Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

qbrozen

jmonroe

qbrozen said:

I think he hacked into @omarman's computer.

jmonroe

explorerx4

@cdnpinhead,
I agree! Decided this should be my only comment on that.

snakeweasel

bwia said:

abacomike said:

I've narrowed my list of possible car choices to the following over the next 4 months:

2020 Mercedes Benz E450 sedan
2020 Genesis G80 3.3 V6 or the V8
2020 Lexus ES350
2030 BMW 5 series

If I end up with the E 450, I will order it in early June for delivery in late August. Mercedes Benz Financial Services has a 3-month pull-ahead program - they pick up the remaining lease payments if I lease or buy another Mercedes. They also forgive the $500 disposition fee at lease end.

So I will begin my search on May 31st. Can't wait - it's been ; years since I bought a new car and my disposition has been ornery due to lack of negotiating and wheeler-dealering.

All nice cars and examples of conspicuous consumption. Not trying to be rude or intrusive but perhaps you could show a little concern for the environment by adding a hybrid or an EV to the mix.

Or a bicycle.

houdini1

He could do like me. I felt so bad about my carbon footprint, I decided no more walking, and now I don't leave any sort of footprint. Hence forth I will drive everywhere I need to go.

fintail

Carbon footprint? I think I'll go start the fintail and cancel out every Prius and Tesla in town Mmmm the smell of exhaust from an engine that was out of production years before even the most primitive smog pump.

I live in small square footage, live close to work, no guilt here. I probably have a smaller footprint than commuters in trashy imcmansions who produce multiple resource-intensive devilspawn and pets and own multiple hybrids or EVs.

roadburner

bwia said:

All nice cars and examples of conspicuous consumption. Not trying to be rude or intrusive but perhaps you could show a little concern for the environment by adding a hybrid or an EV to the mix.

I'm considering a hybrid- it burns both gas and rubber!

carnaught

@abacomike, nice list of cars for you but I would still encourage you to drop the Lexus ES from consideration as it is too low to the ground if one has back issues. Plus, entrance and exit will be uncomfortable because you are a big dude.

ab348

I'm P.O.'ed that one of our supermarket chains here is wrapping themselves in green by eliminating plastic shopping bags as of a week from today in order for them to Save The Planet. Meanwhile they sell tons of stuff wrapped in plastic or in plastic clamshell packages or styrofoam trays. But if I remember that I need a head of lettuce, milk and bread while I'm out, I need to buy yet another reusable shopping bag at whatever price they want to charge if I want to get it home. Absurd.

driver100

houdini1 said:

driver100 said:

ab348 said:

jmonroe said:

Physics tells us that heat is the opposite of cold so the reverse is also true. Actually, cold is the absence of heat but we don't want to get too technical in here. That will just muddy things up. Therefore, when you install insulation in Florida you reverse the way it's installed, from lets say, New York. You can't have it both ways. I thought you knew that.

jmonroe

I was actually thinking about sort of the same thing after I posted but maybe not in the way you suggested. In cold climates when fiberglass insulation is installed in walls you need to seal it up with poly sheets to keep humid air in the house from condensing into the cold insulation, leading to all sorts of Bad Things. But in places like Florida, the warm moist air is on the outside and the cooler air is inside, so wouldn't condensation would remain a concern but in reverse? I honestly don't know what the best way would be there.

Some things to consider:
If your house was built before the mid-1970s -- when energy was cheap and readily available -- the walls and ceiling probably aren't insulated unless some has been added.

Many older Florida homes -- built before the mid-1950s or so -- aren't insulated.

Requirements for new Florida homes call for R-19 minimum ceiling insulation and R-11 minimum in frame walls. ).

Even without insulation, concrete block construction helps protect a house because of the basic properties of the building material.

"There probably are other more cost-effective projects you can do in a concrete block house, but with frame construction, wall insulation is probably cost-effective if you have high air conditioning or heating billsclass="Bold"> Bringing an R-19 attic up to R-30 by adding insulation might save $30 or so per year. But bringing an R-0 attic to R-19 can save hundreds of dollars annually.

Going from R19 to R30 to save $30 a year just ain't worth it.

Full article: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-xpm-1987-02-14-0110070081-story.html

I guess that is true, especially if you don't live in Florida during the hot months, eh?

We have 75 neighbors, about half are here year round, they all have exactly the same insulation.

bwia

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

driver100

jmonroe said:

qbrozen said:

I think he hacked into @omarman's computer.

jmonroe

Yeh, omarman should have been on top of that!

driver100

ab348 said:

I'm P.O.'ed that one of our supermarket chains here is wrapping themselves in green by eliminating plastic shopping bags as of a week from today in order for them to Save The Planet. .

I thought we started using plastic bags to stop using paper bags so we could save the trees. Now I am really getting confused.

driver100

snakeweasel said:

bwia said:

abacomike said:

I've narrowed my list of possible car choices to the following over the next 4 months:

2020 Mercedes Benz E450 sedan
2020 Genesis G80 3.3 V6 or the V8
2020 Lexus ES350
2030 BMW 5 series

If I end up with the E 450, I will order it in early June for delivery in late August. Mercedes Benz Financial Services has a 3-month pull-ahead program - they pick up the remaining lease payments if I lease or buy another Mercedes. They also forgive the $500 disposition fee at lease end.

So I will begin my search on May 31st. Can't wait - it's been ; years since I bought a new car and my disposition has been ornery due to lack of negotiating and wheeler-dealering.

All nice cars and examples of conspicuous consumption. Not trying to be rude or intrusive but perhaps you could show a little concern for the environment by adding a hybrid or an EV to the mix.

Or a bicycle.

How about considering public transit......

oldfarmer50

carnaught said:

@abacomike, nice list of cars for you but I would still encourage you to drop the Lexus ES from consideration as it is too low to the ground if one has back issues. Plus, entrance and exit will be uncomfortable because you are a big dude.

I drove an IS 350 a few years ago on one of those get paid to test drive deals. Not a bad car but it didn’t stand out in any way that would justify the premium price. An ES might make for a plusher ride. More like an Avalon.

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

I'm P.O.'ed that one of our supermarket chains here is wrapping themselves in green by eliminating plastic shopping bags as of a week from today in order for them to Save The Planet. Meanwhile they sell tons of stuff wrapped in plastic or in plastic clamshell packages or styrofoam trays. But if I remember that I need a head of lettuce, milk and bread while I'm out, I need to buy yet another reusable shopping bag at whatever price they want to charge if I want to get it home. Absurd.

New York made use of plastic bags illegal as of March 1st and they’re taxing paper bags a nickel. Glad this is my last year in business.

explorerx4

CT went to you having to pay 10 cents per plastic bag last August.
State thought it would generate significant revenue, but people just started bringing their own bags, instead.
Another unforseen side effect is that the plastic baskets are disappearing from the stores.
I find having to remember to put the bags back in the car after I unpack my groceries, the biggest pain.

stickguy

my area is doing the plastic deal too (and I think possibly paper?) Though we love Aldis and they have always done this. Just remember your bags, or carry out loose. Or pay the nickel for a paper bag (I think they are allowing that). it is silly with the amount of plastic in all the packaging, but every little bit helps.

just need to switch the plastic bags to soy based (or whatever the biodegradable ones are made out of), Just try to not get them too wet.

I don't really care, other than it eliminates my supply of free poop collections bags for when I walk the dog!

houdini1

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

Only one planet wide expert has the authority to give Mike a pass. We'll have to run it past Greta.

Update--Greta wants to know if there is a bus line within 1 mile of Mike's condo.

dino001

bwia said:

abacomike said:

I've narrowed my list of possible car choices to the following over the next 4 months:

2020 Mercedes Benz E450 sedan
2020 Genesis G80 3.3 V6 or the V8
2020 Lexus ES350
2030 BMW 5 series

If I end up with the E 450, I will order it in early June for delivery in late August. Mercedes Benz Financial Services has a 3-month pull-ahead program - they pick up the remaining lease payments if I lease or buy another Mercedes. They also forgive the $500 disposition fee at lease end.

So I will begin my search on May 31st. Can't wait - it's been ; years since I bought a new car and my disposition has been ornery due to lack of negotiating and wheeler-dealering.

All nice cars and examples of conspicuous consumption. Not trying to be rude or intrusive but perhaps you could show a little concern for the environment by adding a hybrid or an EV to the mix.

Après nous le déluge

ab348

houdini1 said:

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

Only one planet wide expert has the authority to give Mike a pass. We'll have to run it past Greta.

Update--Greta wants to know if there is a bus line within 1 mile of Mike's condo.

I think a sailboat might not be too far away.

dino001

Plastic bag taxation/limiting has been long overdue, in my opinion. I’m all for personal freedom and all that good stuff and quite far from environmental extremists, but things that can be done easily and not particularly inconveniently should be done. Want a plastic bag, pay up. Don’t want to pay, use a tote, or reuse old one. Anybody who’s seen the plastic island on the Pacific would understand convenience should have limits and price.

ab348

stickguy said:

my area is doing the plastic deal too (and I think possibly paper?) Though we love Aldis and they have always done this. Just remember your bags, or carry out loose. Or pay the nickel for a paper bag (I think they are allowing that). it is silly with the amount of plastic in all the packaging, but every little bit helps.

I always have reusable bags in the car. But about half the time I forget to bring them into the store.

just need to switch the plastic bags to soy based (or whatever the biodegradable ones are made out of), Just try to not get them too wet.

I don't really care, other than it eliminates my supply of free poop collections backs for when I walk the dog!

Up here we have had municipal collection of compostibles for over 20 years. But those kind of bags are banned because they don't break down fast enough and they clog up the works. Or something. There are long-standing suspicions that the mountains of compost produced are just getting landfilled in any event as it is very poor quality stuff.

I have the same gripes about the plastic bags because of soiled cat litter collection.

I hate govt bans of most fringe-type things like this. In this case it makes far more sense for them to mandate a charge for the shopping bags and let consumers decide. Back when I was working I did the analysis when my company's CEO (actually, his wife) decided we should abandon plastic shopping bags in favor of paper. The data at the time indicated that paper bags brought its own set of environmental issues with it and were really no better. They also cost us a lot more to buy and customers hated them, even to the point where the local news did a piece on the paper bags falling apart if they got wet (what a surprise). But she who must be obeyed got her wish.

ab348

dino001 said:

Plastic bag taxation/limiting has been long overdue, in my opinion. I’m all for personal freedom and all that good stuff and quite far from environmental extremists, but things that can be done easily and not particularly inconveniently should be done. Want a plastic bag, pay up. Don’t want to pay, use a tote, or reuse old one. Anybody who’s seen the plastic island on the Pacific would understand convenience should have limits and price.

A couple of points: up here the enviro extremists won the day with govt and they would only accept a ban, so the choice of paying was not even on the table, though it should have been. Reusable bags are plastic-based in large part and the numbers I saw indicated that they needed to be reused 40 times before their impacts became less than the typical plastic film bag. Apparently the cotton or canvas bags are even worse.

The plastic in the Pacific is a problem largely of those nations own making. The culture there is changing but for a long time there was an attitude that stuff could just be thrown away in waterways or the oceans. The enviro movement here twisted that into it being a problem brought on by us exporting our plastic waste there. I'm not sure of the business case for Asian nations paying to ship that there and then dumping it in the ocean.

In any event there are viable businesses here now that take those bags and convert them into things like plastic "lumber" used for decking, outdoor furniture, etc., so there is no excuse for dumping. Meanwhile here a paper mill has just been forced to close because of its environmental impacts on an ocean inlet (which were truly awful). But use of paper bags is being encouraged. It makes little sense.

houdini1

ab348 said:

dino001 said:

Plastic bag taxation/limiting has been long overdue, in my opinion. I’m all for personal freedom and all that good stuff and quite far from environmental extremists, but things that can be done easily and not particularly inconveniently should be done. Want a plastic bag, pay up. Don’t want to pay, use a tote, or reuse old one. Anybody who’s seen the plastic island on the Pacific would understand convenience should have limits and price.

A couple of points: up here the enviro extremists won the day with govt and they would only accept a ban, so the choice of paying was not even on the table, though it should have been. Reusable bags are plastic-based in large part and the numbers I saw indicated that they needed to be reused 40 times before their impacts became less than the typical plastic film bag. Apparently the cotton or canvas bags are even worse.

The plastic in the Pacific is a problem largely of those nations own making. The culture there is changing but for a long time there was an attitude that stuff could just be thrown away in waterways or the oceans. The enviro movement here twisted that into it being a problem brought on by us exporting our plastic waste there. I'm not sure of the business case for Asian nations paying to ship that there and then dumping it in the ocean.

In any event there are viable businesses here now that take those bags and convert them into things like plastic "lumber" used for decking, outdoor furniture, etc., so there is no excuse for dumping. Meanwhile here a paper mill has just been forced to close because of its environmental impacts on an ocean inlet (which were truly awful). But use of paper bags is being encouraged. It makes little sense.

Those paper mills do smell awful. I've got my own idea of what they mix in to get those brown paper sacks and cardboard items.

driver100

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

He could get a heavy duty extension cord

explorerx4

houdini1,
You are on fire today!

driver100

We bought a new electric car today...........

cdnpinhead

How. . .DARE. . . you!

graphicguy

Tip of the cap to @corvette .....thanks for the car show tix. Greatly appreciated!

explorerx4

Golf Cart?

laurasdada

I've got so many reusable bags from auto/travel shows and company benefit fairs that I just keep a few in my trunk, or by my front door for when I walk to the market. Easy.

stickguy

we have a stash in both cars. Just used mine today at Aldis!

driver100

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

tjc78

Plastic bags are a pretty big expense for retailers. As much as there is a “green” aspect to it I am sure any retailer that drops them instantly adds to the bottom line.

tjc78

stickguy said:

my area is doing the plastic deal too (and I think possibly paper?) Though we love Aldis and they have always done this. Just remember your bags, or carry out loose. Or pay the nickel for a paper bag (I think they are allowing that). it is silly with the amount of plastic in all the packaging, but every little bit helps.

just need to switch the plastic bags to soy based (or whatever the biodegradable ones are made out of), Just try to not get them too wet.

I don't really care, other than it eliminates my supply of free poop collections bags for when I walk the dog!

These work great with the dispenser on the leash.

https://www.amazon.com/SunGrow-Biodegradable-Waste-Bags-Environment-Friendly/dp/B07CZQCV3T/ref=mp_s_a_1_11?keywords=pet+collection+bags&qid=1579996638&sr=8-11

tjc78

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

Our grocery store has a roll of produce bags right next to the chicken. Any chicken I buy goes right in them!

suydam

I have made the switch and actually find using reusable and washable mesh bags for produce, and cloth grocery bags, a big improvement over cheap plastic. I was also surprised to find that beeswax wrap is far superior to Saran Wrap and easier to use. To avoid supermarket plastic packaging, patronize farmers markets when you can. Living near the ocean we really see the effects of all that plastic. My son was shocked when he discovered that Australian beaches actually are covered in tiny ground up bits of plastic. That’s not good for anyone.
It’s nice when taking small steps is actually a life improvement. I keep reminding myself that as a kid we didn’t use so much plastic, and you know, it was ok.

dino001

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

Boohooo. There are washing machines, you know.

ab348

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

Boohooo. There are washing machines, you know.

And what is the enviro impact of that?

The point of all this is that there is no free lunch, and every action has consequences.

Civilizations have always generated waste of some sort. That’s why archaeologists love digging through centuries-old dumps.

dino001

tjc78 said:

Plastic bags are a pretty big expense for retailers. As much as there is a “green” aspect to it I am sure any retailer that drops them instantly adds to the bottom line.

No matter the motivation, it’s OK to do well and do good at the same time. I’m OK with them saving money if I use a reusable bag. I’m not trying to completely eliminate plastic from my life, it’s not possible and there are legitimate uses, but it’s clear lots of use is driven by lazyness and some stupid obsession of of having everything wrapped, sealed. Some of those clamshells are really annoying, when I think about it, can’t count times I hurt myself opening them, or cursed when couldn’t dislodge pieces from each other. Really unnecessary waste.

oldfarmer50

dino001 said:

bwia said:

abacomike said:

I've narrowed my list of possible car choices to the following over the next 4 months:

2020 Mercedes Benz E450 sedan
2020 Genesis G80 3.3 V6 or the V8
2020 Lexus ES350
2030 BMW 5 series

If I end up with the E 450, I will order it in early June for delivery in late August. Mercedes Benz Financial Services has a 3-month pull-ahead program - they pick up the remaining lease payments if I lease or buy another Mercedes. They also forgive the $500 disposition fee at lease end.

So I will begin my search on May 31st. Can't wait - it's been ; years since I bought a new car and my disposition has been ornery due to lack of negotiating and wheeler-dealering.

All nice cars and examples of conspicuous consumption. Not trying to be rude or intrusive but perhaps you could show a little concern for the environment by adding a hybrid or an EV to the mix.

Après nous le déluge

Some can’t wait until you’re gone.

dino001

ab348 said:

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

Boohooo. There are washing machines, you know.

And what is the enviro impact of that?

The point of all this is that there is no free lunch, and every action has consequences.

Civilizations have always generated waste of some sort. That’s why archaeologists love digging through centuries-old dumps.

An impact of washing a dirty bag once in a while together with other dirty clothes is certainly less than taking those plastic bags every time you buy anything.

US consumer produces waste that is probably multiples of that produced by those living in other large economies. Don’t know real statistics, but I see behavior, including mine and I have outside point f reference, as rest of my family lives overseas. I don’t claim any moral high ground of any kind, I use too way much plastic myself, but I would actually appreciate some legal and financial disincentive to dissuade me from doing so, at least using less. Some more decisive government intervention to reduce the growth of the pile of plastic cr.p is long overdue, IMHO. I don’t think my freedom will end if there are some limitations or financial penalties for using plastic when it doesn’t need to be used. Trash is not free.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

So they solve the population problem as well.....

qbrozen

My wife has a collection of at least a couple dozen tote bags.

BTW, there is a fantastic episode of We Bare Bears about tote bags, for those of you without kids who may have missed it.

Can’t find the full episode but here is an edited down version.
https://youtu.be/-Yqp_Xf8q5Y

jmonroe

graphicguy said:

Tip of the cap to @corvette .....thanks for the car show tix. Greatly appreciated!

You're in the wrong forum.

jmonroe

driver100

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

Might save energy using those woven bags but you may die from food poisoning when some of the chicken juice leaks out onto them.

Boohooo. There are washing machines, you know.

Something to think about:
Cotton bags must be reused thousands of times before they meet the environmental performance of plastic bags—and, the Denmark researchers write, organic cotton is worse than conventional cotton when it comes to overall environmental impact. According to the report, organic cotton bags have to be reused many more times than conventional cotton bags (20,000 versus 7,000 times), based on the assumption that organic cotton has a 30% lower yield rate on average than conventional cotton, and therefore was assumed to require 30% more resources, like water, to grow the same amount

Making a paper bag also requires more energy and water than making a plastic bag, so for other environmental considerations besides litter, paper products may be worse than plastic ones.

Read it here

Not everything is as simple as it sounds.

Besides, back home we recycle plastic bags separately, even plastic bottles and recyclables...they will find uses for them if not now....eventually (using them to make highways etc.)

abacomike

carnaught said:

@abacomike, nice list of cars for you but I would still encourage you to drop the Lexus ES from consideration as it is too low to the ground if one has back issues. Plus, entrance and exit will be uncomfortable because you are a big dude.

That's why I dropped the Toyota Avalon from my list. You are probably correct - but I do want to give it a go as the Brits would say.

My guess is that I will end up with a Mercedes or a BMW, but I do want to try the G80. I am going to lease, not buy, my next car. Most important to me is:

-is it comfortable for my body
-does the car accelerate appropriately
-how is the visibility
-can I choose options for improved safety
-and finally, pricing

I might wait for the lease termination date - November 10th - since I put quite a bit of cash down to reduce the monthly payment.

Thanks for your advice - I respect your opinion immensely. 🤪😜😋

abacomike

bwia said:

Oops! I believe @abacomike can be forgiven since he lives in a condo and probably does not have the setup for fast charging.

You are correct, bwia! I have no way to charge an EV. I would consider one if I could easily charge the batteries.

tjc78

“My wife has a collection of at least a couple dozen tote bags”

Bags... bags... bags. Between my wife and mother we are in the same boat. Those $1.00 jumbo ones Christmas tree shop and others sell, canvas ones, beach ones, insulated ones ...you name it.

They do come in handy since we lug a lot of stuff back and forth to the campground home.