Isuzu Axiom

brewmaster

My wife and I test drove the Base 4WD Axiom 3 weeks ago. We both thought very highly of it based on the handling, the std. options, and warranty offered. We are looking to make the purchase within the next 2 months. Since the current financing incentive is ending on 9/4, and considering overall Isuzu's sales for July 01 are down 29% vs. July 00. Could one reasonably expect Isuzu to sweeten the pot further? All opinions welcome.

Regarding Consumer Reports, I have found them to be very inconsistent. As an example their review of the Infiniti G20 on page 46 April 01 issue which they recommend contains the following comments" Handling isn't very nimble, the ride is unimpresspressive, and the rear seat is cramped." The 2.0 liter four feels lethargic. They did state relibility is excellent. When I read something like this I don't know where they are coming from. It is actually a shame they are not less bias in general, as there is a place for this kind of resource.

paisan

Well if I were a betting man, I'd bet they'll move up to at least $2K-$4K incentives on the Axioms as the fall rolls around. I've been around the Isuzus enough in the past 4 years to know they'll offer better deals if you can wait. My buddy who bought a 2000 Trooper LS is probably replacing his 2nd car a Honda Accord Lease with an Axiom in the fall, and he just convinced his father-in-law to buy one too. If you are in the northeast (NY/NJ/CT area) contact Mark Jerrick @ SI Subaru Isuzu, he'll give you a fair deal with no hidden costs. 718-979-9595

-mike

raydahs

Just curious how those new style headlights are working out on the AX? Are they bright enough?

paisan

The Axiom headlights rock. They are way way better than the stuff on the Troopers. Nice near E-code style cutoffs which I like. Sharp edges on the light, and very very effective.

-mike

raydahs

Sorry Mike, what's that? are you still running the Hellas on your rig?

paisan

Oh sorry bout that. E-code is the light pattern that is required by cars sold in Europe. It's a more directed light that has a sharp upper cut-off that provides much better lighting. Basically your low beams have a sharp line and it's very bright in the area that it covers. US DOT spec lights are more diffused, and are dimmer covering a larger area. The new Axiom lights are more E-code ish, in that they have a sharp low-beam cut-off and are bright. I still have my Hella 4000s wired up to my high beams on the trooper. Also the Axiom stock fog-lights are actuall Hella fog lights!

-mike

raydahs

But, are you still using the Hella bulbs in the stock headlights and fogs?

paisan

Yep I've had the Hella 100W H3s in my fog lights(stock position and run whenever low beams are on) and Hella 9004 80/100w bulbs in the headlights. They help, but not a whole lot on the trooper.

-mike

tami1

Does anyone's Axiom produces a loud muffler sound while accelerating?

revolve360

Yes, but I don't mind it. I believe an upgraded exhaust is how they got some of the extra power out of the same 3.5 motor as the trooper & vehicross.

revolve360

"The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety"
is who performed the test in the above link.
I trust insurance companies less when it comes to "safety". Most of them seem more bent on figuring out ways to decrease their payouts.

paisan

It is in their best interest to rate things poorly, since that means they can charger HIGHER rates.

-mike

drew_

The insurance companies are part funders of the IIHS. They don't conduct the tests themselves. If the cars are safer, people are less likely to be injured and they'll have to pay less. So it works out for both us and the insurance companies. There is no conspiracy here. It is quite easy to distinguish a "good" rated vehicle versus a lesser vehicle by the structural collapse. Note that "poor" rated vehicles have not had their insurance rates go up.

However, in Australia or Europe, the very same 40mph offset crash test is conducted by the government as part of the mandatory New Car Assestment Programme. The results of the Euro or Australian tests are usually almost identical to that of the IIHS' when conducted on the same make/model

Look for the Axiom's IIHS test results to be released in about a month's time.

Stay tuned,

Drew
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paisan

The Trooper passed the Aussie test w/o any problems, yet it didn't pass the off-set test here.

-mike

drew_

There is no pass or fail with the IIHS offset crash test, just that the Trooper received a "marginal" for their offset crash test. I'm sorry (but hardly surprised) to report that the rebadged Holden Jackaroo did not do well in the Australian offset crash test either, receiving a "Marginal", with results similar to the IIHS test; that is severe deformation especially in the lower part of the cabin.


In the Australian full frontal crash test, it received an "Acceptable". Crash tools were needed to open the doors after this test. The last Isuzu Trooper that the NHTSA tested in its full frontal test was a '97 model, and it received 3 out of 5 stars for both the driver and front passenger.


http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/ncap/cars/125.html

http://www.nrma.com.au/Page/Public?PageId=mot_ctholdenjackeroo

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/00029.htm


As I've said, there is no conspiracy here, just that the dated design of the platform has probably reached its limits. Hopefully the next generation model will be better!

Drew
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paisan

There is no future one, 2003 will be a re-badge Yukon . Also there are people on here that t-boned a big ole caddy @ 4mph w/o getting a scratch... I like real world test better than ones in a lab... just my preference.

-mike

flonyai1

I have been reading this board for over 4 months and it is one of the major factors in considering to buy an Axiom. I need to say this: despite the poor marketing of the brand. I may stay with this opinion by myself, but in recent days when Isuzu switched off their sophisticated, technically rich and classy site for a Joe Isuzu something I got really disappointed. The new site doesn't even have an e-mail contact. Maybe they are afraid that people may leave messages. This is the reason I am writing. Joe Isuzu is a funny guy, but I would question the overall tone of the latest Isuzu marketing strategy. When you look at the sale numbers, it appears the marketing isn't working. Axiom sales went down over 20 % from June in July. The Isuzu brand is a solid, good quality product and the Axiom is probably one of the most underrated vehicles. Part of it is its unique front fascia, but I think (IMHO) marketing should take large part of the blame. Who wants to buy a Axiom because a guy pokes fun on a Highlander, or Volvo? What is the goal? Isuzu is a better product that Toyota, or Volvo? I think people, in the large majority, buy vehicles because they find some attributes in the vehicle that fits their personality, life style, budget and so on, and not because some one is poking fun on another brand. The pictorial marketing is the same way. The pictures of the Axiom in the Time magazin, or freeway ad signs emphasize qualities of the vehicle which don't draw many customers. Who wants to be a weirdo, or an antidote of a lemming? The pictures of the Axiom are taken from a low angle which further enlarges the front fascia and it looks almost intimidating. Meanwhile, in the Isuzu brochure the same picture taken from a higher angle gives the vehicle a much more balanced view. It looks appealing. That's the way to go.

I think the marketing should be based on the same tone I sense from this board (in the big majority of the cases): love of the truck, good quality, solid performance, commitment for the brand. ( When I read the board of the Mazda Tribute it was enough to dissuade me from considering it). Each Isuzu vehicle has enough positive attributes upon which a successful marketing strategy could be based, this is especially true for the Axiom. But when some one is trying to prove that Highlander is not good enough because it doesn't have ISC, who really cares? They may have a good laughter at Joe Isuzu and then they go to buy a Highlander. Those brands don't have problem selling large numbers of vehicles. I think for Isuzu their neighbor could serve good ideas about a successful marketing and brand identity: Subaru.

In summary: emphasize the positive things of the vehicle, including GO Farther, instead of talking down other products. This strategy easily can backfire because you are giving the other brands free advertisement.

I am sorry about the long ramblings, but it was pressing for long time.

Frank

paisan

Hey Frank you hit the nail on the head. I think this board and some others I'm on could have a better marketing strategy and surely a more successful one than Isuzu currently has...

-mike

flonyai1

Mike:

One comment and one question:
I like the slogan Go Farther and I think the products should support it. The only griping I have with the Axiom is the shallow approach/departure angle. This is a bit contradictory with the Go Farther slogan. For next model year a solution that has been used in the MDX and will be used in the Saturn Vue could be applied on the Axiom as well. A poliurethane front/rear shield rounded upwards which increases the angles and shields the front/rear center section from intrusive material. On both mentioned models they look nice and are very practical.

Why did they change the TOD icon of the Trooper (3 different stages for front drive) to a single box on the Axiom? Do you know something about it? I really enjoyed to monitor how much torque is being transferred to the front axle.

Frank

paisan

Well the TOD display on the trooper took up a lot of room, and they probably just did it to conserve space, also since the trooper is the "flag ship" it has that nice little feature (plus the 8 way drivers seat, hug moonroof, etc)

The axiom is not really meant for off-road (neither is the MDX) anyone who knows off-roading knows that 17" rims aren't the way to go, also the highway tread on the axiom isn't really suited for off-roading as much as the other trucks.

-mike

paisan

The Axiom has skid plates on it in the front, so the only thing that would take damage in the front would be the bottom of the fascia. I'm not sure of the #s on angle of approach/departure v. the MDX and Vue (the vue is an oversized mini-van IMHO) but I'd bet the Axiom beats them both.

-mike

flonyai1

Mike:

I am looking for being able to tackle unpaved roads, forestry roads and so on. No intention climbing rocks and or the Rubicon Trail. The reason I mentioned it was that something like that would take out a bit of the "bite" of the front fascia. Because the one thing I really like in the Axiom is TOD and the full-blown 4WD capability, but I am fully aware the Axiom was never intended for rock climbing. The on-demand it's a tremendous feature, which for example the Highlander doesn't have.

Frank

paisan

Yeah I'd re-do the front if I were in charge. The advantage I found of TOD over other systems is that it put *some* power to the front (15%) almost all the time, which gives it a more pro-active approach to the system rather than what most of the other systems (ford, chevy,etc) have which is reactionary to a wheel slip.

You could always get matt to make you a custom front bumper Also I think you could get the Hella 4000 lights below the headlights in the grille

-mike

flonyai1

I am looking for some feedback. Comparing Carsdirect's and Edmunds' invoices there is a $ 1,500 difference. I checked one invoice and the difference comes from items like:

-Advertisement
-Holdback
-Floorplan,
-and on the specefic invoice there was a stamped TDI item (who knows what it is) and a charge of $ 136. The dealer wanted all above items to be included in his invoice. How negotiable are these items?

Thanks Frank

paisan

I'd say at least the Ad and Floorplan are not counted. the Holdback is what I usually give them as profit.

-mike

flonyai1

Thanks. I had a similar feel. Those two items sound pretty flaky, including the TDI.

Frank

flonyai1

Considering that the Axiom has a satellite linked digital compass, basically a digital signal received by the vehicle, is it possible, or some one knows a way, maybe an aftermarket device that can be hooked up and use it as a GPS device? Are there out navigational systems which could be hooked up to the signal?

Thanks Frank

paisan

But, I'll be it will be offered as an option in a future year's model. Probably after that unit get's installed in the Trooper in 2003 model year.

-mike

Sporin

I agree with you guys about the Isuzu web site. I "get" what they are trying ot do, but now it is so cheesy, and lacks any functioality.

I went there to "Build My Own" Axio, and couldn't... that is the sort of thing that major auto manufacturer's web sites NEED to do in my opinion.

pdt1965

Referring to message #177 my first post -

After spending an additional 25 days on the third trip to the dealer for my Axiom - they finally called to tell me it was ready.

When I got there we began to discuss the repairs. The replaces the gas tank, o-ring, fuel pump, feel line and gas cap (second time) in order to fix the check engine light problem. While there they also replaced all four shocks on the auto because the factory rep found they were leaking (keep in mind here at the time it was in the shop there were about 1000 miles on the vehicle).

I was very pleased with my dealer, Vista Isuzu, as they provided me a rental car for the entire period free of charge and were very discouraged about my difficulties with the vehicle. They have a very good reputation at their family of dealerships and have been around for nearly 60 years. Going so far as to fill the new gas tank even though when I brought it in there was less than a quarter tank of gas.

I drove away hoping for the best. I had ironically put more more than three times the mileage on my rental car than my new one but when I started to drive I realized again why I bought this Axiom. It is just a great car.

It has been over a month and nearly 1700 additional miles and I think the problem has been resolved. I can't say I don't think about it every time I fill up the car though. We went on vacation for a while and it was perfect. Even in the 125 degree desert -we were cool and comfy.

A credit union plug here - I mentioned to my branch gal the auto had been in the shop for nearly a month and Wescom CU (the lienholder)offered to pay that months payment for my trouble. Not tacked on to the end of my loan - or put off till later...just paid. So, on the 20th of July the balance owing on the car dropped - the 2nd payment was made and my checking balance did not go lower. Lesson here is get to know your financial people. Because of their good will - I am allowing them to refinance my house - dropping a full 1.5 points from where I am now...not a bad July if I do say so...just goes to show CU's have a great advantage over banks. (IMHO)

Finally, my euphoria burst just today - as I drove home tonite I came upon the first other Axiom I have scene on the road - it was a blond one. As we sat in traffic the guy looked over and saw me in mine. We both smiled and laughed - we rolled down our windows and I told him he had shattered my record...he remarked that I had shattered his too. We laughed and drove away. Pretty soon everyone will have one!!!!

revolve360

Last Monday, my wife and I left on a short trip to Gilroy (taking our new Axiom of course). That morning as we were leaving, we were wondering when we were ever going to see another one (and we drive all over the SF Bay Area). Well, we stopped by our local Sizzler to have lunch on the way and lo and behold there is the exact same Axiom sitting in their parking lot (Anthracite XS) - We just had to laugh! I guess we jinxed ourselves talking about it. We parked right next to it and hoped we would run into the owners but no luck.

paisan

you should contact Isuzu and let them know what a good job the dealer did. The dealer will get a call from Isuzu. I do this whenever I get outstanding service because usually people only call corporate when there is a problem with service from a dealer.

Glad to hear it's working.

I've only seen 1 axiom on the road here in NYC.

-mike

troyy2k

The Axiom XS current lease promotion is as follows:
$379 Per Month/48 Month Lease
$1,473 Due at lease signing.

How does this compare with a Highlander Limited 4WD lease?

drew_

That's probably because Isuzu only sold 584 Axioms in the entire country for the month of July 2001. They sell more Troopers than that! I have seen zero Axioms on the roads of my city, and the neighbouring cities. Isuzus in general are rare around here anyway.


Drew
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paisan

No contest. The Axiom wins hands down. A family friend brought their MDX over for the weekend. and I got to crawl in, under, and all over it.

It's amazing they can even call it an SUV.

-mike

raydahs

Wow Preston, that's one heck of a story. I must say, you've got a very good attitude. Most people, would be very discouraged at this point. Hope it's all in the past for you.

corsicachevy

In an urban setting, "Joe Isuzu" pulls up along side a young adult male in his Jeep Grand Cherokee. The Jeep has a large rock dangling in front of its grill - taking from the "carrot and stick" theme of the Jeep commercials. The young adult says that his Jeep is going to take him to the "great outdoors". Joe Isuzu replies, with something to the effect of, "Get real. You know you're never going to take that thing off-road, so why did you buy it. You should have bought the Isuzu Axiom with a suspension designed for the real world."

Any thoughts on this marketing strategy?

paisan

But Isuzu's still got the worst marketing team ever assembled, no doubt due to the GM ownership, they don't want them to cut into GM sales...

-mike

corsicachevy

Come buy our new Axiom SUV, it's great for driving on pavement! What a message.

paisan

The Axiom will also do great off-road. But as we all know 95% of SUVs aren't taken off-road. At least the axiom has a full frame, and one of the best drivelines in the 4x4 business (Holden Jackaroo and Isuzu Bighorn are big names in the off-road community worldwide)

-mike

flonyai1

For some reasom the Axiom ads are challenging some well established "axioms" such as the GC is premier off-road vehicle, Toyota can sell almost anything because of its name and associated reliability, or Volvo quality, dependability and so on. One thing is sure: the marketing strategy for Isuzu is not working. They should establish their own niche market, build upon that and emphasize the good stuff of the Isuzu brand. Leave alone those other guys! Subaru doesn't care about the rest of the SUV market. They developed a first class product, and who likes it they will buy it: generation after generation.

This Joe Isuzu marketing is going nowhere...

paisan

I being a subaru fan myself, realize that they were at the right place at the right time. If not for the Outback's success, they would be going the way of Oldsmobile right now.

-mike

ideatampa

After 2,000 miles, I cannot say enough good things about my Axiom. It handles well, feels solid and so far is trouble free.

While I would like to see another one on the road, I like the exclusive feeling. I cannot tell you the number of stares that I get and the thumbs up I receive on a daily basis. Most people just cannot figure out on first glance who is the manufacturer and when they learn its an Isuzu, they are even more surprised.

As for things that I would change, my list is minor. Memory seats/steering would be nice and an outlet in the center arm rest would be welcome so that I can store my cell phone. I would also like to suggest a tray mounted in the back of the front seat for long trip and kid meals (similar to that in a commercial airline), however I'm sure that there are safety concerns which prohibit such a feature.

Again, if there are any aftermarkets sites for the Axiom please keep me posted.

drew_

...at 6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern. Hope to see you there!

http://www.edmunds.com/towchat/isuzuchat.html

jefegigante

I had posted earlier upon the purchase of my Ax. My CE light issue was resolved in < 2hrs by replacing a hose at the dealer. I'm willing to shake this minor issue off since the vehicle have been quite enjoyable to have.

I'd like to try it off-road, but don't know of any handy places near Indianapolis.

Yet so see another in Indy yet. Earlier this week I heard someone on the street say ("What the hell is that?" in a good way).

My wife wants another, which is silly to me, but a testament to how much she likes the vehicle. Given that she passed on a Rodeo 2yrs ago, this is also a testament to the dramatic difference in handling between the two.

paisan

Hey, there is gonna be a big Isuzu Convention in North Carolina the weekend of Oct 5-8 (columbus day weekend) It's easy trails (stock Axiom, Trooper and Rodeos work there) and camping, hanging with a bunch of other Isuzu nuts. Not too far from IN IIRC.

-mike

sowr

Location: Big Bear Lake, CA USA.
Vehicle: Isuzu Axiom 4x4, base.

Tackled some fairly tough roads:

Hasley Canyon Road,4 miles, hard surface, gravel and dirt, no problems, TOD on.

Road #3N16, 2 miles, flat dirt occasionally bumpy, large pools of water, TOD on, no problem.

Road #3N32, 2 miles, very bumpy dirt, big ruts, perpendicular to the road and in-line, tree-roots, many boulders up to about 1ft high, steep and inclined sections, TOD on, no problems. Last section (100 yards) squeeze-play between large boulders, and up and down over rock steps, 4L, no slipping, very impressive.

No BMW's, Acura's, Lexus' or Highlanders in sight, slightly amazed that I didn't hit bottom, no scuff marks on the spare either. Very impressed with the traction in TOD, you can really feel it grabbing, also impressed with the crawling capability of 4L, the rev band in both modes seems perfect for this kind of terrain.

Underneath that racy exterior lies (no, not a Camry)a very capable SUV.

manlystanly

My wife and I are considering a new vehicle to replace our '99 Amigo. We love the Amigo, but the birth of our daughter (in addition to our dog) has quickly shown us that this vehicle is not as practical as it was when we were childless.

We are currently considering purchasing one of three vehicles, and would be interested in hearing the feedback from this group. We are currently looking at the Axiom, the Highlander, and the Acura MDX. We want a good quality, dependable car, with some nice creature comforts. This will be used most often as a long-haul family trip vehicle, as well as frequent Home Depot excursions.

We test drove the Axiom, and were thoroughly impressed with its handling. It had excellent acceleration, cornering, and maneuverability. It was easy to park, and the visuals were great. The interior colors (in the leather package) were very off-putting. It seemed more appropriate for a teenager's car than as a family car. We decided to wait to see if Isuzu would come out with a more conservative interior color scheme. We were also concerned about the re-sale value. Our Amigo has lost almost 50% of its value in 2 years, and despite the fact that it is a great car, it will be difficult to sell it. We were concerned that if for some reason we wanted to sell the Axiom, we would be in the same predicament.

The Highlander 4wd was also a surprisingly pleasant ride. But, by the time we added on the features that we were interested, it became more expensive than we thought it was worth. The demand for the HL is still such that dealers are not willing to deal yet.

Although the MDX is considerably more expensive than the other two, we are still considering this car. It has the 3rd row seat, which adds a considerable amount of future "flexibility" (read: more children?) and Acura's seem to hold their value very well. We were also considering waiting until a Honda version came out, but the Amigo seems to be getting smaller every day.

Does anyone know if the 2002 Axiom will be offered in a plain tan interior leather package? Are all of the Isuzus going to face the same rapid depreciation fate?

corsicachevy

"This will be used most often as a long-haul family trip vehicle, as well as frequent Home Depot excursions."

Don't be so quick to dismiss the Honda Odyssey and Toyota Sienna. These vehicles offer better rides and more interior space than your threesome of small SUVs.

manlystanly

Thanks for responding. I tried to keep my message succinct and to the point by consolidating 3-4 months of decision making on this subject, so I left out a few details.

These three that I mentioned are the comprise vehicles between my tastes, and my wife's (you know how that can be!) She absolutely refuses to consider a minivan, no matter how logical they seem to be. And I do not want to drive a typical gas-guzzling truck-based SUV. So, we are trying to find a middle ground that fits our needs.

The new car-based SUVs seem to be the right compromise. They have better gas milage, and better handling, yet still have a good amount of room. We also like the 4WD/ AWD features due to the fact that we spend time on the Outer Banks, and travelling to New England ski slopes.

One of the questions that we still have unresolved is "How much space is enough space". Which is why we have been spending considerable time sitting in these cars, trying to assess these things.