Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

driver100

While we were in Europe I was impressed with these hybrid buses, that look like LRT cars, but instead of riding on rails these vehicles can drive on the road. They had designated lanes in busy areas, but, on narrow streets or in areas that had less traffic they could become more like a bus. I like the fact you can buy a few at a time and add more as needed. You also have a lot of flexibility with routes, you can change the routes as needed.

Our city is considering buying an LRT system which is very costly and probably just won't get used. So, I want to write a letter to the paper explaining how these should be considered. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of technical knowledge to make my case.

I am certain the buses said they were 'pollution free", but I can't find that on a website.

They are made by Van Hool and are called Exqui.City Hybrid buses, and an all electric model is being built for Hamburg Germany for 2016.
If you can figure out how much pollution there is, if it is a good system then let me know in laymans (means idiots) language.

Thanks!

driver100

abacomike said:

@driver100:

Right you are driver.  What do you think about my brother abandoning his E400 Sedan Mercedes for a Cayenne S - and still has to wait 3-1/2 months for it?

That will be his 3rd new car in less than 12 months.  And the rest of the posters here thought I was bad  

The irony here is that I am keeping mine!!!  

I saw quite a few of them in France and Germany and I like them...at least the way they look.
http://buyersguide.caranddriver.com/media/assets/submodel/6884.jpg


Mike, if he can do it, and he wants to do it, then good for him.
Is he going through some kind major event in his life? Like a big birthday, or retiring, or something.

No matter what car you have there will always be a nicer one out there, so it takes a certain skill to be happy with what you got.
I love my E400 and I am perfectly happy with it, unless the next changeover is completely awesome. But, I have a feeling it will look like an S and have a low roof with slits for windows and the seating will feel like being in a bathtub. If they do that then I will keep mine forever, and it will look like a classic and get even better with age..

My wife said to me today, after seeing the factory and the way that they take such care in building safe cars,...that she is so glad she has an MB.

houdini1

henryn said:

stever said:

I'm still having fun putting down a clicklock floating floor at our friend's house. My stamina fades after a couple of hours so it's not going fast, but if I pushed harder, I'd mess up more. So far the 15% wastage allowance has barely been touched.

Crawling around on your hands and knees and making a bunch of dust (and staining your hands) seems a lot easier and "cleaner" than pulling a head off an engine or swapping a transmission out, not that I have any experience with that stuff other than oil changes, a few brake jobs and one CV axle swap (and a friend did most of that).

I'm okay with that until you mention "knees". The days when I could work down on my knees are long gone. I can still lean over a fender or work underneath a car on my back fairly well.

Another thing I don't do much of these days is work up on a ladder.

Ladder? I have one cardinal rule...I never let my butt get higher than my head normally is !!

abacomike

driver100 said:

@driver100:

Right you are driver.  What do you think about my brother abandoning his E400 Sedan Mercedes for a Cayenne S - and still has to wait 3-1/2 months for it?

That will be his 3rd new car in less than 12 months.  And the rest of the posters here thought I was bad  

The irony here is that I am keeping mine!!!  

I saw quite a few of them in France and Germany and I like them...at least the way they look. http://buyersguide.caranddriver.com/media/assets/submodel/6884.jpg Mike, if he can do it, and he wants to do it, then good for him. Is he going through some kind major event in his life? Like a big birthday, or retiring, or something. No matter what car you have there will always be a nicer one out there, so it takes a certain skill to be happy with what you got. I love my E400 and I am perfectly happy with it, unless the next changeover is completely awesome. But, I have a feeling it will look like an S and have a low roof with slits for windows and the seating will feel like being in a bathtub. If they do that then I will keep mine forever, and it will look like a classic and get even better with age.. My wife said to me today, after seeing the factory and the way that they take such care in building safe cars,...that she is so glad she has an MB.

We are celebrating our 71st birthday together up on Ponte Vedra where he lives.  They have a big golf tournament there this weekend at Sawgrass TPC.

explorerx4

@abacomike,
One of my wife's brothers used to manage Sawgrass. He's moved up since then.

oldfarmer50

henryn said:

explorerx4 said:

@henryn,
I need to know more about your F-150. Model, options, color, etc.. Now that you've had it for a few days, how do you like the 2.7?

XLT crewcab, 145 inch wheelbase, 5.5 feet bed (very short). 302a option package, Bronze Fire Metallic.

40/20/40 bench seat, no console (I hate consoles, they give my right knee a fit)

The 302a package is fairly complete, including:

LED Box Lighting,
4.2" Productivity Screen in Instrument Cluster,
Reverse Sensing System,
Class IV Trailer Hitch Receiver,
smart trailer tow connector and 4-pin/7-pin wiring harness,
SYNC w/MyFord Touch, voice-activated, in-vehicle connectivity system,
8.0" center-stack touch screen w/audio control and compass,
4.2" productivity screen in instrument cluster and 2 USB charging ports,
SYNC Services receive a complimentary 1 year prepaid subscription,
110V/400W Outlet,
XLT Chrome Appearance Package,
Chrome Billet Style Grille w/Chrome Surround, black mesh insert,
Chrome Step Bars,
Tires: P265/60R18 BSW A/S,
Chrome Door Handles w/Black Strap,
Wheels: 18" Chrome-Like PVD,
Single-Tip Chrome Exhaust,
Rear Under-Seat Storage,
10-Way Power Driver's & Passenger Seats, power driver and passenger lumbar,
Radio: Single-CD w/SiriusXM Satellite
7 speakers,
Power-Sliding Rear Window,
privacy glass,
Rear Window Defroster (Fleet),
Power-Adjustable Pedals,
Heated Front Seats,
Auto-Dimming Rearview Mirror,
Leather-Wrapped Steering Wheel,
Rear View Camera,
Power Driver/Passenger Lumbar,
Remote Start System,
Dual Power Glass Heated Sideview Mirrors Manual folding,
turn signal,
auto-dimming feature (driver's side),
black skull caps and interior auto-dimming rearview mirror

The truck has less than 20 miles on it, I can't really tell you much at present. During the week, I drive my Cadillac to work. It fits much better in the parking garage at work, and being 9 years old with a number of very minor scratches and door dings already, I care much less about adding more door dings.


Wow! Sounds more like a Lincoln Town Car. Very nice.

driver100

abacomike said:

driver100 said:

abacomike said:

@driver100:

Right you are driver.  What do you think about my brother abandoning his E400 Sedan Mercedes for a Cayenne S - and still has to wait 3-1/2 months for it?

That will be his 3rd new car in less than 12 months.  And the rest of the posters here thought I was bad  

The irony here is that I am keeping mine!!!  

I saw quite a few of them in France and Germany and I like them...at least the way they look.
http://buyersguide.caranddriver.com/media/assets/submodel/6884.jpg


Mike, if he can do it, and he wants to do it, then good for him.
Is he going through some kind major event in his life? Like a big birthday, or retiring, or something.

No matter what car you have there will always be a nicer one out there, so it takes a certain skill to be happy with what you got.
I love my E400 and I am perfectly happy with it, unless the next changeover is completely awesome. But, I have a feeling it will look like an S and have a low roof with slits for windows and the seating will feel like being in a bathtub. If they do that then I will keep mine forever, and it will look like a classic and get even better with age..

My wife said to me today, after seeing the factory and the way that they take such care in building safe cars,...that she is so glad she has an MB.

We are celebrating our 71st birthday together up on Ponte Vedra where he lives.  They have a big golf tournament there this weekend at Sawgrass TPC.

Happy Birthdays!

ab348

driver100 said:

Your story reminds me of another scam thing. We went to get groceries today and they want to know if we want to donate a food basket. Well, I just saw a program where these companies do that, then they claim the tax write off. In the case of a Canadian bookstore chain, you donate money so children can have books. Ah, isn't that nice! Until you find out the books they give to the kids are paid for at full retail price. So, I donate $20, the school can choose a book worth $20, and the book store chain makes 40% or $8.

I'm not sure if I am getting more paranoid, but it feels like everything I buy or do should be double checked, and being online doesn't help!

I am getting really tired of constantly being asked at checkout to donate to some cause the retailer is connected to. Even worse are the kids bagging your groceries and expecting a donation (I never carry cash) or the kids harassing you at the entrance for donations of something.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

I was caught between a rock and a hard place. So I paid him another $200 because he had the paint and the selected colors. I was furious! I told my neighbor and he agreed with me. I asked him why he recommended this painter. He said because he gets a referral fee. I said to him, "...you mean to tell me you took graft to get him my paint job?" He just walked away. I knew the extra $200 was my neighbor's pocket money

Because he gets a referral fee...it would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic. If the painter explained about the $200 charge up front you probably still would have gone ahead with it, and would think a lot more of him and his work.

Your story reminds me of another scam thing. We went to get groceries today and they want to know if we want to donate a food basket. Well, I just saw a program where these companies do that, then they claim the tax write off. In the case of a Canadian bookstore chain, you donate money so children can have books. Ah, isn't that nice! Until you find out the books they give to the kids are paid for at full retail price. So, I donate $20, the school can choose a book worth $20, and the book store chain makes 40% or $8.

I'm not sure if I am getting more paranoid, but it feels like everything I buy or do should be double checked, and being online doesn't help!

That's what happens when you spend time in the states. I would never question someone's motivations when I was in Canada. I'm sure there are scammers up there too but most people seem to be straight shooters. Same thing with the American Mid West.

In NY I wouldn't trust my own grandma.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

@driver100:

Right you are driver.  What do you think about my brother abandoning his E400 Sedan Mercedes for a Cayenne S - and still has to wait 3-1/2 months for it?

That will be his 3rd new car in less than 12 months.  And the rest of the posters here thought I was bad  

The irony here is that I am keeping mine!!!  

Runs in the family.

oldfarmer50

More bad news for VW.

http://www.propertycasualty360.com/2015/10/01/paul-walkers-daughter-sues-porsche

stickguy

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying.

Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

driver100

stickguy said:

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying.

Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

Stick, I watched some of those shows...they are still on some stations, and it was really sad what the home reno guys could do. Often get a big down payment and never complete the work. Often it isn't worth going after them, they go out of business and open up under a new name. They should have to pay into a fund, and people can get reimbursed if they do poor work or run off.

abacomike

stickguy said:

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying. Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

I remember that show.  It was taped in Canada, IIRC, an I really enjoyed it.  He would demolish the shady contractor's work to uncover substandard work as well as remodeled kitchens, basements, bathrooms and structural bracing that could not meet local codes.

There was one such show that uncovered corner bracing that would collapse in a 50 mph wind.  Yes, the world is filled with unscrupulous contractors.

berri

I recall more than a few stories about shoddy or crooked contractors and businesses when I lived in the Orlando area years back.

nyccarguy

@abacomike - let me wish you both a very happy birthday! I think your brother is going is going to LOVE his Cayenne S. My parents are on their second Cayenne and they couldn't be happier. The Cayenne is well engineered & beautifully crafted. It does everything well.

abacomike

nyccarguy said:

@abacomike - let me wish you both a very happy birthday! I think your brother is going is going to LOVE his Cayenne S. My parents are on their second Cayenne and they couldn't be happier. The Cayenne is well engineered & beautifully crafted. It does everything well.

Thanks for the birthday wishes.  He told me there wasn't one Cayenne S on the east coast that was in the color or had the equipment/options he would accept.  $92,000 MSRP is no cheap SUV.  You could buy an S Class Mercedes for those numbers (maybe $10,000 more MSRP).  He wanted the 400+ hp engine, sport pkg., sound package, etc.  I looked on the Edmunds App and tried to build a Cayenne S.  The list of options is a mile long.

I'm just not a SUV kind of guy.  If I had a family with kids or I towed a boat or camped out s lot, I might be more inclined to buy an SUV.  But right now, it's a Corvette Stingray or a Sedan.  Since I can't get out of a Corvette once I get in the driver's seat, I'm left with a Mercedes E 400 Sedan.  

stickguy

I don't mind the RDX, but prefer driving a sedan (or some sort of car, hatchbacks are fine). Sitting up can come in handy though at times.

doesn't drive quite as nicely, but we do make use of the configuration often enough that we will likely always have some sort of wagon style vehicle.

[Deleted User]

driver100 said:

While we were in Europe I was impressed with these hybrid buses, that look like LRT cars, but instead of riding on rails these vehicles can drive on the road. They had designated lanes in busy areas, but, on narrow streets or in areas that had less traffic they could become more like a bus. I like the fact you can buy a few at a time and add more as needed. You also have a lot of flexibility with routes, you can change the routes as needed.

Our city is considering buying an LRT system which is very costly and probably just won't get used. So, I want to write a letter to the paper explaining how these should be considered. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of technical knowledge to make my case.

I am certain the buses said they were 'pollution free", but I can't find that on a website.

They are made by Van Hool and are called Exqui.City Hybrid buses, and an all electric model is being built for Hamburg Germany for 2016.
If you can figure out how much pollution there is, if it is a good system then let me know in laymans (means idiots) language.

Thanks!

Looks like the drivetrains are configurable to match the local needs. Options include diesel electric hybrid, battery electric, trolley (overhead power wires), compressed natural gas hybrid, and fuel cell. So, pollution emitted will be dependent on the drivetrain selected and possibly local electrical production source. Looks like they tried very hard to cosmetically make a bus look like a train. The big differentiator between this and a bus is the ability to select modern alternative drivetrains (though trolleys and hybrids already exist).

tjc78

@oldfarmer50,

That truck is more equipped than any Town Car to ever leave the line.   Awesome list of equipment 

sda

stickguy said:

I don't mind the RDX, but prefer driving a sedan (or some sort of car, hatchbacks are fine). Sitting up can come in handy though at times.

doesn't drive quite as nicely, but we do make use of the configuration often enough that we will likely always have some sort of wagon style vehicle.

I like the higher driving position of the Pilot, especially in traffic or when traveling. It enables me to see over the bridge guard rails where as in a sedan I can only see the guard rail and nothing beyond. I do prefer the driving dynamics of a sedan, however.

driver100

tyguy said:

driver100 said:

While we were in Europe I was impressed with these hybrid buses, that look like LRT cars, but instead of riding on rails these vehicles can drive on the road. They had designated lanes in busy areas, but, on narrow streets or in areas that had less traffic they could become more like a bus. I like the fact you can buy a few at a time and add more as needed. You also have a lot of flexibility with routes, you can change the routes as needed.

Our city is considering buying an LRT system which is very costly and probably just won't get used. So, I want to write a letter to the paper explaining how these should be considered. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of technical knowledge to make my case.

I am certain the buses said they were 'pollution free", but I can't find that on a website.

They are made by Van Hool and are called Exqui.City Hybrid buses, and an all electric model is being built for Hamburg Germany for 2016.
If you can figure out how much pollution there is, if it is a good system then let me know in laymans (means idiots) language.

Thanks!

Looks like the drivetrains are configurable to match the local needs. Options include diesel electric hybrid, battery electric, trolley (overhead power wires), compressed natural gas hybrid, and fuel cell. So, pollution emitted will be dependent on the drivetrain selected and possibly local electrical production source. Looks like they tried very hard to cosmetically make a bus look like a train. The big differentiator between this and a bus is the ability to select modern alternative drivetrains (though trolleys and hybrids already exist).

Thanks for the info ty. This company has a new model that is all electric and has no pollution. Trams are getting popular in Europe...they bring people to downtown areas where they love to shop....unlike in North America. These bus/light rail transit vehicles seem to have those advantages, plus a lot of flexibility, to make or change routes.

imidazol97

driver100 said:

Thanks for the info ty. This company has a new model that is all electric and has no pollution.

Actually, there is pollution somewhere. Energy has to be generated somewhere, somehow. Building the electric motors or power plants or the photovoltaic cells generates pollution as well.

qbrozen

On our house saga, we are currently homeless. Our stuff is sitting in 2 trucks and 2 PODs at the moment while we spent 2 nights in a hotel and now with the in-laws, followed by at least 2 more nights in a hotel Sunday-Tues. Fingers crossed that the current closing date of Tuesday holds up.

ab348

stickguy said:

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying.

Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

Well, yeah, though he could be a little sanctimonious at times. I found the format got stale in a hurry - "Take it all down" was always heard in the first 10 minutes. He certainly did excellent work, but it was never stated how much doing it the way he chose would cost. There are many ways to get to the same end result that involve different techniques and obviously different investment. Holmes never cared about saving money - he always did everything to the absolute nth degree and the cost would have been huge for some of those projects.

imidazol97

ab348 said:

Well, yeah, though he could be a little sanctimonious at times. I found the format got stale in a hurry - "Take it all down" was always heard in the first 10 minutes. He certainly did excellent work, but it was never stated how much doing it the way he chose would cost. There are many ways to get to the same end result that involve different techniques and obviously different investment. Holmes never cared about saving money - he always did everything to the absolute nth degree and the cost would have been huge for some of those projects.

Right.

It was fun to watch him. I miss the show now that it's gone from whichever cable channel I used to catch it on. It was like watching Norm on This Expensive House doing woodworking. He has every kind of equipment piece from any manufacturer, probably all donated to the This Old House for his use. And he tells us little people working with a drill, hammer, and saw to use this super-dooper fishtail joint making machine to do the build like he's doing in the show. Yeah, Right. When pigs fly (Sorry Cincinnati). http://www.fpqrp.org/pighist.htm

stever

Used to watch the Woodwright guy back in the day. Fun seeing a hunk of wood become a chair with just an adze and an old brace and bit. Way too much work though!

@qbrozen, you can borrow our van but they turned off the water to the river for the year so you'll have to haul your own.

explorerx4

@qbrozen,
Your house was on the market for a while with little interest, but I guess you got an offer with a quick closing involved?

henryn

explorerx4 said:

@henryn,
So that's a SuperCrew? I've been looking at trucks for a while, but not quite ready to pull the trigger.
One thing I'm debating is whether to get a base truck(XL) and add as I go along, or higher trim like XLT with 302A right from the start.

If you want very many of the niceties included in the 302a package, you will definitely save money buying it as a package. Right now, the way the discounts and incentives are stacked, the 302a is only about $1,000 more than the 301a, and it includes quite a bit more. I was unable to get the information I wanted / needed from the Ford web site, I used TrueCar to get a list of what was in each package, and then compared them.

Don't just look at the line item cost for each package, compare the window stickers for a 301a and a 302a (with everything else held constant). The bottom line is only about $1,000 different.

You look at the line item cost for the 2.7L versus the 3.5L engine, and you think it's only $700 difference. But there is another $300 cash back on the 2.7L. And if the dealer has a large number of 2.7L trucks, and very few 3.5L trucks, you know he is going to deal harder on the one he has more of.

I will say this, you can get a similar new Chevy for about $2,000 less right now. But I just really like the new engine technology (twin turbo V6 versus a really, really old V8), and the much lighter aluminum bodied Ford. Toyota seems to want about $10,000 more, and I am not going to do business with Dodge/Fiat.

The Chevy isn't bad though. And $2,000 is a lot of money. I almost bought one a few weeks ago, and would have if they had gone through with the deal we negotiated.

sb55

ab348 said:

stickguy said:

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying.

Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

Well, yeah, though he could be a little sanctimonious at times. I found the format got stale in a hurry - "Take it all down" was always heard in the first 10 minutes. He certainly did excellent work, but it was never stated how much doing it the way he chose would cost. There are many ways to get to the same end result that involve different techniques and obviously different investment. Holmes never cared about saving money - he always did everything to the absolute nth degree and the cost would have been huge for some of those projects.

I liked the Holmes show OK. Adam Corolla has "to catch a contractor" on Cable. Since he's a comedian/contractor, it's fairly low key and humorous. Think Chris Hanson who used to do those catch a (sexual) predator show on NBC dateline and you get the idea.

roadburner

My wife got me watching Rehab Addict; it's pretty entertaining- and borderline down-to-earth.

stickguy

I love Nicole. that is a good show.

oldfarmer50

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

Thanks for the info ty. This company has a new model that is all electric and has no pollution.

Actually, there is pollution somewhere. Energy has to be generated somewhere, somehow. Building the electric motors or power plants or the photovoltaic cells generates pollution as well.

The EPA considers the very breath you exhale to be a pollutant to be regulated.

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

stickguy said:

Driver, they have it in Canada too. There was a show on for a while out of Toronto with a guy (Mike Holmes) that came in after people were ripped off on how remodeling. He showed all the crap they did, then fixed it. Some of the jobs people got stuck with were terrifying.

Holmes on Homes. The type of contractor you pray you find to work on your own house!

Well, yeah, though he could be a little sanctimonious at times. I found the format got stale in a hurry - "Take it all down" was always heard in the first 10 minutes. He certainly did excellent work, but it was never stated how much doing it the way he chose would cost. There are many ways to get to the same end result that involve different techniques and obviously different investment. Holmes never cared about saving money - he always did everything to the absolute nth degree and the cost would have been huge for some of those projects.

Ever wonder how many of these home owners brought their troubles on themselves by taking the lowest bid?

driver100

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

Thanks for the info ty. This company has a new model that is all electric and has no pollution.

Actually, there is pollution somewhere. Energy has to be generated somewhere, somehow. Building the electric motors or power plants or the photovoltaic cells generates pollution as well.

I thought about that....but, I guess the sign on the bus is carefully worded, something like this bus "runs pollution free".

It is like when we bought my wife's new GLK our daughter bought the exact same model but a diesel version, because her family is always after her to be environmentally sensitive. I said I'll stick to the known and proven technology (because I am part dinosaur), and look at whose car is probably polluting more.

driver100

I was just reading where VWs snafu may hurt their rivals even more....mainly Peugeot, Renault and Fiat. All are more heavily invested in diesel technology and aren't doing much to develop electric technology.

This could help Toyota and Honda as they have been leaning toward electric/battery power rather than diesel. Maybe it is a clever plot by VW to put their European rivals out of business (or maybe I am believing too many conspiracy theories).

qbrozen

explorerx4 said:

@qbrozen, Your house was on the market for a while with little interest, but I guess you got an offer with a quick closing involved?

We rented it and they needed it quickly.

when it rains... The T&C headlights are on the fritz yet again. I noticed last night 1 was out and then this morn they were both absent. Called the dealer and they said to bring it in. Maybe they didn't think we'd do it immediately, but we did and they did not have the capacity to work on it. After I huffed and puffed a bit, the service writer put us in a loaner Cherokee. Of course, the lack of space puts us at a disadvantage while homeless. Sigh. I'm starting to ponder lemon law myself. This is 4th visit for same problem, and the headlights are certainly safety related.

driver100

This was one of my favorite rooms at the Mercedes Benz Museum. I like the white model on the left in the 2nd row back.

http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/mercedes-benz-museum-stuttgart-germany-may-automobile-inside-stuttgart-germany-may-covers-41382757.jpg

The museum from the outside:

robr2

stickguy said:

I love Nicole. that is a good show.

Except for when she opens her mouth and yells with that Minnesota accent "Oh My GAWWWDDD, who would do that?"

nyccarguy

@henryn - pickup trucks certainly are an interesting category. Lots of brand loyalty.
So many different configurations, options, and packages. Full size Pickup trucks are a big source of profits for auto companies. You've demonstrated to us that if you buy at the right price with loads of incentives, don't mile it up, or beat on it too much that they can hold their value well.

Ford gives you the choice of the 2.7 or 3.5 Turbo V6 as well as the good ole 5.0 V8. Chevy gets the job done with the tried & true 5.3L pushrod V8 and 6 speed automatic transmission. Ram gives you the choice of a HEMI V8 or Turbo Diesel V6. Toyota offers their Tundra with old school engine & transmission technology that supposedly runs forever and have eye popping resale numbers.

My question is the mid sized pickups. Are they really necessary? I know it is something else for the automakers to sell, but "these things ain't cheap." Build your own Chevy Colorado or Toyota Tacoma and you'll see it is very easy for the sticker price to climb into the low to mid $40K range. Now obviously you'll be able to negotiate some sort of discount on a mid sized pickup. The rebates & incentives on the full sized pickups have got to make their transaction prices not that much higher than its mid sized pickup little brother. The mid sized pickups really aren't THAT much smaller, they offer little advantage as far as gas mileage goes.

boomchek

nyccarguy said:

@henryn - pickup trucks certainly are an interesting category. Lots of brand loyalty.
So many different configurations, options, and packages. Full size Pickup trucks are a big source of profits for auto companies. You've demonstrated to us that if you buy at the right price with loads of incentives, don't mile it up, or beat on it too much that they can hold their value well.

Ford gives you the choice of the 2.7 or 3.5 Turbo V6 as well as the good ole 5.0 V8. Chevy gets the job done with the tried & true 5.3L pushrod V8 and 6 speed automatic transmission. Ram gives you the choice of a HEMI V8 or Turbo Diesel V6. Toyota offers their Tundra with old school engine & transmission technology that supposedly runs forever and have eye popping resale numbers.

My question is the mid sized pickups. Are they really necessary? I know it is something else for the automakers to sell, but "these things ain't cheap." Build your own Chevy Colorado or Toyota Tacoma and you'll see it is very easy for the sticker price to climb into the low to mid $40K range. Now obviously you'll be able to negotiate some sort of discount on a mid sized pickup. The rebates & incentives on the full sized pickups have got to make their transaction prices not that much higher than its mid sized pickup little brother. The mid sized pickups really aren't THAT much smaller, they offer little advantage as far as gas mileage goes.

I saw one of the new Canyons on the road yesterday and almost confused it with a GMC Sierra because of its huge for a mid size truck size. It was driving beside an older late 90s' Dodge Ram and it was almost the same size. It's like a 4/5 scale of full size trucks from 2 decades ago. Probably same size or bigger than GMC trucks from the late 80s/early 90s. Same thing with the new Tacoma, looks huge too. I agree that it's almost pointless buying one if you're looking for a "small" truck. I still believe that manufacturers would do well selling simple small body on frame small trucks, priced at $15-$20k equipped with basics like power windows, locks, a/c (these options are inexpensive these days anyways), simple 4 cylinder engine or a small V6, with an option of 4X4. I mean it wouldn't be expensive to build a no frills vehicle, with a small cab and a metal box out back. Working in the car business, we have a lot of customers coming in looking for used small basic trucks, and they're harder to find these days.

stever

Chicken Tax. Don't know about BC and why y'all don't have them, but open the gates down here and plenty would sell.

In theory anyway.

ab348

nyccarguy said:

My question is the mid sized pickups. Are they really necessary? I know it is something else for the automakers to sell, but "these things ain't cheap." Build your own Chevy Colorado or Toyota Tacoma and you'll see it is very easy for the sticker price to climb into the low to mid $40K range. Now obviously you'll be able to negotiate some sort of discount on a mid sized pickup. The rebates & incentives on the full sized pickups have got to make their transaction prices not that much higher than its mid sized pickup little brother. The mid sized pickups really aren't THAT much smaller, they offer little advantage as far as gas mileage goes.

The mid-sizers don't offer much of either a price or FE advantage. But the size is the big selling point. I think. They are just enough smaller than the battleship class to make a difference in day to day use for some people. I personally think the size of today's pickups is ridiculously huge. Compare the size of a current Chevy or Ford half-ton to a late-60s C10 or F-100 and it is shocking. No excuse, really.

ab348

oldfarmer50 said:

Ever wonder how many of these home owners brought their troubles on themselves by taking the lowest bid?

I'm sure that was the case in some instances, but I clearly remember several shows where the hapless homeowner explicitly stated that they did not take the lowest bid and instead picked someone else for any number of reasons.

robr2

stever said:

Chicken Tax. Don't know about BC and why y'all don't have them, but open the gates down here and plenty would sell.

In theory anyway.

Nah, it's not that. Ford is considering bringing back the Ranger due to the better than lukewarm reception the Canyon and Colorado got. The old Ranger was a low profit vehicle for Ford and they had no interest in selling another low profit truck that could cut into the sales of the F150. Their research showed that most private buyers bought them because of the price, not the utility. Now that GM has shown that people are willing to pay $25K+ for a mid size truck, they may give it a go.

It may come down to the UAW negotiations. Ford may bring back the Ranger as a high profit, low margin option solely to give the UAW some new jobs. If Ford can offer the UAW a new product to build and make a little money on, then they both get a win.

robr2

boomchek said:

I still believe that manufacturers would do well selling simple small body on frame small trucks, priced at $15-$20k equipped with basics like power windows, locks, a/c (these options are inexpensive these days anyways), simple 4 cylinder engine or a small V6, with an option of 4X4. I mean it wouldn't be expensive to build a no frills vehicle, with a small cab and a metal box out back. Working in the car business, we have a lot of customers coming in looking for used small basic trucks, and they're harder to find these days.

Nah - that truck is gone. You may have a few customers but not enough to make a low margin product exciting for the manufacturers.

FCA is considering the RAM 700/Fiat Strada for the North American market. It's a little FWD, unibody trucklet that should keep those folks happy. The problem is they are made in South Africa and Brazil, both of which would be subject to the Chicken Tax. They could make it in Mexico for the US in order to keep prices down.

stickguy

I saw the new world ranger on Amazing race a few times. It looked great. Really think it would do well here.

driver100

Henryn....your new F-150 sounds fantastic...not exactly like roughing it by having a truck these days.

Out of curiousity, what is this feature...is it for religious people?

"black skull caps and interior auto-dimming rearview mirror "

explorerx4

@driver100,
Mercedes has the same optional feature.

driver100

explorerx4 said:

@driver100,
Mercedes has the same optional feature.

But, what is it?