Lincoln LS

bchase1

I have been monitoring the LS Town Hall group for some time and recently registered. I own the LS6M and installed a Granatelli MAS & I&N Filter this weekend. This has taken what was once a marginally spirited V6 and really given it some character. The responsiveness is vastly improved. Someone that is mechanically challenged, me, at times accomplished this in under an hour. For those of you running the V6 and looking for better performance I would highly recommend this upgrade.

ronniepooh

Hi all. Over the past 2-3 weeks, I noticed a relatively persistent brake squeal from my front brakes. Thinking it would go away, as brake squeals sometimes do, I have been ignoring it. Over the last two days, in addition to the squeal, I noticed a grinding type of sound when slowing down, within the 10-0mph range.
Not a major grind, but a grind nonetheless. I cant really see the pad thickness through the spokes of the 17 inch sport wheels, and I wont get a chance to work on the car this weekend, but I do plan to purchase a set of non-sport pads (less dust) from the dealer tomorrow. My questions: Has anyone had to change out front pads at 33,000 miles on their LS? Seems a bit early to me. If so, anyone have any tips or instructions? Are the disc brakes on the LS pretty straightforward?

mikiebaccarat

At 21000 Km I am having electrical problems with my 2000 LS V6 with auto trans. The problem is intermittent. The red battery light comes on and then various electrical things will happen. eg. auto windshield wipers will come on with no rain, or wipers cannot be turned on manually, or power windows won't work, or brake and ABS lights come on, or tranction control can't be turned off, or horn won't work. Problem is intermittent and lasts for varying lengths of time. Dealer has had car for 2 days of tests but hasn't yet found the cause. Anyone else experience this problem?

ezaircon4jc

It seems that I remember electrical gremlins were traced to the ground cable that goes from the battery up front. IIRC, something about the cable shorting out. You could also try the Master Mechanics board at www.llsoc.com .

ronniepooh

Did some more checking on my brake pads. Turns out the rears look fine, the passenger side front looks like it has maybe 40-50% life left, and get this, the drivers side pad (outer is the only one I can see on any of them) has almost ZERO brake pad material left. Im hoping this will be covered under warranty, whatever the problem (sticking caliper?) is. Funny thing is, Ive noticed no pulling to one side at all, during acceleration, coasting, or braking. Anyone else experience the one-sided pad wear issue?

scottc8

Wow. I haven't had a dust problem since the first couple K miles, but I'm sure going to pull the front wheels and have a look at the pads this weekend. Is the dust heavier on the left front wheel? Wondering if the pad has worn that way or if it was thin, i.e. a defective part, to begin with.

pennyl0199

How do I fine the filter that you (bchase1( talked about thanks al

ronniepooh

Man, I really hate it when I post info prematurely, and the original info may not be real accurate. %-) Anyways, I took another look at my front pads (through the spokes of the wheels) this am. The rears are definitely good, as I can see plenty of pad left, as expected. However, now when I look at the fronts, BOTH *appear* to be quite thin, not just the drivers side. And the squealing is still pretty persistent (depending on speed/pedal pressure), and when I roll down the drivers side window, I do hear some form or noise/slight grinding. I felt the rotors, and they feel relatively smooth/no grooves or marks from metal on metal. But again, I didnt use a micrometer or anything. I do plan to jack up the car and pull both wheels this evening to get a much more accurate look. I've had pretty much equal amounts of brake dust on both front wheels, and cant say theres been any pulling to either side at any speed. With those factors in mind, Im gonna guess my initial diagnosis of one side wearing more than the other was incorrect. I think its simply time for pad replacement for the fronts. With that in mind, Im going to pick up a set of non-sport pads from the dealer on the way home, along with any retaining springs or clips that I may need. (As mentioned in a previous post, it appears the front pads on the non-sport packaged LS's are the same size, but of a different, much less dusty compound). The pad replacement job looks pretty straightforward. Looks like I will need a socket/ratchet to loosen the caliper bolts, coathanger to suspend the caliper, big "C" clamp to compress the calipers, and hopefully thats it. If anyone else has changed the front pads on their LS themselves and has tips, I would appreciate it.

PS..on a separate note, I have to agree with a post Giowa made a few weeks ago. The factory floor mats for the LS suck. The new fronts I just purchased a month or so ago, already show noticeable wear where my right foot heel rests. And like giowa says, the mats are too small, and dont cover enough surface area. My next set will either be custom mats, or something much thicker, yet less costly, from Costco or Walmart.

giowa

Today's Omaha World-Herald reprints a recent NY Times article headlined "American Drivers Shifting Away From Sticks". Per Ward's Automotive Reports, in 2000 manuals accounted for just 8.7% of cars made in USA, down from 12.4% in '96. In Europe, automatics account for only 12% versus 88% for manuals. A cultural issue. Article mentions "Mustangs, Camaros and Trans Ams, a new Lincoln LS and a Volvo V70 have them. But they have disappeared from popular full-size cars." Glad to see them mention the LS bucking the trend!!! Quotes a GM Powertrain spokesperson, Matt Kester, as saying "The European mind-set is A, you can't get good mileage with an automatic and B, only weenies drive them." Says Americans won't because of traffic, commutes, cell phones, and new manumatics.

Is driving a stick better for you? Read on.... The 5/29/01 issue of NY Times had an interesting story on a sociology study comparing the sexual habits of Americans and the French. An excerpt: "55 percent of the French men and 49 percent of the women surveyed reported having sex two or three times each week, while only 33 percent of the American men and 31 percent of the women reported similar frequencies ... About 60 percent of the Americans and one-third of the French said they had sex once a week or less ... American women over 50 were far more likely to be sexually inactive than French women of similar age." Has me wondering if driving a stick improves your sex life? (ls1bmw0: You should do an unscientific survey at LLSOC comparing V8 auto, V6 auto, and V6 manual owners.)

ronniepooh: Sadly, my '00 LS8's floor mats compare poorly with my business '00 Hyundai Sonata GLS. The Sonata's mats are top notch quality and cover about every square millimeter of floor space. I HAVE to vacuum the LS weekly to get all too much that the mats don't cover. I just pull out the Sonata's mats and brush 'em off, as usually there is next to nothing to vacuum. A car in this price range needs better mats.

joe166

I complained about the mats immediately. The service manager at my dealership agreed they were really thin and were already wearing out at a few thousand miles. He ordered new ones for me, but before they came in I ordered the "deluxe" mats from Acton, that dealership in Mass. that is linked in the LLSOC site. They are great. Unfortunately, someone else later posted that they ordered the deluxe mats from them and got the regular ones they already had. I would look into it and call them. They are much nicer, much thicker and otherwise are a perfect match. They even have the same number on them as the ones that came from the factory, but they are twice as thick. I also read here that perhaps they were the mats from the new luxury edition or whatever they are calling the spruced up LS. Have to agree that the original mats really are cheap and thin.

ls1bmw0

Okay, I've picked myself back up of the floor after falling off my chair laughing at the thought of sending that survey question out along with the idea of what the responses would come back as!

Hmm.. Let me see....

1. Did you get some more often before or after your purchase of your LS?
2. Did you get any complaints about the lack of a shifter?
3. Did more power make a difference?
4. Does the lack of 2 cylinders hinder performance?

The possibilities would be endless

Brian

GLeen

I am currently getting ready to buy a 2001 BMW 530i but noticed some goo write-ups on the LS. My question is how is the ride on the LS? I currently lease a 1998 528i so I have been spoiled.

Thanks.

heyjewel

You may want to drive an LS before you get into another Beemer. The car has to be driven (hard) to *really* be appreciated. I'm pretty sure you'll be *very* impressed with the way the car handles.

The LS has 2 'ride' possibilties, the Sport pkg option has a firmer more 'European-style' suspension than the non-sport, which is a smoother, more traditional Lincoln-esque ride. A BMW owner may be more at home with the sport package. I love the way my LS rides, and I have the sport pkg.

Definitely drive the V8 for the xtra HP. With the sport pkg it will also have Lincolns' shiftable 5 speed automatic, called Select Shift. Personally I have a 5 speed manual, but one can buy that only with the V6.

I think you'll find the LS comparable to the 5-Series in most aspects. One big difference is the $$$ you'll save at purchase time on the LS. Especially now with great lease deals and 0% financing.

George

giowa

5/29/01 NY Times has an interesting article on GM's plan to sell "displacement on demand" V-8s starting in '04. Remember their '81 fiasco with the 8-6-4 engine? Well this time it will "skip alternate cylinders" to get an "8-10 percent" increase in fuel economy. GM thinks they'll sell 1.5M by '07. Is this "the more things change the more they stay the same" or "those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it"?

ls1bmw0

We have been nicely asked by the Edmunds folks if they could remove the logo from the club room. They are doing this for all the boards due to some other boards having some rather blatant site promotion(dealers coming on and advertising their dealership, etc.) and they want to apply their Terms of Use fairly and equitably.

So as to be fair to all the boards they requested that all Edmunds boards not have other site logos attached to Edmunds. I thought that this was a fair request since LLSOC doesn't compete with Edmunds and vice-versa. They have added a resource link to us in the topic posts on the left.

I've also asked Edmunds to do a slight name change for this board from Lincoln LS Owners to Lincoln LS Enthusiasts so as not to confuse people on what site is which.

Brian

lateralg

Super content; super presentation.

(Stan's article about speaker replacement on the LLSOC site)

ronniepooh

Gleen:
As a former BMW owner and enthusiast myself, I have to srtongly suggest you go test drive the LS. I think youll be quite shocked at what Lincoln has to offer. Although the 528 has a 6 cylinder rated around 193hp, and the V6 LS is rated at 210hp, I suggest you skip the V6 auto and test drive the V6 Manual (if you can find one) if you are in the market for a manual transmission. If a manual is not in your sights, then go straight to the LS V8 Sport Package. Loaded, it will sticker around $40k to $41k. Right now is a great time to buy an LS, great financing incentives, and you can usually snag a LS for around $500 over invoice. The LSV8's performance will exceed the 530's performance, but not by a huge margin, as the LS is a larger, heavier car. The interior space in the LS is actually larger than the 7 series. Interior materials are of somewhat better quality than the LS, but overall, the LS is a better value. Just dont get thrown off by the cheap floor mats in the LS. :-)They really arent representative of the quality of the rest of the car.

ronniepooh

OK. Im kidding. But there is a new white X-Type at Manhattan Jaguar/Lincoln in Rockville. Didnt notice the sticker, but it looked to be the top line model with the Sport Package and the 3.0 liter engine. Looked really nice. The interior was quite attractive, and the front end looks a lot neater and sporty to me than the S type. The rear end is similiar to the S class. Overall, a nice looking Jag, that looks like a Jag. But to get one with the Sport package and top line 231hp 6 cylinder engine, the sticker goes from $29 to the mid $40's. And is all wheel drive really necessary in most of the US, particularly the DC metro area? Is the AWD that much "safer", and that much better at overall handling feel than a RWD sport sedan equipped with traction control and/or stability control?

Reminds me of the idiots who purchase SUV's, only to spend 99% of the time driving it solo, not hauling or pulling anything at all, never go off-road, and see maybe 3 days of snow per year.

Sorry, did I slip off into a rant? ;-)

bchase1

To penny10119,
The K&N Filter # is 33-2148. It was not in stock at the local parts store and was ordered. Received in 3 days.
Bill

ls1bmw0

If you are planning on getting the Borla exhaust system don't but a separate K&N filter. Borla is now including their own version of a K&N with their LS systems.

Brian

ls1bmw0

Bill,

Please email me with feedback on the Granatelli Motor Sports mass air flow sensor on the V-6. I'd like to compare notes against the V-8 version that is on the project car. My email address is: brian.gowing@llsoc.com

Thanks,
Brian

aiuto

I had a squeaking from my front pads since car turned 9k miles. Brought it to two different dealers and was told that this was NORMAL as all pads squeak due to fact that there isn't any asbestos in them. Brought car back a 3rd time and finally got the dealer to agree pads were wearing improperly and had them replaced w/ 16k miles.

LM is not going to give away anything w/o a fight even when they are wrong.

Joe

aiuto

Excuse my ignorance . Is the TSB for trans reflashing only for the manual shift or is it for the automatic as well.

I've recently notice, at 16k miles, a strange odor coming from the heating/AC sytem when it gets turned on. It smells like iodine to me. It goes away after a few moments. Any suggestions.

Thanks.

aiuto

I live in Somerset next to New Brunswick and bouht my LS8 Sport from Lawrence LM in Lawrence down Route 1 near Princeton. Good buying experience and the service people are nice and helpful. I paid $500 over dealer cost. I always request and get a Lincoln loaner when bringing car in for service which happens to be quite often. Contact me if you need additional info.

Joe
aiuto@att.net

GLeen

ls1bmw0

The TSB is for automatic equipped cars only. The smell may be from the cabin air filter or if you've had the car air on recirculate for a time. Several other people have commented on that problem here but don't know what the resolution was.

Brian

scottc8

Well, I'm sorry to hear your brakes are worn out already but glad to hear it's both wheels! Maybe the noise is a built-in wear indicator. Now that four-wheel discs are becoming more common, too bad we can't rotate our pads along with the tires.

I posted a while back about my floor mats and took a little kidding about it, but I can take it. I got mine at Wal Mart, very large and heavy, and they happen to match the gray carpet in the light graphite interior almost perfectly. The drivers' side mat wants to lay just a little crooked due to the way it goes over the "dead pedal" on the left, but otherwise the fit is perfect. Think I paid $19.95 for a set of four.

johnnylinc

The reason the X is all-wheel drive is that it's based on the Ford Mondeo platform. The Mondeo is front-drive, but a front-drive Jag just doesn't fit with the heritage. That's why they made all-wheel drive standard. (You probably knew that already.)

Since the Mondeo's engine is transverse, it probably would've been prohibitively expensive to make it a rear-drive-only car. Platform-sharing does have its limitations, but the Mondeo gets generally high marks from European magazines, so it seems the most reasonable compromise that Ford could make.

I'm interested to see how much room there is in an X. If I remember correctly, the trunk is larger than the S, but I'm guessing that the interior will be noticeably smaller than the S or the LS. I haven't seen one in Texas yet; looks nice in photos. For the money, though, I still think we LS owners have the better deal.

stubcat

I live in Chicago Illinois and I am considering a Lincoln LS v8 with sport package and advance trac. I am some what concerned that a rear wheel drive car won't be driveable during a midwestern winter. Any other midwesterners out there?

ronniepooh

bbbbApologies for not having a digital camera to document this. Also, this was done in an apartment complex parking lot, using hand tools and the stock scissors jack/lug. There was a time when it would have been done in the comfort of my 2-car garage, with air tools, with a beer, under proper lighting, but ex-wives have a way of...sorry, nevermind. :-)

Items Needed:
1)12 Millimeter Socket with ratchet.
2)12 Millimeter Box wrench
3)Coat hanger, or very short bungee cord.
4)Flat head screwdriver
5)Brake Pad Kit, from Lincoln Dealer.

A)Jack up car
B)Remove lug nuts and wheel.
C)Attach one portion of the bungee cord to the top coil of the coil spring. Or, use a untwisted coat hanger. The goal of course is to have something to support the brake caliper once you remove the caliper bolts.
D)Remove the two 12mm Caliper bolts. The socket/ratchet will work on the lower bolt, but a socket/ratchet wont fit on the top one, due to the upper suspension arm being in the wayb. This is where the box wrench is needed.
E)Once both caliper bolts are completely removed, firmly pull the caliper out and up from the rotor assembly.
F)Using the other end of the bungee cord or hanger, suspend the caliper up out of the way, ensuring that there is no stress or tension on the brake lines/ABS wires.
G)Using a flat head screwdriver, remove the brake pads and caliper shims that the ends of the pads rest against.
H)Remove the brake reservoir cap.
I)Using a large "C" clamp, carefully compress the brake caliper pistons fully back into their housings.
H)Insert new pads/caliper shims onto the rotors, and use the new caliper bolts for reassembly.
I)Tighten up the caliper bolts, and replace the wheels.
J)Start the car, and pump the brake pedal 5-10 times to get the calipers pushed back out firmly against the pads. Do this prior to placing the car in gear.

Do-it-yourself savings? Probably 2 dealer service hours of labor, or approx $120-$160 dollars in labor and "disposal/etc fees".

Notes/tips:
Although I have the Sport Package option, I purchased/installed the non-sport pads, as its been reported here that the compounds are different (at least on the fronts), and that the non-sport pads dust significantly less. Ill keep an eye on that and see for myself. I can report that the pads are an exact fit. Additionally, all 4 pads are identical, inboard and outboard. The part number for the kit, which includes 4 pads with installed shims, 4 new caliper bolts, and 4 shims that actually attach to the portion of the caliper assembly that the pads rest against is XW4Z*2001*AA. List price is $99.72. Manhattan Lincoln in Rockville, MD charged me $74.42. Thats the quote they gave me over the phone, and thats what I paid when I got there. My old pads were shot at 33,700 miles. Passenger side had maybe 1 or 2 thousand miles left, by my estimate. The drivers side pads had maybe 100 miles left before the backing would have begun to contact the rotors. The inboard drivers pad was the thinnest of all. Glad I changed them this evening. Total time for the job was 1.5 hours, with at least 1/3rd of that time spent on jacking/removing/re-installing the wheels. If I had to just replace the pads, it would now take me about 25 minutes tops. One other tip. When replacing the caliper bolts, make sure the oval-shaped cailper bolt "housing washer thingie" with the flat sides, has one of the flat sides resting against the rotor. If a rounded end is resting against the rotor, the caliper bolt will never line up properly. Kind of hard to explain, but if you were looking at the assembly right now, you would know what Im talking about.

Good Luck. Brian: Feel free to post this in the appropriate area on LLSOC.

ronniepooh

Dont get me wrong, I liked the looks of the X-Type. And its been getting some good reviews. BUT, I think once you load it up to a comparable BMW 330xi (also AWD), its actually more expensive than the BMW. And I can just about guarantee which one of these two will win every comparison test every mag will do on these two. The 5-series barely beat the LS in comparison tests, but the LS was also thousands less than the 5. In the case of the X-type vs. the 330Xi, well, we will have to wait and see....

ezaircon4jc

Shouldn't the pads be covered under the 4/50 warranty? Or are "wear" parts not covered? When I need pads I plan on getting the new ceramic ones, if available, as they have virtually no dust.

packv12

I live in Green Bay and my 2000 LS sounds similar to what you are looking at. I've had the car for two winters and it has performed great in both. The AdvanceTrak keeps thing well in check on the slippery stuff.

I don't know how it would have handled last years winter, but I had no problems up here. You might have to use a more expensive chair to hold your parking spot though.

ls1bmw0

Thanks Ron! It has been duly posted in the How-To section with the appropriate credit due to you

Brian

scottc8

The LS is a terrific winter car due to great balance, steering, and Advance Trac. Equal to any front drive car I have driven, and I don't miss my Subaru one bit. I'm in Colorado and have done OK without snow tires, but in the Great Lakes area you will probably want them. You might consider an LS without the Sport Package. It will have 16" wheels so your choice of snow tires will be broader (and cheaper).

ronniepooh

Nope. Pads are wear items, and are not covered. However, they are covered in the free 36,000 mile maintenance agreement that comes with the 2001 LS's. (Mine is a 2000 model year).

Regarding the ceramic pads, I've never heard of that. I have heard of $7000 ceramic rotors used in some Porsche's, but never heard of these pads. I could find no dustless pads for the LS in my search. Repco/Axxis is the company that Im most familiar with, with regards to dustless pads, and they dont make any for the LS, at least not yet.

sdouglas2

If you have the 17" wheels / sport package you could always check into getting 215/60R16 snow tires on 16" steel wheels. Small difference in circumference and you don't have to subject you alloys to road salt.

From my personal experience, the 17" Firestones performed reasonably well in the snow. We use Pirelli 210 snow tires (on the sport package) for our cold weather / high altitude development trips and never have a problem. I've been able to drive through snow deep enough to drag the undercarriage with no troubles.

brucelinc

We had a brutal winter here in Minneapolis with plenty of snow and ice. I do not have advance trac but my non-sport performed very well without winter tires. Obviously advance trac and dedicated winter tires would be even better.

We have a Taurus (front-drive) so it was easy to make comparisons between the two. In deep unplowed snow, the Taurus might be marginally better. On hard packed snow and ice, the LS is more confidence inspiring because of its better balance. The LS is far superior to any rear wheel drive car I have ever had. The equal weight distribution is a big plus. I would not hesitate to recommend the LS in snowy climates.

Bruce

giowa

5/24/01 issue of NY Times has a large story in Business Section on Ford Europe & Ford Mondeo. Headlined: "Standing Out in a Tough Crowd: A Ford Model Wins Rare German Praise". Is Ford Europe's biggest hit in a long time. German automotive press has raved about it. Interestingly, they compare it favorably to the class-leading VW Passat, and say it has more value than more expensive BMWs, Volvos, or Audis. Ford Europe run by David Thursfield, "a low-key but tough-minded Briton".

tom12253

Here is a response to my question to tech support at Raybestos http://www.raybestos.com, about dustless brake pads for our LS's

I have not checked into the quality of they're pads any further.

Hi Tom,

The pads available for your application is Raybestos part number PGD805M

and I never had any complaint from our customers on dusting.

Regards,

Pierre Lalonde

Canadian Technical Representative

mailto:Pierre.Lalonde@dana.com

GLeen

How does this car depreciate? Does anyone know?

Thanks.

If anyone leased, what is the residual as a % of negotiated purchase price?

Thanks again.

xwray

A slight change you may want to consider is to open the bleeder prior to pushing the caliper piston back into the caliper. This will prevent any sludge, particles, whatever from being back flushed into the brake system. Up until the LS I never bothered with doing this but with the high-dollar ABS system, etc on the LS I intend to do it when I need to change my pads. Probably overkill but it doesn't take much debris to screw up one of these systems...best to flush it right on out of the system.

ls1bmw0

Good idea, but it might let air into the system if you don't close the bleeder valve just before you complete the pushing. It would definitely let air in if you didn't close the bleeder valve and took off the C-clamp.

Just a been-there, done-that warning

Brian

billincal1

My 01 LS8 sportpackage is giving me a reminder to change my oil soon...I hit reset but it comes up everytime I restart the car. My first scheduled maintenace is in 2 weeks.Is there something I can do to disable the message in the meantime so it won't always appear at startup?

Bill

thomas_l

Either you keep hitting reset to cancel the warning or you reset the counter by using the "status" function until oil life is displayed and hitting the reset button. It will ask you to hit reset again to confirm. I had to do that with the cabin air filter after I got tired of resetting it.

thomas_l

Are completely negotiable and have to be worked in with the rest of the deal to mean anything. You could get a fantastic residual but be getting beat down on the monthly rental fee or up front items. I got 48% on mine which seems about par. On the other hand, the value hasn't been diving too badly, so after 13 months I am only a couple thousand upside down on a 36 mo/15k per year deal. Of course that will change when the '02 models roll out in August and my '00 is then "3" years old.

I have seen news to the effect that many lessors are not offering great lease deals due to the glut of lease returns depressing the resale value on used cars. My dad recently sold his '98 Grand Prix and it was painful. Autotrader.com had over 200 like his listed in metro ATL and at least 2/3 were obviously program cars (base models) going for way less than he really wanted to get. Same thing happened to me when I sold my loaded '97 Grand Marquis. I wanted $11,500 (KBB average condition) and ended up taking $10k from the third guy that even called after 2 months of advertising.

GLeen

If I can get a LS at $500 over cost - and I know I can - and the lease rate is 0%, this sounds like a win, win situation.

giowa

Does it look like Mania 2 is on or off? Pondering whether to submit payment and make reservations. Don't want to do it and find out I wasted my time as it is cancelled. You said you had to have 50. Are you over halfway there?

billincal1

Will try it...I just kept hitting the reset button and not the status button! I really enjoy this board, there is always a friendly chat partner to answer questions to this totally cool car! It really does get better the more you drive it!
Bill

Hey Brian... saw the new T-bird highlighted in the local newspaper today! It shares about 60% of LS parts..including the 3.9 V8. Any word of convertible LS in the future? (Us california guys can't get enough sunshine!) The article said it was about 7" shorter than the LS but the trunk is almost non-existent...just a scant six cubic feet. I still think my LS is by far and away the best car on the road...but that T-Bird sure does bring back memeories of 45s, crusin, and a time where bucket seats were so radical and so cool!
There was even mention of Ford trying to match the color of the leather to the outside of the car. My dad had a Lincoln Continental with suicide doors. It was metalic turquoise with metalic turquoise leather interior...for some reason that combo did it for me when was 14...maybe that's why Ford is trying to recreate the same feeling again...
Bill

slowdriver

Got new tires for my LS-8 non-sport, the OEM Firehawks were worn to the warning marks, at 23K miles. Firestone gave me $400 warrantee credit for the early wear. The Firehawks could not hold the road at all... If I drove thou some mist, the traction control would shut the engine down......

The replacement tires are V rated Bridgestone Turanza Revos and they are quietier, smoother and hold the road better than the Firehawks ever did.

The Service at Firestone was excellant.