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Comments
Did anyone see the commercial that shows the CTS driving so fast that it glows? It then stops at a intersection and you hear the car cooling off and it returns to the white color. Gets your attention!
They didn't show enough of the CTS, but it was cool to see. I hear it will be front and center in the new Matrix movie coming soon.
The bmw has sports car 'taut' suspension. It's tighter, but not at all jarring. You can just feel that it's excellent. The CTS also has a comfortable firm sport feel, but delivers a smoother ride. Of course, it's a heavier car. It's a nice change actually. Feels very in control, but I haven't played with the car at all yet either. Both cars are well balanced. The bmw offers more of a true sports car response and feedback steering feel to it by a margin, but the CTS feels tight and smooth. If you haven't logged much time in one of bmw's award winning chassis, the CTS will feel excellent. To me, the CTS is 'very good', with the bmw rating as 'excellent'. The weight difference shows here. I was running Yokohama AVS's on 17's on the coupe in the summer, and Blizzak lm22's in snow, so it was a sticky ride. So far, I like the stock CTS rubber for being all season. They'll be just fine until it's time to replace. In terms of Stabilitrak, the bmw's DSC- dynamic stability control worked well. I haven't felt the CTS' cut in or out, so I can't say. I think most high end models are up to speed in what they offer in this regard.
Along with the suspension, steering, and rubber, when it comes to ride, one pleasant surprise is that the CTS sport seats are everything the bmw sport seats are. One minor item they don't have is an additional thigh bolster that can be pulled out if desired, but the side bolsters, positioning, and firmness is very nice and compares as an equal. I think interior ergonomics is good in both cars. They both feel good to me. Once adjusted, you fit real well into the bmw. I happen to fit real well in the CTS also. There is more room, but I still prefer the enveloping cockpit feel, and the CTS delivers a comfortable 'drive me' cabin. One detail the CTS excels in is front shoulder belt placement. The bmw coupe's were a long awkward reach. You got used to it, but it was never easy. Steering wheel controls are welcome again, with the CTS reflecting its newness by offering more functions. The CTS's climate control package is far superior to the bmw's in all aspects and additionally offers dual controls. A glaring omission in the CTS is the lack of a temp gauge. Overall, in addition to being newer and more programmable, I like the total CTS controls and instrumentation package better than what's in the 3 series. The CTS audio is also clearly better than the bmw's cd system. We'll see how everything holds up.
Power plants are a different matter. The bmw is a clear winner, with the CTS an admirable second place. It wins out stock, and even stronger with the couple of Dinan mods. There's three main reasons why the others target bmw 3's and 5's in their segments- handling, brakes, and engines. The CTS feels like it could track real well, and I'm comfortable saying that it exceeds my personal capabilities at speed, S-track off of course, so for me that's a wash. But the engine...well, the bimmer is the benchmark. The inline six is ultra smooth, powerful, and just begs to be run all the way to redline. The CTS engine feels great (@300 miles), but you can just 'tell' that it's not as strong or refined. But hey, everyone loses to the bmw six so that's not too bad. The CTS auto trans seems smooth. I haven't pushed beyond 4k rpm yet or been aggressive, so right now I can't judge how it compares against the bmw steptronic in either regular or sport mode. The CTS sport brakes with their hi-perf pads feel solid, very safe, and like they could stop the car in a true sports car like manner. They are not quite up to the bmw's, but keep in mind that the bmw is a lighter coupe with bigger rotors, calipers, and soft rubber. It flat stops. Period.
I received many compliments on my coupe--bright red, fact spoiler, sport pkg. I have already received a few on my CTS. Have to say though, the CTS seems to be a love it or hate it style, whereby the bmw was more universally accepted.
That's all I have for now. More as I think of it.
The classic example of using pricing to gain attention and market share in this segment happened in 1990 with the introduction of the Lexus LS400. In time of recession in the US and Mercedes raising the cost of a S class to 50 grand, Toyota launches a luxury brand with a hokey name that has no reputation whatsoever. But they price their car at $36,000, far below the competition. Mercedes owners started taking a chance on the deal and found out that it was a nice car, better in many ways than their old S classes. Lexus isn't as price competitive any more since they don't need to be, but they are still cheaper than an S class or a BMW 7 series.
That strategy has been mimicked by Infiniti. Up until now, they have not been able to break out of Lexus' shadow with a disastrous product launch in 1990 and good, but not great products ever since. So when they introduced the G35, they made sure that not only was the product capable, but that the price was irresistable. It's easy to leave an Infiniti dealership with a well-optioned G35 and only spend $35K. A well optioned CTS costs $38k and higher. A well optioned BMW 330i is even higher.
When you're behind in the market and the perception is that you must prove yourself, proper pricing becomes a valuable tool in attracting buyers to further increase credibility. You may have the best product going, but if no one buys it since they see little incentive on changing from the market leaders, then you will likely fail. CTS pricing is less than the leader (BMW), but not equal to that Infiniti or Acura (the TL is the best bargain in the class). Lincoln has a similar problem.
Truth be told, Lincoln has a bigger problem. Only the LS can reasonably go up against the luxury imports these days. The old Continental was a joke (and was mercifully killed) and the Town Car is just a livery vehicle...no DTS version. Lincoln has to try to tell their story with one mid-sized vehicle...not a good position to be in. Your only other options is to cross over to Ford's other products (Jaguar, Volvo). At least Cadillac has a product line strategy to compete.
The CTS will feel heavier because it is! Larger, more 5 series dimensions means the CTS is about 300 lbs heavier than your old car (but almost identical in weight to a 530i). Come to think of it, whenever a car magazine does a handling comparison test, everyone always invites the M3, but no one invites the M5. Despite the gobs of horsepower, the M5 is 600 heavier than an M3, which makes a big difference when you are cutting cones and circling the track.
As far as the engine goes, well, no one would disagree with your assessment. Inline sixes are the smoothest way to package 6 cylinders by far. I'm still surprised that Mercedes abandoned their straight-sixes for V6s some years ago. My best compliment for the CTS' engine is that the torque curve is pretty broad, and available at low revs. It does a pretty good job of giving what it has to offer.
Have fun with your new ride and continue to let the community here know what you think.
And I'm not sure most import luxury buyers would consider the DTS or STS to be true competition. They're closer than a Town Car for sure, but not close enough. Caddy and Lincoln both need NEW products (RWD) to successfully compete with the imports. Caddy's only advantage right now is $$$. Ford just doesn't have the cash to invest in new platforms.
E320 530iA LS V6 A6 3.0
E500 540iA LS V8 A6 4.2
On the smaller side you have
C230 325i A4 2.5 Xtype 2.5
C320 330i A4 3.0 Xtype 3.0
I agree the CTS is somewhere in between the first and second groups.
And by the way - car magazines are some of the most biased sources of data you can find. They're good for entertainment and to get specs but I wouldn't take them as anything more.
You also need to have a clear understanding of what kind of car you are looking for too. I bought the SLS because it was a good deal and is not far off the mark as to what I wanted. FWD is good on ice and snow and we have that here. Also have a good sized trunk, the LS had a shallow trunk - but fold down read seat was good.
Three words: K-Mac camber plates.
Yes, the CTS has a better chassis design, but I doubt a CTSv would get me to sign the check. The CTS shape didn't appeal to me much to begin with and the more I see it the less I like it.
We're not talking huge numbers here - a couple inches longer than the E39 5-series, a couple inches shorter than the LS - but then the G35 and Passat (the real 'tweeners') are only 3 inches shorter than the 5-series.
The CTS brochure is much improved this year, but it would be nice to see more of a color variation.
First, I would say that the G35 is a direct competitor to the CTS and the LS. The interior might be a little downmarket compared to a BMW (and the wood package is downright laughable), but they spent their money in the right places (chassis, engine).
Second, if you compare the CTS and LS against the 530i or E320, then yes, they are resonably priced. But for some reason, the CTS ends up always getting compared to smaller competitors. Of course, Cadillac and Lincoln may not care just what they are being compared to as long as they are invited to comparison tests.
But I have to take one issue with the LS. The LS is admittedly a large car for the class. It's three inches longer in wheelbase than the 530i. It's longer in length, width, you name it. And it still manages to be the same weight. And if you directly compare the interior dimensions, the LS seems like a large car.
But the LS doesn't seem like a large car to me at all. Maybe it's because the legroom of the LS (and the Jag S-type) sucks. I don't care what the EPA specs say, the cockpit is cramped...so cramped that it's impossible for me to even drive the car. Now granted, my height is a statistical anomaly. But I can get into a BMW 530i and drive away. I can get into a CTS (and bought one). I can't drive a LS. I've learned never to trust EPA dimensions until I sit my butt in the seat.
BUT, if you DRIVE the way they test cars in the magazine, you will probably be targeted, ticketed and prosecuted as an "agressive driver." It makes no difference if you are on a deserted country road, or an empty freeway at 5 A.M.; you drive in a politically incorrect way, and you are going to get zapped. Here in Texas, they evey write "AD" on the top of a ticket so your case will get special attention from the prosecutor. Of course, once your insurance company finds out you are now the politically incorrect "agressive driver," you will either get a rate increase or loose your coverage.
SOOOOOO, you can buy a Cadillac/Buick/Pontiac and enjoy it on the highway or soaking up undermaintained potholes the way it was designed to do, or buy a car that the magazines praise for its' handling, but rides like a delivery truck with 80PSI of air in the tires. However, if you do buy that overpriced wundercar, don't drive it like you were on a German Autobahn or writing for a magazine!!!
My suggestion: buy the car you like, such as the bargain-priced CTS, and enjoy it.
If one is not interested in energetic driving, the CTS is no better a choice than a 530i, or E320, or 6-cylinder CTS. Or a Taurus, or a Camry...
If one is interested in actually using the tires a little bit, then the CTS is well suited for it (if one tolerates the shape...)
And there are some of us who haven't yet been beaten into submission by the absurdities of law enforcement.
I now have 1200 miles on my dark blue lux-sport CTS. I did a 0-60 test and was not quire happy. the car scored a best of 7.9 sec. I was not really surprised since the car, while responsive and fast, never felt like a low 7 sec car. Even the test drive car (another lux-sport CTS) felt like an 8 second car. The one I got is automatic, and i got the best time launching from 1500 rpm with TCS inactive (but even launching at 1500 rpm did not spin the wheels -does the stabilitrack got something to do with that-) This is really disappointing for me. I do not feel the same about the CTS and can no longer look forward to prove the car in an traffic light grand prix.
Motor Trend tested an auto CTS and reported 6.8 sec 0-60. But they were in a Lux model. Do you think that the extra weight of the moon roof (which I got) and the rest of the sport package items added up to cause the slow down. Or is the stabilitrack holding back hard launches. The passing acceleration (like flooring it from 60 mph) is outstanding though. I will be pitting the CTS against my 1986 modified 442 (my college car). The olds got a 350 cid engine -it is mildy modified and puts out tons of torque and won lots of challenges. It will be interesting to see what the CTS will do.
On another note, I tested the top speed capability and got about 217 kmph (135 MPH) into the wind. The car race to 120 mph in 4th gear before shifting into 5th. In 5th the acceleration died considerably and it was a while before the 135 mph was attained. I felt like it could have gone to 220 km ph (136-137 mph). From experience on the same road, driving with the wind is worth 15-20 kmph. If I was driving the other way into the wind (I am sure I would have got a minimum of 230 kmph (143 MPH). Throughout the exercise, the car was very stable and under control, wind noise was very acceptable, actually remarkable for a GM car.
This is a remarkable car, who cares about all of those put down reviewers.
Does anyone know what this is? It says details not yet available. I wonder if it is something close to the CTSm from the SEMA show?
I did mention before some of the differences that I see in my CTS (Saudi version) from the USA version. I now learned of some more, here is the full account:
- I have a full size head rest for the back seat middle passenger (all the pictures I saw for the US CTS did not have them).
- There is a child seat latch over the middle back seat too. The car.com reviewer complained about the lack of that.
- The Saudi CTS have rear fog lamps (2 strong red lamps beneath the 2 reverse lights that are operated at the driver discretion).
- The speedo have a maximum dial of 260 kmph, which reads 260 mph if the setup is switched to English from Metric (I find this to be very cool)
- While the US warranty is covers 4 years, the Saudi warranty is for 3 years, but we are covered for 62K miles not 50k (for me the extra 12k miles are more significant as I always exhaust the miles ahead of the allowed years)
- We are also covered by 3 year free maintenance (or 50k mile) which includes oil changes and every thing except for tire service (Motor Trend gave credit to BMW for that over the CTS in their Aug 2002 review.)
But do not feel bad guys, we do not have the star one service, hence no center LCD screen for us. We also do not have the compass in the mirror even though gmarabia.com mentions it as standard. Finally we also do not have the garage opener/sound recorder.
How come they did not put parking sensors on this car, I miss these a lot.
That's off the pace of the 1400+ vehicles they have been producing per week.
I'm not surprised that the export CTS's have rear fog lamps. That feature doesn't seem to be offered on any US legal car. In fact, there is a little controversy with Mini Cooper owners about this. The rear fog lamps are on the US car, but the switch to turn them on is missing, much like the CTS. There is confusion about whether or not that rear fog lamps are legal in the United States.
I will only do this at the track to keep it LEGAL and do abhor those who believe any street is a dragstrip.I guess that I'm not proving anything to myself that I don't already know.
I must add that pulling out at a traffic light alongside a car that has challenged me is a problem. I have noticed that cars with auto trans seem to just push the pedal full throttle when they pull out like their going somewhere important. Ocassionaly this does happen alongside of me and when it does I usually enjoy showing the person at the next traffic light what a CTS manual trans can pull out like . Then I get off the gas and return to 'normal driving'. I don't consider this to be racing because then all of the auto trans drivers would be in violation of the law most of the time.
Something else that you had mentioned about your CTS in pulling out that I found interesting, tire squeal or laying rubber as it's called. Since I have gone to the dragstrip many times , I have gone through hell and high water not to get the tires to burn out at the take off. Generally a little is acceptable but while you're sitting there making tire noise the other guy is starting down the track and you have lost time.
I can get the CTS to burn out if I want it to but I usually only want an 'eek'if that.
It is just an illusion of sound that impresses the listener into thinking that a car must really be fast because the tires make noise. On a street car it must make the tire companies just smile with another tire sale soon to be.
Considering the hourrendous multi-car pileups in fog on freeways in various parts of the country, I for one would like to see the super bright taillights made available for use in connection with fog lights. Although, I wonder if it would become a problem in clear air considering the number of cars I see in L.A. driving with fog lights on in perfectly clear air.
Another thought would be to use red or yellow strobe lights in place of the superbright tail lights. These would get even more attention in foggy conditions.
Anybody else have any thoughts on the subject?
But realistically, it would be nice if the laws were changed to allow better rear lighting for difficult situations such as dense fog. Of course it would also take a large education program to convince drivers to use their lighting properly. Here in L.A. is see high beams on city streets. People driving at night with no lights at all (I don't understand how they can drive without noticing that there are no lights on the dashboard). People driving with foglights (or driving lights which are brighter than their headlights) on clear nights. Well that's my [non-permissible content removed] for the evening. Drive safely everyone.
The residual value for lease purposes is a best guess by the leasing companies. With a completely new car such as the CTS it is a SWAG. If you have a crystal ball you might be able to do better.
Seems like a pretty good endorsement of the car.
I frequent the intrigue and impala boards and there have been quite a few that have done lemon law or buybacks.
especially the intrigue.
Looks like caddy has done a pretty good job so far.
The CTS' projected resale probably has a lot to do with Cadillac's earlier reputation in the last 10 years or so. But by the time that other future products join it (STS, SRX and XLR) within 24 months, I expect those residual lease values to climb over time. One thing that will not help the 2003 CTS' resale value is the changeover to a new base engine in 2004. It will leave us 2003 owners with a slightly less desirable trade, but them's the breaks.
The G35 is a wonderful car. My best friend owns one after taking my advice to test drive it. It is stylish, has great quality, is resonably priced and has a killer engine. The resale values of Infiniti are pretty good but probably not as good as Lexus or other cars since Infiniti hasn't made class leading vehicles in the last 12 years either until now. Certainly the old G20 was not on most people's short list for a car.
Even then, now is a lousy time to lease a car. With interest rates in the gutter and everyone wanting to make you a deal on a new car, ownership makes a lot more sense. Either that or ownership in a used car just back from lease, when the big three flooded the market with leases in the last few years.
The auto market has really changed since 9/11 and the GM 0% shock.
My wife has told me that someone from GM called the house to guage customer satisfaction with the car. It's nice to see GM following through on this stuff. It does make a difference.
My dealer also got brownie points yesterday. They have a new service in which an owner can come in for a quick service item (like an oil change or tire rotation) and be out within an hour. They were very busy but in an hour I got my car back, they charged me nothing for the first oil change and even gave me coupons for the next visit. Nice!