a "double yew 8". Hence the vehicle could be described as a "dub vee - vee dub". ; )
Seriously Ray, congratulations for being an "early adopter" of the newest technology. One (somewhat uncommon?) feature I noticed that the car shares with the LS is the global opening of the windows and roof.
Travel well, Ray. : )
Best regards - Brian.

shanian

Dubya Ate mom....

badazzls6

I don't know if it's been brought up here before but, if the positive and negative terminal posts are disconected from the battery; will the car need to be reprogramed like the auto-trans relay for harsh 2-3 shifts and reverse ingagements? Would I need too take it back to the dealership to get it re-flashed?

Proud LS owner,
Mike

ezaircon4jc

I've had my battery disconnected for an extended length of time before. The only thing I lost was some of my radio settings. IIRC, Mark said that once the trans is programmed, it stays programmed.

Mike
Proud LLSOC Charter Member

ls1bmw0

Nope. The reflash is done in non-volatile memory. What you may end up needing to do is to retrain the transmission though.

ls1bmw0

Holy Mother of All That is Automotive!!!!!

I just got off the phone with Stoptech. They've had my car for testing with their brake kit since Friday. They tested it stock with the Porterfield pads, then with their front brake kit (which will be the production version) and then with the front and rear brake kit.

First some good news, then even better news:

(Okay, first the disclaimers: The project car is riding on Bridgestone Potenza Pole Position S-03 tires in the 245/40R18 size. It has Leda Suspension 24-position adjustable gas shocks. Temperature was in the 70s and low humidity and sunny conditions). Track surface was the unused runway at Camarillo Airport, where a number of car magazines run their tests. Speed was verified using a Stalker handheld radar gun. Your actual results will vary especially depending on the tire that you are running.)

1. The good news: The Porterfield brake pads impressed Stoptech. They said that they stopped really well for basically a stock pad. They didn't fade even at 850 degrees F. Stock pads started to fade at 750 degress F. Stopping distances (as those of us who have the Porterfields already know) were shorter than stock. Don't have the numbers yet but I'm sure I can get them.

2. The even better news: Using the Stoptech front brake kit only, the LS was able to stop in a whopping 109 feet!!!!! That was repeatable over the course of the testing. That, my friends, if you look at your issue of Road and Track Test Summary, is better than an Acura NSX, BMW M3, M5, Corvette Z06, any Ferrari, any Lamborghini, any Mercedes Benz, any Porsche except the 911 GT-1, and just 15 feet longer than the BMW M3 GTR!

And brake pedal feel was significantly harder than stock!

3. They are continuing the testing with the rear brake kit, but by the time they had that one on the car and were ready for testing, there was a 10 mph tailwind and the temperature had dropped down to the low 60s so their stopping distance did not improve past the 109 feet.

Brian (who can't wait to get his car back and late-brake some unsuspecting sports car into his favorite turn!)

ronaldcross

After doing a little research, I've decided on the Pirelli PZERO ASIMMETRICO tire as a replacement to the stones. A bit pricey but not as much as the Michelins. They also have the P6000 that would fit, but I'm not concerned about "wet" driving stability as I live in Phoenix. I'll have them installed next Saturday and I'll let y'all know how they feel after a road trip to Vegas coming up in a couple of weeks. Thanks for all of your suggestions.

joe166

I considered the Pirelli PZero, but read the comparisons at Tire Rack and had some reservations. My main reservation was the very low wear index compared to the original stones and the Michelin Pilots. Seems they aren't even expected to last all that long. The comparison with the Michelin Pilot A/S is not good. The only areas the Pirelli seems to be better than the Michelin in is price, $181 v. $212 and dry traction, a small difference of 8.9 to 8.6. In wet traction the Michelin ate them up. The wear index is 140 compared to 400 for the Michelins. If they do, indeed last almost three times as long, the cost difference turns in favor of the Michelins. I have no idea if real life can compare to these numbers, but there must be some relationship since the wear index is a federally mandated number which should mean something.

I am frankly stalling to see if anything goes on sale, (hopefully the Michelins but I will consider the OEM Firestones if anyone puts them down to the $69 they were on a few months ago), but with 31,000+ miles on my OEM Firestones, I won't be able to stall too long. The funny thing is that the Firestone tires still look great with no wear bars showing, but I find the stabilitrak (or whatever the traction control is called), cutting in a lot lately, especially when it starts raining and the road gunk hasn't been washed off completely. I am not talking about really stepping on it either, I am talking about normal acceleration. I guess I can just drive as though it has just started snowing for a couple more weeks and not take any trips.

rgnmstr

<<I am frankly stalling to see if anything goes on sale, (hopefully the Michelins but I will consider the OEM Firestones if anyone puts them down to the $69 they were on a few months ago)>>>

Isn't it funny how a one time low price on something becomes the price people will only pay no matter what the real value is. I believe this tire once sold for around $180 and if it was "on sale" for say $140 it would be considered a bargin if no one had ever seen it for $69.

stanny1

After reviewing all the data I could find, I feel the best value in an all weather tire has to be the original Stones. In a "Summer Tire", the finalists were the Michelin Pilots, the Toyo T1-S Proxes, and the Bridgestone SO-3 Potenza Pole Positions. The Pilots are expensive, and first tested by our fearless leader. The Toyos are criticized as being sensitive to heat and subject to excessive wear. That left the Bridgestones, which seem to have no flaws and have the enthusiastic endorsement of the Pres.
So now that the "Tire Decision" has been made, I am going to order front and rear Porterfield pads. I usually install these myself, but someone mentioned that the rears take a special tool? Is that true?

ezaircon4jc

Stan, you will need a piston turn-in tool. I bought one at Auto Zone/Kragen/Pepboys (I can't remember which) for $7. It was a piece of junk. NAPA has the same thing for $17. It is a universal square with various pins to fit various pistons. If I were to "make a carrer" out of replacing rear pads (which I might, as both cars need the tool), I would pop for this http://www.autopart.com/tools/file/part387.htm

The pile I bought had to be modified and was a bear to make work. It is now in the Miramar land fill! If you go to www.snapon.com and look in the brake tool section, there is a picture of the square thingie. The auto part one appears to have a piece that puts counter pressure against the opposite side of the caliper, something the square thingie doesn't.

Brian, how's the B.....er "loaner" working out?

akirby

I think there was some discussion awhile back about the Michelin Pilots on the McLaren LSE. I thought they were Pilot Sport A/S while the press release said just Pilot Sport implying the summer version. The McLaren slides for the LLSOC conference call on Saturday had a nice closeup of the wheels and tires and they were definitely the A/S version.

gkarg

I had my left rear door do what I think is similar. It was right after the Ford garage had replaced the window regulator, last July.

I was leaving for work and something caught my attention - it looked like my back door hadn't closed completely from the night before. I tried to open it from the inside, but something wrong and I couldn't open it. I got out and was able to open it and then I slammed it shut.

Then I noticed the inside handle was out a little and i reached back - it wouldn't open.

I wasn't sure what happened, but as soon as I got to work I jumped out and checked the outside handle and it wouldn't open, either. I tried the door locks and this and that until suddenly it opened (not sure how/what happened) but the handle was stuck in the outward position. I gave it a couple of taps. Finally, the handle went back in, but at the same time, a piece of metal dropped on the inside of the door. I was able to open and close it - using both inside and outside handles - no problem.

Everything has worked since with the door, so I never had the dealer check it out.

So... I'm not sure what happened - just wanted to let you know what mine did.

akirby

After several months with nobody asking about my LS I had two admirers in less than an hour. First was at the car wash. Guy walked out to my car as they were drying it and walked all the way around it. Said he had a 2001 model but it was 2 cars ago (must lease once a year). He loved the Autumn Red and said he didn't know it was available (never heard of a brochure or web site apparently - must have just went by dealer stock) when he bought his. Then I left the car wash and stopped at the grocery store. There was a guy putting groceries in his truck and he stopped me as I got out. Thought mine was a LSE model (not sure why). Said his wife was looking to replace her Acura 3.2TL that was coming off lease and he was really interested. Really thought it was a great looking car, although when I told him $479 lease for a V8 he acted like that was a little high. I told him it drove even better than it looked.

If Lincoln continues with the new advertising push I think next year could be a banner year for LS sales. The new model should get some really good press (and will be eligible again for MT COTY and C&D's 10 best). I'm also seeing a pattern here: first Caddy announces a 400 hp CTS version and next thing you know there's a rumour of a 400 hp 6-spd manual LS (not to mention an interesting LLSOC member survey question).

One thing that hasn't been talked about are the efffects of the 2003 LS changes on the T-bird. Stiffen up the chassis and drop in a 400 hp 6-spd manual and that would be one sweet ragtop!

matt1972

Saw this on an OASIS broadcast. It may help you guys out.

2939 - DOOR LATCH WILL NOT RELEASE
SOME 2001-2002 LINCOLN LS VEHICLES BUILT BEFORE 12/15/01 MAY EXHIBIT A DOOR LATCH THAT WILL NOT OPEN/RELEASE. THE OUTSIDE AND INSIDE HANDLES CAN BE MOVED FREELY BUT LATCH REMAINS LOCKED. THIS MAY BE DUE TO THE AFFECTED DOOR'S OUTSIDE HANDLE BEING LIFTED AT THE SAME TIME AS THE POWER DOOR LOCK BEING ACTIVATED, EITHER BY THE KEY FOB OR THE DOOR LOCK PANEL BUTTON. IF ATTEMPTS TO OPEN THE DOOR ARE UNSUCCESSFUL, GAIN ACCESS INSIDE THE AFFECTED DOOR THROUGH THE DOOR TRIM PANEL AND RELEASE THE LATCH AS REQUIRED. REPLACE THE AFFECTED LATCH AND CABLE ASSEMBLY WITH THE FOLLOWING PART: L/F 1W4Z-54203A29-EA, R/F 1W4Z-54203A28-EA, L/R 1W4Z-54203A29-AC, R/R 1W4Z-54203A28-AA.

stanny1

Mike -is this the "Tool,Piston Rotation", Stock # YA9329 for $20.20 in the Snap-0n Net Catalog? Looks like a box with square holes on the sides?
Is this all I need? I used to use a large C-clamp to hold the piston in. Thanks and sorry about the CHP incident.

akirby

That sounds like the right tool. The C clamp still works on the fronts but not on the rears. You have to turn the caliper piston to get it to retract due to the parking brake design. It appears that all rear disc brake applications work this way. I bought the $11 generic cube tool at Sears but have not tried it yet. I don't think the rears are worn too badly yet and they're not squealing so I'm holding off on those. I would go ahead and install the fronts ASAP. It takes longer to clean off all the brake dust from yourself than it does to actually install the front pads.

ezaircon4jc

Stan, that's it, but it doesn't work very well as you have to push and turn the ratchet at the same time. I had to grind mine down in places to keep it from slipping so much. The "pegs" still slipped out of the slots in the piston every time I turned. That's why I'd spring for the other one. My neighbor has one for an older piston design that worked on my Sable. IMNSHO, you need a way to apply counterforce against the opposite side of the caliper to be able to twist the piston back in.

einarvikng

No one has even mentioned these tires other than myself), and after having them installed, I am wondering why?

Well, I got the goodrich tires in 245/45 R17. The dry trcation and handling characteristics of this tire blow away the OEM Stones. It felt as if the someone had tightened every nut and bolt on the entire car. The car feels snappier and lighter. It actually felt like a sportier car than when I drove in on the stones an hour before.

Obviously snow performance is yet to be determined. Not much wet driving yet either. I will keep the board updated.

Price installed $155/tire including disposal of the stones.

Someone else needs to look at these tires for the price. Don't take my word for it.......

Scott

ls1bmw0

Actually Scott, I just forgot about them. I've heard a lot of good things about the new Goodrich tires, including the KDWS. If I remember correctly it was the highest performing tire in one of the magazine tests recently for dry grip.

jerrym3

During the discussions on the upcoming 2003 LS enhancements, did the factory reps say anything about the engine improvements also being included on the 2003 TBird?

Since they are mechanical clones engine-wise, it would appear that the TBird would get the same power boost, which should then bring the TBird into near-Marauder acceleration territory.

joe166

I was going to post that each time I have had a problem with opening a rear door from inside, it is because an anxious passenger tried to open it while I was manually (electrically?) trying to unlock the doors for them. Cycling the doors locked and then unlocked again always has resolved the problem for me. I don't know if this is the same problem, but it does not happen any other time for my car.

rayainsw

All -

If one happened (hypothetically) to have, say, 2 OEM rear mufflers from a Y2K LS8 (with less than 1,000 miles on them) and a new (never out of the wrapper) sheepskin seat cover - what would y'all suggest as the best course of disposal?

Thanks,
- Ray
Who does miss that magnificent MagnaFlow burble . . .

stanny1

I just ordered the Snap-On Piston Rotation Tool. I will tell you if it's just an overpriced $7.00 Autozone unit that is repackaged or something better. I'm sure a lot of disgruntled mechanics would force Snap-On to carry only something that works. Stay tuned in about a week. Thanks, Stan

akirby

Ebay - where else??

ronniepooh

Still have my stock pads sitting in the box. Ive got about 3-4k miles left on my original rear pads. Question: In the DC area, Im routinely seeing an ad in the sports section for Ford replacement pads for $89, installed. I *think* I saw this same ad at the local Lincoln Dealer. Anyone know if this applies to the LS? At this price, Im tempted to just let them do it, and return my pads for a refund....

airwolf1000

I think the Advertised deal is with Ford's Value Pads. Whatever that is. From what I have been Hearing do yourself a favor and order the porterfields and install them yourself if you want a little quicker braking.

ronniepooh

Thanks for the tip, but actually, I dont use anywhere near 100% of the stopping power available with the stock pads! ;-) Porterfields would be a bit of overkill for me. But wanted to know, are Porterfield users using them for the rear as well?

ezaircon4jc

Yes, I put them on all 4 corners. I figure, if I only need the extra stopping power to keep from hitting a kid once, they were worth it. Remember, Lincoln had to vent the rear rotors as so much rear brake is applied. The only other car I've seen vented rears on is a Porshe.

heyjewel

Well, the spy fotos continue here: http://pc99.detnews.com/autosinsider/sneakpeek/index.hbs?myrec=31

What's interesting is that that's not the same tailight treatment that I saw at Mania 3. But the LS grin on the front is the same.

George

joe166

According to that preview from the Detroit News contained in post 8784. I guess the Town car crowd wins after all. I have read this forum since it's inception and I don't remember anyone complaining that the LS was too small. More power, yes. More sporty suspension, yes. Manual V-8, mixed. Sportier styling, yes. Better quality, yes. Better dealers, yes. Bigger, NO. So much for listening to the customers!

jhoffman61

I think the stretched LS platform would be used on a different model - like Jaguar is doing with the next XJ model.

The 2003 model will show how well Lincoln is listening (in my opinion). Also, note the spy photo doesn't seem to have the keyless entry pad - maybe they already started listening and placed that model out there for the picture to be taken.

ls1bmw0

I hate to break the news to Brenda Priddy, but that isn't a 2003 LS. It's got some of the components of a 2003 but not all of it.

Brian

airwolf1000

Maybe, The Larger LS will move into the TC Slot. The New Smaller LS coming in a few years will move into the current Slot. Like Aviator/Navigator/McLaren, Baby LS/Papa LS/McLaren. Sounds good to me. 3/5/7/M, C/CLK/E/S/AMG? Creating a Line-up just like the Germans.

Regards,
Airwolf

akirby

I thought the baby LS got cancelled. I think you would still keep the TC but throw in more Lincoln DNA (somebody has to sell Limos). I would love to see a 3/5/7/M DEW98 based lineup for Lincoln but with the shortage of capital (thanks Jac) it may be awhile. Maybe we can use the new mustang platform for a 3-series fighter. It will certainly have the powerplants.

I think what Lincoln really needs is an expensive high end platform that can soak up some of the R&D costs and bring better technology to the lower end of the product line. Mercedes has the S (and SL and CL) and the technology from those eventually makes it's way into the E and C class. Same thing to a lesser degree with the 7. Although I suppose that was the high end platform that got cut back from $2B to $600M so I'm not holding my breath.

airwolf1000

Maybe you are right. I was questioning myself as I wrote if because I hadn't heard much about it lately. At the Same time though they are creating the DEW98 Lite? Correct? Wasn't it speculated the Future LS might be based on the the DEW98 Lite? The Mustang will use the DEW98 Lite right?

Regards,
Airwolf

ls1bmw0

Here are the photos and specs for the McLaren/Stoptech brakes on my car. They are impressive looking and more importantly really stop!

http://www.stoptech.com/productphotos/ls/main.htm

akirby

Yes, the mustang will use the lite version of DEW98 (to keep costs down). But I don't think the LS would use it.

lolaj42

Jhoffman61 - The pictures on the latest '03 spy shots only show the passenger side of the car. I haven't seen a car using the keypad that applied it to the passenger side. These shots neither confirm nor refute the existance of the keypad on the '03. We can only hope . . . (decide for yourself whether this is a good thing or a bad thing). :-P

rgnmstr

Here's the details on the 2003. I don't know if they have been posted before. I hope it does not offend the Mania tour folks who think they are holding the secrets to life. These are real.

-275 HP V8 with variable cam timing
-Keyless entry keypad
-DVD navigation system
-THX certified audiophile system (why anyone would need a system designed for home theater in a car is beyond me)
-Gen III vehicle communication system
-Electronic brake assist
-HID headlamps
-Improved interior storage

Please, you secret keepers, don't send anyone over to kill me.

rgnmstr

<<<The even better news: Using the Stoptech front brake kit only, the LS was able to stop in a whopping 109 feet!!!!!>>>>

I find this pretty hard to believe. I just read a review of a 2000 lb full blown race car that recorded 108 feet. I think this Stoptech company is blowing smoke up your butt.

lobsenza

What is a Gen III vehicle communication system?

ls1bmw0

It may help to also review this link: http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/formulas%20for%20vehicle%20braking%20dynamics.pdf

Five stops averaged 109.6 feet. You should know by now that I don't publish claims I can't authenticate. Besides, the stopping distance is affected as much by tires and suspension. Since I have Bridgestone Potenza Pole Position S-03s ins 245/40/18 size and adjustable gas/oil race shocks, combining that with the brakes, and the fact the car has a 52/48 weight distribution helped significantly to reduce the braking distance.

And a Corvette C-5R (96 ft), BMW M3 (112 ft), BMW M3-GTR (94 ft) and the Porsche 911 GT-1(98 ft) all weigh more than a 2,000 race car.

Brian

drolds1

No, we don't think we are holding the secrets to life. However, we were asked by people, who stuck their necks out us for and have been very nice to us, to honor an agreement.

Now I know that honoring an agreement and keeping your word is a concept that is fading fast and is foreign to some, but there are obviously still some people left who keep a promise and honor their word. If you want to hold such individuals up to ridicule and sarcasm, that speaks volumes.

Sorry if you don't get it.

jhoffman61

Chris, keyless pad only on the driver's side just continues the promotion of a lack of courtesy in today's America. Unless you have the key fob, you could not open the passenger door for someone without first going to the driver's door and then running around to the other side. Where has chivalry gone... ;-)

PS. Same issue applies now with key cylinder only on drivers door.

swauger

Yeah, I guess we've gone from the days of opening the door for your lady to "Get in the truck woman!" Kind of like Redneck foreplay "You wake?"
;-)

JS
LLSOC Charter Member

swauger

Man, impressive stopping numbers, and really impressive specs and pics. Look more like Porsche Turbo brakes than Lincoln brakes! Heck, I find the stock brakes pretty impressive, had to panic haul it down from about 45 to 0 the other day (straight and stable with no dive), if I wasn't wearing a seatbelt I'd have been peeling my face off the windshield. As it was, I had to recover my LLSOC hat that had migrated from the back seat to the junction between the dash and windshield! And this with the stock pads, can't wait to get the Porterfields on when my pads need replacing.

Yes, I keep my LLSOC hat in the back seat, you need a hat in Florida, but I refuse to go white haired Lincoln and put it on the rear shelf! ;-)

JS
LLSOC Charter Member