Mazda Protegé

mazdafun

The RX-8 will appeal to us older folks too, y'know.

dinu01

As far as the Nordics go, I think the rubber will wear off fatser than a regular Pirelli/Michellin brand. They do provide traction. but it's just thread life that might be inferior.

I'm not going for them. I'll wait until Dec 10th or so and go put some Pirellis or Blizzaks. I'll check the prices here in T.O. at that time, just b/c it doesn't look like it wil be snowing for a while.

Dinu

vocus

You have a point with making investments and such. But I thought about that too before getting the Jetta. I figure since I have 3 investment accounts (surprised that not all my money goes to cars?) and never had a German car, I went for the car. I thought about the Benz, and it would have only been a little more than the car I got, but decided against it. The one I got is loaded, and the Benz isn't for the price (leather, sunroof, traction, etc.). I guess now we will get flamed for talking about other cars in this topic by the host. Oh well.

mdaffron

Take your freakin' German car discussion elsewhere, you beer-belchin', autobahn-chasin', Colonel Klink lovin' sauerkraut eaters! This here's the PROTEGE topic!!!

Meadeball

mdaffron

My fruitless attempt at sounding like Yosemite Sam on the Protege topic.

(Ya varmints.)

Meadeball

protegenic

but I was out playing at the BMW Performance Driving School in Greenville, SC! Some of you may remember I won this outing this past summer and finally had the opportunity to go. It was a blast! We started the day at the dealership in Atlanta and had a chartered bus take us to SC. On the way we watched "Gone in 60 Seconds", just to get us in the mood I guess. After meeting our instructors and getting briefed on safety, we split into four groups and put the cars through their paces the remainder of the day. We did a lot of slalom and road course drills on both wet and dry pavement to really get a feel for ABS and their traction control systems. We primarily drove 330 sedans, but we also got to put some of the other cars through their paces. Let's see, I got to punish a Z3, an M3, an M3 roadster (that funky hatchback), an X5 and a 740. Believe it or not the roadster was by far the most fun to drive hard. It just swallowed the corners, even better than the M3 we all agreed. We also got to do an off road course in the X5's just to test their capabilities. To top it all off, it was sunny and 70 to boot. All in all, a great day. Oh, we did a team competition at the end. You will all be glad to know the zoom zoom I experience daily paid off as my team won the contest and I had one of the top five times!

mdaffron

Zoom zoom zoom!

Meade

fowler3

ashtu: I got the figures from Kiplinger's. Your interest rate is a little low. SOme of the best long-term funds are still paying 6% to 7%. You have to figure in compound interest, that's the "magic" in funds. Don't use the interest, leave it in and let it grow - interest on interest.

The first investment that produced $2.5 million was when interest was as high as 21% during the 1980's. It will be a long time before it hits that again.

meade: Your comment -- Believe me, as your income
grows, your expenses grow right along with it. -- is exactly right. Also your expectations and the quality of what you buy. So you are always pinching pennies. If others in your now higher income bracket can afford such-n-such why can't I? You don't know what they are doing, they may be one step shy of Chapter 11. They may not have other debts. They may have other income you don't know about.

elec3 said: When you're young and want to have all sorts of nice things, you don't have the money and when you finally have the money, you're too old to really care about all the nice things you wanted when you were younger.

Partly true. Young people are not usually interested in a house nicely furnished and other more mature things. They are trying to extend their college years as long as possible, the fun days. When you are older your "toys" become more expensive.

Someone commented earlier that they didn't want to skimp while young and die with a lot of money in the bank. Or something to that effect. People who have a lot of money when they are old didn't skimp. They enjoyed life to the fullest, the difference is, they bought cars with the "interest" from their investments, or let their businesses pay for their luxury cars, instead of using their paychecks.

And:

By the time I graduate and am making some real money, I'll be too busy and too old with too many commitments to have the same desires.

elec3: You will never be that busy or that old anytime soon.

And about changes in topic: There is only so much we can say about our cars. The changes in topic provide perspectives and alternatives which are a part of the car-buying experience. Have you ever read a car review that didn't compare the tested car to other brands and models? Same thing. And information on purchasing, financing, and servicing are all part of the game.

fowler3

mdaffron

Yeah, I'm lurking over on the Jetta board. (I'd bet ALL of us are; holding our breath to read your first unhappy post about the Jetta!)

You continue to compare the Jetta to the Protege. Why? You admitted your car was $25,000 -- nearly $10,000 more expensive than my 2000 Protege ES. It SHOULD be a nicer car. That's like going over to the Hyundai Accent topic and raving about how much better an Accord is. Well, DUH!

All I can say is, if you're now going 110 in your Jetta, we won't need to yank your chain much longer because you'll soon find yourself wrapped around a tree and dead from internal injuries! For months we've read about your high-speed escapades and off-ramp heroics, some of which (er, going home from MAPP I?) have gotten you in trouble. Your luck's gonna run out, my friend. C'mon, Paul, stop being so careless!

And before all you people start saying, "Oh, he's young, let him have his fun and sow his wild oats," let me state that it could be ME or YOU who finds himself in Paul's path at that next intersection.

Meade

mdaffron

I'm only starting to notice how protecting my credit has paid off. My bank just offered me "Crown Customer" status with free interest checking, free checks for life, a free safe deposit box and a large line of credit with a very nice rate. Suddenly I'm starting to feel like a responsible person!

Meade

vocus

You all don't miss anything do you? I will tell you the same thing I told a friend this morning when she reamed me out. There was no one on the highway, and I had control of the car. There was no one to pull out in front of me or anything else. And I am going to slow down on the highway instead of getting a detector. My insurance agent told me one ticket in this turbo car, and I have no more insurance.

And I did compare the high-speed feel of the Protege to the Jetta. I know it's going to be better, because the Jetta is Autobahn-bred and meant to run at speeds in excess of 120mph on a regular basis. Sorry for the comparo though. But to be fair, it was not on this board but another one.

mdaffron

We got flamed here for saying something about another vehicle on this topic.

And Paul, if your insurance agent warned you, then WHY were you going 110 this morning? C'mon buddy, we want to see you enjoy your car -- and your driver's license! (And the rest of your life for that matter!)

I know Maryland has aircraft speed enforcement like Virginia does! You never know who's watching you!

BTW ...

You had control of the car? Did you also have control of any tire defects you might have with those brand-new tires? Any road hazards you might encounter? A loose lug nut? Or any of another dozen things I could bring up? Keep this in mind ... your car may have been autobahn-bred, but that's just the point ... our roads are not built for 110-mph cruising like the autobahn is.

Meade

black01coupev6

newcar31: The C230 we drove was base with the exception of the automatic tranny and the roof and it was $28,000 +. What's the point of buying a stripped Benz? An RSX tops out at $23,500 with manual tranny, leather, climate control, 6-disc CD Changer. To get a 6-disc changer in the Benz you have to add $1750, the leather is $1410, the roof is $995. All that equals $29,750. $6000 more than the RSX. Also, the RSX is faster. 6.7 for the Acura vs. 7.2 for the C230. It's amazing what Honda can do with normally aspirated engines.

Like I said, either the CL or the RSX would be the better choice for me.

Hey but the Benz is pretty cool. It doesn't even have a dipstick. It has lifetime roadside (which in the Hyundai topic is pretty important) and it has more standard safety equipment.

Okay, back to topic. Hopefull the Jetta is better on the highway. The Jetta is a nice car but the Protege is a much better choice. Especially with 0.0% interest and the Protege even looks a little like a Japanese Jetta in the front and in the rear it looks like a Japanese A4.

Like you have said Vocus, it's your money, you can spend it however you choose. I just think it's strange you are paying $10,000 more for a car that only has 50 more HP and leather over a Protege. A turbo kit is only $3,000. Still $5,000 more. It might be worth it to you but for $25,000 I could get another Accord EX V6, a used Lexus, Acura, or BMW. There are alot of choices once you get up to $25,000 and I'm not sure the Jetta is the best one unless you just gotta have a new car.

black01coupev6

PS: The Jetta doesn't even have a fully independent rear suspension.

One more thing I thought of that might make you rest a little easier Meade. I don't think Vocus will be able to get out of this Jetta for a while. It seems like he financed in and around $25,000 for it. Someone over in real-world trade values was requesting estimates on their 2001 1.8T, I think they quoted him $15,000. Also I see them get appraised alot and can tell you that he is buried in this car.

vocus

As far as my choice on a car, I wanted a Jetta and that's all that matters. I have not come and flamed the Protege because I have a Jetta, and don't find some comments inappropriate (black01coupev6). The sticker was $25,000 and yes, I must have a new car. I will not drive used, ever. I paid a little less than sticker though. But like I said, it was my choice that I have to live with and that's all that matters that I am happy now.

But as far as the post 5717, it's totally inappropriate. Meade did make comments worse than that the other day, but that's someone I have known. I don't like it at all coming from strangers, and this time I will not be holding back my comments like I did the other day (as praised by ChicagoPro).

Meade, I know it was dumb to be going 110 in the car. You went 100 before though, and race all the time out of the toll gate. You also almost hit the toll gate because you were going 40 into the booth lane when the speed limit is 5. You posted that yourself a couple weeks ago. So don't throw stones when you live in a glass house, buddy.

mdaffron

He may literally be BURIED in this car!

Meade

vocus

Like I said in my last post, I don't think it's cute. And this time, I won't be as nice about my feelings either.

mdaffron

We're just playing with you.

Meade

Hey, by the way Paul, go over to the Cavalier topic and read what I just posted. Can you believe the manager of a dealership said that to me?!

black01coupev6

What did I say that was inappropriate? I stated a fact. You financed in and around $25,000 for the car. You are way upside down and will not be able to get out of the vehicle for a while. Those are facts. I didn't say anything about you personally or anything that I think could be considered inflammatory. I stated in post #5716 that my opinion is that there are better cars out there for the money but I also said that it's your money and you can spend it however you choose.

You also say you won't drive a used car, ever. You already are. As of the minute you drove that vehicle off of the dealer's lot you were in a used car. It's just another used Jetta now. Sorry.

mdaffron

Hee hee hee ...

Meade

(But really, both of you ... thanks for the nice defense/dittos over on the Cav topic.)

protege_fan

Just an article on witner tires I thought some may enjoy:

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/at_011101.htm

Interesting note about the Blizzaks; they only have half-depth siping.

PF

vocus

What I thought was inappropriate was that you had to kinda belittle my Jetta two times (the price and the rear suspension). It seems everyone has a congradulatory comment, then a kick in the face right behind it. Maybe I shouldn't come back to the Protege topic since I don't have one anymore.

dkozik

Hey folks--

A little late to the conversation, but I'd like to (briefly) share my CarMax experience for those who like them. I spent my summer on temporary duty in Washington, without a car (not really a problem thanks to the Metro), and looking forward to buying one when I came back to L.A. I figured that a CarMax might be a good, hassle-free place for me to go and test drive some of the cars I was looking at.

Anyways, I went to the Laurel, MD, CarMax, which is a used car/new Mitsu dealer. The salesperson was very pleasant to deal with, and I appreciated being able to sit down at the computer and search for the car on the lot.

Well, after getting a list of six or seven potential test-drives (to think I was actually thinking of getting a ZX2!), I went out into the lot. Not a *single* car that I had found on their computer was where it was supposed to be. After the fourth or fifth missing car, I gave up and decided to just start looking for any of the cars I was interested in. Every one I saw was a complete disaster inside-- trash, magazines, empties, you name it. I wondered if I was in the employee lot, but no, it was the sales lot; they didn't even bother cleaning up the used cars they got! It was disgusting.

Even after I found a few cars I thought I might be interested in, I would have to truck all the way back across the rather large lot to get the keys because there were no salespeople in the lot (on a Saturday afternoon!). Eventually, I just gave up and decided to do my searching elsewhere.

Now, I've heard that the Dulles CarMax is pretty nice, but I swear, the Laurel CarMax was so bad it made me wonder how they stay in business showing such disdain for their customers.

As for the Protege. . . some of you may remember I was on the fence concerning whether I'd buy a car here in L.A. and drive it to D.C., or wait until I get there to buy it. Well, I've decided to wait. I found a great deal from Budget on a rental car (Ford Ranger, $350 one-way unlimited miles, 9 days), so I'm gonna spring for that. I'll make back that amount on the difference in CA/VA sales tax alone, and plus I don't strain my brand new car by running up three to four thousand miles on the car the week after I buy it. And I still get to see the country!

DK

P.S. One last thing for all the MAPP folks-- which dealers in the DC Metro area accept S-plan pricing? I wrote an email asking that to Brown's Arlington and Alexandria (the "biggest in DC," or so they say), and all they told me (no joke), "the Protege is our best-selling car, come on in and see it!" Uh, I was asking about the S-plan, but thanks for sharing ;-)

protegenic

Enough with the Jetta, Paul and these theories of voodoo economics! It is ultimately Paul's decision, and whether we agree with it or not, it is none of our business.

Paul, there is a reason people keep their financial matters private (heck, my mother doesn't even know what I make!). When you provide information in a forum such as this, you open yourself up for criticism, for better or worse.

Hope you enjoy your Jetta. I personally like the GTI better, but I am becoming a hatchback kinda of guy (Mazda, are you listening?).

mdaffron

I think the answer to the concern in your first paragraph is answered in your second paragraph. Paul opened himself up for this. Anyone who would brag about buying a new car -- and then admit he paid an exhorbitant price for it -- is asking for comments. And isn't that what Town Hall is for? Sharing our otherwise private opinions with each other? If Paul's purchases are none of our business, then why are they being posted for us to read and comment on? When I make a post, I assume someone's going to reply. Isn't that why I make the post in the first place? If something's none of our business, then DON'T MAKE IT OUR BUSINESS!!!

(Besides, we enjoy making fun of Paul. He's so ... spankable.)

(And Paul knows I'm just pulling his leg. He's a big boy ... actually he's taller than most of us! I think we could all use a beer and a laugh together! 5:30, my place!)

Meade

protegenic

I totally agree and that was my point. While I am all for sharing info on our cars and other matters, and Town Hall is a great place to do so, we all have a line we draw on what information we are willing to share. I am not saying don't share any information as that would make this a boring place to visit. Paul probably shared a little more than in retrospect he probably wishes he did. I just think we should lighten up on the guy some.

vocus

Sorry, you are going to have to meet me halfway on that. How about around the area where we had the MAPP II?

vocus

I shared the price of the car and the payment because everyone kinda speculated anyway. I did learn one thing though: Not to trade cars so frequently. I am definitely going to keep this one for a good while. I am not going to say "drive it into the ground", because I know there will be something else I might want before the Jetta is dead. But I do plan to keep it at least 4 years or so.

maltb

"I did learn one thing though: Not to trade cars so frequently. I am definitely going to keep this one for a good while."

Reminds me of Bush Sr's "No New Taxes"

Maybe it's just better left unsaid. That way you can really shock us when you do manage to keep it for the term of the loan.

Sporin

Since you're on a "Driver's Option" you really don't have much choice but to keep it the full 4 years. Getting out of that plan early is never cheap.

Just dirve it and enjoy it and curb that wandering eye. There will always be somehting nicer, of faster, or whatever.

Enjoy.

mdaffron

Know what I miss, Paul? I miss your posts that were entitled, "Well ..."

I bring this up not to make fun of you; when you read all my stuff over on the Cavalier topic today, you undoubtedly read that I had gone back and searched through several hundred posts to find info on the head gasket problem. I came across quite a few of your "Well ..." posts last year, and had a good chuckle. Brought a tear to me eye, it did.

I think I'm finished on the Cavalier discussion anyway. My butt's red now too -- Dindak and I were yelling at each other so much, Pat just had to enter the foray and make us go sit in the corner. I tried to tell her it was all Dindak's fault, but all she said was, "You just WAIT until your father gets home!!!"

;-)

Meade

vocus

I am going to probably refinance the loan soon anyway, to drop the rate when my credit gets a little better. I am going to go through my credit union and refinance it at a cheaper rate.

protegenic

Ain't it the truth! Seems like I spend too much time researching things I know I won't get anytime soon, like cars, bikes, sailboats, etc. Ahh, it is good to be part of such a consumer driven society.

Meade, I'm surprised you retreated from any forum!

mdaffron

... and when to fold 'em.

Besides, I just got one more last word in there too. ;-)

Meade

(With apologies to Kenny Rogers)

nikecar

Vocus has a Jetta now? see you should have takenthe 2000 ES... :-)

I'm slightly jealous cuz that's the car I wanted in 99 but the warranty stunk and the price too much.. and $25K for the car? WOW...

anyways..

Question for the Mobil 1 Filter users out here since Maintenance forum is getting no answers...

I made the switch on our 00ES to Mobil 1 (just hit 10K BTW), and I got the Mobil 1 Filter too. But I noticed the filter (M1-108 i think) was smaller (height/lengthwise). Anyone else notice this?

Sporin

I got a Bosch filter for my P5. t is tiny, but no smaller then the ACDelco, Fram, or Mobil1 filters in teh store.

Can someone give me a DETAILED description of WHERE the oil filter is on the 2.0? I can't even find it.

mdaffron

... on the "Care and Maintenance" topic and didn't get an answer.

Hey you synth users! Any help for our old buddy Victor?

Meade

nikecar

surprised too... I was scared to come back here because there was over 1,000 posts staring at me so it kept getting bigger and bigger and before I knew it, 1,700 was there... so I skipped and read the last 80-100...

I had used Purolator last and it was longer than the Mobil 1. Would have tried the PureOne since I had it on my Alty, but it was at the store so I took it.

mdaffron

When was the last time you were here, Vic?

Meade

the_big_h

CHAT TONIGHT CHAT TONIGHT CHAT TONIGHT

9pm ET/6pm PT

elec3

That VW is now a pricey and somewhat upmarket brand? VW had its humble beginnings with a dream of making an automobile that was 1) cheap to build, 2) affordable to everyone, and 3) simple enough to run forever. Hence the name Volkswagen. It's literally German for people's car. I just think it's funny when most of their vehicles are $25k or more that they've strayed so far from their original goal. I guess they realized there's more money to be made in the market segment they're in now.

Re: Me being old soon. I'm 21 years of age but I've always been older than my age. I'm actually responsible (god forbid), have impeccable credit, am attending school over 1500 miles from home (which means for the most part I'm on my own). I'll probably have a few years to enjoy my income, so to speak, but that depends largely on whether I get married or remain single and whether I can hold off on graduation long enough for the tech. job market to pick up again

Confidential to Meade: Yep, you're ancient. Probably lost your hip and cool quotient already and well over halfway to becoming your father That's what kids do to you, or so I've been told. Still, I'd join you for a beer were I not thousands of miles away

fowler3

If you buy a sailboat don't try to trailer it behind a frontwheel drive car. The weight on the hitch will raise the driving wheels off the ground when you are on a launching ramp.

Sailing is great though, no noise, no fuel bills. You can't imagine the excitement at 7mph! Really!
It's the closest thing to flying an airplane. I've done both.

fowler3

fowler3

The reason VW is more expensive is due to the exchange rate between the dollar and the German Mark, plus import tarifs.

And that many buyers are now demanding more luxuries in even compact cars. It has gotten harder to define true luxury cars as opposed to family sedans and compacts, since most of them have power windows, locks, mirrors, AT, AC, alloy wheels, moonroofs, and keyless entry.

Take all those things off and you will have the "peoples' car" again. Plus a smaller engine without turbocharging, vinyl seats, and no variable windshield wipers.

When VW introduced the New Beetle it wasn't the same as the original model, it came loaded with modern goodies and reflected that in its price.

VW cars cost just as much in Germany, if not more.

fowler3

newcar31

The oil filter is mounted on the intake side of the engine, underneath the intake manifold, just above the axle on the passenger side of the car. You need to get it from underneath and unless you are VERY skinny, you will need to get it off the ground. If it is the first oil change, you will need a claw style oil filter wrench because the factory really wrenches those things on. After the first oil change, you should be able to get it off with your hand.

roger57

Just noticed a strong gas odor from our 2002 Protege ES. Not while running, but sitting in garage after a 300 mile trip. Even a full day later, smell is noticeable. Finally had to back it out and put it in driveway to alleviate the odor.

Nothing else in garage to cause this problem. Any ideas?

Thanks

ps- otherwise we love this little car!

protege_fan

I know that the Tributes had a recall because there was a problem with the intake manifold and that caused a gas odour. I'm not sure what the problem here would be....the 02's are basically the same as the '01's. Maybe somebody else here has an idea....
Glad you like the car!!

Protege_fan

black01coupev6

I think the entire auto industry is going upmarket now. Leather in a Hyundai Elantra? That makes no sense. But on the plus side, todays economy cars have the same features as yesterdays nice cars which means you don't have to feel like you are driving a penalty box. I just hope the manual tranny outlives the trend towards the sportshift automatics.

elec: I am 22 and feel like I am 30. Don't know if that's good or bad.

protegenic

Fowler, don't worry. If I got a boat it would just be a dinghy and I would leave it on a dolly at a yacht club. I've had it with towing and rigging. Actually I sold my last boat several years ago and bought some windsurfing stuff. What a rush when you start planing! Also a lot easier to throw my gear on a roof rack than towing anything. Too bad there is no wind here in Atlanta. Oh well, Hatteras is only about 9 hours away...

dinu01

The article made a great point: "The cost of even a small accident is much higher than the price of a set of winter tires."

I think that's what it's all about. With a $500 deductible, I think the choice is fairly clear (for myself at least).

Interesting point about the Blizzaks and their thread depth! So I guess it's between the Artic Alpins and Assimetricos.

dinu01

I bought my PRO ES 2.0 mid-July 2001. Is now has 15500 kms on it! I'm on pace for 48000/yr and honestly FREAKING OUT! It's about 130 kms/day! I drive the same distances I used to drive in my old Civic. I put gas in it once every 5 days, which is more than I used to with the Civic (but that was a 1.5 -vs- 2.0).

The only answer I have is that the odometer is not properly calibrated. Has anyone noticed any increase in mileage with the Pros over their previous car(s)?

PS: I did factor-in the ZOOM-ZOOM factor (go for a drive just b/c it's so fun to drive it).

Any ideas would be appreciated.

Dinu

By the way: PLEASE, LET'S DROP THE JETTA ISSUE. THE CAR IS BOUGHT, COMMENTS WERE MADE, EVERYONE HAS THEIR OPINION. LET'S FOCUS ON THE PROTEGES! B/C IT'S ALL ABOUT ZOOM-ZOOMING!