Natural Gas Prices

vix4vix4 Member Posts: 52
The price of natural gas here in California is now only 20 cents less than unleaded.


  • leon93leon93 Member Posts: 2
    Does anyone know if I can use scuba compressor to charge CNG car?
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    I know of one person doing this. You have to make the electrical intrinsically safe. you might also have to change the rings. are you thinking of an I.R. or a Bauer?
  • leon93leon93 Member Posts: 2
    Somethink like this: ryZ106436QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
    but used.

    Motor is brashless anyway, so there will be no sparks at all. I think the case of the compressor can be connected to inlet if there is any ring leak.
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    That appears to be a Bauer type compressor. The motor would have to be replaced to an explosion proof and a off skid control panel. It would also need a inlet filter and solinoide valve. At that price I would look for a Fuelmaker C3, FM2 or FM4.
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    As of tTuesday
    So Cal Gas 2.50 (Santa Monica)
    2.39 (Glendale)
    Long Beach Gas 2.23
    Clean Enrgy 2.49
    Reg at Union 76 2.89
  • cngmmcngmm Member Posts: 1
    I call fuelmaker yesterday - the cheapest compressor is ~$7.000
  • cngusercnguser Member Posts: 59
    Re: CNG rates listed for Tuesday
    Looks like the big oil companies have shown the CNG dealers in Calif how to play rip off the customer.
    Doesn't the Calif State PUC set natural gas rates - how could these be so artificially high? If that is attributed to recent natural gas cost increases nationwide, folks might as well switch over and heat their homes with gasoline! Not that more government is the answer, but looks like CNG pricing is out of control there. Hope it can get looked into.
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    There are several places you can look for A used Fuelmaker At under Market place There is some one selling 16 FM2-36 and at look under compressor and fueling appliance I believe mel is selling C3s a 2200.00 and FM2s for 2400.00 Take your time and look around find a used Bower the one thing to keep in mind abuot natural gas comperssors are that they have to meet NFPA52 and your local fire code. also you are limited most of the time to 7" of water colum inlet pressure at your home.
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    The Ca. P.U.C. dose control prices of utilitys. They just granted So. Cal. Gas a 39 cent increase to thier compression rate. I was told Clean Energy had gone to the P.U.C. and lobbied for this because it was an unfair advantage in the market place. (I do not know this for a fact.) The chairman of the board of Clean Energy is T. Boone Pickens is that big oil enough for you. Both So. Cal. Gas And Long Beach Gas are tied to the commity rate by a fixed rate. So thier prices are a set value over what they perchase gas for on the open market. Clean Energy, PIinnacle, ect. are market driven and set thier oun prices.
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    A few years ago I talked to Clean Energy's VP for marketing about pricing. He said it was tied into 87 octane gasoline pricing. He also told me that it's a bargain because use it should be set to premium.
  • londnrlondnr Member Posts: 55
    That's interesting - I live close to ENRG's headquarters in Seal Beach and every once in a while I run into the ENRG staff at lunch.

    During a conversation with an individual ENRG employee (who shall remain nameless) I said that I never used their pumps unless I had to because the price was so high compared to Long Beach and So Cal Gas.

    I mentioned that the ENRG prices seemed to track gas prices - that didn't go down well at all! I was told in no uncertain terms by my conversation partner, that he set the prices, and they were not linked to gas prices. He went on to "cry" about how unfair it was of the utilities to sell their CNG at "below cost" - he claimed that the CNG from Long Beach and So Cal Gas was subsidized and poor old ENRG had a hard time making a buck in this unfair market.

    So from that day to this, knowing just how unfairly ENRG has been treated I now use only their pumps - Just kidding.
  • timontimon Member Posts: 4
    Watch out, I really think that ENGR wants to take over LBE's CNG station. :mad: If they do then there will be no stopping what they will charge us.

    BTW, I know that LBE does not sell below cost and in fact makes money on the station. ENGR is just blowing smoke. Why would the Fountain Valley station be charging 2.049 last month and 2.149 this month when the cost of gas went down by almost $0.030 per gge? Their NOT telling the truth.

    Later this year the fed hwy tax will go up but there will be a $0.50 credit back from the feds. To the end user that should drop the price by at least $0.40. Let's see if ENGR drops their prices. I bet NOT.

    The only thing stopping me from installing Phill in at home is that their is NO ROI. But if per chance ENGR did take over the LBE station the ROI is there.

    I'd love to put in a station somewhere on the 405 and price is below ENGR. Two problems, cost to build the station and you know that ENGR would price their closet station below to try and kill a competting station.

    FYI, it would cost at least $100,000 to $175,000 to build a station using referbed equipment.
  • sethdallob1sethdallob1 Member Posts: 5
    Can you give me your math re: ROI on Phill? It cost $3500, minus the $2000 AQMD rebate, minus the federal tax deduction for the purchase price including installation. It's costing me less than, or about, a dollar per gge to fill my car. I'm saving roughly a dollar per gge, and will have recovered the money spent on the phill, even if i have to throw it away instead of having it rebuilt. Aside from the conveinence factor, there is a financial ROI too, IMHO.

    PS - I don't know if and when they changed the rules, but I got a transponder for free access to the 91 express lanes for my civic gx about 2 years ago, and use it frequently. You just drive through the regular toll lane, not the 3+ lane. I just went in, brought my registration and clean air decal slip, filled out the special access form, and got the transponder....
  • londnrlondnr Member Posts: 55
    Just so that you know - you are absolutely right, in fact not only do ENRG want to take over LBE but they have actually succeeded. I think the change takes place next month or soon thereafter. A sad day.
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    Natural gas prices on the market hit a one year low this week ,about $ 6.60 / million btu , but the price at long beach energy jumped from $ 1.48 to $1.66. Coincidence ?
  • londnrlondnr Member Posts: 55
    From what I understand Clean Energy or ENRG or whatever they are called have managed to negotiate a takeover of the Long Beach Energy CNG system and the changeover is due to go into effect soon. That being said, ENRG is way too greedy to only increase the price by 18 cents per gge.

    I suspect that we will know when the change happens as the price will go through the roof, at least compared to LBE's regular pricing. I am not sure what ENRG is currently charging but last time I looked it was at least $2.50. We will also know when the fateful day arrives as ENRG is going to replace the Long Beach pumps with the newer (and in my opinion less effective) type seen at all of their stations.
  • timontimon Member Posts: 4
    Yes it true, Clean Energy is going to take over the Long Beach Energy Stations and when they do the price is going to go up at least $0.75 per GGE. You know the way Clean Energy works; even if Natural Gas prices go down they will raise prices if the price of gasoline goes up.

    There will be no completion along the 405 they can raise the price to what ever they want to. I bet that you'll see $3.00 per gge soon.

    Can this be stopped? Maybe since the Long Beach city council has not signed the contract yet, may in 3 weeks, we may be able to put pressure on to stop it.

    We need to make a mass showing at the city offices and the next city council meeting on the 23rd. If we don't try to stop this now or at least get Long Beach to force Clean Energy to set a fix amount over natural gas cost then get ready to pay $3.00 a gge.
  • londnrlondnr Member Posts: 55
    I am all for any protest. I think that there has been a rush to off load the CNG pumps without really thinking things through.

    First I know that LBE made a profit on the station, maybe not much, but they did make money instead of losing it.

    Also, now all city owned vehicles will be paying more for CNG, not as much as the public but still over the price that the City buys its natural gas for.

    I wonder if the contract has taken into consideration the loss of a money making venture, plus the increased cost fueling their fleet with their own resources.

    I am still mad that a few years ago the Utilities were pushing NGVs, saying that the price of natural gas was so cheap because we have an abundant domestic supply. Now they see the potential of tracking the price of a gallon of gas, when will their greed end? I guess the environment wasn't the real concern after all was it?

    What do you propose?
  • dsgd47dsgd47 Member Posts: 1
    Burbank 1.66
    Azusa 1.98
    Ontario 1.72
    Gas 3.00+
    Using Phill at home ~1.00
  • rstrst Member Posts: 73
    $2.16 at Van Nuys today. Where is the Burbank station?
  • rogerbohlrogerbohl Member Posts: 34
    Most recent fills of CNG at public stations have been $1.90 to $2.00/Gal. Gas Equivalent. Our '99 Honda has averaged 34 miles/GGE since we bought it 2,000 miles ago.

    Trillium had been $1.73, but recently increased to $1.90. PG&E had been $1.90, but I haven't gotten a bill since Trillium's price went up, and I expect PG&E will also increase. Clean Energy had been around $2.00, but I haven't used them lately.
  • rstrst Member Posts: 73
    tried the Santa Monica SoCal Gas plant at $2.49. (now it is clean energy) cheaper than avgas, but not as fun to go get.
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    These are all recent from last 2 weeks
    Hemet 1.98
    Diamond Bar 1.99
    Placentia 2.25
    Garden Grove (CE) 2.45
  • stohl2stohl2 Member Posts: 4
    $1.66 at Burbank station as of 8-30-06. It is located on Lake and Chestnut (kind of by the Costco).
  • rstrst Member Posts: 73

    that is cheaper than I can pump it at home!
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    (9/1)Hemet went up to 2.20
    (9/5)Diamond Bar went up to 2.09
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    (9/6) Hemet is 2.052 / GGE
  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    Berkeley Trillium up to $1.96 (from $1.89 a couple weeks ago).

    boo! why? aren't NG futures declining (as well as regular gas prices declining, which we all know CNG seems to track)
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    (9/12) Placentia 2.289
  • nostrom0nostrom0 Member Posts: 44
    Azusa $2.05 gge
  • bank1avpbank1avp Member Posts: 78
    Most of these stations should immediately go done $.50 per GGE Oct. 1st when the Fed alt fuel rebate program kicks in. If they do not, the the end consumer can claim the rebate for themselves, This using Fuelmaker at home will also be able to claim the credit. Just convert your therms into GGE which is 1.25 therms = 1 GGE

    CNG Motors
  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    the 3600psi pump was down this morning (wed - 11am) at trillium Berkeley. does anyone know if it is back up?
  • stohl2stohl2 Member Posts: 4
    Burbank station is $1.39 as of 9-30-06
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    My local station in Hemet went down 41 cents to 1.64
  • stohl2stohl2 Member Posts: 4
    The price in Burbank is back up to 1.51 (10-2-06)
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    Diamond Bar 1.84 (Down 0.25 from 2.09)
  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    ok, trillium in berkeley is UP to 2.09 since ~October 1st. I called to ask why we were dropping the way some of you folks are reporting, and he said the federal excise tax went UP on Octover 1st. could someone please clarify for me??

  • bank1avpbank1avp Member Posts: 78
    Excise tax went up yes for alternative fuel, but there is a rebate aswell that should net us about $.35 cents per gallon savings at the pump. Funny how they immediately include the extra tax but not the rebate :0)

  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    murphy -- you commented before that the end user can claim the rebate if not deducted at the pump. do you have more details on how one could do that, or a suggestion on where to look for such information? thank you very much,
  • bank1avpbank1avp Member Posts: 78
    I have a copy of the Energy bill on Adobe. But if I put up my email address, the host will remove my posting and you'll never see this. And if you do the same will happen with your message. I am the owner of cngmotors, hopefully that helps you with the email address. Then I can send it to you. It talks about everything, including car rebates, fueling stations, VRA's, rct..

  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H EdmundsAdministrator Posts: 11,114
    You can always just post a link to download the bill.


    Need help navigating? [email protected] - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

    Share your vehicle reviews

  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    $1.99 at Clean Energy 3rd Street SF (olympian)
    $2.09 at Trillium Berkeley
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    The rebate is $.50 to the seller of the natural gas (per gge), but the federal tax per gge went up .12.
    So fuel prices should drop, I dont understand why they are higher in N. CA.
    Anyone know the prices now at the Clean Energy stations?

    It is on page 3 pdf
  • xpacificxpacific Member Posts: 16
    Longtime lurker, first time posting to this very useful forum. Our price at the pump went down from $1.24 / gge to $0.86 in the past few weeks. (This is at the Sinclair station west of I-15 in Orem) Now I am really going to have to get serious about buying the GX that I have been eyeing for a while. ;)
  • rstrst Member Posts: 73
    $2.19 in Santa Monica and we get a full fill now.
  • epnfrnepnfrn Member Posts: 87
    1.74/ gge at Berkeley Trillium


    ps. to the person oregon ... you're killing us californians! don't tell us anymore :)
  • bank1avpbank1avp Member Posts: 78
    Phoenix Market:
    $2.05 Trillium on Kryene
    $2.01 APS downtown
    $1.85 Washington Schools

    None of them have instituted the credit yet. Trillium had a sign up that said the $.50 cents was to take affect Oct.1 because because they don't know how to apply it they haven't done anything yet. Bull !@#$

    How come other stations have figured it out. CE and Trillium sticking it to the consumer as usual. To be honest I don't know if they actual help promote alternative fuel. Makes you want to open your own station until they buy you out for under cutting them or try to introduce legislation or a case to run you out like what almost happened to Washington Schools.

    Just one mans opinion
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    I agree with you. I am still curious about other prices in So Ca, and if the Anaheim station will ever open back up.
    Diamond Bar 1.85 (SCAQMD Pinnacle) today
    Hemet 1.654 (Riverside Transit Authority) yesterday
  • bank1avpbank1avp Member Posts: 78
    APS is selling CNG Hydrogen blend for $1.91 15% Hydrogen
  • jetboatjohnnyjetboatjohnny Member Posts: 104
    Can I run that in my GX? Would it give me more bang?
    They have 100% hydrogen in Diamond Bar, I have seen a few of the cars, they look like a Toyota Prius
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