Toyota Tundra Problems

losangelesemt

I couldn't be happier to hear the good news. I throw out the carsdirect.com out to anyone I see in here who's open minded to the different avenues. Myself, I was trying to slip into a V-6 ext cab with a decent amount of options, and carsdirect had it for 18K and change. My lowest dealer price was right around 20K. Like I said before, their invoice price seems to be even lower than the lowest of dealers' invoices, which is only a plus in the end.

Sounds like you got a smokin deal, I honestly don't know too many other places period where you could have made out better, without spending weeks to find them. The no haggle buying is quite nice for some of us who know what we want, and just want to get on with the deal and into our new trucks. Your summary of the carsdirect operation is pretty accurate. Best of luck and many great experiences ahead !!!

BTW - What part of Wash are you in ??? A buddy and I are looking into fire departments up there, I've never been there, he went 2 weeks ago and was quite happy. After all like we say, if you've survived the black hole (L.A.) , then you can make it anywhere.

drgo

I now live in Southern Cal again after a 4.5 year hiatus. Prior to my current residence, I was in Seattle training. Seattle is lovely but you've got to be able to handle the rain. During the El Nino of 98, it rained for 98 days straight. There was a period of 3 weeks of nonstop hard rain. You've got to be able to handle that. During the fall,spring, and especially winter, you've got to get your boots and foul weather gear on, go out to the coffee shop,fill up on that latte before doing other stuff, i.e ski, fish, boat, etc... The key is to not stay at home cleaning your sawed off shotgun. Some people pop Prozac.

Craig

losangelesemt

Man I think you were better off up there Craig. If you're talking southern Cal as in L.A. area, I hope you know what you're getting into lol. Although the new truck will come in handy in all the traffic at times. Not too many places for fishing down here anyways, even the man-made stuff is rare. Well I'll still keep Washington in mind as second place to Colorado. Anywhere has to be better than here, place is out of control and only getting worse. Not to mention L.A. took first place for the worst air in the nation for the umpteenth year ... sheesh

Cheers

lariat1

So Cal is fine when you get away from the cities I miss heading out on I-8 and mountain biking 365 days a year, but I was in San Diego not LA.
Washington is my second choice to live. I had a lot of fun when I was stationed a Bangor. I can say I am one of the few people that have caught a steelhead in Washinton on a flyrod, granted it was not intentional and we thought we were going to jail when we realized what the fish was. Also there is some awsome off road trails in the Olympics our favorite thing to do was see if we could get from the Sound side to the Pacific side of the penninsula in my old 94 Ranger.

drgo

The Penninsula is an incredibly beautiful place. I used to go surfing up there at the Makah Nation reservation. I do miss all the outdoor activities up there. While people do like to beat up on LA, there are alot of intangibles like cultural diversity which I appreciate, especially since I went to UCLA. Then again, we are coming up on the 10th anniversary of the riots.

On another note, has anyone had any trouble with the cargo light draining the battery? I'm thinking about disabling my light for fear of such an event. Guess I haven't used my truck enough. Been working too hard.

I appreciate the subwoofer advice. While I'm no audiophile, the 6 speaker system lacks a bit of fullness in the sound. The subwoofer should do nicely. What was the model again? What did yall think about my carsdirect.com posting? Informative?

Craig

twowheeler

its the JL Stealth sub that fits under the center armrest (captain chair option). You can also install a 10" sub under the right side passenger seat in the back for some good thumpin. Checkout www.tundrasolutions.com for additional Tundra audio/video stuff (installation pics, etc.). I would have liked to get the Stealthbox but I have the front bench seat. So I'll have to go with the 10" in the back.

I haven't had any probs with the cargo light draining the battery but I'm sure I will now since I mentioned it.

plutonious

"Not to mention L.A. took first place for the worst air in the nation for the umpteenth year ... sheesh"

Actually, now Houston in the "great" state of Texas takes top honors for the worst air. I'm sure the fact everybody with their big trucks and big egos has something to do with that...

losangelesemt

Hey I was thinkin of getting the bench seat over the chairs, cause every truck Ive had, had the bench. Anything you dont like about the Tundra bench ??? Have the captains chairs in the ambulance and I guess they're nice. But suppose a guy wanted to stop on Santa Monica Blvd. at night and find a little sidewalk company, the bench makes things a little easier to work with lol. Of course thats not my reasoning for the bench, but its hard to get the g/f to sit next to ya with the captains.

losangelesemt

Try this one

http://aolsvc.health.webmd.aol.com/content/article/1728.78753?page=2

Also (Note Health Section)

http://money.cnn.com/best/bplive/details/LOSAN_CA.html

plutonious

I guess it just depends on your sources. This is interesting:

http://www.foeaction.org/Page4-txpollution.htm

http://www.rep.org/news/ge4_GWB%20Report.htm

losangelesemt

Very true about the sources. At this point, I'd vote for either one lol. Both are places I don't wish to spend anymore time in. Plus I'd be afraid my Tundra would be choking on all the smog here, might lose 100hp right there.

texboy2

Has anyone experienced any paint problems with their Tundra? I just bought a 2002 and the hood has started to have small flakes of paint missing on the hood. It doesn't look like rock chips because the edge of the paint looks like it has blistered. The damaged area is well covered by the hood protector. It's a great truck except for the paint.

twowheeler

Well, your both right. Houston has the worst ozone pollution problem, but I believe the South Coast Air Basin in the LA area is still #1 for other pollutants such as Particulate Matter, Carbon Monoxide, only to name a few (check the EPA.gov site).

LAEMT - the bench is just fine for me; I prefer it for the versatility (in the vertical or horizontal positions) and the center armrest, which flips back when you need the space in the middle, is great. The bench is a 60/40 split so the driver's seat adjust independent of the other section. The only thing as mentioned is I can't put a JL Stealth sub in the center pod. Well, not that I totally need it anyways, I'm getting too old to spend big bucks on a sound system. Save it for the young-ens.

How's the search in Colorado going? Have you and Quad settled on the room for rent price yet?!

quadrunner500

What can I say? I got an offer sheet on my house from a guy from L.A. He even drives a Ranger. How's that for coincidence? If he tells me he's buying a tindra, I'll tear up the contract! Closing on June 27th. New one won't be ready until September. For about 2 months, I'll be a homeless person too! EMT and I can share rent! LOL!

drgo

I made a not so minor error in my previous posting. Costco offered the car for $569 MORE FOR LESS OPTIONS than carsdirect.com. The carsdirect.com fleet manager treated me fine. The other guy saw me as a young guy in shorts and didn't give me as much consideration. Too bad he didn't know that I'm an anesthesiologist! The guy has called me to check up on whether or not I've decided. Should I let him know the whole truth?

Craig

davecrook1

Interesting article in Forbes magazine dated 4/29 concerning internet purchasing/research of new vehicles. Includes mention of a new site (www.FightingChance.com)which appears interesting-perhaps I'll use it next time as I just committed to a new Tundra which I had order built. In any event,am looking for suggestions as to whether I should get after market running boards. How necessary are they? If so,what type and from whom?Thanks. BTW-For those in the Northeast,if you're looking for a Tundra from a dealer who will show you ALl his cost figures (Floor planning,invoice,holdback,incentives,etc.)talk to Paul St.Hillaire at Berlin City Toyota in Gorham,NH. Not only were they the ONLY dealer (of over 6 contacted)who would order build,but they sold it for 3.04% over they're TRUE cost(i.e.invoice adjusted for such items as factory to dealer rebate,floorplanning cost,holdback,etc.)Very low key and willing to share anything I requested. They also seem to have a lot in stock though I did not order from stock.

ventolar

My 2001 Tundra has numerous fine scratches on the windshield. I have cleaned it the same way I have cleaned windshields for years. I also have several
paint blisters on the roof. The paint appears to be releasing from the primer. Anyone having similar problems? If so, what have you done?

losangelesemt

Boy you better write down the time and date of your truck transaction for future Guiness consideration lol. Thats one in a million almost that a dealer could be so upfront about sharing business costs and so on. After I read that, I knew it definitely wasn't a Southern California dealer, thats for sure. Out here we have road rage, dealer rage, you name it. Figures it would have to be in NH, but hey at least its nice to know that there's still some sense of humanity left on this planet. Good luck with the future truck.

CRAIG - Hey I think you should get a hold of that guy and tell him in true L.A. style that his deal sucked and you were tempted by the fruit of another. It wouldnt exactly be the first time someone from L.A. found themselves amid uncontrolling temptation lol. Maybe just to make him feel even worse, you can tell him that his price was like $4000 higher than the place you went with lol.

losangelesemt

Well it looks like Quad already made me out. I was trying to sneak in a offer on his house without being too forthcoming. I really hope he doesn't tear the contract when he finds out the guys trying to buy a Tundra lol. Well at least if we both end up homeless, he can sleep in his truck. Ever tried to sleep in the front seat of a 2wd std cab Ranger lol.

Im heading out there first of August to take quite a few tests for fire depts. so we'll see what happens. But hey I need your advice here ... Do you think that the Colorado people are going to welcome me with open arms when I pull into town in a Tundra that has a Honda motorcycle in back lol. Well no Hondas yet, and I really think I'm gonna have to wait and get the Tundra at John Elway Toyota ya know. Maybe they'll throw in season tickets. I do think Quad was talking about going in 3 ways for a new house, so get your stuff my friend. Quads worst nightmare ... having 2 Tundra's in his driveway at any given time ... Yikes.

draymond2

Thanks for all of the great info on cardirect.

twowheeler

I'm game. Quad, actually, EMT lent me the Ranger to drive to your house (for fear that if you saw the Tundra, you'd shutdown) and I was the one that made the offer (nice house). I can't wait any longer. I need to get in before June 27. I'll throw in a ride around the block in my Tundra to seal the deal! Whatya say?

EMT - Tundra + Honda bike + Colorado lifestyle = trade-in for Ford or Chevy 1-ton with 12-inch lift and big mudders & $50K in debt. I don't know EMT, you should just stop resisting, throw in the towel and get the knockerado. Go easy on yourself!

I'm pondering selling off the street bike cause it sits now. No time to ride and enjoy on a regular basis. Anyone interested in buying an '89 Kawasaki ZX10 Ninja? I need the money to buy a supercharger (or Nitrous) for the Tundra so I can keep up with Quad's Monster.

I guess I'll need to change my name to no-more-streetbike-wheeler or something.

twowheeler

It's funny that some salespeople in general don't give some of us that look young and cashless the time of day. I get that all the time cause I look at least 10 years younger than I am. When that happens, I just bypass those idiots and get someone that will service me. And like you, my looks don't mean I'm poor. It means I probably make alot more than the sales person.

quadrunner500

You'll need turbo-supra to even breath the air near my 6 spd, 32 valve, 300 hp, 520 lb/ft turbocharged, intercooled, especially at 14,000 ft.

How about a rent-back on the house for (2) months? LOL!

losangelesemt

so i'll just have to bring my moped out there. That should keep up, maybe I should turbocharge it just to play it safe.

Wheels - I dont know if you want to be borrowin that Ranger ... Man get this, I've had this Ranger for 6 years now. Got it with 18,000 miles on it, was a previous lease vehicle. The dealer tells me the oil was changed 2 or 3 times in the 18,000 miles. So I get a hold of the thing lol ... Well what started out as somewhat of a silly bet, soon turned into a personal mission. I didn't change the oil until 50,000 on the clock. So it went 35,000 with no change, no biggie right lol.

So today it hits 99k and change, and I personally have only changed the oil once !!! Its gone 100,000 on 3 changes I think. Although, I AM at that recommended 50K interval again, and I'm actually getting the itch to change the oil again, hmmmm. I've spent a few years rebuilding engines, and the thing shows no signs of damage from lack of changes. Gonna have to keep driving it until it kicks off. Have to take it deep into the Rockies and break the thing. Will Elway Toyota take a broke down Ford though ???

Just got home from Venice. Put in 250 miles today on L.A. freeways and it only took 10 hours straight through, imagine that. Maybe traffic IS getting better.

BTW ... Go in halves on a knocker ???

bamatundra

It is a good thing you will never have to take that land barge of yours off-road. You would grow tired of watching Tundra tail-lights disappearing into the distance.

Your truck has a Japanese engine and a German transmission? How did Chev dare to put its name on it? Is it because the rest of the truck is a POS?

Good Luck on this one now!

twowheeler

I don't think that a supra-turbo would even do it. You truck is just too superior. Maybe my bike can keep up? Nah! can't even try, I might crash attempting to due to the air turbulence your truck would create behind you. Maybe if I get a 1/4 mile headstart then maybe... Rent back sounds good. It's yours for $5k/mo plus a non-refundable $3k deposit. Sold.

LAEmt - Nice day today for a stroll at the Venice beach. Any good site seeing? I think I'd go in half in the Shaker if I get to drive it the first 25k since you only change the oil on rare occasion. But then maybe the extra thickness of the sludgey oil would help the knocking? Hmmmm....

losangelesemt

Lol wheels ... Actually was down there visiting a nutrionist, so no sight seeing on the beach today. Whats funny though, is all the radio stations were bragging about how it was such a nice day, yet the smog coverd the hollywood sign, and you could hardly even make out the ocean lol. But hey, maybe it WAS a nice day, couldnt tell ya cause I couldnt see anything.

Hey Quad ... maybe you wouldn't mind towing my Ranger when it breaks down out there, over to the Elway lot so the two of us can sit down and look at some 03 Tundra's. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting you to buy one too, just go in halves with me. I mean after all, you guys are said to be more wholesome and sharing people, so the hospitality would be appreciated. It's the least you could do to show us L.A. guys how to share and love again lol. Could use a room too if ya have one, make that 2 of us.

quadrunner500

Burt Ford is right next to John Elway Toyota! We can drop the Ranger off, and shop for tindras while 2-Wheeler gets his supercharger put on. (I think his money would be better spent getting valve lash service, new timing belts, water pump, and the TRD rear disc brake kit.) Of course, without the Ninja to haul around, who needs a tindra?

I'd consider a Zx-10, but I already got rid of a '94 Zx-11. Too uncomfortable at my age. My GSXR1100 was worse. The Zx11 was stiff, handled well but too heavy, lost time in the corners. Once I got passed by the turbo-Volvo in the twisties, my mind was made up to get rid of it. That never happened with the GSXR, but it wasn't as strong or fast, though it had the handle. The bike I should have kept was the Yamaha FJ1100. Not quite as fast, but very comfortable even for long rides. Hated the 16 inch front wheel. If I could find a clean FJ1200 with 17 inch front, I'd be tempted. These days, I maximize the fun off-road on a KTM 520 EX/C. Pretty much sworn off street bikes. (Until I find the magic FJ1200)

I would hope tindra is better off-road given the size. A mega-mothership is for delivering the payload, the KTM gets the off-road part done.

bamatundra

About the only thing I hear you say about that Yugo Shakerado of yours is how big it is. Are you feeling just a little insecure? It is OK, we care - but buying a big truck does not make YOU any bigger.

I hope you can understand. Try and post to "Mah HUGE Shakerado" topics instead. You will get a warm reception there.

I know that you got burned on that Lemonado of yours, but that doesn't give you the right to make a pest of yourself in Tundra topics.

I think that we should all hope that Runny finally sees the light. He is certainly a troubled soul. His anger about buying a Chev is certainly showing through.

Let's all try to support this troubled individual. It is not his fault that he bought a Chev. He just bought into the "Like a crock" advertising.

twowheeler

But the long awaited FJ1300 is coming out to North America next year (I think that's what its called)! I'm not much for the pretzel position on streetbikes either, and the zx10 is pushing it for me, unless I'm on the twisty Angeles Crest Highway or doing 75-80 up the interstate (the air pressure helps take the strain off my wrists at that speed). But I do drool over the new Gixxer 1000 and the new R1. Pieces of art in IMO. When the Ninja is gone, I'll still have the PE175 and the XL600 to fall back on. Nice vintage type bikes for mild play and around town putting.

I'll meet you guys at JE Toyota after you and LAEMT finish up at Burt Ford. But are you sure the Chev can make it there? You'd better bring your cell phone just in case. Call me if the Chev breaks down and I'll come get you (after the charger and nitrous install).

bamatundra

This is the bike that I have been lusting over.

http://www.hondamotorcycle.com/models/2002/index.html?model_number=RVT1000R

 I would buy one, but I am afraid that the torque and horsepower would be dangerous for me and my driver's license. I currently have a BMW K75S which is a bit underpowered, but is very smooth and reliable. I will be selling it soon because I just don't have much time to ride anymore.

plutonious

ever post anything to do with Tundra problems here??? Oh well, lack of subject content is a good thing. I rest my case...

twowheeler

Yeah, that Honda twin is a good one. I think it won the World Superbike championship last year or the year before. 175-185 hp in race trim, I understand. Whoa! Beamers are pretty darn reliable, I'd say. Is yours the 3-cylinder model?

How many miles on your Tundra? I'll only be breaking 1,000 tomorrow (I only work about 1.5 miles from home - a rarity in LA)and will be doing the break in oil change this weekend. What kind of oil and filter do you use?

quadrunner500

When I think of all the street bikes I've had, the FJ1100 was never at the top performance wise, except that the performance it did have was accompanied with excellent ergos, a centerstand, easy to service, good wind protection, very good cornering clearance, excellent high speed stability, broad power and strong rush to the peak. It's flaws...somewhat grabby brakes, needed more undercut on second gear, (could pop out under hard accell on bumps), puffed blue smoke on start-up even when new (but ran great), 16 inch front wheel, along with cold tires could be (and was) unforgiving on more than one occasion. (Early lessons in skin graft, fairing replacement and paint matching)

quadrunner500

That GSXR1000 is supposed to run in the nines at something like 148 mph through the traps. The 1st year Hayabusa went 194 mph before the mfrs quietly introduced speed limiters thereafter. The Hayabusa would be my kind of bike, but again too bent over on the riding position.

Just curious...with the kind of performance even your Zx-10 is capable of, how could a supercharged Tundra even remotely stir the passions? Even on a remote rural two-lane at 165 mph on Zx-11, (several times) I never felt the gratification was worth the risk of going to jail. All it took was a twist of the wrist, holding it open for a few seconds, no particular skill. I found much more satisfaction (and challenge) trying to maintain a 24 mph enduro pace. 100 mph on the dirt, and no radar guns. Grab some air!

twowheeler

Is the closest I've come to crashing at really high speed on a bike while once taking a trip through AZ on the way to the Grand Canyon- on my then Honda V65 Sabre(i.e. Hmmm...I think I'll open her up and see what she'll do). Wobbles began at 120 then was getting too dangerous at around 135 where I promptly backed off. Whew! Great and comfortable long distance bike though. Yeah, going to jail or getting a really expensive ticket is always in the back of my mind when she spools past about 100. Its all too easy on an open classer. I'm sure much more so on a modern bike. Dirt bikes definitely require more skill and it is extremely fun rippin around on some wooded forest trails and climbing vertical hills or getting a good 6 feet of air. None of that X-game stuff for this old boy.

The Tundra will be the last to receive (engine)mods. My (relatively) low mileage, original owner'd, '91 5.0 will receive the blower shortly after I sell the bike. Maybe I'll be joining you and LAEMT at Burt Ford after all, LOL. Not up to the level of acceleration of sport bikes but, It'll have to do for now. Hoping to eventually get in the mid 12's with the stang.

Too bad about the Busa getting a muzzle. The Kaw ZX12 was just about to show some teeth, when it got a muzzle before it's release for general sale. I think they're both limited to about 184-185 mph now. I'm sure though, that it's in the electronics and the chip can be remapped/replaced for max power and speed.

sonjaab

Toy boys afraid to post problems here !
Check out www.tundrasolutions.com
Read the truth over there !
Cold start knock, brakes, peeling paint
and so on !
So lets be fair and talk FISHIN'....geo

BTW: got my 78 Triumph Bonneville outta
the barn. Runs awesome ! I sure miss my
75 Norton 850 Commando.........
nothing sounds sweeter than a Brit bike

themailman1

I have most of those problems on my 2001 tundra and I am currentlyplanning on trading it in on an f250 diesel. I really thought that this truck could last 200-300k miles like the older ones but I am now questioning toyota's durability with the use on tacoma parts on the tundra. It is a good truck don't get me wrong but the paint is a mm thick, my tranny sometimes shifts up too early, engine knock on cold start, not a true full size, my rear suspension is now making weird noises like something is broken, dash squeeks. Not to mention the lack of low end torque, getit to 2500 rpm you a re good to go but under that you are lacking.If I have to keep this truck for financial reasons I wouldn't be mad but I know I have work to do to get it to where the perfromance should be.As for toy owners not posting problems is cause like any other brand loyalist they stick up for the one they own.

bamatundra

Aren't you just a little confused? Your profile says that you own a 2001 GMC Sierra 1500. Another GM boy joins the Tundra topic!

plutonious

kg11

Cold start knock,small 4.7 or 4.8 gas engine.If he want's a 3/4 ton diesel he bought the wrong truck.I've driven all the 1/2 tons and the differences are pretty small.
I have to admit though,I would like to hear the real story but then YOUR profile don't say anything at all.

kip

quadrunner500

>Is the closest I've come to crashing at really high speed on a bike while once taking a trip through AZ on the way to the Grand Canyon- on my then Honda V65 Sabre<

On the long downhill out of Flagstaff? See! Speed trap!

Your Zx-10 won't wobble. V65's did. (Course they had torque like nothing else.) I had an '83 GS1100E that gave me a tank slapper at 130...not something I'll forget.

Your 5.0L LX could conceivably get into or near the high 12's without a blower, just gears, cold air intake, traction.

BTW, no X-games for me either...

losangelesemt

We'll I'm gonna give you the benefit of the doubt and just say that you do actually own a Tundra. I think the complaints you've listed are valid and acknowledged by many. No the truck isn't as big as the others. Yes there has been documentation of cold start knocks, but most of which dont last more than 10-15 seconds.

The paint seems to be a problem, not sure what the reason is. Sounds like Toyota may have cheaped out and skimped a little on the thickness, or quality of paint, but who knows. Since you have doubts about the truck making it past 200K+, how many miles are on truck now ??? I personally wouldn't count the truck out based on the few complaints you've listed. The cold knock will have little effect on the engine if it only occurs for a few seconds.

The paint, interior squeaks, and rattles to me are unacceptable, especially the paint problem. In this day and age, peeling paint should NOT be a concern of new vehicles, especially ones that are only a few years old. Interior noises seem apparent among even the best of cars. They're quite a pain to troubleshoot and pretty annoying.

As far as Toy owners not posting due to loyalness ... well I disagree. First off, the other threads like GMC/Chev/Ford have plenty of posts and I'm sure there are plenty of loyalists there. Honestly, I don't think enough people visit this Toyota Problems forum to even post if they DID have problems. Secondly, I just don't think people are having tons of problems with this truck. Its only been around a few years and many problems are yet to develop, and Toyota does a pretty decent job making quality, reliable autos. I don't believe that there's many people at all who come in here and bother not to post problems, because they love their truck too much.

Very easy for this topic to get off track, because the actual Tundra Problems are just so few, not much to say in here otherwise.

bamatundra

I disagree - if the poster's profile says GM 1500 Lemonado and the poster is bashing Tundras, I would say that something is rotten in Denmark! ObywannaTundra owns a Lemon 1500 GM Sierra. Do you think that Oby changed over to Tundra bashing?

You would think that he would at least change his profile! Oh, well - the Chev boys are going to inhabit this topic regardless. You would think that they would be just a little bit smarter about it.

losangelesemt

Like I say, I'm giving the benefit of doubt that this person has even sat in a Tundra before. Am I necessarily convinced that something isn't rotten in Denmark ??? ummm no. Well shoot, I guess since there's so few actual problems with the truck, people might have to resort to fabricating complaints to keep this topic going, who knows.

I know sometimes people have other trucks than whats listed, but I'm not expecting a GM owner to come in here and give the Tundra a fair shake.

bamatundra

I don't get it! A GM 1500 Lemonado owner (Check Mailboy's profile) posts claiming to own a lemon Tundra. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to conclude that Lemonado owners are posing as lemon Tundra owners in this topic. What am I missing?

losangelesemt

Maybe its truthteller in yet another disguise, or farminchev, rube, you name it lol.

sonjaab

NO....libby speaks his mind under his
own name...Untill the hosts shut him off.
but everybody has their own opinions.

BTW; why do non tundra owners post here ?
and yes I am guilty too !
check out www.tundra solutions.com

losangelesemt

Well I must say, the country theme to the various postings raises doubts in my mind, but I can respect ALL of the opinions nonetheless. Hey, how come no sandwiches lately, haven't been doing much fishing this week ??? Pluto and I are going to famine down here already.

Cheers

sonjaab

Cool by me bro. Community clean up
day today in Alexandria Bay NY.
Gotta help out and get ready for
those $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and
happy tourists............Geo

BTW: everybody afraid to fly so
its gonna mean car trips. Many
tourists sleeping at my motel !