Having just joined this club yesterday, I would like to thank those that responded to my cries for help.
I would also like to thank all that have provided mt with a wealth of humor this past day. IMHO it is all healthy venting, expecially as I have some of the problems listed.
Not to try and make you feel worse, but 'they' actually CAN! My 2000 LS V8 Sport (Dec 99) has never had ANY of those problems (of course I don't even have a moon roof, so I can't have THAT problem).
The real question should be, why can't 'they' FIX any of those problems if they occur. None of these problems are designed into the car, but apparently SOME individual machines have one or more of them. You must be REALLY unlucky to have ALL of them.
I don't think my LS is unique because it has never had any of these problems. I think MOST Lincoln LSs don't have any of these problems.
Your dealer should fix ALL of them, and not try to BS you that any of them are endemic to the Lincoln LS.
klarson1 (#1550): Hey, at least your list didn't include heated seat problems! Or windows falling off or out of their tracks. (I've had lots of the former but not the latter.) Thanks for the kind comment. (I think.) I, too, marvel at how I only have to make some small comment or be a bit sarcastic and all hell breaks loose. (Methinks I keep this august body a bit livelier and more interesting.)
akirby (#1552): Glad to see you know censorship when it is being advocated. I always knew you were quick learner & quite intelligent. Yes, America is great.
Continental & TC Pricing: For a laugh, check out your local newspapers to see how deeply Lincoln dealers have to discount Continentals and TCs. Bet Lincoln's own internal data would show that the LS8 is the most expensive car in their line up(not SUV or truck) based on real sales prices paid by customers to dealers. So if all you want is luxury, room, lots of gadgets, and a great engine (in a mediocre platform) all for a relatively cheap price, Continental not a bad way to go.
Just for laughs I put Norway down as my country. I am a quarter Norse, so what the hey Maybe that's why my filter keeps getting deleted. It's that Viking blood ;~>
Giowa I did have a rear window crash and I lost the drivers heated seat which was ripped when they repaired it. I just left those 2 things off the list since they are currently repaired.
Given your list of issues, is most fascinating to know you also "luv" your car. You must have an interesting "luv-hait" relationship going? But I can appreciate your sentiments. My LS8 Sport is extremely fun to drive. What might happen to sales in long run if reliability were to approach Infiniti or Lexus levels?. They make boring cars quite well; Lincoln just needs to build its exciting car quite well, and have dealer service exceed expectations.
$500 over LIST? Wow, is there anything else you might want to buy that I can go buy and resell to you for over list? Do you mean over invoice? I sure hope so. If not, and you are happy, great.
I haven't posted in many months, simply because there are certain individuals who exist to start wars and I have better things to do (although I read this every day and thank the many informative folks who contribute their wisdom). I agree with traction - the best way to ban this certain individual is to completely ignore him. It's hard to do - he makes your blood boil and the first instinct is to get sucked into a meaningless debate. Don't do it - rise above his/her pettiness. He may not go away completely - kind of like a cockroach - but we'll all feel better about ourselves.
I picked up my new LS V-8 Sport about three weeks ago, and it is really fun to drive, but there are three primary issues that are causing me to have a little buyers remorse. Is anyone else experiencing these problems, or can anyone help me deal with these?
1. Power and engine performance. My car doesn't accellerate nearly as well as the demo I drove. I remember some discussion on here about people's engines "opening up" at about the 4000 mile mark. I only have about 700 miles on mine right now. Can I expect this to get better?
2. Transmission performance. I get a BIG TIME delay in downshifting when I need sudden acceleration, and the shifting is very jerky
3. Gas Mileage. My gas mileage is horrendous. I mean down right terrible. I am consistently getting 9-12 mpg. It doesn't matter if I am driving in the city or on the highway, 12 mpg is THE MOST I get, and it is usually closer to 10. That adds up to one big gas bill.
Will someone please give me a pep talk and convince me that I made the right choice by choosing to buy an LS?
lsndallas, I think your milage should increase significantly. I got my ls v8 in june of 1999, and i consistantly get 17+ mpg. If I really get stupid i get into the 16's, but driving "normally", (which is hard to do) i can get high 18's and 19 mpg. The engine should respond better after breakin, as far as the trans, get used to it. I have a non-sport, but manually shift the auto alot. I have found that most downshifts are adequate except to 2nd gear. I think the reason is the wide spacing between 2nd and 3rd gear. Thought the car is not perfect it is better than most! Jim W
Go pack a few hundred posts, and you will see how a certain individual (GIOWA) almost ruined this board with his inane and consistent comments on V6 vs I6. I also recall him being banned from a Hyundai board/list for his same bait/troll tactics.
Sure, let him speak as much as he wants. But here is a tip that worked very well on this board for months. Simply ignore each and every one of his posts. He has a tempting tactic. He will make a few sensible posts to suck everyone in. Then before you know it, he's talking about i6 vs. v6 or how ridiculously low powered a 210hp engine is, and how great the 193hp I6 in the BMW 528 is. . Next thing you know, every LS V6 owner is getting their pressure up while this guy watches the flames roll.
As far as econocars, a CIVIC Si or an Integra GS-R will outaccelerate a LSV8. Who cares?
There are plenty of serious posters with good info here. Reply to them, ignore him.
Bashing other posters is not within your Terms of Use.
Certainly ignore anyone you wish to ignore, but there is no need to carry on and on about it and no need to continue with these negative characterizations.
Further posts in this vein will be removed.
Now let's talk about the CAR.
Pat Host Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards
I'm opposed to censorship, however, since so many of you aren't, maybe we could agree to censor on the basis of some rational factors? Suggestions: (1) People who won't support their discussions with fact. (2) People who get simple facts wrong. (3) People promoting positive bias groupthink. (4) People who routinely engage in namecalling (all us Epsilon Semi-Morons need to unite against anti-moron discrimination!), or routinely attack the automotive press, consumer publications, journalists, or the government? Don't think I'd end up being banned on these 4.
Who was it that recently posted the note saying the 3.0L and 3.9L engines were related? Or heyjewel's comments about Continentals being $10K more expensive than LSs? aiuto, at #1560, knows in NJ what I see each weekend in the Omaha & Des Moines newspapers.
ronniepooh: At least be accurate. I've never been "banned" from any site and I still routinely post here and on lots of other Edmunds threads and elsewhere, including a plethora of Hyundai sits. My comments about I-6s weren't inane. They were technically accurate. About all I ever said about the I-6 is that it is inherently the smoothest engine. What's wrong with wanting creamy smooth power delivery in a big RWD car with the engine mounted longitudinally as in the LS??? BMW and Lexus have this figured out, as does GM which is reintroducing powerful I-6s in their revised SUVs. It was jnowski who went to great lengths to savage anyone who didn't agree that the 60 degree V-6 was inherently superior, going on at length about characteristics at extremely high RPMs (e.g., over 8 or 9k). And he didn't care how many text books, automotive press articles, etc. were introduced concurring with the inherent design superiority of the I-6. V-6 superior in space packaging but not smoothness.
As for base LS6--it isn't a question of published power output figures. I could care less if Lincoln says it makes 190, 210, or 230 hp, or if BMWs similar sized I-6s makes 190, 210, or 230 hp. It is an issue of a $32K LS6 going 0-60 in 9.0 secs, pulling .77g, with a 121 mph governed top speed. Is that performance? And it isn't that luxurious. Continental can meet or exceed these numbers, and you'll actually pay less.
Those are published base LS6 auto non-Sport figures (C&D, 2/00). Do you have similar numbers for 323i, 328i, or 528i? I doubt it (mainly because auto press usually doesn't test BMW automatics, except 7 Seris). If you do, BMW is doing something about that, what with new 330i, 530i, etc.
700 miles? I'm surprised you don't have to put your foot out to go up hills. Really, these are tight and uncooperative cars when new. Revving the engine is just a waste of time at this point. Just keep driving and your patience and frustration will be rewarded. Stay away from lowered Civics with big exhaust pipes and "Greedy" decals. Don't let your friends "try out" your car. Be sure not to loan it out to any car mags. Things are just not ready. Good Luck!
The only "censorship" that goes on around here is for posts that do not meet the Terms of Use. Choosing to ignore posts with which one does not agree is not "censorship", it is often a wise course of action if we find ourselves repeatedly bothered by such posts.
A clear requirement of the Terms of Use is that everyone has agreed that civility and respect underlie the success of an on-line community such as Town Hall.
Several posts here recently have not met that agreement.
Everyone has now had their say on this issue. Move on to discuss the car, and stop talking about each other.
Any further posts that get into characterizing other posters in any way or continue to mention these entirely off-topic issues will be removed, regardless of what other on-topic content they may contain.
Pat Host Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards
Of course it is, it has the handling for performance. I had an '88 T-Bird Turbo Coupe with an automatic, 0-60 of 9.5 seconds. That was definately a performance car and lots of fun to drive, because it handled very well. The last time I dropped off my LS V8, they gave me a continental, what a pig as far as handling went, no comparison to the LS. Keep in mind you can drive a slower car harder than a fast car without breaking the law. Jim
My 6 was getting 12-14 in the early miles. I was VERY bummed as 92 is around $2 a gallon here. The more miles I put on the better the milage, currently about 22 in about 80% freeway driving. The power also increased SIGNIFICANTLY after about 2k. As stanny1 said, patience will be rewarded! Wait and ENJOY!!!
Thank goodness cars have come a long way since '88. Can't say I remember too many cars of that year that were that great then or would still be competitive today. Lincoln Mark VII LSC was interesting. And the TC/SC T-bird was a much better performer with manual tranny. Just like the then Merkur XR4Ti was with the manual. Look at how far Corvette has come in 13 years, or Camaro/Firebird. Or Mustang Cobra vs. '88 'stang GT. Are you implying that a '00/'01 base LS6 auto non-Sport is up to '88 performance standards? Yeah, but isn't that damning with faint praise?
No, what I'm implying is that you can have fun with an LS V6. Just because my idea of performance leans towards the V8, if your idea of performance is going fast around corners (which I also enjoy) you don't need the V8 or for that matter the sport package. The base LS probably handles better than mine because of lower front end weight. Also I can drive my LS in the snow, It took Eagle performance tires to make the T-bird handle, but couldn't go in the snow.
1)Don't worry about lack of power. Shortly after 4000 miles my V8 rather suddenly felt like a completely different car. Be patient; be gentle; the power is there. While no street racer, the (broken in) V8 will take your breath away when you go to pass a car from 50-60 mph.
2)Transmission: Mine is 5/00 build date and never needed the reflash. It acted as you described when new, but only for a week or so, about 500 miles. Check previous posts, or LLSOC.com; you may be a candidate for the software upgrade.
3)Gas mileage may be something for the dealer to look at. It will certainly get much better, but that seems awfully low. Mine was never worse than about 16, and is now averaging 23.5-24 by the computer (at 11,500 miles). That's about 80% highway miles with Colorado winter gasoline.
Hang in there. You own a magnificent machine. Like Stanny says, it's just not ready yet.
Awhile back several of you were talking about protective covers for your head lamps and fog lamps... but after searching for an hour thou old as boards... find nothing. Please post where they came from again. PS...LSNDALLAS...don't forget to reset the gas mileage button on the message center thing. If you leave it the way it was, it will never improve much. And you bought the right car. Mine has been great since I drove it off the lot... power wise.. V8 automatic.. Sounds like it might need the update from the Lincoln computer satellite God! Mine was made within a day of the date of the alleged "cure", the dealer still ran it thru the reflash and it is a better car for it. lsqueen
Be sure and use either 91 octane or better, too. If you're not, the engine is intentionally retarding spark, etc to reduce power. Try a tank of 94 octane or something like that to see if that makes a difference.
There are other companies that supply similar products; you can probably find them by searching Yahoo in the "autos" category. I'm completely satisfied with the WeatherTech kit, for what it's worth.
Got the info ...thanks very much. Having had my windshield repaired twice in 10,000 miles, I am sure the lamp guards will come to good use. lsqueen :-))
I just got through with a weekend of autocross. Talk about competitive outside the poop in the auto rags: on a 0.7 mile course I was right with anything within a couple hundred pounds and running stock with street tires. There was a late model 528i that was dead even with me. Having the grand experience of all three of my racing adventures, that's enough proof to me that the specs ain't always what they're cracked up to be. My comments about this weekends outing can be summed up:
1. Limited slip would be worth a good 2 second drop on course time. My V8 sport did not hook up well coming out of sharp corners. And yes the Advancetrac was O-F-F.
2. An automatic posing as a manual is still an automatic - SST shifts were delayed and somewhat unpredictable. 'Nuff said.
3. I think sticky tires would be downright scary on this car. Just can't quite justify the expense for this hobby. I'll stick to the $100 Firestones and one set of wheels for now.
I'll be getting plenty of practice for St. Louis...
Went for my usual Sunday afternoon lot-cruise today. The model year has passed the halfway mark, and I STILL haven't seen a Cypress Green LS; I'd like to take a look at a Premium Package-equipped car, too. No luck on either count.
When I visited the local dealer's back lot, I saw something I did NOT wish to see--an LS Sport in ivory, just like mine, parked behind the body shop. It had obviously taken a major hit in the passenger side; both doors were off and leaning against the front end, and the moonroof was bowed out of its track. The whole car was rather severely torqued. Probably a goner, from the looks of things; hope the occupants weren't injured. Let's be careful out there, OK? This was not a pretty sight.
I did see the first '02 Mountaineer that I've seen out in the "real" world. I think it's a really attractive vehicle, except for some of the interior trim. It had what appeared to be brushed aluminum on the steering wheel spokes and door panels, and the instrument panel center stack was also covered in it. Maybe it's OK when you're sitting inside, but when looking through the windows, I found it really jarring.
The point is that, given a choice between this sort of brushed trim and "wud", I'd vote for sticking with "wud" in the LS--the aluminum effect doesn't really work for me, at least not in the Mountaineer application.
You guys are great on here,and it is fun to be part of such an active group. Thanks for all the response about my engine and fuel economy woes.
I went to Wal-Mart today and picked up a can of all-in-one fuel system cleaner and dropped in my tank. I reset the fuel effeciency meter and kept an eye on it. I was almost instantly at 17 plus, and it made its way up to 19.5 after I had driven about 50 miles on the highway and through some city traffic. Not bad, considering I was at 10 yesterday.
Can someone point me to an FAQ or a previous post that explains the deal with the software reflash? I have heard that phrase bounced around, but I would love to know a few more details.
Thanks again for the pep talk. Despite a few minor issues, I am still really loving my new car and I am glad I went with the LS.
lsndallas- Posts dealing with the transmission reflash are scattered throughout this board. At LLSOC.com, click "Recall/TSBs" and read the TSB related to delayed downshifts. This section is accessible to non-members. Armed with this information, talk to your dealer. There have apparently been some problems with a new system Ford has for downloading software to dealers, but people here are getting it done. If the dealer balks, post back here attention mkovalsk (Mark Kovalsky, the Father of our Transmission, AKA The Transmission God). He has helped a lot of us get the most out of what is really an excellent transmission.
Re your gas mileage: The accuracy of the computer's MPG reading has been questioned by many owners. Mine is a little optimistic during weekly commuting but accurate on long trips. Be careful about when you reset it. Do it on a highway downhill and get 60 mpg; do it in traffic and get 2. I find if I reset it at every fill-up, it is a good "yardstick", even if not 100% accurate.
I'm having my LS6 Sport Reflashed tomorrow - providing the planets align at exactly 10:15 a.m. eastern standard time and the moon is tilted at exactly 5 degrees and positioned exactly overhead of Franklin, PA!
Seriously, I'll let everyone know if I experience any improvements.
Just when we thought/hoped it was over... ... another lovely Nor'easter Snowstorm is heading our way for Wednesday/Thursday/Friday...!
I'm scheduled to have magnaflows installed next week on my V6-manual. I've borrowed a decibel meter from the School of Engineering and will record before and after readings and will post for all.
After getting back from travels, I have several red oils spots on the garage floor from this never ending saga I have had. Will now be going in for the 5th oil leak repair. Have called J. Rogers office and will demand a LM engineer go to the dealer to get this resolved once and for all.
I purchased the lamp guards,but have been reluctant to put them on as putting them on the fog lamps seemed more difficult than I expected with air bubbles etc. This becomes a much bigger issue to deal with with the headlight lamps. Anyone have any good/bad experiences in installing the lampguards?
Do you know where the oil leak is? A few weeks ago I was surprised and concerned when I saw some oil under MY LS8! However, after crawling under and looking carefully around I saw that it was coming from my oil filter. I took a strap wrench and gave the oil filter a quarter turn tighter, and voila! No more oil leak!
gkarg - I hope you are wrong. I heard it was only wet snow. I'm supposed to start golfing in 2 weeks! I guess I'll be driving my Explorer a few more times.
Fuel Reset - I think the avg mpg is calculates from the last reset. Therefore if you reset it at fill up you should come pretty close to actual. If you do it while driving you will get the current reading but the overall mpg avg at fill up may not be 100% correct. For the record I have the V8 Sport and I have never seen it below 16. Right now is at 18 and I have 1,900 miles on it.
Even though I went 'round and 'round with my service department about installing the reflash, all I can say after picking up my car is "incredible". I would not have believed software would have changed the driving characteristics so drastically - the engagement time between P-R, P-D5 and R-D5 is faster, the upshifting is crisper, and the surge between shifts is GONE. The car just pulls smoothly through the range. Downshifts through all gears and at all speeds seem better - not just in the 20MPH range as I expected. For the life of me, I can't understand why my service rep worked so hard to convince me not to do this reflash. If anyone else has this problem, DON'T LISTEN! I'm glad I didn't.
Based on all the changes in shifting characteristics, I've started wondering if my early-build 2001 didn't somehow get the old 2000 transmission load - NO MATTER! It's like I'm driving a new car (again).
THANK YOU to Mark Kovalsky and his teammates at Lincoln.
I seem to remember a long time back, that something was asked about changing the automatic transmission fluid and filter. If I remember correctly, I don't think that a definitive answer was posted. I've always changed my auto trannies' fluid and filters every year as a matter of good maintenance. I know that the LS has synthetic fluid from the factory, and therefore, it is a longer lasting fluid, but a "lifetime" fill doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling inside. If you have a chance, Mark, could you provide some advice for this old-time, over-maintainer ? Thanks a lot.
Check out LLSOC transcript from Mark's recent chat. He was specifically asked these sorts of questions. If I'm remembering correctly, he indicated you didn't need to replace fluid and filter aggressively. Follow manual. Thinking he said it was a sealed unit.
I just hit 29,000 miles. Pulled out the LS Service Interval Book. It indicates that many of the Ford 4-speed automatics need 30,000 mile fluid & filter change but not the LS's 5-speed (the 5R55N?). Guessing many service advisors at dealerships will likely recommend changing at 30,000. I say go with whatever Mark indicated at LLSOC session. That's what I'm going to do at my 30,000 interval.
Been awhile since I've read the list but wanted to point something out since I saw two posts on it:
If anyone sees an LS with an "LSC" badge on it, it's most likely someone funning around. Kids like to do this on their imports sometimes (check out the "hall of shame" at: http://riceboypage.com/ )
We don't have any "Hot Rod Lincolns" out on the road secretly identifiable by an "LSC" badge; besides, didn't LSC stand for Lincoln Sport Coupe?
Cheers!
Scot
P.S. advance apologies if the spell check changes something...
been reading this site for bout a yr.bought in aug...and love the car...want to thank Brian for his input and my check's in the mail for the club...in defence of an almost base 6 with automatic,wife and i were looking at a buick lesabre{can you believe it ?} talked her into driving an ls...told her the lesabre went with blue hair..{we're 62} and we luv the ls...only problem is the ls won't tow my fishing boat and the road to roosevelt and bartlett lakes were designed for an ls. haven't had a bit of troubles with it......aside to Rene......ever eat at Pishkies ?
Hi, all. I have been a lurker on this board for many months but the proverbial cat has had my tongue until now. I have a 4/99 build non-sport V8 with about 30,000 miles and I love it. Other than the first reflash and the two minor recalls, the car has been flawless - no clunking windows, failed seat heaters or headlight moisture. Maybe I have been lucky with such an early model but I suspect there are plenty of others who really have had no issues. I originally used the car for business and drove on a lot of twisty two lanes in rural areas. I loved the crisp handling! Now, I live in Minneapolis and drive on mostly crumbling concrete that we use for roads. I have been considering replacing the Firestones with a little softer, quieter rubber. I know some have gone to more aggressive tires but I would like to go in the other direction. My question is has anyone replaced the Firehawks with something a bit more "luxury" than "sport?"
The 5 oil leaks I have experienced are not engine oil but red oil (ie. PS or tranny) they have tighten and replaced gaskets and steering rack. They can't seem to get it right or the leak is from somewhere else than where they think it is from, maybe a crack in the casing?. However, everyday there is a oil spot the size of a half dollar on the garage floor.
I think the manual calls for a trans fluid hange at 30,000 miles for severe duty. My personal opinion is that all driving is severe duty, so that's the schedule I always follow.
The factory fill in the 5R55N transmission is Mercon V, which is a synthetic blend. Any fluid that has a Mercon V rating, including full synthetics, will be fine in this transmission.
It is also my personal opinion that changing the transmission filter isn't necessary. I've cut open filters with huge miles and found very little inside. If there is enough junk in the filter to cause a problem the transmission has already failed.
There is a drain plug on the pan and the torque converter, so you can get most of the fluid out easily.
Filling is another story. There is a fill plug on the back of the transmission. You can also use the drain plug in the pan. There is a plug inside a tube. You must remove the tube, which has the plug inside it, to drain the pan. Reinstall the tube and remove the plug. Pump the fluid in either the fill plug in the top or through the tube in the pan. After putting in about 7 quarts start the engine. This will fill the torque converter. Install the rest of the fluid untill fluid runs out of the tube. When it stops running out install the plug.
The easier way to do this is to go to a place that has a machine that changes the fluid by tapping into the cooler lines. This will change over 95% of the fluid.
I've replaced my non-sport Firestones with the same size Michelin Pilot XGT V4 tires and they ride and handle better, in my opinion. They also seem quieter.
Are you using the 16 in. wheels? I'm nowhere near needing tires but was wondering if Michelin made the Pilot XGT V4 in the right size for the Sport wheels. I'm glad to hear you say they handle well. Had a set of those on my '95 Subaru Legacy and loved them. I didn't do much "spirited" cornering on them (wrong car), but they were the best rain/wet road tire I ever drove, and wore like iron. Pretty fair in the snow, too. If your car corners as well or better, you may have found the perfect all-around tire for our car. I'm generally happy with the Firehawks, but the "all season" rating must be for those parts of the country that only have two seasons.
I am still howling over the [non-permissible content removed] page. Especially funny for me since my son has one of these Hondas. It has adjustable coil-overs and I guess he got tired of denting rims, breaking chin spoilers, ripping out fuel tanks, etc. He raised it to normal riding height the other day. He was so excited- "Dad, you can't believe how good the car rides and how straight it goes now." I've only been trying to tell him this for the last year or so, but it's never a good idea when it comes from the old man.
Thanks again, you made my day! BTW- re LSC- I had the same thought as you, but I think it stood for "luxury sport coupe."
Comments
ezaircon: How'd you end up with ye olde foreign flag on your moniker? San Diego hasn't removed itself from the 50 states, has it?
Brian
Just as Giowa has a right to post here (assuming he follows the TOU) we have an equal and unalienable right NOT TO READ IT.
Ain't America great!?
I would also like to thank all that have provided mt with a wealth of humor this past day. IMHO it is all healthy venting, expecially as I have some of the problems listed.
The real question should be, why can't 'they' FIX any of those problems if they occur. None of these problems are designed into the car, but apparently SOME individual machines have one or more of them. You must be REALLY unlucky to have ALL of them.
I don't think my LS is unique because it has never had any of these problems. I think MOST Lincoln LSs don't have any of these problems.
Your dealer should fix ALL of them, and not try to BS you that any of them are endemic to the Lincoln LS.
akirby (#1552): Glad to see you know censorship when it is being advocated. I always knew you were quick learner & quite intelligent. Yes, America is great.
Continental & TC Pricing: For a laugh, check out your local newspapers to see how deeply Lincoln dealers have to discount Continentals and TCs. Bet Lincoln's own internal data would show that the LS8 is the most expensive car in their line up(not SUV or truck) based on real sales prices paid by customers to dealers. So if all you want is luxury, room, lots of gadgets, and a great engine (in a mediocre platform) all for a relatively cheap price, Continental not a bad way to go.
I did have a rear window crash and I lost the drivers heated seat which was ripped when they repaired it.
I just left those 2 things off the list since they are currently repaired.
Kevin
1. Power and engine performance. My car doesn't accellerate nearly as well as the demo I drove. I remember some discussion on here about people's engines "opening up" at about the 4000 mile mark. I only have about 700 miles on mine right now. Can I expect this to get better?
2. Transmission performance. I get a BIG TIME delay in downshifting when I need sudden acceleration, and the shifting is very jerky
3. Gas Mileage. My gas mileage is horrendous. I mean down right terrible. I am consistently getting 9-12 mpg. It doesn't matter if I am driving in the city or on the highway, 12 mpg is THE MOST I get, and it is usually closer to 10. That adds up to one big gas bill.
Will someone please give me a pep talk and convince me that I made the right choice by choosing to buy an LS?
I think your milage should increase significantly. I got my ls v8 in june of 1999, and i consistantly get 17+ mpg. If I really get stupid i get into the 16's, but driving "normally", (which is hard to do) i can get high 18's and 19 mpg.
The engine should respond better after breakin, as far as the trans, get used to it. I have a non-sport, but manually shift the auto alot. I have found that most downshifts are adequate except to 2nd gear. I think the reason is the wide spacing between 2nd and 3rd gear. Thought the car is not perfect it is better than most!
Jim W
Could this be the SC'd variant of this engine that Lincoln & Jag are working on?
Dang, no Scottish flags!
Sure, let him speak as much as he wants. But here is a tip that worked very well on this board for months. Simply ignore each and every one of his posts. He has a tempting tactic. He will make a few sensible posts to suck everyone in. Then before you know it, he's talking about i6 vs. v6 or how ridiculously low powered a 210hp engine is, and how great the 193hp I6 in the BMW 528 is. . Next thing you know, every LS V6 owner is getting their pressure up while this guy watches the flames roll.
As far as econocars, a CIVIC Si or an Integra GS-R will outaccelerate a LSV8. Who cares?
There are plenty of serious posters with good info here. Reply to them, ignore him.
Now, back to our regularly scheduled programming.
Certainly ignore anyone you wish to ignore, but there is no need to carry on and on about it and no need to continue with these negative characterizations.
Further posts in this vein will be removed.
Now let's talk about the CAR.
Pat
Host
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Who was it that recently posted the note saying the 3.0L and 3.9L engines were related? Or heyjewel's comments about Continentals being $10K more expensive than LSs? aiuto, at #1560, knows in NJ what I see each weekend in the Omaha & Des Moines newspapers.
ronniepooh: At least be accurate. I've never been "banned" from any site and I still routinely post here and on lots of other Edmunds threads and elsewhere, including a plethora of Hyundai sits. My comments about I-6s weren't inane. They were technically accurate. About all I ever said about the I-6 is that it is inherently the smoothest engine. What's wrong with wanting creamy smooth power delivery in a big RWD car with the engine mounted longitudinally as in the LS??? BMW and Lexus have this figured out, as does GM which is reintroducing powerful I-6s in their revised SUVs. It was jnowski who went to great lengths to savage anyone who didn't agree that the 60 degree V-6 was inherently superior, going on at length about characteristics at extremely high RPMs (e.g., over 8 or 9k). And he didn't care how many text books, automotive press articles, etc. were introduced concurring with the inherent design superiority of the I-6. V-6 superior in space packaging but not smoothness.
As for base LS6--it isn't a question of published power output figures. I could care less if Lincoln says it makes 190, 210, or 230 hp, or if BMWs similar sized I-6s makes 190, 210, or 230 hp. It is an issue of a $32K LS6 going 0-60 in 9.0 secs, pulling .77g, with a 121 mph governed top speed. Is that performance? And it isn't that luxurious. Continental can meet or exceed these numbers, and you'll actually pay less.
Those are published base LS6 auto non-Sport figures (C&D, 2/00). Do you have similar numbers for 323i, 328i, or 528i? I doubt it (mainly because auto press usually doesn't test BMW automatics, except 7 Seris). If you do, BMW is doing something about that, what with new 330i, 530i, etc.
A clear requirement of the Terms of Use is that everyone has agreed that civility and respect underlie the success of an on-line community such as Town Hall.
Several posts here recently have not met that agreement.
Everyone has now had their say on this issue. Move on to discuss the car, and stop talking about each other.
Any further posts that get into characterizing other posters in any way or continue to mention these entirely off-topic issues will be removed, regardless of what other on-topic content they may contain.
Pat
Host
Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards
Jim
1)Don't worry about lack of power. Shortly after 4000 miles my V8 rather suddenly felt like a completely different car. Be patient; be gentle; the power is there. While no street racer, the (broken in) V8 will take your breath away when you go to pass a car from 50-60 mph.
2)Transmission: Mine is 5/00 build date and never needed the reflash. It acted as you described when new, but only for a week or so, about 500 miles. Check previous posts, or LLSOC.com; you may be a candidate for the software upgrade.
3)Gas mileage may be something for the dealer to look at. It will certainly get much better, but that seems awfully low. Mine was never worse than about 16, and is now averaging 23.5-24 by the computer (at 11,500 miles). That's about 80% highway miles with Colorado winter gasoline.
Hang in there. You own a magnificent machine. Like Stanny says, it's just not ready yet.
Scott
http://www.macneilauto.com/store/Stonguar.html
If you prefer, here's the main page; just click on LampGard in the left-hand column. (This URL maps to www.macneilauto.com.)
http://www.weathertech.com
There are other companies that supply similar products; you can probably find them by searching Yahoo in the "autos" category. I'm completely satisfied with the WeatherTech kit, for what it's worth.
1. Limited slip would be worth a good 2 second drop on course time. My V8 sport did not hook up well coming out of sharp corners. And yes the Advancetrac was O-F-F.
2. An automatic posing as a manual is still an automatic - SST shifts were delayed and somewhat unpredictable. 'Nuff said.
3. I think sticky tires would be downright scary on this car. Just can't quite justify the expense for this hobby. I'll stick to the $100 Firestones and one set of wheels for now.
I'll be getting plenty of practice for St. Louis...
When I visited the local dealer's back lot, I saw something I did NOT wish to see--an LS Sport in ivory, just like mine, parked behind the body shop. It had obviously taken a major hit in the passenger side; both doors were off and leaning against the front end, and the moonroof was bowed out of its track. The whole car was rather severely torqued. Probably a goner, from the looks of things; hope the occupants weren't injured. Let's be careful out there, OK? This was not a pretty sight.
I did see the first '02 Mountaineer that I've seen out in the "real" world. I think it's a really attractive vehicle, except for some of the interior trim. It had what appeared to be brushed aluminum on the steering wheel spokes and door panels, and the instrument panel center stack was also covered in it. Maybe it's OK when you're sitting inside, but when looking through the windows, I found it really jarring.
The point is that, given a choice between this sort of brushed trim and "wud", I'd vote for sticking with "wud" in the LS--the aluminum effect doesn't really work for me, at least not in the Mountaineer application.
I went to Wal-Mart today and picked up a can of all-in-one fuel system cleaner and dropped in my tank. I reset the fuel effeciency meter and kept an eye on it. I was almost instantly at 17 plus, and it made its way up to 19.5 after I had driven about 50 miles on the highway and through some city traffic. Not bad, considering I was at 10 yesterday.
Can someone point me to an FAQ or a previous post that explains the deal with the software reflash? I have heard that phrase bounced around, but I would love to know a few more details.
Thanks again for the pep talk. Despite a few minor issues, I am still really loving my new car and I am glad I went with the LS.
Posts dealing with the transmission reflash are scattered throughout this board. At LLSOC.com, click "Recall/TSBs" and read the TSB related to delayed downshifts. This section is accessible to non-members. Armed with this information, talk to your dealer. There have apparently been some problems with a new system Ford has for downloading software to dealers, but people here are getting it done. If the dealer balks, post back here attention mkovalsk (Mark Kovalsky, the Father of our Transmission, AKA The Transmission God). He has helped a lot of us get the most out of what is really an excellent transmission.
Re your gas mileage: The accuracy of the computer's MPG reading has been questioned by many owners. Mine is a little optimistic during weekly commuting but accurate on long trips. Be careful about when you reset it. Do it on a highway downhill and get 60 mpg; do it in traffic and get 2. I find if I reset it at every fill-up, it is a good "yardstick", even if not 100% accurate.
Glad you're feeling better!
Scott
Seriously, I'll let everyone know if I experience any improvements.
Just when we thought/hoped it was over...
... another lovely Nor'easter Snowstorm is heading our way for Wednesday/Thursday/Friday...!
Fuel Reset - I think the avg mpg is calculates from the last reset. Therefore if you reset it at fill up you should come pretty close to actual. If you do it while driving you will get the current reading but the overall mpg avg at fill up may not be 100% correct. For the record I have the V8 Sport and I have never seen it below 16. Right now is at 18 and I have 1,900 miles on it.
Based on all the changes in shifting characteristics, I've started wondering if my early-build 2001 didn't somehow get the old 2000 transmission load - NO MATTER! It's like I'm driving a new car (again).
THANK YOU to Mark Kovalsky and his teammates at Lincoln.
If you have a chance, Mark, could you provide some advice for this old-time, over-maintainer ?
Thanks a lot.
I just hit 29,000 miles. Pulled out the LS Service Interval Book. It indicates that many of the Ford 4-speed automatics need 30,000 mile fluid & filter change but not the LS's 5-speed (the 5R55N?). Guessing many service advisors at dealerships will likely recommend changing at 30,000. I say go with whatever Mark indicated at LLSOC session. That's what I'm going to do at my 30,000 interval.
Been awhile since I've read the list but wanted to point something out since I saw two posts on it:
If anyone sees an LS with an "LSC" badge on it, it's most likely someone funning around. Kids like to do this on their imports sometimes (check out the "hall of shame" at: http://riceboypage.com/ )
We don't have any "Hot Rod Lincolns" out on the road secretly identifiable by an "LSC" badge; besides, didn't LSC stand for Lincoln Sport Coupe?
Cheers!
Scot
P.S. advance apologies if the spell check changes something...
The factory fill in the 5R55N transmission is Mercon V, which is a synthetic blend. Any fluid that has a Mercon V rating, including full synthetics, will be fine in this transmission.
It is also my personal opinion that changing the transmission filter isn't necessary. I've cut open filters with huge miles and found very little inside. If there is enough junk in the filter to cause a problem the transmission has already failed.
There is a drain plug on the pan and the torque converter, so you can get most of the fluid out easily.
Filling is another story. There is a fill plug on the back of the transmission. You can also use the drain plug in the pan. There is a plug inside a tube. You must remove the tube, which has the plug inside it, to drain the pan. Reinstall the tube and remove the plug. Pump the fluid in either the fill plug in the top or through the tube in the pan. After putting in about 7 quarts start the engine. This will fill the torque converter. Install the rest of the fluid untill fluid runs out of the tube. When it stops running out install the plug.
The easier way to do this is to go to a place that has a machine that changes the fluid by tapping into the cooler lines. This will change over 95% of the fluid.
Mark
Brian
Scott
Thanks again, you made my day! BTW- re LSC- I had the same thought as you, but I think it stood for "luxury sport coupe."