Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

[Deleted User]

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:

@driver100,
Mercedes has the same optional feature.

But, what is it?

I believe the "skull cap" refers to a piece of colored plastic on the side mirrors. Weird name. I'm betting the aftermarket industry coined it.

henryn

tyguy said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:

@driver100,
Mercedes has the same optional feature.

But, what is it?

I believe the "skull cap" refers to a piece of colored plastic on the side mirrors. Weird name. I'm betting the aftermarket industry coined it.

I think that's true. I never asked. The outside rear view mirrors are covered in a black plastic like material.

bwia

robr2 said:

Chicken Tax. Don't know about BC and why y'all don't have them, but open the gates down here and plenty would sell. In theory anyway.

Nah, it's not that. Ford is considering bringing back the Ranger due to the better than lukewarm reception the Canyon and Colorado got. The old Ranger was a low profit vehicle for Ford and they had no interest in selling another low profit truck that could cut into the sales of the F150. Their research showed that most private buyers bought them because of the price, not the utility. Now that GM has shown that people are willing to pay $25K+ for a mid size truck, they may give it a go. It may come down to the UAW negotiations. Ford may bring back the Ranger as a high profit, low margin option solely to give the UAW some new jobs. If Ford can offer the UAW a new product to build and make a little money on, then they both get a win.

Hmm, Ford bringing back the Ranger with high profit and low margin. Is this a new business model as I've never heard of it before. 

driver100

bwia said:

robr2 said:

stever said:

Chicken Tax. Don't know about BC and why y'all don't have them, but open the gates down here and plenty would sell.

In theory anyway.

Nah, it's not that. Ford is considering bringing back the Ranger due to the better than lukewarm reception the Canyon and Colorado got. The old Ranger was a low profit vehicle for Ford and they had no interest in selling another low profit truck that could cut into the sales of the F150. Their research showed that most private buyers bought them because of the price, not the utility. Now that GM has shown that people are willing to pay $25K+ for a mid size truck, they may give it a go.

It may come down to the UAW negotiations. Ford may bring back the Ranger as a high profit, low margin option solely to give the UAW some new jobs. If Ford can offer the UAW a new product to build and make a little money on, then they both get a win.

Hmm, Ford bringing back the Ranger with high profit and low margin. Is this a new business model as I've never heard of it before. 

Small trucks are an oxymoron. If you are going to buy a truck it has to be a TRUCK, not some wimpy econobox with a box on the back.

Canadians tend to buy smaller vehicles so they kept the Ranger going for an extra few years here. My extremely economical minded BIL bought one...manual on the tree, a.m. radio, no air. He likes it, gets him where he wants to go, it's cheap and pretty solid. The box is not protected and it gets dinged up prettty badly - just one small item knocks against the metal and there is a dent. His son bought a Toyota truck and for a bit more it is much nicer, and the box is protected.

imidazol97

Wednesday is the day for VW to tell what it's going to do to "fix" the vehicles it has been
caught selling with fraudulent emissions testing. Articles says it could kill the
company.

"Volkswagen Groups's incoming chairman warned managers that the automaker's diesel-emission scandal poses "an existence-threatening crisis for the company" as new details emerged about how the debacle unfolded."

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/cars/2015/10/04/volkswagen-emissions-crisis/73356630/

Taxpayers of US duped into paying $51,000,000 in subsidies.

http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-vw-subsidies-20150922-story.html

ab348

driver100 said:

Canadians tend to buy smaller vehicles so they kept the Ranger going for an extra few years here. My extremely economical minded BIL bought one...manual on the tree, a.m. radio, no air. He likes it, gets him where he wants to go, it's cheap and pretty solid. The box is not protected and it gets dinged up prettty badly - just one small item knocks against the metal and there is a dent. His son bought a Toyota truck and for a bit more it is much nicer, and the box is protected.

Both my brother and a good buddy of mine bought them. In fact, both have had 2 each. They are certainly no-frills and now that they have a few years on them they are starting to have lots of problems. The rear frame rails on my brothers totally rusted away in 7 years. My buddy has had lots of niggling problems with his. He is considering a Colorado/Canyon, while my brother is waiting for a screaming deal on a new fullsize to come along.

graphicguy

One of my best friends came over for a cookout on Saturday. He is retired Ford engineer. He did 30 years with Ford, and is now an engineering consultant, making more working part time than he did working for Ford, full time.

Anyway, he just bought a 2016 Ford Explorer Platinum with his Ford Employee discount. $50+K vehicle. And, I think it would proably put just about any other luxury SUV to shame. It is quite opulent. It has very comfortable tufted leather seats throughout. Ford really stepped up their game with the version of Synch in his vehicle, which operated without a hitch when he let me test drive it.

Great suspension. Handled well for such a heavy vehicle. Laser Cruise, self parking, high quality materials throughout, excellent Sony stereo, very well put togehter. Just a nice piece throughout. Had good punch from the turbo V6. Steering was very communicative and smooth (no "hitches" in the power steering, which again reminds me how broke my CTS really is).

Those who are in the market for an SUV should at least test the new Explorer.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

Wednesday is the day for VW to tell what it's going to do to "fix" the vehicles it has been
caught selling with fraudulent emissions testing. Articles says it could kill the
company.

"Volkswagen Groups's incoming chairman warned managers that the automaker's diesel-emission scandal poses "an existence-threatening crisis for the company" as new details emerged about how the debacle unfolded."

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/cars/2015/10/04/volkswagen-emissions-crisis/73356630/

Taxpayers of US duped into paying $51,000,000 in subsidies.

http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-vw-subsidies-20150922-story.html

Good articles imid. Especially the 2nd one.....I forgot the government gave $1200 grants for people to buy these clean diesels when they first came out.

Also, interesting that VW was caught in 1974 and promised to clean up their act:
In 1974, the automaker paid a $120,000 fine to settle EPA charges that it gamed pollution control systems in four models by changing carburetor settings and shutting off an emissions-control system at low temperatures. VW didn't admit guilt but pledged management changes to ensure future compliance with EPA regulations

Then there will be payments for diminished value of their cars. Maybe they did me a favor by not honoring the warranty on the Audi. I was out $1200 but the value if I kept it probably dropped by that amount. It was a gas model, but all of VW/Audi will get tainted, as they should be.

robr2

bwia said:

Hmm, Ford bringing back the Ranger with high profit and low margin. Is this a new business model as I've never heard of it before. 

Yeah, I screwed up. I meant high profit, low volume. By the time I noticed, the 4 hour edit window had expired.

abacomike

@driver100 said:

"...but all of VW/Audi will get tainted, as they should be."

Driver, I disagree with your comment, "...as they should be..."!  I do not wish harm on a company or its consumers for mistakes, even intentional, like VW/Audi.  Remember, consumers who own VW's or Audi's are the ones hurt most by an auto manufacturer either going out of business or being seriously harmed.

In GM's case, they intentionally withheld essential details on a faulty ignition switch which caused serious injuries and scores of deaths in auto crashes.  But even GM and its consumers should not be harmed (other than paying fines and damages in court settled suits).  GM and VW/Audi employ hundreds of thousands of workers, maybe millions, who depend on the manufacturer for their financial existence.

Fine them, YES!  Have them pay hefty sums to consumers who suffered as a result of their errors, YES!  But we sure don't want them driven out of business, do we?

tjc78

graphicguy said:

One of my best friends came over for a cookout on Saturday. He is retired Ford engineer. He did 30 years with Ford, and is now an engineering consultant, making more working part time than he did working for Ford, full time.

Anyway, he just bought a 2016 Ford Explorer Platinum with his Ford Employee discount. $50+K vehicle. And, I think it would proably put just about any other luxury SUV to shame. It is quite opulent. It has very comfortable tufted leather seats throughout. Ford really stepped up their game with the version of Synch in his vehicle, which operated without a hitch when he let me test drive it.

Great suspension. Handled well for such a heavy vehicle. Laser Cruise, self parking, high quality materials throughout, excellent Sony stereo, very well put togehter. Just a nice piece throughout. Had good punch from the turbo V6. Steering was very communicative and smooth (no "hitches" in the power steering, which again reminds me how broke my CTS really is).

Those who are in the market for an SUV should at least test the new Explorer.

The Explorer is a really nice vehicle, when it came time for an SUV last year it was on our short list. In the end the wife just preferred the styling and (what seemed to be) larger interior the Enclave offered. The Ford definitely had the Enclave beat on technology. I'm not so sure how GM can sell these nearly 50K SUV's without smartkey. I don't miss it, but every once in a while the wife says she liked the keyless start our Lacrosse had.

stever

imidazol97 said:

Wednesday is the day for VW to tell what it's going to do to "fix" the vehicles it has been caught selling with fraudulent emissions testing. Articles says it could kill the company.

"Volkswagen's promise to deliver a fix for its rigged diesel engine "in the next few days" refers to vehicles sold in Europe and other foreign markets, not the U.S., according to a company source." VW's Promised Fix for Diesels Doesn't Apply to U.S. Vehicles: Source (NBC)

Doesn't sound like the US fix is going to be so quick and easy.

berri

Are there any really clean car companies out there? Most anyone in Detroit or overseas has had a scandal or two over the past decade or so. I think VW will have short term hit, Audi less so, and then things will get back to normal as long as there isn't lots more to the story.

driver100

abacomike said:

@driver100 said:

"...but all of VW/Audi will get tainted, as they should be."

Driver, I disagree with your comment, "..But even GM and its consumers should not be harmed (other than paying fines and damages in court settled suits).  GM and VW/Audi employ hundreds of thousands of workers, maybe millions, who depend on the manufacturer for their financial existence.

Fine them, YES!  Have them pay hefty sums to consumers who suffered as a result of their errors, YES!  But we sure don't want them driven out of business, do we?

Oh, I don't want them to be run out of business, or go bankrupt. But, I was treated very unfairly by Audi plus I am a much more revengeful person than you are Mike....or most people for that matter.

What I actually said was, ". I was out $1200 but the value if I kept it probably dropped by that amount. It was a gas model, but all of VW/Audi will get tainted, as they should be."

In imids 2nd article it said ""This might be the perfect case for Department of Justice to come down on the criminal side against individuals and not just the company," said Carl Tobias, a University of Richmond law professor. "Someone had to do the computer programming. Someone had to OK this, and all in what is known as an autocratic, top-down company."

I take that to mean higher ups knew what was going on and approved it. I believe that a lot goes on at VW/Audi and we should be suspicious. I feel sorry for the dealers and the workers and all the people affected by this story. The solution should not destroy the company, but it should penalize them greatly. Apparently this cost lives of innocent people too.

On the other hand, it could be one rogue employee or a few who took it upon themselves to fix the test...in order to save their jobs. We have to wait and see, but that seems less likely.

imidazol97

Where are the calls to ljust let VW/Audi go out of business? This has gone on for years. It not something they accidentally did last month, like running a red light, 'cause they forgot they were warned years ago. LOL

They have taken lots of money and subsidies from various state/local entities and then they thumb their nose at the EPA pollution rules meant to save lives.

stever

VW has ~600,000 employees worldwise. It'd be the GM/FCA argument, too painful for them to simply liquidate.

qbrozen

BTW, Jeep Cherokee loaner we have is not a very good vehicle. The ride is just so-so, the transmission is among the worst I've ever experienced, and the storage space is absolutely awful in this size vehicle. My Honda Fit has way more useable space, as did the Ford Escape we had on vacation last year.

I am having a hard time describing the transmission problems. I would say its like something from the 1980s in terms of responsiveness, but I'm pretty sure even my dad's 1980s GM vehicles like his C20 van and K5 Blazer had transmissions that kicked down way quicker than this new Chrysler 9-speed. I had to resort to manually shifting it, but even that requires very careful planning, as its response to shifts must be sent by telegraph. I redlined it once merging on the highway and it was stuck at the rev limiter for a good 5 secs before it decided my upshift request was probably a good idea after all. When on a downhill slope on the highway at 75mph, I upshifted twice from 7 to 9. The readout acknowledged my request, but it wasn't until about another 100 yards down the hill that the car actually clicked off 2 perceptible shifts.

Oh, and even when driven gently, I averaged 25 mpg on the trip home from the dealer, which is right about the same as our T&C. So with 2 fewer cylinders, about 100 fewer ponies, 3 more gears, and probably 1k or more fewer pounds, it is somehow comparable in efficiency. That's sad.

dino001

stever said:

VW has ~600,000 employees worldwise. It'd be the GM/FCA argument, too painful for them to simply liquidate.

Not to mention Lower Saxony government's "golden share". No government official will allow it on their watch. However, they may wipe out other shareholders and nationalize it, if feel it can save their bottoms. Employees and unions are much more important contituances for them. Europeans are much faster to nationalize failing companies, or give them public help. Last installment was a deal of French gov. with Peugeot, trading IIRC tax considerations for jobs staying in France. EU frowns upon on public help, in general, but they usually have no guts to stop it in the biggest countries.

BTW, people didn't call for GM to be completely disbanded, just follow bankruptcy laws - there is a difference.

stever

I don't think GM was going to get financing from the private sector without government guarantees. They'd already been down that road. Without that, their Ch. 11 could have gone 7 or at least more liquidation than we saw with the shedding of Pontiac and Saturn. They shuttered a dozen US factories and shed ~20,000 employees as it was.

VW's ownership is a mess for sure and as near as I can figure, only about 20% of the company is held by private shareholders.

stickguy

spent the weekend with my son, and drove his Jetta up to NY. So of course, we discussed his next car, for when he lease ends (about 15 months left). He has been in love with the A3, and maybe considering a GTI or GLI. But now with the VW mess, he is thinking it may not be a smart way to go, so is thinking of other options (which somehow became a new Mustang, for the moment).

So there very easily could be extended "trickle down" with people bailing on them. And he is the worst case scenario. Someone that is hooked on German cars, and was already planning to stay in the family as he went up the ladder, but could easily be lost in the future.

I am glad that the Jetta I got in the summer was a lease (as is his).

dino001

I think going against the grain may be smart at some point. Perhaps not just yet. I hope if/when they get beat up senseless, they will try harder. I'm thinking better warranty, dealers, equipment etc. It will be a long term process and it should take more than just a bad quarter. In a couple of years new VW's and Audis may become much better value than today, just to stay alive.

stever

Even with the recent bust, Germany is still ahead of everyone else in solar so they have a lot of engineering and tech capacity. VW should jump into hybrids and EVs with both feet (Bosch already has a solar division and I'm sure they could share some software, lol).

driver100

dino001 said:

I think going against the grain may be smart at some point. Perhaps not just yet. I hope if/when they get beat up senseless, they will try harder. I'm thinking better warranty, dealers, equipment etc. It will be a long term process and it should take more than just a bad quarter. In a couple of years new VW's and Audis may become much better value than today, just to stay alive.

Good point. Hyundai made terrible cars...then they got better and gave a 100k mile warranty. People thought if Hyundai believed in their product, then the public could. They had to sell cars for less than the competition, but they rebuilt their reputation.

VW is a huge complex company, and they will find a way to survive, and throw in a few good deals and the public will forget. Could bounce back bigger and better than ever...as you say dino...this will make them try even harder.

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

Canadians tend to buy smaller vehicles so they kept the Ranger going for an extra few years here. My extremely economical minded BIL bought one...manual on the tree, a.m. radio, no air. He likes it, gets him where he wants to go, it's cheap and pretty solid. The box is not protected and it gets dinged up prettty badly - just one small item knocks against the metal and there is a dent. His son bought a Toyota truck and for a bit more it is much nicer, and the box is protected.

Both my brother and a good buddy of mine bought them. In fact, both have had 2 each. They are certainly no-frills and now that they have a few years on them they are starting to have lots of problems. The rear frame rails on my brothers totally rusted away in 7 years. My buddy has had lots of niggling problems with his. He is considering a Colorado/Canyon, while my brother is waiting for a screaming deal on a new fullsize to come along.

Are you talking about the Ranger or Toyota rusting? My Toyota came rusted from the factory, I think. Back then i didn't buy a Ranger because it was $1000 more. Boy was I dumb.

abacomike

I'm having lunch at McDonald's just north of Cocoa Beach near Cape Canaveral.  About 135 more miles to go to get to my brother's house in Ponte Vedra.

I'll pick up on the posts later this evening.

nyccarguy

@tjc78 - good to see you posting again. When did you guys get an Enclave? How do you like it so far? They are really nice vehicles. I was semi seriously looking at them last year when GM had their 20% off thing going ($10K off of a $50K Buick SUV looked like a sweet deal). I found out that the 20% off is the only thing you get with those certain cars, so no leasing and no 0% financing. Every one on the dealer lots in my area were configured for 7 passengers and we like the 8 passenger capability of our Pilot. Ultimately I decided to stick with the Pilot which has about 70K on it right now and will be paid off in May.

boomchek

driver100 said:

bwia said:

robr2 said:

stever said:

Chicken Tax. Don't know about BC and why y'all don't have them, but open the gates down here and plenty would sell.

In theory anyway.

Nah, it's not that. Ford is considering bringing back the Ranger due to the better than lukewarm reception the Canyon and Colorado got. The old Ranger was a low profit vehicle for Ford and they had no interest in selling another low profit truck that could cut into the sales of the F150. Their research showed that most private buyers bought them because of the price, not the utility. Now that GM has shown that people are willing to pay $25K+ for a mid size truck, they may give it a go.

It may come down to the UAW negotiations. Ford may bring back the Ranger as a high profit, low margin option solely to give the UAW some new jobs. If Ford can offer the UAW a new product to build and make a little money on, then they both get a win.

Hmm, Ford bringing back the Ranger with high profit and low margin. Is this a new business model as I've never heard of it before. 

Small trucks are an oxymoron. If you are going to buy a truck it has to be a TRUCK, not some wimpy econobox with a box on the back.

Canadians tend to buy smaller vehicles so they kept the Ranger going for an extra few years here. My extremely economical minded BIL bought one...manual on the tree, a.m. radio, no air. He likes it, gets him where he wants to go, it's cheap and pretty solid. The box is not protected and it gets dinged up prettty badly - just one small item knocks against the metal and there is a dent. His son bought a Toyota truck and for a bit more it is much nicer, and the box is protected.



I don't believe that Rangers came with a manual on the steering column, the shifter was on the floor. But the late model Rangers were bare bones, with super cheap plastics. At sever lots I worked at, we had trouble keeping the used ones in stock, they always sold quickly despite their cheap trimmings: rubber floors, ancient radio, shaky ride, but I guess that's what a true inexpensive bare bones work truck should be.

suydam

Like the old Nissan Frontier. Not everyone needs a bohemoth.

stickguy

Some people could use the functionality, but don't want a new behemoth. A current 1/2 done is just too big for normal use for a lot of us.

I had a 1990ish xtravcab Nissan back then. A reasonable size and very useful. I could consider something that size again, but would never but a full size.

graphicguy

stickguy said:

spent the weekend with my son, and drove his Jetta up to NY. So of course, we discussed his next car, for when he lease ends (about 15 months left). He has been in love with the A3, and maybe considering a GTI or GLI. But now with the VW mess, he is thinking it may not be a smart way to go, so is thinking of other options (which somehow became a new Mustang, for the moment).

So there very easily could be extended "trickle down" with people bailing on them. And he is the worst case scenario. Someone that is hooked on German cars, and was already planning to stay in the family as he went up the ladder, but could easily be lost in the future.

I am glad that the Jetta I got in the summer was a lease (as is his).

Stick...was just talking to my son last Saturday. He has been piling up the miles on his stellar Ford Fiesta. Not one issue in nearly 100K miles.

He has started thinking about his next car. He had the GTI high on his list, too. Now, with all the VW fallout, it's off his list entirely. WRX is now his target. Maybe a Mazda 3......

ab348

oldfarmer50 said:

Are you talking about the Ranger or Toyota rusting? My Toyota came rusted from the factory, I think. Back then i didn't buy a Ranger because it was $1000 more. Boy was I dumb.

The ranger. Apparently it is a common problem. If you see a Ranger from behind that has the spare tire hanging down under the bed at an angle, or better yet just laying inside the pickup box, it probably has the frame rail rust. Just bad parts quality, as the underside of the box on my brother's truck was perfect. I'm surprised there hasn't been a recall.

My buddy's Ranger has had a lot of problems with the brakes (his has rear disks), it has needed a clutch, and several other niggly things despite fastidious care. The list of things that have let go on my brother's is very long, too long for here.

ab348

qbrozen said:

BTW, Jeep Cherokee loaner we have is not a very good vehicle. The ride is just so-so, the transmission is among the worst I've ever experienced, and the storage space is absolutely awful in this size vehicle.

I have not heard one good thing about that transmission in any application, though it seems to be at its worst in the Jeeps. They have had transmission problems in the Grand Cherokee also. Thankfully I have no desire to own anything built by FCA.

abacomike

Arrived here at 4:10 PM.

On the interstate, I saw a new Ford Explorer.  That has to be the best looking SUV on the road today.  I love its stance and the rear wrap-around window.  The one I saw was in an opulescent red (like a pearl red color) - gorgeous - not just gorgeous, but rich looking and sophisticated as well.

If I was in the market for an SUV, that Explorer in that color would be it!  

stickguy

I agree that is it sharp, but too big and bulky for me, I think the Edge is also a very nice looking package, and a much more manageable size.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

Canadians tend to buy smaller vehicles so they kept the Ranger going for an extra few years here. My extremely economical minded BIL bought one...manual on the tree, a.m. radio, no air. He likes it, gets him where he wants to go, it's cheap and pretty solid. The box is not protected and it gets dinged up prettty badly - just one small item knocks against the metal and there is a dent. His son bought a Toyota truck and for a bit more it is much nicer, and the box is protected.

Both my brother and a good buddy of mine bought them. In fact, both have had 2 each. They are certainly no-frills and now that they have a few years on them they are starting to have lots of problems. The rear frame rails on my brothers totally rusted away in 7 years. My buddy has had lots of niggling problems with his. He is considering a Colorado/Canyon, while my brother is waiting for a screaming deal on a new fullsize to come along.

Are you talking about the Ranger or Toyota rusting? My Toyota came rusted from the factory, I think. Back then i didn't buy a Ranger because it was $1000 more. Boy was I dumb.

The Ranger was rusting where the box got dented and chipped. Things can really fly around in the back and just a chair can do a lot of damage if you stop suddenly. The Toyota is a new one and the bed is coated, and it seems like a much more substantial vehicle.

abacomike

It is so nice and cool here in Ponte Vedra.  You really need a sweater or sweatshirt when you go outside here in the evening and it is very dry compared to the southern part of the state.  It was 88 degrees when I left late this morning and when I got here at 4:15 this afternoon, it was 72 degrees.

Dropping into the 60's tonight and the rest of the nights this week.  Glad my brother told me to bring a sweatshirt - going out on his boat into the Atlantic where it will be windy.  We'll probably wait until Wednesday or Thursday when the surf is supposed to settle down.

I averaged 31.6 mpg at 75 mph - not bad for a 4100+ lb vehicle.  The price of gas up here is 20 cents per gallon less than back home, and that's for Shell PUG.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

It is so nice and cool here in Ponte Vedra.  You really need a sweater or sweatshirt when you go outside here in the evening and it is very dry compared to the southern part of the state.  It was 88 degrees when I left late this morning and when I got here at 4:15 this afternoon, it was 72 degrees.

Dropping into the 60's tonight and the rest of the nights this week.  Glad my brother told me to bring a sweatshirt - going out on his boat into the Atlantic where it will be windy.  We'll probably wait until Wednesday or Thursday when the surf is supposed to settle down.

I averaged 31.6 mpg at 75 mph - not bad for a 4100+ lb vehicle.  The price of gas up here is 20 cents per gallon less than back home, and that's for Shell PUG.

Not to brag but today driving in granny mode I got 31.4 in mixed driving with the Mustang. Actually it was 32 but in the final stretch I popped it good and brought the average down. Granny is boring.

abacomike

Mixed diving?  Is that when you and your wife (or significant other) take turns driving?

Sandman6472

Again, I do not think VW/Audi has much to worry about as people have short memories and will buy certain things, eventually, no matter what. Found that some folks in here like to pontificate a lot, beat a dead horse again and again, just don't get why? Think that's the reason I hardly come in here anymore as some seem to post just to post. Whatever!
Am not worried one bit and we love our Golf and A3, and that's the last comment on this subject. Unfortunately, Edmunds has lost a lot of the reasons I came in many, many years ago and think it's time to exit for awhile. Guess B. B. was right, "the thrill is gone"!

dino001

I guess we have the first one. To this point it was only anti-GM conspiracy, now we have anti VW pontificating

Truth is, nobody knows. Chances are VW/Audi may be fine, as GM's sales didn't budge during the ignition key crisis. However, even their new CEO says the crisis has potential to threaten their existence. This may be a smart executive move to set lowest possible expectation, so he can beat them. He wouldn't say that though, if it was not serious.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

Mixed diving?  Is that when you and your wife (or significant other) take turns driving?

Nah, wife is reluctant to even ride in it. That means about 60% highway, 40% stop & go. Truth is I had to pretty much coast between the traffic lights to do that.

driver100

sandman_6472 said:

Again, I do not think VW/Audi has much to worry about as people have short memories and will buy certain things, eventually, no matter what. Found that some folks in here like to pontificate a lot, beat a dead horse again and again, just don't get why? Think that's the reason I hardly come in here anymore as some seem to post just to post. Whatever!
Am not worried one bit and we love our Golf and A3, and that's the last comment on this subject. Unfortunately, Edmunds has lost a lot of the reasons I came in many, many years ago and think it's time to exit for awhile. Guess B. B. was right, "the thrill is gone"!

I had to look up the word just to make sure:
Pontificate: express one's opinions in a way considered annoyingly pompous and dogmatic.

What should we do, sing Cumbia? We are just talking about a real situation that is pretty big news in the automobile world...Cars and Conversation.

I wrote to Audi Canada and Audi Germany and said the company was arrogant and corrupt. And we still own a Passat! We like the car, and we may get another one one day, but, it will be a lot harder for us to buy another one, trust isn't easy to get back. I don't mind intelligent comments that are made, positive or negative....that's how I learn. There has been some excellent information posted the last few days about VW....for example I forgot about the $1200 grants the government gave for buying clean diesels!

abacomike

We all have our own reasons for choosing to be members of Edmunds' forums.  One thing we all have in common is that we "love" cars - new, old, classic, etc.  We each have our own attitudes and opinions and we rarely hesitate to post our responses to other's opinions.

As far as posting for the sake of posting and pontificating, I really don't know each poster's reason or rationale for choosing to be an active Edmunds "contributor".  What I do know is that we love to talk about cars, manufacturers, current events as they relate to anything automotive, and share our past and current experiences as they relate to SUV's, classic cars, used cars and new cars.

In the poster's opinion, too much negativity has been expressed as it relates to VW and Audi and that negativity has become personally distasteful to him - especially since he takes pride in both his VW and Audi and is tired of reading the posts tearing the parent company - VW - apart.

ab348 and imid have felt the same way when GM was at the forefront for its intentional withholding of info re: the faulty ignition part - GM bashing I believe is what was coined as the negativity against GM.  Those posters had similar internal biases as loyal as well as completely satisfied GM owners/customers.

Everyone here is entitled to be heard.  The poster/member espoused his being fed up with VW/Audi bashing - and we have heard his side.

Even the Edmunds moderators have read about his opinion and many have posted their own opinions - as have all of us.  

Maybe be we all need to be a bit more sensitive to the fact that there are GM, VW, Audi, Ford, Toyota, Hyundai, Kia, Suburu, etc., owners out there who love their cars and the manufacturer that built their cars and are tired of hearing all the negativity.  

I rest my case!  

dino001

The scandal is still getting bigger: the latest count is total 11 million vehicles, 8 million in Europe, half million in the US, three engine sizes: 1.2, 1.6, 2.0. I think American market liability is highest per vehicle, but European market may be much more serious, even if damage per unit is much less. This can be an earthquake in the entire Euro industry. So far other swear they didn't do it, but somehow I find it hard to believe.

[Deleted User]

dino001 said:

I guess we have the first one. To this point it was only anti-GM conspiracy, now we have anti VW pontificating

Truth is, nobody knows. Chances are VW/Audi may be fine, as GM's sales didn't budge during the ignition key crisis. However, even their new CEO says the crisis has potential to threaten their existence. This may be a smart executive move to set lowest possible expectation, so he can beat them. He wouldn't say that though, if it was not serious.

I was shocked to read the quote from the incoming president that the scandal could end the company. That's a very serious statement to make. Typically a president would be organizing the troops and laying out a plan of attack to get them motivated for the challenges ahead. Maybe it's a German thing.

The biggest threat is the cumulative impact from all the different countries. 11 million cars is an extensive number. If all the countries decide to go after big penalties it could very well force them into bankruptcy. Personally I hope to see them use this as a rallying call to improve and become an even more competitive company. Right now they're liars, their US dealer network is bottom of the barrel, and reliability is atrocious. Hopefully they'll use this opportunity for inner reflection and make truly great cars. More competition is good for us as car enthusiasts.

thebean

Well, I ain't leaving, no matter who someone is bashing.  Reading these and the CCBA posts is the best part of my day. That's a bit sad, but what the heck.  

abacomike

thebean said:

Well, I ain't leaving, no matter who someone is bashing.  Reading these and the CCBA posts is the best part of my day. That's a bit sad, but what the heck.  

This forum would not be as interesting or as informational or as enjoyable if you ever left, Bean!  I feel the same way about most of our family of posters here and on CCBA (which I don't follow very often - but still interesting).  Each poster brings with him/her a different motivation for posting as well as a host of varying opinions and perspectives.

I always learn something every day here on this forum which enables me to rethink my opinion about something or someone.  I also enjoy the sagas that posters convey, whether it be a car shopping experience, a car buying experience, experiences with lemons and their trials and tribulations, as well as perspectives on life, in general.

Yes, each of us bring an asset, a story, a slant on things in general that make us think deeper about things.  I thank you all for your insights and contributions.

driver100

thebean said:

Well, I ain't leaving, no matter who someone is bashing.  Reading these and the CCBA posts is the best part of my day. That's a bit sad, but what the heck.  

Well said Bean. If I wanted to win the Mr. Congeniality contest I would just nod and say that's nice, or how unfortunate VW finds themselves in this situation.

I have learned a lot, I have been amused a lot, and I have blown off some steam....this is cheaper than therapy!

graphicguy

abacomike said:

Arrived here at 4:10 PM.

On the interstate, I saw a new Ford Explorer.  That has to be the best looking SUV on the road today.  I love its stance and the rear wrap-around window.  The one I saw was in an opulescent red (like a pearl red color) - gorgeous - not just gorgeous, but rich looking and sophisticated as well.

If I was in the market for an SUV, that Explorer in that color would be it!  

Mike...if you get a chance, test drive the '16 Explorer. I truly was stunned how well it drove and how nice it was. Granted, my friend's is all loaded up. So, I'm guessing his was in the high $40s, knocking on $50K. I've seen Lexus SUVs around the same price that aren't as nice.

OF...how in the world can you drive around a Mustang like a "Granny"? That's sacriligious. I think you owe it to the car the next time you're in 4th, double clutch it, down shift to 2nd and nail it.


VW/Audi stuff.....I have no idea what the outcome will be. Personally? Can't say as I care one way or the other. I do think it's a shame that those who own VW or Audi products might stand to lose something, and I hope that's not the case. But, if it is, I also hope the owners are somehow made whole, although I have my doubts that will be the case.

As far as the new VW CEO predicting potential dire consequences? I will agree with most here. For him to say the company may not survive is a very ominous proclimation.

If that's the case, it won't be from the fines, $$$$ paid to current customers and dealers in the U.S. It will be those in the rest of the world who come after VW for their pound of flesh. Diesel sales here are miniscule compared to what VW's diesel market share is in the rest of the world.

None of that takes into account lost sales, lack of funds for future product R&D due to all the payouts VW will have to make.

If we're honest with each other, it's not like VW's products had the reputation of being rock solid reliable to begin with. This fiasco certainly will lower that reputation a significant amount. I know it affected my son's decision. And, he's in that coveted 25 y.o. to 30 y.o. range where car companies try to snag a customer and hold onto them for life, moving them up the ladder of better and more expensive brands.

abacomike

My brother and I are going up to his Porsche dealer so I can get a first-hand, close-up look at the Cayenne S.  Then, I might just ask him to run over to the Ford Dealer so I can drive one.  I was truly taken back with the looks of the pearl red Explorer I saw on I-95 near the Cape Canaveral area.