Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

Mr_Shiftright

That type of color scheme is considered very passe by current restoration standards.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

stickguy said:

I sat in an E class at the auto show. Very comfy. Great visibility. My son said it was an "old mans car". Considering the 2 people here I know that have one (well, until recently 2), I couldn't argue with him.

I agree with everything you said stick. It is the most comfortable car I have been in, and it has the best visibility I have experienced. If "old man's car" means the most sensible, logical, best handling and easiest to drive car made I would agree. Ask your son what a young person's car would be....a Fit, a Prius, a Camaro, a Scion, a Miata, Corvette........he's absolutely correct, I will take the E.

I take an old man's car to be one that is so expensive that you are an old man by the time you save enough money to buy one.
LOL

How come you left Mustang off your young man's list? Though I must admit I usually only see olds coots driving them.

I was going to put the Mustang on the young man's list then I remembered you had one!

driver100

OF I actually think a Mustang is an older persons car. I know of two tennis guys that have one, one in his 60s and one 70s. I think it is the car they wish they could have had in the 70s....that is why I like them. Of course, it appeals to younger people who want a personal sporty car that has a rear seat if needed. They are the ones who would put a stripe on it....none of the older guys I know would do that to a Mustang.

I checked my Mercedes logo and it is just a decal - I thought it would be etched in or at least placed in the glass. I would definitely pay $700 for a generic windshield plus $7.50 for the decal and save over $600....I'm not that much of a snob.

driver100

stever said:

Those pics that speak for themselves remind me of another sedan I got as a rental a couple of months ago:

That looks like it needs someone to take it home and look after it.

Mr_Shiftright

Looks like where you return books at the library

stever

yeah, yeah, and that fancy schmancy Wraith looks like a Lincoln Town Car.

berri

Toyota and Lexus seem to have been hit pretty hard lately with the ugly stick!

abacomike

venture said:

ab348 said:

I bet Daimler Benz has some sort of hi-tech way to tell if the windshield is replaced with one lacking the requisite signature. You might get drummed out of the club for not wanting to spend an extra $600 for the signature!

Daimler-Benz sends in their top ophthalmologist to "look" for the 3-pointed star on the right side of the windshield.  Definitely high tech! 

Maybe I could forge one.....sign it Mercanti

You should be able to get the sticker from a Mercedes dealer. If they don't have any, eBay has them.

When I was in my car this morning, I double-checked the stickers and etched logo and barcode in the front windshield.

The plastic sticker is on the bottom right but the etched 3-pointed star and barcode are located on the bottom left of the windshield.  That barcode/star is what can't be duplicated by an after-market windshield.

abacomike

oldfarmer50 said:

stever said:

stever said:

Guess my X macro is too close to my V macro (L is reserved for Lincoln so I use X for LeXus). My, ahem, XC90 typo has been edited. Sorry to raise any wraith.

Wraith or wrath?  Wraith is a ghostlike demon.  Wrath is ire or anger.  I don't think you raised either. 

Mild bit of car humour for the Grey Poupon crowd.

Speaking of "WRAITH", Rolls Royce of Ft. Lauderdale has a two-tone Wraith on display at the Boca Town Center mall.  Hood and most of the sides and trunk is a dark maroon.  Top and front and rear quarter panels are a light gray.  Beautiful RR Coupe - big car!

Kind of like this?

Yes, OF!  But about $250,000 more than the one above.  It (the RR Wraith) has suicide doors - on a coupe no less!

qbrozen

oldfarmer50 said:

Speaking of which I saw a previous gen. Mustang in the same color as mine with a big wide white stripe down the middle. Hideous! Must have been some kid's car. No old fart would ruin his car like that.

Kind of like this but looked worse:

I'm glad to know I'm not an old far yet. I wanted to put those Shelby stripes on my Stang, although in flat black. Of course, I didn't own it long enough to get around to it.

henryn

driver100 said:

tjc78 said:

tyguy said:

I flew into Austin today and rented a Toyota Venza LE. After pulling out of the covered multi-story parking garage I was confronted with a massive windstorm that pushed the Venza around on the highway, literally making it hard to stay in a lane. The engine struggled, challenging me to hold a steady speed, and the rushing wind noise inside the cabin was deafening. Incredible the effect strong wind can have on a vehicle. Or so I thought. When I arrived at the hotel I braced myself and opened the door only to find the "major" wind was a light breeze. HA. HA, HA. A light breeze was all it took to make my rental Venza a miserable ride.

It didn't even need a light breeze to be miserable. The center arm rest and storage area squeaked incessantly under my arm, the plastics literally hurt my fingernail when rubbed it across the texture, rattles abounded throughout the cabin, and the thing felt like an economy car from top to bottom. Cheap materials, disconnected steering, uninspired suspension, overwhelmed 4-cylinder motor. It takes Toyota boring to a whole new level.

My Mother has a Venza, and while no Toyota is built like they were in the late 90s early 2000s I really don't see what you are talking about. I've driven hers (4cyl, base) in snow wind and rain on crappy NJ roads and it has handled everything beautifully. Yes, the 4cyl is a bit underpowered but I don't think the interior is anything below other vehicles in its class.

They make excellent appliances. Any of the Toyotas I have driven in or have driven just are lacking something for me. I get that they are dependable, that they don't do anything risky as that adds to the chance something can go wrong, they are reliable....but, they lack soul.

I would neither agree nor disagree without hearing your definition of soul.

The most fun I ever had in a Toyota was a RAV4 with the V6, back before they discontinued offering the V6 as an option. When you punched that sucker, you better be holding on, torque steer out the wazoo!

stickguy

I like the stripes too. Would want them if I got a mustang. Guess that makes me young too!

henryn

Not sure if anyone in here is currently looking at VWs, but I just got this in an email. Bear in mind that the 2015 Passats are under a stop sale order, so you would have to be looking at a 2016.


Good afternoon Henry,

Just wanted to let you know that today VW announced a $1,000 Presidents Bonus that can be used on any Passat, Jetta or Tiguan that we have in stock. Are you still in the market?

sda

venture said:

driver100 said:

abacomike said:

ab348 said:

I bet Daimler Benz has some sort of hi-tech way to tell if the windshield is replaced with one lacking the requisite signature. You might get drummed out of the club for not wanting to spend an extra $600 for the signature!

Daimler-Benz sends in their top ophthalmologist to "look" for the 3-pointed star on the right side of the windshield.  Definitely high tech! 

Maybe I could forge one.....sign it Mercanti

You should be able to get the sticker from a Mercedes dealer. If they don't have any, eBay has them.

Looks good.....are they legal?

stever

henryn said:

Just wanted to let you know that today VW announced a $1,000 Presidents Bonus that can be used on any Passat, Jetta or Tiguan that we have in stock. Are you still in the market?

At the rate VW is going, people are going to start wondering if their local dealer will be around for service and warranty work.

Volkswagen of Freehold closes mysteriously (app.com)

stickguy

I'm glad both jettas I got in the family were leased! I only need them to stay in business for another 2.5 years!

cdnpinhead

Here in the desert, windshield repair or replacement is much like oil changes or suspension fixes in the Northeast. It's a regular thing. Amazing how the next crack, pit or star shows up within a month or two of the replacement.

That said, optical quality of windshields is extremely variable, and my put is that, even when the same manufacturer makes windshields for (fill in the name of your favourite car), when the quality control department looks at the result, the garbage (hey, it looks like a windshield, whaddia you want?) doesn't get the magic seal of approval. They all get shipped to Safelite, and all is well.

When I look out to the right through my windshield, it sometimes looks like a fun house mirror, depending on who put the last windshield in.

driver100

stickguy said:

I like the stripes too. Would want them if I got a mustang. Guess that makes me young too!

Not necessarily....feel young probably
or immature...one or the other!

driver100

henryn said:

driver100 said:

tjc78 said:

tyguy said:

I flew into Austin today and rented a Toyota Venza LE. After pulling out of the covered multi-story parking garage I was confronted with a massive windstorm that pushed the Venza around on the highway, literally making it hard to stay in a lane. The engine struggled, challenging me to hold a steady speed, and the rushing wind noise inside the cabin was deafening. Incredible the effect strong wind can have on a vehicle. Or so I thought. When I arrived at the hotel I braced myself and opened the door only to find the "major" wind was a light breeze. HA. HA, HA. A light breeze was all it took to make my rental Venza a miserable ride.

It didn't even need a light breeze to be miserable. The center arm rest and storage area squeaked incessantly under my arm, the plastics literally hurt my fingernail when rubbed it across the texture, rattles abounded throughout the cabin, and the thing felt like an economy car from top to bottom. Cheap materials, disconnected steering, uninspired suspension, overwhelmed 4-cylinder motor. It takes Toyota boring to a whole new level.

My Mother has a Venza, and while no Toyota is built like they were in the late 90s early 2000s I really don't see what you are talking about. I've driven hers (4cyl, base) in snow wind and rain on crappy NJ roads and it has handled everything beautifully. Yes, the 4cyl is a bit underpowered but I don't think the interior is anything below other vehicles in its class.

They make excellent appliances. Any of the Toyotas I have driven in or have driven just are lacking something for me. I get that they are dependable, that they don't do anything risky as that adds to the chance something can go wrong, they are reliable....but, they lack soul.

I would neither agree nor disagree without hearing your definition of soul.

The most fun I ever had in a Toyota was a RAV4 with the V6, back before they discontinued offering the V6 as an option. When you punched that sucker, you better be holding on, torque steer out the wazoo!

Soul for me in a car is when you feel like you are one with your car. It feels like it is part of you. At the far end of the scale for me was a K-Car I rented...honestly, felt like I was steering a wagon that happened to have a steering wheel. I find my E400 almost senses where I want it to go, I just guide it a bit. I would say a big part of soul is responsiveness, it goes when I want it to go and it stops and steers - does exactly what I want and need it to do. I know I can pass a car or get onto a highway and I don't have to think about it too much - it does exactly what I expect and want it to do. The Passat has some feel of the road and I am more connected because it is a manual, but there is a bit of a disconnect between me and the car....I still expend energy actually steering it. I have to really think about whether I should speed up and attempt to get on a highway, or just slow down and slowly merge when I can do it. There are lots of things I can do in the E that I would never do in the Passat. That disconnect or connection is what I refer to as soul....the car is intuitive to my wants and needs.

I rented a RAV 4 about 5 or 6 years ago and it was without a soul. Total lack of feeling between the steering and handling and me. I might as well have been driving one of those cars in a grocery store where you put your 50 cents in and the steering wheel just spins around.

Very few rental cars have had soul. My Jeeps had some. Our Audi A4 had a lot of soul, if it had more power it would be near the top of the scale. Soul requires power to be responsive if you need a burst of power. Torque steer means "no soul".....you are not as one with your car if it isn't under your control.

driver100

stever said:

henryn said:

Just wanted to let you know that today VW announced a $1,000 Presidents Bonus that can be used on any Passat, Jetta or Tiguan that we have in stock. Are you still in the market?

At the rate VW is going, people are going to start wondering if their local dealer will be around for service and warranty work.

Volkswagen of Freehold closes mysteriously (app.com)

We took the Passat in for a recall yesterday.......it was the first time we took it to this dealers brand new just opened new facility....must have cost a few $million to build the place. I tried sitting in a few of the newer models and I liked them...the Tiguan was very comfortable and I like the vision, and nicely finished. They made slight improvements to the Passat and it feels and looks like an even more expensive car than it did. The Jetta surprised me, seems fairly large for a small car and it was pretty comfortable considering the price. With $2600 wheels it came to the same price as a Passat....don't know who needs fancy wheels that much.

While there the place was empty of customers and 3 different sales people approached me...had to say I was waiting for my car that was in for service.

I felt very sorry for the dealer. It is a top quality dealership....very friendly and efficient. They have a lot of money invested and they are being hurt through no fault of their own. The Passat has 5200 miles on it after 3 1/4 years, so I don't think we will be trading it.....but, I'd consider a VW, though the cheating and the transmission problem with the Audi don't endear me to the brand.

$100 off, Presidents Sale doesn't sound like much....the trade-in value has probably gone down by a lot more than that!

driver100

cdnpinhead said:

Here in the desert, windshield repair or replacement is much like oil changes or suspension fixes in the Northeast. It's a regular thing. Amazing how the next crack, pit or star shows up within a month or two of the replacement.

That said, optical quality of windshields is extremely variable, and my put is that, even when the same manufacturer makes windshields for (fill in the name of your favourite car), when the quality control department looks at the result, the garbage (hey, it looks like a windshield, whaddia you want?) doesn't get the magic seal of approval. They all get shipped to Safelite, and all is well.

When I look out to the right through my windshield, it sometimes looks like a fun house mirror, depending on who put the last windshield in.

I doubt if the seconds go to Safelite and other companies. The Safelite guy might have made up his story but he said they make windshields for Mercedes at the factory, then they do a run that is exactly the same for other dealers....just without the decal.

When we talked about it before someone found some companies were importing windshields from China etc, they were stored horizontally instead of vertically so they could warp. They stacked them high in warehouses to save rent, and that hurts them.

I had Safelite install a windshield on my 2000 Jeep and it was as good as the original.......don't know why yours cdnpinhead is distorted. I put a comment on Yelp that I was pleased with their company...there were some serious complaints but they said to write and they would look into it. Might be worth writing to them.

houdini1

We are going to have to change your name to, "Soul man". Could be a problem though, everyone might think you drove a Kia.

tjc78

I've told this before but I had an aftermarket windshield installed in my LaCrosse (with heads up display) and you couldn't tell a thing.  In that car with as raked as the windshield is you would definately notice if something wasn't right. 

stever

driver100 said:

We took the Passat in for a recall yesterday.......it was the first time we took it to this dealers brand new just opened new facility....must have cost a few $million to build the place.

$100 off, Presidents Sale doesn't sound like much....the trade-in value has probably gone down by a lot more than that!

Lousy timing for them - too bad.

The sale is a $1,000 Presidents Bonus from @henryn's post. That's enough to get people's attention, but good point about the resale.

@houdini1, Kia is exactly what I thought about reading that post.

abacomike

tjc78 said:

I've told this before but I had an aftermarket windshield installed in my LaCrosse (with heads up display) and you couldn't tell a thing.  In that car with as raked as the windshield is you would definately notice if something wasn't right. 

tjc, could you repost this - I have no idea what your last sentence is trying to communicate.

driver100

houdini1 said:

We are going to have to change your name to, "Soul man". Could be a problem though, everyone might think you drove a Kia.

houdini, maybe I should test drive a Kia Soul...maybe it will have even more Soul......

abacomike

This morning, my tire pressure monitors registered 28 psi in each tire.  The temperature was 48 degrees.  So when I took the car in for a wash this afternoon, they put enough nitro-fill in each tire to bring the pressure on each tire to 34 psi.  The plate on the inside of the fuel filler door reads 33 psi for each tire.

The mechanic told me that the psi tomorrow morning will probably be very low due to expected temperatures to drop into the 30's tonight.  He strongly suggested that I not drive the car until the outside temperature reaches 55 degrees which should be about 10:00 AM.  I asked him why?  He said that the manufacturer (Pirelli) cautions that the car should not be driven when ambient temperatures fall below 55 degrees as the tires could be damaged.  

Does anyone know why the manufacturer would issue such a warning for my 285/30 and 235/35 R19 96Y XL tires?

oldfarmer50

qbrozen said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Speaking of which I saw a previous gen. Mustang in the same color as mine with a big wide white stripe down the middle. Hideous! Must have been some kid's car. No old fart would ruin his car like that.

Kind of like this but looked worse:

I'm glad to know I'm not an old far yet. I wanted to put those Shelby stripes on my Stang, although in flat black. Of course, I didn't own it long enough to get around to it.

Don't feel bad, I wanted to put these on mine until you guys talked me out of it.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

stever said:

henryn said:

Just wanted to let you know that today VW announced a $1,000 Presidents Bonus that can be used on any Passat, Jetta or Tiguan that we have in stock. Are you still in the market?

At the rate VW is going, people are going to start wondering if their local dealer will be around for service and warranty work.

Volkswagen of Freehold closes mysteriously (app.com)

We took the Passat in for a recall yesterday.......it was the first time we took it to this dealers brand new just opened new facility....must have cost a few $million to build the place. I tried sitting in a few of the newer models and I liked them...the Tiguan was very comfortable and I like the vision, and nicely finished. They made slight improvements to the Passat and it feels and looks like an even more expensive car than it did. The Jetta surprised me, seems fairly large for a small car and it was pretty comfortable considering the price. With $2600 wheels it came to the same price as a Passat....don't know who needs fancy wheels that much.

While there the place was empty of customers and 3 different sales people approached me...had to say I was waiting for my car that was in for service.

I felt very sorry for the dealer. It is a top quality dealership....very friendly and efficient. They have a lot of money invested and they are being hurt through no fault of their own. The Passat has 5200 miles on it after 3 1/4 years, so I don't think we will be trading it.....but, I'd consider a VW, though the cheating and the transmission problem with the Audi don't endear me to the brand.

$100 off, Presidents Sale doesn't sound like much....the trade-in value has probably gone down by a lot more than that!

I thought you were selling it to me once it got 10,000 miles or the ash trays were full. Of course I'll have to take the bad publicity hit on resale value into account.

driver100

abacomike said:

This morning, my tire pressure monitors registered 28 psi in each tire.  The temperature was 48 degrees.  So when I took the car in for a wash this afternoon, they put enough nitro-fill in each tire to bring the pressure on each tire to 34 psi.  The plate on the inside of the fuel filler door reads 33 psi for each tire.

The mechanic told me that the psi tomorrow morning will probably be very low due to expected temperatures to drop into the 30's tonight.  He strongly suggested that I not drive the car until the outside temperature reaches 55 degrees which should be about 10:00 AM.  I asked him why?  He said that the manufacturer (Pirelli) cautions that the car should not be driven when ambient temperatures fall below 55 degrees as the tires could be damaged.  

Does anyone know why the manufacturer would issue such a warning for my 285/30 and 235/35 R19 96Y XL tires?

Sounds a bit Obsessive Compulsive to me....but, what do I know. Well, one thing I know is I would never buy a tire that can't be driven in temperatures below 55 even if I lived in Miami. I am sure they would have put the same tires on that model car if you had bought it in Toronto and it was 28F there today.

I could be wrong on this too...it would be worth looking up because I am not an expert, but I don't think it should be necessary to change tire pressure because the temperature changes by 10 degrees, I mean it can be changing 4 or 5 times a day....no one can be checking their tire pressure that often. And if 55 is a problem, why doesn't the warning sensor go off.

Like I say, don't go by me...but, let us know what you find out....maybe I should buy an air pump.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

This morning, my tire pressure monitors registered 28 psi in each tire.  The temperature was 48 degrees.  So when I took the car in for a wash this afternoon, they put enough nitro-fill in each tire to bring the pressure on each tire to 34 psi.  The plate on the inside of the fuel filler door reads 33 psi for each tire.

The mechanic told me that the psi tomorrow morning will probably be very low due to expected temperatures to drop into the 30's tonight.  He strongly suggested that I not drive the car until the outside temperature reaches 55 degrees which should be about 10:00 AM.  I asked him why?  He said that the manufacturer (Pirelli) cautions that the car should not be driven when ambient temperatures fall below 55 degrees as the tires could be damaged.  

Does anyone know why the manufacturer would issue such a warning for my 285/30 and 235/35 R19 96Y XL tires?

Below 55 damaging your tires? That sounds like crazy talk. I've seen tire Rack reccomendations to not store certain tires at below 15 degrees but not 55.

explorerx4

@abacomike, Does your car have summer spec tires on it?
I have some cheap Sears digital tire gauges, accurate to within 1/2 a pound.
Are they really accurate? I don't know, but they read the same, so good enough for me.
Despite all the snow, I haven't put the truck in 4wd or even locked the rear axle, never mind putting any weight in the bed.
I want to learn how to drive it just like it is.

abacomike

The research I've done in the last 10 minutes merely cautions driving on ultra high performance summer tires in ambient temperatures below 32 degrees as the tires could crack.  It is also suggested that recommended tire pressures be increased by 5 psi when temps are near or below freezing.

abacomike

explorerx4 said:

@abacomike, Does your car have summer spec tires on it? I have some cheap Sears digital tire gauges, accurate to within 1/2 a pound. Are they really accurate? I don't know, but they read the same, so good enough for me. Despite all the snow, I haven't put the truck in 4wd or even locked the rear axle, never mind putting any weight in the bed. I want to learn how to drive it just like it is.

Yes - they are optional Pirelli high performance summer tires.

abacomike

More research seems only to confuse the issue.  Some manufacturers say driving on high performance summer tires at or below 20 degrees is not recommended.  Others caution not to drive on them at or below freezing as cracks can develop.

I think the mechanic was suggesting not to drive on the tires while temps are in the 30's, like the forecast for tonight here in the western suburbs.  But to wait until temps moderate in the later morning.

imidazol97

@abaco Look up the tires on Pirelli's own site to see what they say about that particular
model tire.

As for temps going down to 32 deg F, I don't have much sympathy right now, LOL.

I don't think we got above 17 deg F. here today. Tonight, single digits then tomorrow back to more
normal weather.

I just keep telling myself the couple inches of white stuff outside is white sand on the
beach in Florida... instead of snow!

abacomike

It's supposed to be in the 20's in the Jacksonville suburbs tonight.

iluvmysephia1

Buick Grand Sofa (SUV)

shifty - I see nothing at all odd about that name!

stever - my 2011 Kia Soul is a base model according to Viva Kia of El Paso, where I bought it. Though I notice it says "Sport" by the turning indicator lights on the front quarter panels. So I refer to it as a base but it could be a Sport model.

snakeweasel

Mr_Shiftright said:

I don't see why car companies would have any trouble coming up with new car names instead of lettering. Why, I've got 4 already in 4 minutes:

Ford Duck (a sure-footed AWD sedan)
Hyundai Dominant Owl (with optional lighting package)
Lexus Cote D'Oro (gold package)
Buick Grand Sofa (SUV)

See, it's easy....

Didn't GMC make the Duck (DUKW)?

snakeweasel

qbrozen said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Speaking of which I saw a previous gen. Mustang in the same color as mine with a big wide white stripe down the middle. Hideous! Must have been some kid's car. No old fart would ruin his car like that.

Kind of like this but looked worse:

I'm glad to know I'm not an old far yet. I wanted to put those Shelby stripes on my Stang, although in flat black. Of course, I didn't own it long enough to get around to it.

It would look better with the flat black stripes.

oldfarmer50

Mike,

I found this when I was researching putting summer tires on my car.


Winter tires, all-season-tires and summer tires differ in the pliability and durability of their rubber at different temperatures. Tire engineers call it "glass transition temperature": Get them cold enough and every tire will have the grip of a Formica kitchen counter. For a race tire, it might be 40 Fahrenheit. For a winter tire it could be 60 degrees below zero. Summer tire tread starts becoming Formica-like somewhere just below freezing. Most all-season tires are still pliable below zero, but some "ultra-high-performance all-season" tires start losing grip well before that.

So it seems a matter of grip rather than tires cracking.

snakeweasel

stickguy said:

I like the stripes too. Would want them if I got a mustang. Guess that makes me young too!

Well they say that you're only as old as the person you feel.

driver100

Evedently, I did a little more research and there is some truth to the cold weather affecting high performance summer tires, oldfarmer is on the right track:

Don't Drive Summer Performance Tires in Cold Temperatures

Whether you blame it on climate change, a polar vortex or what seems to be the beginning of the next ice age, there's no doubt recent weather patterns have exposed many drivers to freezing temperatures and wintery driving conditions. In anticipation of the next time Mother Nature extends her cold reach, drivers with vehicles equipped with summer performance tires need to know those tires are not designed for near- or below-freezing temperatures on clear roads, nor in slush, snow and ice.

When faced with near- and below-freezing temperatures, drivers should leave their summer performance tire-equipped vehicle at home and drive a vehicle equipped with all-season or winter tires.

Summer performance tires feature tread compounds engineered to provide traction in warm to hot ambient temperatures. They were never intended to experience near- and below-freezing temperatures, nor the wintry driving conditions that often accompany them.

As ambient temperatures get colder, typically in the 40-45° Fahrenheit range, summer performance tires lose a noticeable percentage of traction as their tread compound rubber properties change from a pliable elastic to inflexible plastic.

The real problem could be around freezing, which Miami won't be experiencing tonight........low will be about 40 in Tampa area. It seems you can go slowly until tires warm up. Mike, I really think they should telll you this kind of thing when you order those tires.

abacomike

oldfarmer50 said:

Mike, I found this when I was researching putting summer tires on my car. Winter tires, all-season-tires and summer tires differ in the pliability and durability of their rubber at different temperatures. Tire engineers call it "glass transition temperature": Get them cold enough and every tire will have the grip of a Formica kitchen counter. For a race tire, it might be 40 Fahrenheit. For a winter tire it could be 60 degrees below zero. Summer tire tread starts becoming Formica-like somewhere just below freezing. Most all-season tires are still pliable below zero, but some "ultra-high-performance all-season" tires start losing grip well before that. So it seems a matter of grip rather than tires cracking.

Thanks OF.  Since I have ultra high performance summer tires on the car, the suggestion made by the mechanic makes perfectly good sense - avoid driving on the tires until the temp moderates in mid-morning.

snakeweasel

abacomike said:

This morning, my tire pressure monitors registered 28 psi in each tire.  The temperature was 48 degrees.  So when I took the car in for a wash this afternoon, they put enough nitro-fill in each tire to bring the pressure on each tire to 34 psi.  The plate on the inside of the fuel filler door reads 33 psi for each tire.

The mechanic told me that the psi tomorrow morning will probably be very low due to expected temperatures to drop into the 30's tonight.  He strongly suggested that I not drive the car until the outside temperature reaches 55 degrees which should be about 10:00 AM.  I asked him why?  He said that the manufacturer (Pirelli) cautions that the car should not be driven when ambient temperatures fall below 55 degrees as the tires could be damaged.  

Does anyone know why the manufacturer would issue such a warning for my 285/30 and 235/35 R19 96Y XL tires?

Don't drive in temps under 55? doesn't sound right. But if true don't take that car on a summer vacation into the Rockies.

driver100

The rest of the article courtesy of tirerack.com:

As ambient temperatures get colder, typically in the 40-45° Fahrenheit range, summer performance tires lose a noticeable percentage of traction as their tread compound rubber properties change from a pliable elastic to inflexible plastic. The tire industry uses the term "glass transition" to describe the temperature where a summer performance tire's grip/slip performance changes dramatically. This means the summer performance tires that provide predictable traction in warm to hot conditions will be found to be very challenging to drive in cold to freezing temperatures. This is especially true when the tires first begin to be driven or if the driver aggressively applies gas pedal pressure with today's turbocharged fours or high-torque sixes and eights. Fortunately, glass transition is a reversible condition that allows the tires' normal traction to return as the ambient temperatures climb.

If ambient temperatures drop to near- or below-freezing, driving or rolling a vehicle equipped with summer performance tires risks the possibility of tread compound cracking. Tread compound cracking is a permanent condition that requires the tires to be replaced. The other condition that can be caused by running summer performance tires in cold temperatures is the possibility of chipping away the edges of the tread blocks.

Since both of these conditions only occur as the result of what's considered improper use or storage, they are not typically covered by the manufacturer's warranty.

Don't drive with high performance summer tires in freezing temps

driver100

snakeweasel said:

stickguy said:

I like the stripes too. Would want them if I got a mustang. Guess that makes me young too!

Well they say that you're only as old as the person you feel.

Not sure if that sounds right?

abacomike

driver100 said:

Evedently, I did a little more research and there is some truth to the cold weather affecting high performance summer tires, oldfarmer is on the right track: Don't Drive Summer Performance Tires in Cold Temperatures Whether you blame it on climate change, a polar vortex or what seems to be the beginning of the next ice age, there's no doubt recent weather patterns have exposed many drivers to freezing temperatures and wintery driving conditions. In anticipation of the next time Mother Nature extends her cold reach, drivers with vehicles equipped with summer performance tires need to know those tires are not designed for near- or below-freezing temperatures on clear roads, nor in slush, snow and ice. When faced with near- and below-freezing temperatures, drivers should leave their summer performance tire-equipped vehicle at home and drive a vehicle equipped with all-season or winter tires. Summer performance tires feature tread compounds engineered to provide traction in warm to hot ambient temperatures. They were never intended to experience near- and below-freezing temperatures, nor the wintry driving conditions that often accompany them. As ambient temperatures get colder, typically in the 40-45° Fahrenheit range, summer performance tires lose a noticeable percentage of traction as their tread compound rubber properties change from a pliable elastic to inflexible plastic. The real problem could be around freezing, which Miami won't be experiencing tonight........low will be about 40 in Tampa area. It seems you can go slowly until tires warm up. Mike, I really think they should telll you this kind of thing when you order those tires.

I didn't order these tires and wheels - they were on the car from the factory.  Remember, we haven't had persistent cold temps in the winter for many years down here.  Our average night-time winter temps are in the low to mid 60's - daytime in the low to mid 70's.

Tonight, we are supposed to dip into the high 30's out here in the western Broward suburbs.  I am just 10 miles east of the beginning of the Everglades.  The ocean warms the eastern sections of the metro area where temps will be in the 40's.  We don't have the advantage of that warming out here.

snakeweasel

driver100 said:

snakeweasel said:

stickguy said:

I like the stripes too. Would want them if I got a mustang. Guess that makes me young too!

Well they say that you're only as old as the person you feel.

Not sure if that sounds right?

It sounds exactly how I mean it.

snakeweasel

abacomike said:

Tonight, we are supposed to dip into the high 30's out here in the western Broward suburbs.  I am just 10 miles east of the beginning of the Everglades.  The ocean warms the eastern sections of the metro area where temps will be in the 40's.  We don't have the advantage of that warming out here.

Can you send some of that warm "high 30's" my way? We could use the warm weather.