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Toyota Matrix

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  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Zircon, to answer your question, we ordered a Base Matrix 5 speed with the B package (A/C alloy wheels, keyless entry etc.). This is a second vehicle to complement our Subaru Forester. My wife commutes a fair distance to work so the AWD Forester is great for winter and the Matrix will be for better mileage in the summer. We sold our other vehicle (Mazda Mx3) a month ago but I wanted to wait and get a 2003 as well as get something a little different. We agreed on $800 under suggested retail(which hopefully will be around $22,500 Canadian). The local Toyota dealer is a great dealer generally labelled the best for service.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I agree - I also don't like how Toyota packages their options. They nickel-and-dime you to death.

    An example: to get heated leather seats with power adjustment on a Highlander, you have to buy three separate option packages! Just for the seats! Check it out:

    Heated seats, $440
    Leather package, $1070
    Power seat controls, driver only, $390

    So it's almost $2 grand just for the lousy seats!

    The RAV4 is almost worse. 4WD, ABS, power windows, power locks, even a rear bumper is an extra cost option.

    -juice
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    Just came back from the movies, saw oceans 11. Not a bad movie at all!!!

    Anyways, they had a quick 10 second trailer for the matrix to come out 02/02/02. They also advertised a new web page, www.toyotamatrix.ca
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Saw one in person for the first time. It was up on a stand at the DC Auto Show. It looked like a basic model, no clear tail lights for example. Doesn't look nearly as good without them, kind of bland.

    They also had a Vibe, which still doesn't look as good as the Matrix.

    Too bad you couldn't get close to either one, so not much else to report.

    -juice
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    I don't recall reading anything about the tail lights being different in the 180 HP Matrix. I'm wondering if they don't have 2 different types of tail lights out there on pre-production models. I know I've seen pictures of the 180HP XRS with the clear tail lights as well as with the traditional orange-red lights (sport compact car Jan issue). So perhaps all Matrix models will have the same tail lights. Hopefully they will be the clear lights.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Not sure if this is new but here's another review:


    http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=4435&sid=181&n=157

  • just_some_guyjust_some_guy Member Posts: 52
    This is to anybody who might know and Tup in particular. Is there anywhere we can go now to find out what the available packages will be on the Matrix?
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    As I posted earlier, To see the toyota specs go to the www.Toyota.com site, click on the Matrix, click on utility and then specs and then scroll down until you see "download pdf version of specs"
  • just_some_guyjust_some_guy Member Posts: 52
    I've downloaded that spec sheet but what I was wondering about was if there are certain options that have to be ordered together. Like on a Celica you have to get a sunroof with leather seats.
  • zircon2zircon2 Member Posts: 94
    Hope you enjoy he car!
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Actually, here in Canada the options are different than the US. For example, here I ordered a base Matrix with the "B" option pack which is power doors, alloy wheels, keyless entry, illuminated entry and Air conditioning. It looks like in the US that you can order things like A/C all by itself.
  • just_some_guyjust_some_guy Member Posts: 52
    I've got a couple of dealership email addresses that I can use. I hope that I'll be able to order particular items seperately but from what some people have told me that might not be a possiblitity. Just for info here's what I'm thinking about:

    Matrix XRS
    Automatic (yea I'm lame and can't drive a stick)
    DVD/GPS navigation system
    Leather seats
    Lunar Mist Metallic OR Cosmic Blue Metallic

    I've not decided if I will give up the leather if it requires a sunroof. Until I find out definitively what distributor has TN I'm wary of the sunroof. I've read too many horror stories of Gulf States and Southeast adding cheap crap to the car. A cheap sunroof might be one of the things they'd add. Also I just don't know if I like the idea of having a hole in the top of my car.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Well, when I was last at the Toyota dealer, they had received a notice that the Automatic in the XRS didn't perform much better than the automatic in the base 130hp engine. All the extra HP is at very high RPM's and the automatic shifted before the power band was hit. Perhaps they will find a fix for this by production time.
  • silentguiltsilentguilt Member Posts: 35
    They won't. They haven't for the celica, they won't for the matrix considering it is the same powerplant. My only question is why some one would want to have a highrevving and basically torqueless engine with an automatic transmission? Sorry guys, if you don't like to drive stick, it isn't worth the $ for the XRS.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Member Posts: 2,287
    A decision that Pontiac apparently made a long time ago. No automatic available with the 180hp engine at Pontiac, announced long ago. At the time, I was upset with Pontiac, especially since Toyota was going to have an auto with the 180.

    I wonder if they will actually build any of these with that configuration. Seems to me it would just upset the buyers. Toyota is a very smart company. They will either work it out or won't sell them, I bet!

    Want torque? Get a Grand Prix GTP. Torque is NOT what Matrix/Vibe are about. Different market.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdrives/03vibe.htm
  • joee1joee1 Member Posts: 16
    I noticed that they show a matching solid color cladding on GT version, but the same-o, same-o grey colored cladding on the other models.

    Does anyone know if you can get the matching solid color cladding on ALL models?
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    From what I have read, monochrome cladding will be added to the vibe in the months after initial production has started.
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    Hey there, CFTO had a quick spot on some new cars and low and behold they show a bing shind-dig on the "first" Matrix rolling off the assembly line here in Cambridge, with whomever it was driving it off. Should be interesting to see how much longer we have to wait for pricing, either the Matrix (u.s. or can) or the Vibe (can) . Noticed one thing, front bumber was rather lame, no sport skirt with the small lights just a plain old bumper that looks like the ones in all the pics on the toyota.ca & .com web pages but the bottom half was chopped off. Now I noticed this on a Toyota released video that was shown as a part of the news segment. I was unable to see the front on the car that came off the line, however I assume they must be the same.

    Too bad in my opinion, it really made a HUGE difference on how the car looked.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    That chopped off bumper is on the base Matrix. The Xr and XRS have the beefed up bumper.
  • jimjpsjimjps Member Posts: 146
    According to Canadian driver the 130 hp engine lost 7 hp in the AWD due to exhaust restrictions due to tight squeeze around the RWD components. If the low output engine drops 7 hp I would think the loss would be much greater on the high output engine where exhaust flow would be more critical. This is a possible explanation as to why the 180 hp is not available in the AWD. Seems like they could find a way around this but may require too much retooling for a new car introduction.
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    http://www.toyota.com/html/about/news/archive/press_release/product/docs/2002/20020103a_matrixp.jsp
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Wow...those are even better prices than the Vibe.

    Here are the numbers we have:
    Vibe:
    Craig Bierley, Pontiac Vibe brand manager, said that pricing will begin at $16,900 manufacturer's suggested retail price (MSRP), including destination charges of $560. The powerful Vibe GT will start at $19,900 MSRP and Vibes equipped with all-wheel-drive will list for $20,100 MSRP, also with destination charges.

    Matrix:
    The front-wheel-drive Standard grade with a five-speed manual transmission starts at $14,670. The front-wheel-drive Standard with an automatic transmission begins at $15,470. The four-wheel-drive automatic Standard is priced at $17,115.

    The Matrix XR front-wheel drive with a five-speed manual transmission is base priced at $16,180. The front-wheel-drive XR with an automatic transmission starts at $16,980. A four-wheel-drive automatic XR begins at $18,445.

    Base MSRP for the XRS ranges from $18,750 for the six-speed manual transmission to $19,330 for the four-speed automatic.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/48582/page007.html


    That red one looks a little different. I wonder if those will be the final tail lights or is this a picture of an XR with the XRS having the silver tail lights.

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Remember, though, Toyota makes a lot of things a la carte options, such as ABS, side air bags, etc. I read that Pontiac was going to make a lot more equipment standard.

    So priced with the same equipment, they'll be closer than that.

    -juice
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Looking at that red matrix at the LA autoshow:

    http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/48582/page007.html


    It seems to me that the side indentations are not as prominant esp. where go over the rear wheel well. Could they have toned this down a bit for production or is the color and lighting just masking it a little.


    As for options on the base vibe vs the base Matrix I can see that the Vibe does have a few more....such as seat height, the household plug, roof rack but I still think that Matrix has been priced lower...even with options.

  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    Well well well.

    If with the options the Matrix is cheaper who would buy a vibe, just on resale value alone it would then make sense to get the Toyota instead.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    True, the Toyota ought to have better resale. Is the warranty the same? Toyota gives 3/36 B2B and 5/60 powertrain, what about Pontiac?

    -juice
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Member Posts: 2,287
    According to one of the many car magazines I read, Vibe will have the same powertrain warranty as Toyota, to be competitive.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Is the standard equipment the same on the Vibe and Matrix base?
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    The standard equipment is greater on the base Vibe.


    In the US:

    The Matrix has 3 levels(not counting AWD): Base; XR; XRS. The Vibe has only base and GT. So the Base Vibe has more options than the base Matrix; things like illuminated entry, that household type plug, drivers seat height adjust, power side mirrors, rear wiper. Now a base vibe has A/C and there are conflicting accounts...both from Toyota as to if the Base Matrix has A/C or not(I suspect not). So this explains some of the cost difference (Vibe $16400 vs Matrix $14670.) ....However...


    A Matrix XR is still cheaper(16,100) than a Base Vibe and has base vibe features: A/C, seat height adjust, power side mirrors, household style plug. It also has: Power windows, power doors, leather wrapped steering wheel, variable int. wipers, keyless entry.


    So the Matrix XR seems to be by far the best deal.


    Also, if you want the all wheel drive version, you can get it in base or XR trim with the Matrix while with the Vibe, you have to get it fairly loaded.


    Now in Canada...

    We have no pricing yet but it should mirror the US pricing.

    The base vibe seems to be the same as in the US but instead of stand alone options, they are mostly in packages.

    The Matrix is slightly different in Canada...Base Matrix in Canada has a rear wiper and the XR Matrix has alloy wheels and cruise.


    I ordered a base Matrix with the "B" option package which includes power doors, keyless entry, alloy wheels, A/C and illuminated entry.


    The AWD Matrix is available in any of the trim levels while a Vibe AWD comes with all the base vibe options plus the 6 speaker 200Watt stereo, power windows and doors, keyless entry, cruise, side airbags, ABS.


    I find it ironic that the Vibe which looks more sport utilitish has made the AWD very optioned and costly while the more "sporty" looking Matrix will probably sell more AWD versions.


    To research some...check out http://www.toyota.com/html/shop/look_ahead/matrix_specs.pdf

    www.gmcanada.com/english/vehicles/ (take out this gap) pontiac/vibe/pont_vibe_flash.html

    http://www.pontiac.com/vibe/vibe_specs.pdf


    Studying these same but different cars has been interresting. I still think that the Matrix offers the best bang for the buck but it depends on the options you want.

  • mpgmanmpgman Member Posts: 723
    So if I want both of the above, which trim line do I have to get for both cars? Will they be available as standalone options, be packaged together, or will they only be included in a certain trim line? Will one be able to order either car with exactly the options they want from the factory, like you could with the Prism? Thanks.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    According to their website, ABS and side airbags will be stand alone options in the US.
  • QualityQuality Member Posts: 17
    Will the Matrix have a timing belt or chain. I prefer the chain since it cuts down on maintenance costs. I simply feel like I am getting my money's worth.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Everything I have read indicates it will have a timing chain. Changing the timing belt at 100,000KM's is always an unwelcome expense.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    No kidding. A belt would be a big minus for this car if it has one. Most new engines seem to be going to chains. Our current Intrigue has a chain on the 3.5L.
  • carguy62carguy62 Member Posts: 545
    Feb. issue reviews both the Matrix and Vibe.
  • 8u6hfd8u6hfd Member Posts: 1,391
    Chain driven
  • grandtotalgrandtotal Member Posts: 1,207
    Whoa!


    http://www.newswire.ca/releases/January2002/07/c0613.html

  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Very aggressive pricing on the Matrix!!

    Given the Vibe has standard A/C, the base price should be about $1000 more.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    Wow!!!! That's agressive pricing!!!!! I'm very glad my Matrix is on order due to be built on friday since that pricing is going to cause long lines I suspect! Much better than the Protege 5 or even the Ford Focus ZX5.
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    I'm looking into an XR. Only question is what is the full list of Canadian standard features? When looking at it the only thing I'd want is Auto, ABS, and moonroof.

    It will be interesting to see what packages come out.
  • TupTup Member Posts: 200
    The preliminary info I have suggests that the XR comes with PW; PD; Keyless entry; A/C; Alloy wheels; var int. wipers; cruise; seat height adjust; side skirts; leather steering wheel; colour keyed door handles; power side mirrors etc. I don't however see any option packages avail. for the XR (dealer provided info). That may have been old info though. The XRS comes with ABS; 6 speaker; 17" alloys; fog lanps; full skirt etc.

    Try calling a dealer.
  • jsminjsmin Member Posts: 11
    Toyota base prices always look good, then you add options and they skyrocket. Toyota is about the only car maker that does not include AC standard any more. I remember looking at RAV-4s and thinking I could get one under $20K US...was I wrong. I think that they wanted $1450 for AC alone. Tires, trim, radio....everything was designed to be upgraded.

    After seeing the production models, it seems that the automakers may have messed up the Vibe and Matrix from concept to reality. All the preproduction models looked pretty nice, but I recently saw a Motorweek review of the Vibe and it was less than appealing. Focus and Pro5 would look pretty sweet next to it IMO. I am sure the Matrix will look a bit better, but I am a little disappointed.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    IMO the Matrix has always been better looking. I agree about the RAV4, though, they even offer a rear bumper as an extra-cost accessory.

    -juice
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I think people looking for more of a crossover SUV looking vehicle will go Vibe and those looking more for a car look will go Matrix. Higher end Matrix models have a street racer look to them. Either way, you are getting the same car under the skin.
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    Thanks TUP. All those as standard features would be great!!!! Lets hope we don't see this bumper as an option business. I really hope that's not the case. As it stands now I'm leaning to a Matrix over a Vibe. If the options start getting crazy, which I hope is not the case, I'll be in a Vibe. Either way there is a fairly large Toyota dealer near my place. I called them today, I'll be there Saturday 2/2/02 to get a quote. Was told to expect 6.8% financing, as that is what they are giving on the Camary right now. That rate is too high IMO, lucky me though, the inlaws hinted they would laon us the money at a much lower rate.
  • stragerstrager Member Posts: 308
    I think they will play their usual options game by inflating the MSRP with a few thousand $ of unnecessary options and accesories.
  • leafguy2727leafguy2727 Member Posts: 83
    You could be right, however with the VIBE being the same car they will in the end have to be priced close. If not one will take the others business.
  • ilia20ilia20 Member Posts: 1
    http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/020108-1.htm
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