Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

oldfarmer50

carnaught said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well we accepted millions of displaced refugees in the early 1900s. You just sailed over, got a medical exam, and you were in. There was no "applying" or anything like that. Then you worked your way to citizenship, while working. Of course, we needed cheap labor then, and most of these immigrants, while by no means angelic creatures, were at least familiar with Western culture. Many were no less desperately poor than the ones we see today.

Suffice to say, those displaced refugees were not out to kill our innocents en masse. "Suicide bombers" (as we know of today), were not yet invented.

Well to be fair there were always radicals. Back then they were called Anarchists.

houdini1

Mr_Shiftright said:

Oh, I wouldn't be too sure about that. There was the anarchy movement which was a similar form of terrorism, and editorial cartoons in the American press depicted them blowing up the statue of liberty (1919). Anarchists detonated 8 large bombs simultaneously in US cities in one wave of attacks. They almost killed Asst. Sec'y of the Navy FDR.

carnaught said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well we accepted millions of displaced refugees in the early 1900s. You just sailed over, got a medical exam, and you were in. There was no "applying" or anything like that. Then you worked your way to citizenship, while working. Of course, we needed cheap labor then, and most of these immigrants, while by no means angelic creatures, were at least familiar with Western culture. Many were no less desperately poor than the ones we see today.

Suffice to say, those displaced refugees were not out to kill our innocents en masse. "Suicide bombers" (as we know of today), were not yet invented.

The difference being that, back then, the government did not sit around and wring their hands, but took immediate action by arresting several thousand people and deporting several hundred. Problem solved.

isellhondas

Mike,

You have dealt with a ton of adversity recently and I've been impressed with your toughness and ability to fight through all of this. Don't be so thin skinned now to leave these forums where you are a vauled member!

Mr_Shiftright

A bit hard to arrest people operating in a cave halfway 'round the world, though. Also the modern age has allowed single individuals to inflict much greater harm than in the past. Besides, I don't think giving up all our freedom to a police state is a keen idea. I'd rather be free, travel free, live free, and take my risks. Living peacefully and without fear or danger is a very modern luxury in the history of the world.

houdini1 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Oh, I wouldn't be too sure about that. There was the anarchy movement which was a similar form of terrorism, and editorial cartoons in the American press depicted them blowing up the statue of liberty (1919). Anarchists detonated 8 large bombs simultaneously in US cities in one wave of attacks. They almost killed Asst. Sec'y of the Navy FDR.

carnaught said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well we accepted millions of displaced refugees in the early 1900s. You just sailed over, got a medical exam, and you were in. There was no "applying" or anything like that. Then you worked your way to citizenship, while working. Of course, we needed cheap labor then, and most of these immigrants, while by no means angelic creatures, were at least familiar with Western culture. Many were no less desperately poor than the ones we see today.

Suffice to say, those displaced refugees were not out to kill our innocents en masse. "Suicide bombers" (as we know of today), were not yet invented.

The difference being that, back then, the government did not sit around and wring their hands, but took immediate action by arresting several thousand people and deporting several hundred. Problem solved.

graphicguy

bwia...big difference with Tesla...they are factory owned stores, not franchisees who own the stores.

I think Tesla is making cars with an approximate 300 mile range and sports car performance. To my knowledge, no one else is doing this at the same price point. They are selling cars direct, and sidestepping franchises as best as they can, and gaining ground in doing it.

Their battery products alone will propel them to success.

graphicguy

Explorer...congrats again. Did the dealer give any indication why they had a new '14 F150 still sitting around?

carnaught

"I don't think giving up all our freedom to a police state is a keen idea."

In the Middle East innocent people are literally getting carved up by large knife attacks, wounds so bad, they can't simply get sutured up.

Not an all-or-none phenomenon, "all of our freedom", but I would give up some of my freedoms for as much security as possible. We just have to be prudent and realistic. If it's not stopped, it's not a matter of "if", but "when" these things start happening more commonly here. Besides "911", remember what happened at the Boston Marathon.

houdini1

We wouldn't have to give up our freedoms in order to strengthen our borders, or to start deporting any illegal that breaks our laws. All those potential terrorists and criminals in the U.S. aren't hiding in caves halfway around the world, they are here right now, just like those anarchists were. When you don't protect your borders like the U.S. (and France) these people just sneak in like everyone else. We will eventually find them, but we will pay a very heavy price for not acting sooner. I sure hope I am wrong about this.

Mr_Shiftright said:

A bit hard to arrest people operating in a cave halfway 'round the world, though. Also the modern age has allowed single individuals to inflict much greater harm than in the past. Besides, I don't think giving up all our freedom to a police state is a keen idea. I'd rather be free, travel free, live free, and take my risks. Living peacefully and without fear or danger is a very modern luxury in the history of the world.

houdini1 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Oh, I wouldn't be too sure about that. There was the anarchy movement which was a similar form of terrorism, and editorial cartoons in the American press depicted them blowing up the statue of liberty (1919). Anarchists detonated 8 large bombs simultaneously in US cities in one wave of attacks. They almost killed Asst. Sec'y of the Navy FDR.

carnaught said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well we accepted millions of displaced refugees in the early 1900s. You just sailed over, got a medical exam, and you were in. There was no "applying" or anything like that. Then you worked your way to citizenship, while working. Of course, we needed cheap labor then, and most of these immigrants, while by no means angelic creatures, were at least familiar with Western culture. Many were no less desperately poor than the ones we see today.

Suffice to say, those displaced refugees were not out to kill our innocents en masse. "Suicide bombers" (as we know of today), were not yet invented.

The difference being that, back then, the government did not sit around and wring their hands, but took immediate action by arresting several thousand people and deporting several hundred. Problem solved.

graphicguy

I'm on the other end of the issue. I believe once we stat giving up freedoms for the sake of "security", our enemies have won. Protecting against some maniac(s) with no sense of right or wrong isn't going to be thwarted by any sort of fence, wall, or border patrol.

Bad people exist. Crazy people exist. You can't legislate them away.

Some want to paint this as a cultural war. It isn't. Mentally and physically displaced people will never fit into normal society, regardless of cultural background.

Limiting freedoms won't overcome that.

Mr_Shiftright

Crazy people will always find a way to hurt you.

explorerx4

@graphicguy,
I found 2 14's I was interested in by browsing the web.
Also, the one I ended up buying was at the dealer where I get several cars serviced, so I had seen it before.
Sent out 2 inquiries for price.
One took over a week to respond, but by then I was working with the dealer I ended up buying from.
The truck at the dealer who took their time, was less expensive and I would have traded the Fusion for instead of the Escape.

snakeweasel

carnaught said:

"I don't think giving up all our freedom to a police state is a keen idea."

In the Middle East innocent people are literally getting carved up by large knife attacks, wounds so bad, they can't simply get sutured up.

Not an all-or-none phenomenon, "all of our freedom", but I would give up some of my freedoms for as much security as possible. We just have to be prudent and realistic. If it's not stopped, it's not a matter of "if", but "when" these things start happening more commonly here. Besides "911", remember what happened at the Boston Marathon.

The one problem is once you give up part of your freedom you set a precedence and where does it end?

carnaught

"The one problem is once you give up part of your freedom you set a precedence and where does it end?"


Again, I can't make a blanket statement like that. I don't believe it's always EITHER black or white with nothing in between. So, you wouldn't believe in Martial Law, EVER, no matter what the situation, for example.

driver100

graphicguy said:

So, dealership and GM Repurchasing center calls yesterday. I floated the idea that instead of ordering a car (the dealership sold the one I wanted, and there's not another one like it in the Region), perhaps I'll take one of the "Luxury" models instead of the "Performance" model. Price delta is about $8K. I would get a check from Cadillac for about $8K, plus the car.

Given I don't plan on keeping it, I just want a car that's reliable at this point. They didn't say no. But, I have yet to see the new offer letter that is supposed to be sent. They said they'd have it out yesterday. Again, they can't seem to keep their own promises any better than they can fix the cars they manufacture.

graphicguy said:

So, dealership and GM Repurchasing center calls yesterday. I floated the idea that instead of ordering a car (the dealership sold the one I wanted, and there's not another one like it in the Region), perhaps I'll take one of the "Luxury" models instead of the "Performance" model. Price delta is about $8K. I would get a check from Cadillac for about $8K, plus the car.

Given I don't plan on keeping it, I just want a car that's reliable at this point. They didn't say no. But, I have yet to see the new offer letter that is supposed to be sent. They said they'd have it out yesterday. Again, they can't seem to keep their own promises any better than they can fix the cars they manufacture.

graphicguy said:

So, dealership and GM Repurchasing center calls yesterday. I floated the idea that instead of ordering a car (the dealership sold the one I wanted, and there's not another one like it in the Region), perhaps I'll take one of the "Luxury" models instead of the "Performance" model. Price delta is about $8K. I would get a check from Cadillac for about $8K, plus the car.

Given I don't plan on keeping it, I just want a car that's reliable at this point. They didn't say no. But, I have yet to see the new offer letter that is supposed to be sent. They said they'd have it out yesterday. Again, they can't seem to keep their own promises any better than they can fix the cars they manufacture.

GG.....hat is going on? You supposedly picked out a car that you were willing to swap for....and now they sold it out from under you? So, is this the new game they are playing? You keep reserving a car and they keep waiting until it gets sold. I would think part of the deal should have been they would reserve that car for you until the paperwork was done. This makes it even worse....now they are bigger liars and cheats as far as I am concerned.

driver100

Mr_Shiftright said:

Well we accepted millions of displaced refugees in the early 1900s. You just sailed over, got a medical exam, and you were in. There was no "applying" or anything like that. Then you worked your way to citizenship, while working. Of course, we needed cheap labor then, and most of these immigrants, while by no means angelic creatures, were at least familiar with Western culture. Many were no less desperately poor than the ones we see today.

Yeh but most refugees in those days didn't want to kill us, or change us to be the same as them.. They just wanted a better way of life, and worked hard to make it happen.

stickguy

I can't wait to see how this turns out. It is like a TV show with all kinds of shocking plot twists, so you never know what is coming next!

driver100

I don't mind some security if it helps protect me. If they want to search me at the airport I don't mind, if it saves planes from going down...if the government can listen in to phone conversations and pick up terrorists plotting I say go for it.

The big fear is the government taking over our lives. There is an acceptable limit, but, the world has changed, and if it takes some of our rights away it is worth it to me.

carnaught

driver100 said:

I don't mind some security if it helps protect me. If they want to search me at the airport I don't mind, if it saves planes from going down...if the government can listen in to phone conversations and pick up terrorists plotting I say go for it.

The big fear is the government taking over our lives. There is an acceptable limit, but, the world has changed, and if it takes some of our rights away it is worth it to me.

Exactly!

houdini1

We really don't need more security or more laws. We just need to enforce the laws we already have on immigration and that would solve most of the problems.

imidazol97

houdini1 said:

We really don't need more security or more laws. We just need to enforce the laws we already have on immigration and that would solve most of the problems.

X2

oldfarmer50

explorerx4 said:

@graphicguy,
I found 2 14's I was interested in by browsing the web.
Also, the one I ended up buying was at the dealer where I get several cars serviced, so I had seen it before.
Sent out 2 inquiries for price.
One took over a week to respond, but by then I was working with the dealer I ended up buying from.
The truck at the dealer who took their time, was less expensive and I would have traded the Fusion for instead of the Escape.

What kind of business model is that? Hold onto a unit until it depreciates beyond any hope of selling at a profit and then play hard to get with the only interested customer.

Last October I visited the Ford dealer only 3 miles down the street to inquire about Mustangs. The salesman acted bored, told me "they won't be in stock for a month". He claimed there were no brochures available. I even left my number a email (which I never do) and asked for contact when something arrived.

I'm still waiting.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

explorerx4 said:

@graphicguy,
I found 2 14's I was interested in by browsing the web.
Also, the one I ended up buying was at the dealer where I get several cars serviced, so I had seen it before.
Sent out 2 inquiries for price.
One took over a week to respond, but by then I was working with the dealer I ended up buying from.
The truck at the dealer who took their time, was less expensive and I would have traded the Fusion for instead of the Escape.

What kind of business model is that? Hold onto a unit until it depreciates beyond any hope of selling at a profit and then play hard to get with the only interested customer.

Last October I visited the Ford dealer only 3 miles down the street to inquire about Mustangs. The salesman acted bored, told me "they won't be in stock for a month". He claimed there were no brochures available. I even left my number a email (which I never do) and asked for contact when something arrived.

I'm still waiting.

Maybe he reads Edmund's and knows you have already bought

Actually, I found a lot of salesmen don't call back Those are probably the one's that won't last too long in the business.

Life insurance people have to call back 7 times to become really successful. The first time they get about a 14% average, it goes up each time after that to over 80% after 7 calls. Not too many salespeople make it to the top tier.

Just a suspicion, but I think the foreign luxury car salespeople are trained better to follow up. I assume they have more training and know the importance of calling back...that has been my experience.

roadburner

snakeweasel said:

If that were me I would no longer be a loyal customer after being lied to like that, that is unless the dealer simply swapped out the cars at no additional cost. This is why it is best to get things in writing.

It was the salesman's fault, but he wasn't lying- he was just lazy/uninformed, if a C6 had MSRC there was a button on the console to activate it. The C7 has a similar button but it is present in every car whether it has MSRC or not.

roadburner

houdini1 said:

We really don't need more security or more laws. We just need to enforce the laws we already have on immigration and that would solve most of the problems.

Yep.

suydam

Yeh but most refugees in those days didn't want to kill us, or change us to be the same as them.. They just wanted a better way of life, and worked hard to make it happen.

And the vast majority of today's refugees don't want to kill us either. It would be terrible if a few fanatics made seeking a better life impossible for them.

berri

I think our problem in the Mideast is we want to fight "politically correct" and that's like being half pregnant - doesn't work. General Schwarzkopf went into Iraq with shock and awe, the Iraqi fighting quickly faded. But ever since it's been a lot of half a.. stuff. You want to make a point with ISIS, when you sight a large encampment, bring in the old B-52's and carpet bomb them. The terrorist don't follow any treaties, so beehive round 'em and napalm 'em too. That will make them feel some consequences. Won't stop a lot of it initially, but after several courses they may start thinking more before attacking. People talk all brave, and the first hit may empower them, but several courses of things like this are going to start frightening them and breaking morale. If you don't want to utilize the power you have in warfare, you might as well just back off and go home. We need to decide whether to start making it hurt, or pack up. I don't know which course is the best for the US, but I think its an issue Washington needs to start getting serious about and stop this politicizing and pussyfooting that is only hurting people and not accomplishing anything while wasting money.

driver100

suydam said:

Yeh but most refugees in those days didn't want to kill us, or change us to be the same as them.. They just wanted a better way of life, and worked hard to make it happen.

And the vast majority of today's refugees don't want to kill us either. It would be terrible if a few fanatics made seeking a better life impossible for them.



Agreed, but, it is harder to filter the good from the bad, or the children who will grow up to hate their new country. How do we solve that one? Even if it is only a few who become radical, they cause a lot of harm
(Boston Bombers as one example).

driver100

berri said:

I think our problem in the Mideast is we want to fight "politically correct" and that's like being half pregnant - doesn't work. General Schwarzkopf went into Iraq with shock and awe, the Iraqi fighting quickly faded. But ever since it's been a lot of half a.. stuff. If you don't want to utilize the power you have in warfare, you might as well just back off and go home.

I would agree...the bad guys can cut off heads and kill innocent civilians but we have to go by the rules of war.

In business I always tried to be as honest as possible. Then I came up against a liar and a thief. I agreed to something and then on advice from my lawyer decided to change my mind. The liar was upset since I was such an honest person, why would I change what I agreed to. I didn't say it to him but I made a new rule......Be as honest as possible, but if you are dealing with a liar and a cheat you have to play by their rules or you won't have a chance....they'll use it against you.

Same here, you have to do whatever you can to get rid of them.

houdini1

I agree with you but there are some things that I don't understand. Back during shock and awe, there were stories told about the enemy hiding in caves, etc. but that if they so much as rattled a tin can we were able to pick up that noise and bomb them. Now they are marching around in the open, holding truck parades, gathering for mass executions, etc., and we just can't seem to locate them and apparently when we do drop a bomb it in is the middle of the open desert where no one is.

All this is enough for me to think that maybe, for some sort of twisted political reasons, we don't really want this war to end. Maybe the pentagon is using it for practice for when we have a tougher enemy, or maybe they want to keep the munitions people happy by selling more guns and ammo, or maybe they like getting funded to develop new and better weapons, etc. It just seems to me that if we wanted to end this nonsense, we could do it in about 2 weeks. The U.S. can be very ruthless when necessary and I think it is possible that using political correctness in this war is just a convenient lie and excuse to keep it going.

berri said:

I think our problem in the Mideast is we want to fight "politically correct" and that's like being half pregnant - doesn't work. General Schwarzkopf went into Iraq with shock and awe, the Iraqi fighting quickly faded. But ever since it's been a lot of half a.. stuff. You want to make a point with ISIS, when you sight a large encampment, bring in the old B-52's and carpet bomb them. The terrorist don't follow any treaties, so beehive round 'em and napalm 'em too. That will make them feel some consequences. Won't stop a lot of it initially, but after several courses they may start thinking more before attacking. People talk all brave, and the first hit may empower them, but several courses of things like this are going to start frightening them and breaking morale. If you don't want to utilize the power you have in warfare, you might as well just back off and go home. We need to decide whether to start making it hurt, or pack up. I don't know which course is the best for the US, but I think its an issue Washington needs to start getting serious about and stop this politicizing and pussyfooting that is only hurting people and not accomplishing anything while wasting money.

carnaught

"It just seems to me that if we wanted to end this nonsense, we could do it in about 2 weeks."

Like going after Raqqa, the Isis capital?

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

explorerx4 said:

@graphicguy,
I found 2 14's I was interested in by browsing the web.
Also, the one I ended up buying was at the dealer where I get several cars serviced, so I had seen it before.
Sent out 2 inquiries for price.
One took over a week to respond, but by then I was working with the dealer I ended up buying from.
The truck at the dealer who took their time, was less expensive and I would have traded the Fusion for instead of the Escape.

What kind of business model is that? Hold onto a unit until it depreciates beyond any hope of selling at a profit and then play hard to get with the only interested customer.

Last October I visited the Ford dealer only 3 miles down the street to inquire about Mustangs. The salesman acted bored, told me "they won't be in stock for a month". He claimed there were no brochures available. I even left my number a email (which I never do) and asked for contact when something arrived.

I'm still waiting.

Maybe he reads Edmund's and knows you have already bought

Actually, I found a lot of salesmen don't call back Those are probably the one's that won't last too long in the business.

Life insurance people have to call back 7 times to become really successful. The first time they get about a 14% average, it goes up each time after that to over 80% after 7 calls. Not too many salespeople make it to the top tier.

Just a suspicion, but I think the foreign luxury car salespeople are trained better to follow up. I assume they have more training and know the importance of calling back...that has been my experience.

There's being TOO persistent as well. I am high pressure adverse. If a salesman called me 7 times it would chase me away but to NEVER bother to follow up on someone who expresses interest in a specific car it kind of dumb in my opinion.

imidazol97

Has anyone else had a full installation of Windows 10 as an update?

Mine was upgraded to Windows 10 a couple months back. But
now it has an upgrade to the new Windows 10.

Mine didn't do the Windows 10 update on the first try, so I tracked it on the retry last evening.
This morning it's doing a restart which is an installation, complete with multiple restarts
and the same screen as the original Win 7 to Win 10 upgrade.

EDITED:
It has run what acted like the first installation. Took about 30 minutes.
When done it acknowledges that all things are where they were, etc..
Must have been a big update to Windows 10. So instead of doing an
update, they did an upgrade installation again.

Mr_Shiftright

I'm very hesitant to do it as my machine is some 3 years old. Sounds like yours is too?

stever

I've done two here, one on the desktop that I built back in '06, and one on an older ThinkPad T500 I got in '09. The ThinkPad gives me various issues, mostly because the video gets lost in sleep mode (it did that under 8.x too). One attempt to fix the video with a bios update didn't work so I formatted back to 8.x and then reinstalled 10 (it originally came with Vista fwiw). No issues with the actual OS updates (but still have the sleep issue).

Mostly I use that laptop in the garage for net music so I haven't spent a lot of time figuring out the real fix for the video.

Try http://www.tenforums.com/ for suggestions.

stickguy

I am just leaving my laptop on windows 7 until it dies. Then I will wrench open the wallet and switch to a Mac.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

explorerx4 said:

@graphicguy,
I found 2 14's I was interested in by browsing the web.
Also, the one I ended up buying was at the dealer where I get several cars serviced, so I had seen it before.
Sent out 2 inquiries for price.
One took over a week to respond, but by then I was working with the dealer I ended up buying from.
The truck at the dealer who took their time, was less expensive and I would have traded the Fusion for instead of the Escape.

What kind of business model is that? Hold onto a unit until it depreciates beyond any hope of selling at a profit and then play hard to get with the only interested customer.

Last October I visited the Ford dealer only 3 miles down the street to inquire about Mustangs. The salesman acted bored, told me "they won't be in stock for a month". He claimed there were no brochures available. I even left my number a email (which I never do) and asked for contact when something arrived.

I'm still waiting.

Maybe he reads Edmund's and knows you have already bought

Actually, I found a lot of salesmen don't call back Those are probably the one's that won't last too long in the business.

Life insurance people have to call back 7 times to become really successful. The first time they get about a 14% average, it goes up each time after that to over 80% after 7 calls. Not too many salespeople make it to the top tier.

Just a suspicion, but I think the foreign luxury car salespeople are trained better to follow up. I assume they have more training and know the importance of calling back...that has been my experience.

There's being TOO persistent as well. I am high pressure adverse. If a salesman called me 7 times it would chase me away but to NEVER bother to follow up on someone who expresses interest in a specific car it kind of dumb in my opinion.

Good point...I am high pressure averse too. In the case of the insurance guy calling 7 times it is not pressure. It is used to help build a relationship of trust. No high pressure. Just a hello, are you satisfied with your current supplier, and build a little more with each call to see if you can offer something more suited to the customer. High pressure turns off most people these days.

I have to add, it should be done in a truly helpful way, never setting up a con.

stever

stickguy said:

I am just leaving my laptop on windows 7 until it dies. Then I will wrench open the wallet and switch to a Mac.

Windows 7 is already out of mainstream support. I'm running 7 Enterprise on another laptop and it's fine. Extended support is available for that edition until 2020 (for a fee). Would rather be able to update it too, but it's not my laptop.

Support for Windows 10 ends in 2020, so I guess Microsoft has a new vision for then.

Mr_Shiftright

Let's see...every other MS OS is a good one, so I guess we'll get another turkey for 2020

tjc78

Re: high pressure sales. 

I agree high pressure turns off many people.  Just this week a sales rep I've done a few projects with at work left 4 voice mail and an email looking for jobs.  Don't you think after the 2ND no call that I'm not in the market for anything?  I'm all for keeping your name (and company) out there but there are other ways of doing it. 

houdini1

carnaught said:

"It just seems to me that if we wanted to end this nonsense, we could do it in about 2 weeks."

Like going after Raqqa, the Isis capital?

Looks like the French manned up today and bombed Raqqa !! VIVA LA FRANCE ! Nice call carnaught.

roadburner

imidazol97 said:

Has anyone else had a full installation of Windows 10 as an update?

Mine was upgraded to Windows 10 a couple months back. But
now it has an upgrade to the new Windows 10.

Mine didn't do the Windows 10 update on the first try, so I tracked it on the retry last evening.
This morning it's doing a restart which is an installation, complete with multiple restarts
and the same screen as the original Win 7 to Win 10 upgrade.

EDITED:
It has run what acted like the first installation. Took about 30 minutes.
When done it acknowledges that all things are where they were, etc..
Must have been a big update to Windows 10. So instead of doing an
update, they did an upgrade installation again.

My PC's 8.1 install has been a bit screwy ever since a virus attacked it. Windows Update has been dead for months, and it won't download windows 10. I'm probably going to use my laptop to download a copy of 10 to a USB drive and see if I can upgrade my PC that way. On the bright side, I have a friend who is an insider at MS; he can come to the rescue if that plan fails...

ab348

M$ did their usual weekly Windows update overnight Wednesday into Thursday and it caused a lot of problems. I got a bulletin from Dell describing what it did and in my case the update caused full lockup of one of my PCs. Apparently M$ sent some revisions out the next day.

Mr_Shiftright

Mine bombed too after that update. Had to use multiple browsers and a couple of restarts.

stever

The update released three days was a "huge" one but I didn't notice anything unusual here. Some people lost their privacy settings so you may want to check that.

driver100

What I don't get about this ISIS thing is don't these people need food and water? Why can't our guys cut off their supplies and make them give up by starving them to death?

The other thing is who is selling them all those Toyota trucks? It seems to be their truck of choice.

bwia

At the  G20 Summit perhaps the conversation should shift to stopping weapon sales to the enemy.  How can they be serious about neutralizing ISIS when they sell guns and amution to ISIS and other terrorists.

stickguy

would not be the first time that a government supported some radical group on the sly, to "use them" against another country or group. Then once the devil was out of the cage, lost control of it.

unless the host countries stop enabling (if not outright supporting) they won't starve.

berri

I think many terrorists are getting lots of funding from people in Sunni Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Kuwait. The same countries that claim to be our allies and have at least some possible ties to 9/11.

houdini1

A combination of all the above.

Mr_Shiftright

Can't find 'em. They can melt intantly right in amonst the people. The terrorist becomes the local grocer. The whole idea is to jab you in the nose and provoke you to hit back violently and indiscriminately. The more collateral damage, the better for them. That is the strategy of terrorism, and the Big Giants are often quite helpless against this elusive little rat. Their violence is intended to stir massive emotion, and thus put their enemy off balance. They've been chased, pounded, bombed, droned and assassinated for years. It does little good. There is no real solution here. The rat has to die from an internal disease.

I'm sure this is publicity that Toyota doesn't want! Well now at least they have some American vehicles that the U.S. trained Iraqi army gave them when the Iraqis ran away.

driver100 said:

What I don't get about this ISIS thing is don't these people need food and water? Why can't our guys cut off their supplies and make them give up by starving them to death?

The other thing is who is selling them all those Toyota trucks? It seems to be their truck of choice.