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2) I failed to mention one other slight "negative" I noticed on the showroom floor model Sedona EX I looked at (not the one I drove w/the rattle). In the back the plastic was quite beat up/scratched up. We've had two Dodge minivans now so I know how that injection-molded plastic can get scratched up tossing things in and out. But the scratches on the Kia seemed to be the kind of scratches I'd expect to see on a 100,000 mile vehicle, not on a showroom floor model. Has anyone had any good/bad experience w/the plastic on the inside cabin? And while I'm at it how about the fake wood? I can take it or leave it but I've never owned a vehicle w/fake wood and wondering if it shows smudges easier than plastic, harder to clean, etc.?
Thanks,
Rob
- I would advise anyone in Southeast Michigan to think VERY hard before visiting Goodman Automotive Group in Ann Arbor. Both vehicles we drove there had something wrong w/them and the salespeople didn't seem the least bit concerned. When I went to negotiate with the salesman he pulled the following:
- The $1000 rebate will DEFINITELY be gone next month (highly unlikely in my opinion but even other dealers said it will "likely" continue)
- They were willing to give me $6000 on my '96 Plymouth trade-in (though charge me full MSRP on the Kia), which is currently worth about $5200-$5800 wholesale according to Kelley Blue Book, but he said next month after it hits 90,000 miles it would be worth $2500. HUH!?!?!?!
- He said he'd pull out "all the stops" to get me 5.5% 60 month financing though the next dealership easily offered 5.04%
- In addition I had to practically beg him to show me how the seats work and, once he did, that's ALL he showed me on the van...nothing else.
- We then went to Dick Scott Kia in Canton, MI. VERY professional group and you can tell it the minute you pull up. We dealt with Jeff Powers who was probably one of the nicest most professional car salesman I've met. Unfortunately we couldn't agree on a value for our trade-in van. But they did come down to $49 over invoice and 5.04% financing.
We may take our van to a few more Kia dealers to see if anyone is willing to bite on our van but I think we're also going to start looking at the new Dodge Grand Carvans. I know these dealerships will have a little easier time moving a used '96 with 90,000 miles so I'm hoping for a better trade deal. We'll see where it leads us. But it bothers me to lose out on a decent minivan with a hell of a warranty AND with leather and sunroof for ~$20,000!!!
Good luck all,
Rob
2. Rider's Mileage: In Canuck gallons you should be easily getting over 30 mpg on the highway with A/C and a few kids on board. We have enjoyed as high as 34 mpg. City mileage varies from the 18-19 that my hotrod wife gets, to my more leisurely (love that stereo) 21-22 mpg.
3. Rear Room: Taking out one seat makes an incredible difference. If you are not up to dead-lifting 60-70 lbs of seat, then we find folding the rearmost seatbacks forward until flat creates a lot of storage room. We cover them with a heavy plastic tarp to protect the (table tray?) surfaces.
4. Plastic: The fake wood stands up very well so far (12 months this August). The rear horizontal plastic piece ahead of the tailgate will become scratched if you are not careful, but I believe that it is considerable narrower than the piece on the Ford and others.
I'd encourage you to shop your used Caravan around to some other dealers and see what they are willing to offer you for it. You might do better than what Dick Scott offered you. Also, my preference is to sell my outgoing vehicles privately. I've never had a bad experience and always gotten much more than a trade-in would have yielded.
Don't let the low trade-in offers on your Caravan prevent you from pulling the trigger on the Sedona.
Email me if you are interested in having me 'refer' you to Dick Scott, even though you've already visited there. I'd sure like to get a $100 referral and I'd be willing to split it with you. Technically, I did suggest Dick Scott to you on this forum before you visited, so it wouldn't really be 'cheating.'
Jason
white_shoes_white@yahoo.com
As for fuel economy, my calculations for fuel economy are based upon approx. 600 km (373 miles)on a 75 litre (20 gallon) tank of gas. I'm hoping that my calculation of approx. 19 mpg is incorrect (for Canadian gallons) and do hope that my fuel economy on the highway goes as high as your Sedona's.
Perhaps after the engine breaks in the economy will improve? I shouldn't say that I'm disappointed, as I knew that the Kia wasn't the "miser" of all the mini-vans on the maket, but it is a little harder on gas than expected. Nonetheless, even considering the added fuel expense, I still believe that I'm further ahead (economically) with a Kia than any of the other choices.
I just realized last night that my vehicle was manufactured on a Friday. Any concerns out there with this (is Friday the end of the work week in Korea too?). Food for thought...
Subsequently, packed the family up for a 1500 mile trip VA-MI and back last week. No problems.
This is the second major (1000+ mi.) family trip and I just have to say, this van loves to cruise down the highway. The cruise control is excellent in that I really like the ability to modify the speed setting in 1mph increments. MPG was consistently about 23 with long segments at 70-75.
Of course, no trip is complete without a good emergency maneuver, and the van handled a 75mph last second right lane sidestep pass and re-establish lane maneuver when the 50 mph on ramp traffic elected to merge immediately into the right lane instead of using the 1000'+ of remaining merge lane to yield and merge at speed. Thoughts about my decision making aside, the van handled remarkably well.
Oh, and no summer trip is complete without a 1 hour traffic delay at 12:50pm on a 98 degree MI day (on the Zilwaukeee bridge if anyone cares). And as noted in other posts, even running the A/C in dead stop hot traffic, the engine temp gauge registered zero change remaining one needle length short of the middle mark for the entire trip.
But...a big disappointment for me was the way the back row seats folded up " out of the way". The poor salesman struggled to show me how they worked. He couldn't fold one of the up in the showroom vehicle. He chalked it up to the fact that the vehicle hadn't been "PDI'd" . So I suggested that we go outside where he could demonstrate how they worked on another vehicle on the lot. He struggled yet again and finally was able to show me.
I was disappointed to find out that the seats basically had to be completely unlatched from the floor and then tied up to the second row seats. Is this dumb and awkward, or what??
Does this bother anyone else?
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs & A&A Message Boards
The temp gauge not moving even with A/C running and vehicle at idle makes you wonder if the gauge even works! I, too, have been impressed by the cooling ability of the A/C and the van's resistance to overheating.
So perhaps we're not done w/the Kia just yet. Although the Dodge dealers were willing to come down to $15,500 on a 2001 executive-driven Town & Country Lx with 18-22,000 miles. That would put me at about $315/month out-the-door, versus the Kia at about $415/month. Although the Dodge wouldn't have ABS, leather or sunroof and we'd have that peace of mind of the 100K warranty. First things first I guess, we need to sell our '96! It's in great shape if anyone is interested! (Sorry for the soliciation Steve).
Does anyone else have any thoughts on the back seat fold-up issue? The schlocky dealer we went to just kind of explained it to us w/out actually doing it. But it apppeared that I'd have to somewhat "remove" the seat and then tie it down (?) with a strap of some kind. I'm trying to picture my wife trying to lean into a van 3-4' to tie down a seat while our two little kids are running around and her grocery cart is rolling downhill towards another car in the Sam's Club parking lot.
- R
It has been in the shop for 3 substantial items:
First, the windshield developed a stress crack and had to be replaced. Wow! Am I glad the warranty covered it! With my $500 deductible, I would have been paying the $400+ myself if it had been caused by a rock instead.
Next, at around 12,700 miles the power steering unit completely failed. We had began hearing an odd 'purr' noise that rose and fell with the RPM. Called the dealership about it on a Thursday and they said "go ahead and drive it--bring it in Tuesday". It lasted until Saturday evening when it "groaned" on one sharp turn in a parking lot. Recognizing the sound, I knew immediately then that the power steering was involved. In less than one mile it began a constant "garbage disposal" sound--the power steering unit had emptied itself of all the fluid and was fried. Had it towed in and the dealership replaced it.
About 500 miles after the power steering replacement, my wife called me at work to say she had was stranded at a shopping center. She walked out after a 10 minute stop and the van wouldn't start--clicking like a dead battery. Had it towed. The dealership diagnosed a bad alternator--suspected the "hot weather" as a factor. When the alternator arrived 2 days later, I suppose they got as far as installing it and then realized it wasn't the alternator after all. At that point they decided it was a fried battery. Reportedly, the folks at Sedona said the original equip battery was undersized and therefore had been overcharged/burned up. They had the dealership purchase and install a pumped-up gel battery.
We've now had it back for about 10 days and so far no further problems.
Now--before some of you jump to conclusions--we still love the van! I'd still recommend one to anyone who asks. But, I thought you all deserve to know what has transpired--especially since it seems to be the exception rather than the rule among experiences posted on this board.
Yep. Unfortunately, we were about 20 minutes late or we could have avoided the southbound lane closures for the on-bridge accident involving a camper-trailer.
- The weather was hot, +/- 120 degree at valley floor and +/- 110 degree at most desert road during day.
- My 4 month old Sedona EX successfully kept cool inside temperature. My kids in the back seat complains TOO cold, time to time. The temperature gauge stays where it used to be, even in the Devil's Golf Course area.
- Gas mileage was not impressive. It measures about 17 mpg. (When I had a trip with Chevy Venture last year, it averages 25 mpg.) Due to low or no traffic, I maintained over 60 mph average, means median speed somewhere around 85 mph.
- Transmission downshifted a lot. While driving 80+ mph, with little more pressure on gas pedal ignite downshifting. I understand its little hilly and high altitude landscape, but it bothers me quite a bit.
- Ride quality is good in paved road, but not in rough paved or not paved area. Steering wheel giggles a lot in gravel road.
Overall, it was a good trip.
best move i've made in a long time.
I got $2300 for it. Good thing because it had almost 120,000 miles and it had this annoying check engine light and various other electrical problems with it. It started having electrical problems within 3 months of purchasing the GC. Typical of Chrysler products. The KBB site would not value my van due to the mileage. The GC was costing me a $1,000 a year in repairs with no end in site.
At 3,000 miles on the Kia I have not had any issues, other than trying to keep it clean after several long road trips with 2 kids in the van.
I'm hoping I don't have to use my warranty as much as I did on the GC. So far the info on the Kia Town Hall says I won't.
I bought the Sedona and kept the Dodge -- just call me soccer dad. I'll probably sell the Dodge soon and look for a used BMW -- definately by the time my next major repair is due.
On the Kia -- so far we are very pleased. It compares well with the Dodge. With the warranty program (my Dodge was 3/36) on the Kia I expect to not have to do much out of pocket work. The Kia is also a sharp looking car -- and I couldn't touch a van by anyone else with the options at anywhere near the price.
AutoPacific's results come from surveys of more than 34,000 owners and lessees of new 2002 vehicles acquired from September to November 2001. Owners are asked about the overall satisfaction they have with the vehicle, as well as 43 features that are important in a vehicle's operation, comfort and safety.
AutoPacific said Kia made the list for the first time, with the 2002 Kia Sedona minivan named best in satisfaction among minivans. "This is a remarkable accomplishment; not just for the vehicle but for the brand itself," Peterson said.
Here's the link if you're interested.
http://carpoint.msn.com/advice/windowshop.aspx?contentid=4020111&src=MSN
Is it fair to say that, in general, minivans are less reliable then other cars? It seems like an Accord will hold up better then an Odyssey, a Maxima will hold up better then a Quest, and a Camry will hold up better then a Sienna. Do most people find this to be true? People I know that purchase cars (reasonably) expect them to last 150,000 miles without major problems, but I don't know many people who have the same expectations with regard to minivans.
Obviously, the reason I'm asking is because of the reliability issues with the Sedona. I'm not so sure that comparing the reliability of a Sedona with a Sienna is the same as comparing the reliability of an Optima with a Camry.
I think you could check reliability ratings from CR, CarPoint, JD Power and whoever else and see it there's a glimmer of truth in this assumption. I tend to think there is myself but never checked out any stats. Plus it's also commonly assumed that MV drivers are saner than other drivers, so we aren't so hard on our vehicles, which would trump the first assumption. And you know what they say about assumptions :-)
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
(1) With Canadian vehicles, daytime running lights are standard (required by law). Normally, only the headlights are "on", but I've noticed that the taillights are also "on" when my Sedona is running. Is this typical?
(2) Has anyone put the oil additives (friction reducers) into their Sedona with hopes of boosting the gas mileage? Is this worthwhile, and more importantly, will using these additives void the factory warranty?
(3) Has the rear heater debate been concluded? I haven't checked, but I'm curious as to whether the rear heater has only one temp. or if it can be controlled with the front temp. control knob.
(4) I've got a Craftsman (Sears) garage door opener with a small controller. In my LX, the remote fits into the garage door opener compartment in the ceiling of the van, however, pushing this compartment will not activate the controller. Any tips for making this work? I've thought about gluing a small dowell into the door that will push the controller button when the compartment is pressed...
I don't think there's anything inherent about minivans that prevents them from being as reliable or trouble-free as cars, though.
Personally, my expectations for the durability, reliability, and longevity of a vehicle are the same regardless of the body type or EPA classification. I fully expect/hope our Sedona will last 200k miles, and I expect our Isuzu Trooper to do the same. Your idea that minivan owners have lower standards isn't something I've heard before, and I'm inclined to disagree with it.
I'm a tall guy, about 6'5", and although with the sunroof there's not much headroom, and not much room for my knees in front, it's perfect for my wife and three children.
A question. Was anybody offered the extend warranty on the sedona? I need to go back and read through it, but they claimed it would cover the van, bumper to bumper, for 5 years/100,000 miles. I haven't purchased it yet, but I am considering it if it is worth it. The finance guy who was pushing it claimed that it would cost 3 times the amount they were offering it for if I purchased it 3 years down the road. Is there any truth to this? Also, he offered it to me for $895, which he claimed was discounted from $1500. Does this sound accurate? I can't help but not trust these guys, especially when I'm not using their financing. I'm sure they're going to take any angle they can to get some extra cash for the dealership.
Yes, the cost of an extended warranty might be higher once the vehicle is beyond the factory bumper-to-bumper warranty. I believe that's the case with Warranty Gold's warranties.
$895 for the 5 yr / 100k bumper-to-bumper sounds too high. You could probably get something cheaper through Warranty Gold or someone else. I don't know which would be more convenient, easier to deal with, etc.
It's been a busy summer, and I haven't sat down to this board for a while. Still have over a hundred posts to catch up on, but I wanted to return to throwing in my two cents.
Have now had our EX with leather/ABS for 7 1/2 months and 10,000 miles. I've had only two problems, really: it pulled left a bit for the first few months, but the dealer adjusted the alignment (under warranty), and it's fine now. Then, in May, the left side sound on the stereo went out, but only for CDs, not for the radio. Dealer replaced the CD player under warranty with a smile and a "yes sir".
On some of the issues people have discussed in the past:
-Finally got her out on the highway on a long trip. Got between 19 and 23 miles per gallon depending on speed, with A/C on. Seemed to get very slightly better mileage with premium gas.
-A/C does indeed seem to take a little while to cool the cabin, but after a maybe ten-fifteen minutes on the road, does a fine job. I was continually being told to turn it down because the Supreme Commander was cold.
Speaking of mileage, I've got a funny story to post when I get a few minutes. Stay tuned. Best to all of you (kinda like old friends, now!), and I hope your families are safe and your vans are running well.
Mark
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Will be looking for your post, take care.
The first step in buying smart is to buy a vehicle you can afford to pay off in a reasonable amount of time so you won't be looking to get rid of it while you still have all those coupons left. Congratulations - buying a KIA Sedona is a smart move in that respect.
The next step is to keep the vehicle for at least enough years after you've finished paying it off until it is worth only 2-3 thousand dollars. I've found that cars in that price range sell quickly and easily.
Another good trick is to keep making payments to yourself after the car is paid off - putting that money aside for the down payment on your next car. The more you can put down, the shorter you loan will be and you will be ahead of the game next time.
My question is for Canadian owners. I am looking to purchase the EX Luxury model, and was curious as to what deals everyone is getting. The dealers I have spoken to are not very willing to negotiate. Any help with this would be appreciated, even if I can get a price on the EX model, for comparison.
Thanks.
Needless to say we love the van and hope to keep it for a long while.
To geosks: search for dealers offering "no dicker sticker" prices. We found two of these in Alberta that were offering prices about $500-$800 lower than the dealers operating under the traditional offer/counter-offer format. Saved a lot of time closing the deal as well. We paid $28,300 for our EX (loaded) in August of 2001 at Sherwood Kia in Sherwood Park.
Electrical issues: we operated our van in -10F to -20F conditions several times last winter (we were having a mild winter) with full heater fan front/rear, all the electric defrosters, headlights, foglights & probably stereo. Even with the reduced capacity of a very cold battery, we never had any problem starting the van. xarly should investigate the lemon laws in his/her area. The lack of similar problems on this board indicate that perhaps your van is seriously defective.
excelent3: does your towing setup include a "hot" wire to charge the battery of the rvs that you pull? If so, then you will have been placing an even greater load on the van's electrical system than the rest of us.
I would like to hear what other owners are getting and what you have found to improve mileage.
Thanks for your response.
DL Cooper....Your gas mileage is certainly suspect. I would have that checked over immediately. Some of us charter members contributed to a MPG poll back in February, most of us did not have our vans close to break-in and we were averaging on the hwy 23.725 mpg . I get 24-25 on the hwy, without my air on with midrange (89-90) octane fuel. Check your tires also, can make a difference.
Apparently the 2003 models won't be out until October (at least that's the line I am getting). The dealer is telling me that when the new model comes out, the price will go up 8%. They also say that there are no changes with the new model year.
On another note, I have been reading in this forum that any Sedona made after February comes with two remotes. The dealer I spoke with told me the second remote has to be ordered and I would have to pay for it. Could you confirm?
klcooper: about your poor mileage on the highway - do you have the overdrive feature engaged? Just a thought.
As well, can any Canadian owner tell me if they received 1 or 2 keyfobs, as I am told they only come with one, but I can order a second at my cost.
Thanks